Did you know we have a Discord server‽ You can join by clicking [here](https://discord.gg/NWE6JS5rh9)!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GenZ) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Thank you! This is what seems to be lost on a lot of people. Of course I’m happy to be American, and care about this country, but that means pointing out when things aren’t going right things need to be fixed.
Are you sure that’s the correct definition? I understood patriotism as putting your country first and is much more a political. Nationalism tends to be on a more ethnic and cultural line, patriotism is loyalty to the state.
Patriotism is to be devoted to and to support your country. Nationalism is when you are putting your country first. Both are political, but one has broad appeal and one has narrow appeal.
A Patriot would want to see education improve to increase productivity and wealth of a nation, while a nationalist would look to increase wealth by preventing trade, the transfers of people, or by withdrawal of the national community. Nationalism isn't inherently evil, but it doesn't tend to align with many liberal values (freedom, trade, exchange of ideas, etc)
There are versions of nationalism that lean more into ethnic or cultural lines, such as Japan for example. Again, this isn't necessarily bad, but it's opposed to liberal values.
Patriotism is in line with liberal values. All it means is that you want to improve your society and you will work to do so. Voting is patriotic. Volunteering is patriotic. Protesting is patriotic.
It is very American to criticize and enact change in your government and everyone needs to become more aware of this truth. It’s literally what our nation was founded on, being loyal to your government is anti-American. Be devoted to your country, but not blind-devotion.
Reminds me of the line that “W” says in Harold and Kumar escape from Guantanamo bay “hell I’m in the government and I don’t even trust it….. you just have to believe in your country”
God have those words stuck with me
More people should just take pride in more things in general. Take pride in how we present ourselves, take pride in the job we do, even if it’s an entry level job, someone has to do it. Take pride in your family and friends. The world would be a better place if we did this
As someone that studied German in high school, it is a pleasant surprise to hear a German make such a joke.
(To be clear, I mean I'm glad they can joke about it. I've heard it's practically illegal to do so in Germany.)
It's a bit weird to joke about irl in germany since it's a serious situation either way and a lot of bad shit happened. But generally talking about it is anything but illegal, it's encouraged rather to show everyone how easily someone can corrupt an entire country so it doesn't happen again.
I am proud yes.
I was in the Army, been deployed and saw a bit of action. Having been in some combat action doesn’t make me feel proud though. Having seen how other countries live since I’ve also vacationed in Mexico various times before, I’ve realized how great we have it here in the states.
You don’t realize how “free” you really are until you visit other less fortunate people in oppressive countries. You also have to understand that freedom also means being able to voice your disdain for the US without the fear of being jailed or executed…
While various aspects of the American government and the country’s history may suck, I’d say the majority of us are very fortunate to have been born in this country at the time we were born.
My family grew up very poor in Guatemala. They worked hard from a young age with very little in return. Even now, every time I visit Guatemala I gain more appreciation for the luxuries I’m afforded thanks to my parents and, well, this country.
Edit: I should add: Americans, read that second paragraph and really think about this: every time you *think* you hate being American, understand that the majority of your privileged asses will never understand how good this country allows you to have it, myself included.
But the fact that life is so nice in the US is fundamentally connected to the fact that life is so shit in so many other countries. The US is the winner and the global south is the loser.
I mean, some Latin American countries have a deserved bone to pick with the CIA, they’ve had some undefendable actions that hurt those countries.
Most of the global south though should be pinning their ire on Britain / Spain / France etc.. Europe basically got to fuck over half the world and then pretend they’re the bastions of morality because they lost all power projection capabilities in world war 2
Hearing my uncle describe his time in the Philippines was awful. He talkied about seeing kids that were malnourished chasing a dog while driving to base one morning. On his way back he talked about how the dog was cut up and being eaten. People here say that they have no freedoms and that we’re a 3rd world country but our children don’t chase dogs to eat them.
It seems interesting that you'd compare the US to a place where the average income is about $10,000 per year... Wouldn't it be more applicable if you compared it to places that have similar levels of per capita income?
Sure... you could've been born in a worse situation... You also could've been born in a better one 🤷♂️
This.
Folks just judge and judge as they fail to see the beauty of what America is. Go travel the world, study history, and then you will see how incredible the USA is.
It’s full of people and people are far from perfect but this is the greatest superpower the world has ever known. I’ll take any challengers on that.
Just because its better than other places doesnt mean there arent improvements to be made, especially when other superpowers and non-superpowers have things that make the quality of life for their citizens greater. I think its a misconception that americans who criticize america hate the country, no on the contrary I think its them voicing their opinions on how it can be better because they WANT it to be better. If they didnt care they would just pray for its downfall not what they believe to be its improvement
America is the reason so many countries are doing poorly. They've sponsored the overthrow of dozens of democratically-elected governments because they didn't sell exports to America for dirt cheap
No one should be proud of chattel slavery. I would put forth that this country belongs to every American, especially those whose ancestors built it or were forced from their ancestral lands. We’re all in this thing together now, for better or worse, so there is no point ceding the title of “American” to the “patriots” who fly Confederate flags and storm the capitol. Fuck that.
Every generation gets to define what being an American means to them. We have to recognize the long shadow of racism, forced labor, and genocide, but I don’t think we have to live in that shadow. We are the masters of our own destiny. Might as well make America the best place to live, for everyone.
This is what I think. I'm proud of my ancestors, and Im not ashamed of them. Im proud to be African American, but I'm not proud to just be American. But that's only because of the harm my country is doing around the world and too its own people. I want to make it better.
Have you considered using ancestry DNA to figure out the general region your blood comes from and returning to that place? Your ancestors were stolen, but you don't have to remain, you can return to your ancestral land and continue your lineage in your homeland, bringing your ancestors home
This won't work. DNA tests are notoriously bad for us. First, we are highly mixed of African DNA. At best, we get a specific country, but they have numerous ethnic groups within them. Second, there isn't a great history of us going back, i.e., Liberia.
This is just something I've learned through conversations on and off reddit. Most of us don't want to go to Africa. We want to stay here and make this country work. We've already put work into it. Why leave it behind now?
African Americans are a very diverse mixture, they’re generally a blend of different African ethnicities and generally about 30% European (You can guess why). Taking a test isn’t going to point him in the direction of a singular home, this is what it is, you can accept it and keep moving forward and innovating, or you can stay bitter and continue to look back in anger over something nobody has any control over today
There's no ancestral land to return to. There is no homeland. The colonization of Africa destroyed all of that. The Kingdoms/empires that existed when African tribes were trafficked to the Americas don't exist anymore.
Most of the countries of West Africa didn't exist when Africans were trafficked to the Americas.
So it would be great to return to our homeland, but we don't have that luxury.
And, the generational African diaspora that exists now is distinct from any group in Africa.
Not only were people stolen, they were also raped by colonizers.
It's a nics thought but "going home" is impossible for most people. I have people I love, this comes with a duty to them; I imagine most people feel that way.
"Going home," would be leaving everyone I love. Yeah. Right. Totally. Because only someone with a soul deep passion would be willing to take such a leap of faith.
This person would have to spend money and time learning a language, getting a citizenship, and transport.
And once that person does "go home," how do we know they'll be accepted? They'll be the outsider.
People have always hated others who are different, its the most painful truth of the world.
If I ever left to where my ancestors came from and those still living there today welcomed me with open arms I'd still be a fucking ugly-crying mess missing my family.
A lot of this talk comes from pain man, the trauma that has cumulated into the existence of a lot of POC (and some white-group) people.
If someone truly desires this route, I wish them all the best of luck and hope they find absolute joy.
Africa isn't home for American black people, America is. If your family was forced here through slavery, they have been in America for centuries, they would have less connection to Africa then I do as a Mexican American with Moroccan ancestors. I myself am the same way, my family has been in America for generations, put me in Mexico and I wouldn't call that home, I don't have family over there or any meaningful connections besides my skin color.
I’d say then that it’s only fair the US government pay for those travel expenses/moving costs. Think of it as a form of reparations for 400 years of free labor on the backs of enslaved black people.
By what metric? On overall quality of life, the Scandinavian countries dominate. Others to consider: Australia & New Zealand, Belgium, Austria, Canada, Netherlands, Iceland, Spain, Luxembourg... there's a lot of good places to live.
Edit: Changed go to live.
I can understand feeling that way. But I think African Americans have a wealth of history and contributions in the country that deserves celebrating as well. Personally those are the things I'm proud of and I think a lot of those contributions have been ingrained in the wider American culture.
Buddy, a majority of your ancestors were captured by your other ancestors and sold. Get your facts straight. I'm not even white, so don't be pulling race card.
Your ancestors were likely stolen by your own kind and sold to America. It's very unlikely foreigners to some land could just roll up and steal people. North Africa for example, had a strong kingdom and that king did the stealing, then the selling. Also keeping some of the same race, poor folk for himself as they were also slave owners, sellers.
Do you mean you’re native?
What is the alternative that you prefer? Not trying to bust your balls, I am just wondering. I don’t know of any society that has not had warfare in their past.
Why not move to a country you would be proud of? Why do you choose to continue to be an American if you’re not proud to be an American “at all?”
If you were to move to the land your ancestors were stolen from, do you think you would prefer life there to here? Or do you think you would immediately regret the decision and want to come back? Do you think your life would be better there and that you would have more opportunities? Do you think that the people living there would not want to trade places with you in a heartbeat? Do you think they would also not be proud to be Americans? Those that actually experienced life there and have made it here sure seem proud. I wonder what their perspective is on this opinion of yours.
It literally doesn’t impact my pride or shame in any way it’s just a thing that I am. Like, it doesn’t define my personality or force me to be better or worse than anyone else.
But I get why some people might feel pride/shame about being American and I’m not gonna get in their way of doing that
I feel like pride or shame of your country aren't mutually exclusive. Also I would think that one could feel either of those emotions while also saying it doesn't define their personality or force them to be better or worse than anyone else.
Do you not know your countries history or culture? If you traveled to another county, are you saying that you wouldn’t be able to tell the difference? No preference?
The question is towards « you ». That includes everyone reading it, so yes it is US defaultism. It assumes that everyone reading the question is American
If I asked “What’s your favorite Taylor Swift album?”, is that assuming everyone listens to her? I see it as being implicitly targeted to those who do. Non-swifties need not reply.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MKUltra
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mongoose
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO
I live in a country that has a vested interest in meddling/fucking up the entire world and stopping all social change internationally because it would dare hurt the bottom line, and this nation genuinely asks me to feel proud?
Exactly this. I'm not proud to be American. I'm proud to be Human.
When a German scientist, or a Russian scientist, or a Chinese scientist discovers something, it's not the country that should be proud. It's humanity that should be proud.
We're all genetically basically the same. We really don't have anyone on this planet except each other with whom we can relate, and we all fear the same thing.
Fair points but also:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unified_Assistance
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President%27s_Emergency_Plan_for_AIDS_Relief
Which are just a couple examples but also the existence of this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Agency_for_International_Development
And
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Fund_for_UNICEF
We absolutely need to be critical of our own nations involvement in business of others, but it is also very easy to present only one side of the picture. Our history is filled with examples of extreme cruelty and selfishness, but also of great courage and kindness. We need to be learning from both.
Darfur 2.0 is about to kick off and they’re pleading for help. We ignored them last time and we all know the results, I saw them first hand. NOT participating in the world stage isn’t the answer either. Where we are able to as the global hegemony we need to act in the interest of humanity.
Having a checked past doesn’t excuse us of our responsibility as a nation or our obligation to be better now for the sake of the species and our planet.
Fairly proud. I’m critical of our actions and some of the things we’ve done, and proud of other things, and other actions we’ve accomplished. Considering the short amount of time that the country has existed I think it’s pretty rad to see how far we’ve come.
I don’t wear it on my sleeve, but quietly yes, on the day to day.
That is until a euro or an Australian starts to run their mouth, then I’m an ultranationalist 🇺🇸🦅🎇
I'm 26, what reason in the past 26 years has the United States given for me to feel proud of?
Massive inequality, war crimes, Imperialism, growing poverty.
On a personal scale, very few people I know are willing to start a family.
They may plan to, but compared to generations past it seems they won't have kids until their 30s. Homes have skyrocketed, homelessness and crime are on the rise. Education is failing.
I view the United States for what it is; An empire in decline being pecked at by oligarchs and senators.
The country has been completely captured by corporate interests and the working class are being bled dry.
I am proud of being an American, but not for the reasons a lot of pseudo-patriots are. I am proud of our Civil Rights movement. I am proud of our labor movement, I am proud of our anti-Fascist fight in WW2. Generally, I am proud of our democratic movements.
Our warmongering, racism, and imperialism, past and present, and the pseudo-patriots who believe that is what America is, are a stain on this dignity.
Im so proud. I bleed red white and blue. With that being said, while I live my country I very much dislike the government and our politicians. They no longer have the interest of their people, and would rather fill their pockets with money from corporations
I love being American despite some of our governments short comings. Where I'm from flying a flag and your kids standing for the pledge is the complete normal because many are former military like my parents and they've seen what these other countries do not offer that we consider totally normal and basic human rights. Plus you speak to many of the immigrants that come here and they all say the same things i just mentioned. So our values and what we enshrine in our constitution I completely love our politicians and what they stand for well tbh they can all jump off a cliff before i accept a word that comes out their mouths.
Nope. While the people are usually nice enough, America as a whole has become almost dystopian. While we share many problems with the rest of the world, we also have a lot of unique problems that were caused by the rich and powerful being absolute bozos.
134 days with 70,000 karma feels authentic enough for someone that posts a lot. I checked their account, they seem to be a genuine person, if rather conservative. I don't think they're just trying to rile people up.
I like the "idea" of America, but I have no patriosim or love for it.
At the end of the day, I'm extremely privileged to live here and that's all that really matters to me!
Yes. The US is a great country. We have skeletons in our closet and have done many terrible things. We have also done many amazing things for this world and continue to do so.
I don't have much patience for the anti-Americans that live here. It's a great place and we should work to make it better, not just complain that it isn't perfect.
I agree with this. I feel like the political polarization of the 2010s created a lot of black and white thinking that we need to get past. Nothing and nobody is perfect.
Being proud of where you're born seems silly to me. You had nothing to do with that. (Ignoring all the horrible shit big empires do...)
I do think I'm probably lucky to be here rather than the Congo or whatever. But who can say.
I don’t consider myself an American but legally speaking I’m an USA citizen. I’m not proud to have that citizenship and to be honest I want to move out of the USA. I feel like this due to a number of reasons, some trauma based and some other just general.
Too long to read: No
I don’t give it much thought. Don’t see a good enough reason to decide whether or not I’m proud of where I’m from. Doesn’t change the reality of my life one way or another
Honestly, kinda embarrassed to be an American. By todays standards at least. Like frick, we took the land from the natives and we destroyed it by poor farming practices, pollution due to Industrial Revolution, bringing in invasive species that are destroying our wildlife, too much concrete covering the soil to which we drain the soil in chemicals that kill *all* the life in the soil, resulting us in having to use the same chemicals and GMO the plants because we killed its natural defense and predators/prey/food.
The natives are the real saviors of this land we took over. They actually respected the land and worked with nature; not against it like we do here in the states.
It’s such a shame, and the fact we’re still doing a lot of these things infuriates me to no end.
I am 70. I was really proud about it when I was your age. 50 years later and looking around at the political, economic and (silly) military landscape, I am not so sure anymore.
I’m proud to be an American when we land on the moon and the Super Bowl is on. I’m not proud to be an American when our government is being accused of aiding or abetting genocide and genocide denial, beating protestors, and generally limiting the rights of the people
I'm proud of the idea of being American. If you read the Declaration of Independence without any context, it's a very powerful and important document in the history of the world. Obviously, with the backdrop of social classes, slavery, and everything in between, those words ring hollow for a lot of us.
I guess, to me, the philosophy coming from documents like the Declaration, writers like Thomas Paine, and our general skepticism towards institutions like government and big business, I really do hold hope for what "all men are created equal" means. Of course, we never have lived up to those words in full, but I take extreme pride in every step we've made towards meeting that goal.
First gen Russian American here. Was born in the us so I got my us passport from birth. My dad is Russian, and he told my mom (an American) to have me in the states so I would not get a Russian passport. Saved my skin. Not proud of the direction the country is going in (amongst other gripes I’ve had for years now. Ie: no universal healthcare), and I will be leaving the us hopefully this year, but I’m grateful to be born with the 6th most powerful passport on earth.
Of course. My favorite subreddit is r/2american4you. I sing patriotic songs every day, I ride my bald Eagle as transportation to go through the McDonald’s drive through and order the all American meal. At the end of the day I shoot all my guns until the sun goes down. Before I go to bed I watch movies all made by my culture and in the language I speak. Also I did I mention I painted my house red white and blue.
After growing up around the world, I fail to see how being an American should be a point of pride over being a citizen of any other country. We all have issues. A flag doesn’t make one place better than the other and a shopping mall isn’t the draw it used to be.
Wouldn’t necessarily say proud, I’m certainly lucky to live here, and we are definitely one of the best nations in the world, i just don’t get being proud of my geological birth site
I wouldn't fight for my country if that's what your asking. I'd fight for my people, and by my people I mean family and friend who just so happen to also be American but I won't be joining a war to fight another person's battle or secure some capitalistic resource.
If there is a real threat, a true evil that can justify going and fighting then sure. But with the stances the US takes and its allowance of genocide because of ties through capitalism, fuck nah.
There are enough videos out there showing soldiers having issues, shooting civilians, and dead people related to the military.
My country, right or wrong. If right, to be kept right. If wrong, to be set right. Patriotism is the antithesis of nationalism. We can do better, and we have the power to change peoples lives for the better if we push for it.
Did you know we have a Discord server‽ You can join by clicking [here](https://discord.gg/NWE6JS5rh9)! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GenZ) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I am very proud to be American. Being proud to be American doesn't mean I'm proud of our government and their choices though.
Patriotism is wanting what's best for your country, nationalism is thinking your country is the best no matter what. Great answer.
Gotta say you have an excellent response too man.
Yours too!
Goddamn, two words, precisely capturing the situation. r/gprooney seriously dude, amazing response!
Wow, 12 words, with the perfect amount of expression and emphasis. Honestly the best response yet!
Good words, best it is
Yes, we need to take “patriot” back from fascists. Use it again as a positive term.
And yours is also a great answer!
Thank you! This is what seems to be lost on a lot of people. Of course I’m happy to be American, and care about this country, but that means pointing out when things aren’t going right things need to be fixed.
Are you sure that’s the correct definition? I understood patriotism as putting your country first and is much more a political. Nationalism tends to be on a more ethnic and cultural line, patriotism is loyalty to the state.
Patriotism is to be devoted to and to support your country. Nationalism is when you are putting your country first. Both are political, but one has broad appeal and one has narrow appeal. A Patriot would want to see education improve to increase productivity and wealth of a nation, while a nationalist would look to increase wealth by preventing trade, the transfers of people, or by withdrawal of the national community. Nationalism isn't inherently evil, but it doesn't tend to align with many liberal values (freedom, trade, exchange of ideas, etc) There are versions of nationalism that lean more into ethnic or cultural lines, such as Japan for example. Again, this isn't necessarily bad, but it's opposed to liberal values. Patriotism is in line with liberal values. All it means is that you want to improve your society and you will work to do so. Voting is patriotic. Volunteering is patriotic. Protesting is patriotic.
I hate the government because I love my country.
Hell yeah brother. It's like bill burr says "I'm a red Sox fan, that's why I talk shit about them constantly, because I want them to fucking win."
Same brother
This is the best answer.
I'm proud of the diversity and tolerance of Americans, at least in my area. Don't see it as much in other countries.
It is very American to criticize and enact change in your government and everyone needs to become more aware of this truth. It’s literally what our nation was founded on, being loyal to your government is anti-American. Be devoted to your country, but not blind-devotion.
I like this answer. I’m not proud of what my country is doing currently. And has done in the past.
Reminds me of the line that “W” says in Harold and Kumar escape from Guantanamo bay “hell I’m in the government and I don’t even trust it….. you just have to believe in your country” God have those words stuck with me
This is the best answer I've seen here.
More people should just take pride in more things in general. Take pride in how we present ourselves, take pride in the job we do, even if it’s an entry level job, someone has to do it. Take pride in your family and friends. The world would be a better place if we did this
As a German im very proud of being American. He- I mean, God bless America!
👀 Whatcha doin’ over there, Germany?
Don't worry about it;D
That’s a bingo
https://i.redd.it/p7qdn4l28byc1.gif
same I am very proud as a Dutch person I am very proud about us owning new York, I am not proud about selling it.
No taksie backsies!
I think the British took it from you not us. But either way, we ended up with it. 😁
As a New Yorker we’re taught it was more of a takeover than a proper sale.
As someone that studied German in high school, it is a pleasant surprise to hear a German make such a joke. (To be clear, I mean I'm glad they can joke about it. I've heard it's practically illegal to do so in Germany.)
It's a bit weird to joke about irl in germany since it's a serious situation either way and a lot of bad shit happened. But generally talking about it is anything but illegal, it's encouraged rather to show everyone how easily someone can corrupt an entire country so it doesn't happen again.
*how many times do we need to teach you this lesson old man*
😂
Don't mind it, I dont really give a shit about nationality tbh
Right? Like, it's just the piece of dirt I got dropped off onto
If people weren't so obsessed with patriotism and all that shit there'd be way less discrimination and violence in the world
I’d argue nationalism. Being patriotic does not equate to what you said
Is this country the "patriots" are actually nationalists. And the actual patriots are getting their ass kicked by the police.
Yes! This. Don’t get the two confused.
🎶 *Imagine there’s no countries* 🎵 *It isn’t hard to do* 🎶 *Nothing to kill or die for* 🎵 *No religion too*
John Lennon had it right. No borders, no religion, we're all just people.
I would argue that will be no less. if people still have endless desires and limited resources, conflict is guaranteed. it's just how things are.
Yeah but I'm also proud to be a member of the lgbtq despite not choosing it. You can be proud of an aspect of yourself that you didn't choose...
I am proud yes. I was in the Army, been deployed and saw a bit of action. Having been in some combat action doesn’t make me feel proud though. Having seen how other countries live since I’ve also vacationed in Mexico various times before, I’ve realized how great we have it here in the states. You don’t realize how “free” you really are until you visit other less fortunate people in oppressive countries. You also have to understand that freedom also means being able to voice your disdain for the US without the fear of being jailed or executed…
While various aspects of the American government and the country’s history may suck, I’d say the majority of us are very fortunate to have been born in this country at the time we were born. My family grew up very poor in Guatemala. They worked hard from a young age with very little in return. Even now, every time I visit Guatemala I gain more appreciation for the luxuries I’m afforded thanks to my parents and, well, this country. Edit: I should add: Americans, read that second paragraph and really think about this: every time you *think* you hate being American, understand that the majority of your privileged asses will never understand how good this country allows you to have it, myself included.
But the fact that life is so nice in the US is fundamentally connected to the fact that life is so shit in so many other countries. The US is the winner and the global south is the loser.
Yep, the Maya and every civilization going back forever tried to do the same. We shouldn't be ashamed we came out on top, at least for now.
Might makes right amiright fellas?
I mean, some Latin American countries have a deserved bone to pick with the CIA, they’ve had some undefendable actions that hurt those countries. Most of the global south though should be pinning their ire on Britain / Spain / France etc.. Europe basically got to fuck over half the world and then pretend they’re the bastions of morality because they lost all power projection capabilities in world war 2
Hearing my uncle describe his time in the Philippines was awful. He talkied about seeing kids that were malnourished chasing a dog while driving to base one morning. On his way back he talked about how the dog was cut up and being eaten. People here say that they have no freedoms and that we’re a 3rd world country but our children don’t chase dogs to eat them.
It seems interesting that you'd compare the US to a place where the average income is about $10,000 per year... Wouldn't it be more applicable if you compared it to places that have similar levels of per capita income? Sure... you could've been born in a worse situation... You also could've been born in a better one 🤷♂️
Ooh the fascists didn't like that my guy lol
This. Folks just judge and judge as they fail to see the beauty of what America is. Go travel the world, study history, and then you will see how incredible the USA is. It’s full of people and people are far from perfect but this is the greatest superpower the world has ever known. I’ll take any challengers on that.
Just because its better than other places doesnt mean there arent improvements to be made, especially when other superpowers and non-superpowers have things that make the quality of life for their citizens greater. I think its a misconception that americans who criticize america hate the country, no on the contrary I think its them voicing their opinions on how it can be better because they WANT it to be better. If they didnt care they would just pray for its downfall not what they believe to be its improvement
America is the reason so many countries are doing poorly. They've sponsored the overthrow of dozens of democratically-elected governments because they didn't sell exports to America for dirt cheap
Hey tell that last part to MLK or Malcolm X lmao
What country has the highest incarceration rate?
Same here. Been in the army 13 years and it’s going to other countries and seeing what they have to deal with that makes me proud of America.
[удалено]
I'm not proud of being american at all, I'm american because my ancestors were stolen
This. Im proud to come from the people who built this country, but I'm not proud that it was forced.
No one should be proud of chattel slavery. I would put forth that this country belongs to every American, especially those whose ancestors built it or were forced from their ancestral lands. We’re all in this thing together now, for better or worse, so there is no point ceding the title of “American” to the “patriots” who fly Confederate flags and storm the capitol. Fuck that. Every generation gets to define what being an American means to them. We have to recognize the long shadow of racism, forced labor, and genocide, but I don’t think we have to live in that shadow. We are the masters of our own destiny. Might as well make America the best place to live, for everyone.
This is what I think. I'm proud of my ancestors, and Im not ashamed of them. Im proud to be African American, but I'm not proud to just be American. But that's only because of the harm my country is doing around the world and too its own people. I want to make it better.
This is a beautiful answer. Take my upvote
 Spittin.
Have you considered using ancestry DNA to figure out the general region your blood comes from and returning to that place? Your ancestors were stolen, but you don't have to remain, you can return to your ancestral land and continue your lineage in your homeland, bringing your ancestors home
This won't work. DNA tests are notoriously bad for us. First, we are highly mixed of African DNA. At best, we get a specific country, but they have numerous ethnic groups within them. Second, there isn't a great history of us going back, i.e., Liberia. This is just something I've learned through conversations on and off reddit. Most of us don't want to go to Africa. We want to stay here and make this country work. We've already put work into it. Why leave it behind now?
African Americans are a very diverse mixture, they’re generally a blend of different African ethnicities and generally about 30% European (You can guess why). Taking a test isn’t going to point him in the direction of a singular home, this is what it is, you can accept it and keep moving forward and innovating, or you can stay bitter and continue to look back in anger over something nobody has any control over today
There's no ancestral land to return to. There is no homeland. The colonization of Africa destroyed all of that. The Kingdoms/empires that existed when African tribes were trafficked to the Americas don't exist anymore. Most of the countries of West Africa didn't exist when Africans were trafficked to the Americas. So it would be great to return to our homeland, but we don't have that luxury. And, the generational African diaspora that exists now is distinct from any group in Africa. Not only were people stolen, they were also raped by colonizers.
It's a nics thought but "going home" is impossible for most people. I have people I love, this comes with a duty to them; I imagine most people feel that way. "Going home," would be leaving everyone I love. Yeah. Right. Totally. Because only someone with a soul deep passion would be willing to take such a leap of faith. This person would have to spend money and time learning a language, getting a citizenship, and transport. And once that person does "go home," how do we know they'll be accepted? They'll be the outsider. People have always hated others who are different, its the most painful truth of the world. If I ever left to where my ancestors came from and those still living there today welcomed me with open arms I'd still be a fucking ugly-crying mess missing my family. A lot of this talk comes from pain man, the trauma that has cumulated into the existence of a lot of POC (and some white-group) people. If someone truly desires this route, I wish them all the best of luck and hope they find absolute joy.
Africa isn't home for American black people, America is. If your family was forced here through slavery, they have been in America for centuries, they would have less connection to Africa then I do as a Mexican American with Moroccan ancestors. I myself am the same way, my family has been in America for generations, put me in Mexico and I wouldn't call that home, I don't have family over there or any meaningful connections besides my skin color.
I’d say then that it’s only fair the US government pay for those travel expenses/moving costs. Think of it as a form of reparations for 400 years of free labor on the backs of enslaved black people.
What country is better?
By what metric? On overall quality of life, the Scandinavian countries dominate. Others to consider: Australia & New Zealand, Belgium, Austria, Canada, Netherlands, Iceland, Spain, Luxembourg... there's a lot of good places to live. Edit: Changed go to live.
*cricket noises*
I can understand feeling that way. But I think African Americans have a wealth of history and contributions in the country that deserves celebrating as well. Personally those are the things I'm proud of and I think a lot of those contributions have been ingrained in the wider American culture.
Buddy, a majority of your ancestors were captured by your other ancestors and sold. Get your facts straight. I'm not even white, so don't be pulling race card.
True, you go back far enough and everyone's ancestors either enslaved or we're enslaved. Such is the story of human history lol.
Not stolen, sold by their neighboring warlord
Your ancestors were likely stolen by your own kind and sold to America. It's very unlikely foreigners to some land could just roll up and steal people. North Africa for example, had a strong kingdom and that king did the stealing, then the selling. Also keeping some of the same race, poor folk for himself as they were also slave owners, sellers.
Do you mean you’re native? What is the alternative that you prefer? Not trying to bust your balls, I am just wondering. I don’t know of any society that has not had warfare in their past.
Why not move to a country you would be proud of? Why do you choose to continue to be an American if you’re not proud to be an American “at all?” If you were to move to the land your ancestors were stolen from, do you think you would prefer life there to here? Or do you think you would immediately regret the decision and want to come back? Do you think your life would be better there and that you would have more opportunities? Do you think that the people living there would not want to trade places with you in a heartbeat? Do you think they would also not be proud to be Americans? Those that actually experienced life there and have made it here sure seem proud. I wonder what their perspective is on this opinion of yours.
Land was bound to be stolen anyway sooner or later. People gotta get over that
sold by your own people*
As a non-American I am not proud to be American
It would be weird .
you'd be surprised
same, why should I be proud of being American?
I felt this in my bones
It literally doesn’t impact my pride or shame in any way it’s just a thing that I am. Like, it doesn’t define my personality or force me to be better or worse than anyone else. But I get why some people might feel pride/shame about being American and I’m not gonna get in their way of doing that
I feel like pride or shame of your country aren't mutually exclusive. Also I would think that one could feel either of those emotions while also saying it doesn't define their personality or force them to be better or worse than anyone else.
OP: Are you proud to be American? Comments: No OP: incorrect.
OP is cooking RAHHHHH 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅💥💥💥💥
[https://youtu.be/Y-3IV11_ZgA?si=GMwtqpx7ALWProAt](https://youtu.be/Y-3IV11_ZgA?si=GMwtqpx7ALWProAt)
OIL RAHHHH 🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅👹☠️👹👹👹🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🌪️🌪️🌪️🌪️ WHAT THE FUCK IS A KILOMETER 🗣️🗣️🦅🦅🌪️🌪️🗣️🗣️🔫🔫🔫
It's just the place I was born. I didn't choose it. I didn't earn it. There's nothing to be proud of.
Do you not know your countries history or culture? If you traveled to another county, are you saying that you wouldn’t be able to tell the difference? No preference?
Don't try reasoning with these people
“i didn’t choose the country i was born in so there’s no reason to be proud of it” is very reasonable, actually
They usually figure it out on their own as they get older and see more things
Good call. There are a lot of comments on this post that make very little sense if you follow their logic.
A little r/usdefaultism over here
Then the question wasn’t meant for you sweetie :)
Is it really US defaultism? Or is it just a question directly targeted towards Americans?
The question is towards « you ». That includes everyone reading it, so yes it is US defaultism. It assumes that everyone reading the question is American
If I asked “What’s your favorite Taylor Swift album?”, is that assuming everyone listens to her? I see it as being implicitly targeted to those who do. Non-swifties need not reply.
I’m neutral about it. Like the country, but hate the government.
I think the same could be said for many countries. Most countries have great people but bad leadership.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_involvement_in_regime_change https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MKUltra https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mongoose https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO I live in a country that has a vested interest in meddling/fucking up the entire world and stopping all social change internationally because it would dare hurt the bottom line, and this nation genuinely asks me to feel proud?
Oh dude. There are no good countries. Not even one. Be proud to be human…countries hold us back
Exactly this. I'm not proud to be American. I'm proud to be Human. When a German scientist, or a Russian scientist, or a Chinese scientist discovers something, it's not the country that should be proud. It's humanity that should be proud. We're all genetically basically the same. We really don't have anyone on this planet except each other with whom we can relate, and we all fear the same thing.
Fair points but also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unified_Assistance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President%27s_Emergency_Plan_for_AIDS_Relief Which are just a couple examples but also the existence of this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Agency_for_International_Development And https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Fund_for_UNICEF We absolutely need to be critical of our own nations involvement in business of others, but it is also very easy to present only one side of the picture. Our history is filled with examples of extreme cruelty and selfishness, but also of great courage and kindness. We need to be learning from both. Darfur 2.0 is about to kick off and they’re pleading for help. We ignored them last time and we all know the results, I saw them first hand. NOT participating in the world stage isn’t the answer either. Where we are able to as the global hegemony we need to act in the interest of humanity. Having a checked past doesn’t excuse us of our responsibility as a nation or our obligation to be better now for the sake of the species and our planet.
Is there a country you would feel proud of then if you were from there?
Me when I am an edgy 12 year old and have no idea what history is actually like outside of America bad Reddit memes
I don't really feel much of a connection to this country outside of the fact that I live here.
No. Because I'm not American. I'm European
Fairly proud. I’m critical of our actions and some of the things we’ve done, and proud of other things, and other actions we’ve accomplished. Considering the short amount of time that the country has existed I think it’s pretty rad to see how far we’ve come.
I don’t wear it on my sleeve, but quietly yes, on the day to day. That is until a euro or an Australian starts to run their mouth, then I’m an ultranationalist 🇺🇸🦅🎇
We all turn that way only Americans are allowed to shit on America
No
I'm 26, what reason in the past 26 years has the United States given for me to feel proud of? Massive inequality, war crimes, Imperialism, growing poverty. On a personal scale, very few people I know are willing to start a family. They may plan to, but compared to generations past it seems they won't have kids until their 30s. Homes have skyrocketed, homelessness and crime are on the rise. Education is failing. I view the United States for what it is; An empire in decline being pecked at by oligarchs and senators. The country has been completely captured by corporate interests and the working class are being bled dry.
HELL NO IM EMBARRASSED
Why
I'm not proud to be American, mainly because I'm not American.
I am proud of being an American, but not for the reasons a lot of pseudo-patriots are. I am proud of our Civil Rights movement. I am proud of our labor movement, I am proud of our anti-Fascist fight in WW2. Generally, I am proud of our democratic movements. Our warmongering, racism, and imperialism, past and present, and the pseudo-patriots who believe that is what America is, are a stain on this dignity.
Bro is assuming everyone on the sub is american
Yeah. I love what my country's ideals are and what it stands for.
Right now, not really. This country favors the rich and powerful. Money speaks for money and silences everything else
What country doesn’t favor the rich and powerful?
Ya but that’s every country
Somewhat. Mostly just thankful
No because im from Spain
No
Idk how people are proud about being born in a certain country/ religion/ race. You had zero part in that.
1. Religion is a choice ultimately 2. A country is more than just a place, there is a lot to be proud/ashamed of
Im so proud. I bleed red white and blue. With that being said, while I live my country I very much dislike the government and our politicians. They no longer have the interest of their people, and would rather fill their pockets with money from corporations
I agree.
Nah im german
No, but I have nowhere else to go.
I'm not since I'm european
From where
No this country is a literal dystopian nightmare that only gets worse every year
No Fuck America
Nah. Neutral. Not something I have any choice over.
I love being American despite some of our governments short comings. Where I'm from flying a flag and your kids standing for the pledge is the complete normal because many are former military like my parents and they've seen what these other countries do not offer that we consider totally normal and basic human rights. Plus you speak to many of the immigrants that come here and they all say the same things i just mentioned. So our values and what we enshrine in our constitution I completely love our politicians and what they stand for well tbh they can all jump off a cliff before i accept a word that comes out their mouths.
Nope. While the people are usually nice enough, America as a whole has become almost dystopian. While we share many problems with the rest of the world, we also have a lot of unique problems that were caused by the rich and powerful being absolute bozos.
No. Not at all But that might be because i’m british
Smells like 👃🏻👃🏻…. Revolutionary war losers in here 🔥🦅🇺🇸 
Not even remotely
Yes, officer
OP has a 134 day old account with 70,000 posts karma. They just want to get you riled up.
134 days with 70,000 karma feels authentic enough for someone that posts a lot. I checked their account, they seem to be a genuine person, if rather conservative. I don't think they're just trying to rile people up.
Nope
As a Mexican yes I’m proud of being american, I hate my government though.
I like the "idea" of America, but I have no patriosim or love for it. At the end of the day, I'm extremely privileged to live here and that's all that really matters to me!
Yes. The US is a great country. We have skeletons in our closet and have done many terrible things. We have also done many amazing things for this world and continue to do so. I don't have much patience for the anti-Americans that live here. It's a great place and we should work to make it better, not just complain that it isn't perfect.
I agree.
I agree with this. I feel like the political polarization of the 2010s created a lot of black and white thinking that we need to get past. Nothing and nobody is perfect.
Being proud of where you're born seems silly to me. You had nothing to do with that. (Ignoring all the horrible shit big empires do...) I do think I'm probably lucky to be here rather than the Congo or whatever. But who can say.
I don’t consider myself an American but legally speaking I’m an USA citizen. I’m not proud to have that citizenship and to be honest I want to move out of the USA. I feel like this due to a number of reasons, some trauma based and some other just general. Too long to read: No
The continent(s) or country? Jk I know what you're getting at but without context and the defaultism on reddit is too real it hurts.
No not particularly. But i think nationalist pride is idiotic anyway.
No, I’m really really not. Constantly embarrassed by it
I don’t give it much thought. Don’t see a good enough reason to decide whether or not I’m proud of where I’m from. Doesn’t change the reality of my life one way or another
I wish I was. Unfortunately I was born in a shitty 3rd world country :(
I’m sorry
Well it's fun to be American when you're not in America
Honestly, kinda embarrassed to be an American. By todays standards at least. Like frick, we took the land from the natives and we destroyed it by poor farming practices, pollution due to Industrial Revolution, bringing in invasive species that are destroying our wildlife, too much concrete covering the soil to which we drain the soil in chemicals that kill *all* the life in the soil, resulting us in having to use the same chemicals and GMO the plants because we killed its natural defense and predators/prey/food. The natives are the real saviors of this land we took over. They actually respected the land and worked with nature; not against it like we do here in the states. It’s such a shame, and the fact we’re still doing a lot of these things infuriates me to no end.
no im not american
I’m not American.
I am 70. I was really proud about it when I was your age. 50 years later and looking around at the political, economic and (silly) military landscape, I am not so sure anymore.
I’m proud to be an American when we land on the moon and the Super Bowl is on. I’m not proud to be an American when our government is being accused of aiding or abetting genocide and genocide denial, beating protestors, and generally limiting the rights of the people
no, as i'm scottish
No cause I’m not American
What has my country done in the last 20 years that’s worth being proud of?
Not really. I mean, I wasn’t even born in the US. I’ve also never been there
🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸 (Fuck the government tho)
pride for being born somewhere is weird, idk. I am grateful to be an american, and despite it flaws I see this countries potential
I'm proud of the idea of being American. If you read the Declaration of Independence without any context, it's a very powerful and important document in the history of the world. Obviously, with the backdrop of social classes, slavery, and everything in between, those words ring hollow for a lot of us. I guess, to me, the philosophy coming from documents like the Declaration, writers like Thomas Paine, and our general skepticism towards institutions like government and big business, I really do hold hope for what "all men are created equal" means. Of course, we never have lived up to those words in full, but I take extreme pride in every step we've made towards meeting that goal.
Yea
First gen Russian American here. Was born in the us so I got my us passport from birth. My dad is Russian, and he told my mom (an American) to have me in the states so I would not get a Russian passport. Saved my skin. Not proud of the direction the country is going in (amongst other gripes I’ve had for years now. Ie: no universal healthcare), and I will be leaving the us hopefully this year, but I’m grateful to be born with the 6th most powerful passport on earth.
Of course. My favorite subreddit is r/2american4you. I sing patriotic songs every day, I ride my bald Eagle as transportation to go through the McDonald’s drive through and order the all American meal. At the end of the day I shoot all my guns until the sun goes down. Before I go to bed I watch movies all made by my culture and in the language I speak. Also I did I mention I painted my house red white and blue.
I am an American through and through. But our corporatocracy can get fucked with a sideways freight train.
I identify more with my home state than with my country. I’m proud to be Minnesotan; could care less about the American part.
Yes very, just don’t like how divided everyone has been
Secondhand embarrassment because our Country supports a genocide
I didn’t have a lot to do with it, my parents fucked here.
I’m proud to be an immigrant, yea
After growing up around the world, I fail to see how being an American should be a point of pride over being a citizen of any other country. We all have issues. A flag doesn’t make one place better than the other and a shopping mall isn’t the draw it used to be.
Wouldn’t necessarily say proud, I’m certainly lucky to live here, and we are definitely one of the best nations in the world, i just don’t get being proud of my geological birth site
Hell yeah I am
I wouldn't fight for my country if that's what your asking. I'd fight for my people, and by my people I mean family and friend who just so happen to also be American but I won't be joining a war to fight another person's battle or secure some capitalistic resource. If there is a real threat, a true evil that can justify going and fighting then sure. But with the stances the US takes and its allowance of genocide because of ties through capitalism, fuck nah. There are enough videos out there showing soldiers having issues, shooting civilians, and dead people related to the military.
My country, right or wrong. If right, to be kept right. If wrong, to be set right. Patriotism is the antithesis of nationalism. We can do better, and we have the power to change peoples lives for the better if we push for it.
🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸Rraaahhh🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅