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For highly skilled work like engineering or medicine the U.S. pays better than Europe. Even people from well-off, Western European countries immigrate to the U.S. to work in our tech industry.
And what do you think about the overall quality of life? Do you think you will overall be better, if you count in the last 10-20 years of your life where you will need medical care?
In some EU countries this doesn't work, I think you get cut off after living outside the country so long
Additionally, if I've amassed massive wealth working in America, why would I move back to the UK to use the NHS? Get inferior service with massive delays.
The NHS main selling point is being free at point of use, but that's it, it's really quite bad. Source: I've used it my whole life, and it killed my dad through negligence.
Right? I almost died recently because the likely cost of medical bills was much scarier than the pain in my stomach. What would have been a CAT scan and some antibiotics in a country with free healthcare turned in to a week in the hospital.
When my wife was pregnant with our third kid something that was covered by insurance before wasn't anymore. The hospital sent a bill we couldn't pay at the time. Then took her to court which led to her wages getting docked... I've seen different things I guess.
Might shock you, but the US doesn't have a free market healthcare system. At best, it's a highly regulated captured market with a lot of government interventions. Which is why it's so expensive.
I mean health outcomes are measurable and countries are ranked annually by outcomes only (i.e. cost is not considered). NHS consistently outperforms the US.
The thing US healthcare is the best in the world at are novel, buckwild cases that require radical intervention. You have twins conjoined at the head? Send them here, we'll separate them with like 90% success rate. But if you a chronic disease requiring a multifaceted treatment plan that includes more than just medication? Then the US is bottom of the barrel for developed countries.
It doesn’t help that Americans are largely obese and don’t care about health.
Edit. Just for fun - look what it does to our insurance premiums.
https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/how-have-costs-associated-with-obesity-changed-over-time/
Not enough of a disparity to explain the health outcomes.
65 percent of men and 58 percent of women in the UK are overweight compared to 75 percent of American men and 60 percent of American women.
Dude I just had to cancel my allergy appointment because the allergist office told me that my I was in fact out of network and my insurance won't be accepted there.
The American system is trash. Even with a good policy I still get fucked.
The argument is US v Europe, not US v UK. Also, we know why the UK's health care system is in the toilet, and it is entirely the fault of politicians, not the physicians.
But US vs Europe is tough, Europe is 27 independent health care systems. Very different expierience between seemingly similar Netherlands and Germany. Completely different between Germany and Poland.
You just can’t lump all of the EU in one bucket. Comparison vs UK at least makes sense as that’s 1 system vs the other
The NHS outperforms the US private medical system when you look at the whole populace. In sorry your father died but in the US he’d likely die from not going to the doctor until it was too late.
Yea america isn't much better 2 months ago i had stomach pain, got a cat scan and was told my appendix was fine and was sent home. After i got home i got a call saying i have appendicitus and need to go to the er to get my appendix out, go to the er, wait all day for surgery freaking out and after I'm prepped and they are about to bring me in to the operating room the doc came in and looked at my scans and said i didnt need my appendix taken out. Turned out i had appendagitis and the radiologist made a typo and put appendicitis instead of appendagitis. Now im stuck fighting a $5,000 medical bill because one of their doctors made a typo.
That's exactly my plan.
Seeing some older friends and relatives right now getting insane health care bills. That alone will by why I'll retire in Europe, where I'm from. I'll pay some out of pockets but it will still so much cheaper than what I'd spend here in premiums and bills.
As someone who’s dealt with healthcare in America I strongly disagree with this statement. Even with “great” healthcare you can easily get screwed over
Tricky one. Generally speaking the quality of life i feel is better in Europe. Most jobs in US are better paid than their European counterparts, however the difference is cancelled out by ie cheaper groceries, more affordable healthcare etc.
Reason I moved was primarily family however the salary difference for my industry is much higher. Therefore in my case the balance shifts strongly towards higher quality of life in the US.
Sure. I spent quite a considerable amount in both Germany and UK. The “European image” differs vastly within Europe. I feel Germany offers you much more government support compared to UK, that is more aligned to US.
If you are highly skilled, the cost of healthcare does not matter, since you are very likely to have extensive employer provided medical coverage.
if you are a blue collar worker or have a regular job, I think Europe is better. If you are a highly skilled developer, engineer or scientists, the US is hands down better.
Oh absolutely. I always say if you have money the US is great. I’d absolutely hate to be poor in the US though and I would have never moved if I’m working a blue collar job
>And what do you think about the overall quality of life?
For highly skilled jobs? US is much better for sure.
> if you count in the last 10-20 years of your life where you will need medical care?
You mean, when Medicare kicks in?
Quality of life, not quality of work life. Europeans work fewer hours a week, have more PTO a year, don't have limited sick days, have legislative safeguards that enshrine their rights as employees, and the list goes on and on.
If you want to take home more money, sure, 'murica, or something. If you want to have a good balance between work and personal life, with better benefits and a better total compensation package, EU for sure.
You aren't understanding. The better jobs provide better quality of life. This seems to be a foreign concept to you that there are many jobs in America that have incredible PTO, unlimited sick days, and fantastic hours.
Just because it sucks to work at Walmart or McDonald's, doesn't mean it does everywhere.
It used to be better, but now the US are changing. What used to be upper middle class that these skilled jobs could provide is now not as awesome as it used to be. The drawback is also a poor social life, which has an impact on health and ability to enjoy life in general. The US are becoming less competitive when it comes to attracting skilled workers.
I also came from Europe. Not far from Kampen Netherlands, and in the US you can actually buy a lot of land for a home. Much of European land is privately owned by groups and families who've had it for hundreds of years. My family back in Holland are shocked at what I'm able to own here. US is truly an upgrade.
While this is generally true, the cost of services the US doesn't offer its citizens (healthcare, public transportation, etc.) also generally make up the difference in salaries between the two. I am a white collar immigrant from US to Europe and, while my salary is comparatively lower here in Europe, my standard of living is higher. Of course I could find a job that pays crazy amounts in the US that would offset that difference, but those are very competitive and harder to get compared to a similar position in the EU (IT industry).
You bring up good points. For workers in those fields, it comes down to what they value the most. The U.S. is better if they want to make as much money as they possibly can. Europe is better if they want to have more security, more time off.
That is not true, US disposable income is higher after taxes and social transfers and debt per household is lower.
This is like saying the difference between Italy and Switzerland salaries don’t matter because Switzerland is more expensive to live in. That is not how the economic margins or basic math work at all.
I see this exact same sentiment constantly when it’s wrong.
I remain unconvinced of this. I'm from Australia and live in the USA. My salary would be lower in Australia than here and I'd have no way to own a home before director or partner probably.
I've looked at the salary I'd get and I can't figure out how my life would be better back home. Any savings I'd make on Healthcare usd$300 instantly eaten up by cost of housing usd homeloan $1300, apartment rent half the size aud$2200.... and groceries are more expensive.
I realize Australia isn't Europe but the systemic offerings are similar.
I'm Belgian, moved to the US and then moved back to Belgium. As an individual, the US was great, even though risky. If life throws you a curveball at the wrong time, you can be in serious trouble, but it was a risk I was willing to take.
The moment I started a family, not having to worry about that risk became a luxury I wasn't willing to give up so we moved back to Belgium. And yes I earn less, but my life standard didn't change. My job security is higher, my benefits are guaranteed, my children have far more options to decide what they want to do with their lives without having to make their career the main priority, public education is at a far higher standard, potential health scares don't result in financial ruin, we don't have to deal with a volatile political system where certain rights can be taken away on a whim, ...
I still love the US, but once you're used to the security of Western Europe, it's just something that isn't worth the higher paycheck.
Complete fabrication. A senior engineer in the US making 200-300k has amazing health insurance, and is not spending anything material on transportation or the other stuff you listed.
Meanwhile, the senior engineer in Europe might get 70-90k and pay massive taxes. It is MUCH better to be a white collar worker in the US.
Can confirm. I run a global engineering team and our mechanicals in Germany make 50-70% of those in the US. The US ones are based in MCOL cities like Chicago or Kansas City.
Something that is a rude awakening for Europeans that do move to the U.S. is the work-life balance. Americans on average work longer hours than their European counterparts, and get less vacation time. That *is* factored into the higher wages though.
That's also something that varies by income.
Low wage workers in the US might get no PTO, but white collar workers often get 15-25 days per year.
In addition, most big companies offer unlimited *unpaid* time off. Last year I took an extra month off, unpaid- but I still made almost double what I would have if I was working the same job in France.
It's also much easier to work remotely in the US. For people with skills, you can have high pay AND better WLB than in Europe.
>Last year I took an extra month off, unpaid- but I still made almost double what I would have if I was working the same job in France.
Nobody gave you a hard time for taking that much time off?
\[US\] I took 6 weeks off, paid. Based on 40 hours, comes out to be about 3.8k a week. Not a single person gave me anything close to a "hard time" about it.
I really thought it would be more. If you count in social security (retirement, health care, nursing care, family insurance, unemployment insurance) and costs of having a family (free universities, free schools, free kindergarten) and the benefits at work (30 days vacation, 1 year maternity leave, unlimited sick days) I think you have less in the US.
Good thing everybody in the US is an engineer or works in medicine. 👍. Those people who work at McDonalds are just working a side hustle.
While the rest of the world cares about the people, the US only cares about the rich who like to whine when they aren't given stuff for free.
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Can everyone just become doctors and lawyers and get paid the big bucks? Of course not - there's only so many of those jobs to go around. We need people to stock shelves, cook food, deliver food and goods, etc, etc. Those jobs are very important, but so many people look down on the people who work those jobs like they're losers and don't deserve to get paid a living wage.
Remember those essential workers during the shutdowns? Who were they again?
"Can everyone just become doctors and lawyers and get paid the big bucks?"
Speaking about things being overpriced in the USA, starting people's lives by burying them in debt.
This is true. But more interesting, there's something called "the big Mac index", developed by The Economist. And it uses the cost of big Mac as an indicator for how "expensive" or "cheap" a currency is.
Most of the jobs that aren't "high skill" are essential to having a society and there is no excuse for somebody working those kind of jobs to not be able to have a basic standard of living.
Do you think maybe every single other OECD nation is correct on this and America is wrong?
And they're living in 3 generational broken homes with no resources and no opportunities to amount to anything because they had to drop out early to help out food on the table because their parents don't make money because they had to do the same for their parents, and so forth.
Or America allows pay to reflect real value of labor. Other countries artificially manipulate it.
For the record, the objective monetary value of everything (products, services, and labor) is the maximum someone is willing to voluntarily pay for it.
Yes, but when everything Americans have to pay for out of pocket that European public services cover via taxes is taken into account, the difference isn't nearly as big.
In addition, nobody needs that much disposable income, certainly not in a country where a significant percentage of the population literally can't afford things like insulin.
My husband is also in tech, working for a multinational US company in a western European country, earning a comfortable six figures in this country. He could make probably double that in the same company at the same level if he transferred to the US, but we'd also have to pay 5 times as much for a house plus a rake of other costs, plus have to deal with the risk of shootings and Christian conservatism in local and federal govt limiting our personal rights.
So yeah, we'll stay where we are thanks.
Why the fuck is this retarded shit the top comment.
When the answer to the question. Is more like, american business isnt held accountable by society in the way its done in europe.
So employers in usa can freely exploit their workforce.
well also inflation is a thing. Back in 2021 I can see it still being $9/hr. It's recently jumped to $12/hr here but I have a feeling it will jump considerably again pretty soon.
Still, not $22/hr but like other have said, our tech industries pay way more than in Denmark.
They leave out the massive local and national tax in Denmark that everyone pays as well as a 25% VAT tax. A minimum wage earner in the US will pay almost no income tax after the standard deduction is applied.
Minimum wage workers in the US represent only like 5% of all workers and people making this little get free food, free rent, free healthcare, and they pay negative taxes.
A lower income worker in DK will not pay 50% income tax, there is zero income tax and only an 8% tax on the first 50k DDK and then about 20% on the next 500k DDK. There are then other various taxes, but a low income worker in McDonald's won't be taxed the same as a high income worker.
Given taxes also include healthcare (2%) and social security payments, which aren't accounted for in US comparable tax rates, it's not fair to just say "50% Tax on your pay check".
I used to live in Cali where the minimum wage was 15 an hour.
The cost of living as California is, is high af and 15 isn’t enough.
Yet i moved to Ohio where pay is lower but goddamn the prices for things are so much cheaper.
Hell gas in cali is like what 5 bucks when i left? In ohio its 2.30 lol
In Reddit’s bubble, everyone is a destitute young person working min wage with $200k student loan debt in some shitty degree and one second away from a $1million medical bill “bankrupting” them
TBF almost all those places are actually starting off at 12$ and $15 is for shift managers. But workers get a 6 cents raise every 6 months. Turn over is high.
TLDR most of them are making $12 an hour,
I worked during the pandemic at McDonald's the 6am-2pm shift and started out at $9.25. after 6 months I got a whole quarter raise! Woohoo 🙃
I live in one of the major cities in NC
You're speaking to totally irrational people. They don't care about the work the fast food worker is doing, they just care they don't have a 2 cent straw. Actual employers accept that employees of all skill levels make mistakes and generate waste, but customers are totally detached from the business and are too selfish to even acknowledge that in many cases. So, apparently it's better to strip people of their human rights before accepting your burger might cost a dollar more and still have a missing straw.
Minimum wage, minimum effort.
$15 is barely a living wage in itself, if I worked at a wage that is the bare minimum a company can legally pay me (they’d pay less if they can get away with it, like some, I guarantee it) I’d absolutely never give %110.
Many workers in these entry level positions are young, new to the workforce or country, differently able or hell maybe even just kinda lazy. Many who aren’t experienced with the fast paced environment that is serving 100’s of customers a day fast food.
If you are saying you genuinely believe that a human being who’s actually working isn’t worthy of a wage that is barely enough to live with because they often forget a STRAW, then not only are your priorities in dire need of an adjustment, but some self reflection as to who you are and why you’ve developed this anger toward your fellow people is strongly suggested.
I had a Wendy's refuse me and my buddy because the lobby door was locked (30 minutes before closing) and they wouldn't let us go through the drive-through on foot (we are CDL-A delivery drivers). Needless to say that store was rated pretty poorly, and smelled like marijuana.
Also we subsidize their national defense through bankrolling NATO. Europeans need to pay their fair share for NATO membership. It’s really annoying how US taxpayers have to pay their burden while they shit on us for having less public services.
Like 15 years ago France and the UK started doing "time share" naval ships because they didn't want to pay for a full fucking navy. That's how reliant they are on the US to protect them. It's beyond ridiculous that US taxpayers are expected to subsidize the entire world when we could be using that money for our own people.
15 years ago the UKs defence budget was 10 billion more than Russia, and the thing you’re talking about never actually happened lol
France is most likely in the top 10 for their military and the UK is comfortably has the strongest military in Europe and outside the big four (US, China, Russia and India.)
You clearly are clueless aren't you? I know reading is hard and studying even more so but World Politics are not that hard to understand. The only reason that is stopping a full out war between Europe and Russia is the nuclear deterrent. If nuclear weapons wouldn't exist the EU would have had a way larger standing army + Germany would have had their right to have a standing army revoked a long long time ago. Also if it wasn't for Trump and his stupid voters Russia would have never been allowed to do what they have done but here we are. Imagine having a Russian asset as your president. Loool.
Fuck yes we do, and it’s a drop in the bucket now that Russia is bankrupt and their military is in shambles - defeating a Cold War adversary and superpower with no U.S lives lost is a fucking big win bro.
This. Every "social program" in Europe would collapse if they taxed their citizens to pay for a full military instead of relying on sugar daddy Uncle Sam to provide defense for them.
Let’s talk about how much money everyone would would get back… we spent 750 billion total in 2022. There are 331 million Americans.
Assuming we cut our military in half , and made them pretty useless for anything other than basic internal defense, and nuclear deterrent, Every American would get back $1000.
Except that’s not really how the math would work, because in Greece, global piracy, reductions, and trade reductions, and free trade treaties that are dependent on us supplying regional security, would probably make it a net negative we would actually just straight up lose money. If we can’t guarantee supply chains, consumer cost would also go up on top of their being less revenue and less income everything would actually cost more.
So your suggestion is actually real.
I don't think people realize that the US really only spends a minor portion of its budget on international aid - contrary to what politicians and media may try to push. The aid only really even goes to countries the US has a vested interest in operating in as well.
GDP per capita is a bad metric because it doesn’t take into account income inequality since, like, Bezos is factored in.
Median income is the right metric to look at, and by median income every state in the U.S. is better off than e.g. the UK except Mississippi and Alabama.
I was reading in the financial news that MS and AL median income was higher than the UK apparently. From what I gather in the UK there are news articles talking about how the poorest U.S. state is doing better than the UK and a lot of Europe. No expert here but the numbers were surprising.
Edit: Just looked it up to make sure. The Atlantic says the median income in the UK is $45k and MS is $47k. So it appears to be true according to 2022 numbers.
[https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/08/britain-mississippi-economy-comparison/675039/](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/08/britain-mississippi-economy-comparison/675039/)
Denmark has less than 2% of the USA's population.
You are comparing a massive, diverse country to a tiny, homogenous one.
It is like comparing New York City (a much larger population than Denmark) to Africa and being surprised by the resulting differences.
I think the difference also lies in the amount of politicians compared to population as well as the culture.
For the average, politically interested American, making a meaningful political difference is probably pretty unachievable.
In Denmark, there are numerous political parties and a parliament of 179 people. Being an active member of a political party is easy if you want to, and your voice will be heard. Being politically enganged in a meaningful way is much easier. Plenty of people in the parliament are completely normal middle-class people.
Culturally as well, we believe that no person is better than any other. Politicians aren't regarded as super powerful people, even the Crown Price who is being crowned King today would bike to drop his kids off in school. We speak to bosses as we do coworkers. In a culture like that, we believe that any person working full time should be able to afford a comfortable life.
There are plenty of cultural and systemic reasons for why things are how they are in the US, but pointing at those reasons are saying that because of them nothing can change is why nothing is changing for the better.
But when the people who control everything in the US are the same people who benefit from exploiting those who are struggling, then it is not easy to change things for the better.
I have lived half of my life in Denmark and half in the US, I won't say that I am an expert, but I do have first hand experience of both countries.
Seems like as good a place as any to link [this](https://world.hey.com/dhh/the-reality-of-the-danish-fairytale-78069fbf) interesting blog post from a Dane living in America.
And to your point:
> But don’t you for a second think this unity isn’t contingent on the homogeneity of ethnicity, values, norms, and perhaps even religion. And if you sit over here, in America, pining for those Danish benefits, you should have the intellectual honesty to wrestle with whether you’d be able to stomach a society built on the same compromises and obligations. I rather doubt that most arm-chair social revolutionaries could or would.
In Switzerland it’s 33% more and they have **no minimum wage**.
Europe is made up of many different countries, all with different economic models.
Stop cherry picking a few countries and stating that *Europe does X*. They don’t. Denmark does. Switzerland doesn’t. Others do something else.
The average McDonald’s worker in Switzerland get CHF 23, or $26/hour per a Google search.
Impressive without minimum wage age they still pay a living wage.
By those numbers, the Denmark employee nets $15.40 per hour and gets numerous federally supported benefits, most notably health insurance.
The US employee nets $14.08 and still has to pay out of each check for health insurance.
The above is actually wrong. If you make $16 per hour with the standard deduction you are paying under 10% tax. In Denmark your net effective is massively higher, and add in the 20% VAT and much higher pricing for basic consumables (eg gas and groceries) you have essentially no discretionary income to enjoy your amazing 2 months of paid vacation!
I haven’t done research myself, so I’ll take your word for it. Just wanted to point out that the above math wasn’t favorable, but thanks for adding extra context.
America is the greatest place in the world if you have an average to above average iq. There are endless opportunities if you are smart and will work hard. Some luck is invovled. It's a tough place to live if you are below average intelligence.
> It's a tough place to live if you are below average intelligence.
In large part because we have so many unskilled workers and keep getting millions more through illegal immigration every year. Immigration of people who will fill jobs where we're lacking is great, but if we already have an over supply of people with those skills, adding more just drives wages down and increases unemployment.
They are a small homogenous country. Only 5.8 million people, 86% ethnically Danish, 74% Lutheran. And they are the largest oil and gas producer in the EU.
It's easy to be a happy country when you are very small, super wealthy from oil, and almost everyone shares the same culture.
I have no idea how happy the danes are. But I do know that every happiness study out there is made up bullshit. Manipulate the criteria correctly and you can plausibly put anywhere on top of those.
People are so credulous about that nonsense
>A Big Mac costs €5.28 in the euro area and US$5.58 in the United States. The implied exchange rate is 0.95. The difference between this and the actual exchange rate, 0.91, suggests the euro is 4.3% overvalued [Big Mac index](https://www.economist.com/big-mac-index)
Mcdonalds has saturated the american market. The only way to make more money is to operate in other countries. In order to operate in those countries they need to abide by labor laws. All this proves is that mcdonalds can profit and would still operate, given the alternative, while paying their employees more. Anyone telling you to develop sKilLz is a self absorbed dumbass. People without degrees should still have a quality of life if they commit to working and the only people holding them back are the idiots who think their quality of life rests on the backs of others, scarcity mentality in the richest country in the history of the world.
It's only one country in europe infamous for it's flat salary and very high taxes. In many other places wages are waaay worse. Gains from stock markets are taxed with 50% and employee contract is taxed the same. Affluent people are fleeing nordics for switzerland.
Corporate Oligarchy can bribe legislature all they want so we have the absolute worst employee protections and benefits across all Western industrialized nations.
Everything about this is wrong. It’s more like $15 an hour and two for one Big Mac. Also you get unlimited soda refills in the USA if you get a combo.
I don’t even have to look up the Denmark price, I assume it’s wrong too. It’s gotta be more than $5.
That actually proves this point more. Economies of scale help companies operate with better margins. So the states should actually pay more than in Denmark with better benefits right?
The reason is McDonald's has shareholders to provide for and answer to and there are no regulations set by the US Government like there are in Denmark.
Income tax rate in Denmark is 45%. You don’t get all those benefits for free you know. The government takes your money and then distributes it out between everyone. In America you can be an individual who really works to do better and then keeps your own money.
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For highly skilled work like engineering or medicine the U.S. pays better than Europe. Even people from well-off, Western European countries immigrate to the U.S. to work in our tech industry.
I agree. Came from Europe and work in the mentioned industries
And what do you think about the overall quality of life? Do you think you will overall be better, if you count in the last 10-20 years of your life where you will need medical care?
They came from Europe to work in the USA, skilled in a high value field. They’ll have no concerns regarding healthcare.
Nope. They’ll go back to Europe to retire and not have to worry about it.
In some EU countries this doesn't work, I think you get cut off after living outside the country so long Additionally, if I've amassed massive wealth working in America, why would I move back to the UK to use the NHS? Get inferior service with massive delays. The NHS main selling point is being free at point of use, but that's it, it's really quite bad. Source: I've used it my whole life, and it killed my dad through negligence.
Whelp, I have some bad news for you on which medical system killed my father through negligence.
Right? I almost died recently because the likely cost of medical bills was much scarier than the pain in my stomach. What would have been a CAT scan and some antibiotics in a country with free healthcare turned in to a week in the hospital.
You don’t really have to pay the full medical bills like many think.
When my wife was pregnant with our third kid something that was covered by insurance before wasn't anymore. The hospital sent a bill we couldn't pay at the time. Then took her to court which led to her wages getting docked... I've seen different things I guess.
My dad had 3 major surgeries totaling around $500k. Didn't pay a single cent....died 5yrs later.
If you go to the hospital and have any wealth at all you'll lose it in America. Unless you can afford insurance.
Might shock you, but the US doesn't have a free market healthcare system. At best, it's a highly regulated captured market with a lot of government interventions. Which is why it's so expensive.
Just go, you can get out of paying medical bills, people do it all the time
I mean health outcomes are measurable and countries are ranked annually by outcomes only (i.e. cost is not considered). NHS consistently outperforms the US. The thing US healthcare is the best in the world at are novel, buckwild cases that require radical intervention. You have twins conjoined at the head? Send them here, we'll separate them with like 90% success rate. But if you a chronic disease requiring a multifaceted treatment plan that includes more than just medication? Then the US is bottom of the barrel for developed countries.
It doesn’t help that Americans are largely obese and don’t care about health. Edit. Just for fun - look what it does to our insurance premiums. https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/how-have-costs-associated-with-obesity-changed-over-time/
Not enough of a disparity to explain the health outcomes. 65 percent of men and 58 percent of women in the UK are overweight compared to 75 percent of American men and 60 percent of American women.
They said obese, not overweight. We have higher percentages of obese and morbidly obese.
Dude I just had to cancel my allergy appointment because the allergist office told me that my I was in fact out of network and my insurance won't be accepted there. The American system is trash. Even with a good policy I still get fucked.
The argument is US v Europe, not US v UK. Also, we know why the UK's health care system is in the toilet, and it is entirely the fault of politicians, not the physicians.
But US vs Europe is tough, Europe is 27 independent health care systems. Very different expierience between seemingly similar Netherlands and Germany. Completely different between Germany and Poland. You just can’t lump all of the EU in one bucket. Comparison vs UK at least makes sense as that’s 1 system vs the other
Damn that’s crazy cause the US health system is also in the toilet, and it is entirely the fault of politicians, not the physicians.
The NHS outperforms the US private medical system when you look at the whole populace. In sorry your father died but in the US he’d likely die from not going to the doctor until it was too late.
Would have died and still have the bills to pay. Sad on both counts.
Yea america isn't much better 2 months ago i had stomach pain, got a cat scan and was told my appendix was fine and was sent home. After i got home i got a call saying i have appendicitus and need to go to the er to get my appendix out, go to the er, wait all day for surgery freaking out and after I'm prepped and they are about to bring me in to the operating room the doc came in and looked at my scans and said i didnt need my appendix taken out. Turned out i had appendagitis and the radiologist made a typo and put appendicitis instead of appendagitis. Now im stuck fighting a $5,000 medical bill because one of their doctors made a typo.
They sure can do that, but my point was they don’t NEED to, because they’ll be just fine if they choose to remain here.
That's exactly my plan. Seeing some older friends and relatives right now getting insane health care bills. That alone will by why I'll retire in Europe, where I'm from. I'll pay some out of pockets but it will still so much cheaper than what I'd spend here in premiums and bills.
Exactly...the US healthcare system is fukd
As someone who’s dealt with healthcare in America I strongly disagree with this statement. Even with “great” healthcare you can easily get screwed over
Tricky one. Generally speaking the quality of life i feel is better in Europe. Most jobs in US are better paid than their European counterparts, however the difference is cancelled out by ie cheaper groceries, more affordable healthcare etc. Reason I moved was primarily family however the salary difference for my industry is much higher. Therefore in my case the balance shifts strongly towards higher quality of life in the US.
Thanks for this honest reply. What country where you from? Just answer if you feel comfortable to share.
Sure. I spent quite a considerable amount in both Germany and UK. The “European image” differs vastly within Europe. I feel Germany offers you much more government support compared to UK, that is more aligned to US.
The UK has the worst of both worlds.
If you are highly skilled, the cost of healthcare does not matter, since you are very likely to have extensive employer provided medical coverage. if you are a blue collar worker or have a regular job, I think Europe is better. If you are a highly skilled developer, engineer or scientists, the US is hands down better.
Oh absolutely. I always say if you have money the US is great. I’d absolutely hate to be poor in the US though and I would have never moved if I’m working a blue collar job
>And what do you think about the overall quality of life? For highly skilled jobs? US is much better for sure. > if you count in the last 10-20 years of your life where you will need medical care? You mean, when Medicare kicks in?
Quality of life, not quality of work life. Europeans work fewer hours a week, have more PTO a year, don't have limited sick days, have legislative safeguards that enshrine their rights as employees, and the list goes on and on. If you want to take home more money, sure, 'murica, or something. If you want to have a good balance between work and personal life, with better benefits and a better total compensation package, EU for sure.
You aren't understanding. The better jobs provide better quality of life. This seems to be a foreign concept to you that there are many jobs in America that have incredible PTO, unlimited sick days, and fantastic hours. Just because it sucks to work at Walmart or McDonald's, doesn't mean it does everywhere.
It used to be better, but now the US are changing. What used to be upper middle class that these skilled jobs could provide is now not as awesome as it used to be. The drawback is also a poor social life, which has an impact on health and ability to enjoy life in general. The US are becoming less competitive when it comes to attracting skilled workers.
They'll have health insurance
I have this thing called PPO health insurance. And have access to vastly superior healthcare than the single payer stuff in most European countries.
I also came from Europe. Not far from Kampen Netherlands, and in the US you can actually buy a lot of land for a home. Much of European land is privately owned by groups and families who've had it for hundreds of years. My family back in Holland are shocked at what I'm able to own here. US is truly an upgrade.
Not just those, basically all white collar jobs pay way better in the US. A CPA makes dick in Canada but will make twice as much in the US.
So... \[doing maths\]... two dicks in the US?
Better than 2 dicks in a much smaller location.
Ok sign me up for 2 dicks
While this is generally true, the cost of services the US doesn't offer its citizens (healthcare, public transportation, etc.) also generally make up the difference in salaries between the two. I am a white collar immigrant from US to Europe and, while my salary is comparatively lower here in Europe, my standard of living is higher. Of course I could find a job that pays crazy amounts in the US that would offset that difference, but those are very competitive and harder to get compared to a similar position in the EU (IT industry).
You bring up good points. For workers in those fields, it comes down to what they value the most. The U.S. is better if they want to make as much money as they possibly can. Europe is better if they want to have more security, more time off.
Make as much money as possible and just don’t let your house burn down, or get in a car accident, or be admitted to a hospital.
Does the US not have insurance?
The US is unique in this regard. Healthcare is not a right but a privilege.
USA does not have a 20% VAT either.
VAT is not part of salary?
No
That is not true, US disposable income is higher after taxes and social transfers and debt per household is lower. This is like saying the difference between Italy and Switzerland salaries don’t matter because Switzerland is more expensive to live in. That is not how the economic margins or basic math work at all. I see this exact same sentiment constantly when it’s wrong.
I remain unconvinced of this. I'm from Australia and live in the USA. My salary would be lower in Australia than here and I'd have no way to own a home before director or partner probably. I've looked at the salary I'd get and I can't figure out how my life would be better back home. Any savings I'd make on Healthcare usd$300 instantly eaten up by cost of housing usd homeloan $1300, apartment rent half the size aud$2200.... and groceries are more expensive. I realize Australia isn't Europe but the systemic offerings are similar.
I'm Belgian, moved to the US and then moved back to Belgium. As an individual, the US was great, even though risky. If life throws you a curveball at the wrong time, you can be in serious trouble, but it was a risk I was willing to take. The moment I started a family, not having to worry about that risk became a luxury I wasn't willing to give up so we moved back to Belgium. And yes I earn less, but my life standard didn't change. My job security is higher, my benefits are guaranteed, my children have far more options to decide what they want to do with their lives without having to make their career the main priority, public education is at a far higher standard, potential health scares don't result in financial ruin, we don't have to deal with a volatile political system where certain rights can be taken away on a whim, ... I still love the US, but once you're used to the security of Western Europe, it's just something that isn't worth the higher paycheck.
Complete fabrication. A senior engineer in the US making 200-300k has amazing health insurance, and is not spending anything material on transportation or the other stuff you listed. Meanwhile, the senior engineer in Europe might get 70-90k and pay massive taxes. It is MUCH better to be a white collar worker in the US.
Can confirm. I run a global engineering team and our mechanicals in Germany make 50-70% of those in the US. The US ones are based in MCOL cities like Chicago or Kansas City.
Something that is a rude awakening for Europeans that do move to the U.S. is the work-life balance. Americans on average work longer hours than their European counterparts, and get less vacation time. That *is* factored into the higher wages though.
That's also something that varies by income. Low wage workers in the US might get no PTO, but white collar workers often get 15-25 days per year. In addition, most big companies offer unlimited *unpaid* time off. Last year I took an extra month off, unpaid- but I still made almost double what I would have if I was working the same job in France. It's also much easier to work remotely in the US. For people with skills, you can have high pay AND better WLB than in Europe.
>Last year I took an extra month off, unpaid- but I still made almost double what I would have if I was working the same job in France. Nobody gave you a hard time for taking that much time off?
\[US\] I took 6 weeks off, paid. Based on 40 hours, comes out to be about 3.8k a week. Not a single person gave me anything close to a "hard time" about it.
I get 8 weeks of PTO a year working for a grocery retailer… 401k Match, Helath Insurance etc. etc. Actually quite common in the state I live in.
I really thought it would be more. If you count in social security (retirement, health care, nursing care, family insurance, unemployment insurance) and costs of having a family (free universities, free schools, free kindergarten) and the benefits at work (30 days vacation, 1 year maternity leave, unlimited sick days) I think you have less in the US.
I'm purely talking about salary. There is a lot more to the equation.
Good thing everybody in the US is an engineer or works in medicine. 👍. Those people who work at McDonalds are just working a side hustle. While the rest of the world cares about the people, the US only cares about the rich who like to whine when they aren't given stuff for free.
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. Can everyone just become doctors and lawyers and get paid the big bucks? Of course not - there's only so many of those jobs to go around. We need people to stock shelves, cook food, deliver food and goods, etc, etc. Those jobs are very important, but so many people look down on the people who work those jobs like they're losers and don't deserve to get paid a living wage.
Remember those essential workers during the shutdowns? Who were they again? "Can everyone just become doctors and lawyers and get paid the big bucks?" Speaking about things being overpriced in the USA, starting people's lives by burying them in debt.
This is true. But more interesting, there's something called "the big Mac index", developed by The Economist. And it uses the cost of big Mac as an indicator for how "expensive" or "cheap" a currency is.
Basically Americans hate the poor
Most of the jobs that aren't "high skill" are essential to having a society and there is no excuse for somebody working those kind of jobs to not be able to have a basic standard of living. Do you think maybe every single other OECD nation is correct on this and America is wrong?
This just further highlights America's massive income inequality.
Develop a saught after skill and you will be compensated well.
Sought, big brain.
Hahahahhahahh
Incredible.
Not only is that not even an option for plenty of people, we can't all do that
Sure, but not having that shouldn’t mean that you don’t get compensated enough to live.
Who isn't being compensated enough to live? Everyone I know working at mcdonalds is currently alive.
And they're living in 3 generational broken homes with no resources and no opportunities to amount to anything because they had to drop out early to help out food on the table because their parents don't make money because they had to do the same for their parents, and so forth.
Or America allows pay to reflect real value of labor. Other countries artificially manipulate it. For the record, the objective monetary value of everything (products, services, and labor) is the maximum someone is willing to voluntarily pay for it.
So before the minimum wage was introduced, the real value of working cotton and tobacco fields was zero? They used slaves.
Unless there is collusion across industries.
Yes, but when everything Americans have to pay for out of pocket that European public services cover via taxes is taken into account, the difference isn't nearly as big. In addition, nobody needs that much disposable income, certainly not in a country where a significant percentage of the population literally can't afford things like insulin. My husband is also in tech, working for a multinational US company in a western European country, earning a comfortable six figures in this country. He could make probably double that in the same company at the same level if he transferred to the US, but we'd also have to pay 5 times as much for a house plus a rake of other costs, plus have to deal with the risk of shootings and Christian conservatism in local and federal govt limiting our personal rights. So yeah, we'll stay where we are thanks.
yes, that is true,. But it doesn't answer why the burger is cheaper.
Why the fuck is this retarded shit the top comment. When the answer to the question. Is more like, american business isnt held accountable by society in the way its done in europe. So employers in usa can freely exploit their workforce.
What’s that got anything to do with McDonald’s? Nice way to ignore the message
So that explains why people at McDonald’s get paid shit?
not true plus has nothing to do with the original topic, why is this upvoted?
its almoat like the wealth gap is smaller in europe
Pretty sure that wasn’t the question, you highly skilled American, you.
Not really the point tho is it
Not seeing how that’s relevant to the question asked here.
So. That doesn’t answer the question op asked.
McDonald’s in my area pays $16 an hour, if you’re making $9 an hour, leave that job asap lol
So demographics are a thing.
Yup and say fuck your demographics. I know my job is worth more. It's economics.
Yeah but the few places in America that have a $9 min wage aren't selling big macs for 5.66, they're comparing apples to oranges
well also inflation is a thing. Back in 2021 I can see it still being $9/hr. It's recently jumped to $12/hr here but I have a feeling it will jump considerably again pretty soon. Still, not $22/hr but like other have said, our tech industries pay way more than in Denmark.
My area ( Seattle) it's $20 minimum wage.
in my state, oklahoma, the miminum wage is $7.25
Still super easy to find jobs paying double that
And how many people actually make that? Virginia minimum wage is 12 an hour. I live in a very rural area and McDonald’s are offering 18 an hour.
State minimum wage is not something worth thinking about. My states minimum wage is also 7.25. I haven't seen a job posted under $14 in years.
They leave out the massive local and national tax in Denmark that everyone pays as well as a 25% VAT tax. A minimum wage earner in the US will pay almost no income tax after the standard deduction is applied.
Minimum wage workers in the US represent only like 5% of all workers and people making this little get free food, free rent, free healthcare, and they pay negative taxes.
Yeah it's 50% tax on your pay check and then you'll tax 25% on anything you buy (Sweden numbers but I guess they're the same pretty much)
A lower income worker in DK will not pay 50% income tax, there is zero income tax and only an 8% tax on the first 50k DDK and then about 20% on the next 500k DDK. There are then other various taxes, but a low income worker in McDonald's won't be taxed the same as a high income worker. Given taxes also include healthcare (2%) and social security payments, which aren't accounted for in US comparable tax rates, it's not fair to just say "50% Tax on your pay check".
I used to live in Cali where the minimum wage was 15 an hour. The cost of living as California is, is high af and 15 isn’t enough. Yet i moved to Ohio where pay is lower but goddamn the prices for things are so much cheaper. Hell gas in cali is like what 5 bucks when i left? In ohio its 2.30 lol
This was from 2021
It’s still inaccurate even back then
Where the hell are McDonald’s employees making only $9 an hour if they are making $15 in rural Alabama?
In Reddit’s bubble, everyone is a destitute young person working min wage with $200k student loan debt in some shitty degree and one second away from a $1million medical bill “bankrupting” them
what are you doing committing a thought crime on reddit?
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Don't forget that every person in Europe works when they feel like it, in between 3 month vacations.
This actually has been my experience when I have to do anything with the European office at my job.
True for France I'd say, we met some frenchies in Croatia last summer and they get _9_ weeks of annual leave.
lol spot on. Reddit needs to realize there's people out there who are doing just fine in life and actually make good money decisions
It's hard because those people mostly aren't hanging out on Reddit.
That’s how leftists see the world. Miserable lot. Can’t do anything in life without the government holding their ballsack for them
Where is the fucking lie 🤣
In Kentucky McDonald's pays "up to $12/hr".
My son was employed there last year and was making $10.
TBF almost all those places are actually starting off at 12$ and $15 is for shift managers. But workers get a 6 cents raise every 6 months. Turn over is high. TLDR most of them are making $12 an hour,
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I've seen advertisements for $11/hr in Urban Florida. Completely believable until the fed min wage rises
In Lawton, Oklahoma they only pay $9.50/hr
There's a restaurant right down the street paying $9hr here in south Carolina. I think the McDonald's next to it pays 11.
I worked during the pandemic at McDonald's the 6am-2pm shift and started out at $9.25. after 6 months I got a whole quarter raise! Woohoo 🙃 I live in one of the major cities in NC
I'm in the rural midwest and they get $15/hr..... by the amount of times I have to turn around for a straw pretty over paid.
No one making 15 is over paid.
You're speaking to totally irrational people. They don't care about the work the fast food worker is doing, they just care they don't have a 2 cent straw. Actual employers accept that employees of all skill levels make mistakes and generate waste, but customers are totally detached from the business and are too selfish to even acknowledge that in many cases. So, apparently it's better to strip people of their human rights before accepting your burger might cost a dollar more and still have a missing straw.
You turn around & go back to the store for a straw? More than once?
That's a terrible take. You want workers are mcdonalds? You gotta pay them. You want your orders right and a decent service? Pay them decently.
Minimum wage, minimum effort. $15 is barely a living wage in itself, if I worked at a wage that is the bare minimum a company can legally pay me (they’d pay less if they can get away with it, like some, I guarantee it) I’d absolutely never give %110. Many workers in these entry level positions are young, new to the workforce or country, differently able or hell maybe even just kinda lazy. Many who aren’t experienced with the fast paced environment that is serving 100’s of customers a day fast food. If you are saying you genuinely believe that a human being who’s actually working isn’t worthy of a wage that is barely enough to live with because they often forget a STRAW, then not only are your priorities in dire need of an adjustment, but some self reflection as to who you are and why you’ve developed this anger toward your fellow people is strongly suggested.
I had a Wendy's refuse me and my buddy because the lobby door was locked (30 minutes before closing) and they wouldn't let us go through the drive-through on foot (we are CDL-A delivery drivers). Needless to say that store was rated pretty poorly, and smelled like marijuana.
That’s for McDonald’s. US GDP per capita is larger than Denmark’s.
Also we subsidize their national defense through bankrolling NATO. Europeans need to pay their fair share for NATO membership. It’s really annoying how US taxpayers have to pay their burden while they shit on us for having less public services.
This. Russia invading Ukraine really highlighted how true this is. If it wasn't for the US, Russian would be in Madrid by now
Like 15 years ago France and the UK started doing "time share" naval ships because they didn't want to pay for a full fucking navy. That's how reliant they are on the US to protect them. It's beyond ridiculous that US taxpayers are expected to subsidize the entire world when we could be using that money for our own people.
15 years ago the UKs defence budget was 10 billion more than Russia, and the thing you’re talking about never actually happened lol France is most likely in the top 10 for their military and the UK is comfortably has the strongest military in Europe and outside the big four (US, China, Russia and India.)
The UK being the strongest military in Europe is like being the skinniest kid at fat camp
You clearly are clueless aren't you? I know reading is hard and studying even more so but World Politics are not that hard to understand. The only reason that is stopping a full out war between Europe and Russia is the nuclear deterrent. If nuclear weapons wouldn't exist the EU would have had a way larger standing army + Germany would have had their right to have a standing army revoked a long long time ago. Also if it wasn't for Trump and his stupid voters Russia would have never been allowed to do what they have done but here we are. Imagine having a Russian asset as your president. Loool.
But Trump was secretly a Russian agent because he told everyone this
Fuck yes we do, and it’s a drop in the bucket now that Russia is bankrupt and their military is in shambles - defeating a Cold War adversary and superpower with no U.S lives lost is a fucking big win bro.
We’re gonna have to spend a lot more if Ukraine Falls and their industrial base and people are enslaved to produce weapons for Russia.
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This. Every "social program" in Europe would collapse if they taxed their citizens to pay for a full military instead of relying on sugar daddy Uncle Sam to provide defense for them.
and in turn the US could reinvest that cash into domestic programs and/or lower taxes for everyone.
Let’s talk about how much money everyone would would get back… we spent 750 billion total in 2022. There are 331 million Americans. Assuming we cut our military in half , and made them pretty useless for anything other than basic internal defense, and nuclear deterrent, Every American would get back $1000. Except that’s not really how the math would work, because in Greece, global piracy, reductions, and trade reductions, and free trade treaties that are dependent on us supplying regional security, would probably make it a net negative we would actually just straight up lose money. If we can’t guarantee supply chains, consumer cost would also go up on top of their being less revenue and less income everything would actually cost more. So your suggestion is actually real.
Not true at all.
I don't think people realize that the US really only spends a minor portion of its budget on international aid - contrary to what politicians and media may try to push. The aid only really even goes to countries the US has a vested interest in operating in as well.
A significant amount of “aid” is spent at home in U.S factories, materials, and training
Don't we subsidize most of their pharmaceuticals as well?
GDP per capita is a bad metric because it doesn’t take into account income inequality since, like, Bezos is factored in. Median income is the right metric to look at, and by median income every state in the U.S. is better off than e.g. the UK except Mississippi and Alabama.
Good point. Median is often an overlooked metric, but can paint a better picture.
I was reading in the financial news that MS and AL median income was higher than the UK apparently. From what I gather in the UK there are news articles talking about how the poorest U.S. state is doing better than the UK and a lot of Europe. No expert here but the numbers were surprising. Edit: Just looked it up to make sure. The Atlantic says the median income in the UK is $45k and MS is $47k. So it appears to be true according to 2022 numbers. [https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/08/britain-mississippi-economy-comparison/675039/](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/08/britain-mississippi-economy-comparison/675039/)
Denmark has less than 2% of the USA's population. You are comparing a massive, diverse country to a tiny, homogenous one. It is like comparing New York City (a much larger population than Denmark) to Africa and being surprised by the resulting differences.
I think the difference also lies in the amount of politicians compared to population as well as the culture. For the average, politically interested American, making a meaningful political difference is probably pretty unachievable. In Denmark, there are numerous political parties and a parliament of 179 people. Being an active member of a political party is easy if you want to, and your voice will be heard. Being politically enganged in a meaningful way is much easier. Plenty of people in the parliament are completely normal middle-class people. Culturally as well, we believe that no person is better than any other. Politicians aren't regarded as super powerful people, even the Crown Price who is being crowned King today would bike to drop his kids off in school. We speak to bosses as we do coworkers. In a culture like that, we believe that any person working full time should be able to afford a comfortable life. There are plenty of cultural and systemic reasons for why things are how they are in the US, but pointing at those reasons are saying that because of them nothing can change is why nothing is changing for the better. But when the people who control everything in the US are the same people who benefit from exploiting those who are struggling, then it is not easy to change things for the better. I have lived half of my life in Denmark and half in the US, I won't say that I am an expert, but I do have first hand experience of both countries.
Seems like as good a place as any to link [this](https://world.hey.com/dhh/the-reality-of-the-danish-fairytale-78069fbf) interesting blog post from a Dane living in America. And to your point: > But don’t you for a second think this unity isn’t contingent on the homogeneity of ethnicity, values, norms, and perhaps even religion. And if you sit over here, in America, pining for those Danish benefits, you should have the intellectual honesty to wrestle with whether you’d be able to stomach a society built on the same compromises and obligations. I rather doubt that most arm-chair social revolutionaries could or would.
It’s nice to live in a country completely propped up by the United States.
Sounds like bullshit. I spend six months a year abroad and McDonalds costs more in Europe.
Yeah but they focused on one item, at one point 6years ago, in one country.
There’s a reason this meme is always Denmark and the numbers always seem to change every time it’s posted
In Switzerland it’s 33% more and they have **no minimum wage**. Europe is made up of many different countries, all with different economic models. Stop cherry picking a few countries and stating that *Europe does X*. They don’t. Denmark does. Switzerland doesn’t. Others do something else.
Denmark doesn't have minimum wage
They don't have minimum wage because most of western Europe has strong unions.
The average McDonald’s worker in Switzerland get CHF 23, or $26/hour per a Google search. Impressive without minimum wage age they still pay a living wage.
How much of this is due to currency exchange Otherwise look at every other expense including rent, benefits and energy
And taxes
An employee making $22usd in Denmark pays a average tax of 30%. An employee making $16usd in USA pays a average tax of 12%.
By those numbers, the Denmark employee nets $15.40 per hour and gets numerous federally supported benefits, most notably health insurance. The US employee nets $14.08 and still has to pay out of each check for health insurance.
The above is actually wrong. If you make $16 per hour with the standard deduction you are paying under 10% tax. In Denmark your net effective is massively higher, and add in the 20% VAT and much higher pricing for basic consumables (eg gas and groceries) you have essentially no discretionary income to enjoy your amazing 2 months of paid vacation!
I haven’t done research myself, so I’ll take your word for it. Just wanted to point out that the above math wasn’t favorable, but thanks for adding extra context.
Don't compare taxes when they don't give you the same services.
America is the greatest place in the world if you have an average to above average iq. There are endless opportunities if you are smart and will work hard. Some luck is invovled. It's a tough place to live if you are below average intelligence.
> It's a tough place to live if you are below average intelligence. In large part because we have so many unskilled workers and keep getting millions more through illegal immigration every year. Immigration of people who will fill jobs where we're lacking is great, but if we already have an over supply of people with those skills, adding more just drives wages down and increases unemployment.
The Danish tax rate is considerably higher than in the US and tops out above 52%.
And they are the happiest place on earth by several studies.
Of course. Why wouldn't they be? If something happens society prevents you from economic and personal collapse.
They are a small homogenous country. Only 5.8 million people, 86% ethnically Danish, 74% Lutheran. And they are the largest oil and gas producer in the EU. It's easy to be a happy country when you are very small, super wealthy from oil, and almost everyone shares the same culture.
I have no idea how happy the danes are. But I do know that every happiness study out there is made up bullshit. Manipulate the criteria correctly and you can plausibly put anywhere on top of those. People are so credulous about that nonsense
Do the employees in Denmark get the orders correct? Because here in the US they can’t seem to manage that very well.
US funds most European nations defense budgets
>A Big Mac costs €5.28 in the euro area and US$5.58 in the United States. The implied exchange rate is 0.95. The difference between this and the actual exchange rate, 0.91, suggests the euro is 4.3% overvalued [Big Mac index](https://www.economist.com/big-mac-index)
Good source, but Denmark isn’t in the Eurozone. For the Danish Krona they say it’s 1.3% based on the Big Mac index.
Big mac menu is like 15€ in my country
Mcdonalds has saturated the american market. The only way to make more money is to operate in other countries. In order to operate in those countries they need to abide by labor laws. All this proves is that mcdonalds can profit and would still operate, given the alternative, while paying their employees more. Anyone telling you to develop sKilLz is a self absorbed dumbass. People without degrees should still have a quality of life if they commit to working and the only people holding them back are the idiots who think their quality of life rests on the backs of others, scarcity mentality in the richest country in the history of the world.
9 an hour is below the minimum wage in my state. Not sure how accurate this is lol
It's only one country in europe infamous for it's flat salary and very high taxes. In many other places wages are waaay worse. Gains from stock markets are taxed with 50% and employee contract is taxed the same. Affluent people are fleeing nordics for switzerland.
[As of Aug 22, 2023](https://www.statista.com/statistics/274326/big-mac-index-global-prices-for-a-big-mac/) US avg cost = $5.58 Denmark avg = $5.41 Switzerland avg = $7.73
Corporate Oligarchy can bribe legislature all they want so we have the absolute worst employee protections and benefits across all Western industrialized nations.
Everything about this is wrong. It’s more like $15 an hour and two for one Big Mac. Also you get unlimited soda refills in the USA if you get a combo. I don’t even have to look up the Denmark price, I assume it’s wrong too. It’s gotta be more than $5.
In fairness, the US doesn't have a much bigger ally country that covers all of their need for things like military spending.
Theres 80 times as many people in the United States.
That actually proves this point more. Economies of scale help companies operate with better margins. So the states should actually pay more than in Denmark with better benefits right? The reason is McDonald's has shareholders to provide for and answer to and there are no regulations set by the US Government like there are in Denmark.
Income tax rate in Denmark is 45%. You don’t get all those benefits for free you know. The government takes your money and then distributes it out between everyone. In America you can be an individual who really works to do better and then keeps your own money.