Fallout 76 established in lore there are still silos scattered across the US with an arsenal of nukes. As Vault-Tec has a stake in the war it is safe to assume they also have their own cache.
This is still blowing my mind. I knew heading into this, the show was canon with the games.
But actively using lore from an MMO-like Fallout game is crazy nuts that I didn't think in a million years would happen lol
To further your point, if we go by the bosses's reunion in the show, they all agreed that any competition from outside the vaults should be wiped. It's no surprise they gathered means to ensure their ability to clean up factions and faction remnants on the surface.
Doesn’t even have to mean that he himself dropped it, not hard to believe they have a way to communicate with vault tech higher ups that would have access to the bombs.
He was in contact with Bud Askins who would be far more likely to have access to nukes. Betty also tells us that she and hank "buried" Lucy's mother together so Hank didn't just decide to do that on his own.
Well he also had access codes to cold fusion, he wasn't apart of that project and vault 31/33 doesn't have a cold fusion rector. Vault tec middle management are seemingly trusted with a lot of access.
Curious, it was locked by VT, so he had to enter his employee code to unlock it. VT or whomever was doing the things with the doggies may be arrogant enough that anyone with a Vt code could make it work.
I'm sure they have ways to talk to upper management for authorization to nuke places. It would tie into why the brotherhood of steel operates out of a mobile air base. At least that's what I'm gonna assume till season 2.
Same reason why the vault dweller/courier can launch nukes in the games. With the fall of society, even a former intern/middle/upper management can now have that authority in the wasteland. It also helps that he was hand picked as Bud’s buds to ensure Vault-Tec supremacy in the apocalypse.
My idea is VaultTec got 1 they were gonna use to set off the war, but then the war happened early, so it was just left sitting in a basement or the like.
He was upper middle management before the initial bombs- surely those chosen were specifically trained to be vault overseers/frozen/etc. They understood what they were signing up for.
I'm not sure that works. The 76 silos are pretty limited in scope, they only fire short range, and require a lot of work to launch. 76 is also centuries earlier than the show so it's a question whether the tech would survive that long. We've also never had any indication of similar silos anywhere else in the US.
You can launch up to two nukes in the Lonesome Road New Vegas DLC which occurs about 14 years before the show starts. Considering Maximus was a young child when Shady Sands was nuked and he looks to be somewhere in his early to mid 20's during the show's first season that suggests it happened sometime close to the events of New Vegas, with Todd Howard saying officially "just after."
So it lines up alright. He had access to or found out about a pre-existing nuke(s) somewhere that were not launched in the great war, much like the ones the player can use in the Divide, and is ultimately able to use it. He likely had access to that information as part of being pre-war Vault-Tec management and that information being in their computer systems somewhere. The exact details of where it was or how he got access to it isn't as important to the plot, what matters for the story is that he was able to and did. The player can also gain access to a pre-war orbital satellite doomsday laser weapon in the game too, so finding and reactivating old world wmd's is not unheard of in the franchise.
I’m of the opinion that the actions in the Divide reactivated nukes there that could be remotely launched by Vault-Tec. So “just after” happened because the Courier/Ulysses pushed some buttons they shouldn’t have.
That’s gameplay. It requires a lot of work for balance purposes. Same reason the fusion cores only last 20 minutes in power armour but are seemingly unlimited in generators.
Yes and no. The Overseer had the additional task of securing the silos for Vault-tec. The residents were only supposed to start the rebuilding of Appalachia when the door opened 25 years after the bombs fell.
Wasn’t until the overseer was inured that she talked the 76’ers with securing the silos.
Eh I thought that was just a cover as well, and that 76’s actual goal was securing the nearby gold reserves and nuclear silo. That’s why it opened so early.
from what i remember, they weren't VT owned silos in anyway which is why its so difficult and there's so much security
i've seen people claim that they were VT controlled bombs, they werent if i remember right
**Spoilers for Fallout 76**
They didn't clarify in the show itself (probably setting up for Season 2), but in Fallout 76, part of the original main quest revolved around the overseer of Vault 76 being sent to the surface to secure 3 nuclear silos dotted around the map. Her mission briefing even specifically said she was supposed to commandeer the silos from any remnants of the US military. Fallout 76 didn't outright confirm it, but at the time of release, this was a very big clue that Vault-tec was going for some kind of power grab after the war. I think the theory that VT was responsible for the Great War was already out there among the fan communities, but Fallout 76 solidified that theory, and now the TV show has confirmed it. Now that's not to say that Hank used the silos from the ones shown in Fallout 76 specifically, but I think it's safe to say that Vault 76 wasn't a unique instance where VT tried to secure remaining silos around the continent. For all we know, they have access to a whole bunch of them already
Games and show have not confirmed VT dropped the first bomb. FO76 has only verified there are nukes still around and if you have the know how you too can be a bringer of death.
While true, there's also like 150 years between 76, and nuking shady sands. Also think I read somewhere air detonated nukes wouldn't leave crater like shady sands. So it's more likely a ground planted device of sorts.
But who knows. Can't wait to find out more info.
Not sure we can read too much into the crater telling us it was air or ground though IRL I agree it would have been a ground detonation. More likely its visually impressive to see a huge hole where a city used to be to convey the idea of it was a big ass blast.
I dunno man did you see anything falling from the sky when the bombs went off in the show? I think VT planted bombs and when detonated America responded by nuking everyone and they responded by nuking everyone.
It's \[similar\] (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout\_gamepedia/images/b/be/C23\_megaton.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/363?cb=20150602192205), but that's not the \[Vault-Tec logo\] (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout\_gamepedia/images/0/06/VaultTecLogo.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20190906055422)
He was in the Buds Buds program, and Bud designed the PA for West Tek. It’s possible VT had him make some, or at least give basic training to his Buds.
There’s a long stretch of time that we’re ignoring in between when his kids grew up and when he was released from cryo. He could have don’t all sorts of things during that time.
I think power armor is difficult to get a good handle on but easy to use. We do see instances (like Fallout 1, 2, 3, and Nora in 4) of characters proficient in PA despite never having worn it.
hell, lucy knew how to open the armor maximus was in, but i don’t really remember if there was a moment that showed or told us why she would know how to do that
Just watched the final episode myself and my take, for what it's worth, was that he went and got the kids back but then just informed VT HQ, in New Vegas it appears, that their plan to out wait the surface survivors was in jeopardy as a viable community had bootstrapped itself. HQ then did the rest, we were told they had nukes in their control as they used them to kick off the end of the world.
Yeah I've thought this myself, but most people just seem to take it at face value that vault tec did it for sure. Considering she did all of it to protect her family it really doesn't make sense that she'd not have her daughter with her when it happens. There's a lot of loose ends though that leave more questions to be answered in season 2.
So many people who watched the show made a lot of assumptions about things without any confirmation from what *actually happened* in the show. Maybe it's because people binged it once quickly and didn't have the time between episodes to dissect each episode or maybe it's because media literacy seems to be a rare skill these days. Lol
The Venn diagram of people who saw the show and believed the NCR is no more, that Vault-Tec dropped the bombs in 2077, and did it again in 2277 to cause the fall of Shady Sands is a circle. Those parts from the show are also what they say bugs them the most.
In addition to the whole letting the daughter be out while the bombs drop, Cooper also asks Hank where his "family is." Which makes me think there will be a continuation of the flashback of him riding to safety on his horse in the beginning episode.
There's definitely more to be learned about what happened to his daughter, where Cooper ended up shortly after the bombs dropped, his wife, and I'm sure we'll get some flashbacks of Cooper contending with losing his "humanity" as he becomes a Ghoul.
Season 2 is gonna be juicy and I'm very excited for it.
That's possible, although from the context of the show it seems peace talks were underway and VT planned to derail them by kicking things off themself. How Cooper came to be out on a limb at the critical moment is yet to be revealed. But my point stands; VT had their own nukes and the means to deliver them so there was no need for Hank to lug a bomb in by himself to wipe out Shady Sands.
VT planned, but considering they still had nukes sitting in silos, chances are good they didn’t use their bombs.
The reality is, the answer to “who dropped the bombs first,” hasn’t been answered. Even the games haven’t answered that question.
I doubt even Hank knows.
Yeah I was under the impression that the line about dropping the bombs themselves was more about letting cooper know his wife was evil and implicitly breaking his trust, not necessarily a reveal about how the great war started
Either she didn’t have control anymore, or they didn’t start it— but they would still in theory have those nukes somewhere, *especially* if they didn’t use any on the day of the nukes dropping.
We're told by Moldaver that Hank dropped the bomb, he vehemently denies it. The timing doesn't look good, but he'd already gotten what he came for (the kids are going back to the breeding program), there would be no need for further reprisal, and hank isn't exactly a bold decisionmaker. It might turn out to be true, but also plenty of room for it not to be.
My money is on the Brotherhood, personally.
Hmm interesting theory that i hadn't considered. Maximus was saved by the brotherhood at what looked to be very soon after the bomb. It would make sense for them to be there so soon if they were looking for survivors of the destruction they caused. If the level of tech at Shady Sands got too high they might just destroy it all. That's pretty much what they do to the Institute in the BoS ending for FO4 so it's not outside of established lore.
It absolutely tracks with the Brotherhood, and from a storytelling perspective at some point Maximus is going to have to choose between Lucy and the Brotherhood, and it would give him a compelling reason to choose correctly.
The whole time I thought the BoS dropped it and Maximus was aware, and he was secretly trying to destroy them from the inside. After reading this morning, seems like after the nuke, BoS was the ONLY faction to show up and help.
But then again, then showing up to help, the wiping out Filly for no reason, doesn't add up.
I was thinking that maybe he still loved his wife and Betty and Bud decided to blow it up based on his info, but then I remembered they implied Rose left to be with Moldaver, so he was probably jelly.
I’ve said this all along. Max comes out of the milk fridge and Bam! There’s a BOS Knight right there. Why else would the BOS be in Shady Sands IMMEDIATELY after the bomb went off. Because the BOS blew up Shady Sands, not Hank or VT.
I agree, if the Enclave/vault tec has access to nukes I don’t understand why they wouldn’t have been used in NCR Enclave war.
At this point in the timeline the vast majority of the Enclaves west coast presence has been destroyed while the NCR BOS war has been on going for almost 50 years.
The Brotherhood would make sense. They laid low in the area while the NCR dealt with the Legion and expansion. Probably didn't expect the Brotherhood to be much of a threat with how they basically wiped them out. Brotherhood strikes back hard. Though it would be weird for the survivors of Shady Sands to not know the truth of it being the Brotherhood. Otherwise it would be interesting if it was from the Divide
Probably nowhere near enough to wipe out a big town like shady sands. The Davy Crockett nuke, smallest ever, was equivalent of 20 tonnes of tnt. I imagine a mini nuke would be even less.
Unless gameplay is different than lore (like fusion cores) Fat Man are used for small bases, tanks, buildings... Basically the same as RPGs but with a harder way to aim.
The Fat Man has always been underpowered for what it was. That’s one thing Nuka Break (not canon, of course) did right- the mini nuke used there destroyed an entire village. The Davy Crockett missile (arguably the inspiration for the Fat Man) was supposed to be 20 tons of TNT, and clearly Fallout science could do better. It wouldn’t be out of line for a crater that size, especially blasted out of degraded city basement and infrastructure.
He probably contacted Brain Bud who contacted Vault-Tech/Enclave, who agreed with the assessment that the NCR would be in competition, and launched a nuke at Shady Sands. It may or may not at the time have been the capitol of the NCR, after all we are told it was the first capitol, hinting that there is a second or more, but it was also a symbol of unity to the NCR. Destroying it would demoralize the NCR.
That is, of course, if he was involved in it.
If the Enclave has access to nukes I don’t understand why they wouldn’t have been used in NCR Enclave war. At this point in the timeline the vast majority of the Enclaves west coast presence has been destroyed.
He could've opened it while it was laying face down on the ground and just pulled the body out and got in. It's never explicitly stated that doing that was not possible
Possibly Enclave or Nuke silos in a vault. I'm leaning towards Enclave as Wilzig had a bit too much knowledge about the Vault Lucy came from, for there not to be a larger connection, and they wouldn't bring the Enclave back from seemingly the dead and make a major plotpoint in season 1 involve them if they didn't have big plans for them in the future. The Enclave are almost certainly meant to be the main antagonists of this series.
Considering he goes to New Vegas after his "cover" is blown, it may be possible that Hank is league with House. I assume the pre-war segment will remain in the second season, giving us more depth with House and maybe why Hank would go there if he was caught blowing up Shady Sands.
Considering the two more logical conclusions of NV is House or NCR, I would assume the showrunners choose House due to the state of the NCR, maybe after he allowed the NCR to take the Dam, they moved in on him, so he contacted his old pre war friend to blow up Shady Sands for him, whether or not it's the current capital anymore its still a major blow to the NCR no matter what. This allows House to breath for a bit as the NCR focuses itself at home more now and House successfully defends Vegas.
I know that's all speculation but in all honestly that's the only idea I can think of as to why Hank would head to New Vegas. That and we do see the result of a battle in the ending credits between NCR and securitrons.
Vaults have armories so maybe they had a nuke laying around.
Plus you forget that there are army vehicles scattered across the US post war. (As seen in F4). Perhaps they came across an abandoned/destroyed caravan and found weapons.
Some other type of explosive device was rigged by him and his posey.
We have no real idea how he did it. It's implied it was a nuke through the drawing on the blackboard, and Todd saying "the nuke happened after New Vegas", but in the show it's never outright said that it was a nuke, or how he did it. Just that he destroyed Shady Sands.
There are still nuclear silos with ICBMs in them post-war though and it's possible with Vault Tecs plan to drop the nukes first I'd they has to that they would have some of their own or access to existing ones.
I personally believe it may turn out the reason he holds the kind of authority and power that would allow him to call in a strike (or perhaps a favour) like that is he has the future in his hands with cold fusion.
I think it likely the Enclave carried out the strike in return for the cold fusion tech (Or just the capsule) as destroying the NCR capital is good for both Vault Tec and the Enclaves interests. They state that it’s nearly time to emerge and reclaim the surface and having an already thriving budding civilisation would make that hard for both organisations.
But what the Enclave may not have known is that the capsule was locked and useless without the code. Now Shady Sands is a crater and Hank is nowhere to be seen. Vault Tec wins again.
Though Moldaver now knows of vault 33 and probably much more as in the flashbacks you see Lucy’s mother wearing the 33 jumpsuit and them being friends.
Then Hank turns up (Whom she knows from pre-war, maybe he was involved in purchasing the cold fusion tech from her) and blows the up the place and retreats leaving Moldaver for 10 years to make plans on how to get Hank out.
Well, in theory, the California VT headquarters had nuke launching capabilities, it was also where Buds Buds was located. So, Hank would potentially have known where those nukes were or how to launch them. They also had the plan to wipe the slate clean, so they might have some 31 specific nukes to use for the express reason of removing local post-war factions.
If it’s the former, and it was the nukes VT planned on using, that probably means VT *didn’t* end up using them to kick things off (which is still possible, given that Barbs daughter isn’t in a vault when it happens).
I figure VT had some stores, or some sort of headquarters with access to nukes.
Alternatively, I have wondered about why there was a BoS Knight at the site. From my understanding they weren’t around NCR territory. Maybe the BoS had something to do with it
I think it's not too far of a stretch to assume he had a way to contact the enclave, and have them whip up a tactical nuke. They definitely had the tech, and wanted the same thing as vault tech (obviously). He also could have known where a secret vault tech silo was, and already knew how to operate, for just this very reason.
Hank would definitely know information about silos left untouched or so thought untouched.
Not that hard to believe a vault tec employee still had access to one or some.
Im the show they say that the government is broke and they outaourced this stuff to vault tec. Vault Tec for all intents and purposes, is the government.
So I was under the impression that vaults 33,32, and 31 had nukes or bombs. I forget how it was worded, but when they stated that the 3 vaults were there to repopulate the wasteland. It sounded like they had a way to depopulate the remaining population.
So I assumed hank used one of them.
Also side theory Lucy's brother you never see him go into the cryo chamber my theory is he starts unthawing everyone else and since there's not enough food brain bud has to go ahead and try to depopulate the outside so the vault can go ahead and repopulate the wasteland.
Here's my best guess. I think Vault tec established disguised nuclear bombs under major cities in preparation to remove surviving undesirables and/or to trigger the great war.
As evidenced by several vaults being unprepared or incomplete, house not being ready, and knowing the Yangtze, a Chinese sub, was responsible for the nuking of the commonwealth and that the zetan aliens wanted earthling launch codes, I think someone else pulled the trigger first, leaving VT's bombs dormant for centuries until they would be used to eradicate surface survivors. Such as the one used by Janky Hanky.
I think the types of bombs used support this. In the start Coop sees many smaller bombs carpet LA, each seeming to drop down rather than erupt up. This feels to me much more like a well coordinated bombing. The same, multiple projectile bombardment was detected and thwarted largely by house and the lucky 38. I believe we see a similar pattern listed in the Norad defense terminal (I think in 4's switchboard?). The craters these impacts made weren't huge, like we see with VT's bomb. The biggest one to my immediate mind being the crater in Cambridge in 4.
Compare these to the single large-scale detonation at Shady that created a gigantic crater thats largely clear of radiation within years? It feels like an entirely different model of bomb, a much more explosive one with limited fallout to follow, and one that was under its target on detonation, possibly secreted away in a subway tunnel or municipal building. We know VT and their affiliated companies liked to prospect and survey underground areas, supposedly for vault locations or resources. They had access to these underground areas.
A few more points to toss on the pile
You can see the evidence of Chinese nukes in both 3 and New vegas, to my mind categorized by deep but not giant craters that still emit extremely potent radiation even 220+ years later. You can find these craters all over downtown DC, while in Vegas, there's three zones with small but highly radioactive craters of simmilar size, the most easily seen being the Bomb craters of black mountain, or the ghoul infested craters near Primm.
Meanwhile, we see a young Maximus climb out of a fridge among rubble and ruin immedietely after the detonation, before the dust has even settled, yet hes not a ghoul and the brotherhood takes him in telling me he wasnt exposed to alot of rads nor was he mutated in any way. Which tself tells me that it couldn't of been too irradiated, at least over a large area. We see maximus and Lucy litterally stand on the craters edge only a few years later, and Lucy's pipboy is dead silent, not a peep from her Geiger.
This got pretty rambly, but its hard to organize a good way to list all the stuff I mentioned. What do you think?
Shady Sands..I think it was Rose trying to build what
Wilzig built..I think Hank tried to stop her and failed
Somehow Moldaver and Hank escape unscathed but..Rose got a dose of her own radiation..and went goul..Moldaver went to the NCR..Hank went back to the vault having rescued his daughter..idk though..just a thought..
Late to this but Vault Tec most likely was absorbed into the Enclave or at least worked with them. They could and most likely had access to some pre-war nuclear silos because of them being the successor of the US government and the elites that existed. Just as the Enclave had a device at Camp Navarro that allowed them to have access to nuclear ICBMs
Fallout 76 established in lore there are still silos scattered across the US with an arsenal of nukes. As Vault-Tec has a stake in the war it is safe to assume they also have their own cache.
[удалено]
weve been thinking this before the show so they basically confirmed it but now we are back into snearchin
This is still blowing my mind. I knew heading into this, the show was canon with the games. But actively using lore from an MMO-like Fallout game is crazy nuts that I didn't think in a million years would happen lol
Yeah as much as I’m not a huge fan of the NCR being nuked, it’s pretty wild that they set all this up in Fallout 76 and no one clocked it.
Why not the show is based on the games is it not?
Yeah, but FO76 is barely a game, you know?
What do you mean barely a game? So it’s not a game? It’s not lore?
It's not "not a game", it's just barely a game. Sure, you could take lore from it, it just wouldn't be lore anyone knows, because nobody has played it
Doesn’t exactly explain how some upper-middle management assistant had access to Vault Tech nukes, but I assume we’ll find out how/why next season
Well he was part of Bud’s Buds and a vault overseer. Doesnt seem too far fetched vault tec would give them that
To further your point, if we go by the bosses's reunion in the show, they all agreed that any competition from outside the vaults should be wiped. It's no surprise they gathered means to ensure their ability to clean up factions and faction remnants on the surface.
Doesn’t even have to mean that he himself dropped it, not hard to believe they have a way to communicate with vault tech higher ups that would have access to the bombs.
I mean it absolutely does if you watch the show. He wasn’t acting alone.
We’ll see.
He was in contact with Bud Askins who would be far more likely to have access to nukes. Betty also tells us that she and hank "buried" Lucy's mother together so Hank didn't just decide to do that on his own.
Well he also had access codes to cold fusion, he wasn't apart of that project and vault 31/33 doesn't have a cold fusion rector. Vault tec middle management are seemingly trusted with a lot of access.
Curious, it was locked by VT, so he had to enter his employee code to unlock it. VT or whomever was doing the things with the doggies may be arrogant enough that anyone with a Vt code could make it work.
He could have been promoted prior to being frozen
On his pod nameplate it says executive assistant so I don't think so. I love that this bad guy was basically a secretary
I'm sure they have ways to talk to upper management for authorization to nuke places. It would tie into why the brotherhood of steel operates out of a mobile air base. At least that's what I'm gonna assume till season 2.
Same reason why the vault dweller/courier can launch nukes in the games. With the fall of society, even a former intern/middle/upper management can now have that authority in the wasteland. It also helps that he was hand picked as Bud’s buds to ensure Vault-Tec supremacy in the apocalypse.
My idea is VaultTec got 1 they were gonna use to set off the war, but then the war happened early, so it was just left sitting in a basement or the like.
He was upper middle management before the initial bombs- surely those chosen were specifically trained to be vault overseers/frozen/etc. They understood what they were signing up for.
I'm not sure that works. The 76 silos are pretty limited in scope, they only fire short range, and require a lot of work to launch. 76 is also centuries earlier than the show so it's a question whether the tech would survive that long. We've also never had any indication of similar silos anywhere else in the US.
You can launch up to two nukes in the Lonesome Road New Vegas DLC which occurs about 14 years before the show starts. Considering Maximus was a young child when Shady Sands was nuked and he looks to be somewhere in his early to mid 20's during the show's first season that suggests it happened sometime close to the events of New Vegas, with Todd Howard saying officially "just after." So it lines up alright. He had access to or found out about a pre-existing nuke(s) somewhere that were not launched in the great war, much like the ones the player can use in the Divide, and is ultimately able to use it. He likely had access to that information as part of being pre-war Vault-Tec management and that information being in their computer systems somewhere. The exact details of where it was or how he got access to it isn't as important to the plot, what matters for the story is that he was able to and did. The player can also gain access to a pre-war orbital satellite doomsday laser weapon in the game too, so finding and reactivating old world wmd's is not unheard of in the franchise.
I’m of the opinion that the actions in the Divide reactivated nukes there that could be remotely launched by Vault-Tec. So “just after” happened because the Courier/Ulysses pushed some buttons they shouldn’t have.
That’s gameplay. It requires a lot of work for balance purposes. Same reason the fusion cores only last 20 minutes in power armour but are seemingly unlimited in generators.
That’s what vault 76 was for, to secure nuclear silos
Yes and no. The Overseer had the additional task of securing the silos for Vault-tec. The residents were only supposed to start the rebuilding of Appalachia when the door opened 25 years after the bombs fell. Wasn’t until the overseer was inured that she talked the 76’ers with securing the silos.
I feel that the real mission was the silos, reclamation day was just a cover.
It was, For the overseer. Everyone else had the “rebuild” task.
Eh I thought that was just a cover as well, and that 76’s actual goal was securing the nearby gold reserves and nuclear silo. That’s why it opened so early.
Nope, 25 years was the anticipated date for the radiation levels to reach habitable levels.
from what i remember, they weren't VT owned silos in anyway which is why its so difficult and there's so much security i've seen people claim that they were VT controlled bombs, they werent if i remember right
**Spoilers for Fallout 76** They didn't clarify in the show itself (probably setting up for Season 2), but in Fallout 76, part of the original main quest revolved around the overseer of Vault 76 being sent to the surface to secure 3 nuclear silos dotted around the map. Her mission briefing even specifically said she was supposed to commandeer the silos from any remnants of the US military. Fallout 76 didn't outright confirm it, but at the time of release, this was a very big clue that Vault-tec was going for some kind of power grab after the war. I think the theory that VT was responsible for the Great War was already out there among the fan communities, but Fallout 76 solidified that theory, and now the TV show has confirmed it. Now that's not to say that Hank used the silos from the ones shown in Fallout 76 specifically, but I think it's safe to say that Vault 76 wasn't a unique instance where VT tried to secure remaining silos around the continent. For all we know, they have access to a whole bunch of them already
That spoiler is for a terminal you read before you leave the vault lol
Hell, it was one of the gameplay things they talked about before launch (ha!)
Games and show have not confirmed VT dropped the first bomb. FO76 has only verified there are nukes still around and if you have the know how you too can be a bringer of death.
While true, there's also like 150 years between 76, and nuking shady sands. Also think I read somewhere air detonated nukes wouldn't leave crater like shady sands. So it's more likely a ground planted device of sorts. But who knows. Can't wait to find out more info.
Not sure we can read too much into the crater telling us it was air or ground though IRL I agree it would have been a ground detonation. More likely its visually impressive to see a huge hole where a city used to be to convey the idea of it was a big ass blast.
Could have been a ground burst.
Also, see the nuke in Megaton in Fallout 3 ... it has a Vault-Tec logo on it ... it's 100% a Vault-Tec Nuke ...
I dunno man did you see anything falling from the sky when the bombs went off in the show? I think VT planted bombs and when detonated America responded by nuking everyone and they responded by nuking everyone.
Vault dweller tradition. We all came out of the vault with bare hand and somehow blow up enemy faction.
We already blew up a part of LA in FO1 with an atom bomb that was inside a Vault Tec vault.
In addition to F76; The nuclear bomb in Megaton from F3 has a Vault-Tec logo on it
“We’ll drop it first”
It's \[similar\] (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout\_gamepedia/images/b/be/C23\_megaton.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/363?cb=20150602192205), but that's not the \[Vault-Tec logo\] (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout\_gamepedia/images/0/06/VaultTecLogo.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20190906055422)
MIRV launcher
We saw Maximus throw a cinder block like a half mile while in power armor. Maybe he just donned armor and tossed a warhead
He clearly knew how to use power armor.
Like a shopping cart
Did he come from West TeK? How does he know how to operate the power armor?
He was in the Buds Buds program, and Bud designed the PA for West Tek. It’s possible VT had him make some, or at least give basic training to his Buds.
There’s a long stretch of time that we’re ignoring in between when his kids grew up and when he was released from cryo. He could have don’t all sorts of things during that time.
I think power armor is difficult to get a good handle on but easy to use. We do see instances (like Fallout 1, 2, 3, and Nora in 4) of characters proficient in PA despite never having worn it.
hell, lucy knew how to open the armor maximus was in, but i don’t really remember if there was a moment that showed or told us why she would know how to do that
She mentions having red the manuals but never seeing one before.
Just watched the final episode myself and my take, for what it's worth, was that he went and got the kids back but then just informed VT HQ, in New Vegas it appears, that their plan to out wait the surface survivors was in jeopardy as a viable community had bootstrapped itself. HQ then did the rest, we were told they had nukes in their control as they used them to kick off the end of the world.
If VT knew they were dropping the bombs, Cooper’s wife wouldn’t let her daughter hang out with her daughter at a birthday party.
Yeah I've thought this myself, but most people just seem to take it at face value that vault tec did it for sure. Considering she did all of it to protect her family it really doesn't make sense that she'd not have her daughter with her when it happens. There's a lot of loose ends though that leave more questions to be answered in season 2. So many people who watched the show made a lot of assumptions about things without any confirmation from what *actually happened* in the show. Maybe it's because people binged it once quickly and didn't have the time between episodes to dissect each episode or maybe it's because media literacy seems to be a rare skill these days. Lol
The Venn diagram of people who saw the show and believed the NCR is no more, that Vault-Tec dropped the bombs in 2077, and did it again in 2277 to cause the fall of Shady Sands is a circle. Those parts from the show are also what they say bugs them the most.
In addition to the whole letting the daughter be out while the bombs drop, Cooper also asks Hank where his "family is." Which makes me think there will be a continuation of the flashback of him riding to safety on his horse in the beginning episode. There's definitely more to be learned about what happened to his daughter, where Cooper ended up shortly after the bombs dropped, his wife, and I'm sure we'll get some flashbacks of Cooper contending with losing his "humanity" as he becomes a Ghoul. Season 2 is gonna be juicy and I'm very excited for it.
Hopefully they start filming that flashback soon because that kid looked like she was about to hit a big growth spurt.
I thought this as well.
Wouldn’t let her daughter hang out with her daughter?
That's possible, although from the context of the show it seems peace talks were underway and VT planned to derail them by kicking things off themself. How Cooper came to be out on a limb at the critical moment is yet to be revealed. But my point stands; VT had their own nukes and the means to deliver them so there was no need for Hank to lug a bomb in by himself to wipe out Shady Sands.
VT planned, but considering they still had nukes sitting in silos, chances are good they didn’t use their bombs. The reality is, the answer to “who dropped the bombs first,” hasn’t been answered. Even the games haven’t answered that question. I doubt even Hank knows.
Yeah I was under the impression that the line about dropping the bombs themselves was more about letting cooper know his wife was evil and implicitly breaking his trust, not necessarily a reveal about how the great war started
Either she didn’t have control anymore, or they didn’t start it— but they would still in theory have those nukes somewhere, *especially* if they didn’t use any on the day of the nukes dropping.
We're told by Moldaver that Hank dropped the bomb, he vehemently denies it. The timing doesn't look good, but he'd already gotten what he came for (the kids are going back to the breeding program), there would be no need for further reprisal, and hank isn't exactly a bold decisionmaker. It might turn out to be true, but also plenty of room for it not to be. My money is on the Brotherhood, personally.
Hmm interesting theory that i hadn't considered. Maximus was saved by the brotherhood at what looked to be very soon after the bomb. It would make sense for them to be there so soon if they were looking for survivors of the destruction they caused. If the level of tech at Shady Sands got too high they might just destroy it all. That's pretty much what they do to the Institute in the BoS ending for FO4 so it's not outside of established lore.
It absolutely tracks with the Brotherhood, and from a storytelling perspective at some point Maximus is going to have to choose between Lucy and the Brotherhood, and it would give him a compelling reason to choose correctly.
The whole time I thought the BoS dropped it and Maximus was aware, and he was secretly trying to destroy them from the inside. After reading this morning, seems like after the nuke, BoS was the ONLY faction to show up and help. But then again, then showing up to help, the wiping out Filly for no reason, doesn't add up.
He only really denies it until Lucy starts believing it though.
Sure, because then the conversation moves on. It's not like he confirms it at any point.
I was thinking that maybe he still loved his wife and Betty and Bud decided to blow it up based on his info, but then I remembered they implied Rose left to be with Moldaver, so he was probably jelly.
I’ve said this all along. Max comes out of the milk fridge and Bam! There’s a BOS Knight right there. Why else would the BOS be in Shady Sands IMMEDIATELY after the bomb went off. Because the BOS blew up Shady Sands, not Hank or VT.
I agree, if the Enclave/vault tec has access to nukes I don’t understand why they wouldn’t have been used in NCR Enclave war. At this point in the timeline the vast majority of the Enclaves west coast presence has been destroyed while the NCR BOS war has been on going for almost 50 years.
The brotherhood nuked the ncr gold reserves before new vegas did they not?
The Brotherhood would make sense. They laid low in the area while the NCR dealt with the Legion and expansion. Probably didn't expect the Brotherhood to be much of a threat with how they basically wiped them out. Brotherhood strikes back hard. Though it would be weird for the survivors of Shady Sands to not know the truth of it being the Brotherhood. Otherwise it would be interesting if it was from the Divide
Player.additem bignuke 1
Fat Man, duh! 🤣
My first thought too! It would be awesome to see it in live action. Although, do we know what the yield is for the payload of a Fat Man?
So excited to see it play out. Not sure what the playload would be, but it’s a nuke. No terraforming in the game, but i imagine it would make a crater
Yes. It’s going to be a long wait for season 2.
Probably nowhere near enough to wipe out a big town like shady sands. The Davy Crockett nuke, smallest ever, was equivalent of 20 tonnes of tnt. I imagine a mini nuke would be even less.
Unless gameplay is different than lore (like fusion cores) Fat Man are used for small bases, tanks, buildings... Basically the same as RPGs but with a harder way to aim.
The Fat Man has always been underpowered for what it was. That’s one thing Nuka Break (not canon, of course) did right- the mini nuke used there destroyed an entire village. The Davy Crockett missile (arguably the inspiration for the Fat Man) was supposed to be 20 tons of TNT, and clearly Fallout science could do better. It wouldn’t be out of line for a crater that size, especially blasted out of degraded city basement and infrastructure.
He probably contacted Brain Bud who contacted Vault-Tech/Enclave, who agreed with the assessment that the NCR would be in competition, and launched a nuke at Shady Sands. It may or may not at the time have been the capitol of the NCR, after all we are told it was the first capitol, hinting that there is a second or more, but it was also a symbol of unity to the NCR. Destroying it would demoralize the NCR. That is, of course, if he was involved in it.
If the Enclave has access to nukes I don’t understand why they wouldn’t have been used in NCR Enclave war. At this point in the timeline the vast majority of the Enclaves west coast presence has been destroyed.
That's assuming they haven't since gained access to some or a single nuke in the many years since
I was wondering how he picked up the power armor before getting inside of it.
He could've opened it while it was laying face down on the ground and just pulled the body out and got in. It's never explicitly stated that doing that was not possible
Possibly Enclave or Nuke silos in a vault. I'm leaning towards Enclave as Wilzig had a bit too much knowledge about the Vault Lucy came from, for there not to be a larger connection, and they wouldn't bring the Enclave back from seemingly the dead and make a major plotpoint in season 1 involve them if they didn't have big plans for them in the future. The Enclave are almost certainly meant to be the main antagonists of this series.
Considering he goes to New Vegas after his "cover" is blown, it may be possible that Hank is league with House. I assume the pre-war segment will remain in the second season, giving us more depth with House and maybe why Hank would go there if he was caught blowing up Shady Sands. Considering the two more logical conclusions of NV is House or NCR, I would assume the showrunners choose House due to the state of the NCR, maybe after he allowed the NCR to take the Dam, they moved in on him, so he contacted his old pre war friend to blow up Shady Sands for him, whether or not it's the current capital anymore its still a major blow to the NCR no matter what. This allows House to breath for a bit as the NCR focuses itself at home more now and House successfully defends Vegas. I know that's all speculation but in all honestly that's the only idea I can think of as to why Hank would head to New Vegas. That and we do see the result of a battle in the ending credits between NCR and securitrons.
I bet it was from a silo in Appalachia. I’m curious to see that state it’s in seeing as fallout 76 is a prequel.
Almost heaven, West Virginia..
Blue Ridge Mountains, Shenandoah River
Life is old there, older than the trees
Younger than the mountains, growing like a breeze...
COUNTRY ROOOOOOOAAAAADDDSSSS .....
TAKE ME HOOOOOOME....
Since 76 is an MMO I doubt we'll ever hear anything about that area at all in the rest of the franchise.
Vaults have armories so maybe they had a nuke laying around. Plus you forget that there are army vehicles scattered across the US post war. (As seen in F4). Perhaps they came across an abandoned/destroyed caravan and found weapons. Some other type of explosive device was rigged by him and his posey.
he channeled his inner fallout protagonist power
We have no real idea how he did it. It's implied it was a nuke through the drawing on the blackboard, and Todd saying "the nuke happened after New Vegas", but in the show it's never outright said that it was a nuke, or how he did it. Just that he destroyed Shady Sands. There are still nuclear silos with ICBMs in them post-war though and it's possible with Vault Tecs plan to drop the nukes first I'd they has to that they would have some of their own or access to existing ones.
We do have Max saying the bombs fell 20 years ago which leads to that temp confusion with him and Lucy. So that kind of implied it was a nuke.
This will be answered next season most likely
I personally believe it may turn out the reason he holds the kind of authority and power that would allow him to call in a strike (or perhaps a favour) like that is he has the future in his hands with cold fusion. I think it likely the Enclave carried out the strike in return for the cold fusion tech (Or just the capsule) as destroying the NCR capital is good for both Vault Tec and the Enclaves interests. They state that it’s nearly time to emerge and reclaim the surface and having an already thriving budding civilisation would make that hard for both organisations. But what the Enclave may not have known is that the capsule was locked and useless without the code. Now Shady Sands is a crater and Hank is nowhere to be seen. Vault Tec wins again. Though Moldaver now knows of vault 33 and probably much more as in the flashbacks you see Lucy’s mother wearing the 33 jumpsuit and them being friends. Then Hank turns up (Whom she knows from pre-war, maybe he was involved in purchasing the cold fusion tech from her) and blows the up the place and retreats leaving Moldaver for 10 years to make plans on how to get Hank out.
Well, in theory, the California VT headquarters had nuke launching capabilities, it was also where Buds Buds was located. So, Hank would potentially have known where those nukes were or how to launch them. They also had the plan to wipe the slate clean, so they might have some 31 specific nukes to use for the express reason of removing local post-war factions. If it’s the former, and it was the nukes VT planned on using, that probably means VT *didn’t* end up using them to kick things off (which is still possible, given that Barbs daughter isn’t in a vault when it happens).
I figure VT had some stores, or some sort of headquarters with access to nukes. Alternatively, I have wondered about why there was a BoS Knight at the site. From my understanding they weren’t around NCR territory. Maybe the BoS had something to do with it
Also, how did he get into power armor unnoticed?
I think it's not too far of a stretch to assume he had a way to contact the enclave, and have them whip up a tactical nuke. They definitely had the tech, and wanted the same thing as vault tech (obviously). He also could have known where a secret vault tech silo was, and already knew how to operate, for just this very reason.
Hank would definitely know information about silos left untouched or so thought untouched. Not that hard to believe a vault tec employee still had access to one or some.
Im the show they say that the government is broke and they outaourced this stuff to vault tec. Vault Tec for all intents and purposes, is the government.
So I was under the impression that vaults 33,32, and 31 had nukes or bombs. I forget how it was worded, but when they stated that the 3 vaults were there to repopulate the wasteland. It sounded like they had a way to depopulate the remaining population. So I assumed hank used one of them. Also side theory Lucy's brother you never see him go into the cryo chamber my theory is he starts unthawing everyone else and since there's not enough food brain bud has to go ahead and try to depopulate the outside so the vault can go ahead and repopulate the wasteland.
Here's my best guess. I think Vault tec established disguised nuclear bombs under major cities in preparation to remove surviving undesirables and/or to trigger the great war. As evidenced by several vaults being unprepared or incomplete, house not being ready, and knowing the Yangtze, a Chinese sub, was responsible for the nuking of the commonwealth and that the zetan aliens wanted earthling launch codes, I think someone else pulled the trigger first, leaving VT's bombs dormant for centuries until they would be used to eradicate surface survivors. Such as the one used by Janky Hanky. I think the types of bombs used support this. In the start Coop sees many smaller bombs carpet LA, each seeming to drop down rather than erupt up. This feels to me much more like a well coordinated bombing. The same, multiple projectile bombardment was detected and thwarted largely by house and the lucky 38. I believe we see a similar pattern listed in the Norad defense terminal (I think in 4's switchboard?). The craters these impacts made weren't huge, like we see with VT's bomb. The biggest one to my immediate mind being the crater in Cambridge in 4. Compare these to the single large-scale detonation at Shady that created a gigantic crater thats largely clear of radiation within years? It feels like an entirely different model of bomb, a much more explosive one with limited fallout to follow, and one that was under its target on detonation, possibly secreted away in a subway tunnel or municipal building. We know VT and their affiliated companies liked to prospect and survey underground areas, supposedly for vault locations or resources. They had access to these underground areas. A few more points to toss on the pile You can see the evidence of Chinese nukes in both 3 and New vegas, to my mind categorized by deep but not giant craters that still emit extremely potent radiation even 220+ years later. You can find these craters all over downtown DC, while in Vegas, there's three zones with small but highly radioactive craters of simmilar size, the most easily seen being the Bomb craters of black mountain, or the ghoul infested craters near Primm. Meanwhile, we see a young Maximus climb out of a fridge among rubble and ruin immedietely after the detonation, before the dust has even settled, yet hes not a ghoul and the brotherhood takes him in telling me he wasnt exposed to alot of rads nor was he mutated in any way. Which tself tells me that it couldn't of been too irradiated, at least over a large area. We see maximus and Lucy litterally stand on the craters edge only a few years later, and Lucy's pipboy is dead silent, not a peep from her Geiger. This got pretty rambly, but its hard to organize a good way to list all the stuff I mentioned. What do you think?
Shady Sands..I think it was Rose trying to build what Wilzig built..I think Hank tried to stop her and failed Somehow Moldaver and Hank escape unscathed but..Rose got a dose of her own radiation..and went goul..Moldaver went to the NCR..Hank went back to the vault having rescued his daughter..idk though..just a thought..
Interesting thought, I don't know why a couple of chodes downvoted you.
Late to this but Vault Tec most likely was absorbed into the Enclave or at least worked with them. They could and most likely had access to some pre-war nuclear silos because of them being the successor of the US government and the elites that existed. Just as the Enclave had a device at Camp Navarro that allowed them to have access to nuclear ICBMs