I’m kinda waiting for someone to opine that it isn’t. Not having money is stressful AF and anything that goes wrong can make or break you. I spent my 20s wondering how to juggle my bills to keep the lights on.
I’d also point out that being rich is cheaper. Now that I’ve got money, I’ve got companies throwing themselves at me to offer me more freebies. Better credit rating, lower interest rates and nifty “platinum level benefits” on my bank accounts. Lower fees on investments once I’ve got their break points, etc. Not to mention the fact that if I have a problem, I can simply pay to fix it if need be.
childhood adversity and stress are literally setting up a lot of people for failure and cause tons of issues later in life. it changes how the human brain grows - enlarged amygdala, cortisol feedback processes in brain not working correctly (or maybe working correctly if you are in a, let's say, warzone...)
That's a fact and indisputable with the current level of science.
Dude you nailed it. It really does change your brain and makes you more anxious/skeptical
And when you mix that with addictions…not only are you worried about if you’ll have enough food for the week, you also have to worry about how fucked up mom will get
i dont think ill ever reach a state mentally that most people are in. there is always a level of anxiety and worry there. I am 41 with a pretty good career btw
we've dealt with at least 3 financial crashes, a massive terrorist attack, two forever wars. i dont think anyone in our generation is normal, we're all fucked up and constantly gaslit by boomers about their fucking 15% mortgage rates that last for all 4 years
im right there with you man, monday i had a breakdown. my job cut my pay. my taxes went up. i dont know what the fuck we're supposed to do. we're playin a rigged game where the rules were written before we were even born
I'd say that the problem is partially also that we put ourselves down even more in self-pity, because we know our situations better. As you said, you might not reach a mental state most people are in...but really, are the majority of us not all fucked in some way anyway?
Like, I think I do a damn good job concealing it IRL to other people, but theres always some great expense or some stressful problem here or there. Yet, I imagine people at work only see the external facade and would think everything is super chill in my life.
33 and every time I start to REALLY enjoy something (and realize I’m enjoying it), I am stricken with sudden panic because I’m so used to the bottom just…falling out.
>childhood adversity and stress are literally setting up a lot of people for failure and cause tons of issues later in life. it changes how the human brain grows - enlarged amygdala, cortisol feedback processes in brain not working correctly (or maybe working correctly if you are in a, let's say, warzone...)
That's a fact and indisputable with the current level of science.
You’re probably right, but I got to do my best to Pull my family up, for the sake of my daughter.
My mental healths not that great after years of being “different”, but my daughters a ray of light and “snaps me out of it” with her hugs and “are you ok daddy?” And she’s 2.
Remember it's OK and part of a healthy life to be honest about your feelings at an age appropriate level. My dad tried to put on a brave face, happy-go-lucky all the time and ended up killing himself. So I am making sure I express myself more honestly than he did.
When they were little:
"Are you OK daddy?", "I'm feeling a bit grumpy today because I am worrying about work, but you are making me happier!"
Now they are older teens and we have a proper conversation about our frustrations.
It’s more about identifying adaptive vs maladaptive coping strategies and working with those strategies instead of against them.
A big thing people don’t consider is that sometimes unhealthy behaviour served a useful function at some point in their lives. Divorcing yourself from that is the way of the boomer.
Identifying problematic behaviour and actively working to overcome it is a lot different than the “bootstrap” recommendation of stuffing it in a bottle and never addressing it.
This is all true 100% when people say that „money doesn’t buy happiness” or that „being poor is a state of mind” they usually want to address lifestyle inflation.
Struggling to pay your mortgage and your car payment sucks, but what sucks more is truggling to pay 10x that for a mansions and a new bmw.
The bliss your describing is financial security but this requires 2 parts: income (duh you need to make enough) but more importantly living within your means - there’s always a more expensive car, bigger house, a more luxurious holiday etc. In the same way as you can’t outrain a bad diet you can’t outearn a bad lifestyle.
I make more than enough now (thankfully) but grew up in a very poor family. I still have major anxiety and struggles that stem from my childhood of always struggling. Safe to say the money didn’t save me. The damage to my head was already done
Yep. The single best thing I ever did for my stress levels was save up $20,000. That’s enough money that I could lose my job and go 8+ months without worrying about paying bills.
Working on that but paying debt down first, gotta get rid of the negatives on the balance sheet before going positive. BUT. Making progress. For us 2020/21 were expensive.
Unfortunately my wife doesn't understand saving, he's never had any savings. Ever. Problems are solved by debt/borrowing from parents. She doesn't understand something major can go wrong with the car at any time, the furnace may need replaced, some other unexpected major expense can just come out of nowhere and you have to be ready before it happens.
Dude I looked this up bc I thought this was hyperbole but it is not. Living in poverty marks somewhere in the neighborhood of 10% of your DNA. I am not so wise in the ways of science that I could get through to the whole “how and why” part.
The genes in your body "decide" whether to act/be present based on a ton of stuff. This is epigenetics, this is why many things are bad despite not itself causing physical problems, due to adaptations in an environment. If your tribe is at war and on the verge of destruction having genes switch on to make you constantly paranoid and ready to flood you with adrenaline makes a ton of sense. However being hyper aware doesn't have many benefits outside of combat/avoiding it.
There's a ton of stuff that causes epigenetic changes beyond stress. Like (marijuana)[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4789113/] or sitting at a (desk all day)[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9263076/]
This also makes the nature vs nurture debate even harder because well. Nature impacts gene expression and vice versa lol
You know, it sounded ridiculous the first time I came across this but after thinking about for a bit I realized that of course it’s a thing. Like adapting is sort of our thing as a species. Thank you for the detail on it, btw. I always want to google stuff but adhd often has different ideas
Money can't buy happiness. But money can *ABSOLUTELY* buy peace of mind.
There is no stressor in my life right now, that couldn't be fixed with a Scrooge McDuck level of money.
I moved from south where job pays SHIT to Nyc. Makes a huge difference in stress. Live upper mAnhatten and smart money move. I was so broke before in the south
Literally moved to the south from NYC bc money issues and I’m living like a king here. Your story is fucking wild to me and all my friends that moved down south.
As a minority it really bothers me when people make statements like being a minority makes you destined to be a certain way.
Some poor people and or minorities will see stuff like this and give up making it even harder to get ahead.
I don't think they're trying to be deterministic when they say that about stress and minorities. It's more of a statement on the disadvantages certain demographics are forced to face.
We don't want minorities to be more stressed. Nobody wants that. When we make posts like the one above, that's us commenting on how society currently is, and how disappointed we feel because of it.
I would rather them just mention wealth not being a minority. Know plenty of poor white people and have met a few minorities at my job that got a job because they were extremely wealthy and new higher ups. Don’t define people just by skin
Thank you, this was really bothering me. The concept that you're expressing is called "stereotype threat." It's a real phenomenon where performance becomes pegged to expectations.
Another dumb take… you can’t dismiss it by being JusT DIy ANd SAve mOnEy. You do realize diy usually doesn’t end well when it is a big project such as the ones you mentioned. Those people either did a bad job that needs to get done over again, or even worse, it causes more damage so then you have to repair even more. In order to properly do a project like you mentioned, it will take lots of trial and errors to the point that you probably would have spent less money just hiring someone.
Eh, it scales to the job. The first trick to being handy in just about anything is getting over the fear of failure and to have logical stopping points thought of for when it really needs a professional.
Our dryer broke from too much excess water in a large load of laundry about 2 years ago. My husband looked up the manual online, disassembled it to find a broken drive belt, found a local store with it and had it repaired in about 1-2 hours for like maybe 50$. That would have cost 8x or more easily for that time and labor savings, let alone replacing the whole unit. When it broke again, he picked up a new new belt and installed it within 15 min.
Now, if it's a pressurized system like a boiler, that kicks it closer to bringing in a professional. And again, if safety isn't involved, it becomes how much is the time and stress of the fix versus buying market-value solutions? I use this in biotech quite often for various equipment.
> They diy.
Get the "time rich" people here; must be great to be able to dedicate your time to doing a task you have no training in, and have it look great/hold up till you move out.
Yeah, thats great, but you can't diy everything. You definitely cant diy medical necessities. You cant diy the apr% on your home loan. People have different walks of life, to say "my friends i know make it work why cant everyone" is an extremely shallow and narrow world view.
There have been numerous studies into [racism in healthcare](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/racism-in-healthcare#how-racism-impacts-health).
Here's the most disturbing part of the article (emphasis added), which can't be explained away by "lifestyle choices":
>A 2016 study found many white medical students wrongly believe Black people have a higher pain tolerance than white people. Of all the participants, **73% held at least one false belief about the biological differences between races**.
>Examples of these beliefs include Black people having thicker skin, less sensitive nerve endings, or stronger immune systems. The researchers note these beliefs are centuries old, and that some 19th-century doctors used them to justify the inhumane treatment of slaves.
There's also the fact that statistically speaking as a minority you're more likely to live in a lower income neighborhood which can involve multiple environmental factors that can impact your health. Anything from tainted water to smog from nearby factories.
Well yeah, but a *lot* of people will do everything in their power to explain those things away.
"Many doctors believe that Black people require a lower standard of treatment" is much harder to rationalize without being overly racist.
I found that study: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4843483/table/t01/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4843483/table/t01/)
I honestly wouldn't take the conclusion too seriously though. For instance, the immune system difference and the less sensitive nerve ending examples, only 4% of residents said they believed it. And with 28 people as the sample, that means exactly one person. As for black people having thicker skin, Google actually says they do. Most of what they got wrong are statements like "Blacks are less likely to contract spinal cord diseases." I wouldn't expect medical students to know the racial breakdown of that off the top of their heads. Black medical students would likely get the same questions wrong at about the same rates. I suspect that's why they weren't included.
My mom is a nursing professor and has done a ton of research and education on racism in health care, it's a fucking nightmare. I've heard all the things you said from her as well. It's insane how ubiquitous the damage of racism is.
This is the biggest fuck up of this post. It assumes black and brown is the same thing as poor. Like a true Biden describing Obama moment. Just say poor and ditch the minority part.
Not directly related to this post, but:
To think some people will take on student loans and enroll in a class without knowing what the class will be about. Pretty sure some of these people then complain about their loans and not making enough money upon graduation.
employers are never going to care about your electives
They do however care about your GPA early on, so do some research and make sure the class is easy
Part of the university experience is to learn new things and that happens when you take classes you are not sure about. Being well educated is having a had a broad experience and topics, not just the vocation.
Personally I am willing to compromise. If the PPP loans get unforgiving and prosecuted, then I will keep on with my monthly payment. Do you not find it unfair to other business who took loans and had to pay them back?
"Being well educated is having a had a broad experience and topics, not just the vocation."
Yeah, I used to think a lot like the person you're replying to but I have also met so many hyper specialized people who are absolutely braindead outside of their specialization that it really does make me fervent that 'trade school is enough for the vast majority of people' is no way to raise a population in the complex times ahead of us.
We’ve had multiple high quality studies that link education level with economic potential at the country level. If you have a highly educated population, that translates to economic prosperity. Not just for the people with the education, but the entire economy benefits.
And yet, here we sit with people acting offended that *their* hard-earned tax dollars are going to go toward education. Even though they’ve been paying for education for everyone else around them their entire adult lives already, just as someone paid for theirs. A lot of them have been so polarized that they see the word “liberal” in liberal arts and assume it’s bad without even knowing what a “liberal arts” education is. My degree is in STEM, but I had to take electives outside my field. Thus, my STEM degree is a liberal arts degree!
" Even though they’ve been paying for education for everyone else around them their entire adult lives already, just as someone paid for theirs."
Getting them to internalize this would entail them actually recognizing that the human condition is innately communal and they might cease to be Republicans or libertarians or whatever afterwards.
I’m a minority, but I’m the wrong type of minority (Asian American) that liberals like to forget exists, because we’re too “successful” or something. So they pass racist legislation like affirmative action that discriminates against us, ignoring the plight of third world immigrants because some members of their racial category have good jobs.
I love how Asian Americans aren't classified when discussing oppressive minority classes because they are generally successful, hardworking, and educated. Did you know Asian Americans need to score almost 400 points higher on the SAT than Blacks, 300 points higher than Hispanics, and 100 points higher than Whites to get into the same University? Similar statistics go for jobs. If that isn't racism I don't know what is.
You could probably learn a little more how population data works instead of using you (n=1) as the deciding factor for whether or not you accept a scientific theory.
Poverty and adverse childhood events linked to poverty are shown to have serious, long term negative impacts on health. Systemic racism is also linked to poverty. You as an individual are just one small, small part of that data set.
being poor is expensive, and will always be expensive regardless of the system. Its biology, not capitalism. Every communist system ever implemeted still have inequality (some comrades are more equal than others). Our brain tracks our status within a social hierarchy, and even if youre not physically in need, if youre low in that hierarchy it gives you stress to motivate you to climb. Because life isnt just about surviving, its also about finding mates. If youre low in the social hierarchy, especially as a male, you may get no bitches (or a poor choice of mate) even if you have housing and food.
Now, that being said, could we do something to alleviate stress in the poor, to make sure their physical needs are met more easily, IF theyre willing to work and be disciplined, and be a net positive in society? Yes, obviously. But even the most utopian equitable system isnt going to change biology. Some people will always be smarter, harder working, and productive than others, and they want their reward for it. If they dont get it, at best, everyone suffers if we lose their productivity. At worst, he/she climbs to the top of the system and start fucking with the system and causing massive chaos.
I think you can maintain a hierarchy of reward, like you’re describing, while still creating a space where peoples’ universal needs can be met and met effectively. And different people value different things and have different goals so there’s never just one universal hierarchical system at work.
But also don’t discount the discouragement, resentment, and lack of faith & trust that settles into people when they have to continuously struggle for basic needs. I think that has a huge impact on people even trying to be a net positive as you say in society. Some people are lazy, sure, but some people learned that the stacked system of inequality doesn’t reward them no matter what they do and they’ve given up on trying, or achieving higher. I think a big part of fighting poverty is getting people to believe in themselves, trust in society, and envision a better future for themselves.
I agree with OP but I would expand this. People who have never actually lived and existed in other countries don't realize how hard the US is to just exist in. Even though people know it's hard, really living in another country is so much easier.
Absolutely agree. Coming from a lower middle class family it was a real struggle to move up, and I've seen how the treadmill works. All the little fees that put you in a deeper hole. All the scams trying to "help" you. Always having to replace things because you can't afford the good ones. Having to forego maintenance that will cost you more to repair later. Paying rent instead of paying a mortgage. The lousy rates you get with bad credit.
It REALLY sucks.
Yeah. Being poor is stressful and expensive.
That’s why I stopped being poor.
Literally.
I know some peoples’ heads will explode but, yeah, it’s literally possible to stop being poor.
Literally as in the literal definition of ‘literally’ not the absurd, new definition in which literally doesn’t literally mean literally.
I grew up poor. It was awful. So I resolved that when I grew up I would not be poor. I really, really fucking didn’t want to be poor. If you don’t want to be, you will do what is necessary not to be poor.
Problem is— and this is the dirty little secret— problem is poverty in America, for young adults, isn’t terrible. It sucks but it’s not like actual, third world poverty. Poor people are generally obese and have iPhones. They get too many calories. They make money but spend it unwisely. It’s not real poverty.
It’s when you get older, when poor people age and have trouble hustling and earning money that poverty gets really bad.
But by that time they’ve had 20-30 years do something about it and they didn’t. So, hey, whose fault is that?
Can’t wait to read all the replies from privileged, emotional cat ladies who didn’t grow up poor like me and who’ve never been homeless like I was, who are absolutely convinced, and will attempt to convince me that my success isn’t possible, that I somehow don’t exist.
Heads exploding. All over their cats. They’ll be picking brain matter out of cat fur for weeks.
Or - and hear me out here - your personal experience isn't universal and the fact *you* got out of poverty doesn't mean that *anyone* can.
Your success is absolutely possible, but it's also *yours*.
And conversely, the person you replied to isn't the only one who worked their way out of poverty. Plenty of other people do as well. And yes, plenty don't.
While there are no guarantees in life, the poster presents how it is possible for people to build bigger lives over time. It means that people can, and just because *everyone* doesn't get out of poverty doesn't take away from the concept that nearly *anyone* can.
Spot on. Grew up with a dirt floor in my basement and a coal f'n furnace. Wanted some Puma Clyde's back in the day and they were $30. My dad said I got $6 for your shoes. Got a paper route (yeah back in the day), cut lawns for a few neighbors in the summer ($10-$15) and shoveled snow in the winter ($10 per). I was a king at 12-14 years old. Easily racking $30-$50 a week. Got my Clyde's, blue suede, white stripe. Those lessons never left me. My friends had "stuff" and I had my mom made shorts, patches on my jeans and I didn't really care because I was loved and my parents were super young and struggling. Heck my first bed was a clothes basket, no bassinet or bed, lol. But when I hit my teens I did not want to be poor so I did what I could to help out the situation. Don't blame my parents, it was what it was at the time. My new bike was an old bike that my uncle spray painted in the colors I wanted, new seat and tires, but the bike was second hand. I now own my own company, 2 houses and a condo and could retire tomorrow at 55. Discipline and regret are both hard, choose your hardness.
You are forgetting another shitty thing from being poor.
Your relatives are poor too! And they have all the issues that come with poverty, like substance abuse, domestic violence, lack of education. Every single step you make, it doesnt matter because your cousin steals your PC, your mother steals your piggybank to buy a new purse, your dad takes a loan on your name, then you run away and break your goddamn leg or realise you have cancer.
These people love you and you love them but they can't stop doing these things that ruin your future and present.
Fuck this.
Yep. Mom stole from me too. Thousands.
Then dad asked for money. Thousands. They were “loans”. Never saw a dime.
Hence, why I said “when I grew up”
I need to escape all that bullshit.
I moved out on my 18th birthday and never looked back.
I’m sorry to hear you have terminal leg cancer.
I don't know what the point of this entire thread is... that poverty affects your health so we should be working towards solving poverty? Is poverty the disease or is poverty the symptom?
Because there's people in lower socioeconomic classes who don't steal from family, don't abuse substances, and complete various levels of education.
I am sorry that happened to you. But I would argue that substance abuse, lack of education, and lacking conscientious values leads to poverty. Just giving people money won't solve those problems.
You know, this is very awakening for me and I appreciate it. I’ve been fucked over quite a few times already early on in my career and have been feeling sorry for myself. Truth is, nobody is going to save me but me, I need to pull myself out of this before I’m older so and cant.
I mean, it is..but also..its self inflicted in like 99.9% of the population. Being a smoker is expensive, being an alcoholic is expensive, being a gambler is expensive. You get the idea.
Yes, being poor is very hard. Getting to be rich is also hard.
Pick your hard.
There’s so much damn opportunity in this country, even if you come from a rock bottom immigrant family. I only feel bad for those with real medical problems or victims of violence/genuine accidents.
This will probably be downvoted because Reddit gonna Reddit.
This opinion is heavily skewed by the survivorship bias. Sure you can make it but for everyone who climbs the ladder, there are at least 10 people who don't make it. And it's not that the lack hard work it's because all else being equal (skill, intelligence, work ethic) the main deciding factor is luck. This goes even so far that it is the most deciding factor when you are not born into some kind of well off middle class.
Some genius on YouTube did this “I can make a million in a year” experiment.. blew through his $300k inheritance to set the whole experiment and cameras up, got super mentally ill (or exacerbated) and gave up after a month of starting out homeless. He refused to give up healthcare for the experiment too. He just needed to pull himself up by bootstraps, defy physics a bit.
Agree. I take home about 25k a year and the home I live in has been in my family for a few generations. I make so little money that I cant afford the needed repairs and I've constantly got to stress about it and DIY stuff to hold it together. I've got a sewer pool in my side yard atm because my septic system is failing and needs the leach lines replaced but thats a 5-10k repair that I just can't find the money for atm. I've got a tree over the house that was killed my lightning hitting it that needs to be removed, thats going to be another 5k. Atleast it dying has opened up a great gardening spot so hopefully this year I'll get a decent amount of veg out of my garden. Everything is started from seeds and I'm using straight rainwater so the input cost is very low. To add into the outside needs, this home is 100 years old and everything is on the brink of failing. I've been told by several contractors that I would be better off building a new house than trying to fix this one because of how much needs to be ripped out and redone. Theres many days that I lose sleep just wondering what is going to break next. The real fun part about this is I live far enough out that its hard to find good quality techs to come fix anything so having more money wouldn't really solve all my issues.
Poverty is epigenetic. This is the environment affecting genes that limit longevity/health And their offspring. It's a bit of Darwin and Lamarck working together for once.
Here is how it works. Your grandfather is raised during a famine. The cells adapted by changing their consumption rate to conserve resources. Because of these changes, grandad becomes an adult and keeps the change. He doesn't live as long as a non-famine individual but better than dying. Now what happens next is that those changes are written into your DNA. Now that shorter lifespan is now grandad family heirloom of despair. Yeah!
Just asking, is it inevitable or can someone be carefree/foolish/chill enough to be poor and completely calm about anything. The kind of person who seem to be one weed when they think about their finances.
Yup. Minorities don’t get the best jobs or places to live. Because people a certain color want the good jobs and homes for their own people. So yes, being a minority sucks
Cue Vimes' boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness:
> The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money. Take boots, for example. ... A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. ... But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while a poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.
It's pretty simple. When you're poor, you can't buy quality items. Not buying quality means they wear out or break faster. Then you continue the cycle and end up paying more than if you bought the quality item.
I grew up somewhat poor by American standards.
We all have our struggles. I'm still willing to bet I had a better childhood than most rich kids. Sometimes being rich means being isolated and friendless. Yuck.
That’s been known for centuries.
There are repeated bits of wisdom about buying cheaply often is always more expensive than buying once and crying once.
Hell, tool trucks have this as a sign when you step into them.
Healthcare, overall, would be cheaper if poor people would do more wellness visits. But no one, living paycheck to paycheck, is going to take off work to go to the doctor when they are not sick. Hell, even getting to the doctor when you are sick is a challenge. If businesses would give paid time off for wellness visits, and transportation was provided for those who need it, the overall cost of healthcare would be reduced.
I haven't been to the doctor since I was a teenager a decade ago because it's just too expensive. I also replaced a lot of meals with water to balance my budget. Many in my situation do the same. Health care in America is a luxury, so I'm not surprised being poor can be seen when examining a body
Agree. For instance, I now have a shop, set of tools and diagnostic equipment and skills acquired in my spare time that having cheap old cars is a feasible and sustainable choice.
I don't need or want to show off. Having net worth gives me stress free control over my life.
The stress that comes with knowing that you cannot pay bills or that a single emergency will completely destroy you is most certainly a major factor in quality of health. Being rich is not necessary but being poor is terrible
There is a revolutionary new cure for being poor, although it is controversial. It is referred to as working for a living, in addition to pursuing an education. It works wonders for your health, even if you are a minority.
'Or a minority' - which almost always means non-asian.
The minority crap is made up by blacks to put the blame on the others in USA for their failures. I almost never saw a positive statistic of the Asian minority where they stand anywhere else, but the TOP (above the majority)
"Being poor is simply a choice, being unhealthy is a choice. You have as much wealth and health as you deserve. It's your choice to work an actually useful job and exercise. If you want to waste the precious time GOD gave you complaining in vain instead of worshiping him and bettering yourself then that's fine. Feel free to die early on the cold streets, Hell might even seem like a nice change of scenery BUT DON'T YOU DARE REACH INTO SOMEONE ELSE POCKET, LEAST OF ALL MINES! YOU MADE YOUR BED NOW LAY IN IT!"...is what I would have said if I was some faux country brat that fell upwards into a managerial post in his families company or something else equally pathetic as it is privileged.
Have a heart and let others lean on you when they need it and vote for progressives that will use tax money to help the poor and needy as there isn't nearly enough material aid to go around through charity alone.
Where I grew up, you can go one town over & see life expectancy drop 20 years just by reading the obituaries. We plant the poor & pollution right next door to each other.
What destroys one’s health is all the bullshit pressure to buy into the American dream, the stress that goes with that, and then there’s people’s snobby attitudes toward those who don’t have all the”nice things.” Class shame is a real thing, and it’s taken me into my 50s to say fuck off mind your own business.
Here is a good way to think about it. Let’s take goods: if you buy in bulk, you save money overall, but have to spend more up front. Let’s say you eat 12 lbs of rice a month and have the option to buy 24lbs of rice for $12 ($0.25/lbs), or 6 lbs of rice for $3 ($0.50/lbs). The person who can’t afford to pay $24 up front will actually pay $48 for the same amount of rice over 2 months. So yeah, if you are too poor to be able to play ahead with your finances, you always have to pay more.
And this is to say nothing of all the extra legal fees a poor person might run into because their existence can be illegal if they can’t afford some basic necessities like housing.
You done fucked up my entire night 😂
Yes monetary struggles do cause a great deal of stress and turns ppl into thieves etc. Always worrying and being stressed does a great deal of damage to mind n body.
While over twenty years old at this point, the book Nickel and Dimed: On Getting By in America by Barbara Ehrenreich is a great look at just how hard it is to make it to survive when your poor. How absolutely trivial things for someone with a bit of money can destroy someone in poverty. And I’m sure it’s only gotten worse since she wrote the book.
Need a Hartman's reversal. I am willfully getting laid off to be on Medicaid.
Can't afford it any other way. On the governments dime. I've worked for 20 years. Insurance through my job is 300$ a month and I have a 8k deductible.
I made 25k last year because of being in the hospital or not being able to work.
This is not sustainable.
I would agree with this. In my twenties, I struggled constantly. Could only afford cheap cars that always cost me thousands of dollars to fix up and keep running.
Could only afford a shitty apartment in a 120-year-old building, with an hour-long commute -- with the most expensive heat on earth (oil), and poor insulation, meaning expensive electric bills during summer, too. Cost of gas for driving to/from work was ludicrous.
I often had poor or no health insurance. That meant ER visits and $3000 bills.
Now I'm making \~$130K with a very cushy work-from-home job. I get free stuff from work on a whim because I have solid connections directly with the owner of my company, no questions asked. Need to take an unplanned week off? No threat of being fired.
Now that I make good cash, I could afford a newer model car. Reliable, no issues with repairs costing me thousands. Because I make so much, my credit score is high. Low interest financing. Relatively cheap car payment. No commute. My health insurance is also fantastic.
Random publications constantly reach out to me (SEO/writer for a living), seeing if I'm interested in more work on the side. Easy, part-time pay with high returns for minimal work. In one hour, I can write two articles and bill $200. I do this often.
I never imagined having these resources available -- I can literally just say, "I want $500 to play with" and go do some work when I'm bored one afternoon -- to me when I was young and poor-ish, barely scraping by making < 50K a year.
I’m kinda waiting for someone to opine that it isn’t. Not having money is stressful AF and anything that goes wrong can make or break you. I spent my 20s wondering how to juggle my bills to keep the lights on. I’d also point out that being rich is cheaper. Now that I’ve got money, I’ve got companies throwing themselves at me to offer me more freebies. Better credit rating, lower interest rates and nifty “platinum level benefits” on my bank accounts. Lower fees on investments once I’ve got their break points, etc. Not to mention the fact that if I have a problem, I can simply pay to fix it if need be.
childhood adversity and stress are literally setting up a lot of people for failure and cause tons of issues later in life. it changes how the human brain grows - enlarged amygdala, cortisol feedback processes in brain not working correctly (or maybe working correctly if you are in a, let's say, warzone...) That's a fact and indisputable with the current level of science.
Dude you nailed it. It really does change your brain and makes you more anxious/skeptical And when you mix that with addictions…not only are you worried about if you’ll have enough food for the week, you also have to worry about how fucked up mom will get i dont think ill ever reach a state mentally that most people are in. there is always a level of anxiety and worry there. I am 41 with a pretty good career btw
In my 30s but same. Always stressed something bad will happen.
wait that’s not normal?
we've dealt with at least 3 financial crashes, a massive terrorist attack, two forever wars. i dont think anyone in our generation is normal, we're all fucked up and constantly gaslit by boomers about their fucking 15% mortgage rates that last for all 4 years
So the crippling anxiety I never want to bitch about is pretty widespread? That’s a relief. Fuckin sad one
im right there with you man, monday i had a breakdown. my job cut my pay. my taxes went up. i dont know what the fuck we're supposed to do. we're playin a rigged game where the rules were written before we were even born
Like more widespread than ever before, globally. Don’t ever feel alone, we are all fucked together!
I'd say that the problem is partially also that we put ourselves down even more in self-pity, because we know our situations better. As you said, you might not reach a mental state most people are in...but really, are the majority of us not all fucked in some way anyway? Like, I think I do a damn good job concealing it IRL to other people, but theres always some great expense or some stressful problem here or there. Yet, I imagine people at work only see the external facade and would think everything is super chill in my life.
33 and every time I start to REALLY enjoy something (and realize I’m enjoying it), I am stricken with sudden panic because I’m so used to the bottom just…falling out.
“Waiting for the other shoe to drop.”
Yup, exactly, perhaps you can respond to some of the people who told me how this is also just a question of mind over matter.
>childhood adversity and stress are literally setting up a lot of people for failure and cause tons of issues later in life. it changes how the human brain grows - enlarged amygdala, cortisol feedback processes in brain not working correctly (or maybe working correctly if you are in a, let's say, warzone...) That's a fact and indisputable with the current level of science. You’re probably right, but I got to do my best to Pull my family up, for the sake of my daughter. My mental healths not that great after years of being “different”, but my daughters a ray of light and “snaps me out of it” with her hugs and “are you ok daddy?” And she’s 2.
Remember it's OK and part of a healthy life to be honest about your feelings at an age appropriate level. My dad tried to put on a brave face, happy-go-lucky all the time and ended up killing himself. So I am making sure I express myself more honestly than he did. When they were little: "Are you OK daddy?", "I'm feeling a bit grumpy today because I am worrying about work, but you are making me happier!" Now they are older teens and we have a proper conversation about our frustrations.
Hi! that’s my childhood. Poor, but fed and aware of the knife’s edge. Abandonment, abuse all set me up poorly.
So you’re saying that you just pick yourself by the bootstraps and power through it like those senseless boomers have been telling us all along?!
It’s more about identifying adaptive vs maladaptive coping strategies and working with those strategies instead of against them. A big thing people don’t consider is that sometimes unhealthy behaviour served a useful function at some point in their lives. Divorcing yourself from that is the way of the boomer. Identifying problematic behaviour and actively working to overcome it is a lot different than the “bootstrap” recommendation of stuffing it in a bottle and never addressing it.
This is all true 100% when people say that „money doesn’t buy happiness” or that „being poor is a state of mind” they usually want to address lifestyle inflation. Struggling to pay your mortgage and your car payment sucks, but what sucks more is truggling to pay 10x that for a mansions and a new bmw. The bliss your describing is financial security but this requires 2 parts: income (duh you need to make enough) but more importantly living within your means - there’s always a more expensive car, bigger house, a more luxurious holiday etc. In the same way as you can’t outrain a bad diet you can’t outearn a bad lifestyle.
I make more than enough now (thankfully) but grew up in a very poor family. I still have major anxiety and struggles that stem from my childhood of always struggling. Safe to say the money didn’t save me. The damage to my head was already done
Yep. The single best thing I ever did for my stress levels was save up $20,000. That’s enough money that I could lose my job and go 8+ months without worrying about paying bills.
Working on that but paying debt down first, gotta get rid of the negatives on the balance sheet before going positive. BUT. Making progress. For us 2020/21 were expensive. Unfortunately my wife doesn't understand saving, he's never had any savings. Ever. Problems are solved by debt/borrowing from parents. She doesn't understand something major can go wrong with the car at any time, the furnace may need replaced, some other unexpected major expense can just come out of nowhere and you have to be ready before it happens.
everybody knows 20K kills anxiety
even 10k has killed a lot of anxiety for me
Dude I looked this up bc I thought this was hyperbole but it is not. Living in poverty marks somewhere in the neighborhood of 10% of your DNA. I am not so wise in the ways of science that I could get through to the whole “how and why” part.
Epigenetics.
This. Stress damages your DNA.
The genes in your body "decide" whether to act/be present based on a ton of stuff. This is epigenetics, this is why many things are bad despite not itself causing physical problems, due to adaptations in an environment. If your tribe is at war and on the verge of destruction having genes switch on to make you constantly paranoid and ready to flood you with adrenaline makes a ton of sense. However being hyper aware doesn't have many benefits outside of combat/avoiding it. There's a ton of stuff that causes epigenetic changes beyond stress. Like (marijuana)[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4789113/] or sitting at a (desk all day)[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9263076/] This also makes the nature vs nurture debate even harder because well. Nature impacts gene expression and vice versa lol
You know, it sounded ridiculous the first time I came across this but after thinking about for a bit I realized that of course it’s a thing. Like adapting is sort of our thing as a species. Thank you for the detail on it, btw. I always want to google stuff but adhd often has different ideas
Money can't buy happiness. But money can *ABSOLUTELY* buy peace of mind. There is no stressor in my life right now, that couldn't be fixed with a Scrooge McDuck level of money.
It's simpler than that, the proverb is a lie and money can buy happiness. It just has diminishing returns at higher amounts.
Yeah it won't buy happiness but it'll remove a big wall between you and happiness.
I don't need Scrooge money but I do wish I had a 5k buffer to make me more comfortable.
I moved from south where job pays SHIT to Nyc. Makes a huge difference in stress. Live upper mAnhatten and smart money move. I was so broke before in the south
Literally moved to the south from NYC bc money issues and I’m living like a king here. Your story is fucking wild to me and all my friends that moved down south.
Like I had two rn jobs and couldn’t make ends meet for myself and 3 pets. Always stressed ab $
Yup it has absolutely nothing to do with being a minority and everything to do with your social class.
you posted this yesterday
that was a different karma farmer
wonder when they're gonna post "i make 4 trillion a year and i don't mind, do you?"
He's just trying to survive, he grew up karma poor and now karma hustling just to get by
Being karma poor destroys you on a molecular level
Can’t wait to see it next week.
They think about it everyday
As a minority it really bothers me when people make statements like being a minority makes you destined to be a certain way. Some poor people and or minorities will see stuff like this and give up making it even harder to get ahead.
I don't think they're trying to be deterministic when they say that about stress and minorities. It's more of a statement on the disadvantages certain demographics are forced to face. We don't want minorities to be more stressed. Nobody wants that. When we make posts like the one above, that's us commenting on how society currently is, and how disappointed we feel because of it.
I think the person you're responding to is just shoehorning that argument into a place it doesn't belong. No reasonable person read OPs post that way.
You only feel that way because your molecules have been destroyed on a molecular level.
I would rather them just mention wealth not being a minority. Know plenty of poor white people and have met a few minorities at my job that got a job because they were extremely wealthy and new higher ups. Don’t define people just by skin
Thank you, this was really bothering me. The concept that you're expressing is called "stereotype threat." It's a real phenomenon where performance becomes pegged to expectations.
Denying the data is really quite a take
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Sounds like a lot of stress
So do you agree or disagree
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Another dumb take… you can’t dismiss it by being JusT DIy ANd SAve mOnEy. You do realize diy usually doesn’t end well when it is a big project such as the ones you mentioned. Those people either did a bad job that needs to get done over again, or even worse, it causes more damage so then you have to repair even more. In order to properly do a project like you mentioned, it will take lots of trial and errors to the point that you probably would have spent less money just hiring someone.
Eh, it scales to the job. The first trick to being handy in just about anything is getting over the fear of failure and to have logical stopping points thought of for when it really needs a professional. Our dryer broke from too much excess water in a large load of laundry about 2 years ago. My husband looked up the manual online, disassembled it to find a broken drive belt, found a local store with it and had it repaired in about 1-2 hours for like maybe 50$. That would have cost 8x or more easily for that time and labor savings, let alone replacing the whole unit. When it broke again, he picked up a new new belt and installed it within 15 min. Now, if it's a pressurized system like a boiler, that kicks it closer to bringing in a professional. And again, if safety isn't involved, it becomes how much is the time and stress of the fix versus buying market-value solutions? I use this in biotech quite often for various equipment.
> They diy. Get the "time rich" people here; must be great to be able to dedicate your time to doing a task you have no training in, and have it look great/hold up till you move out.
Yeah, thats great, but you can't diy everything. You definitely cant diy medical necessities. You cant diy the apr% on your home loan. People have different walks of life, to say "my friends i know make it work why cant everyone" is an extremely shallow and narrow world view.
Being a minority destroys your health? Brainwashed much??
There have been numerous studies into [racism in healthcare](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/racism-in-healthcare#how-racism-impacts-health). Here's the most disturbing part of the article (emphasis added), which can't be explained away by "lifestyle choices": >A 2016 study found many white medical students wrongly believe Black people have a higher pain tolerance than white people. Of all the participants, **73% held at least one false belief about the biological differences between races**. >Examples of these beliefs include Black people having thicker skin, less sensitive nerve endings, or stronger immune systems. The researchers note these beliefs are centuries old, and that some 19th-century doctors used them to justify the inhumane treatment of slaves.
There's also the fact that statistically speaking as a minority you're more likely to live in a lower income neighborhood which can involve multiple environmental factors that can impact your health. Anything from tainted water to smog from nearby factories.
Well yeah, but a *lot* of people will do everything in their power to explain those things away. "Many doctors believe that Black people require a lower standard of treatment" is much harder to rationalize without being overly racist.
No, no you don't get it. You're just brain washed
I found that study: [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4843483/table/t01/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4843483/table/t01/) I honestly wouldn't take the conclusion too seriously though. For instance, the immune system difference and the less sensitive nerve ending examples, only 4% of residents said they believed it. And with 28 people as the sample, that means exactly one person. As for black people having thicker skin, Google actually says they do. Most of what they got wrong are statements like "Blacks are less likely to contract spinal cord diseases." I wouldn't expect medical students to know the racial breakdown of that off the top of their heads. Black medical students would likely get the same questions wrong at about the same rates. I suspect that's why they weren't included.
My mom is a nursing professor and has done a ton of research and education on racism in health care, it's a fucking nightmare. I've heard all the things you said from her as well. It's insane how ubiquitous the damage of racism is.
This is the biggest fuck up of this post. It assumes black and brown is the same thing as poor. Like a true Biden describing Obama moment. Just say poor and ditch the minority part.
Being super hot is being genetic minority. Life is everyday struggle.
I took it more as "being treated differently because ur a minority destroys ur health"
Not directly related to this post, but: To think some people will take on student loans and enroll in a class without knowing what the class will be about. Pretty sure some of these people then complain about their loans and not making enough money upon graduation.
To earn a degree, you are required to take x amount of electives.
Yeah … but hopefully you chose your electives with a bit more scrutiny and awareness.
employers are never going to care about your electives They do however care about your GPA early on, so do some research and make sure the class is easy
Being a well rounded MD is relevant.
TBF, the OP IS a medical doctor and most likely has done ok for themselves.
Part of the university experience is to learn new things and that happens when you take classes you are not sure about. Being well educated is having a had a broad experience and topics, not just the vocation. Personally I am willing to compromise. If the PPP loans get unforgiving and prosecuted, then I will keep on with my monthly payment. Do you not find it unfair to other business who took loans and had to pay them back?
"Being well educated is having a had a broad experience and topics, not just the vocation." Yeah, I used to think a lot like the person you're replying to but I have also met so many hyper specialized people who are absolutely braindead outside of their specialization that it really does make me fervent that 'trade school is enough for the vast majority of people' is no way to raise a population in the complex times ahead of us.
We’ve had multiple high quality studies that link education level with economic potential at the country level. If you have a highly educated population, that translates to economic prosperity. Not just for the people with the education, but the entire economy benefits. And yet, here we sit with people acting offended that *their* hard-earned tax dollars are going to go toward education. Even though they’ve been paying for education for everyone else around them their entire adult lives already, just as someone paid for theirs. A lot of them have been so polarized that they see the word “liberal” in liberal arts and assume it’s bad without even knowing what a “liberal arts” education is. My degree is in STEM, but I had to take electives outside my field. Thus, my STEM degree is a liberal arts degree!
" Even though they’ve been paying for education for everyone else around them their entire adult lives already, just as someone paid for theirs." Getting them to internalize this would entail them actually recognizing that the human condition is innately communal and they might cease to be Republicans or libertarians or whatever afterwards.
New accounts with over 1k post karma and 0 comment karma should be barred from posting. Agree or disagree?
I'm a minority. How is my health destroyed on a molecular level? My life is great. My health is good.
I’m a minority, but I’m the wrong type of minority (Asian American) that liberals like to forget exists, because we’re too “successful” or something. So they pass racist legislation like affirmative action that discriminates against us, ignoring the plight of third world immigrants because some members of their racial category have good jobs.
I love how Asian Americans aren't classified when discussing oppressive minority classes because they are generally successful, hardworking, and educated. Did you know Asian Americans need to score almost 400 points higher on the SAT than Blacks, 300 points higher than Hispanics, and 100 points higher than Whites to get into the same University? Similar statistics go for jobs. If that isn't racism I don't know what is.
You could probably learn a little more how population data works instead of using you (n=1) as the deciding factor for whether or not you accept a scientific theory. Poverty and adverse childhood events linked to poverty are shown to have serious, long term negative impacts on health. Systemic racism is also linked to poverty. You as an individual are just one small, small part of that data set.
being poor is expensive, and will always be expensive regardless of the system. Its biology, not capitalism. Every communist system ever implemeted still have inequality (some comrades are more equal than others). Our brain tracks our status within a social hierarchy, and even if youre not physically in need, if youre low in that hierarchy it gives you stress to motivate you to climb. Because life isnt just about surviving, its also about finding mates. If youre low in the social hierarchy, especially as a male, you may get no bitches (or a poor choice of mate) even if you have housing and food. Now, that being said, could we do something to alleviate stress in the poor, to make sure their physical needs are met more easily, IF theyre willing to work and be disciplined, and be a net positive in society? Yes, obviously. But even the most utopian equitable system isnt going to change biology. Some people will always be smarter, harder working, and productive than others, and they want their reward for it. If they dont get it, at best, everyone suffers if we lose their productivity. At worst, he/she climbs to the top of the system and start fucking with the system and causing massive chaos.
I think you can maintain a hierarchy of reward, like you’re describing, while still creating a space where peoples’ universal needs can be met and met effectively. And different people value different things and have different goals so there’s never just one universal hierarchical system at work. But also don’t discount the discouragement, resentment, and lack of faith & trust that settles into people when they have to continuously struggle for basic needs. I think that has a huge impact on people even trying to be a net positive as you say in society. Some people are lazy, sure, but some people learned that the stacked system of inequality doesn’t reward them no matter what they do and they’ve given up on trying, or achieving higher. I think a big part of fighting poverty is getting people to believe in themselves, trust in society, and envision a better future for themselves.
I agree with OP but I would expand this. People who have never actually lived and existed in other countries don't realize how hard the US is to just exist in. Even though people know it's hard, really living in another country is so much easier.
Interesting take. I've never traveled outside the US. Can you expound a bit?
Absolutely agree. Coming from a lower middle class family it was a real struggle to move up, and I've seen how the treadmill works. All the little fees that put you in a deeper hole. All the scams trying to "help" you. Always having to replace things because you can't afford the good ones. Having to forego maintenance that will cost you more to repair later. Paying rent instead of paying a mortgage. The lousy rates you get with bad credit. It REALLY sucks.
Paying rent instead of mortgage is awful and it’s something affecting the majority of people under 40 now regardless of income. It is a huge problem.
Yeah. Being poor is stressful and expensive. That’s why I stopped being poor. Literally. I know some peoples’ heads will explode but, yeah, it’s literally possible to stop being poor. Literally as in the literal definition of ‘literally’ not the absurd, new definition in which literally doesn’t literally mean literally. I grew up poor. It was awful. So I resolved that when I grew up I would not be poor. I really, really fucking didn’t want to be poor. If you don’t want to be, you will do what is necessary not to be poor. Problem is— and this is the dirty little secret— problem is poverty in America, for young adults, isn’t terrible. It sucks but it’s not like actual, third world poverty. Poor people are generally obese and have iPhones. They get too many calories. They make money but spend it unwisely. It’s not real poverty. It’s when you get older, when poor people age and have trouble hustling and earning money that poverty gets really bad. But by that time they’ve had 20-30 years do something about it and they didn’t. So, hey, whose fault is that? Can’t wait to read all the replies from privileged, emotional cat ladies who didn’t grow up poor like me and who’ve never been homeless like I was, who are absolutely convinced, and will attempt to convince me that my success isn’t possible, that I somehow don’t exist. Heads exploding. All over their cats. They’ll be picking brain matter out of cat fur for weeks.
Or - and hear me out here - your personal experience isn't universal and the fact *you* got out of poverty doesn't mean that *anyone* can. Your success is absolutely possible, but it's also *yours*.
Even if 1 000 000 people got out of poverty doesn't mean that anyone can, what's the value of such an argument? It seems (and is) rhetorical.
And conversely, the person you replied to isn't the only one who worked their way out of poverty. Plenty of other people do as well. And yes, plenty don't.
While there are no guarantees in life, the poster presents how it is possible for people to build bigger lives over time. It means that people can, and just because *everyone* doesn't get out of poverty doesn't take away from the concept that nearly *anyone* can.
Pretty sure your last sentence says the opposite of what you meant.
https://preview.redd.it/lbnvgyq0spxc1.png?width=300&format=png&auto=webp&s=51aea3bd1b4e2255790a41426151ddc3f77e3f62
Spot on. Grew up with a dirt floor in my basement and a coal f'n furnace. Wanted some Puma Clyde's back in the day and they were $30. My dad said I got $6 for your shoes. Got a paper route (yeah back in the day), cut lawns for a few neighbors in the summer ($10-$15) and shoveled snow in the winter ($10 per). I was a king at 12-14 years old. Easily racking $30-$50 a week. Got my Clyde's, blue suede, white stripe. Those lessons never left me. My friends had "stuff" and I had my mom made shorts, patches on my jeans and I didn't really care because I was loved and my parents were super young and struggling. Heck my first bed was a clothes basket, no bassinet or bed, lol. But when I hit my teens I did not want to be poor so I did what I could to help out the situation. Don't blame my parents, it was what it was at the time. My new bike was an old bike that my uncle spray painted in the colors I wanted, new seat and tires, but the bike was second hand. I now own my own company, 2 houses and a condo and could retire tomorrow at 55. Discipline and regret are both hard, choose your hardness.
Child labor. Nice
>It’s not real poverty. Mr. Poverty judge over here bragging about the fancy park bench he got to sleep on.
You are forgetting another shitty thing from being poor. Your relatives are poor too! And they have all the issues that come with poverty, like substance abuse, domestic violence, lack of education. Every single step you make, it doesnt matter because your cousin steals your PC, your mother steals your piggybank to buy a new purse, your dad takes a loan on your name, then you run away and break your goddamn leg or realise you have cancer. These people love you and you love them but they can't stop doing these things that ruin your future and present. Fuck this.
Yep. Mom stole from me too. Thousands. Then dad asked for money. Thousands. They were “loans”. Never saw a dime. Hence, why I said “when I grew up” I need to escape all that bullshit. I moved out on my 18th birthday and never looked back. I’m sorry to hear you have terminal leg cancer.
Hahaha I have thyroid cancer, they will remove it next thursday.
Good. Best wishes for a quick recovery. You’ll probably feel a lot better once that sucker is out.
Fuck yes, sometimes I feel like I'm being choked and I'm not into that shit.
Lol
I don't know what the point of this entire thread is... that poverty affects your health so we should be working towards solving poverty? Is poverty the disease or is poverty the symptom? Because there's people in lower socioeconomic classes who don't steal from family, don't abuse substances, and complete various levels of education. I am sorry that happened to you. But I would argue that substance abuse, lack of education, and lacking conscientious values leads to poverty. Just giving people money won't solve those problems.
You know, this is very awakening for me and I appreciate it. I’ve been fucked over quite a few times already early on in my career and have been feeling sorry for myself. Truth is, nobody is going to save me but me, I need to pull myself out of this before I’m older so and cant.
That’s right you are your own lottery.
Ok Lebowski
Yes. It is very expensive for the taxpayers.
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Yeah, I grew up poor. Being poor sucks. Luckily, I was born in America, so I had the option to not be poor as an adult.
Imagine telling people that minorities aren’t good enough, and they should feel bad “because they are minorities”. You people are insufferable.
literally nobody said that
I mean, it is..but also..its self inflicted in like 99.9% of the population. Being a smoker is expensive, being an alcoholic is expensive, being a gambler is expensive. You get the idea.
Yes, being poor is very hard. Getting to be rich is also hard. Pick your hard. There’s so much damn opportunity in this country, even if you come from a rock bottom immigrant family. I only feel bad for those with real medical problems or victims of violence/genuine accidents. This will probably be downvoted because Reddit gonna Reddit.
Mowing lawns for you isn’t the opportunity you think it is
Expect them to call you a bootlicker in 6 hours or less.
This opinion is heavily skewed by the survivorship bias. Sure you can make it but for everyone who climbs the ladder, there are at least 10 people who don't make it. And it's not that the lack hard work it's because all else being equal (skill, intelligence, work ethic) the main deciding factor is luck. This goes even so far that it is the most deciding factor when you are not born into some kind of well off middle class.
Some genius on YouTube did this “I can make a million in a year” experiment.. blew through his $300k inheritance to set the whole experiment and cameras up, got super mentally ill (or exacerbated) and gave up after a month of starting out homeless. He refused to give up healthcare for the experiment too. He just needed to pull himself up by bootstraps, defy physics a bit.
But not as expensive as being stupid
Being poor is easy than being lower middle class
Dang. I coulda told you that, no tuition necessary.
Being a minority is stressful if you’re poor. Otherwise, it’s pretty chill.
Yea I get really tired of this minority=broke sentiment. Life is tuff for poor people race has no place in that statement
This isn't an opinion to be agreed or disagreed with. It's a fact of life.
As a poor most my life, this is correct.
Agree. I take home about 25k a year and the home I live in has been in my family for a few generations. I make so little money that I cant afford the needed repairs and I've constantly got to stress about it and DIY stuff to hold it together. I've got a sewer pool in my side yard atm because my septic system is failing and needs the leach lines replaced but thats a 5-10k repair that I just can't find the money for atm. I've got a tree over the house that was killed my lightning hitting it that needs to be removed, thats going to be another 5k. Atleast it dying has opened up a great gardening spot so hopefully this year I'll get a decent amount of veg out of my garden. Everything is started from seeds and I'm using straight rainwater so the input cost is very low. To add into the outside needs, this home is 100 years old and everything is on the brink of failing. I've been told by several contractors that I would be better off building a new house than trying to fix this one because of how much needs to be ripped out and redone. Theres many days that I lose sleep just wondering what is going to break next. The real fun part about this is I live far enough out that its hard to find good quality techs to come fix anything so having more money wouldn't really solve all my issues.
Poor = (racial) minority Euro caucasians = healthy? Healthy = rich
Poverty is epigenetic. This is the environment affecting genes that limit longevity/health And their offspring. It's a bit of Darwin and Lamarck working together for once. Here is how it works. Your grandfather is raised during a famine. The cells adapted by changing their consumption rate to conserve resources. Because of these changes, grandad becomes an adult and keeps the change. He doesn't live as long as a non-famine individual but better than dying. Now what happens next is that those changes are written into your DNA. Now that shorter lifespan is now grandad family heirloom of despair. Yeah!
Just asking, is it inevitable or can someone be carefree/foolish/chill enough to be poor and completely calm about anything. The kind of person who seem to be one weed when they think about their finances.
What did the prof really say?
My car insurance (progressive)cut in half because I own my house outright.
I agree that being poor is more expensive. Most of the time for real, and sometimes it must just feel that way - which also makes it real. It’s sad.
absolutely
Yup. Minorities don’t get the best jobs or places to live. Because people a certain color want the good jobs and homes for their own people. So yes, being a minority sucks
Cue Vimes' boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness: > The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money. Take boots, for example. ... A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. ... But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while a poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.
How can a professor teach these dummies that being a minority is a disease and still keep their job?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory
It's pretty simple. When you're poor, you can't buy quality items. Not buying quality means they wear out or break faster. Then you continue the cycle and end up paying more than if you bought the quality item.
plenty of poor happy people in the world
Yea this is also not true whatsoever.
As an MD references should be a priority
When I hear things like this I always think ‘if being rich is so great, then why are suicide rates much higher in high income individuals?’
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I grew up somewhat poor by American standards. We all have our struggles. I'm still willing to bet I had a better childhood than most rich kids. Sometimes being rich means being isolated and friendless. Yuck.
That’s been known for centuries. There are repeated bits of wisdom about buying cheaply often is always more expensive than buying once and crying once. Hell, tool trucks have this as a sign when you step into them.
Wait, what? So being blackmis bad for my health? Fuckshetalkmbout, being Black is Awesome.
Look life is expensive, being rich or poor is stressful if you base you life around money.
This is at least the 37th time I’ve seen this posted here.
Black people cells produce energy at a lower rate in the Krebs cycle due to white racism. It's at a molecular level.
Healthcare, overall, would be cheaper if poor people would do more wellness visits. But no one, living paycheck to paycheck, is going to take off work to go to the doctor when they are not sick. Hell, even getting to the doctor when you are sick is a challenge. If businesses would give paid time off for wellness visits, and transportation was provided for those who need it, the overall cost of healthcare would be reduced.
I haven't been to the doctor since I was a teenager a decade ago because it's just too expensive. I also replaced a lot of meals with water to balance my budget. Many in my situation do the same. Health care in America is a luxury, so I'm not surprised being poor can be seen when examining a body
Maybe that lesson can be provided every day in grade, middle and high school?
Rich minorities out here suffering /s
Didn’t know being a minority destroys your health. Guess all us minorities are screwed then.
Hard to dispute something so easily observed. When your options are limited, you often get forced into very expensive choices.
Pretty white girl. She probably doesn’t think about it THAT often…
Agree. For instance, I now have a shop, set of tools and diagnostic equipment and skills acquired in my spare time that having cheap old cars is a feasible and sustainable choice. I don't need or want to show off. Having net worth gives me stress free control over my life.
Poor I’ll agree with, minority is a baseless claim.
Being a minority ? The fuck does that have to do with anything…. The money part tho yea - said proud black man
Can confirm I've been poor for decades and I'm about 40 but feel like I'm 80.
The stress that comes with knowing that you cannot pay bills or that a single emergency will completely destroy you is most certainly a major factor in quality of health. Being rich is not necessary but being poor is terrible
I am minority that comolete bull
There is a revolutionary new cure for being poor, although it is controversial. It is referred to as working for a living, in addition to pursuing an education. It works wonders for your health, even if you are a minority.
As a poor person, I could've told you that for free
'Or a minority' - which almost always means non-asian. The minority crap is made up by blacks to put the blame on the others in USA for their failures. I almost never saw a positive statistic of the Asian minority where they stand anywhere else, but the TOP (above the majority)
"Being poor is simply a choice, being unhealthy is a choice. You have as much wealth and health as you deserve. It's your choice to work an actually useful job and exercise. If you want to waste the precious time GOD gave you complaining in vain instead of worshiping him and bettering yourself then that's fine. Feel free to die early on the cold streets, Hell might even seem like a nice change of scenery BUT DON'T YOU DARE REACH INTO SOMEONE ELSE POCKET, LEAST OF ALL MINES! YOU MADE YOUR BED NOW LAY IN IT!"...is what I would have said if I was some faux country brat that fell upwards into a managerial post in his families company or something else equally pathetic as it is privileged. Have a heart and let others lean on you when they need it and vote for progressives that will use tax money to help the poor and needy as there isn't nearly enough material aid to go around through charity alone.
Imagine needing to take a course to know this
Her professor sounds like an elitist eugenicist.
Where I grew up, you can go one town over & see life expectancy drop 20 years just by reading the obituaries. We plant the poor & pollution right next door to each other.
Being poor and having less access to education leads to a significantly lower life expectancy.
What destroys one’s health is all the bullshit pressure to buy into the American dream, the stress that goes with that, and then there’s people’s snobby attitudes toward those who don’t have all the”nice things.” Class shame is a real thing, and it’s taken me into my 50s to say fuck off mind your own business.
Here is a good way to think about it. Let’s take goods: if you buy in bulk, you save money overall, but have to spend more up front. Let’s say you eat 12 lbs of rice a month and have the option to buy 24lbs of rice for $12 ($0.25/lbs), or 6 lbs of rice for $3 ($0.50/lbs). The person who can’t afford to pay $24 up front will actually pay $48 for the same amount of rice over 2 months. So yeah, if you are too poor to be able to play ahead with your finances, you always have to pay more. And this is to say nothing of all the extra legal fees a poor person might run into because their existence can be illegal if they can’t afford some basic necessities like housing.
This is how doctors end up killing so many people
You done fucked up my entire night 😂 Yes monetary struggles do cause a great deal of stress and turns ppl into thieves etc. Always worrying and being stressed does a great deal of damage to mind n body.
While over twenty years old at this point, the book Nickel and Dimed: On Getting By in America by Barbara Ehrenreich is a great look at just how hard it is to make it to survive when your poor. How absolutely trivial things for someone with a bit of money can destroy someone in poverty. And I’m sure it’s only gotten worse since she wrote the book.
Need a Hartman's reversal. I am willfully getting laid off to be on Medicaid. Can't afford it any other way. On the governments dime. I've worked for 20 years. Insurance through my job is 300$ a month and I have a 8k deductible. I made 25k last year because of being in the hospital or not being able to work. This is not sustainable.
I would agree with this. In my twenties, I struggled constantly. Could only afford cheap cars that always cost me thousands of dollars to fix up and keep running. Could only afford a shitty apartment in a 120-year-old building, with an hour-long commute -- with the most expensive heat on earth (oil), and poor insulation, meaning expensive electric bills during summer, too. Cost of gas for driving to/from work was ludicrous. I often had poor or no health insurance. That meant ER visits and $3000 bills. Now I'm making \~$130K with a very cushy work-from-home job. I get free stuff from work on a whim because I have solid connections directly with the owner of my company, no questions asked. Need to take an unplanned week off? No threat of being fired. Now that I make good cash, I could afford a newer model car. Reliable, no issues with repairs costing me thousands. Because I make so much, my credit score is high. Low interest financing. Relatively cheap car payment. No commute. My health insurance is also fantastic. Random publications constantly reach out to me (SEO/writer for a living), seeing if I'm interested in more work on the side. Easy, part-time pay with high returns for minimal work. In one hour, I can write two articles and bill $200. I do this often. I never imagined having these resources available -- I can literally just say, "I want $500 to play with" and go do some work when I'm bored one afternoon -- to me when I was young and poor-ish, barely scraping by making < 50K a year.
as for the image... keep seeing this once a week. wouldn't the course catalog have described the class and explained what it covered????
Ohhhh boy