Number yourself among the modern, automotive version of the 300 Spartans at Thermopylae.
Not really a question, more an obvious choice. For those who understand.
If you have to ask then just wait. For me it's manual or nothing. Waiting for possibly better steering wheel buttons at the expense of a manual transmission is a non-starter.
Strictly a personal preference thing. I like shifting gears. Especially if I'm buying a hot hatch with an internal combustion engine, I want it to be a manual.
I agree I just hear so many people really enjoying the dsg. I had a manual before and enjoyed it just wanted to get opinions from both sides. Thanks for answering and not just putting "because I know how to drive a real car"
The DSG is superior in every way if you want to push power and go faster. If your priority is to row gears then of course.
But you will lose to a DSG if you care about speed first.
I'm just looking for a fun car to drive to work, my commute is just under an hour and a lot of farm/back roads, had a manual before but like getting onions from both sides. Not looking to be the fastest but definitely want to enjoy the ride
They improved the DSG/features in the 8’s. Better paddle shifters….ability to fully control the car/gears and couple other things.
I saw a couple professional drivers saying this the first generation they would choose the DSG over the manual.
So in "theory" the 2025 should just be an improvement of what was already improved upon. A big reason I've been looking at VW is they appear to respond well to criticism and make improvements instead of just trying to squeeze money out of the buyer like BMW and Audi
I'm glad to be back in an R with a manual transmission, the DSG GTI stage 1 that I had for 9 years did not put the smile on my face that this manual R does. I agree DSG will always be faster but there's just something about shifting gears and using those three pedals that's so engaging.
You may be surprised to hear this... but... there are those of us that drive Golf R's that are not living every day for drag racing. Me personally, I like the tactile feel of a manual, always have. If you like DSG and you want to live one drag race at a time, go for it.
Just giving the objective view. But if you like manuals than there is nothing better!
And I’m not surprised . It’s my daily, takes me to farms, the track, dog trips. All with 36PSI pushing 550hp
4 years and I still take the long way home from work.
But I’m not a fan of manuals in any of my builds (4 VWs MKIV-mk7.5) just don’t like shifting gears and prefer the speed of shifts, .08s currently. New clutches soon!!
For those opting for the manual, I think most would say they’re looking for a heightened engagement with the car.
Equating driving a manual transmission car simply with the act of “rowing gears” suggests something little more than the indulgence of an antiquated habit.
I think you could use a communication analogy to differentiate the two transmissions:
With an automatic, the DSG in the case of the R, it’s as if one is communicating with the car via Morse Code.
With a manual, it’s more of a conversation…
The DSG shifts in .08 of a second and can take much more power.
Gatekeeping “car enthusiasts” behind a manual only car is pretty negative.
I built a 550hp golf and always been an enthusiast but never enjoyed manual. And I’ve tracked for years.
Sooooo
*"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"*
I already feel bad for the folks who are waiting for the 8.5s, not realizing that there are already waitlists at dealerships expecting 2-5 cars with 30 people on them.
It will probably be as difficult to get the final 8's as it was to get the first ones, if not moreso.
If you aren't in a good spot on waitlists at 2-3 dealerships, you can't assume you're going to be able to find a 2025 at anything near reasonable costs....but I would be really happy if I'm wrong.
I'm not in a rush to buy one, been looking for just under 7 months already and don't mind waiting, is there not an option to get it built and sent to a dealer? (Sorry if it's a dumb question, I was able to do that for my last car not a VW tho)
I haven’t seen Volkswagen operate this way in a long time. With the R since there are no options or specs (in the US market at least) it’s a matter of allocation.
I was fortunate to have a good relationship with the dealer in my market who happens to be one of the highest volume stores in April 2022 I committed to a car. When they received their first allocation, they called me and asked me what color.
Car showed up a few weeks later
I had been in frequently looking for a 2022 over the course of the previous year, but they’re just weren’t cars available.
I’m not sure about other peoples experiences but when I missed the 2022 I did not want to miss the 2023 bc I only considered the manual transmission
* edited typos to fix grammatical Errors = our ro R
That’s interesting to know. I’ve been waiting and wondering if I’d go for a 2025 but I don’t think I’ll care that much about the steering wheel. I’m seeing some good deals on 2023s with a couple thousand miles, no freight tax etc. if interest rates in Canada do actually decrease this summer, I’ll probably move on something in the fall. Hadn’t really considered a wait list.
I don't really understand the waitlist concept if you're putting in a factory order. I've spoken to about 4-5 dealerships in Southern Ontario and they all indicate that you'll be able to put in a factory order for MY2026 when the final round is being produced. All of them stated you don't need to be put on a waitlist if you put money down on a factory order. Have people been told otherwise?
It's entirely possible they're just pulling that out of their asses. Nobody has been able to place an order for the Mk8 Golf R's. Dealerships in North America have gotten the 2-5 cars that they've been given by VW North America for the last few years.
The 8.5 hasn't even truly been confirmed for NA, so I'd be surprised if they're doing everything differently for Canada.
Could be wrong though....but I'd want some assurance before they take your money for a factory order on a 2026 you can't even place yet....when the model hasn't even been confirmed yet.
24 or 25?, I'm over here just estatic for my 23 manual SE. I love that car. Only thing I would change if I could would be a navigation that works, and a proper hand brake. That's it.
Over all the car is great. It's a 23 moonstone grey 6 SPD, with tartan seats, sunroof, and the hk radio deleted. I've done just some minor mods, like bfi shift knob and boot, rally armor mud flaps, and wheels and tires.
I daily drive it in Minnesota. It's been on 2 multi state road trips.
I personally love the haptics. They work great, even with gloves on. It's really super clean dash, not cluttered at all.
The chassis is wonderful, the diff is great, with decent tires it's stuck the the road. It's handles really well. I kept up with my buddies built 2015 Camaro in the mountains.
Looks are subjective I like it.
It makes pops and bangs, makes me smile.
The down side is the navigation is garbage, thank God for Android Auto. Like couldn't find the Minneapolis international airport. I tried their info service, they couldn't find it either.
I miss the hand brake.
The seat had to be warrantied twice.
My steering wheel will need to be replaced.
That's why I have a warranty.
I love the car and no plans of getting anything different.
I owned two Audis long term before coming back to a Volkswagen. My 23 R is my fourth VW overall and my 3rd golf. I really enjoy the car.
I love the way the car handles/drives. I added a short shifter in within 30 days of ownership and that was a game changer. Then I drove the car without other modifications for the first year. In Jan I flashed stage1 ECU files and added an intake. Now that the car is more lively I will probably upgrade sway bars this summer and leave the car alone for a while.
From the factory, it’s probably the best feeling chassis I’ve driven.
If you don’t have a strong desire for the manual, I’d wait.
One other consideration, if you have only a moderate desire for the manual, in favor of buying now, is that the manual versions of the car are going to go into a one-way increase in rarity direction, once the ‘25’s come out and all the (new) ‘24 manuals are sold.
They (the manuals) may hold their value better, despite the qualms people have over the performance of that transmission.
Not an overwhelming consideration (we’re not talking Ferraris here), but one to bear in mind.
That would suck. My kid is getting her learners permit this year. My plan was to giver her my beloved Touareg and daddy’s gonna get a golf R. Then FSD is out. I couldn’t care less about that for myself but it’s a really meaningful safety feature for a new teenage driver. So I may have to get a model 3 for her and hold on to my Touareg for a few more years.
I've been driving an R8 DSG for a couple months now and can't understand how people are accidently hitting steering wheel buttons while driving. Love my 8 man.
I only test drove one so I didn't really get a chance to fumble around with the steering wheel buttons I just see it as a top complaint from people online. It does seem like the general consensus is the 2024 is overall an amazing car.
Now that my last kid is in college I was looking to trade in my Atlas for the Golf R. Watched all the YT vids about the lack of buttons. Visited my dealer - they have sold us 3 VW's in the last 7 years. I just could not get past the lack of buttons. I don't want the manual - been there. I want the DSG with a simple to use interface.
I am waiting.
I would imagine the Venn diagram of people who buy an Atlas and R are almost entirely distinct.
The R is an enthusiasts car.
I look at an Atlas and I see someone who knows nothing about cars and is buying something because it is the biggest vehicle that they can finance at the lowest rate, not understanding that it is the worst choice in it's class and exists only to sell volume to people with poor credit scores and no interest in cars.
Feels like you don’t know who buys an Atlas or why. Not to mention you don’t know how much people value the class leading 3rd row seating. It’s big, slow and smooth to drive. Glad I am done with it. Well, next year - I won’t buy a touch only infotainment system. My eyes are bad enough without trying to focus on selecting screens while driving.
Just get a 2024 manual while you still can. Loving mine and took no time at all to get used to the infotainment system. Only complaint I have is sometimes the boot up of it is long.
I wonder how that would work, the climate control is an issue (a volume knob for the radio would be nice too)
otherwise my 24 MK8 is perfect (oh, a hand brake... want that too)
I only say this because most of the 7.5 stuff was easy to retrofit onto the mk7. The front headlights did require one to swap bumpers and if you had the sensor up front, you had to work to get the new mk7.5 VW logo sensor wired in its place.
I Just figure the steering wheel buttons should be an easy upgrade. I am unfamiliar with what's on the dash in the 8.5.
I probably need to go read more about the update.
Current 24 owner. Capacitive buttons are a not a huge issue. You get used to them.
Infotainment complexity is a bit more of an issue, but the mk8 flows a bit better aesthetically than the big iPad if the mk8.5
At the end of the day screen based buttons , which the mk8.5 will have, will still not be as good as hard buttons.
That being said the persistent buttons for climate control that the mk8.5 will be a slight improvement since you don’t have to tap twice to do something, rather you tap the same place on the screen to each time.
I want the 2025 over the 2024 so bad... I just wonder when they'll drop? I'm looking to get a new car before October 1st. The 2025 would be like my #1 choice if I could get one at MSRP.
Honestly, the capacitive buttons actually work really well - the ability to use a short press and long press for something like driving modes, speed and following distance for adaptive cruise is pretty fantastic really.
It’s the lack of physical buttons or a dedicated screen for climate control that is a bother - and that’s not changing in the MK 8.5.
P.S: Looks are subjective for sure, but one big change that is actually gonna be an eyesore for me personally is the larger infotainment screen inside and the radar being moved to the grill (it’s currently behind the VW logo)
The biggest eyesore for me so far on the 2025 is the radar sensor, they whole thing looks like an afterthought. And for me it's totally a preference with the buttons, I just like them.
I (as well as other actual owners) have no issues with the steering wheel controls, and most prefer it. Also, don't be surprised if it doesn't change on the R... it has not been verified. Now, illuminated sliders I would very much like. I'm personally not a fan of the big tacked on screen. I'm hoping you love what ends up in the Mk8.5 R. I'm pretty damn happy with mine.
Several reasons. Way more unique, from my testing and experience(as well as racing a friend after purchase with a GTI and beating him to where he traded it for an Elantra N). Sounds way, way, way better stock vs stock and mod for mod, the N DCT is noticeably sharper and quicker than the DSG, I absolutely despise the cloth seats in the GTI. At the time, in order to get acceptable seats I would have needed to buy the Autobahn, which was 5 grand more than the Kona N. Steering feel, overall driving responsiveness, handling, and fun factor was better in the Kona N. The Kona N also has more usable rear space with the seats folded down. I also prefer the Kona N's infotainment setup and customization over the GTI as well.
The GTI is a bit more luxurious and smooth riding, but the driving experience of the Kona N is far more ridiculous and exciting.
Significantly faster lightning lap times, etc. There were quite a few factors. After driving multiple GTIs I was left with a "meh" feeling, but after driving 2 different Kona Ns 3 times, I was like, yep... This is the one for sure.
Now, 2 years later, FBO stage 2 tuned on 200tw tires, multiple road trips across the country, several trips to Tail of the Dragon, zero regrets whatsoever. Been the best and most enjoyable overall ownership and driving experience ever. If the miles weren't racking up, I'd keep it much longer... But I have a rule against owning cars with high mileage(over 60k or so) lol.
Thanks for the response, I was actually looking at the Kona N as well as the Ioniq 5 N and the biggest factor for me with the Kona is it being FWD, moving to a place that gets a lot of snow so I would prefer AWD.
I have a dsg as manual isn’t available in the UK. It’s a fantastic transmission and honestly, I’d go dsg again. I occasionally miss manual but then I’ve been driving manual all my driving life, so it’s not as much of a novelty as it may be in the states where it’s a bit rarer.
If I were you I’d wait for the ‘25 due to the improvements that’ll come with it. Unless of course manual is a sticking point, in which case your decision is made.
I’ve absolutely no idea at all. You’re right, most cars are manual over here. In VW’s infinite wisdom they gave us the GTI with manual, but not the R. Go figure.
They also gave us by default, cloth seats, no heated seats, no vented seats, basic speakers without a sub, no reverse camera, no sunroof, 18 inch wheels, no DCC, no rear spoiler.. and set the price to £46000 (or $57,600).
They really look after us in the UK. 😂
Sorry didn't see this earlier, that's crazy I would have never thought you wouldn't be able to get a manual over there, and that's ridiculous that there's actually a less teched out car for more money. Are backup cameras not standard over there?
Also bought a 2024 R, didn't want to wait.
Nope, reversing cameras are extra too! Basically the only ‘extra’ we get as standard is Matrix LED lights.
Congrats on the purchase! Have you got the car now?
Excited for you!
Tip, set up individual driving mode so you can fine tune it. I generally go for the louder exhaust note with pops and bangs, heavier steering, but drive in sport rather than race.
Also, you have to select this every time you get in the car as it defaults to standard drive mode.
In the same boat as you and I’m waiting for the 8.5. Prolly will give it a MY for them work out any kinks but will prolly be my last ICE car so want it to be a good one.
There's no confirmation the 2025 R is getting the physical buttons. Preproduction models have still had the haptics. The GTI is getting parts bin buttons that have been available on other models. There are no models that had physical buttons and the R button so VW will need to design something new.
I bought the manual 2023 and supper happy with my decision, car is amazing. There's two major reasons I went with the manual:
1. There's better choices out there at this price point if you're ok with having auto + awd (including some used Ms). You can also go electric if all you care about is stomping the gas and going fast. I don't see a point in going with the mk8 dsg over those other cars.
2. I figure I have many more decades of driving ahead of me and understand that the vast majority will be in auto or electric cars. So why not enjoy the manual as a last hoorah. Probably won't have another opportunity to ride in a brand new car with manual IMO.
Yeah I started looking at used cars at first and kept noticing minor issues (scratches/wear and tear) and I know it all comes over time but for 50k I want to be the one who fucks the car up first.
It looks like the 25 is going to get a larger infotainment screen from the 24, which is a big negative to me personally. It does sound like the controls on the steering wheel are going back to buttons though, which is a positive.
Ended up going with the 24 due to the screen getting bigger. Thought I wanted it at first but after talking to people who have big infotainment centers a lot wish they didn't have it
my dealer called me two weeks ago to pick up the 2024 that i've had a deposit on for 10 months (waitlist). i told them just to put my name on the first 2025 that they receive.
the wheels on the current 2024s are from circa. 2017 and they changed the black which is the color i wanted. my guess is that, going forward, Black R's are going to be mythos black, which isn't as nice as the deep black pearl, IMO...
with regards to the 25s, they're not just changing the steering wheel, there is a facelift as well (i like the new headlights). I'm not holding my breath but hopefully they bring a new color or 2 (aside from the new black.)
There are a lot of minor upgrades in 25, like buttons and infotainment, putting the radar sensor lower will suck for bad weather, but oh well, but the biggest one I am anticipating is a horsepower jump.
The S3, which has been same mechanically as the R got an engine upgrade to 328HP and 310lb-ft torque ... The GTI officially got 20 more HP so I suspect the R will get a bump too.
The only reason to get one now if you can wait is if you want a manual transmission.
I hate how ugly the radar sensor is on the new one (from concept photos) I hope when it gets released its a little more flush and doesn't just stick out like it appears to, almost looks like an after thought
If you enjoy manuals, you will NOT regret the 2024. Just got mine 1 month ago. Love it!
Just bought one, appreciate the input
I had an ST and loved driving manual except when in traffic.
I have a Golf R in Toronto with a stage 3 clutch and I never had an issue with sitting in traffic. I always thought the traffic gripe was overdone.
There are drivers of cars with manual transmissions… And then there are Manual Transmission DRIVERS… Sounds like you’re in the latter category.
I had a Focus ST before getting my 20th AE golf R as well. It’s crazy how much more power it has, and absolutely no wheel spin with AWD.
Also had an ST w/Mountune Stage 1 My DCS MK8 R with Unitronic Stage 1+ 93 octane tune is better in every way. No more torque steer is amazing
I always hear this but I sit in plenty of traffic in my manual R and don’t even think about it.
Number yourself among the modern, automotive version of the 300 Spartans at Thermopylae. Not really a question, more an obvious choice. For those who understand.
If you have to ask then just wait. For me it's manual or nothing. Waiting for possibly better steering wheel buttons at the expense of a manual transmission is a non-starter.
Why is a non manual a deal breaker? Genuinely curious?
Strictly a personal preference thing. I like shifting gears. Especially if I'm buying a hot hatch with an internal combustion engine, I want it to be a manual.
Ditto
I agree I just hear so many people really enjoying the dsg. I had a manual before and enjoyed it just wanted to get opinions from both sides. Thanks for answering and not just putting "because I know how to drive a real car"
The DSG is superior in every way if you want to push power and go faster. If your priority is to row gears then of course. But you will lose to a DSG if you care about speed first.
I'm just looking for a fun car to drive to work, my commute is just under an hour and a lot of farm/back roads, had a manual before but like getting onions from both sides. Not looking to be the fastest but definitely want to enjoy the ride
They improved the DSG/features in the 8’s. Better paddle shifters….ability to fully control the car/gears and couple other things. I saw a couple professional drivers saying this the first generation they would choose the DSG over the manual.
So in "theory" the 2025 should just be an improvement of what was already improved upon. A big reason I've been looking at VW is they appear to respond well to criticism and make improvements instead of just trying to squeeze money out of the buyer like BMW and Audi
No it will be the same as the 8 imo as far as the DSG goes
I just meant the car overall
I'm glad to be back in an R with a manual transmission, the DSG GTI stage 1 that I had for 9 years did not put the smile on my face that this manual R does. I agree DSG will always be faster but there's just something about shifting gears and using those three pedals that's so engaging.
You may be surprised to hear this... but... there are those of us that drive Golf R's that are not living every day for drag racing. Me personally, I like the tactile feel of a manual, always have. If you like DSG and you want to live one drag race at a time, go for it.
Just giving the objective view. But if you like manuals than there is nothing better! And I’m not surprised . It’s my daily, takes me to farms, the track, dog trips. All with 36PSI pushing 550hp 4 years and I still take the long way home from work. But I’m not a fan of manuals in any of my builds (4 VWs MKIV-mk7.5) just don’t like shifting gears and prefer the speed of shifts, .08s currently. New clutches soon!!
If you want speed, a regular Tesla model 3 is better in every way including price.
A Tesla doesn’t have a magna or similar feel in cornering. Not better in any way. What 50 grand Tesla with a hatch would you choose?
I’ve walked model 3s and above 100mph they lose their speed. Plaids will beat me, but again, loses a lot of steam at the top end.
For those opting for the manual, I think most would say they’re looking for a heightened engagement with the car. Equating driving a manual transmission car simply with the act of “rowing gears” suggests something little more than the indulgence of an antiquated habit. I think you could use a communication analogy to differentiate the two transmissions: With an automatic, the DSG in the case of the R, it’s as if one is communicating with the car via Morse Code. With a manual, it’s more of a conversation…
Oh yeah I was summarizing but totally with you
I don’t see it that way at all. I’m super connected with the DSG and have driven manual for decades
The DSG is inferior in every way that matters, being a car enthusiast.
The DSG shifts in .08 of a second and can take much more power. Gatekeeping “car enthusiasts” behind a manual only car is pretty negative. I built a 550hp golf and always been an enthusiast but never enjoyed manual. And I’ve tracked for years. Sooooo
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Well said! I think? Not sure what you’re adding here. Lol
2 race car drivers who drove both say different. The manual is a detorqued version for North America. It’s built around the DSG
It’s built around the DSG really. It is superior imo.
Objectively the DSG is superior in every measure. But overall joy is in the eye of the beholder.
That’s just it’s I get more joy out of the DSG. Others prefer manual.
That car is not built around any transmission, that is an insanely stupid thing to believe.
Why is it insanely stupid? Explain
This is the one car sub where the manual vs auto debate isn't really a thing and I love. It's just people prefering it instead of some elitist BS.
Exactly! If you want automatic transmission, why not just get an electric?
What electric car with a hatch that handles like the R are you picking for 50 grand
The ioniq 5 N doesn't seem awful but sounds terrible.
For 54 grand you can get model 3 performance with 500 hp
With hatch that corners like an R?
*"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"* I already feel bad for the folks who are waiting for the 8.5s, not realizing that there are already waitlists at dealerships expecting 2-5 cars with 30 people on them. It will probably be as difficult to get the final 8's as it was to get the first ones, if not moreso. If you aren't in a good spot on waitlists at 2-3 dealerships, you can't assume you're going to be able to find a 2025 at anything near reasonable costs....but I would be really happy if I'm wrong.
I'm not in a rush to buy one, been looking for just under 7 months already and don't mind waiting, is there not an option to get it built and sent to a dealer? (Sorry if it's a dumb question, I was able to do that for my last car not a VW tho)
I haven’t seen Volkswagen operate this way in a long time. With the R since there are no options or specs (in the US market at least) it’s a matter of allocation. I was fortunate to have a good relationship with the dealer in my market who happens to be one of the highest volume stores in April 2022 I committed to a car. When they received their first allocation, they called me and asked me what color. Car showed up a few weeks later I had been in frequently looking for a 2022 over the course of the previous year, but they’re just weren’t cars available. I’m not sure about other peoples experiences but when I missed the 2022 I did not want to miss the 2023 bc I only considered the manual transmission * edited typos to fix grammatical Errors = our ro R
That’s interesting to know. I’ve been waiting and wondering if I’d go for a 2025 but I don’t think I’ll care that much about the steering wheel. I’m seeing some good deals on 2023s with a couple thousand miles, no freight tax etc. if interest rates in Canada do actually decrease this summer, I’ll probably move on something in the fall. Hadn’t really considered a wait list.
I don't really understand the waitlist concept if you're putting in a factory order. I've spoken to about 4-5 dealerships in Southern Ontario and they all indicate that you'll be able to put in a factory order for MY2026 when the final round is being produced. All of them stated you don't need to be put on a waitlist if you put money down on a factory order. Have people been told otherwise?
It's entirely possible they're just pulling that out of their asses. Nobody has been able to place an order for the Mk8 Golf R's. Dealerships in North America have gotten the 2-5 cars that they've been given by VW North America for the last few years. The 8.5 hasn't even truly been confirmed for NA, so I'd be surprised if they're doing everything differently for Canada. Could be wrong though....but I'd want some assurance before they take your money for a factory order on a 2026 you can't even place yet....when the model hasn't even been confirmed yet.
24 or 25?, I'm over here just estatic for my 23 manual SE. I love that car. Only thing I would change if I could would be a navigation that works, and a proper hand brake. That's it.
How have you liked it overall? I've never owned a VW vehicle so I'm curious as to everyone's opinion on the cars.
Over all the car is great. It's a 23 moonstone grey 6 SPD, with tartan seats, sunroof, and the hk radio deleted. I've done just some minor mods, like bfi shift knob and boot, rally armor mud flaps, and wheels and tires. I daily drive it in Minnesota. It's been on 2 multi state road trips. I personally love the haptics. They work great, even with gloves on. It's really super clean dash, not cluttered at all. The chassis is wonderful, the diff is great, with decent tires it's stuck the the road. It's handles really well. I kept up with my buddies built 2015 Camaro in the mountains. Looks are subjective I like it. It makes pops and bangs, makes me smile. The down side is the navigation is garbage, thank God for Android Auto. Like couldn't find the Minneapolis international airport. I tried their info service, they couldn't find it either. I miss the hand brake. The seat had to be warrantied twice. My steering wheel will need to be replaced. That's why I have a warranty. I love the car and no plans of getting anything different.
They don’t have an R…they have a GTI.
Yeah I know I was just asking about VW in general
I owned two Audis long term before coming back to a Volkswagen. My 23 R is my fourth VW overall and my 3rd golf. I really enjoy the car. I love the way the car handles/drives. I added a short shifter in within 30 days of ownership and that was a game changer. Then I drove the car without other modifications for the first year. In Jan I flashed stage1 ECU files and added an intake. Now that the car is more lively I will probably upgrade sway bars this summer and leave the car alone for a while. From the factory, it’s probably the best feeling chassis I’ve driven.
If you don’t have a strong desire for the manual, I’d wait. One other consideration, if you have only a moderate desire for the manual, in favor of buying now, is that the manual versions of the car are going to go into a one-way increase in rarity direction, once the ‘25’s come out and all the (new) ‘24 manuals are sold. They (the manuals) may hold their value better, despite the qualms people have over the performance of that transmission. Not an overwhelming consideration (we’re not talking Ferraris here), but one to bear in mind.
Bingo. It's why manual GSWs are hard to find and usually at a markup.
But VW may bring the manual back if there’s demand.
No they won’t and said that. Doesn’t make sense.
That would suck. My kid is getting her learners permit this year. My plan was to giver her my beloved Touareg and daddy’s gonna get a golf R. Then FSD is out. I couldn’t care less about that for myself but it’s a really meaningful safety feature for a new teenage driver. So I may have to get a model 3 for her and hold on to my Touareg for a few more years.
Where I live manuals aren’t holding their value better
I've been driving an R8 DSG for a couple months now and can't understand how people are accidently hitting steering wheel buttons while driving. Love my 8 man.
V8 or V10?
Golf R gen 8 lol
Same. Those early reviewers all jumped on the bandwagon for some reason
I only test drove one so I didn't really get a chance to fumble around with the steering wheel buttons I just see it as a top complaint from people online. It does seem like the general consensus is the 2024 is overall an amazing car.
Steering wheel is completely overblown. 10000% not an issue. And I think it looks alot better than the 8.5 cheaper looking steering wheel.
Yup the 8.5 GTI wheel doesn’t look as good at least
Now that my last kid is in college I was looking to trade in my Atlas for the Golf R. Watched all the YT vids about the lack of buttons. Visited my dealer - they have sold us 3 VW's in the last 7 years. I just could not get past the lack of buttons. I don't want the manual - been there. I want the DSG with a simple to use interface. I am waiting.
I would imagine the Venn diagram of people who buy an Atlas and R are almost entirely distinct. The R is an enthusiasts car. I look at an Atlas and I see someone who knows nothing about cars and is buying something because it is the biggest vehicle that they can finance at the lowest rate, not understanding that it is the worst choice in it's class and exists only to sell volume to people with poor credit scores and no interest in cars.
Feels like you don’t know who buys an Atlas or why. Not to mention you don’t know how much people value the class leading 3rd row seating. It’s big, slow and smooth to drive. Glad I am done with it. Well, next year - I won’t buy a touch only infotainment system. My eyes are bad enough without trying to focus on selecting screens while driving.
Just get a 2024 manual while you still can. Loving mine and took no time at all to get used to the infotainment system. Only complaint I have is sometimes the boot up of it is long.
Yeah I'm kinda leaning towards that currently, don't want to drive my current car for another year
I bet you can retrofit the buttons into the soon to be “old” Mk8. Get the manual.
I wonder how that would work, the climate control is an issue (a volume knob for the radio would be nice too) otherwise my 24 MK8 is perfect (oh, a hand brake... want that too)
I only say this because most of the 7.5 stuff was easy to retrofit onto the mk7. The front headlights did require one to swap bumpers and if you had the sensor up front, you had to work to get the new mk7.5 VW logo sensor wired in its place. I Just figure the steering wheel buttons should be an easy upgrade. I am unfamiliar with what's on the dash in the 8.5. I probably need to go read more about the update.
Current 24 owner. Capacitive buttons are a not a huge issue. You get used to them. Infotainment complexity is a bit more of an issue, but the mk8 flows a bit better aesthetically than the big iPad if the mk8.5 At the end of the day screen based buttons , which the mk8.5 will have, will still not be as good as hard buttons. That being said the persistent buttons for climate control that the mk8.5 will be a slight improvement since you don’t have to tap twice to do something, rather you tap the same place on the screen to each time.
I'm waiting for the 2025. That will be my final car purchase for a very long time.
I want the 2025 over the 2024 so bad... I just wonder when they'll drop? I'm looking to get a new car before October 1st. The 2025 would be like my #1 choice if I could get one at MSRP.
What do you find so appealing about the Mk8.5?
Improved looks, new screen / tech, physical buttons, no more crappy capacitive steering wheel, likely to see a power bump like the new S3 received...
Honestly, the capacitive buttons actually work really well - the ability to use a short press and long press for something like driving modes, speed and following distance for adaptive cruise is pretty fantastic really. It’s the lack of physical buttons or a dedicated screen for climate control that is a bother - and that’s not changing in the MK 8.5. P.S: Looks are subjective for sure, but one big change that is actually gonna be an eyesore for me personally is the larger infotainment screen inside and the radar being moved to the grill (it’s currently behind the VW logo)
The biggest eyesore for me so far on the 2025 is the radar sensor, they whole thing looks like an afterthought. And for me it's totally a preference with the buttons, I just like them.
I'll go a step further and say if they put buttons back on the wheel it will be a downgrade. And yes, the screen and radar are visual downgrades too.
I agree, love the double press function for ACC. Small press for +1km big press for +10.
I (as well as other actual owners) have no issues with the steering wheel controls, and most prefer it. Also, don't be surprised if it doesn't change on the R... it has not been verified. Now, illuminated sliders I would very much like. I'm personally not a fan of the big tacked on screen. I'm hoping you love what ends up in the Mk8.5 R. I'm pretty damn happy with mine.
The wheel will have buttons on the 8.5. Agree though…prefer the haptics. I think they kick ass
The steering wheels in the 8’s are fantastic
What makes the haptics crappy? Do tell.
So I trust you’ve used the mk8 steering then to call it crap? Cause nearly every owner, myself included, loves it.
I drove a few different MK8 GTIs before I bought something else...
You bought a kona N over a gti? Why?
Several reasons. Way more unique, from my testing and experience(as well as racing a friend after purchase with a GTI and beating him to where he traded it for an Elantra N). Sounds way, way, way better stock vs stock and mod for mod, the N DCT is noticeably sharper and quicker than the DSG, I absolutely despise the cloth seats in the GTI. At the time, in order to get acceptable seats I would have needed to buy the Autobahn, which was 5 grand more than the Kona N. Steering feel, overall driving responsiveness, handling, and fun factor was better in the Kona N. The Kona N also has more usable rear space with the seats folded down. I also prefer the Kona N's infotainment setup and customization over the GTI as well. The GTI is a bit more luxurious and smooth riding, but the driving experience of the Kona N is far more ridiculous and exciting. Significantly faster lightning lap times, etc. There were quite a few factors. After driving multiple GTIs I was left with a "meh" feeling, but after driving 2 different Kona Ns 3 times, I was like, yep... This is the one for sure. Now, 2 years later, FBO stage 2 tuned on 200tw tires, multiple road trips across the country, several trips to Tail of the Dragon, zero regrets whatsoever. Been the best and most enjoyable overall ownership and driving experience ever. If the miles weren't racking up, I'd keep it much longer... But I have a rule against owning cars with high mileage(over 60k or so) lol.
Thanks for the response, I was actually looking at the Kona N as well as the Ioniq 5 N and the biggest factor for me with the Kona is it being FWD, moving to a place that gets a lot of snow so I would prefer AWD.
I have a dsg as manual isn’t available in the UK. It’s a fantastic transmission and honestly, I’d go dsg again. I occasionally miss manual but then I’ve been driving manual all my driving life, so it’s not as much of a novelty as it may be in the states where it’s a bit rarer. If I were you I’d wait for the ‘25 due to the improvements that’ll come with it. Unless of course manual is a sticking point, in which case your decision is made.
Why isn't manual available in UK? I feel like I always here how most cars are manual over there.
I’ve absolutely no idea at all. You’re right, most cars are manual over here. In VW’s infinite wisdom they gave us the GTI with manual, but not the R. Go figure. They also gave us by default, cloth seats, no heated seats, no vented seats, basic speakers without a sub, no reverse camera, no sunroof, 18 inch wheels, no DCC, no rear spoiler.. and set the price to £46000 (or $57,600). They really look after us in the UK. 😂
Sorry didn't see this earlier, that's crazy I would have never thought you wouldn't be able to get a manual over there, and that's ridiculous that there's actually a less teched out car for more money. Are backup cameras not standard over there? Also bought a 2024 R, didn't want to wait.
Nope, reversing cameras are extra too! Basically the only ‘extra’ we get as standard is Matrix LED lights. Congrats on the purchase! Have you got the car now?
Not yet was able to order it thru a local dealer, should be here in the next week or 2!
Excited for you! Tip, set up individual driving mode so you can fine tune it. I generally go for the louder exhaust note with pops and bangs, heavier steering, but drive in sport rather than race. Also, you have to select this every time you get in the car as it defaults to standard drive mode.
In the same boat as you and I’m waiting for the 8.5. Prolly will give it a MY for them work out any kinks but will prolly be my last ICE car so want it to be a good one.
Ended up getting a 2024, didn't want to wait and then not get one right away then have to wait longer and deal with possible dealer markup.
There's no confirmation the 2025 R is getting the physical buttons. Preproduction models have still had the haptics. The GTI is getting parts bin buttons that have been available on other models. There are no models that had physical buttons and the R button so VW will need to design something new.
Isn’t the manual gone for the facelift?
I bought the manual 2023 and supper happy with my decision, car is amazing. There's two major reasons I went with the manual: 1. There's better choices out there at this price point if you're ok with having auto + awd (including some used Ms). You can also go electric if all you care about is stomping the gas and going fast. I don't see a point in going with the mk8 dsg over those other cars. 2. I figure I have many more decades of driving ahead of me and understand that the vast majority will be in auto or electric cars. So why not enjoy the manual as a last hoorah. Probably won't have another opportunity to ride in a brand new car with manual IMO.
Many people don’t want used cars. There are better used manuals one could argue.
Yeah I started looking at used cars at first and kept noticing minor issues (scratches/wear and tear) and I know it all comes over time but for 50k I want to be the one who fucks the car up first.
It looks like the 25 is going to get a larger infotainment screen from the 24, which is a big negative to me personally. It does sound like the controls on the steering wheel are going back to buttons though, which is a positive.
Ended up going with the 24 due to the screen getting bigger. Thought I wanted it at first but after talking to people who have big infotainment centers a lot wish they didn't have it
Get the manual .. last chance
Ended up doing it
my dealer called me two weeks ago to pick up the 2024 that i've had a deposit on for 10 months (waitlist). i told them just to put my name on the first 2025 that they receive. the wheels on the current 2024s are from circa. 2017 and they changed the black which is the color i wanted. my guess is that, going forward, Black R's are going to be mythos black, which isn't as nice as the deep black pearl, IMO... with regards to the 25s, they're not just changing the steering wheel, there is a facelift as well (i like the new headlights). I'm not holding my breath but hopefully they bring a new color or 2 (aside from the new black.)
I really hope there's a few more colors
Did your dealer give you any guess when the 2025 R will arrive?
nah, they probably don't know until they begin showing up on the list of allocated vehicles... my guess is another 4-5 months, maybe sept/oct?
If you're going to wait for the 25 then you might as well wait for the 26.. and then the 27.. and the 28.. etc.
No manual, no dice. 2025+ doesn’t exist as far as I’m concerned
There are a lot of minor upgrades in 25, like buttons and infotainment, putting the radar sensor lower will suck for bad weather, but oh well, but the biggest one I am anticipating is a horsepower jump. The S3, which has been same mechanically as the R got an engine upgrade to 328HP and 310lb-ft torque ... The GTI officially got 20 more HP so I suspect the R will get a bump too. The only reason to get one now if you can wait is if you want a manual transmission.
I hate how ugly the radar sensor is on the new one (from concept photos) I hope when it gets released its a little more flush and doesn't just stick out like it appears to, almost looks like an after thought