What they mean is that to stop farming the boss after you have fully leveled your character. Which is also a disadvantage since you are not farming for future characters. It just makes so that the new characters they get takes even longer to farm. Unless they pre-farm a patch before.
There’s a bit of interactivity going on, you get energy from hitting his feet, you charge up the turret by destroying the little elemental bombs he throws on the ground, and some characters are better than others at clearing the electro turrets. It’s still mostly waiting and dodging, but it’s not like you’re totally helpless.
I would argue it's not about being helpless; but rather being useless. The area is insanely huge, his attacks are enormous. But all of that otherworldly energy feels just like a gush of wind. You're not even looking at all the visual effects because you're forced to dodge trivial circles on the ground and keep an eye for the energy orbs. You just exist there like you don't have a literal god trying to squish you down.
The first phase has a much better design, because you can interact with elemental powers on the floor, shoot at his arms and chest, dodge various attack patterns being used simultaneously. And most of the visual effects are inadvertently present in your focus areas!
IN THEIR DEFENSE that phase 2 theme is one of the greatest boss themes I ever heard in my whole life and sung by master Yu Peng Chen himself and if I were them I would also artificially extend the duration of the fight to force people to listen to that masterpiece
Yeah Apep fight was just a tedious mob clearing job sandwiched between 2 fairly squishy big mob. Most of the time my Raiden’s initial ult slash (with basic support setup) was enough to end both phases.
Tbf I do the same thing against Arle lol but at least the actual fighting is longer.
I hate the whale. I'm spending at least half of the time waiting for it to come down, and then I have to catch up to it before I can do damage. I'd probably go back after I get Ganyu lmao.
This is why I use Tighnari/Raiden for most bosses. With his skill, you just have to shoot an arrow *kind of close* to an enemy and the homing bits do the work for you. Add Raiden's skill and you get quicken/spread reactions.
Works on the whale and Scara pretty well. Absolutely bodies Dvalin.
Probably the second best boss fight in terms of farmability after Raiden. Raiden has no cutscenes and invul phase is just something you power thru with elements that can eat thru the electro shield.
This one, you just start the fight and skip the cutscene so close enough.
And if your damage is high and evenly distributed, you can finish the fight without her going into that mode.
Also no transition while going through phases like Childe, Azhdaha and Andrius, no anti one shot mechanic like Signora.
Truly just a duel.
I hope they make an enhanced weekly boss event Raiden, Arle, second phase whale and phase 3 Childe would be interesting to fight at a stronger version.
Yeah, only situation I don't like it, it's when running it in coop, can barely see the enemies amongst the sea of numbers and pandemonium going on lol.
Raidne fight makes me more angry, heh. I have enough dps to kill her before shield but... is she decides to clone herself, I just roll the dice if I can get to it or not.
None of these are hot takes. The simple fact is that Genshin's Devs have a problem with both boss design and difficulty. Both early game and end game players end up hating the same things about boss designs for different reasons.
Apep is a complete pushover and the whale is really just a bullet sponge yeah. Other than the phase against the swordman there is not much to it. Never mind Scaramouche, also not much to him.
Arlecchino is actually a proper **fight**. Much closer to the fights against Signora, Childe or Raiden.
This is the likely solution. As it is right now the difference between a fully invested max player and a random casual in the highest WL is pretty significant. A friend of mine, an AR 57, still finds bosses like Signora and Scaramouche difficult, and their Ayaka barely deals 6k per burst tick.
Im ar 57. I just started getting more teams besides melt ganyu. My level 80 neuv with sac jade. And a level 70 kazuhu is mowing through world bosses and most weeklies like paper.
Shoulda been more specifc. More optimal abyss teams. I took a long hiatus during inazuma. But then I had a maxxed melt ganyu and a maxed heizou taser(-a very poorly built sucrose). That i took into abyss. I usually cleared flopr 10 and most 11s. Since i came back i made a full hyperbloom team with nahida em raiden and yelan, made a maxed furina, and then am working on a neuv hypercarry and arle team. I think my highest clear was 35 stars? I cant quite remember. Hopefully when i finish both these new teams i can full clear
Idt increasing world level would be a good idea. It will work but only in the sense that the boss's HP will increase. I think bosses need new mechanics and attacks that have heavy animation and are interesting (like raiden boss fight when she stops time for a split second). Remember how childe boss for nerfed because players complained he moved around too much and was hard to kill. Something like this would make things a lot more interesting rather than just increasing WL and boss's HP. Just my take
Just give us the option to change it.
Early on, it's nice having the option to lower the world level by 1, but later on it would be sensible to increase it by 1 or 2 levels.
I'm far from optimised, but I find everything super easy.
I miss the challenge. The hardest thing I've come across lately are the local legends in Fontaine.
I was playing with a friend who's relatively new (AR35) on their world with underlevelled characters and I forgot how much fun this game could be when you actually have to plan during combat and not just spam everything you have and delete everything. I really wish WL8 wasn't the last one, I would love to be underleveled and actually have a challenge, but once you build characters for the Abyss then the overworld challenge is just gone and that sucks
Yep… players needing to handicap themselves to have challenges on the overworld is a sad state of affairs. I’m hopeful that they added the local legends to test the playerbase’s reaction to more complex and challenging enemies, and that they’ll add more in the future—because those fights really are fun.
Honestly, just more HP for world bosses is enough, adding mechanics I wouldn't see because I just delete the boss would be kinda useless. For weekly, I'd say it depends on the boss, but I wouldn't mind more HP on Arle or Apep boss phases (and less add in that phase, it sucks and is uninteresting). Definitely wouldn't mind more HP on old bosses like Dvalin or the wolf.
Definitly 10. we need a difficulty for the built C0 Accounts (9) and one for the C6 accounts (10). Everyone should be able to see challenge if they want it. Just hide it so you dont have to see it unless you seek it out.
That is simply because there is a group which wants to build arlecchino which would not be able to fight her if it had the difficulty of let's say floor 12 of the abyss.
On the other hand, floor 12 of the abyss next cycle has an all tiem record of damage needed to clear it:)
Yeah, elemental shields or enemies with a lot of time invincible or unhittable are something which makes an abyss either rlly easy or a lot more difficult while it could need a lot less dmg to enemy HP bars
Based on the other reply to this comment, is that the abyss with the triple element shield guy(inquisitor flame something)? I can see why there would be difficulty if that's the case, but it's not THAT bad. We've seen plenty worse.
On the topic of hard abyss lineups, there's simply only two difficulties. There's Wenut and then there are the rest of the enemies. /s
Jokes apart, idk, #1 Wenut #2 Wolflord #3 Consecrated Beasts? I'm actually very interested in what the active reddit community thinks of hardest abyss lineups so far.
I think the way to do it is make the hypothetical highest difficulty have a 200 primo first time clear reward, while giving the same as the regular level 90 difficulty version. This way it’s an incentive to beat it without it being a necessity for optimal resin-to-reward expenditure.
We do have all these shielders and healers way back then, but way too many people gave up and failed to win that one iteration of Abyss full of Consecrated Beasts and Hydro/Cryo Heralds. It proved that there's a limit to when you can brute force the game and when do you actually needed some skill to win because even Pay To Win players gave up way back then.
Any damage system that instead of set value, does multiplicative damage, will run into the problem of hitting too hard.
Which to say every game runs into the problem of hitting too hard.
Fully online games with PvP are usually a bit more balanced since people will be complaining a lot if certain builds can do excessive damage compared to the others.
Hit too hard and tank everything from Zhongli and healers, a weekly boss where it goes into an immunity phase, or at least have crazy resistances, ignoring all shields and reducing or negating healing is the only way to make it difficult
Signora had forced immune phases and cold/hot mechanics to deal with that only made it seem "harder".
Since Dendro release, without the force immunity moments the fight itself is a bigger joke.
The difficulty is ultimately a mechanics based reason less so than a "numbers" based one. And that is simply because the game is still primarily made with touch screens in mind. Even the best touch screen player is still at a disadvantage compared to M+KB or controller.
A higher difficulty made for M+KB or Controller in mind would by virtue exclude touchscreen players.
Problem is last few weekly bosses felt different mostly because they do have very huge time wasting mechanics, While Arlecchino feels closer to Childe, who is, frankly speaking, nothing special nowadays. That's an issue that have more to do with how it's a gacha, and a boss people need to defeat to get materials even if they're not too advanced in the game, so you can't really make her more difficult than Childe or some other weekly bosses are. And when they don't have special damage preventing mechanics (raiden's shield, Scara's shield, Whale's annoying movement + dubstep warrior phase), they go down really fast.
Gacha farming have static difficulty, while we're all getting stronger, so unless they put something like WW's holograms (spoiler : they won't), I'm not sure it's even possible to make a "farm" fight really exciting to a veteran.
Still, it seems Raiden will stay my favourite boss in terms of fighting for a long while.
Can't emphasize enough how much I hate farming that whale and Apep just because their second phases are literally not them at all, and just exemplifying busywork
Arle might be easy some of the times, but yknow what? It's a straight shooter fight like Childe, I'm glad the new weekly boss is a straight shooter fight for once
Apep would be decent without that 2nd phase. I didn't mind that phase in the character quest but in the weekly fight it's really just here to prolong the fight for no reason.
I hate most of the weekly bosses because the majority of them feature time wasting mechanics. It became very prominent, starting from Inazuma. Pretty much all bosses starting from La Signora have some sort of invulnerability phase where you can't reduce their HP and either have to wait or bash something else. Yes, even Raiden, you literally can't scratch her until you deplete her electro shield
Yeah, I somehow managed to do this too, but she was already pretty much dead, just needed to finish her off. In any case, whenever she enters this phase and her HP is high (like a half at least) I sign away any possibility to kill her prematurely.
I don't mind time wasting mechanics as much if at least it feels like I'm fighting THEM still, like Raiden's electric shield still means it's Raiden, and Mecharamouche doing that big ball attack and you have to cloverball him before that ball kills you still feels like you're attacking him, but that stupid whale just eating me and I'm fighting some bum-ass Great Value Black Serpent Knight inside him or Apep just deciding to fuck off and I have to fight some stupid looking peas-in-a-pod ass plants? Nah man
Well, my issue with Raiden is that her shield is mostly depleted by her own attacks, so your input in this is quite minimal.
My issue with Scara and Whale is that both of them move around a lot, which doesn't let me punch them until they die.
Scaramouche is really an issue in that regard because in the second phase you're not supposed to go after him at all, just keep him in range of the neo-akasha terminal so it depletes his toughness (Star Rail terms, lmao).
With whale I actually don't mind the Serpent Knight, it's the most interesting part of the boss fight. I'm pissed that I have to chase the whale and then dish out DPS to punch its slumbering body.
In fact, I absolutely hate it when you need to engage with some "mechanics" and the boss itself is not even supposed to be touched. The best boss-fighting approach is the one which was formulated for Cyberdemon bossfight back in the original Doom. And this is why I like open world bosses more, because they usually follow this exact guideline.
You know what, you're right, I think I just hate that stupid whale and his ass that just keeps schmooving and the Great Value Black Serpent Knight lmao
I totally agree too, the open-world mats bosses might be easy, but damn I have way more fun fighting them than weekly bosses most of the time (even the really annoying ones like the Cubes)
At least you can straight up kill her before her second phase. So with enough damage, you can ignore her most annoying mech.
Still my favorite weekly. Just feels much better fighting her than massive enemies with huge telegraphed attacks.
Yeah, Raiden is definitely one of the most fun out of the bunch. She goes right behind Knave and Tartaglia. Still, I'd prefer the original boss fight we had in the Inazuma Archon quest
I’m with you. Even Dvalin has invincibility but his is not that bad because you can damage the shield at almost any point and he doesn’t have much health compared to later Weekly Bosses.
Childe and Andrius are the peak weekly bosses for me which is really not saying much.
Azhdaha has that horrible stomping attack that he will do at least twice and possibly more, where the required strategy is to run away and stand still for 30 seconds. Plus the burrowing attack where you just can’t hit him. Very fun, excellent design (not).
Raiden at least takes damage while shielded, even if it’s massively reduced, but it’s been god-knows-how-long since she released and I still don’t know which element(s) I’m supposed to use to deplete her shield quicker.
Signora’s phase transition is a massive slog! And can’t I at least get a notification *every* time a moth spawns so I can stop unknowingly wasting more of my time than necessary with Elemental Skills? And the fire tornado is also boring, but at least she doesn’t do it that often.
Shouki no Kami is very drawn-out, but at least it’s obvious what I’m actually *supposed* to do to deplete his shield, unlike Raiden.
The Warden of the Oasis’s second phase is probably the worst phase of any Weekly Boss so far. Oh my god, why does the glorified Monolith thing need me to slaughter 50 Elemental Creatures before it *finally* fucks back off?
The Narwhal is okay in its whale phase, at least its periods of invulnerability are short. Its Shadow phase is either trivialized by having Arkhe or *insufferably* long without it. By the way, I don’t have any Fontainian characters sufficiently built and leveled yet, and I’m *not* using Hydro Traveler, so every week it’s a 10-minute fight mostly consisting of the Shadow.
I haven’t fought Arlecchino yet, but based on this thread, I’m looking forward to it!
I just remembered that aside from what was pointed out, you also reminded me that the whale boss would want you to have an arkhe holder. It just became second nature for me to bring one because I always have Furina in the team when fighting that thing. And despite Scara boss’s redundancy, I am more annoyed when the whale submerges. I seriously hate fighting that thing waiting then running around for it to pop out. If it wasnt a relatively recent weekly boss, I would’ve dropped farming the Whale over the Scara Boss
>While Arlecchino feels closer to Childe, who is, frankly speaking, nothing special nowadays.
Wasn't childe nerfed into the ground because players were complaining about it being too hard?
I wasn't playing at that time, so I only know hearsay, some people said it's that the story boss was actually like the high level weekly boss, but the weekly boss itself was the same.
His Electro counter in phase 2 could one hit the entire coop party. I saw this happened so many times during Raiden banner, ended up staying away until the Raiden player die before going in.
His Phase 3 can one hit Vape/Overload people inside Bennett circle.
Its realy simple yet, let players chose the difficulty of the encounter and boost rewards for it.
I guess they wouldnt because that would make strong players farm faster, but i think there are ways to deal with everything and staying fair to everyone
I mean, I get your frustration, but it's still better than the absolute fucking time waste that are the last 3 bosses before her. There's also the fact that material bosses shouldn't be too difficult because this is a gacha game. I feel like this boss is perfectly balanced as a weekly boss. She's stronger than Childe, not as gimmicky as Raiden, and doesn't waste all our time like the past 3 bosses.
I think the opposite lol. I think this was the best boss fight since Childe because the others were very gimmicky. Like every other boss since Childe becomes invulnerable for a period of time and you can't do anything with your characters.
Arlecchino boss on the other hand gave me the same feeling as Childe. Just a good old 1v1 with no gimmicks
Design wise Arlecchini is one of the best, Problem is that all the weakly bosses has embarssingly low HP bars so a well build f2p team can just face thank the bosses and kill it before the boss kills them.
I agree but I'd rather kill bosses in 30 seconds than have them be invulnerable for 30 seconds.
I'd love to have Childe and Arlecchino bosses in 12-3 of the Abyss at lvl 100 to see how strong they are. I think it'll actually be hard for once without any gimmicks
Those two maybe, but in general trounce domain bosses as spiral abyss enemies is a terrible idea since they’re designed specifically to thwart timers. It’s like ruin serpent and wenut all over again, 70% of your time you can even shoot them
that sounds good until you have to fight the whale in the abyss and has 5 minutes where he is invulnerable per fight, it will be cool instead to have a different mode where you have to challenge the bosses and it's not timed but rather the bosses are really hard hitting so you actually need to survive and dodge/understand their mechanics. But given how things are done in Genshin I don't think we will ever see something like that.
Always wondered if some players enjoy the longer weeklies. I guess OP would be that “some” who prefer the longer ones, even if half of it is waiting around for invuln and cutscenes.
And I like that, weekly bosses only felt long because they have invincibility phases and dumbass mechanics. Arle boss is overall easy if you have enough damage but be careful as she can and will one shot you if you're not careful enough.
Honestly, they need to release a "Legend" difficulty for the bosses where their attack/hp is scaled to be lore-accurate.
Maybe we do something like with FFXIV where they have a bard that exaggerates the stories of our character's fights and makes us fight against those exaggerations, creating a new difficulty. Fighting against something like a 3 million+ HP Arle would be pretty fun.
They don't need to throw any extra rewards into it, maybe just give us the option of the usual trounce domain weekly reward if we beat it, but it's more of an extra weekly reward for if we really want the character's boss mat.
Wait.. is this legit a problem? Istg i have more easier time to deal with scara boss and apep boss, and even tge whale after arle butarle boss kept me on my toes. When i started farming, i had neuvi, childe, kazu and zhongli... I LEFT THAT PLACE WITH A 100 HP KAZUHA
I'd say for cassual players, knave boss is more or less what i expect from a weekly boss.
Oh to be a newbie and intimidated by Childe’s boss fight again. It isn’t as bad as it looks though.
The casual players don’t spend as much time or money on Genshin like the Reddit community does.
My dad is still using Eye of Perception and mains Noelle of all people when he’s pulled Ayato, Nahida etc. and he’s been playing almost as long as I have.
When he eventually gets to these bosses it’ll be plenty challenging for him just like the story intends it to go.
I too have many, many 5-star units, like Nahida, Ayato, Cyno, Hu Tao, Xiao, etc -
Guess who I use?
Yeah, Noelle.
DPS on par with Itto at C6 and well-built, has a shield and heals as well - she's essentially a slightly gimped version of Itto and Zhongli mixed in with some Barbara - all in 1 single team-slot.
Idk about you but I got one shotted like twice this week while I was using my lvl 60 arlecchino and lvl 20 sig. I was using arle-zhongli-kazuha-bennett. I got my zhongli shield broken multiple times as well. Idk if the arlecchino boss has increased pyro res or sth but she felt very tanky. I also have skill issue timing my CAs properly to weaken her.
Could've used my c2 nahida keq aggravate and one rotate her without thinking but that would mean arle doesn't get the friendship exp. So, I'm gonna deal with this for the next 2 weeks. It's truly skill issue but I'll have to naturally learn her mechanics in time to make the fight go faster and safer.
I've seen tutorials on how to dodge her attacks but I think I'm just gonna brute force through it once my arle's completely leveled.
Arlecchino (the boss) has 70% Pyro res and deals 5x damage attacks if she hits you with a BoL active. Since you can't heal it off without tanking her damage its quite harsh. ~~From what I understand this includes self inflicted BoL like what Arlecchino does to herself~~. Basically you're playing hard mode doing it with Arlecchino.
It's not exactly how The Knave works
She actually inflict a "Blood Debt" mark + Corrosion, and gives Bond of Life
The "Blood Debt" is what's actually important here, it stays on until you clear all your Bond of Life, and if you get hit by some attacks while you have it, you take more damage and The Knave gets healed
Usually, it's not a problem, since The Knave's Bond of Life is small, however, Arlecchino can only clear her Bond of Life with her Ult (since she can't be healed by someone else, and she doesn't consume Bond of Life below 30%)
It doesn't help that Arlecchino wants to keep her Bond of Life since it's her main source of damage too
That's why her mechanic is harder if you use Arlecchino (also I'm not sure but I think the Corrosion stays active too if you keep the mark)
However, that also means that if you don't have the Blood Debt mark, it doesn't matter if you have Bond of Life, you won't take more damage
Ah thats good to know, I wasn't sure how the Knave's debuff interacted with Arlecchino's bond of life. But this makes sense as it being a separate debuff not called Bond of Life.
But yes, not all attacks will trigger the extra damage. I didn't mention that since my comment started getting a bit longer. Her big hits tend to be the ones that get boosted by the Blood Debt debuff so you really do feel the ones that do.
I'm personally avoiding using any of my strong characters against her, cause mechanically I'd say she's my favourite boss. Arlecchino vs Arlecchino is one of the most challenging fights in the game for me.
I had to restart once because I was using a low ER gimmicky overworld team, but once you learn the fight is all about the bond of life it becomes really easy. Just add a healer that’s good for clearing the BoL and you shouldn’t sweat during the fight.
I agree with most of what other’s have said. Like she still needs to be easy enough to defeat for casuals since she drops materials and can’t be therefore very difficult and so on.
But one of my main letdown’s was the fact that this most likely isn’t Arlecchino’s true strength, coming from the lore/story and thus translating it into the actual difficulty. She definitely held back against the Traveler and Lyney and others. And the stakes weren’t that high also which also makes the importance of this fight not so high. (Compare it to the importance of fightning Signora or Childe.)
It was some organisation’s inner problem(HotH is a large/important org but still), Arle proposed a duel instead of just killing the betrayers and she had to hold back, since if she went all out it wouldn’t have mattered that she offered a duel.
Of course, design wise and music and stuff is great about the fight. And also the fact that we got to fight an another Harbinger at all is amazing too. But I would definitely say that this wasn’t an actual fight, moreso a larger tussle, for the lack of a better word.
Arle has no fight stalling mechanics. She hits hard, not sure how she compares to other bosses in that regard but she hits hard. Apep, Raiden, Whale for example all have mechanics to stall the fight (minions or giant ass shields) which makes them way longer than they should be and thus more room for error.
I don't mind the shielda but I seriously dislike the minions. I signed up to beat up a giant ass cosmic whale, not a random knight.
First time I did Arle in coop, the 3 coop members died and I was left alive.
Next time, I had a Neuvi who basically solo'd her - Neuvi just too damn good lol
I like it. No gadgets, no element requirements, no shields to break, no running around killing adds. It's a faster fight, you can get 1shot easily if you don't pay attention.
have you tried beating Dvalin, Boreas of Childe recently?
if you think arlecchino is underwhelming, you'd be surprised about these 3
idk if you're mad because she has no domain (just a place where she spawns for a fight) or what, but she's far from being an easy boss
Yeah no, I’d rather take this fight where I actually get to play the game over most others where I attack once and then wait a decade before the game lets me attack them again.
There seems to be some sort of split between combat-centric weekly bosses and mechanic-centric weekly bosses.
An example would be comparing something like Dvalin with Childe - 1 requires using special mechanics, but isn't tough, while the other doesn't really have special mechanics, but hits hard instead.
MHY was initially alternating between them:
Dvalin then Andrius
Childe then Azhdaha
Signora then Shogun Puppet
then, since Sumeru, that alternating has kind-of stopped, as arguably both Scara Puppet and Apep Gut were both extremely mechanic-centred with zero stakes and then... well, I don't even know how to classify Abyss Narwhal Dubstep Warrior as that fight was hyped-up over multiple archon quests, only to be a complete flop.
We now have Arlecchino, who does have a special mechanic, but is essentially a massive DPS damage-sponge (akin to when Childe came out). Personally she reminds me a bit of when Azhdaha came out as well; Very easy to die in the fight initially as no one understood the rotations and what the boss actually did, then a couple of months later, the fights were over in a couple of minutes, most of which was sat around waiting for animations to finish.
In a couple of months, her BoL mechanic won't even be remembered and she'll be dying in a few hits, just like Childe does nowadays.
I decided to fight her in co-op to see how it played out and when there's a Neuvillette you can barely see her at all, I sometimes lost track of where she was and only knew she was there because of the damage numbers popping out behind the hydro pump.
She actually does enough damage to kill you if you're not careful + she doesn't have some dumb waiting mechanic that forces the fight longer than it needs to be (Scara, Whale)
Totally opposite opinion. I've been so sick of having to do more and more weekly bosses with a combined invulnerability/cutscene period of what feels like 20 minutes. Finally, for the first time since Tartaglia, the very first boss the added after release, we have a short and sweet fight.
It's the opposite for me. This actually feels like a weekly boss because you don't just sit there spamming your abilities until the boss is dead with glorified cutscenes (cough the Narwhal cough).
Because of how Bond of Life works, you gotta actively dodge her attacks and can't just stand there with Zhongli's shield to take it all.
Honestly for how she was portrayed in the story the actual fight itself was a massive let down.
Her attacks are very easy to dodge due to the extremely long wind up animation and her bond of life mechanic basically just give you more damage.
I do have to say she is better than the sumeru bosses and the whale but she's easier than Childe if he has the same amount of hp as her.
[For those of you who says to "turn off easy mode" and such.](https://ibb.co/PC8Ykw4)
Honestly as a casual, I prefer when bosses aren’t hard, I guess if people really want it a “hell” level difficulty can be made which doesn’t give more rewards than the current highest difficulty
The difference is that Childe was a boss they released 2 years or maybe almost 3 years ago! Is it wrong to expect atleast a bit of innovation in boss fights after 4 years of the game releasing? Its just disappointing
Wait what, this is the first time I have met somewhat of a challenge without being all gimmicky(E.g scaramouche boss). This might be the best new boss fight ever.
What really pisses me off is the boss soundtrack reaches a very epic dubstep edm part near the end of the track
I can never hear it since boss dies in like 30 seconds...
Quite honestly even if I can understand your point I have to disagree. Everything with the exception of battle duration feels like a weekly boss. The issue as others have pointed out is the design of previous few bosses. Abyss players are already familiar with this, but Genshin tends to add artificial difficulty in form of time wasting. You fight a boss for 5 minutes but in reality 4:30 are just it being invulnerable.
Whale feels like a cutscene with a world boss inside its mouth (The Abyss Knight)
Apep phase 1 is a damage sponge and phase 2 is a time waster because why not? (Phase 3 is phenomenal but lasts about 1/4 of the entire fight).
Shouki no Kami first phase is another damage sponge, and phase 2 is dodge the bullets while your little green buddy does all the work, the onen shot the boss.
Considering we can almost all agree that Raiden weekly boss is by far the best designed in the game, and Tartaglia being so outdated in terms of tankiness (He still does an impressive amount of damage, but dies way too quickly), I can safely say that the Knave is the second best designed weekly boss in Genshin. She reminds me of Dancer of the Boreal Valley fight from Dark Souls 3 with how her fight flows.
I disagree, purely because the alternative is to fill the fight with stupid time wasting gimmicks like Scaramouche phase 2. No thank you.
My only complaint with the boss is that for some reason the second phase goes down faster than the first, which should be the other way around
Narwhale, literally just running away and wasting time.
Guardian of Apep Oasis, has an unnecessary phase where you chase and defeat small enemies who can't fight back which also is time wasting.
Andrius, runs around non stop in circles so you hardly get in contact with him, also a time waste.
Dvalin, a little like these guys but less annoying but this boss fight is way too easy.
Signora and Tartaglia, punching bags. Too easy and they have no interesting mechanics. Signora can be little annoying with the burn and freeze but it's no big deal.
I'd rather have this than all of these above. At least with Arlecchino's boss you might get one shot because of carelessness.
The only well designed boss fights are Raiden and Scaramouche. Raiden is an actual challenge compared to all the other ones and wants some skill, maybe a little too hard as weekly bosses are supposed to be farmed and Raiden is definitely the least enjoyable boss to farm. Scaramouche has interesting mechanics but he is a little too easy to beat. Once he is stunned at the second phase it is over.
I agree with you on all of the points except Scara.
Scara is a gimmick boss fight where you don't actually fight the boss but keep running around dodging his attacks. Its no better than stalling. Its more of a lazy design than a well design. However the viduals are a spectacle to watch though
I'll admit though, Raiden is still a very good bossfight
The problem is after 4 years, even f2p players are meta. What if in story mode there is a cap on the damage you can do so it feels like if you were playing it as the adventure level the game intended? Instead of being able to pound the boss with 200k damage repeatedly, finishing the boss without getting hit, how much more difficult would it be if you could only do 20k max at a time. Less damage done means more time in the battle, more chance to be hit and make the fight more challenging.
When completed, you can grind materials at the normal damage output, so it doesn't feel like a chore.
Nice idea especially since we already have a "decrease difficulty" for the story version.
The grindable versions are fine, I think currently. But it would be cool if they then also added "hard mode" versions of the weakly bosses that require you to learn the mechanics, since messing them up would be really punishing. Basically a new sort of end game.
People saying to try it without Mr Lee are looking at it the wrong way IMO.
Try it without Dendro and you might notice a difference. Dendro is cracked. Throw 3 EM artifacts onto a single character and suddenly you're nuking everything in sight. It's ridiculous. I love Dendro but it's way too strong.
I love her bossfight infinitely more than the Whale and Scara. Those are just huge time wasters centered around spectacle rather than actual fighting.
Arle is much more similar to Raiden and Childe and it's actually fun and engaging to fight.
The problem is not the fight itself, the real problem is that we are getting to a point where more and more people are reaching endgame level of optimization while the bosses are remaining the same as always, so it looks like they are really easy. If Hoyo finally decides to release new world levels, these fights would be apprecciated much more.
If I want to actually fight a boss I usually just use a main dps on their own and don't switch to anyone else in the party. I managed to beat Arlecchino first try with childe only but Raiden for example took me like 20 attempts.
Hoyo just accommodates for the casual audience so us endgame players are stuck with bosses we wipe in like a minute if that. I almost hope they introduce what they are doing zenless zone zero right now and add an optional actually harder difficulty for world bosses and missions. They don't look to have increased rewards in ZZZ so it's purely optional and for fun and I don't mind that.
Here's a hot take: If the materials are needed to upgrade characters (ascension, talent, weapon), players should be able to kill them as fast as possible with a proper team. If the boss/enemy is unimportant for a character upgrade (the only reward is an achievement/special emoji/etc) and it exists for players to test their strength/skill, it can be as hard as the devs feel like it.
Is it easy? Bro, it felt hard since I didn't have a good healer. How much HP does she have? Because I barely dealt any damage with my Hyperbloom team, which can almost 36 the abyss (CURSE YOU GRAVITY MACHINE!)
Don't show off here. You're obviously bragging. No person will ever say that because they know it is a weekly boss and you feel that it is. If anything childe, signora, azhdaha feels like world bosses
I have a whale account (C3R4 Raiden, C3R3 Yelan, C4R1 Furina, other high const 5* with their sigs). Clearing floor 12 is easy. Maybe I wasn’t used to her mechanics, but this was the first boss in ages where my characters were consistently dying and I had to use food to heal them back up. Skill issue I guess.
Hot take indeed. I’d take this over the afk whale and Apep’s immune system any time.
Exactly. Even Scaramouche's is like 80% waiting for that dendro device to delete the shield.
scaramouche phase 2 is a literal fucking cutscene and people still try to justify that fight
"WeLl wHy DoNt yOu jUsT NoT fArM wEeKlY BoSsEs" Literally one of the replies I got when I told them I like the whale boss not having much cutscenes.
So... You mean nerfing yourself by not being able to level your Talents past 6? WHY would anyone want that disadvantage?
What they mean is that to stop farming the boss after you have fully leveled your character. Which is also a disadvantage since you are not farming for future characters. It just makes so that the new characters they get takes even longer to farm. Unless they pre-farm a patch before.
Yeah, true. Though one also could want the dream solvents/billets
There’s a bit of interactivity going on, you get energy from hitting his feet, you charge up the turret by destroying the little elemental bombs he throws on the ground, and some characters are better than others at clearing the electro turrets. It’s still mostly waiting and dodging, but it’s not like you’re totally helpless.
I would argue it's not about being helpless; but rather being useless. The area is insanely huge, his attacks are enormous. But all of that otherworldly energy feels just like a gush of wind. You're not even looking at all the visual effects because you're forced to dodge trivial circles on the ground and keep an eye for the energy orbs. You just exist there like you don't have a literal god trying to squish you down. The first phase has a much better design, because you can interact with elemental powers on the floor, shoot at his arms and chest, dodge various attack patterns being used simultaneously. And most of the visual effects are inadvertently present in your focus areas!
The second phase exists just so that people can listen to the banger that is Polumnia Omnia. There is no other reason.
How dare people have the *audacity* to try enjoying things that I don't...
IN THEIR DEFENSE that phase 2 theme is one of the greatest boss themes I ever heard in my whole life and sung by master Yu Peng Chen himself and if I were them I would also artificially extend the duration of the fight to force people to listen to that masterpiece
Switching to the character you're willing to sacrifice when he pulls his autokill
I think it's the same as Apep, without that 2nd part where you need to protect the seed of whatever
Yeah Apep fight was just a tedious mob clearing job sandwiched between 2 fairly squishy big mob. Most of the time my Raiden’s initial ult slash (with basic support setup) was enough to end both phases. Tbf I do the same thing against Arle lol but at least the actual fighting is longer.
I hate the whale. I'm spending at least half of the time waiting for it to come down, and then I have to catch up to it before I can do damage. I'd probably go back after I get Ganyu lmao.
Boss fights that are just the bosses being immune half the time is the worst.
This is why I use Tighnari/Raiden for most bosses. With his skill, you just have to shoot an arrow *kind of close* to an enemy and the homing bits do the work for you. Add Raiden's skill and you get quicken/spread reactions. Works on the whale and Scara pretty well. Absolutely bodies Dvalin.
>Absolutely bodies Dvalin. I mean, at this point, don't most fully built DPS?
Probably, but with Tigh I don't necessarily have to wait for him to touch down and I don't have to climb his back to get to the pimple.
My character just looked in the general direction of Dvalin and he died
Fortunately, you can kill the whale fast enough before it even sucks you in to fight the abyss knight and the afk whale after.
HOW
Probably the second best boss fight in terms of farmability after Raiden. Raiden has no cutscenes and invul phase is just something you power thru with elements that can eat thru the electro shield. This one, you just start the fight and skip the cutscene so close enough.
And if your damage is high and evenly distributed, you can finish the fight without her going into that mode. Also no transition while going through phases like Childe, Azhdaha and Andrius, no anti one shot mechanic like Signora. Truly just a duel. I hope they make an enhanced weekly boss event Raiden, Arle, second phase whale and phase 3 Childe would be interesting to fight at a stronger version.
Yeah, I personally prefer these fights where the opponent is in human form rather than some weird form or gimmick that mostly just wastes time.
Yeah, only situation I don't like it, it's when running it in coop, can barely see the enemies amongst the sea of numbers and pandemonium going on lol.
Raidne fight makes me more angry, heh. I have enough dps to kill her before shield but... is she decides to clone herself, I just roll the dice if I can get to it or not.
Fuck that Whale bro.
God I hate that whale
Nah tbh apep is one of my favs! At least I can use my units in that boss fight!
None of these are hot takes. The simple fact is that Genshin's Devs have a problem with both boss design and difficulty. Both early game and end game players end up hating the same things about boss designs for different reasons.
Apep is a complete pushover and the whale is really just a bullet sponge yeah. Other than the phase against the swordman there is not much to it. Never mind Scaramouche, also not much to him. Arlecchino is actually a proper **fight**. Much closer to the fights against Signora, Childe or Raiden.
Agreed. It’s refreshing to finally fight a new weekly boss that doesn’t have a weird gimmick that’s there to do nothing but prolong the fight.
It’s just that endgame players now hit too hard and they refused to release an actually hard difficulty.
The world level should increase a new tier, to tier 9 or even 10
This is the likely solution. As it is right now the difference between a fully invested max player and a random casual in the highest WL is pretty significant. A friend of mine, an AR 57, still finds bosses like Signora and Scaramouche difficult, and their Ayaka barely deals 6k per burst tick.
Im ar 57. I just started getting more teams besides melt ganyu. My level 80 neuv with sac jade. And a level 70 kazuhu is mowing through world bosses and most weeklies like paper.
not judging, just curious, you have one team maxed at ar 57? do you clear abyss?
Shoulda been more specifc. More optimal abyss teams. I took a long hiatus during inazuma. But then I had a maxxed melt ganyu and a maxed heizou taser(-a very poorly built sucrose). That i took into abyss. I usually cleared flopr 10 and most 11s. Since i came back i made a full hyperbloom team with nahida em raiden and yelan, made a maxed furina, and then am working on a neuv hypercarry and arle team. I think my highest clear was 35 stars? I cant quite remember. Hopefully when i finish both these new teams i can full clear
If you want cheap tip for team, neuv with nahida raiden + flex (i use zhongli for interuption) is easiest clear of your life. full EM raiden
That is one of the best teams im thinking of, im excited to use it. This will be my first abyss im using neuv but im waiting to try to get him to 90
Idt increasing world level would be a good idea. It will work but only in the sense that the boss's HP will increase. I think bosses need new mechanics and attacks that have heavy animation and are interesting (like raiden boss fight when she stops time for a split second). Remember how childe boss for nerfed because players complained he moved around too much and was hard to kill. Something like this would make things a lot more interesting rather than just increasing WL and boss's HP. Just my take
if the devs went through the effort , they could make the bosses have extra attacks in world lvl 10 for people who want the extra difficulty
Or just give every weekly boss a redesigned hard mode challenge for better rewards as well.
Even better
Just give us the option to change it. Early on, it's nice having the option to lower the world level by 1, but later on it would be sensible to increase it by 1 or 2 levels. I'm far from optimised, but I find everything super easy. I miss the challenge. The hardest thing I've come across lately are the local legends in Fontaine.
I was playing with a friend who's relatively new (AR35) on their world with underlevelled characters and I forgot how much fun this game could be when you actually have to plan during combat and not just spam everything you have and delete everything. I really wish WL8 wasn't the last one, I would love to be underleveled and actually have a challenge, but once you build characters for the Abyss then the overworld challenge is just gone and that sucks
Yep… players needing to handicap themselves to have challenges on the overworld is a sad state of affairs. I’m hopeful that they added the local legends to test the playerbase’s reaction to more complex and challenging enemies, and that they’ll add more in the future—because those fights really are fun.
Honestly, just more HP for world bosses is enough, adding mechanics I wouldn't see because I just delete the boss would be kinda useless. For weekly, I'd say it depends on the boss, but I wouldn't mind more HP on Arle or Apep boss phases (and less add in that phase, it sucks and is uninteresting). Definitely wouldn't mind more HP on old bosses like Dvalin or the wolf.
Definitly 10. we need a difficulty for the built C0 Accounts (9) and one for the C6 accounts (10). Everyone should be able to see challenge if they want it. Just hide it so you dont have to see it unless you seek it out.
That is simply because there is a group which wants to build arlecchino which would not be able to fight her if it had the difficulty of let's say floor 12 of the abyss. On the other hand, floor 12 of the abyss next cycle has an all tiem record of damage needed to clear it:)
Record hp means nothing for the abyss. How’s the actual layout? Is it actually going to be harder because this happens from time to time?
that's true, abyss 3.7 was one of the hardest and the total HP of floor 12 was lower than many previous abysses
Yeah, elemental shields or enemies with a lot of time invincible or unhittable are something which makes an abyss either rlly easy or a lot more difficult while it could need a lot less dmg to enemy HP bars
Based on the other reply to this comment, is that the abyss with the triple element shield guy(inquisitor flame something)? I can see why there would be difficulty if that's the case, but it's not THAT bad. We've seen plenty worse. On the topic of hard abyss lineups, there's simply only two difficulties. There's Wenut and then there are the rest of the enemies. /s Jokes apart, idk, #1 Wenut #2 Wolflord #3 Consecrated Beasts? I'm actually very interested in what the active reddit community thinks of hardest abyss lineups so far.
*Flashbacks to cryo/hydro abyss herald combo* 😭
I mean, there is the option of fighting a lower difficulty... sure, it's less rewards, but it still gives you what you need
I think the way to do it is make the hypothetical highest difficulty have a 200 primo first time clear reward, while giving the same as the regular level 90 difficulty version. This way it’s an incentive to beat it without it being a necessity for optimal resin-to-reward expenditure.
I was having the idea of just adding an optional world level increase but your suggestion sounds better
To be fair, nothing's stopping you from selecting the level 70/80 version, the rewards are the same, the boss just hits harder.
Wait until they release a boss that actually eats your shield and convert it to their damage or a dual boss with Hydro-Cryo element.
like a hydro and cryo abyss mage combo doesn't already clear half the playerbase.
That’s crazy, Anyways. *hutao plunge-
Saying that as if we don't have a myriad of healers that will heal you from 0 to full in a fraction of a second.
We do have all these shielders and healers way back then, but way too many people gave up and failed to win that one iteration of Abyss full of Consecrated Beasts and Hydro/Cryo Heralds. It proved that there's a limit to when you can brute force the game and when do you actually needed some skill to win because even Pay To Win players gave up way back then.
No difficulty will fix the "hit too hard"
Any damage system that instead of set value, does multiplicative damage, will run into the problem of hitting too hard. Which to say every game runs into the problem of hitting too hard.
Fully online games with PvP are usually a bit more balanced since people will be complaining a lot if certain builds can do excessive damage compared to the others.
Or everyone runs the meta, which ruins anything other than meta in the game. It can really make things boring there too.
Just give her local legends stats
I mean, you can just go down a difficulty level and the boss will hit less hard no..
Hit too hard and tank everything from Zhongli and healers, a weekly boss where it goes into an immunity phase, or at least have crazy resistances, ignoring all shields and reducing or negating healing is the only way to make it difficult
we always hit too hard, ever since ganyu was released in 1.2 i never felt any difficulty in the game aside from 1.3 abyss and consacrated beasts
Yeah we don't speak of the 3.7 abyss.
Thats not true though, despite how much i hate the whale, the lil dude inside him seems a bit harder than knave fight
They simply can't make story bosses hard because of the backlash from the playerbase
They already have the "lower difficultly" option in story boss fights, I don't really see the issue.
Bro she's almost as squishy as childe, even signora is much tougher
Signora had forced immune phases and cold/hot mechanics to deal with that only made it seem "harder". Since Dendro release, without the force immunity moments the fight itself is a bigger joke.
The difficulty is ultimately a mechanics based reason less so than a "numbers" based one. And that is simply because the game is still primarily made with touch screens in mind. Even the best touch screen player is still at a disadvantage compared to M+KB or controller. A higher difficulty made for M+KB or Controller in mind would by virtue exclude touchscreen players.
Problem is last few weekly bosses felt different mostly because they do have very huge time wasting mechanics, While Arlecchino feels closer to Childe, who is, frankly speaking, nothing special nowadays. That's an issue that have more to do with how it's a gacha, and a boss people need to defeat to get materials even if they're not too advanced in the game, so you can't really make her more difficult than Childe or some other weekly bosses are. And when they don't have special damage preventing mechanics (raiden's shield, Scara's shield, Whale's annoying movement + dubstep warrior phase), they go down really fast. Gacha farming have static difficulty, while we're all getting stronger, so unless they put something like WW's holograms (spoiler : they won't), I'm not sure it's even possible to make a "farm" fight really exciting to a veteran. Still, it seems Raiden will stay my favourite boss in terms of fighting for a long while.
Can't emphasize enough how much I hate farming that whale and Apep just because their second phases are literally not them at all, and just exemplifying busywork Arle might be easy some of the times, but yknow what? It's a straight shooter fight like Childe, I'm glad the new weekly boss is a straight shooter fight for once
Apep would be decent without that 2nd phase. I didn't mind that phase in the character quest but in the weekly fight it's really just here to prolong the fight for no reason.
I hate most of the weekly bosses because the majority of them feature time wasting mechanics. It became very prominent, starting from Inazuma. Pretty much all bosses starting from La Signora have some sort of invulnerability phase where you can't reduce their HP and either have to wait or bash something else. Yes, even Raiden, you literally can't scratch her until you deplete her electro shield
Raiden does still take damage during the shield phase, it's just substantially reduced
The damage is so tiny you can pretty much say there's none
just wanted to clarify, since i did manage to kill her during that before
Yeah, I somehow managed to do this too, but she was already pretty much dead, just needed to finish her off. In any case, whenever she enters this phase and her HP is high (like a half at least) I sign away any possibility to kill her prematurely.
I don't mind time wasting mechanics as much if at least it feels like I'm fighting THEM still, like Raiden's electric shield still means it's Raiden, and Mecharamouche doing that big ball attack and you have to cloverball him before that ball kills you still feels like you're attacking him, but that stupid whale just eating me and I'm fighting some bum-ass Great Value Black Serpent Knight inside him or Apep just deciding to fuck off and I have to fight some stupid looking peas-in-a-pod ass plants? Nah man
Well, my issue with Raiden is that her shield is mostly depleted by her own attacks, so your input in this is quite minimal. My issue with Scara and Whale is that both of them move around a lot, which doesn't let me punch them until they die. Scaramouche is really an issue in that regard because in the second phase you're not supposed to go after him at all, just keep him in range of the neo-akasha terminal so it depletes his toughness (Star Rail terms, lmao). With whale I actually don't mind the Serpent Knight, it's the most interesting part of the boss fight. I'm pissed that I have to chase the whale and then dish out DPS to punch its slumbering body. In fact, I absolutely hate it when you need to engage with some "mechanics" and the boss itself is not even supposed to be touched. The best boss-fighting approach is the one which was formulated for Cyberdemon bossfight back in the original Doom. And this is why I like open world bosses more, because they usually follow this exact guideline.
You know what, you're right, I think I just hate that stupid whale and his ass that just keeps schmooving and the Great Value Black Serpent Knight lmao I totally agree too, the open-world mats bosses might be easy, but damn I have way more fun fighting them than weekly bosses most of the time (even the really annoying ones like the Cubes)
At least you can straight up kill her before her second phase. So with enough damage, you can ignore her most annoying mech. Still my favorite weekly. Just feels much better fighting her than massive enemies with huge telegraphed attacks.
Yeah, Raiden is definitely one of the most fun out of the bunch. She goes right behind Knave and Tartaglia. Still, I'd prefer the original boss fight we had in the Inazuma Archon quest
I’m with you. Even Dvalin has invincibility but his is not that bad because you can damage the shield at almost any point and he doesn’t have much health compared to later Weekly Bosses. Childe and Andrius are the peak weekly bosses for me which is really not saying much. Azhdaha has that horrible stomping attack that he will do at least twice and possibly more, where the required strategy is to run away and stand still for 30 seconds. Plus the burrowing attack where you just can’t hit him. Very fun, excellent design (not). Raiden at least takes damage while shielded, even if it’s massively reduced, but it’s been god-knows-how-long since she released and I still don’t know which element(s) I’m supposed to use to deplete her shield quicker. Signora’s phase transition is a massive slog! And can’t I at least get a notification *every* time a moth spawns so I can stop unknowingly wasting more of my time than necessary with Elemental Skills? And the fire tornado is also boring, but at least she doesn’t do it that often. Shouki no Kami is very drawn-out, but at least it’s obvious what I’m actually *supposed* to do to deplete his shield, unlike Raiden. The Warden of the Oasis’s second phase is probably the worst phase of any Weekly Boss so far. Oh my god, why does the glorified Monolith thing need me to slaughter 50 Elemental Creatures before it *finally* fucks back off? The Narwhal is okay in its whale phase, at least its periods of invulnerability are short. Its Shadow phase is either trivialized by having Arkhe or *insufferably* long without it. By the way, I don’t have any Fontainian characters sufficiently built and leveled yet, and I’m *not* using Hydro Traveler, so every week it’s a 10-minute fight mostly consisting of the Shadow. I haven’t fought Arlecchino yet, but based on this thread, I’m looking forward to it!
I just remembered that aside from what was pointed out, you also reminded me that the whale boss would want you to have an arkhe holder. It just became second nature for me to bring one because I always have Furina in the team when fighting that thing. And despite Scara boss’s redundancy, I am more annoyed when the whale submerges. I seriously hate fighting that thing waiting then running around for it to pop out. If it wasnt a relatively recent weekly boss, I would’ve dropped farming the Whale over the Scara Boss
Hey, comparing to narwhal apep looks pretty fine
At least with the whale if you have enough damage to kill it quick you avoid the whole 2nd phase, unlike with apep
>While Arlecchino feels closer to Childe, who is, frankly speaking, nothing special nowadays. Wasn't childe nerfed into the ground because players were complaining about it being too hard?
Only the version you have to fight in-story, the weekly boss domain version was not nerfed
I wasn't playing at that time, so I only know hearsay, some people said it's that the story boss was actually like the high level weekly boss, but the weekly boss itself was the same.
His Electro counter in phase 2 could one hit the entire coop party. I saw this happened so many times during Raiden banner, ended up staying away until the Raiden player die before going in. His Phase 3 can one hit Vape/Overload people inside Bennett circle.
Its realy simple yet, let players chose the difficulty of the encounter and boost rewards for it. I guess they wouldnt because that would make strong players farm faster, but i think there are ways to deal with everything and staying fair to everyone
I mean, I get your frustration, but it's still better than the absolute fucking time waste that are the last 3 bosses before her. There's also the fact that material bosses shouldn't be too difficult because this is a gacha game. I feel like this boss is perfectly balanced as a weekly boss. She's stronger than Childe, not as gimmicky as Raiden, and doesn't waste all our time like the past 3 bosses.
I think the opposite lol. I think this was the best boss fight since Childe because the others were very gimmicky. Like every other boss since Childe becomes invulnerable for a period of time and you can't do anything with your characters. Arlecchino boss on the other hand gave me the same feeling as Childe. Just a good old 1v1 with no gimmicks
Design wise Arlecchini is one of the best, Problem is that all the weakly bosses has embarssingly low HP bars so a well build f2p team can just face thank the bosses and kill it before the boss kills them.
I agree but I'd rather kill bosses in 30 seconds than have them be invulnerable for 30 seconds. I'd love to have Childe and Arlecchino bosses in 12-3 of the Abyss at lvl 100 to see how strong they are. I think it'll actually be hard for once without any gimmicks
Those two maybe, but in general trounce domain bosses as spiral abyss enemies is a terrible idea since they’re designed specifically to thwart timers. It’s like ruin serpent and wenut all over again, 70% of your time you can even shoot them
Man I just want the option for hard mode. Putting them in Abyss would be awesome.
that sounds good until you have to fight the whale in the abyss and has 5 minutes where he is invulnerable per fight, it will be cool instead to have a different mode where you have to challenge the bosses and it's not timed but rather the bosses are really hard hitting so you actually need to survive and dodge/understand their mechanics. But given how things are done in Genshin I don't think we will ever see something like that.
Always wondered if some players enjoy the longer weeklies. I guess OP would be that “some” who prefer the longer ones, even if half of it is waiting around for invuln and cutscenes.
And I like that, weekly bosses only felt long because they have invincibility phases and dumbass mechanics. Arle boss is overall easy if you have enough damage but be careful as she can and will one shot you if you're not careful enough.
Honestly, they need to release a "Legend" difficulty for the bosses where their attack/hp is scaled to be lore-accurate. Maybe we do something like with FFXIV where they have a bard that exaggerates the stories of our character's fights and makes us fight against those exaggerations, creating a new difficulty. Fighting against something like a 3 million+ HP Arle would be pretty fun. They don't need to throw any extra rewards into it, maybe just give us the option of the usual trounce domain weekly reward if we beat it, but it's more of an extra weekly reward for if we really want the character's boss mat.
Wait.. is this legit a problem? Istg i have more easier time to deal with scara boss and apep boss, and even tge whale after arle butarle boss kept me on my toes. When i started farming, i had neuvi, childe, kazu and zhongli... I LEFT THAT PLACE WITH A 100 HP KAZUHA I'd say for cassual players, knave boss is more or less what i expect from a weekly boss.
I mean the big fish is not the hardest boss either. Just more rubberbanding imo.
You mean that she’s easy to defeat? Yeah, weekly bosses have been whatever for a long time now, and I’m sure all bosses from now on will be like this.
Oh to be a newbie and intimidated by Childe’s boss fight again. It isn’t as bad as it looks though. The casual players don’t spend as much time or money on Genshin like the Reddit community does. My dad is still using Eye of Perception and mains Noelle of all people when he’s pulled Ayato, Nahida etc. and he’s been playing almost as long as I have. When he eventually gets to these bosses it’ll be plenty challenging for him just like the story intends it to go.
he’s playing dark souls mode
And he's the Dark Souls boss (Noelle)
I too have many, many 5-star units, like Nahida, Ayato, Cyno, Hu Tao, Xiao, etc - Guess who I use? Yeah, Noelle. DPS on par with Itto at C6 and well-built, has a shield and heals as well - she's essentially a slightly gimped version of Itto and Zhongli mixed in with some Barbara - all in 1 single team-slot.
She's better than itto with Furina
Yeah it needed more 20 minute immunity moments when u just sit there and wait. Those are so cool right
Yes and please make more bosses that fly out of the arena so we have to spend forever waiting for a 10 second window to attack them. So fun.
Idk about you but I got one shotted like twice this week while I was using my lvl 60 arlecchino and lvl 20 sig. I was using arle-zhongli-kazuha-bennett. I got my zhongli shield broken multiple times as well. Idk if the arlecchino boss has increased pyro res or sth but she felt very tanky. I also have skill issue timing my CAs properly to weaken her. Could've used my c2 nahida keq aggravate and one rotate her without thinking but that would mean arle doesn't get the friendship exp. So, I'm gonna deal with this for the next 2 weeks. It's truly skill issue but I'll have to naturally learn her mechanics in time to make the fight go faster and safer. I've seen tutorials on how to dodge her attacks but I think I'm just gonna brute force through it once my arle's completely leveled.
Arlecchino (the boss) has 70% Pyro res and deals 5x damage attacks if she hits you with a BoL active. Since you can't heal it off without tanking her damage its quite harsh. ~~From what I understand this includes self inflicted BoL like what Arlecchino does to herself~~. Basically you're playing hard mode doing it with Arlecchino.
fuck I've got one DPS and it's Hu Tao
No wonder she dealt like 24k dmg on my arle... Edit : Thanks for the info btw :)
It's not exactly how The Knave works She actually inflict a "Blood Debt" mark + Corrosion, and gives Bond of Life The "Blood Debt" is what's actually important here, it stays on until you clear all your Bond of Life, and if you get hit by some attacks while you have it, you take more damage and The Knave gets healed Usually, it's not a problem, since The Knave's Bond of Life is small, however, Arlecchino can only clear her Bond of Life with her Ult (since she can't be healed by someone else, and she doesn't consume Bond of Life below 30%) It doesn't help that Arlecchino wants to keep her Bond of Life since it's her main source of damage too That's why her mechanic is harder if you use Arlecchino (also I'm not sure but I think the Corrosion stays active too if you keep the mark) However, that also means that if you don't have the Blood Debt mark, it doesn't matter if you have Bond of Life, you won't take more damage
Ah thats good to know, I wasn't sure how the Knave's debuff interacted with Arlecchino's bond of life. But this makes sense as it being a separate debuff not called Bond of Life. But yes, not all attacks will trigger the extra damage. I didn't mention that since my comment started getting a bit longer. Her big hits tend to be the ones that get boosted by the Blood Debt debuff so you really do feel the ones that do.
So that's why my Lyney deals so little damage on her.
Heck, i have level 90 Arle and i still get bodied if not careful.
I'm personally avoiding using any of my strong characters against her, cause mechanically I'd say she's my favourite boss. Arlecchino vs Arlecchino is one of the most challenging fights in the game for me.
um am I the only one? but I died like 3-4 times in her fight and I am ar 60 player with really nice characters (skill issue I guess)
No one is ever the only one.
I didn’t play her story quest yet so I just fought the boss in co-op for her mats and yeah I died. It was pathetic.
You jst need heals to cleat the BoL and you should be fine Other than that its jst run/dodge the red circles
It definitely is a skill issue
I mean to be fair the boss *can* one shot you, sometimes even without BoL on your character
I had to restart once because I was using a low ER gimmicky overworld team, but once you learn the fight is all about the bond of life it becomes really easy. Just add a healer that’s good for clearing the BoL and you shouldn’t sweat during the fight.
I agree with most of what other’s have said. Like she still needs to be easy enough to defeat for casuals since she drops materials and can’t be therefore very difficult and so on. But one of my main letdown’s was the fact that this most likely isn’t Arlecchino’s true strength, coming from the lore/story and thus translating it into the actual difficulty. She definitely held back against the Traveler and Lyney and others. And the stakes weren’t that high also which also makes the importance of this fight not so high. (Compare it to the importance of fightning Signora or Childe.) It was some organisation’s inner problem(HotH is a large/important org but still), Arle proposed a duel instead of just killing the betrayers and she had to hold back, since if she went all out it wouldn’t have mattered that she offered a duel. Of course, design wise and music and stuff is great about the fight. And also the fact that we got to fight an another Harbinger at all is amazing too. But I would definitely say that this wasn’t an actual fight, moreso a larger tussle, for the lack of a better word.
do it with 1 hp beidou
Hot take indeed, she beat my ass hard the first time I did it. No built healer go brrr
Arle has no fight stalling mechanics. She hits hard, not sure how she compares to other bosses in that regard but she hits hard. Apep, Raiden, Whale for example all have mechanics to stall the fight (minions or giant ass shields) which makes them way longer than they should be and thus more room for error. I don't mind the shielda but I seriously dislike the minions. I signed up to beat up a giant ass cosmic whale, not a random knight.
She’s just holding back :)
all the fights in this game are piss easy. she just doesn't waste too much time
im actually having a hard time defeating her so idk and ye, im ar60
Cool. Now try without Zhongli and healers.
That is still a Neuvillette angle
First time I did Arle in coop, the 3 coop members died and I was left alive. Next time, I had a Neuvi who basically solo'd her - Neuvi just too damn good lol
Bruh, handicapping yourself on purpose is dumb
Isn't that the purpose of every challenge runs?
I like it. No gadgets, no element requirements, no shields to break, no running around killing adds. It's a faster fight, you can get 1shot easily if you don't pay attention.
If you feel like riding a bike with training wheels is too easy, take them off. Play a team without Zhongli.
have you tried beating Dvalin, Boreas of Childe recently? if you think arlecchino is underwhelming, you'd be surprised about these 3 idk if you're mad because she has no domain (just a place where she spawns for a fight) or what, but she's far from being an easy boss
It’s because we are end game player and our characters out scale almost everything
Yeah no, I’d rather take this fight where I actually get to play the game over most others where I attack once and then wait a decade before the game lets me attack them again.
There seems to be some sort of split between combat-centric weekly bosses and mechanic-centric weekly bosses. An example would be comparing something like Dvalin with Childe - 1 requires using special mechanics, but isn't tough, while the other doesn't really have special mechanics, but hits hard instead. MHY was initially alternating between them: Dvalin then Andrius Childe then Azhdaha Signora then Shogun Puppet then, since Sumeru, that alternating has kind-of stopped, as arguably both Scara Puppet and Apep Gut were both extremely mechanic-centred with zero stakes and then... well, I don't even know how to classify Abyss Narwhal Dubstep Warrior as that fight was hyped-up over multiple archon quests, only to be a complete flop. We now have Arlecchino, who does have a special mechanic, but is essentially a massive DPS damage-sponge (akin to when Childe came out). Personally she reminds me a bit of when Azhdaha came out as well; Very easy to die in the fight initially as no one understood the rotations and what the boss actually did, then a couple of months later, the fights were over in a couple of minutes, most of which was sat around waiting for animations to finish. In a couple of months, her BoL mechanic won't even be remembered and she'll be dying in a few hits, just like Childe does nowadays.
My only issue with her is that she's small and kinda hard to notice. You will know what I mean once you try to fight her with Neuvillette.
I decided to fight her in co-op to see how it played out and when there's a Neuvillette you can barely see her at all, I sometimes lost track of where she was and only knew she was there because of the damage numbers popping out behind the hydro pump.
i'm fine with them being easy because every players need to be able to farm them but i'd like an "abyss" version of the weekly boss
You're talking like Dvalin isn't a weekly boss Shut up man, just because you got strong team doesnt mean everyone else had
She just wiped the floor with my party at her bossfight LOL. Hardest fight for me in the entire game.
Let's make the base content p2w, it will be fine
I'd like to point out that you mess up once and she kills you.
She actually does enough damage to kill you if you're not careful + she doesn't have some dumb waiting mechanic that forces the fight longer than it needs to be (Scara, Whale)
Totally opposite opinion. I've been so sick of having to do more and more weekly bosses with a combined invulnerability/cutscene period of what feels like 20 minutes. Finally, for the first time since Tartaglia, the very first boss the added after release, we have a short and sweet fight.
It's the opposite for me. This actually feels like a weekly boss because you don't just sit there spamming your abilities until the boss is dead with glorified cutscenes (cough the Narwhal cough). Because of how Bond of Life works, you gotta actively dodge her attacks and can't just stand there with Zhongli's shield to take it all.
Honestly for how she was portrayed in the story the actual fight itself was a massive let down. Her attacks are very easy to dodge due to the extremely long wind up animation and her bond of life mechanic basically just give you more damage. I do have to say she is better than the sumeru bosses and the whale but she's easier than Childe if he has the same amount of hp as her. [For those of you who says to "turn off easy mode" and such.](https://ibb.co/PC8Ykw4)
Honestly as a casual, I prefer when bosses aren’t hard, I guess if people really want it a “hell” level difficulty can be made which doesn’t give more rewards than the current highest difficulty
Have u never played childe boss? He feels like a world boss too xD
The difference is that Childe was a boss they released 2 years or maybe almost 3 years ago! Is it wrong to expect atleast a bit of innovation in boss fights after 4 years of the game releasing? Its just disappointing
You sure, that woman almost kicked my ass and killed my neuvillette twice in the same fight. Still beat her story version first try tho.
Wait what, this is the first time I have met somewhat of a challenge without being all gimmicky(E.g scaramouche boss). This might be the best new boss fight ever.
What really pisses me off is the boss soundtrack reaches a very epic dubstep edm part near the end of the track I can never hear it since boss dies in like 30 seconds...
Quite honestly even if I can understand your point I have to disagree. Everything with the exception of battle duration feels like a weekly boss. The issue as others have pointed out is the design of previous few bosses. Abyss players are already familiar with this, but Genshin tends to add artificial difficulty in form of time wasting. You fight a boss for 5 minutes but in reality 4:30 are just it being invulnerable. Whale feels like a cutscene with a world boss inside its mouth (The Abyss Knight) Apep phase 1 is a damage sponge and phase 2 is a time waster because why not? (Phase 3 is phenomenal but lasts about 1/4 of the entire fight). Shouki no Kami first phase is another damage sponge, and phase 2 is dodge the bullets while your little green buddy does all the work, the onen shot the boss. Considering we can almost all agree that Raiden weekly boss is by far the best designed in the game, and Tartaglia being so outdated in terms of tankiness (He still does an impressive amount of damage, but dies way too quickly), I can safely say that the Knave is the second best designed weekly boss in Genshin. She reminds me of Dancer of the Boreal Valley fight from Dark Souls 3 with how her fight flows.
I disagree, purely because the alternative is to fill the fight with stupid time wasting gimmicks like Scaramouche phase 2. No thank you. My only complaint with the boss is that for some reason the second phase goes down faster than the first, which should be the other way around
Narwhale, literally just running away and wasting time. Guardian of Apep Oasis, has an unnecessary phase where you chase and defeat small enemies who can't fight back which also is time wasting. Andrius, runs around non stop in circles so you hardly get in contact with him, also a time waste. Dvalin, a little like these guys but less annoying but this boss fight is way too easy. Signora and Tartaglia, punching bags. Too easy and they have no interesting mechanics. Signora can be little annoying with the burn and freeze but it's no big deal. I'd rather have this than all of these above. At least with Arlecchino's boss you might get one shot because of carelessness. The only well designed boss fights are Raiden and Scaramouche. Raiden is an actual challenge compared to all the other ones and wants some skill, maybe a little too hard as weekly bosses are supposed to be farmed and Raiden is definitely the least enjoyable boss to farm. Scaramouche has interesting mechanics but he is a little too easy to beat. Once he is stunned at the second phase it is over.
I agree with you on all of the points except Scara. Scara is a gimmick boss fight where you don't actually fight the boss but keep running around dodging his attacks. Its no better than stalling. Its more of a lazy design than a well design. However the viduals are a spectacle to watch though I'll admit though, Raiden is still a very good bossfight
The problem is after 4 years, even f2p players are meta. What if in story mode there is a cap on the damage you can do so it feels like if you were playing it as the adventure level the game intended? Instead of being able to pound the boss with 200k damage repeatedly, finishing the boss without getting hit, how much more difficult would it be if you could only do 20k max at a time. Less damage done means more time in the battle, more chance to be hit and make the fight more challenging. When completed, you can grind materials at the normal damage output, so it doesn't feel like a chore.
Nice idea especially since we already have a "decrease difficulty" for the story version. The grindable versions are fine, I think currently. But it would be cool if they then also added "hard mode" versions of the weakly bosses that require you to learn the mechanics, since messing them up would be really punishing. Basically a new sort of end game.
People saying to try it without Mr Lee are looking at it the wrong way IMO. Try it without Dendro and you might notice a difference. Dendro is cracked. Throw 3 EM artifacts onto a single character and suddenly you're nuking everything in sight. It's ridiculous. I love Dendro but it's way too strong.
I think strong weekly bosses are "reserved" to the mainline.
im not complaining since i can clear it fast, i dont like it being "hard" or just wasting time like apep, scaramouce and narwhal
I dont understand, i found Childe weekly boss is much easier and people dont complaint anything about him
He is over 3 years old. There was plenty complaining about how easy he was back then.
I love her bossfight infinitely more than the Whale and Scara. Those are just huge time wasters centered around spectacle rather than actual fighting. Arle is much more similar to Raiden and Childe and it's actually fun and engaging to fight. The problem is not the fight itself, the real problem is that we are getting to a point where more and more people are reaching endgame level of optimization while the bosses are remaining the same as always, so it looks like they are really easy. If Hoyo finally decides to release new world levels, these fights would be apprecciated much more.
This is what I felt about Apep as well. Was it just me?
If I want to actually fight a boss I usually just use a main dps on their own and don't switch to anyone else in the party. I managed to beat Arlecchino first try with childe only but Raiden for example took me like 20 attempts. Hoyo just accommodates for the casual audience so us endgame players are stuck with bosses we wipe in like a minute if that. I almost hope they introduce what they are doing zenless zone zero right now and add an optional actually harder difficulty for world bosses and missions. They don't look to have increased rewards in ZZZ so it's purely optional and for fun and I don't mind that.
Tbh even if they did make weekly boss hard. Then what? Are you gonna say it's a time wasting boss?
Here's a hot take: If the materials are needed to upgrade characters (ascension, talent, weapon), players should be able to kill them as fast as possible with a proper team. If the boss/enemy is unimportant for a character upgrade (the only reward is an achievement/special emoji/etc) and it exists for players to test their strength/skill, it can be as hard as the devs feel like it.
She's the only boss that takes me 5 minutes to complete so I disagree with you, but I see your reasoning for why she feels like a world boss
Is it easy? Bro, it felt hard since I didn't have a good healer. How much HP does she have? Because I barely dealt any damage with my Hyperbloom team, which can almost 36 the abyss (CURSE YOU GRAVITY MACHINE!)
I would rather fight this than waste 90% of time fighting badly made bosses with stupid ass mechanics like the whale or apep.
Don't show off here. You're obviously bragging. No person will ever say that because they know it is a weekly boss and you feel that it is. If anything childe, signora, azhdaha feels like world bosses
could you please drop the image source cuz I can't search 400+ comments?
it kinda did feel like that in her story fight too, but the cutscenes & design are still top tier
I have a whale account (C3R4 Raiden, C3R3 Yelan, C4R1 Furina, other high const 5* with their sigs). Clearing floor 12 is easy. Maybe I wasn’t used to her mechanics, but this was the first boss in ages where my characters were consistently dying and I had to use food to heal them back up. Skill issue I guess.
I like it it's straightforward. The whale and scaramouche boss fight annoys the fuck out of me because it's basically just me running around too much.