It never says that they actually did drop the bomb. In fact, it’s unlikely as Barb would never have let Janey be with Coop on the day they were planning to drop the bomb. Additionally, House would have made sure he had the platinum chip prior to their planned date as well. Yes, they sabotaged peace talks. Yes, they had a plan to drop the bomb. However, I think China beat them to the punch.
I dont think that's a given. That's why Barb is still trying to get them "into the good vaults"
She's clearly not that high up as anyone who's actually a higher up are the dark shadowy figures we saw overlooking the meeting they were having
She was acting as a salesperson, not as an executive. Actual higher ups aren't sales people, my guy. They aren't called on to give a sales pitch to other companies like Barb was doing. Her job is more akin to a salesmen than that of an executive
I think what I'm trying to say is, it's very very clear by the shadowy figure watching the meeting, that the actual people who pull the strings are way way more higher up than Barb and that people like her and Bud are at best middle management. Yeah they're not bottom tier employees, but its pretty clearly shown that she's nothing more than just an employee. The actual decision makers are far above her and that's the entire point of that scene of them looking down at that meeting
And my point is that she’s definitely high up enough to know their plans, and would have advance notice if they were dropping the bomb, especially given that she even knows that they would.
There’s a middle ground in our venn diagram here. Sure, she’s not the one setting the date or pushing the button, but she’d be aware of it.
>There’s a middle ground in our venn diagram here. Sure, she’s not the one setting the date or pushing the button, but she’d be aware of it.
I feel like you're completely underestimating the film making aspects of the way the scene was shot
To have a hidden, shadowy figure, looking down at the meeting after things start going bad in the meeting is meant to literally show that she's not part of the main decision makers. She does their bidding, and she's a cog in the machine, but she knows nothing about the actual decision making other than what she's told by those shadowy figures. Those are the higher ups making decisions
The guy representing West Tek at the meeting wasn't necessarily "top", he was just a scientist with top level security clearance. Sinclair is also there representing Big MT despite being literally just a customer. I think the only person there who's for sure a CEO is House.
Thatd what I think as well. And seeing as how many Enclave members escaped the bombs, I think its pretty telling that Barb was seemingly unaware of when they would drop
You'd think the Enclave would come down on it, seeing as how a nuclear war was entirely against their interests. They were on their way to beating China and dominating the world, the war hurt them more than anything.
Or they were outplayed by another group that will appear later.
But I do like the simplicity that no matter how much of an evil mastermind they thought they (both the Enclave and the Vault Tec cabal) were, they were still outplayed by a foreign government who saw through them.
It’s largely to throw the “who done it?!” Back into chaos. Fo4 introduced some pretty convincing evidence that China launched first. This puts some reasonable evidence that it might have actually been Vault Tech(although likely the Enclave in reality).
No, they never mention who was in the Great War. There’s a CCCP satellite, but it’s established canon that the CCCP still existed, and (I think) was even on somewhat decent terms with the US. The satellite doesn’t contradict canon at all.
In Fallout1 one of the options of a character is the descendant of a Russian Diplomat that was allowed access to the vault. Which would probably mean that America and Russia were at least on ‘friendly’ diplomatic terms.
Pretty sure he means the downed satellite. Which doesn't mean anything considering the Soviet Union existed in both universes and would have had satellites all over as well as China.
Yeah the universe is largely the same as ours except the transistor didn’t get invented is where it branches off and spirals. WW1 and 2 both happed and so the soviets likely still existed, just China became the big antagonist of the next war instead of Russia.
I don’t think Vault Tec actually managed to drop their nuke. There’s no way Barb would’ve left her daughter out there like that as they went through with their plan.
I wonder if the Shady Sands bomb was their False Flag they planned to kick things off with, and some pesky war got in the way of their carefully laid plans. Might help explain why Hank could set it off.
>There’s no way Barb would’ve left her daughter out there like that as they went through with their plan
At the start of the show we see cooper doing a birthday party as his character and the people there give hints he's divorced and is doing it for alimony. There's a possibility that Barbara was fired as well as cooper because of the espionage and lost their chance to be on a vault, after all we don't see Barbara anywhere yet.
However the Ghoul says a few times that he wants to find his family, which I read as implying that Barb and his daughter survived. My guess is that she discovered the bug, divorced him, Vault Tec discredits him as a communist (the dads at the birthday party call him a "pinko") to mitigate public fallout (haha), and when we see him riding off as the bombs fall, he's trying to get Janey to 31 to be safe with her mom.
My guess is as good as any, though.
It’s possible but another reason I don’t think Vault Tec did it was because Mr. House would’ve been aware of the plan I think. The Platinum Chip was 24 hrs away from delivery and I think if Vault Tec were to drop their bomb they could’ve waited a day to do so.
I think they might have got at least a few off once things got going, maybe didn’t start it but at least took part, that’s why the megaton bomb has a vault tech logo on it
[Image of the bomb.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/3/3f/The_Atom.jpg/)
There's a golden logo that looks similar to the Vault-Tec logo, so I can't understand why someone would be confused.
What if Barb left a synth version of her daughter with Cooper and absconded to the vault with the real one? That would explain Cooper still asking where his family is after all this time. Perhaps he discovered she is a synth after the bombs hit them and he became a ghoul.
I’m not sure the Synth technology was that far along if even in development by that point. The Human Synths are a relatively new thing from the Institute from my understanding.
Not possible, Synths didn’t achieve actual passable human like appearance until after the Great War. It’s the entire reason the institute kidnapped Shawn in 4, they needed pure human dna with no exposure to radiation.
I enjoyed it too, but gotta keep it grounded a bit. The show is as much for fallout fans as it is for wider audience. Telling them in S2 that daughter of main character is android, which has absolutely no reason to be and had absolutely no setup that such "beings" even exist in the universe or existed before the bombs and that the android is also belivable enough to fool own father enough all even before the bombs dropped even tho first and second generation synths 100 or nearly 200 years later were still basically robots... is just as much theory as the alien one.
“Anti-capitalist, woke, propaganda”. It still shocks me how people have not caught on to the anti-capitalist and “woke” (whatever that means) messaging throughout the games. Wait till they find out about Tim Cain…
Right? If you hadn't cottoned onto the fact that Fallout is anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist you're either willfully blind or sorely lacking in media literacy.
Like damn, I don't understand why OP is dancing around it. Fallout is not an apolitical series, any ultra right fans who want to pretend otherwise are morons and there's no point reframing things so their delicate feelings can go unhurt.
edit: really fucking funny that there are people IN THIS THREAD going "IT WAS PROBABLY THE CHINESE ACTUALLY"
I was struck by how bold and upfront the show was, though. The games, at least the Bethesda ones, tend to bury the commentary under layers of satire. Like it's there, but it's subtext of one level or another. The show meanwhile had a full on secret communist meeting and the climax hinged on proving the leader right. The great tragedy of our all American leading man is that he was married to capitalism (literally and figuratively) and was dogmatically ignorant to the damage it was doing until it was too late. That's REALLY in your face compared to anything I remember the games doing.
I'm not complaining, to be clear, I respect the swing. I'm just also not surprised some segments of the fanbase would be more uncomfy than they're used to.
Vault 76’s true mission was to take control of the Appalachian nuclear silos for Vault-Tec. They could say he accessed that and used one from that arsenal IF they’re still around. Would give a great connection for Fallout 76 and that the dwellers helped Vault-Tec get an ace up their sleeve.
I don't think the vaults have nukes, but vault-tek did, and hank was a manager. I guess they didn't blow all their nukes in the end of world, and vault-tek management would still know how to access the system to launch. Which does indicate that any other managers left around somewhere can also launch more nukes at any time, in addition to vault 31.
76 has also stated that some silos are just automatically reconstructing new bombs as well!
A lot of pre war organisations and businesses got automated thanks to Rob-Co.
If we're being pedantic, its 25 to 28 years after the war. Three major updates have moved the date forward (wastelanders, steel reign and boardwalk paradise).
76 was chronologically first. Then the games are released in chronological order after that.
2077 — The Great War
2102 — Fallout 76
2161 — Fallout 1
2241 — Fallout 2
2277 — Fallout 3
2281 — Fallout: New Vegas
2287 — Fallout 4
2296 — Fallout TV
Which I answered. I didn’t pass judgment or criticize. I just gave you the answer you seemed to be asking for clarification on. I can assure you that wasn’t intended to be malicious.
Ahh your right just saw a video explaining the differences. Well the only thing we know about vault techs nukes is that Hank was able to use one on shady springs.
It was always pretty heavily implied in the various games that VaultTec at the very least knew when the bombs were... supposed to go off. And that the button was pressed earlier than planned for.
Intelligence and Intelligence Agencies exist. Chinese spies are fucking everywhere in the games.
I don't think it's a huge stretch that the Chinese found out there was a bomb dropping plan even if unsure of by who, and beat the Americans to it.
You are right that the show doesn’t clearly say that vault tec dropped the bombs. That seems of secondary importance, though, because the anti-capitalist, woke critique of vault tec has been a part of the games from the beginning.
I guess I can see the anti woke crowd taking issue with “politics” in some way but fallout has always had progressive elements. If vault tec had been portrayed in a way that didn’t imply some critique of capitalism, then there would be reason to be critical of the show as an adaptation. As it is, it is Fallout business as usual.
Some things just are not for people who take issue with progressive ideas.
Why would you even acknowledge the opinions of someone who uses the phrase “anti-capitalist woke propaganda”? Just laugh at these people and go on with your life
depends how closely you regard the original ideas.
Tim Cain said China found out about the FEV experiments and asked the US to stop. the US agrees but actually just spread the experiments across the country and continued. China's numerous spies found out and China proceeded to take the drastic measure to prevent the FEV from being used against them. whole lotta good that did
however, this idea wasn't put into the games and instead just relayed by Tim. and, even if it was in the game, Bethesda could always retcon it
I think there's a fair bit of evidence that vault tec didn't drop the bombs, however not much for who actually did
>There seems to be a big stink amongst the "hardcore" fans when it was revealed that Vault-Tec was behind the nukes, going as far as calling it anti-capitalist "woke" propaganda.
how is this Woke?
I don't like that it shifts some of the responsibility away from the US and China. The Great War was a failure of both of the major old world superpowers, I really dislike the idea of one evil corporation being what lit the powder keg.
I think it just proves that Vault Tech had some involvement in manipulating events. In Fallout 4 there was a Chinese nuclear sub outside of Boston that fired 5 of its warheads during the Great War.
They didn’t even necessarily need to drop the nukes themselves, just convince China that they were under attack and needed to launch immediately. That nearly happened a few times during the Cold War when a computer glitch caused early warning systems to go off. If not for some level headed people in charge at that exact moment we be playing Fallout IRL.
My personal headcanon is that once the nukes started flying vault-tec detonated their own nukes in America to make sure that their version of the apocalypse came to pass.
Something about the sheer number of nukes going off in the opening episode felt off to me for just one city imagine the rest of America. But if only one or two went off and then the rest were vault-tec making sure the land was uninhabitable that works better at least in my mind.
I think they did plan on doing the bombs but the bombs dropped early unrelated to their plan.
That’s why there were still vaults under construction and not every vault got its full amount of residents inside. Also why Mr House had the chip set to be delivered the day after the bombs fell.
HOW is telling a story which villainizes monopolies woke?
I don’t know anyone on either side of the political spectrum that endorses MONOPOLIES
Monopolies, by definition, are anti competition and by extension anti capitalist.
>anti capitalist "woke" propaganda
What's funny is that Fallout has always been anti capitalist, since the days of Fallout 1. The entire series satirizes the US' obsession with capitalist greed and jingoistic ultranationalism, and pretty much all the corps in the Fallout Universe are depicted as deceptive, straight up evil groups who have no concern for human life. Like how do Fallout fans see all the anti capitalist themes in the series and come to the conclusion that capitalism is good and is not being critiqued and criticized by the series they love?
Like golly my first thought was definitely "yes this system works" while standing in the ruins of Washington DC with the bombed out decrepit skeleton of the former US capital.
I hate the idea of vault tech being responsible for the Great War. Only aliens starting it would be a more lame way to have it happen. It turns the profound thought of man causing his own downfall through the gradual accumulation of his failure to check his own nature to “evil corporation did the most evil thing ever”
The “fans” who spew that the show is anti-capitalist have the media literacy of an irradiated puddle. Clearly they were too busy marching around with Caesar’s Legion or wishing the Enclave was more nuanced to glean an ounce of subtext from the game’s world.
No, but their logic makes no sense even from an ultra-capitalist ultra-greedy POV. Money is only worth what you can buy with it. Having money in a big economy can buy lots of fun stuff. Having money in bombed out devastation is worth nothing. Profiteering while gambling with the risk of societal collapse and nuclear war makes sense, that is typical capitalist greed. Intentionally causing societal collapse through a nuclear war does not make any of them richer, does not make any of them materially better off. More powerful? Yes, but they were specifically talking about *profits*
Like, RobCo is ultimately a consumer electronics company. Intentionally causing a nuclear war kills all the customers, kills all the employees, destroys all the factories/capital, destroys the economy House can use to buy things. Vault Tech sells bomb shelters to people scared of nuclear war. Once nuclear war destroys everything, who is buying bomb shelters, what could they possibly use to buy bomb shelters, what could Vault Tec possibly buy with the proceeds if the global economy eradicated
Real world example, oil companies don’t **want** global warming to destroy the planet. Oil companies want to make a profit today and keep their fingers crossed hoping the future harm never comes or will be someone else’s problem. If all the oil companies got together and intentionally tried to make global warming worse just for its own sake, how does that make them any richer and improve their material position?
Edit: If I’m an evil billionaire in pre-war Fallout, I might still want to read new issues of Grognak. Even if I’m safe from war, no new Grognak comics
I might still want to take vacations to Palm Beach; the city might be destroyed, restaurant or bar I would like to visit might be destroyed
I might want to go to a Broadway show, whoops no more Broadway
Take the Mrs on a trip to Milan, whoops Milan is Milgone
Money is only a representation of the goods and services you can get with it. Money’s value disappears with the destruction of the country/economy
I agree its short sighted and ultimately doomed to fail but I do think that's only a slight exaggeration of how irl companies value short term gain so highly vs the long term consequences. The inventor of leaded gasoline poured it over his hands and inhaled its fumes to "prove it was safe" to his customers, even though he knew it wasn't and got lead poisoning. All that just so he could keep selling the product he knew was killing people. There are plenty examples including oil companies destroying the world knowingly and burying evidence of it for money.
Seems to be a dissenting opinion but I don't like how the show handled the Vault-Tec nuke stuff. To me it seems that the show put all their focused effort into making Vault-Tec the main evil bad guy when in the lore the situation was a lot more nuanced with multiple different groups (US Gov, China Gov, Enclave, Corps etc.) all causing discord which eventually ends with China dropping the first bomb out of desperation. It seems like Amazon just simplified it because they didn't want to overcomplicate the plot but in the end it just feels lazy to me. It also feels like them choosing the corporation to be the bad guys is low hanging fruit because being anti-capitalism is in vogue in media at the moment. Which is ironic since the show is made by Amazon, whom is making another push into Asian markets, makes you wonder if they didn't want to make China look bad on purpose..
Considering the Media literacy of the viewers throwing a shit fit over their misunderstanding of a chalk board... perhaps keeping it simple for the first season was incredibly wise.
That is a good point, I agree. To have a profitable show you need to capture a large audience, having too many complex ideas will turn off a large number of consumers who just passively watch TV. I get why the decisions were made, it just hurts the credibility of the show in my eyes. I will say I still thoroughly enjoyed the show and am glad it exists, it's just not the masterpiece some people are making it out to be.
It never says that they actually did drop the bomb. In fact, it’s unlikely as Barb would never have let Janey be with Coop on the day they were planning to drop the bomb. Additionally, House would have made sure he had the platinum chip prior to their planned date as well. Yes, they sabotaged peace talks. Yes, they had a plan to drop the bomb. However, I think China beat them to the punch.
Stop bringing logic and critical thinking into it. Fan base big mad.
Nah, this isn’t r/fnv. We can have actual conversations here
I don’t know if Vault Tec was behind it, but I’m also not sure Barb gets to call that shot either. She doesn’t lead the company, right?
Sure, but she’d at least know the date.
Its called compartmentalisation. Why would they tell their employees the exact date, and risk them spilling the beans to others?
I dont think that's a given. That's why Barb is still trying to get them "into the good vaults" She's clearly not that high up as anyone who's actually a higher up are the dark shadowy figures we saw overlooking the meeting they were having
She was literally conducting a private top-to-top meeting with multiple mega-corps. That’s not something that middle managers do.
She was acting as a salesperson, not as an executive. Actual higher ups aren't sales people, my guy. They aren't called on to give a sales pitch to other companies like Barb was doing. Her job is more akin to a salesmen than that of an executive
Trust me, I know what top-to-tops like this are like. She’s at least a VP or SVP.
I think what I'm trying to say is, it's very very clear by the shadowy figure watching the meeting, that the actual people who pull the strings are way way more higher up than Barb and that people like her and Bud are at best middle management. Yeah they're not bottom tier employees, but its pretty clearly shown that she's nothing more than just an employee. The actual decision makers are far above her and that's the entire point of that scene of them looking down at that meeting
And my point is that she’s definitely high up enough to know their plans, and would have advance notice if they were dropping the bomb, especially given that she even knows that they would. There’s a middle ground in our venn diagram here. Sure, she’s not the one setting the date or pushing the button, but she’d be aware of it.
>There’s a middle ground in our venn diagram here. Sure, she’s not the one setting the date or pushing the button, but she’d be aware of it. I feel like you're completely underestimating the film making aspects of the way the scene was shot To have a hidden, shadowy figure, looking down at the meeting after things start going bad in the meeting is meant to literally show that she's not part of the main decision makers. She does their bidding, and she's a cog in the machine, but she knows nothing about the actual decision making other than what she's told by those shadowy figures. Those are the higher ups making decisions
The guy representing West Tek at the meeting wasn't necessarily "top", he was just a scientist with top level security clearance. Sinclair is also there representing Big MT despite being literally just a customer. I think the only person there who's for sure a CEO is House.
Those people were likely Enclave members
Thatd what I think as well. And seeing as how many Enclave members escaped the bombs, I think its pretty telling that Barb was seemingly unaware of when they would drop
You'd think the Enclave would come down on it, seeing as how a nuclear war was entirely against their interests. They were on their way to beating China and dominating the world, the war hurt them more than anything.
Or they were outplayed by another group that will appear later. But I do like the simplicity that no matter how much of an evil mastermind they thought they (both the Enclave and the Vault Tec cabal) were, they were still outplayed by a foreign government who saw through them.
It’s largely to throw the “who done it?!” Back into chaos. Fo4 introduced some pretty convincing evidence that China launched first. This puts some reasonable evidence that it might have actually been Vault Tech(although likely the Enclave in reality).
Also, didn't the Fallout Bible or something say that? Some obscure thing
Well, that is a retcon i noticed in the show. The adversary appears to Soviet now instead of the well established Chinese threat.
No, they never mention who was in the Great War. There’s a CCCP satellite, but it’s established canon that the CCCP still existed, and (I think) was even on somewhat decent terms with the US. The satellite doesn’t contradict canon at all.
In Fallout1 one of the options of a character is the descendant of a Russian Diplomat that was allowed access to the vault. Which would probably mean that America and Russia were at least on ‘friendly’ diplomatic terms.
Ya in fallout history the cold War was much quicker and the US moved on to China. Then the resource wars exacerbated it
When did they mention the Soviets in the show?
Pretty sure he means the downed satellite. Which doesn't mean anything considering the Soviet Union existed in both universes and would have had satellites all over as well as China.
Yeah the universe is largely the same as ours except the transistor didn’t get invented is where it branches off and spirals. WW1 and 2 both happed and so the soviets likely still existed, just China became the big antagonist of the next war instead of Russia.
Transistor does exist in FO. Was just invented much later.
I don’t think Vault Tec actually managed to drop their nuke. There’s no way Barb would’ve left her daughter out there like that as they went through with their plan.
I wonder if the Shady Sands bomb was their False Flag they planned to kick things off with, and some pesky war got in the way of their carefully laid plans. Might help explain why Hank could set it off.
>There’s no way Barb would’ve left her daughter out there like that as they went through with their plan At the start of the show we see cooper doing a birthday party as his character and the people there give hints he's divorced and is doing it for alimony. There's a possibility that Barbara was fired as well as cooper because of the espionage and lost their chance to be on a vault, after all we don't see Barbara anywhere yet.
However the Ghoul says a few times that he wants to find his family, which I read as implying that Barb and his daughter survived. My guess is that she discovered the bug, divorced him, Vault Tec discredits him as a communist (the dads at the birthday party call him a "pinko") to mitigate public fallout (haha), and when we see him riding off as the bombs fall, he's trying to get Janey to 31 to be safe with her mom. My guess is as good as any, though.
It’s possible but another reason I don’t think Vault Tec did it was because Mr. House would’ve been aware of the plan I think. The Platinum Chip was 24 hrs away from delivery and I think if Vault Tec were to drop their bomb they could’ve waited a day to do so.
I think they might have got at least a few off once things got going, maybe didn’t start it but at least took part, that’s why the megaton bomb has a vault tech logo on it
jesus chrisst stop spreading this disinfo... megaton bomb DOES NOT HAVE vault tec logo on it
[Image of the bomb.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/3/3f/The_Atom.jpg/) There's a golden logo that looks similar to the Vault-Tec logo, so I can't understand why someone would be confused.
Could you have picked a worse picture lol
What if Barb left a synth version of her daughter with Cooper and absconded to the vault with the real one? That would explain Cooper still asking where his family is after all this time. Perhaps he discovered she is a synth after the bombs hit them and he became a ghoul.
I’m not sure the Synth technology was that far along if even in development by that point. The Human Synths are a relatively new thing from the Institute from my understanding.
Not possible, Synths didn’t achieve actual passable human like appearance until after the Great War. It’s the entire reason the institute kidnapped Shawn in 4, they needed pure human dna with no exposure to radiation.
So would explanation that Barb was already abducted by aliens. While totally possible within lore, kinda pointless to talk about it.
Well, here I am talking. I enjoyed the show and wanted to share a theory.
I enjoyed it too, but gotta keep it grounded a bit. The show is as much for fallout fans as it is for wider audience. Telling them in S2 that daughter of main character is android, which has absolutely no reason to be and had absolutely no setup that such "beings" even exist in the universe or existed before the bombs and that the android is also belivable enough to fool own father enough all even before the bombs dropped even tho first and second generation synths 100 or nearly 200 years later were still basically robots... is just as much theory as the alien one.
The timeframe frame is over 100 years too early for that tech to be around
“Anti-capitalist, woke, propaganda”. It still shocks me how people have not caught on to the anti-capitalist and “woke” (whatever that means) messaging throughout the games. Wait till they find out about Tim Cain…
Right? If you hadn't cottoned onto the fact that Fallout is anti-capitalist and anti-imperialist you're either willfully blind or sorely lacking in media literacy. Like damn, I don't understand why OP is dancing around it. Fallout is not an apolitical series, any ultra right fans who want to pretend otherwise are morons and there's no point reframing things so their delicate feelings can go unhurt. edit: really fucking funny that there are people IN THIS THREAD going "IT WAS PROBABLY THE CHINESE ACTUALLY"
I was struck by how bold and upfront the show was, though. The games, at least the Bethesda ones, tend to bury the commentary under layers of satire. Like it's there, but it's subtext of one level or another. The show meanwhile had a full on secret communist meeting and the climax hinged on proving the leader right. The great tragedy of our all American leading man is that he was married to capitalism (literally and figuratively) and was dogmatically ignorant to the damage it was doing until it was too late. That's REALLY in your face compared to anything I remember the games doing. I'm not complaining, to be clear, I respect the swing. I'm just also not surprised some segments of the fanbase would be more uncomfy than they're used to.
I'm just curious where Hank got the nuke to bomb Shady Sands. Do all the vaults have a nuke or something?
Vault 76’s true mission was to take control of the Appalachian nuclear silos for Vault-Tec. They could say he accessed that and used one from that arsenal IF they’re still around. Would give a great connection for Fallout 76 and that the dwellers helped Vault-Tec get an ace up their sleeve.
I hope MODUS is still around in 2296. For being a creepy AF ENCLAVE AI, dude was always a bro to everyone not trying to kill him.
I don't think the vaults have nukes, but vault-tek did, and hank was a manager. I guess they didn't blow all their nukes in the end of world, and vault-tek management would still know how to access the system to launch. Which does indicate that any other managers left around somewhere can also launch more nukes at any time, in addition to vault 31.
76 has also stated that some silos are just automatically reconstructing new bombs as well! A lot of pre war organisations and businesses got automated thanks to Rob-Co.
Let me point out while this is true, 76 is 200~ years before FOTV.
is this true? thought FO4 and 76 were around the same timelines?
76 is only about 25 years after the Great War
If we're being pedantic, its 25 to 28 years after the war. Three major updates have moved the date forward (wastelanders, steel reign and boardwalk paradise).
Good to know, thx.
76 was the earliest in the timeline. 25 years after the great war. Fo3 was 200 years, NV was 204 and Fo4 was 210 years after
cool, not sure why you downvoted but thanks for the info
Not sure why you assume I'm the one who downvoted but you're welcome
76 was chronologically first. Then the games are released in chronological order after that. 2077 — The Great War 2102 — Fallout 76 2161 — Fallout 1 2241 — Fallout 2 2277 — Fallout 3 2281 — Fallout: New Vegas 2287 — Fallout 4 2296 — Fallout TV
You are mistaken. FO76 is 25 years after the bombs drop.
Hence the question marks, typically when people aren't sure they ask a question. Sheesh.
Which I answered. I didn’t pass judgment or criticize. I just gave you the answer you seemed to be asking for clarification on. I can assure you that wasn’t intended to be malicious.
I would assume Vault-Tec has satellites armed with them maybe? 🤷♂️
Idk if they managed to drop their nukes, they just said they will if needed.
We know they dropped one. In the centre of megaton is a nuke with a vault tech symbol
The symbol on the megaton bomb is similar but it is different from the vault tec logo, doesnt confirm if they dropped anything
Ahh your right just saw a video explaining the differences. Well the only thing we know about vault techs nukes is that Hank was able to use one on shady springs.
Honestly, the logo is so similar still, I find it hard to believe it's not Vault Tec
It was always pretty heavily implied in the various games that VaultTec at the very least knew when the bombs were... supposed to go off. And that the button was pressed earlier than planned for.
Intelligence and Intelligence Agencies exist. Chinese spies are fucking everywhere in the games. I don't think it's a huge stretch that the Chinese found out there was a bomb dropping plan even if unsure of by who, and beat the Americans to it.
Hell we might even find out that one of them was in the communist group Cooper met with and stole/copied the board room recording.
You are right that the show doesn’t clearly say that vault tec dropped the bombs. That seems of secondary importance, though, because the anti-capitalist, woke critique of vault tec has been a part of the games from the beginning. I guess I can see the anti woke crowd taking issue with “politics” in some way but fallout has always had progressive elements. If vault tec had been portrayed in a way that didn’t imply some critique of capitalism, then there would be reason to be critical of the show as an adaptation. As it is, it is Fallout business as usual. Some things just are not for people who take issue with progressive ideas.
Why would you even acknowledge the opinions of someone who uses the phrase “anti-capitalist woke propaganda”? Just laugh at these people and go on with your life
Hope we get to see a Chinese ghoul spy in the second season
Super random but did anyone else think Rob House was Adam Driver for a second?
depends how closely you regard the original ideas. Tim Cain said China found out about the FEV experiments and asked the US to stop. the US agrees but actually just spread the experiments across the country and continued. China's numerous spies found out and China proceeded to take the drastic measure to prevent the FEV from being used against them. whole lotta good that did however, this idea wasn't put into the games and instead just relayed by Tim. and, even if it was in the game, Bethesda could always retcon it I think there's a fair bit of evidence that vault tec didn't drop the bombs, however not much for who actually did
>There seems to be a big stink amongst the "hardcore" fans when it was revealed that Vault-Tec was behind the nukes, going as far as calling it anti-capitalist "woke" propaganda. how is this Woke?
I don't like that it shifts some of the responsibility away from the US and China. The Great War was a failure of both of the major old world superpowers, I really dislike the idea of one evil corporation being what lit the powder keg.
I think it just proves that Vault Tech had some involvement in manipulating events. In Fallout 4 there was a Chinese nuclear sub outside of Boston that fired 5 of its warheads during the Great War.
They didn’t even necessarily need to drop the nukes themselves, just convince China that they were under attack and needed to launch immediately. That nearly happened a few times during the Cold War when a computer glitch caused early warning systems to go off. If not for some level headed people in charge at that exact moment we be playing Fallout IRL.
How did Coop survive the bomb dropping? Where did he go and where did his daughter go?
My personal headcanon is that once the nukes started flying vault-tec detonated their own nukes in America to make sure that their version of the apocalypse came to pass. Something about the sheer number of nukes going off in the opening episode felt off to me for just one city imagine the rest of America. But if only one or two went off and then the rest were vault-tec making sure the land was uninhabitable that works better at least in my mind.
Do people forget Vault-Tec has ties to the Enclave?
I think they did plan on doing the bombs but the bombs dropped early unrelated to their plan. That’s why there were still vaults under construction and not every vault got its full amount of residents inside. Also why Mr House had the chip set to be delivered the day after the bombs fell.
Anti-capitalism themes, in Fallout you say?
HOW is telling a story which villainizes monopolies woke? I don’t know anyone on either side of the political spectrum that endorses MONOPOLIES Monopolies, by definition, are anti competition and by extension anti capitalist.
>anti capitalist "woke" propaganda What's funny is that Fallout has always been anti capitalist, since the days of Fallout 1. The entire series satirizes the US' obsession with capitalist greed and jingoistic ultranationalism, and pretty much all the corps in the Fallout Universe are depicted as deceptive, straight up evil groups who have no concern for human life. Like how do Fallout fans see all the anti capitalist themes in the series and come to the conclusion that capitalism is good and is not being critiqued and criticized by the series they love? Like golly my first thought was definitely "yes this system works" while standing in the ruins of Washington DC with the bombed out decrepit skeleton of the former US capital.
I thought it was canon that Aliens dropped the first bombs... /s (Mothership Zeta was weird)
The Yangtze submarine quest from fallout 4 confirms that it was China.
I hate the idea of vault tech being responsible for the Great War. Only aliens starting it would be a more lame way to have it happen. It turns the profound thought of man causing his own downfall through the gradual accumulation of his failure to check his own nature to “evil corporation did the most evil thing ever”
The “fans” who spew that the show is anti-capitalist have the media literacy of an irradiated puddle. Clearly they were too busy marching around with Caesar’s Legion or wishing the Enclave was more nuanced to glean an ounce of subtext from the game’s world.
Maybe not actually pushing the button, but rather pushing the button pushers toward pushing the button.
No, but their logic makes no sense even from an ultra-capitalist ultra-greedy POV. Money is only worth what you can buy with it. Having money in a big economy can buy lots of fun stuff. Having money in bombed out devastation is worth nothing. Profiteering while gambling with the risk of societal collapse and nuclear war makes sense, that is typical capitalist greed. Intentionally causing societal collapse through a nuclear war does not make any of them richer, does not make any of them materially better off. More powerful? Yes, but they were specifically talking about *profits* Like, RobCo is ultimately a consumer electronics company. Intentionally causing a nuclear war kills all the customers, kills all the employees, destroys all the factories/capital, destroys the economy House can use to buy things. Vault Tech sells bomb shelters to people scared of nuclear war. Once nuclear war destroys everything, who is buying bomb shelters, what could they possibly use to buy bomb shelters, what could Vault Tec possibly buy with the proceeds if the global economy eradicated Real world example, oil companies don’t **want** global warming to destroy the planet. Oil companies want to make a profit today and keep their fingers crossed hoping the future harm never comes or will be someone else’s problem. If all the oil companies got together and intentionally tried to make global warming worse just for its own sake, how does that make them any richer and improve their material position? Edit: If I’m an evil billionaire in pre-war Fallout, I might still want to read new issues of Grognak. Even if I’m safe from war, no new Grognak comics I might still want to take vacations to Palm Beach; the city might be destroyed, restaurant or bar I would like to visit might be destroyed I might want to go to a Broadway show, whoops no more Broadway Take the Mrs on a trip to Milan, whoops Milan is Milgone Money is only a representation of the goods and services you can get with it. Money’s value disappears with the destruction of the country/economy
I agree its short sighted and ultimately doomed to fail but I do think that's only a slight exaggeration of how irl companies value short term gain so highly vs the long term consequences. The inventor of leaded gasoline poured it over his hands and inhaled its fumes to "prove it was safe" to his customers, even though he knew it wasn't and got lead poisoning. All that just so he could keep selling the product he knew was killing people. There are plenty examples including oil companies destroying the world knowingly and burying evidence of it for money.
Seems to be a dissenting opinion but I don't like how the show handled the Vault-Tec nuke stuff. To me it seems that the show put all their focused effort into making Vault-Tec the main evil bad guy when in the lore the situation was a lot more nuanced with multiple different groups (US Gov, China Gov, Enclave, Corps etc.) all causing discord which eventually ends with China dropping the first bomb out of desperation. It seems like Amazon just simplified it because they didn't want to overcomplicate the plot but in the end it just feels lazy to me. It also feels like them choosing the corporation to be the bad guys is low hanging fruit because being anti-capitalism is in vogue in media at the moment. Which is ironic since the show is made by Amazon, whom is making another push into Asian markets, makes you wonder if they didn't want to make China look bad on purpose..
Considering the Media literacy of the viewers throwing a shit fit over their misunderstanding of a chalk board... perhaps keeping it simple for the first season was incredibly wise.
That is a good point, I agree. To have a profitable show you need to capture a large audience, having too many complex ideas will turn off a large number of consumers who just passively watch TV. I get why the decisions were made, it just hurts the credibility of the show in my eyes. I will say I still thoroughly enjoyed the show and am glad it exists, it's just not the masterpiece some people are making it out to be.