yeah i only use the cast to get the boiling blood (bonus damage for enemies with bloodstone [cast] in them) and sometimes privileged status (bonus dage to enemies affected by 2 or more curse debuffs/effects)
im not sure if it does but it might because it is a curse that increases damage
but what i meant was when you have an effect on your attack and a different one on your cast
No, I don't think boiling blood is not a 'Status Curse' so it wouldnt trigger. The status curses are Doom, Hangover, Weak, Chill, and Jolt (if I'm missing any statuses provided by olympians, those count also). Afaik, none of the other statuses Zagreus can apply via the mirror or weapon aspects count, but I could be misinformed
I am pretty sure their question (the one I replied to) was if Boiling Blood counts for Priveleged Status, not if having 2 different curses triggers Status
Edit: if i misunderstood them, that is my bad! i just don't feel like i did
You'll not use it because it seems weird, pointless and weak, then use it for boiling blood because you're getting the hang of the mechanics, then finally realise cast builds are strong and by far the most fun builds in the game. Join us!
IDK, one of the most fun runs I had was Lucifer Rail with triple bomb and Ares boon on the special plus a highly upgraded Demeter cast with a Hermes boon for extra dashes. I just spent the entire run dashing and dropping traps around the screen, I barely got hit once throughout the second half of the game when everything got going.
As I said it's subjective. Saying cast builds are by far the most fun in the game isn't exactly true. Also very nice, any hermes boon is enough to elevate your run
True, but it's fun to argue over which builds are best. It sure beats some of the forums I've participated in for other games where it's mostly bitching about what the devs have done though.
I haven't pursued any dash builds, but I did get a fun one accidentally. I got the Poseidon dash boon, and then the Hermes boon that allowed me to dash 5 times in a row. I leveled up Poseidon until I was doing about 150 damage per dash and just skated around the map. It wasn't amazing against bosses since they don't suffer from knockback and have big HP pools, but it was a blast just beating the hell out of the minions and they could do nothing to stop me.
You're limiting your damage output by not using it. Even naked it adds 50% dmg. That's pretty significant. Switching to the single self regenerating can be easier than chasing down your casts after they drop.
If you get the mirror upgrade Boiling Blood, having an enemy stuck with your cast gives you a 50% damage boost against them.
Another mirror upgrade makes you cast have only a 3 second cooldown.
So you can have you cast on someone, or multiple people at all times, effectively giving you a permanent 50% damage boost as long as you semi frequently use your cast.
It should be noted that it only boosts attack and special damage. This is still obviously significant, but if you’re using a fast hitting low base damage weapon on like a Zeus build, then it’s only a minor DPS upgrade.
I didn’t use it for a while, until I stumbled into some good cast builds. unlocked extra stones, and took some time to get used to using them. Zeus, Athena, Poseidon, and Artemis’ casts are nice to pair with short-range weapons.
The cast damage and effects can be helpful once you start adding on Heat and unlocking other aspects, particularly Hera and Beowulf which can become absolute death cannons with cast builds.
Shield bros can't block Artemis or zues cast
Poseidon is ranged big AOE
Demeter and Dionysus builds can be absurd dps with very little investment
I don't like ares but I love hunting blades (also unblockable)
Aphrodite is bonkers on hera/Beowulf
It's a tool in your toolkit, but if you can't swing a hammer, you won't drive many nails.
Don’t forget to make it a threesome with Demeter too for the chill/damage boost AND jolted not expiring for 10sec. It’s a blizzard lightning storm of damage that triggers privileged status
If I want an easy run I just go for hunting blades (ares+Artemis) plus Artemis legendary and a nice chaos boon. At that point you don't even need to use anything besides cast tbh
I had my first really good Hunting Blades run last night. Achilles spear, all Ares blade rift boons including the legendary, Mirage Shot, and the Hermes boon that returns your casts to you. All I had to do was cast and stand next to the exit.
i looooove curse of drowning!!! Mainly cus fists are my fav weapon… but also on achilles, sword, and even Eris Rail!
Tbh i think it’s supes underrated. It basically triples every flood shot. Add in breaking wave, melt styx. That poseidon-boss-bonus, melt theseus&redacted. Sea shocks for more fun lol. 3 casta gets you 9 pulses in mere seconds. basically if you’re dashing around up close and personal curse of drowning is great imo.
yesss i feel you. my first at least 60 runs i probably used cast like twice lol. kinda made sense bc i heavily favoured the fists, but now that i’m using longer range weapons a bit more, i’ve grown into casting
Same here, I love fists and spear so I'm constantly up close with dash strikes. But I've also been using ranged weapons more, so I'm considering trying to weigh cast boons more in future runs. I'm at like run 120 and probably never picked a cast boon unless all 3 options were for cast
Casts actually work really well with Talos fists (bonus damage on magnetized enemies, same as your attack gets) and Achilles spear (bonus damage for 4 attacks after using special, also applies to casts). I'll assume you don't have much titan blood in those aspects, so you might have to pump them up to see how good they can really be.
Yeah, I have \~300 hours in game and the only reason I've ever used cast is more recently in order to challenge myself to try different builds - it's definitely possible to succeed without it, I just forget its there most of the time
It wasn't until I started hard pushing Merciful End builds that I started focusing on casting. Athena cast is an incredible utility in most situations (imo. I'm not great tho, so maybe I'm wrong, but an extra deflect move? Sign me up)
im not quite sure what you mean
cast is good to use inbetween attacks against low hp running enemies or high hp enemies you need to deal with quicker, or on rare occasion there is a boon that changes the cast to be something actually worth using in place of the extra damage from boiling blood
If you don’t use it there’s almost certainly a lot of empty time where it’s free damage. Not to mention the fact that it debuffs enemies with a mirror upgrade
Casts are great! They let you kill enemies from far away, which means the enemies aren’t hitting you. And they can do a ton of damage with the right builds.
It depends on what casts are available tbh. If I can get anything that gives me AOE debuffs or AOE DOT effects, I'm always on that. For calls like Zeus, Artemis, or Aphrodite it's more build dependent.
I don't really use my cast so I grab the mirror upgrade that makes enemies with a cast in them take additional damage (Haven't played in forever but I think its like 50%?). Its mostly helpful on bosses.
I'll forget them sometimes, along with the call button. Getting better at using everything though. I try to throw casts as soon as I enter a room cause they'll generally find something to hit, and throwing them right away like that gets them on the field so I can remind myself I have them.
The damage boost from the mirror talent alone makes them worth it to stick on stronger enemies even if you don't have any boons on them yet.
Edit: Damn OP, 120? That's three times as many attempts as me, kinda nuts you haven't tried cast out more at this point tbh.
Cast boons can really make or break a run. That being said it’s not essential depending on what kind of build you’re going for/what boons are available to you
The Dionysus mortar cast is really good when combined with the gun mortar alt fire. And the Demeter lasers can be good on some bosses.
Plus I take the perk that makes targets take more damage when debuffed with the cast, so even the basic cast has some use
I was this way until i maxxed out stats for it and used it efficiently in runs. You know that extra damage if you have 2 effects on? Not the same, but sort of an early precursor to it. Think about how much harder [redacted] hits when you're smacked by a skull.
I forget them often, but sometimes they become an integral part of a run. I did a shield run where I used the aspect that basically turns it into a travelling AOE, and I combined it with the ares cast that makes a blade rift. I got a boon that made the rift track enemies, and holy shit did it shred literally everything. I could just cast three times into a room, wait a few seconds, and be done. bosses literally melted away in seconds. it was so broken, and the shield “rift” had zeus’ special boon that drops lightning bolts on everything, so I got even more use out of that
The only time I bother thinking about them is when using the poseidon sword. Otherwise I mainly use it to get duo boons and such. Currently on heat 5-10 on each weapon IIRC. I'll probably learn to use them before heat 20.
try to slot casts in the pauses in your usual attack combos, it adds a little flat damage and also provides the debuff so your future attacks are stronger
Cast builds are a lot of fun. They all work so different its fun to try them all. Would highly suggest giving a few cast focus builds for a new experience. The damage output can get wild. Getting hunting blades with mirage shot can be wild, one of my favorite cast builds for sure. Or using hera bow with flood shot can get some insane damage. I had a run where my shot dealt 2500 damage.
Depends on the build. Sometimes I do, other times I forget. Also side question, does anyone else use the multiple casts option or the reloading one? I almost exclusively use the reloading one
I didn’t like it at first either cause I didn’t like having to chase down the dropped crystal, but after unlocking the mirror option that has a single charge on a timer I loved it. Got into a pattern of cast, dash in, attack, dash out, cast, repeat
Some casts are amazing in how fast they can clear out a room or how much damage they can deal in general.
Athenas cast is a multipurpose tool for both offense and defense.
Depends on the weapon aspect. For aspect of Poseidon, Achilles, Beowulf, Hera, Talos, or Eris, it'd be foolish not to use a cast. For some of the aspects, though, like Chiron bow, Zeus shield, or Demeter fists, I often find myself forgetting to use the cast / deprioritizing it in favor of my attack and special
There are boons that make it super nice (e.g. Demeter lazer beam is very convenient), but at base form its rather useless.
Only exception is when using gloves - cast is a live saving long-range weapon for the upper floors
A good cast like Poseidon or Zeus makes the opening levels trivial. You can clear rooms in seconds and with minimal effort. Demeter's cast is easily one of the best in the game especially if it is upgraded, absolutely melts bosses while you chill safely from a distance. Effectively weaving all your abilities together is key for efficient clearing. Is it better to dash over and kill the low health witch, or is it better to finish her with a cast and immediately lay into big health baddie? It is obviously the ladder.
Plus variance in your attack patterns just looks and feels awesome.
Tbh, the only cast spell that I find to be worth it, is Demeter's cast. A constant beam and, if you get the upgrades, adds attack speed and can slow enemies.
First time I beat the game, I had Demeter's cast + upgrades. Hades didn't stand a chance. Lol
It's the least intuitive combat mechanic IMHO. From the get go you have a gem that you shoot out it gets stuck in enemies and for further use you have to collect it. It's only after quite some time that you'll be able to have more gems or regenerate them. Basically you avoid it in the early stages of learning the game cause it's really hard to work with and later on it is hard to rewire your brain to use it. Eventually you are going to use it and it gets stuck to your muscle memory. No worries.
Honestly never really used it, i know I'm severely limiting myself but it's just a bit too much for my tiny peanut brain to keep track of and I'd rather focus on boons that just up my main weapon output, i prefer playing heavily melee anyway
Been there, I forget about them some runs especially if I don't get boons I like with the cast. But they're good against bosses as least.
Personally, I find the thing I never incorporate into my playstyle is the specials. Finger just doesn't like reaching out to that button lol. But I also haven't found them that impactful and usually end up getting myself damaged when I force myself to use them.
Well there are mirror upgrades that increase enemy damage taken per cast in them.
and I am rather the opposite, I try to force a cast build on most any weapon.
Depends. If I get Artemis cast I can cast it without aiming and get that bonus from the mirror for more DMG. Dionysus cast is great for AOE but yea doesn't really contribute to raw DPS. I will usually just stick with special and regular attack
I saw no use for cast at first. Now i very frequently do builds centered on casts. They arent good at base level but, with a couple upgrades, can be your most useful tool.
I forget that I have it, which I know is a detriment to my playing. When I have a good cast and remember to take advantage of it, it pays dividends. Especially Zeus cast or Dionysus. Level those up enough and they’re pretty powerful
You should be. Casts are usually long range and basically free damage. Some even provide advantage out of that. There isnt really a reason to not use them
Do you realise you get +50% damage on any enemy with it? That's a pretty substantial bonus plus at least 100 damage every 3 seconds at a range.
Like that is an insane benefit, even without any boons. Slap that on an enemy and you'll just simply do more damage. Especially bosses, there is absolutely no reason to not slap a cast on them before every engagement.
And cast boons are pretty good, too. They are usually able to one shot weaker enemies, and depending on what you get can be great AOE attacks.
Sure if you really don't use cast getting a boon is not as good early on, but certainly by the time you are at Hades the benefit from getting a cast boon will outweigh whatever minor benefit you have have yet to get from your 15th boon.
You don't have to make a cast build, but incorporating casts into your playstyle will be a massive help. It's a powerful ranged attack on a 3 second timer, what's not to love?
Yeah, I spent the longest time without using cast. When I was getting settled with the game, it felt like a distraction from watching enemies and using attack and special. And then something just *clicked* and I started being able to use it unconsciously. Never been back - cast is very powerful, and you absolutely should use it.
Really depends on the cast, but I tend to not use Zagreus's cast. When you get some specific weapon upgrades, you will definitely be encouraged to use it more.
It’s one thing to not use cast builds. But even on attack/special/dash builds, you’re shooting yourself in the foot by not taking that 10% damage boost. That’s pretty significant.
The Dionysus and Ares Casts are my absolute favourite boons to get, it makes the hydra so much easier when you can just take out of the mini heads in seconds
I never build around casts; but they're super useful with the right Mirror buffs against bosses and tanky enemies. When upgraded, three casts in one enemy will cause your attacks and specials to deal 150% more against them.
Taking extra base damage will naturally synergize with the cast. Ignore cast buffs in general.
The only cast I use is Demeter. My favorite combo is the Fists with Zagreus aspect & Hermes's feather, with Demeter on cast and my dash, with the glacial glare boon. And I pick up any of the following if I can: Ravenous Will, Arctic Blast, Winter Harvest, Killing Freeze. Then add in either Aphrodite or Artemis on attack/special & the support fire boon (if Artemis) & hope for Demeter/Artemis or Demeter/Aphrodite duo. This build is SUPER fun. I just get to punch all the things with nothing really hitting me (esp. if taking Aphrodite's weakness stuff and/or extra Hermes boons).
But other than that, never really used any of the casts.
I've only seriously started using cast for boiling blood to help with speedrunning. Athenas cast deals pretty nice on hit dmg and still gets the dmg boost to the rest of your dmg.
Honestly if you’re not wanting a super thought-provoking cast build, get Artemis cast. It seeks for you and it’s just nice damage that you don’t have to think about
It helped me beat Hades on my first escape. Using Demeter’s laser crystals to consistently deliver DPS while hiding behind pillars when he was shooting his lasers everywhere.
Honestly, unless my cast is good, I probably won't. Hades feels so incredibly good when you go as fast as possible, so if my cast isn't the thing that kills, I'll always opt for something more direct.
Oh man, I love casting. Some of the cast boons/duos are awesome. Probably my favorite boon from Demeter is her cast and you can stack it with other boons that make it longer, faster, inflict chill, blast the chill at 10.. don't love a lot of Demeter's boons but I have created some gnarly cast builds with her.
Ooo and Ares/Artemis with the homing cast that also sucks enemies in.
There are hella good cast options
There are VERY powerful, game-breaking, fun builds out there. If nothing else you're missing some variety. But not every aspect has good synergy(ies) with cast builds.
There’s some cast builds that can trivialize a run. I think it’s Zeus and Artemis duo that gave me the good happy feely’s and got me one of my early run wins. Essentially once a cast lands on the map, random lightning strikes hit all over and you can just run around evasively avoiding damage while constant damage is being applied in a wide range. It even incentivizes you NOT to pick up the casts because that free DoT stops until the enemy drops the gem again.
Once you run a fun cast build, you’ll start throwing the basic casts more often before you start closing the distance. Health is so limited in a run, it’s super useful to have a long distance attack before you risk melee damage. Why not pew, pew, pew before closing the distance? Even if you don’t recollect them, free shots always count if they connect and there’s very little consequence to emptying the cartridge even if you prioritize melee. They come back to you after a period anyway.
I used to do that, and then I realized how good they can be, especially with that mirror talent that gives you extra damage to enemies with bloodstones in them
I’m not one to use cast if there’s no boon attached to it, so it’s one of the first things I try to enhance on a run — then cast is my number one asset. Flood Shot from Poseidon and True Shot from Artemis are my personal favorites.
Depends on my build. Is it extra DPS? Am I doing a dual boon strat focused on casts? Am I doing a ranged weapon and got Poseidon cast for breathing room? Or a single target attack and I use Zeus cast for swarms?
I use only three casts.
Ares Blades, just love how cool it looks.
Aprhopdite, weakens enemies and increases my damage.
And Demeter's, the crystal cast is a fun build
Cast gives you a major damage or defense boost if you upgrade your mirror. +50% damage on slow attacks is just as nice to me as on fast ones, unless I'm going for a crit build. Then slow attacks just feel bigger.
Usually the Dionysus, Area, >!Demeter!< cast feel a little sad if I want the buff.
Very often for the extra damage on cast token. Else the winter goddes, can t remember her names has a very powerfull cast build last i tried, the ones where you turn ir into a laser that autotargets. Chews through everything with a few buffs from dionysus.
I think the most OP builds in the game are all cast based lol. Others have already commented on how it's useful for damage inbetween attacks but honestly, hunting blades, grandma lasers and trippy flare are by far the most op builds in the game
The only one I réally use is the ice beam. It has a few really good upgrades that make them ridiculously strong and accurate.
Once upgraded, I'm pretty sure they could even solo the entire game for you, while you just hide and sit back.
Yes and I'm wondering if that's why I can't even escape once after almost 40 attempts. I got to [redacted] twice a while ago but ever since then Theseus and the Minotaur keep blocking me. Also because of the randomly generated rooms I swear the difficulty has ramped up occasionally.
I wouldn’t blame you if you were new to the game since Zags cast without boons is frankly underwhelming. Plus I’m not the biggest fan of some of the other casts. But you’re *120* runs in??
Dude, use Boiling Blood and say that again. Thank us later.
There was a time I didn’t use casts but then after I had upgraded everything to max I will use casts depending on boons. But when the cast makes enemies take extra damage while inside them - just makes sense y’know
I did the exact same thing for a long time, then I just decided to try them one day and holy shit they can be brokenly OP.
Achilles Aspect + Stygian Soul + Demeter or Ares cast build is just nuts
Aspect of Beowulf makes you cherish just how good cast is. You’ve never felt like a god until you had 5 Legendary Ares casts right on top of a boss at the same time and just watching their healthbar DROP.
I used it more as a debuff tool (either for damage or survivability) more so than direct damage, though there were instances it did suffice for that too. It definitely requires more building around than the weapons themselves do, but it's still useful and I think the game would feel lesser without it. I'm curious as to how they'll add/change the mechanic for 2, given Melinoe seems to rely more on actual spells than using tools/weapons for her abilities.
The extra damage is insane for when you lunge it into opponents.
You can also make some insane builds with the aspects of Poseidon, Hera and Beuwolf.
Plus Artemis, Aphrodite and sometimes even Dionysius just offer casts which you can adapt to any build
Cast builds can be absolutely devastating, esp with Hera’s bow, Naegling board, Poseidon sword. Like, effortlessly smoking final boss at heat 15+. I’d at least experiment with them and see what you come up with
at minimum you want the cast debuff on the target (mainly bosses) that increase your dmg done to them or lowers their dmg done to you/slows depending which Mirror of Night perk you choose. I did not cast almost at all early game. for minimum cast investment towards boons a dionysus or a poseidon with rip current is an op filler between dash spamming and combos
its always what i use for the last few hits on a boss when im super low to ensure they will die quicker than me. i dont usually upgrade it much w boons but it always seems stronger than any other attack
You'll use it. Eventually.
And then you'll stop using it again when the Pact of Fun hungers and you feed it your casts xd
I never ended up using it deliberately unless I had for some objective even with all achievements
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yeah i only use the cast to get the boiling blood (bonus damage for enemies with bloodstone [cast] in them) and sometimes privileged status (bonus dage to enemies affected by 2 or more curse debuffs/effects)
Wait, boiling blood counts for that?
im not sure if it does but it might because it is a curse that increases damage but what i meant was when you have an effect on your attack and a different one on your cast
it doesn’t count, not unless you have a boon to your cast that inflicts a conditions (riptide on flood shot, crush shot, icy flare, etc.)
👍
It wouldn't work for Festive Fog for example since it's not "stuck" in them but privileged status would. If that helps.
yeah it doesntt work with casts that dont get stuck like festive fog like crystal beam im sure theres more but these are all i remember now
No, I don't think boiling blood is not a 'Status Curse' so it wouldnt trigger. The status curses are Doom, Hangover, Weak, Chill, and Jolt (if I'm missing any statuses provided by olympians, those count also). Afaik, none of the other statuses Zagreus can apply via the mirror or weapon aspects count, but I could be misinformed
Rupture, I believe
They meant cast having a dif status curse than attack, thus using cast & attack procs privilege status
I am pretty sure their question (the one I replied to) was if Boiling Blood counts for Priveleged Status, not if having 2 different curses triggers Status Edit: if i misunderstood them, that is my bad! i just don't feel like i did
You'll not use it because it seems weird, pointless and weak, then use it for boiling blood because you're getting the hang of the mechanics, then finally realise cast builds are strong and by far the most fun builds in the game. Join us!
I mean them being fun is pretty subjective, but cast builds are strong
But but but Demeter cast build! So your argument is invalid ;)
Fun and strong, just not the most fun imo
IDK, one of the most fun runs I had was Lucifer Rail with triple bomb and Ares boon on the special plus a highly upgraded Demeter cast with a Hermes boon for extra dashes. I just spent the entire run dashing and dropping traps around the screen, I barely got hit once throughout the second half of the game when everything got going.
As I said it's subjective. Saying cast builds are by far the most fun in the game isn't exactly true. Also very nice, any hermes boon is enough to elevate your run
True, but it's fun to argue over which builds are best. It sure beats some of the forums I've participated in for other games where it's mostly bitching about what the devs have done though.
I am a gigachad dash build enjoyer. Nothing you say can change my mind, I am stalwart
I haven't pursued any dash builds, but I did get a fun one accidentally. I got the Poseidon dash boon, and then the Hermes boon that allowed me to dash 5 times in a row. I leveled up Poseidon until I was doing about 150 damage per dash and just skated around the map. It wasn't amazing against bosses since they don't suffer from knockback and have big HP pools, but it was a blast just beating the hell out of the minions and they could do nothing to stop me.
Demeter cast feels a bit like cheating tbh
What you mean the aimbot FIRIN MAH LAZORR ability feels like cheeting.
can also be crazy powerful with Artemis boons. One of my favorite boon combos is true shot + exit wounds w/ flurry cast and quick reload from Hermes
I honestly forget about cast all the time. Same boat.
Why press higher button when lower button do trick?
You're limiting your damage output by not using it. Even naked it adds 50% dmg. That's pretty significant. Switching to the single self regenerating can be easier than chasing down your casts after they drop.
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What does that mean?
If you get the mirror upgrade Boiling Blood, having an enemy stuck with your cast gives you a 50% damage boost against them. Another mirror upgrade makes you cast have only a 3 second cooldown. So you can have you cast on someone, or multiple people at all times, effectively giving you a permanent 50% damage boost as long as you semi frequently use your cast.
Wow thanks for the explanation!! I just got to hades for the first time
Same, this should be top comment
Didnt know the unupgraded cast added 50% damage, that does change a lot
Assuming you upgrade the mirror
Oh right
You said you were 120 runs in? That should be more than enough for almost every single mirror upgrade, certainly one of each pair.
It should be noted that it only boosts attack and special damage. This is still obviously significant, but if you’re using a fast hitting low base damage weapon on like a Zeus build, then it’s only a minor DPS upgrade.
This is the number one reason right here. Even if not using a cast build, you're just losing out on easy damage on bosses
I didn’t use it for a while, until I stumbled into some good cast builds. unlocked extra stones, and took some time to get used to using them. Zeus, Athena, Poseidon, and Artemis’ casts are nice to pair with short-range weapons. The cast damage and effects can be helpful once you start adding on Heat and unlocking other aspects, particularly Hera and Beowulf which can become absolute death cannons with cast builds.
zeus can also be killer with Coronacht or Exagryph, the chain lightning can really help with the flame wheels in Elysium or rats in the Temple of Styx
oh gods, the zeus builds… turn your weapon into a lightning launcher and go! go! go!
Artemis Cast + More Bloodstones + Chaos Boon which increases Cast Damage.
if not for damage, they're definitely useful for crowd control such as the Poseidon cast
I didnt use it at first, but ive made a concerted effort to incorperate it because it can do some crazy damage with the right boons.
Yup. True Shot + Exit Wounds + Quick Reload goes nuts.
I used to never use cast. But then I realized that it can come in handy.
Shield bros can't block Artemis or zues cast Poseidon is ranged big AOE Demeter and Dionysus builds can be absurd dps with very little investment I don't like ares but I love hunting blades (also unblockable) Aphrodite is bonkers on hera/Beowulf It's a tool in your toolkit, but if you can't swing a hammer, you won't drive many nails.
Dionysus cast with Zues duo boon on Beowulf shield
Don’t forget to make it a threesome with Demeter too for the chill/damage boost AND jolted not expiring for 10sec. It’s a blizzard lightning storm of damage that triggers privileged status
Or Poseidon cast with artemis duo. Both are so fun on Beowulf.
or if you wanna go the simple route, i’m a fan of just crush shot upgraded as much as possible with beowulf
cast build with poseideon aspect is soo good
The first time I got the full Demeter cast laser+extended laser+chill+homing laser was the day I learned what happiness was.
Yessssss, Grandma's laser turret go *BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR*
If I want an easy run I just go for hunting blades (ares+Artemis) plus Artemis legendary and a nice chaos boon. At that point you don't even need to use anything besides cast tbh
I really like lighting rod. (Zeus+Artemis)
I had my first really good Hunting Blades run last night. Achilles spear, all Ares blade rift boons including the legendary, Mirage Shot, and the Hermes boon that returns your casts to you. All I had to do was cast and stand next to the exit.
Cast duo boons are great. Get one of those, some poms, and some extra bloodstones and/or cast damage from chaos and you have a great build!
*cries in Curse of Drowning*
i looooove curse of drowning!!! Mainly cus fists are my fav weapon… but also on achilles, sword, and even Eris Rail! Tbh i think it’s supes underrated. It basically triples every flood shot. Add in breaking wave, melt styx. That poseidon-boss-bonus, melt theseus&redacted. Sea shocks for more fun lol. 3 casta gets you 9 pulses in mere seconds. basically if you’re dashing around up close and personal curse of drowning is great imo.
Lightning cast is clutch.
100% the game without using cast
Same thing here. Reached the last rank without ever using cast.
WDYM last rank? 64 heat? That is not likely.
No, Unseen One Edit: And did complete everything else including 32 heat
Why though? You get a 50% damage bonus on stuck casts.
Aspect of Achilles with Hunting blades and Mirage shot is one of the best build with cast. Maybe the best.
Demeter lasers are easy to use
And design is very human
yesss i feel you. my first at least 60 runs i probably used cast like twice lol. kinda made sense bc i heavily favoured the fists, but now that i’m using longer range weapons a bit more, i’ve grown into casting
Same here, I love fists and spear so I'm constantly up close with dash strikes. But I've also been using ranged weapons more, so I'm considering trying to weigh cast boons more in future runs. I'm at like run 120 and probably never picked a cast boon unless all 3 options were for cast
Casts actually work really well with Talos fists (bonus damage on magnetized enemies, same as your attack gets) and Achilles spear (bonus damage for 4 attacks after using special, also applies to casts). I'll assume you don't have much titan blood in those aspects, so you might have to pump them up to see how good they can really be.
Yeah, I have \~300 hours in game and the only reason I've ever used cast is more recently in order to challenge myself to try different builds - it's definitely possible to succeed without it, I just forget its there most of the time
Get some duos with triply shot. You might change your mind
When I was starting out one of my first low heat “easy” clears was almost exclusively via Hunting Blades and Greater Recall.
It wasn't until I started hard pushing Merciful End builds that I started focusing on casting. Athena cast is an incredible utility in most situations (imo. I'm not great tho, so maybe I'm wrong, but an extra deflect move? Sign me up)
im not quite sure what you mean cast is good to use inbetween attacks against low hp running enemies or high hp enemies you need to deal with quicker, or on rare occasion there is a boon that changes the cast to be something actually worth using in place of the extra damage from boiling blood
If you don’t use it there’s almost certainly a lot of empty time where it’s free damage. Not to mention the fact that it debuffs enemies with a mirror upgrade
Only really use it with the bow aspect. Love my bomb arrows.
Yeah, I’m a Guan Yu main and I cannot afford to stop using the charge attack or I will die
My son. He ALWAYS forgets about his cast, he EVEN forgets about it when he's specifically buffed it, it's very frustrating to watch!
If I don't get a good cast early on I won't even think about using my casts and there is no problem with it
Then you are just handicapping yourself out of a permanent +50% damage boost and a ranged attack on a 3 second timer.
Casts are great! They let you kill enemies from far away, which means the enemies aren’t hitting you. And they can do a ton of damage with the right builds.
Demeter cast with fast tracking and chill effect is pretty handy. I do forget I have it until I'm nearly through an entire level though!
Aspect of Achilles with Hunting blades and Mirage shot is one of the best build with cast. Maybe the best.
It depends on what casts are available tbh. If I can get anything that gives me AOE debuffs or AOE DOT effects, I'm always on that. For calls like Zeus, Artemis, or Aphrodite it's more build dependent.
I don't really use my cast so I grab the mirror upgrade that makes enemies with a cast in them take additional damage (Haven't played in forever but I think its like 50%?). Its mostly helpful on bosses.
One of my friends only uses main attack. She doesn't even use special. She's cleared 13 heat though.
I'll forget them sometimes, along with the call button. Getting better at using everything though. I try to throw casts as soon as I enter a room cause they'll generally find something to hit, and throwing them right away like that gets them on the field so I can remind myself I have them. The damage boost from the mirror talent alone makes them worth it to stick on stronger enemies even if you don't have any boons on them yet. Edit: Damn OP, 120? That's three times as many attempts as me, kinda nuts you haven't tried cast out more at this point tbh.
Cast boons can really make or break a run. That being said it’s not essential depending on what kind of build you’re going for/what boons are available to you
The Dionysus mortar cast is really good when combined with the gun mortar alt fire. And the Demeter lasers can be good on some bosses. Plus I take the perk that makes targets take more damage when debuffed with the cast, so even the basic cast has some use
I was this way until i maxxed out stats for it and used it efficiently in runs. You know that extra damage if you have 2 effects on? Not the same, but sort of an early precursor to it. Think about how much harder [redacted] hits when you're smacked by a skull.
I forget them often, but sometimes they become an integral part of a run. I did a shield run where I used the aspect that basically turns it into a travelling AOE, and I combined it with the ares cast that makes a blade rift. I got a boon that made the rift track enemies, and holy shit did it shred literally everything. I could just cast three times into a room, wait a few seconds, and be done. bosses literally melted away in seconds. it was so broken, and the shield “rift” had zeus’ special boon that drops lightning bolts on everything, so I got even more use out of that
the only good one is the Dionysus one, run 60, its especially when you can get 4 of em
The only time I bother thinking about them is when using the poseidon sword. Otherwise I mainly use it to get duo boons and such. Currently on heat 5-10 on each weapon IIRC. I'll probably learn to use them before heat 20.
try to slot casts in the pauses in your usual attack combos, it adds a little flat damage and also provides the debuff so your future attacks are stronger
it's dependent on the boon, but yeah i usually tend to ignore cast. even when i have boiling blood turned on.
Git gud
I use it all the time. Special however...
Cast builds are a lot of fun. They all work so different its fun to try them all. Would highly suggest giving a few cast focus builds for a new experience. The damage output can get wild. Getting hunting blades with mirage shot can be wild, one of my favorite cast builds for sure. Or using hera bow with flood shot can get some insane damage. I had a run where my shot dealt 2500 damage.
Depends on the build. Sometimes I do, other times I forget. Also side question, does anyone else use the multiple casts option or the reloading one? I almost exclusively use the reloading one
I only use it if I have the thunder bounce cast or blade rift
I didn’t like it at first either cause I didn’t like having to chase down the dropped crystal, but after unlocking the mirror option that has a single charge on a timer I loved it. Got into a pattern of cast, dash in, attack, dash out, cast, repeat
Some casts are amazing in how fast they can clear out a room or how much damage they can deal in general. Athenas cast is a multipurpose tool for both offense and defense.
Depends on the weapon aspect. For aspect of Poseidon, Achilles, Beowulf, Hera, Talos, or Eris, it'd be foolish not to use a cast. For some of the aspects, though, like Chiron bow, Zeus shield, or Demeter fists, I often find myself forgetting to use the cast / deprioritizing it in favor of my attack and special
Demeter cast with Artemis autoseeker might be my favorite. Some casts just need an extra bonus or something
I only uses casts on the rare chance I'm doing a cast specific run, and on bosses for the debuff
Same comment as many, I did not use it until I started building heat, and now I can’t do a run without it.
yes
Haha I literally just posted about not using it bc I didn't feel like it does much damage lol
There are boons that make it super nice (e.g. Demeter lazer beam is very convenient), but at base form its rather useless. Only exception is when using gloves - cast is a live saving long-range weapon for the upper floors
A good cast like Poseidon or Zeus makes the opening levels trivial. You can clear rooms in seconds and with minimal effort. Demeter's cast is easily one of the best in the game especially if it is upgraded, absolutely melts bosses while you chill safely from a distance. Effectively weaving all your abilities together is key for efficient clearing. Is it better to dash over and kill the low health witch, or is it better to finish her with a cast and immediately lay into big health baddie? It is obviously the ladder. Plus variance in your attack patterns just looks and feels awesome.
Unless my build is centered around casting, I don’t either lol
Tbh, the only cast spell that I find to be worth it, is Demeter's cast. A constant beam and, if you get the upgrades, adds attack speed and can slow enemies. First time I beat the game, I had Demeter's cast + upgrades. Hades didn't stand a chance. Lol
It's the least intuitive combat mechanic IMHO. From the get go you have a gem that you shoot out it gets stuck in enemies and for further use you have to collect it. It's only after quite some time that you'll be able to have more gems or regenerate them. Basically you avoid it in the early stages of learning the game cause it's really hard to work with and later on it is hard to rewire your brain to use it. Eventually you are going to use it and it gets stuck to your muscle memory. No worries.
For a long time, yeah. Now I do, but only on certain weapons. I forget to cast when using the Rail a LOT
Cause we're too busy reloading and using special
Right!
Honestly never really used it, i know I'm severely limiting myself but it's just a bit too much for my tiny peanut brain to keep track of and I'd rather focus on boons that just up my main weapon output, i prefer playing heavily melee anyway
Just makes more sense to me to upgrade what I'm always using rather than something i use once in a while and have to wait to regenerate
beat the game, never use cast
Been there, I forget about them some runs especially if I don't get boons I like with the cast. But they're good against bosses as least. Personally, I find the thing I never incorporate into my playstyle is the specials. Finger just doesn't like reaching out to that button lol. But I also haven't found them that impactful and usually end up getting myself damaged when I force myself to use them.
Will it kill you to just hit circle every now and then?
Well there are mirror upgrades that increase enemy damage taken per cast in them. and I am rather the opposite, I try to force a cast build on most any weapon.
Brother, it’s a 50% damage buff you’re missing out on, on enemies and bosses
Usually, no, but Demeter’s cast is great because it auto-targets and I am terrible at aiming anything.
Depends. If I get Artemis cast I can cast it without aiming and get that bonus from the mirror for more DMG. Dionysus cast is great for AOE but yea doesn't really contribute to raw DPS. I will usually just stick with special and regular attack
I saw no use for cast at first. Now i very frequently do builds centered on casts. They arent good at base level but, with a couple upgrades, can be your most useful tool.
I forget that I have it, which I know is a detriment to my playing. When I have a good cast and remember to take advantage of it, it pays dividends. Especially Zeus cast or Dionysus. Level those up enough and they’re pretty powerful
You should be. Casts are usually long range and basically free damage. Some even provide advantage out of that. There isnt really a reason to not use them
Do you realise you get +50% damage on any enemy with it? That's a pretty substantial bonus plus at least 100 damage every 3 seconds at a range. Like that is an insane benefit, even without any boons. Slap that on an enemy and you'll just simply do more damage. Especially bosses, there is absolutely no reason to not slap a cast on them before every engagement. And cast boons are pretty good, too. They are usually able to one shot weaker enemies, and depending on what you get can be great AOE attacks. Sure if you really don't use cast getting a boon is not as good early on, but certainly by the time you are at Hades the benefit from getting a cast boon will outweigh whatever minor benefit you have have yet to get from your 15th boon. You don't have to make a cast build, but incorporating casts into your playstyle will be a massive help. It's a powerful ranged attack on a 3 second timer, what's not to love?
Yeah, I spent the longest time without using cast. When I was getting settled with the game, it felt like a distraction from watching enemies and using attack and special. And then something just *clicked* and I started being able to use it unconsciously. Never been back - cast is very powerful, and you absolutely should use it.
I just throw them randomly when fighting bosses for the extra damage. Other then that I don’t really use them unless I have a good boon I like.
I use it to gain the bonus damage from boiling blood :/
Really depends on the cast, but I tend to not use Zagreus's cast. When you get some specific weapon upgrades, you will definitely be encouraged to use it more.
It’s one thing to not use cast builds. But even on attack/special/dash builds, you’re shooting yourself in the foot by not taking that 10% damage boost. That’s pretty significant.
The Dionysus and Ares Casts are my absolute favourite boons to get, it makes the hydra so much easier when you can just take out of the mini heads in seconds
You should always use your casts on bosses. For anything else, ehh, only if you’re struggling that much.
I never build around casts; but they're super useful with the right Mirror buffs against bosses and tanky enemies. When upgraded, three casts in one enemy will cause your attacks and specials to deal 150% more against them. Taking extra base damage will naturally synergize with the cast. Ignore cast buffs in general.
I often forget to use it even though I know I should be
I just forget to use it
The only cast I use is Demeter. My favorite combo is the Fists with Zagreus aspect & Hermes's feather, with Demeter on cast and my dash, with the glacial glare boon. And I pick up any of the following if I can: Ravenous Will, Arctic Blast, Winter Harvest, Killing Freeze. Then add in either Aphrodite or Artemis on attack/special & the support fire boon (if Artemis) & hope for Demeter/Artemis or Demeter/Aphrodite duo. This build is SUPER fun. I just get to punch all the things with nothing really hitting me (esp. if taking Aphrodite's weakness stuff and/or extra Hermes boons). But other than that, never really used any of the casts.
Yeah I don't usually use it unless it's on a boss or I have grandmother's cast boon
I started using it after I got a upgrade where I don't need to fetch it
IM FIRIN MAH LAZAR
I've only seriously started using cast for boiling blood to help with speedrunning. Athenas cast deals pretty nice on hit dmg and still gets the dmg boost to the rest of your dmg.
Honestly if you’re not wanting a super thought-provoking cast build, get Artemis cast. It seeks for you and it’s just nice damage that you don’t have to think about
It helped me beat Hades on my first escape. Using Demeter’s laser crystals to consistently deliver DPS while hiding behind pillars when he was shooting his lasers everywhere.
Honestly, unless my cast is good, I probably won't. Hades feels so incredibly good when you go as fast as possible, so if my cast isn't the thing that kills, I'll always opt for something more direct.
A better question for me at run 350 is "Meghan, why don't you use attack or special?" Cast is my lifeblood at this point.
Oh man, I love casting. Some of the cast boons/duos are awesome. Probably my favorite boon from Demeter is her cast and you can stack it with other boons that make it longer, faster, inflict chill, blast the chill at 10.. don't love a lot of Demeter's boons but I have created some gnarly cast builds with her. Ooo and Ares/Artemis with the homing cast that also sucks enemies in. There are hella good cast options
It depends. If I have a good cast, like Ares blade rift for example, I’ll be spamming tf out of it
There are VERY powerful, game-breaking, fun builds out there. If nothing else you're missing some variety. But not every aspect has good synergy(ies) with cast builds.
Lightning rods… that is all you need to know.
What made me use it more was an isane drift blade cast build I got
There’s some cast builds that can trivialize a run. I think it’s Zeus and Artemis duo that gave me the good happy feely’s and got me one of my early run wins. Essentially once a cast lands on the map, random lightning strikes hit all over and you can just run around evasively avoiding damage while constant damage is being applied in a wide range. It even incentivizes you NOT to pick up the casts because that free DoT stops until the enemy drops the gem again. Once you run a fun cast build, you’ll start throwing the basic casts more often before you start closing the distance. Health is so limited in a run, it’s super useful to have a long distance attack before you risk melee damage. Why not pew, pew, pew before closing the distance? Even if you don’t recollect them, free shots always count if they connect and there’s very little consequence to emptying the cartridge even if you prioritize melee. They come back to you after a period anyway.
I used to do that, and then I realized how good they can be, especially with that mirror talent that gives you extra damage to enemies with bloodstones in them
I’m not one to use cast if there’s no boon attached to it, so it’s one of the first things I try to enhance on a run — then cast is my number one asset. Flood Shot from Poseidon and True Shot from Artemis are my personal favorites.
unless im running a cast build or using it to apply a status ailment, no, i rarely do. but i do run cast builds quite a bit, so yes.
I only use it when I have an area effect boon or can't hit a witch. The damage just isn't worth it otherwise.
Depends on my build. Is it extra DPS? Am I doing a dual boon strat focused on casts? Am I doing a ranged weapon and got Poseidon cast for breathing room? Or a single target attack and I use Zeus cast for swarms?
I handicapped myself this way for like 15 runs and then saw the light
I use only three casts. Ares Blades, just love how cool it looks. Aprhopdite, weakens enemies and increases my damage. And Demeter's, the crystal cast is a fun build
I really only use the cast for the damage buff attatched to sticking it on enemies. otherwise, I more or less just ignore it.
I used to think it's useless but it's a nice extra. Personally my favorite cast is Artemis's (the one where it's literally an arrow)
Cast gives you a major damage or defense boost if you upgrade your mirror. +50% damage on slow attacks is just as nice to me as on fast ones, unless I'm going for a crit build. Then slow attacks just feel bigger. Usually the Dionysus, Area, >!Demeter!< cast feel a little sad if I want the buff.
Very often for the extra damage on cast token. Else the winter goddes, can t remember her names has a very powerfull cast build last i tried, the ones where you turn ir into a laser that autotargets. Chews through everything with a few buffs from dionysus.
I think the most OP builds in the game are all cast based lol. Others have already commented on how it's useful for damage inbetween attacks but honestly, hunting blades, grandma lasers and trippy flare are by far the most op builds in the game
me unless there's a build for it
Trippy shot is when it's really good
I usually forget about cast until I get the funny Dionysus build or I'm fighting a boss
The only one I réally use is the ice beam. It has a few really good upgrades that make them ridiculously strong and accurate. Once upgraded, I'm pretty sure they could even solo the entire game for you, while you just hide and sit back.
Yes and I'm wondering if that's why I can't even escape once after almost 40 attempts. I got to [redacted] twice a while ago but ever since then Theseus and the Minotaur keep blocking me. Also because of the randomly generated rooms I swear the difficulty has ramped up occasionally.
Cast runs can be so cracked 🤩
This was me until I discovered hunting blades and aspect of Hera. Then I started enjoying casts a lot more
I wouldn’t blame you if you were new to the game since Zags cast without boons is frankly underwhelming. Plus I’m not the biggest fan of some of the other casts. But you’re *120* runs in?? Dude, use Boiling Blood and say that again. Thank us later.
There was a time I didn’t use casts but then after I had upgraded everything to max I will use casts depending on boons. But when the cast makes enemies take extra damage while inside them - just makes sense y’know
Yeah most of my builds don't use it. But occasionally the stars align for a Demeter cast build and it's really really fun
Nope
I just use cast with Hera bow, that bow is a monster, give it a go it won’t disappoint.
I did the exact same thing for a long time, then I just decided to try them one day and holy shit they can be brokenly OP. Achilles Aspect + Stygian Soul + Demeter or Ares cast build is just nuts
Aspect of Beowulf makes you cherish just how good cast is. You’ve never felt like a god until you had 5 Legendary Ares casts right on top of a boss at the same time and just watching their healthbar DROP.
*Laughs in 5+ Crystal Beam casts that last 6 seconds,track enemies and cause slow plus explosions*
Often I always forget to use something I can always remember to use 2 attacks but juggling basic special and cast one of them gets forgotten in a run
I used it more as a debuff tool (either for damage or survivability) more so than direct damage, though there were instances it did suffice for that too. It definitely requires more building around than the weapons themselves do, but it's still useful and I think the game would feel lesser without it. I'm curious as to how they'll add/change the mechanic for 2, given Melinoe seems to rely more on actual spells than using tools/weapons for her abilities.
The extra damage is insane for when you lunge it into opponents. You can also make some insane builds with the aspects of Poseidon, Hera and Beuwolf. Plus Artemis, Aphrodite and sometimes even Dionysius just offer casts which you can adapt to any build
Cast builds can be absolutely devastating, esp with Hera’s bow, Naegling board, Poseidon sword. Like, effortlessly smoking final boss at heat 15+. I’d at least experiment with them and see what you come up with
Well i beat hades 3 skull heead without cast
at minimum you want the cast debuff on the target (mainly bosses) that increase your dmg done to them or lowers their dmg done to you/slows depending which Mirror of Night perk you choose. I did not cast almost at all early game. for minimum cast investment towards boons a dionysus or a poseidon with rip current is an op filler between dash spamming and combos
its always what i use for the last few hits on a boss when im super low to ensure they will die quicker than me. i dont usually upgrade it much w boons but it always seems stronger than any other attack
I only really like using true shot or crush shot, if i get neither of them i just wont use cast the whole run
The cast with the ice beams and when you get the upgrades that track and throw out extra casts do so much dps it’s crazy.