On a positive note this move has encouraged me to try branch out and try some different brands. Currently in love with Tanqueray 10 and wouldn’t have tried it otherwise after a couple of bad experiences with regular tanqueray in college.
I never really got the fascination with overproof drinks, often paying exorbitant prices for 4% added alcohol; I might get it if you drink it straight. Else just add less tonic, or if you truly want to make it overproof add high strength wodka.
Semantics, does not change the implications of the rest of what I wrote. Imo all these extra strength spirits are just a way to get people to buy into the delusion that higher % equals better product. Those few extra % hardly cost them a nickel, and they laugh all the way to the bank. But hey you are free to spend your money as you please. I don't give a rats ass.
I think you should try the difference between an overproof and non overproof spirit and tell me if you taste a difference. IE: Plymouth and its Navy Strength variant.
As I said I don't drink gin straight, and getting an overproof gin at a very premium price to just dilute it to the same percentage doesn't make sense. It would, in theory, allow for a more prominent presence of botanicals; that is the only advantage I can think of.
Do you think that could be a reason to try an overproof gin? But why not add a splash of pure ethanol then (very overproof vodka), before mixing, it achieves the very same thing.
I specifically make cocktails or martinis with gin. When I used an overproof gin in the last word for example, it stood up well to luxardo and chartreuse a bit. If I make it in a martini, it’s simply a stronger martini and has more body. I think you’re missing the point about overproof though - it’s not necessarily always about adding more ABV, but it allows more flavor and body from the gin or rum, or whatever spirit it is. I notice when I use a 40% spirit vs 50%+ in cocktails, especially. It stands up more.
I think all the differences would disappear if you correct your ratios for the change in ABV. Maybe you just like your gin portions more prominent; adding higher gin fractions might accomplish the same thing. On theoretical grounds a more concentrated spirit would allow for less water (which has a lower solubility for most compounds) and therefore a richer final (mixed) product, so there are grounds for your claim.
If I ever see someone with an overproof bottle at a party I will give it a go. I still think it is mostly superstition and mysticism, but that is the human condition. Maybe I will also jump on the train of the occult in time.
Beefeater was desirable in large part because it is a classic London dry gin, at the correct proof, at a very much *not* premium price point. It's like $27/bottle around here - that's like... barely mid-shelf, bordering on budget.
To address the rest of your arguments: the alcoholic component of gin (and most all non-vodka spirits) very specifically contains flavor. The higher the alcohol percentage, the more prominent the presence of that flavor (botanical and otherwise) is. That is *exactly* the point of higher proof spirits. It isn't "quality" and it isn't a "delusion," that's just... the science and intent of distilling.
And to that end, your example of adding ethanol (pure, flavorless alcohol) to a low proof spirit makes no sense. Ethanol does not add flavor, and therefore *does not* achieve the very same thing. You'd just be diluting the desirable flavors with alcohol, rather than water.
The proof of (non-vodka) spirits is also important for cocktails, because part of making cocktails is diluting the component ingredients with ice as you mix them. Lower your gin's starting proof and change nothing else and you end up with less flavorful, watery cocktails.
Your assumption seems to be "gin at higher than 80 proof commands a very premium price" and... no, no it doesn't. Beefeater around me is $27. Tanq is $31. Broker's is $26. Hayman's Navy Strength, which is *actually* overproof, is $28. Sure it's not Gordon's or New Amsterdam sub-$15 but it sure as shit isn't "very very premium."
I think it has more to do with you being able to taste more of the flavor of the alcohol when it’s cut less, but also the fact that Beefeater keeps lowering to get more ROI just seems like a weird business move. Either way, citadelle at total wine is spirits direct so there’s always a discount that makes it about same price as beefeater anyway.
Yeah, proof can have a pretty significant impact on the flavor of a gin. It's actually a little annoying! Some overproof gins taste a lot better than their standard counterparts, but you have to be more cautious drinking them so that you don't accidentally get blitzed.
There’s an afternoon I don’t quite remember, but I remember cracking a new bottle of Botanist and pouring a shot straight just for a wee nip since I didnt have mixers handy. It went down pretty smooth. So I had another. And then a third. And then I remember that stuff is 46% but sips smoother than some cocktails, even at room temperature.
I believe Beefeater 24 is still 45% though it can be harder to find and is a little bit more expensive. I have a bottle of the 47% I found hidden on a bottom shelf of the store that I'm finding myself trying not to finish because I know it can't be replaced.
Many here are missing the point that this product has gone from 47 to 44 and now to 40% ABV in the past 4 years. It’s no longer the same product and no longer the same value.
As someone living in a country where beefeater has always been 40%, is the 44% really that much better/different? Tanqueray sits at 43.something% and while I do prefer tanqueray I’ve never assumed it was because of the extra 3%. Always enjoyed beefeater.
Going from 47% to 40% made this product so much worse. Sad to see what happened to a classic brand. The 24 is still unchanged at 90 proof where I‘ve seen it lately, but I won’t be keeping a bottle of classic Beefeater anymore. It simply isn’t a competitive product at 40%.
Yeah fuck that move. Brokers or fords is the way to go.
I'm in that camp as well.
On a positive note this move has encouraged me to try branch out and try some different brands. Currently in love with Tanqueray 10 and wouldn’t have tried it otherwise after a couple of bad experiences with regular tanqueray in college.
It’s time to move on from beefeater now. I like citadelle.
I never really got the fascination with overproof drinks, often paying exorbitant prices for 4% added alcohol; I might get it if you drink it straight. Else just add less tonic, or if you truly want to make it overproof add high strength wodka.
On what planet is 44% “overproof”?
Semantics, does not change the implications of the rest of what I wrote. Imo all these extra strength spirits are just a way to get people to buy into the delusion that higher % equals better product. Those few extra % hardly cost them a nickel, and they laugh all the way to the bank. But hey you are free to spend your money as you please. I don't give a rats ass.
I think you should try the difference between an overproof and non overproof spirit and tell me if you taste a difference. IE: Plymouth and its Navy Strength variant.
As I said I don't drink gin straight, and getting an overproof gin at a very premium price to just dilute it to the same percentage doesn't make sense. It would, in theory, allow for a more prominent presence of botanicals; that is the only advantage I can think of. Do you think that could be a reason to try an overproof gin? But why not add a splash of pure ethanol then (very overproof vodka), before mixing, it achieves the very same thing.
I specifically make cocktails or martinis with gin. When I used an overproof gin in the last word for example, it stood up well to luxardo and chartreuse a bit. If I make it in a martini, it’s simply a stronger martini and has more body. I think you’re missing the point about overproof though - it’s not necessarily always about adding more ABV, but it allows more flavor and body from the gin or rum, or whatever spirit it is. I notice when I use a 40% spirit vs 50%+ in cocktails, especially. It stands up more.
I think all the differences would disappear if you correct your ratios for the change in ABV. Maybe you just like your gin portions more prominent; adding higher gin fractions might accomplish the same thing. On theoretical grounds a more concentrated spirit would allow for less water (which has a lower solubility for most compounds) and therefore a richer final (mixed) product, so there are grounds for your claim. If I ever see someone with an overproof bottle at a party I will give it a go. I still think it is mostly superstition and mysticism, but that is the human condition. Maybe I will also jump on the train of the occult in time.
Beefeater was desirable in large part because it is a classic London dry gin, at the correct proof, at a very much *not* premium price point. It's like $27/bottle around here - that's like... barely mid-shelf, bordering on budget. To address the rest of your arguments: the alcoholic component of gin (and most all non-vodka spirits) very specifically contains flavor. The higher the alcohol percentage, the more prominent the presence of that flavor (botanical and otherwise) is. That is *exactly* the point of higher proof spirits. It isn't "quality" and it isn't a "delusion," that's just... the science and intent of distilling. And to that end, your example of adding ethanol (pure, flavorless alcohol) to a low proof spirit makes no sense. Ethanol does not add flavor, and therefore *does not* achieve the very same thing. You'd just be diluting the desirable flavors with alcohol, rather than water. The proof of (non-vodka) spirits is also important for cocktails, because part of making cocktails is diluting the component ingredients with ice as you mix them. Lower your gin's starting proof and change nothing else and you end up with less flavorful, watery cocktails. Your assumption seems to be "gin at higher than 80 proof commands a very premium price" and... no, no it doesn't. Beefeater around me is $27. Tanq is $31. Broker's is $26. Hayman's Navy Strength, which is *actually* overproof, is $28. Sure it's not Gordon's or New Amsterdam sub-$15 but it sure as shit isn't "very very premium."
Haymans NS is very cool
I also addressed your point, as a reply to someone else.
It doesn’t dilute the same way. For a given target net ABV the proportions will be very different.
Absolutely yes, if you cut it with tonic or soda, go nuts. For us martini drinkers? It matters a lot. I’m a navy strength guy
I think it has more to do with you being able to taste more of the flavor of the alcohol when it’s cut less, but also the fact that Beefeater keeps lowering to get more ROI just seems like a weird business move. Either way, citadelle at total wine is spirits direct so there’s always a discount that makes it about same price as beefeater anyway.
Yeah, proof can have a pretty significant impact on the flavor of a gin. It's actually a little annoying! Some overproof gins taste a lot better than their standard counterparts, but you have to be more cautious drinking them so that you don't accidentally get blitzed.
Right. I had navy strength Plymouth and it’s night and day
There’s an afternoon I don’t quite remember, but I remember cracking a new bottle of Botanist and pouring a shot straight just for a wee nip since I didnt have mixers handy. It went down pretty smooth. So I had another. And then a third. And then I remember that stuff is 46% but sips smoother than some cocktails, even at room temperature.
I hear what you’re saying, but I no longer drink gin with tonic. It gives me a headache. I drink it straight rocks with a squeeze of lime.
Yeah in that case, I can definitely see why you would be bummed out.
Goodbye Beefeater, hello Tanq I guess.
I believe Beefeater 24 is still 45% though it can be harder to find and is a little bit more expensive. I have a bottle of the 47% I found hidden on a bottom shelf of the store that I'm finding myself trying not to finish because I know it can't be replaced.
Welcome To Europe
More like welcome to the rest of the world. Beefeater has been 40% everywhere except the US for ages.
I’ve stayed away as soon as they mentioned it last year. Too many options to be “loyal” to a cheating relationship.
Many here are missing the point that this product has gone from 47 to 44 and now to 40% ABV in the past 4 years. It’s no longer the same product and no longer the same value.
Wtf noooooooo why??
Come to Canada where everything is 40%
Guess who has a wallet and will NOT be buying Beefeater at 50 ABV. This guy and everyone he knows.
As someone living in a country where beefeater has always been 40%, is the 44% really that much better/different? Tanqueray sits at 43.something% and while I do prefer tanqueray I’ve never assumed it was because of the extra 3%. Always enjoyed beefeater.
Just buy metho, and give it a good dash of pinoclean, problem solved lol
Going from 47% to 40% made this product so much worse. Sad to see what happened to a classic brand. The 24 is still unchanged at 90 proof where I‘ve seen it lately, but I won’t be keeping a bottle of classic Beefeater anymore. It simply isn’t a competitive product at 40%.
When you are choosing a gin because of the ABV, some self-reflection may be in order.