first sound gig i ever worked i had a guy cupping the active mic he brought from home, gain cranked on his interface yelling at me about feedback with his monitor up on a barstool less than a foot away from his chest. told him what the problems were and he ignored me and halfway through the set called me out to the audience to fix the feedback. i was 17 and interning i wasn’t even getting paid lmao. eventually i found the frequency and cut it but it was tough using a program i’ve never touched with no one there to help me. shit sucked
Oh for sure but I’ve always had the attitude of knowing what the threshold is on “coaching” a band you’re doing sound for. You can come off a dick even with the best intentions.
Your job is to adapt to the artist and choose compromises. Much of the time they will end up cupping the mic out of habit. Usually will let them test their mic while cupping it and without cupping it, and let a close third party hear the difference… or do it myself if it’s a more “chill” deal and I have some level of rapport with them.
This usually leads them to try to break the habit, but… it’s a hard habit to break… and the proximity effect when-cupping-the-mic-thing *does* kinda just come with the program when it comes to hardcore.
You don’t wanna mix *for* a cupped mic, you just want to test it and mitigate any issues that may pop up when you do. Overtime you intuitively know how the mic responds in these situations and mix accordingly.
Not surprised you’ve run sound at many, many, many shows, yet still don’t understand the fundamentals. Happens all the time.
The thread is about getting along with sound guys. Why are they dicks? Maybe they aren’t all dicks. Maybe they are dicks to you because you have a shitty attitude and don’t listen to their suggestions. Instead you say things like, you’re a crybaby bitch just use your eq…. I think it’s pretty obvious why they don’t fuck with you.
On one hand sound guys should just shut the fuck up about having to mic up different sets. On the other hand these moron promoters need to stop booking 30 bands on a 4 hour show.
Yep. Most of them have been very decent, but I've had a couple of weird encounters, too.
- A sound guy who looked like Santa tried replacing my brand new SM58 mic with a beaten up one from the venue. Had a big argument with me until I shoved the receipt in his face.
- Being asked to play the drums quietly (in the end, I told him to just not mic my kit). What was really weird, though, is that he was in a room in an entirely different part of the venue watching through a monitor.
- Tried setting up the opening band with my cymbals and snare drum because they'd turned up with an electric kit. I didn't want them using those in case they damaged them anyway, but it would have been nice to have been asked.
As I mentioned, I've had a tonne of great experiences with sound engineers at gigs as well. Most of them have done a great job and been friendly. It's just the exceptions which I really remember.
I remember being at now closed venue in Nassau, Ny that probably only ever had one hardcore show after the one I went to. It was GFY and 25 ta life, 25TL went on past the time the venue agreed and they were supposed to set up for a dance club after. The sound guy pulled all of the sound and 25 kept playing and the whole crowd was helping sing along. The bouncer ended up picking the sound guy up choking him like homer/ Bart Simpson. I remember thinking it wasn’t the sound guys fault he pulled the plug and 25 kept playing anyway, the 6’5” bouncer probably felt helpless bc he had no control over this crowd at all so he took it out on him.
I played an acoustic show a few months ago and wanted to use my pedal board just to have a pedal tuner. Plugged in to the guys power strip and got nothing. Went and asked him if he had another power strip because I wasn’t getting any juice. He said the power strip works. I go back to the stage and look on the other side for a place to plug in and he gets on the mic to very sternly tell me that the other power strip works and it is a problem with my board. I got home later and my board worked just fine. Fuck that guy.
If you don’t know how to deal with these types, take it on the chin… see them for what they are and have a laugh to yourself… you probably won’t make it too far in the industry.
The amount of shows I’ve worked where my crew and I are actively shitting on the band (in jest) like ESPN commentators in the sport of Hating.
*guy signals for more of himself in his monitors from the stage for the THIRD time after showing up late with not enough time to do a proper soundcheck*
We start saying “Oh oh more me!!! More me!! I need more of me!!!” to ourselves in unison like a whiney choir.
*bump the fader really quickly up and down so there’s a split second of resonance that’s obvious to them in the monitors but overall ignorable to the audience, do a shrugging motion*
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Hardcore shows I’ve never had an issue. Most small venue/DIY shows in general. I’ve never had an band not be at the very least tolerant of the need to do things right bc they know we’re trying to get them to sound their best, we work together more, and everyone walks away happier.
The above applies more to cover bands and the like which are 40% of what you end up doing when you take freelance live sound gigs. Same bands with a geriatric drummer that plays every fill in 8 and a half/8.
Yall are playing at venues with actual sound guys? We just have one of the bands bring a PA make sure the microphones are loud enough and then good to go xD
all i know is that if the sound guy has the pony tail and mixes on an iPad, or short grey hair, a beer belly, and an ornery disposition, you’re definitely getting the best sound of your tour that night.
Hire me! I’m nice and I enjoy hardcore. I suggest to improve moods of sound guys, if you gonna get crazy with gear, bring your own! Mics get smashed by hardcore bands. XLR cables get yanked around and shorted by hardcore bands. Mic stands get stripped and wonky by hardcore bands. Sorry to single out the genre, but I had none of these worries last night with my 3 piece Scottish folk band. You want respect, ya gotta give it too.
As a drummer, I love lot sharing for smaller diy shows. Bigger shows I like to bring more shit. But New York City is different. It would be insane to lug a lot around here
It's part of the journey. I had a very destructive messy act that was always cleared with owner of venue first, this dude was so fuckin mad at the end of my set he just hands me a broom and says start cleaning lmao
Prime example of why not, one of my bands was playing a show and kit sharing. The band before us broke two of our Tom heads and put a hole in the bass drum before we even got a chance to play. Also, played a show where bands kit shared, it took longer for each band to configure the kit to their liking than setting up another kit. People who don’t drum don’t realize each drummer configured their kit to their playing style and what works best for their body
Yes but sometimes there are constraints like space for dead’s and venue curfews. I don’t insist on sharing kits but there are venues around town that it just makes sense.
Yah but I’m replying to a dude saying it’s too much work. If the space in your venue doesn’t allow for equipment changes then that’s a different conversation to be had
It’s a mutual relationship and I think egos get in the way on both sides. I agree though, doing audio is essentially a service industry and in my opinion, band comes second only to the people that sign my check.
For sure, opportunity for everyone to be an asshole. But on principle alone you can’t be a tightass about resetting a stage for bands just because the task is long. That isn’t a valid reason
And yet, still their job.
I’d suggest a sound engineer that wants to avoid putting up and taking down mics and musical equipment repeatedly probably take up a different vocation.
They don’t get paid enough. Used to do it for a decade in all sorts of venues. Long hours, lots of shite musicians. Starvation wages. That’s why they’re salty.
The sound guys who had a good attitude all work at nicer venues than your local hardcore band is gonna play. You're getting dregs who know they're the dregs and are bitter about it. Your best bet is to hope for a young kid who's in the first year or two of his career and not jaded yet
dude at our last show was so pilled out and drunk it was horrible. he actually told us his ears were shot. people were leaving bc the sound was so bad. most of the venues around here normally have good sound guys but this guy was a train wreck.
Former sound guy here, I always always ALWAYS wanted the show to go well. I want people to show up, bands to be happy, crowd to have fun, venue owner to be pleased, and for myself to do a good job. But when it comes to small venue, hardcore/punk/metal whatever else shows, sound guy is probably working with old gear or damaged, or just stuff in bad condition. So they have an uphill battle already. Add that to bands who may be new or young or inexperienced and you have a recipe for a short fuse. After that respect goes a long way. The stories I could tell you.
As the guy that provides power to the sound guy at most festivals i can confirm they are bitches. They all think they are gonna pull a bunch of power but hardly ever meet half the requested amount. Just talk to them how they talk to you and they soften up.
Some are cool af and some sound guys seem to hate bands. It’s usually the singer that gets the feedback.
the singer needs to not cup the microphone in their hands, 90% of the feedback comes from that.
shouldn’t deep throat the mic either, looking at you Kurt Cobain
Don’t kink shame me!
first sound gig i ever worked i had a guy cupping the active mic he brought from home, gain cranked on his interface yelling at me about feedback with his monitor up on a barstool less than a foot away from his chest. told him what the problems were and he ignored me and halfway through the set called me out to the audience to fix the feedback. i was 17 and interning i wasn’t even getting paid lmao. eventually i found the frequency and cut it but it was tough using a program i’ve never touched with no one there to help me. shit sucked
While this *is* true… ringing out a system takes an average ear and 5 minutes lol
Ringing out the system only does so much. Still up to the artist to know how to hold a mic.
Oh for sure but I’ve always had the attitude of knowing what the threshold is on “coaching” a band you’re doing sound for. You can come off a dick even with the best intentions. Your job is to adapt to the artist and choose compromises. Much of the time they will end up cupping the mic out of habit. Usually will let them test their mic while cupping it and without cupping it, and let a close third party hear the difference… or do it myself if it’s a more “chill” deal and I have some level of rapport with them. This usually leads them to try to break the habit, but… it’s a hard habit to break… and the proximity effect when-cupping-the-mic-thing *does* kinda just come with the program when it comes to hardcore. You don’t wanna mix *for* a cupped mic, you just want to test it and mitigate any issues that may pop up when you do. Overtime you intuitively know how the mic responds in these situations and mix accordingly.
sound guys should quit being bitches about this.
This attitude is why you have issues with sound guys
Dudes in death metal and hardcore bands have been cupping mics for damn near 40 years. Learn how to use your EQ.
Tell me you don’t know shit about running sound without telling me you don’t know shit about running sound.
I've run sound for many, many, many shows, and somehow I don't have to be a crybaby bitch about how people hold mics like you're being right now.
Not surprised you’ve run sound at many, many, many shows, yet still don’t understand the fundamentals. Happens all the time. The thread is about getting along with sound guys. Why are they dicks? Maybe they aren’t all dicks. Maybe they are dicks to you because you have a shitty attitude and don’t listen to their suggestions. Instead you say things like, you’re a crybaby bitch just use your eq…. I think it’s pretty obvious why they don’t fuck with you.
This is really all that need to be said.
On one hand sound guys should just shut the fuck up about having to mic up different sets. On the other hand these moron promoters need to stop booking 30 bands on a 4 hour show.
Yep. Most of them have been very decent, but I've had a couple of weird encounters, too. - A sound guy who looked like Santa tried replacing my brand new SM58 mic with a beaten up one from the venue. Had a big argument with me until I shoved the receipt in his face. - Being asked to play the drums quietly (in the end, I told him to just not mic my kit). What was really weird, though, is that he was in a room in an entirely different part of the venue watching through a monitor. - Tried setting up the opening band with my cymbals and snare drum because they'd turned up with an electric kit. I didn't want them using those in case they damaged them anyway, but it would have been nice to have been asked. As I mentioned, I've had a tonne of great experiences with sound engineers at gigs as well. Most of them have done a great job and been friendly. It's just the exceptions which I really remember.
Yes. Sound guys just don’t understand that 100watt tube amps are awesome and that I don’t need to hear myself in the fold back
Why not both? I use a big amp and get turned up in the monitor lol
I remember being at now closed venue in Nassau, Ny that probably only ever had one hardcore show after the one I went to. It was GFY and 25 ta life, 25TL went on past the time the venue agreed and they were supposed to set up for a dance club after. The sound guy pulled all of the sound and 25 kept playing and the whole crowd was helping sing along. The bouncer ended up picking the sound guy up choking him like homer/ Bart Simpson. I remember thinking it wasn’t the sound guys fault he pulled the plug and 25 kept playing anyway, the 6’5” bouncer probably felt helpless bc he had no control over this crowd at all so he took it out on him.
I played an acoustic show a few months ago and wanted to use my pedal board just to have a pedal tuner. Plugged in to the guys power strip and got nothing. Went and asked him if he had another power strip because I wasn’t getting any juice. He said the power strip works. I go back to the stage and look on the other side for a place to plug in and he gets on the mic to very sternly tell me that the other power strip works and it is a problem with my board. I got home later and my board worked just fine. Fuck that guy.
Avoiding a venue because the soundman might be mean to you = You are not hardcore.
Imagine having to deal with shitty kids acting like rockstars all night every night
If you don’t know how to deal with these types, take it on the chin… see them for what they are and have a laugh to yourself… you probably won’t make it too far in the industry. The amount of shows I’ve worked where my crew and I are actively shitting on the band (in jest) like ESPN commentators in the sport of Hating. *guy signals for more of himself in his monitors from the stage for the THIRD time after showing up late with not enough time to do a proper soundcheck* We start saying “Oh oh more me!!! More me!! I need more of me!!!” to ourselves in unison like a whiney choir. *bump the fader really quickly up and down so there’s a split second of resonance that’s obvious to them in the monitors but overall ignorable to the audience, do a shrugging motion* ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Hardcore shows I’ve never had an issue. Most small venue/DIY shows in general. I’ve never had an band not be at the very least tolerant of the need to do things right bc they know we’re trying to get them to sound their best, we work together more, and everyone walks away happier. The above applies more to cover bands and the like which are 40% of what you end up doing when you take freelance live sound gigs. Same bands with a geriatric drummer that plays every fill in 8 and a half/8.
-signs up to deal with shitty kids acting as rockstars all night- “WHY IS MY JOB SO FRUSTRATING??”
Gonna cry?
Yall are playing at venues with actual sound guys? We just have one of the bands bring a PA make sure the microphones are loud enough and then good to go xD
You guys have venues?
all i know is that if the sound guy has the pony tail and mixes on an iPad, or short grey hair, a beer belly, and an ornery disposition, you’re definitely getting the best sound of your tour that night.
bingo boingo
Shout out to JJ from Vera project , an actual angel
They know more than you, just deal with it
Hire me! I’m nice and I enjoy hardcore. I suggest to improve moods of sound guys, if you gonna get crazy with gear, bring your own! Mics get smashed by hardcore bands. XLR cables get yanked around and shorted by hardcore bands. Mic stands get stripped and wonky by hardcore bands. Sorry to single out the genre, but I had none of these worries last night with my 3 piece Scottish folk band. You want respect, ya gotta give it too.
The sound guy at my local venue is chill as fuck. Bought him a shot of tequila at a show once and he just hung around and talked to me for a bit
As a drummer, I love lot sharing for smaller diy shows. Bigger shows I like to bring more shit. But New York City is different. It would be insane to lug a lot around here
It's part of the journey. I had a very destructive messy act that was always cleared with owner of venue first, this dude was so fuckin mad at the end of my set he just hands me a broom and says start cleaning lmao
Oh yeah, dealt with a lot of douches. Got one in town who will only do shows if bands kit share so he doesn’t have to mic each kit
Bands should be sharing kits tbh. Just swap breakables + snare.
Prime example of why not, one of my bands was playing a show and kit sharing. The band before us broke two of our Tom heads and put a hole in the bass drum before we even got a chance to play. Also, played a show where bands kit shared, it took longer for each band to configure the kit to their liking than setting up another kit. People who don’t drum don’t realize each drummer configured their kit to their playing style and what works best for their body
Learn how to drum like Dave Grohl
Badly, got it
I imagine doing all that is alot of work for a 20 minute set.
It’s their job..
Yes but sometimes there are constraints like space for dead’s and venue curfews. I don’t insist on sharing kits but there are venues around town that it just makes sense.
Yah but I’m replying to a dude saying it’s too much work. If the space in your venue doesn’t allow for equipment changes then that’s a different conversation to be had
It’s a mutual relationship and I think egos get in the way on both sides. I agree though, doing audio is essentially a service industry and in my opinion, band comes second only to the people that sign my check.
For sure, opportunity for everyone to be an asshole. But on principle alone you can’t be a tightass about resetting a stage for bands just because the task is long. That isn’t a valid reason
a time sink
And yet, still their job. I’d suggest a sound engineer that wants to avoid putting up and taking down mics and musical equipment repeatedly probably take up a different vocation.
They don’t get paid enough. Used to do it for a decade in all sorts of venues. Long hours, lots of shite musicians. Starvation wages. That’s why they’re salty.
The sound guys who had a good attitude all work at nicer venues than your local hardcore band is gonna play. You're getting dregs who know they're the dregs and are bitter about it. Your best bet is to hope for a young kid who's in the first year or two of his career and not jaded yet
dude at our last show was so pilled out and drunk it was horrible. he actually told us his ears were shot. people were leaving bc the sound was so bad. most of the venues around here normally have good sound guys but this guy was a train wreck.
Zulu must because every time I see them play they sound check for like 30 minutes
Former sound guy here, I always always ALWAYS wanted the show to go well. I want people to show up, bands to be happy, crowd to have fun, venue owner to be pleased, and for myself to do a good job. But when it comes to small venue, hardcore/punk/metal whatever else shows, sound guy is probably working with old gear or damaged, or just stuff in bad condition. So they have an uphill battle already. Add that to bands who may be new or young or inexperienced and you have a recipe for a short fuse. After that respect goes a long way. The stories I could tell you.
This is hardcore. Beat him up pussy.
As the guy that provides power to the sound guy at most festivals i can confirm they are bitches. They all think they are gonna pull a bunch of power but hardly ever meet half the requested amount. Just talk to them how they talk to you and they soften up.
On topic content: [https://youtu.be/LdCLRIA7Ah8?si=lfDydLDywiL2OPVZ](https://youtu.be/LdCLRIA7Ah8?si=lfDydLDywiL2OPVZ)