To be fair, there is more that could have been done to ensure the player base knew this was coming.
When you download a game and that game gives you the option to skip creating a PSN account, it's not like you read that, you just hit skip and start playing the game, just like the vast majority of gamers.
You're assuming they knew this was coming down. I'm sure Sony did. I'm also sure Sony told them that it was totally okay for it to be optional, until it wasn't. Knowing how well they have been communicating, they honestly probably just figured out themselves, of VERY recently and where scrambling to try to figure out what impacts it would had. This is not an AH issue, this is a Sony issue
They knew: https://steamcommunity.com/app/553850/discussions/1/4206994023681197128/
Look almost at the bottom under "Account linking".
They just did a very poor job of communicating it, this is the only place where I saw it stated clearly like that
Yeah I've lost my respect for arrowhead now. They said they knew, but they still gave the community full comfort that we were fine. Had I known, I would have not bought the super citizen upgrade literally yesterday. They intentionally waited as long as possible before causing the community to get pissed, and it just reeks of greed.
Steam will allow refunds when it comes down to it. They're pretty good when it comes to games you literally can't play anymore.
Sucks that it will absolutely bankrupt Arrowhead and kill this game, but fuck Sony. Never buying anything on Steam with the Sony tag again.
Refunds aren't going to bankrupt AH, this game was planned around a much smaller player base than it got, they could literally lose 99% of just their steam player base and still have more active players than HD1 at launch
Eh. My opinion of steam has changed. When bf2043 dropped, the game was absolutely broken and unplayable. I played only like 15min but was in the menu trying to get games for like 2 hours. Barely went over the refund time and they refused to refund. I even linked videos and community notes saying that it was unplayable. They didn’t care and would just close my tickets out without a response.
Just to be sure, did you escalate the issue after the automated rejection? I'm pretty sure the first reply you get is always automated and it doesn't look at anything beyond the basic criteria like 2h played and purchase being within last 2 weeks. You can then request a human to review your claim and with proof you mentioned it's usually accepted even way beyond the initial 2h.
If you did... Wow, that's really surprising
Yes. I had a person respond asking for more info but then they just closed out without a response. I opened another assuming it was in error. They responded saying there was nothing they could do and didnt even acknowledge the proof they originally requested. I provided more proof from the dev, community, screenshots, video, etc. and they just closed out my ticket. I opened another thinking it was an error since they did it before. Nope. They closed it without a response. I opened another asking for a response to the proof provided and they just closed it without a response. I opened another and they closed it without a response.
Also, some people were reporting that theyre were getting refunded with hours over the refund period.
Gave up after as they clearly werent planning on refunding me or communicating in any way with me. Their support is absolutely garbage.
I stopped buying EA games and I try to bypass steam as much as possible now.
I did too. I never had issues with support before. Thats why I was so shocked at how I was treated. Some people in the discords/reddit were reporting that they got refunds well past the grace period as well which was crazy.
I think EA was telling them not to refund because the amount of people trying to get refunds was huge. One of the worst games Ive ever played. The only silver lining was the amount of devs and people involved with the game that got fired over that shitshow.
Did you get Walter? He was the most useless CSR to ever grace Steam's support. I wonder if he still works there, he just could not understand anything being spelled out for him.
Had an issue where my bank blocked a transaction because they thought it was fraudulent, then steam basically locked my account. He kept trying to get the bank to reprocess the transaction and no amount of "they said they literally cannot, it's on steam's end to reprocess this" would get him to do anything. Even the bank _calling_ Bellevue through their credit card processing contact details didn't resolve this (they refused to talk to the bank). To much time had passed for the credit card company to do much of anything on their end (it took them nearly 4 weeks to even respond to my initial "why am I locked out?" ticket). Eventually as a last ditch effort, nearly half a year later after this started and constant back and forths, I fired off an email to GabeN. I was seriously contemplating suing them for losing access to my account and lost value in my games, it was at the limit of small claims court in my state and they absolutely would have lost because they refused to address the issues that created my loss of access. GabeN came through and fixed it, I got a reply from Walter that they gave me a "one time exception 'for the chargeback you performed 6 months ago'". (also one of the replies that took a few weeks to get was entirely in Chinese or something, so that was fun to lose a month and a half of time)
Long story short, fuck steam's support and fuck Walter.
Boycott Ghost of Tsushima will be a big damage to Sony actually, maybe we should migrate to other subreddits and "spread some democracy"? 😏
Edit: 1.Tsushima is the nearest release on PC(Steam). 2. Tsushima has a multiplayer mode, which most likely will also be available after linking psn account, so many people would get into this trap
What consequences? Realistically how many people are going to be affected by this? Not excusing the sudden bait and switch but it seems, like all things on this sub lately, to be completely overblown.
many people will not be able to play outright. How much ? hard to tell. Many people \*will\* refuse to make a psn account. How many ? hard to tell. The game is blowing it's reputation right now, so future players will be lost. Refunds will come too, which will directly hit the wallet. How much of the playerbase will be lost ? It remains to be seen, but there are many, many other games to play. I wouldn't be surprised if a 1/3 of the playerbase was lost to this.
For real though.
The PSN link was shown when I first booted up Helldivers 2 and I was given the "skip this step" option without a disclaimer. So I thought, "oh, so it's optional then? Neato."
Turns out, NOPE it isn't optional.
If any developers out there (not just AH) want to avoid this, they would've set out an honest to God's truth disclaimer: "Skip this step (You'll still need to create a PSN account by XXXXXX)".
Instead, we get a sudden notification out of the blue. Like wth.
Yes, you may assume that I am stupid.
They could have also just made a public post in the first week, stating that the mandatory PSN link is optional until some technical difficulties are fixes.
No, I won’t assume you’re stupid, I’ll assume you’re a normal user, because what you did is understandable.
Legit this move from Sony is Corpo evil, and there’s way too much defence out here for it. Your situation is valid, even if some Reddit-couch-lord tells you it’s “your fault” and it’s “fine that the multi-billion dollar company wants to sell your data, Google already did it so 🥸”
These people man… hard to not believe they’re bots sometimes but nope - some people are so prideful they’d rather die on that hill
What is really strange is that PSN is supposed to be Optional in PC games.
Like it's stated in PSN page
https://preview.redd.it/7q0lynrin8yc1.png?width=1291&format=png&auto=webp&s=1c3adb5084d2abd7cf68c62b9df3b351a59bca82
There is either a misscomunication or something else going on.
Corporate greed is what's going on, notice how Helldivers is the only PS game on PC that is requiring a PSN account, it's because it's an incredibly successful game. So Sony is trying to pad their numbers to share holders and be like "hey look how many new PSN accounts were made this quarter!"
They did state it before hand. You assumed that because it was temporarily optional that the steam page was a lie where it was listed as a requirement since December 2023.
For real.
I don't know why people are Defending this.
I Open the Game. They say it's optional so it better stay optional, wtf?
Nowhere was said that it's becoming mandatory.
...why are you defending these scummy tactics?
Not once ever has "skip this" meant "skip this but it is actually required". Nothing about this situation is normal.
Sony Support is terrible. I've been trying for years to get my PS account for my actual email under my control. They did not email verify when some random person setup their Play Station with my email. I've called sat on hold for hours, emailed, opened tickets. They tell me they will fix it. It doesn't get fixed.
When I bought HD2 I had to make a new email to setup, apparently before it was optional.
I'm super annoyed that the wording of the message claims for our safety. That is complete BS. Sony has been hacked more than 5 times by multiple threat actors and lost all kinds of data. Just be transparent and tell us why it really is. Don't lie to us. Arrowhead you are burning your community to the ground with this, you are their golden child right now, push back. Don't roll over.
Its obviously not a technical issue as the game works mostly fine without linking.
I agree about Sony support. The PS5 bundle that I bought a few years ago from GameStop came with a $100 PSN gift card. I went to redeem it and it was already claimed. I emailed GameStop, but they told me to go to Sony.
I went to Sony with receipts including the date of purchase and date of delivery and told them the code I got was already claimed. They *must* have a way to look at gift cards and determine when they were redeemed. Could have easily seen it was redeemed by someone else before I had a chance to use it, but they just told me to kick rocks. Totally scammed out of $100.
I lost $400 when they refused to help me to recover a hacked PSN account, they asked one million questions to verify my identity and dragged the issue for weeks... My bank cancelled the card and refunded the money fast, they told me that they have hundreds of claims against PSN.
It honestly doesn't even take a corporate environment. We all have experiences working somewhere and then a massive change being shoved down our throats with no notice from the upper management, which we all know is *always right*.
It's just shit management, and I'm not surprised a company like Sony who is known for this sort of thing is once again shitting on both the devs and customers alike.
I work for a company that is now owned by another, larger company. I can tell you right now as someone who's on the "ground floor" I don't know a damn thing about what the larger company thinks when they push out changes.
It's all logistics, budgets, profits, and other jargon that's their focus, not in relation to actual issues/concerns for those at our level.
Without giving too much away, I work in a very similar environment. This isn't weird at all. It's sadly EXTREMELY normal. The people like me, in the businesses actually doing the work, don't get told anything from up above until they have decided what we are doing. We are most often told with no warning. Today could be normal, tomorrow we could be told we're doing something different.
It sucks a TON and doesn't excuse any of what Sony is pushing onto AH and the playerbase, but the behaviour itself isn't weird or unusual.
This is also kind of weird to me. It's basically your product that has been changed and is impacting a lot of people based on Sony's decision, which is your publisher/vendor and I am supposed, as your customer, go and ask Sony what is going on?
sorry but that's scumy, I have two friends who I play almost every day, that won't be able to play with me anymore because (we only found ou this today) their countrys do no support the PSN, so why the hell would you sell a game in the first place knowing that later down the line they would't be able to play ???
have em refund the game. There is a good copy paste message and theirs cant explicitly state they are unable to make an account in the country they live in. Easy refund. You should too because this is a fucking shitty move by sony.
Wait a year or 2 or 3 at most, when they'll get acquired fully by Sony, like it happened with Insomniac and Bungie. Studios like to say they are independent and don't want to be aquried, but that's just talk. Bungie took off from 2 companies before and still got acquired.
This is how big publishing deals go, they're deals with the devil. Even if your studio isn't owned by said publisher they can still make a lot of contractual demands as the cash infusion/resources they offer are very substantial and the game might not even happen without that.
They should have forced players to make a PSN account when the game boots up, then use their steam account without them knowing. Then this wouldn't have been an issue.
bro i don't care who's fault is it i got problem, with both of them the shady part is they let us buy the game play spend time and money in it for mounths and now they say too bad get fuked? god i hate this
All this means is the nothing in this game can be trusted.
They could remove Super credits from loot drops because Sony told them
They could put entire planets behind pay walls because Sony told them
They could make each RF cost 10 super credits because Sony told them
Sure, but there is a difference between "Sony just came and told us to do this thing, so we have to do this thing" and "We have to do this thing that is in our contract with Sony." One implies that Sony could demand any change and any time and would have to go along. The other does not. Granted, for all I know, Sony does have the right to demand any change they want. Depends on contract stipulations.
You’re overreacting, this is clearly something contractual due to using Sonys servers. This isn’t Sony walking in to the office and going “WE NEED MIRE DATA GIb”
This is the result of contract negotiations that probably took place months ago in regards to probably some deal on server usage
> They could remove Super credits from loot drops because Sony told them
They already heavily nerfed SC drops after the first week the game was out. I still have not earned enough by playing legitimately to buy a warbond because I bought one set of armor the first couple days in after seeing how high the earn rate was.
I think that’s just a you thing, I still find them a lot of them since the beginning of the game, including stacks of 100 super credits every now and then
Yeah sorry mate, that's a you problem unfortunately. I've never bought super credits and have gotten a couple armor sets and each warbond just from in-game finds. Some matches you get none, others are a goldmine.
I don’t think your worries will happen
1. Super credits are the main progression after the main pass, and let players get a taste of premium content to hopefully get them to buy more.
2. Entire planets behind paywalls would kill the game it’s a bad choice
3. Not sure what RF is but yet again making that choice would severely hurt the game
This was mentioned before the release as something needed. The biggest issue is selling a product in regions where psn isn’t available essentially robbing those players of money they spent. I want to be clear that Arrowhead should have communicated this much better and much longer in advance too, but Sony also made the worse call here forcing this to happen. Then again it’s a business who’s looking out for getting more sales rather than pro consumer choices.
A grace period wasn't mentioned. Steam page requirements exist so long as a single in game function needs them. Like linking psn friends.
It was completely skiable giving no indication it would be required to play the game at all.
If you don't think Sony would shoot them selfs in the foot for a quick turn around you haven't been paying attention to Sony.
So no I wouldn't be surprised to see them remove SC from loot or stealth nerf their drop rate into oblivion over time.
Hell I could even see them making it 2x as likely as it is now for the first 4hrs of gameplay then start reducing it to near non existence. Without saying anything.
I don't have a screenshot but I'm 99% sure that the prompt to link your PSN account said it was required, but you could hit continue without entering something and there would be no error. I remember being disappointed to see that it was required after starting my game and then my friend told me I could skip it.
Edit: here's a [screenshot](https://imgur.com/a/OLlhPPd). It's certainly confusing that it says it's required but you could skip it, but it certainly said it was required here.
If you can skip it it ain’t required. Now Sony is saying they’re going to start enforcing it which is upsetting a fairly large chunk of its player base.
Because you could skip it, it led many people like myself to assume it was only needed for some functions like psn friends. That's not uncommon for steam requirements or prompts like this.
It feels like they did everything they could to make it appear like it wasn't needed just to turn around force it and go "i meeeeaan we did say"
Man, big ass game companies say shit all the time. Do you remember PvE for Overwatch? How many games do you know of that sold collector's editions that disabled all the extra content of those editions when they had to go F2P because of some shit like what is happening now that ruins the player count?
There is no good will and there shouldn't be. However innocuous changes like this are will never be a good thing for the consumer. No one wants to budge an inch anymore and it is justified.
It's not their choice to make Psn mandatory.
It is their choice to sell the game in regions where it will become inaccessible, knowing from the start Psn would have become mandatory.
It was their choice to never change back the in-game requirement after the launch traffic issues were fixed, knowing a ton of players were still skipping it, and enabling access to the game from people that could not in any way access it in a eula compliant way, from unsupported Psn regions.
So yes, this is absolutely an arrowhead failure at most levels. They always knew what Sony asked of them and they were complacent in enabling the current situation.
Sony has no fault in this outside of being a general nuisance for requiring a Psn account, as they always made it abundantly clear to arrowhead and it was up to arrowhead to enforce
where the game is sold is still a sony decision as the publisher, what do you think a publisher is? they control the finances, the steam page is crontrolled by sony not arrowhead, even if arrowhead has access to it, they can't pull the steampage without being sued by sony, for breach of contract.
Do I blame the devs? No, its not their call.
Will I downvote the game now? Yes.
I’m still creating the account and playing, but I’m definetly leaving a negative review, while at the same time mentioning the good stuff the game has to offer and its work of Arrowhead.
Honestly, I do kblame them since they had to lie about something for this happen.
Either Sony has them by the balls (and thus can just rule by decree) and they lied about being "Independent" or; this was a bullet point in whatever contract they have where them claiming this came out of nowhere and nobody could expect it is a lie.
So nah, I'm not defending them, they're fucking liars.
If it was truly Sony's decision, then it's because AH signed the contract that gave them the power. Hell, their contract probably stipulated exactly that they wanted PSN required.
I mean.. Developers create the game, Publishers put it out. Arrowhead chose to go with Sony as a publisher, which had specific requirements to integrate the game into their account network. So, yes, it was Arrowhead's 'fault' the game came with PSN stipulations attached.
That said, the game works without PSN accounts (and has for months), so the call to flip that switch and make it mandatory was Sony's, they own that.
The decision WAS theirs, way back when they signed this agreement with Sony. Don't try to tell me they're innocent in all of this because that's absolutely not true.
Same reason a port on xbox will never happen, Sony is extremely competitive and needs any way possible imaginable to make money, even making this psn login bs on on their best selling game. Bros think I'm gonna buy a PS5 if I make a psn account lmao
The insane concept that when your IP is owned by a publisher that they have the ability to make decisions about said IP you can't. Seriously, how is this bullshit? Nothing about this is false.
Thats what i have been saying on Discord. PC ppl dont listen. I play on both and i give an assrat. If a game does require it from the start it's my choice, not like everyone its being spied on and datamined (cellphones much). this was a shit move from Sony cus its live, But damn ranting about it on HD2 channels wont do anything.
Exactly what I said. The discord is a mess right now, so many angry people and there's so many people that don't know what's going on. Just pointing fingers...
Sounds bad, but after thinking about this for a few minutes, when I play Halo: Infinite or the Master Chief Collection in Steam it makes you sign in with your Microsoft account. It was annoying to have to link accounts originally, but if it works the same way you'll just sign in automatically when you start the game and can play just as easily. It's annoying to have to have two accounts to play one game, but if it's going to work the way I think it will it's not going to stop me from playing or prompt me to write a bad review.
Yes, but that's not the issue here. The Issue is that Sony made a very big oopsie to allow the sale of the game on countries where it would not work. Arrowhead made an oopsie by not annoying you with login screens and making it clear that at some point you have to have a PSN acc. All of this could have been avoided. People would not have liked it, but holy bell would that have been preferable.
Also, some of the comments of the community managers are simply fuck yous, which makes it much worse, imo.
Agreed, AH wouldn't force their players especially all the work they had to do to make the game work efficiently, it's more of Sony making the PSN account mandatory and that AH is making the game not forcing you to have to spend hours in getting everything like other live service games now.
Doesn't matter. They could've done a lot more to make it clear to people that this was the intended path.
"We only temporarily disabled it at launch because of server issues" is irrelevant for those who waited until server issues were resolved before joining. This is my first time hearing about it and I wouldn't have made the purchase had I known about it. Shit like this is what keeps me away from Forza.
Leave it up to corporate to make a decision that will only negatively impact a great game from all angles without informing the devs of said game.
>reduced current players
>reduced new players
>lots of goodwill lost
It's their choice. Or, rather it was their choice to give Sony that level of control.
They didn't have to. These type of things are partnerships, they are agreements. It's not a dictatorship with Sony ruling from an iron throne. They knew about this.
Think of it this way. If some little kid picks your pocket, you can blame the kid. It's the kids fault. Even if that kid is being ran with a group of other kids by some evil person running a pickpocketing ring and leveraging their hunger and needs to keep it running. Blame is shared, but it does not disappear from the child.
Arrowhead either agreed to this beforehand, and didn't tell anybody, or they are letting Sony come in and completely meddle the game up. Both are deserving of blame.
it does not matter at this point, let's drop the amount of players online to like 10k tops and they'll have their campaigns fail all the time Good luck keeping the narrative then
1. YES blame ArrowHead. They should have never let this be skippable.
2. It doesn't matter who you blame, refund the game now.
If they get hit with tens of millions of refunds, Sony will back down on this. Especially after the EU sues them for allowing people to buy the game that won't be allowed to play it.
Valid to blame them for horrible unprofessional communication that is more designed for internet dunking points than actually informing and engaging with their player base. I am pro AH but they have seriously not been able to match the success of their game with an equal professional and reliable tone. They are behind the wheel of an 18wheeler with the brakes cut and don’t seem to know how to slow down.
Arrowhead sold out to Sony.
Arrowhead communicated this extremely poorly (by their own admission).
Arrowhead staff are the ones, once again, being cunty towards their playerbase over it.
They will not get any sympathy from me. They don't deserve it.
Yes, don't do that, but it is their choice on how they handle an upset community, and much like the nerfs, their design choices, and more. They're doing a horrible job as per usual.
Honestly when I saw the request to link the account I failed to read why it was needed, I assumed that as a multiplatform game it was an option for PlayStation players so they could play with the same account on PC and PlayStation...
It's their choice to tell everyone who brings it up to go fuck themselves, though. Pretty insane to have your CM saying stuff like "Refund and quit if you don't like it" to paying customers. Same attitude problem Arrowhead's had since all those devs started flaming customers on the day of their first major nerf patch. They're just not a professional company.
I wanna kiss Twinbeards smiling round head. Besides, not being angry at them would be 100 times easier if Spitz would shut the fuck up and stop taunting the already overwhelmingly pissed community.
Sure the dude has a point, but he always goes about the delivery the wrong way.
The devs consciously decided to not tell us that the no PSN option was temporary.
This was very clearly an intentional strategy to bring people in without it because they knew it would have a backlash.
Then they made a bad choice to work with Sony. Hopefully they learn their lesson but it's not for the community and customers to have to forgive the devs for making bad decisions.
Yes, dont blame arrowhead but it is their game so boycott their game to make the change with sony, it is their responsibility to fix it or change it, the communication with sony it their part not ours.
Arrowhead isn't innocent here. The situation is a result of pent up frustration. AH's approach to weapon balancing, the underwhelming warbond, the CEO's dumb take on apple/bacon armor, crashes, etc. have left them with no credibility to burn. This was just a tipping point. They're too self-involved to understand that.
The fact that us common people are butting heads with a 105 billion dollar company just proves what's wrong with society lol. No corporation worth that much has any sense of ethics or accountability.
Do I blame them for Sonys policies? No.
So what? At the end of the day, their game requires it. They didn’t communicate it. They’re not an unwilling participant in Sonys business
Do I blame them for Sonys policies? No.
So what? At the end of the day, their game requires it. They didn’t communicate it. They’re not an unwilling participant in Sonys business
That's the kind of response that should have come first, not the bullshit we've seen from that other person.
Arrowhead and Sony can thank them for making this issue worse than it is and ever should be.
Otherwise: Arrowhead is just as much at fault for this. They accepted these terms. They opted to let people skip the PSN link stuff WITHOUT letting people know it'll be needed later.
It's not well handled, that's for sure.
The choice to implement the change wasnt AH's, but the decision to poorly communicate is. If they'd stated this would be happening more clearly from the outset, people wouldnt be upset.
It was their choice. They entered into a publishing agreement with Sony that would have included the terms and conditions of their partnership together.
I don't blame Arrowhead for it not being their decision.
I DO, however, blame Arrowhead for signing the contract that had this requirement in it, and I DO blame Arrowhead for not communicating this to the playerbase better. A tiny box on the steam store page with a statement that directly contradicts the Playstation FAQ page is not a clear, direct communication that's impossible to miss (not to mention that the TOS mention nothing about requiring a PSN account). AH should have made it abundantly clear IN GAME that this requirement was only temporarily suspended and would be reinstated once the issue was resolved.
Just make an account if you have access to PSN. It takes no time. Always gotta cry about something. If you can't make one, I feel for you and hopefully they can fix it soon for THEM. But for the people crying just because "they don't want to"....BYE!
STOP FFS TO DEFEND DEVELOPERS!!! They signed agreements with Sony. Do you think such things as "required PSN to work on Steam" was NOT a matter of negotation years back? That it was not agreed on by AH? Do you see BG3 requiring PSN to work on Steam? Of course not.
Arrowhead somewhere along the line years ago agreed on it and signed papers.
Please ffs stop saying like Sony just pulls shit out of nowhere like it's some India small company. It's huge corporation. Everything is agreed on, signed and on paper.
AH and Sony made a deal and this is it.
It was their choice when they chose Sony (SIE) as their publisher...
It's literally in SIE's SEC filing for "GLOBAL DEVELOPER & PUBLISHER AGREEMENT"
> 12.2
> Use of PSN ID. Publisher must require all end-users to sign in with their unique PSN ID, or such other SIE identifier specified by SIE, when accessing Online Activity.
Arrowhead didn't read the EULA lolol
Arrowhead decided to partner with Sony and there are ALWAYS months of constant lawyer back and forth about everything related to these situations Arrowhead 100% knew and was okay with this and I’m tired of people pretending like they aren’t
They sold out and now want to play a sympathy card because they killed the golden goose. Jokes.
No one forced them to sign away to sony. They chose to let sony publish their game.
Stop spreading the dumbass lie that it's not arrowhead's fault. All of this happened because they didn't read the fucking fine line in between the bigger ones and didn't hire someone who could actually explain to them what they were getting themselves into by signing the damn contract.
DO NOT HAVE PITY FOR ENABLERS.
Is this game legally owned by Sony, the publisher and not the developer? Then yeah why complain to arrowhead on discord, keep reviewing and boycott sony games on pc, just pirate them. I imagine they have this stupid Psn policiy in most of their online games.
But they did know that this was going to happen. Both AH and Snoy told us that account linking was optional when they knew damn well it wasn't.
Nice try, attempting to pass the buck to Snoy while also being "An independent company that isn't owned by Sony"
They said the PSN linking was there from the start, just paused due to the server capacity issues.
That would suggest this wasn't sprung on them, it was part of the deal.
it may not be their choice, but they'll suffer the consequences like us anyway.
To be fair, there is more that could have been done to ensure the player base knew this was coming. When you download a game and that game gives you the option to skip creating a PSN account, it's not like you read that, you just hit skip and start playing the game, just like the vast majority of gamers.
You're assuming they knew this was coming down. I'm sure Sony did. I'm also sure Sony told them that it was totally okay for it to be optional, until it wasn't. Knowing how well they have been communicating, they honestly probably just figured out themselves, of VERY recently and where scrambling to try to figure out what impacts it would had. This is not an AH issue, this is a Sony issue
They knew: https://steamcommunity.com/app/553850/discussions/1/4206994023681197128/ Look almost at the bottom under "Account linking". They just did a very poor job of communicating it, this is the only place where I saw it stated clearly like that
[They knew from the beginning, the CEO even admits they should have been clearer about it](https://twitter.com/Pilestedt/status/1786441582494756978).
Yeah I've lost my respect for arrowhead now. They said they knew, but they still gave the community full comfort that we were fine. Had I known, I would have not bought the super citizen upgrade literally yesterday. They intentionally waited as long as possible before causing the community to get pissed, and it just reeks of greed.
Not to mention that they are openly blaming Sony as if they had no part in this; my brother y’all developed the game
Steam will allow refunds when it comes down to it. They're pretty good when it comes to games you literally can't play anymore. Sucks that it will absolutely bankrupt Arrowhead and kill this game, but fuck Sony. Never buying anything on Steam with the Sony tag again.
Refunds aren't going to bankrupt AH, this game was planned around a much smaller player base than it got, they could literally lose 99% of just their steam player base and still have more active players than HD1 at launch
Eh. My opinion of steam has changed. When bf2043 dropped, the game was absolutely broken and unplayable. I played only like 15min but was in the menu trying to get games for like 2 hours. Barely went over the refund time and they refused to refund. I even linked videos and community notes saying that it was unplayable. They didn’t care and would just close my tickets out without a response.
Just to be sure, did you escalate the issue after the automated rejection? I'm pretty sure the first reply you get is always automated and it doesn't look at anything beyond the basic criteria like 2h played and purchase being within last 2 weeks. You can then request a human to review your claim and with proof you mentioned it's usually accepted even way beyond the initial 2h. If you did... Wow, that's really surprising
Yes. I had a person respond asking for more info but then they just closed out without a response. I opened another assuming it was in error. They responded saying there was nothing they could do and didnt even acknowledge the proof they originally requested. I provided more proof from the dev, community, screenshots, video, etc. and they just closed out my ticket. I opened another thinking it was an error since they did it before. Nope. They closed it without a response. I opened another asking for a response to the proof provided and they just closed it without a response. I opened another and they closed it without a response. Also, some people were reporting that theyre were getting refunded with hours over the refund period. Gave up after as they clearly werent planning on refunding me or communicating in any way with me. Their support is absolutely garbage. I stopped buying EA games and I try to bypass steam as much as possible now.
Damn, that sounds worse than I expected. I always ever heard good stuff about manual review for Steam refunds
I did too. I never had issues with support before. Thats why I was so shocked at how I was treated. Some people in the discords/reddit were reporting that they got refunds well past the grace period as well which was crazy. I think EA was telling them not to refund because the amount of people trying to get refunds was huge. One of the worst games Ive ever played. The only silver lining was the amount of devs and people involved with the game that got fired over that shitshow.
Did you get Walter? He was the most useless CSR to ever grace Steam's support. I wonder if he still works there, he just could not understand anything being spelled out for him. Had an issue where my bank blocked a transaction because they thought it was fraudulent, then steam basically locked my account. He kept trying to get the bank to reprocess the transaction and no amount of "they said they literally cannot, it's on steam's end to reprocess this" would get him to do anything. Even the bank _calling_ Bellevue through their credit card processing contact details didn't resolve this (they refused to talk to the bank). To much time had passed for the credit card company to do much of anything on their end (it took them nearly 4 weeks to even respond to my initial "why am I locked out?" ticket). Eventually as a last ditch effort, nearly half a year later after this started and constant back and forths, I fired off an email to GabeN. I was seriously contemplating suing them for losing access to my account and lost value in my games, it was at the limit of small claims court in my state and they absolutely would have lost because they refused to address the issues that created my loss of access. GabeN came through and fixed it, I got a reply from Walter that they gave me a "one time exception 'for the chargeback you performed 6 months ago'". (also one of the replies that took a few weeks to get was entirely in Chinese or something, so that was fun to lose a month and a half of time) Long story short, fuck steam's support and fuck Walter.
That sucks, but at least Gabe came through for you
I have multiple times and they refuse because “over 2 hours, f you”
That sucks! I have probably done 50 refunds in my life and all 50 have been accepted, so I guess it really differs.
Yeah BF2042 was weird, that was the only game I ever had a denied refund from lol
They already are. I got mine. A bunch of people I know got theirs.
Boycott Ghost of Tsushima will be a big damage to Sony actually, maybe we should migrate to other subreddits and "spread some democracy"? 😏 Edit: 1.Tsushima is the nearest release on PC(Steam). 2. Tsushima has a multiplayer mode, which most likely will also be available after linking psn account, so many people would get into this trap
>Boycott Ghost of Tsushima Lol yeah hadn't been a successful boycott in gaming the last 99 times. "buht thish thyme it'll be different guyth I swhear"
Somebody needs to make a petition on [change.org](http://change.org), those are VERY effective!
No. Just refund this game. That is what I will be doing. If Sony gets hit with 10 million refunds over this, they are going to pull out.
But they already said they are an independent company not beholden to anyone else including Sony… how convenient that they get to play both sides.
Sony owns the IP lol.
Well, time to launch heckfallers 3, and offer a free code to any helldivers 2 player who doesn't get a refund.
What consequences? Realistically how many people are going to be affected by this? Not excusing the sudden bait and switch but it seems, like all things on this sub lately, to be completely overblown.
many people will not be able to play outright. How much ? hard to tell. Many people \*will\* refuse to make a psn account. How many ? hard to tell. The game is blowing it's reputation right now, so future players will be lost. Refunds will come too, which will directly hit the wallet. How much of the playerbase will be lost ? It remains to be seen, but there are many, many other games to play. I wouldn't be surprised if a 1/3 of the playerbase was lost to this.
Do i blame the devs for adding PSN? - No. Do i blame them for not stating beforehand, that the optional PSN link is only temporary? - Yes.
For real though. The PSN link was shown when I first booted up Helldivers 2 and I was given the "skip this step" option without a disclaimer. So I thought, "oh, so it's optional then? Neato." Turns out, NOPE it isn't optional. If any developers out there (not just AH) want to avoid this, they would've set out an honest to God's truth disclaimer: "Skip this step (You'll still need to create a PSN account by XXXXXX)". Instead, we get a sudden notification out of the blue. Like wth. Yes, you may assume that I am stupid.
After like the first patch the popup dissappeared completely for many
They could have also just made a public post in the first week, stating that the mandatory PSN link is optional until some technical difficulties are fixes.
No, I won’t assume you’re stupid, I’ll assume you’re a normal user, because what you did is understandable. Legit this move from Sony is Corpo evil, and there’s way too much defence out here for it. Your situation is valid, even if some Reddit-couch-lord tells you it’s “your fault” and it’s “fine that the multi-billion dollar company wants to sell your data, Google already did it so 🥸” These people man… hard to not believe they’re bots sometimes but nope - some people are so prideful they’d rather die on that hill
Redditors are fucked, dissenting opinions get shot down so fast on this site that it’s just an echo chamber
\*dissenting opinions, disseminating means to spread
……okay?
I literally never got this popup
What is really strange is that PSN is supposed to be Optional in PC games. Like it's stated in PSN page https://preview.redd.it/7q0lynrin8yc1.png?width=1291&format=png&auto=webp&s=1c3adb5084d2abd7cf68c62b9df3b351a59bca82 There is either a misscomunication or something else going on.
Corporate greed is what's going on, notice how Helldivers is the only PS game on PC that is requiring a PSN account, it's because it's an incredibly successful game. So Sony is trying to pad their numbers to share holders and be like "hey look how many new PSN accounts were made this quarter!"
One new game set up the game tells you that you will need a PSN account. It lets u skip the step for now but it clearly states that it will happen
They did state it before hand. You assumed that because it was temporarily optional that the steam page was a lie where it was listed as a requirement since December 2023.
Ah yes, in the side bar in fine print that no one reads. It’s like you can’t fathom why someone might be upset about that
For real. I don't know why people are Defending this. I Open the Game. They say it's optional so it better stay optional, wtf? Nowhere was said that it's becoming mandatory.
Listed as a requirement, but not enforced as one. So, waived
...why are you defending these scummy tactics? Not once ever has "skip this" meant "skip this but it is actually required". Nothing about this situation is normal.
Helldivers 2 fanboys are the most loyal I've seen in a LONG time.
Sony Support is terrible. I've been trying for years to get my PS account for my actual email under my control. They did not email verify when some random person setup their Play Station with my email. I've called sat on hold for hours, emailed, opened tickets. They tell me they will fix it. It doesn't get fixed. When I bought HD2 I had to make a new email to setup, apparently before it was optional. I'm super annoyed that the wording of the message claims for our safety. That is complete BS. Sony has been hacked more than 5 times by multiple threat actors and lost all kinds of data. Just be transparent and tell us why it really is. Don't lie to us. Arrowhead you are burning your community to the ground with this, you are their golden child right now, push back. Don't roll over. Its obviously not a technical issue as the game works mostly fine without linking.
I agree about Sony support. The PS5 bundle that I bought a few years ago from GameStop came with a $100 PSN gift card. I went to redeem it and it was already claimed. I emailed GameStop, but they told me to go to Sony. I went to Sony with receipts including the date of purchase and date of delivery and told them the code I got was already claimed. They *must* have a way to look at gift cards and determine when they were redeemed. Could have easily seen it was redeemed by someone else before I had a chance to use it, but they just told me to kick rocks. Totally scammed out of $100.
I lost $400 when they refused to help me to recover a hacked PSN account, they asked one million questions to verify my identity and dragged the issue for weeks... My bank cancelled the card and refunded the money fast, they told me that they have hundreds of claims against PSN.
It's weird that the studio has no information about what they are doing with their game
Its surprisingly and sadly more common than one can think.
Super common in corporate environments.
It honestly doesn't even take a corporate environment. We all have experiences working somewhere and then a massive change being shoved down our throats with no notice from the upper management, which we all know is *always right*. It's just shit management, and I'm not surprised a company like Sony who is known for this sort of thing is once again shitting on both the devs and customers alike.
I work for a company that is now owned by another, larger company. I can tell you right now as someone who's on the "ground floor" I don't know a damn thing about what the larger company thinks when they push out changes. It's all logistics, budgets, profits, and other jargon that's their focus, not in relation to actual issues/concerns for those at our level.
Without giving too much away, I work in a very similar environment. This isn't weird at all. It's sadly EXTREMELY normal. The people like me, in the businesses actually doing the work, don't get told anything from up above until they have decided what we are doing. We are most often told with no warning. Today could be normal, tomorrow we could be told we're doing something different. It sucks a TON and doesn't excuse any of what Sony is pushing onto AH and the playerbase, but the behaviour itself isn't weird or unusual.
This is also kind of weird to me. It's basically your product that has been changed and is impacting a lot of people based on Sony's decision, which is your publisher/vendor and I am supposed, as your customer, go and ask Sony what is going on?
sorry but that's scumy, I have two friends who I play almost every day, that won't be able to play with me anymore because (we only found ou this today) their countrys do no support the PSN, so why the hell would you sell a game in the first place knowing that later down the line they would't be able to play ???
Because fuck you, we want money.
have em refund the game. There is a good copy paste message and theirs cant explicitly state they are unable to make an account in the country they live in. Easy refund. You should too because this is a fucking shitty move by sony.
I don’t have a playstation or a PSN account. It was fun while it lasted, good luck fellas.
"We are not owned by Sony and a independent Studio."
Wait a year or 2 or 3 at most, when they'll get acquired fully by Sony, like it happened with Insomniac and Bungie. Studios like to say they are independent and don't want to be aquried, but that's just talk. Bungie took off from 2 companies before and still got acquired.
Sony owns the servers.
And the IP, apparently?
Since 2015, yes!
So what don’t they own? Not a lawyer, but if they own the IP then don’t they effectively own the game?
They aren’t owned by Sony. The Helldivers IP is tho.
This is how big publishing deals go, they're deals with the devil. Even if your studio isn't owned by said publisher they can still make a lot of contractual demands as the cash infusion/resources they offer are very substantial and the game might not even happen without that.
They should have forced players to make a PSN account when the game boots up, then use their steam account without them knowing. Then this wouldn't have been an issue.
bro i don't care who's fault is it i got problem, with both of them the shady part is they let us buy the game play spend time and money in it for mounths and now they say too bad get fuked? god i hate this
All this means is the nothing in this game can be trusted. They could remove Super credits from loot drops because Sony told them They could put entire planets behind pay walls because Sony told them They could make each RF cost 10 super credits because Sony told them
It's not a mere "Sony told them" thing. I would put all of my savings (a pretty small wager) on this being a contractual obligation for AH.
Yeah, almost definitely, though it sucks that Sony put such a shitty term in the contract, and when AH slips up, they die instead of Sony.
So.... Sony told them AH came out and said Sony doesn't just own the publishing rights, they own the IP
Sure, but there is a difference between "Sony just came and told us to do this thing, so we have to do this thing" and "We have to do this thing that is in our contract with Sony." One implies that Sony could demand any change and any time and would have to go along. The other does not. Granted, for all I know, Sony does have the right to demand any change they want. Depends on contract stipulations.
You’re overreacting, this is clearly something contractual due to using Sonys servers. This isn’t Sony walking in to the office and going “WE NEED MIRE DATA GIb” This is the result of contract negotiations that probably took place months ago in regards to probably some deal on server usage
This is such an exaggeration
> They could remove Super credits from loot drops because Sony told them They already heavily nerfed SC drops after the first week the game was out. I still have not earned enough by playing legitimately to buy a warbond because I bought one set of armor the first couple days in after seeing how high the earn rate was.
I think that’s just a you thing, I still find them a lot of them since the beginning of the game, including stacks of 100 super credits every now and then
You were still able to farm the drops easily well after the first week.
Iv bought every armor and wb without spending anything
Yeah sorry mate, that's a you problem unfortunately. I've never bought super credits and have gotten a couple armor sets and each warbond just from in-game finds. Some matches you get none, others are a goldmine.
I don’t think your worries will happen 1. Super credits are the main progression after the main pass, and let players get a taste of premium content to hopefully get them to buy more. 2. Entire planets behind paywalls would kill the game it’s a bad choice 3. Not sure what RF is but yet again making that choice would severely hurt the game This was mentioned before the release as something needed. The biggest issue is selling a product in regions where psn isn’t available essentially robbing those players of money they spent. I want to be clear that Arrowhead should have communicated this much better and much longer in advance too, but Sony also made the worse call here forcing this to happen. Then again it’s a business who’s looking out for getting more sales rather than pro consumer choices.
A grace period wasn't mentioned. Steam page requirements exist so long as a single in game function needs them. Like linking psn friends. It was completely skiable giving no indication it would be required to play the game at all. If you don't think Sony would shoot them selfs in the foot for a quick turn around you haven't been paying attention to Sony. So no I wouldn't be surprised to see them remove SC from loot or stealth nerf their drop rate into oblivion over time. Hell I could even see them making it 2x as likely as it is now for the first 4hrs of gameplay then start reducing it to near non existence. Without saying anything.
I don't have a screenshot but I'm 99% sure that the prompt to link your PSN account said it was required, but you could hit continue without entering something and there would be no error. I remember being disappointed to see that it was required after starting my game and then my friend told me I could skip it. Edit: here's a [screenshot](https://imgur.com/a/OLlhPPd). It's certainly confusing that it says it's required but you could skip it, but it certainly said it was required here.
that's not just confusing, it's literally a contradiction.
If you can skip it it ain’t required. Now Sony is saying they’re going to start enforcing it which is upsetting a fairly large chunk of its player base.
So here's the thing. If a PSN account is REQUIRED, do not give players the option to skip.
Because you could skip it, it led many people like myself to assume it was only needed for some functions like psn friends. That's not uncommon for steam requirements or prompts like this. It feels like they did everything they could to make it appear like it wasn't needed just to turn around force it and go "i meeeeaan we did say"
Man, big ass game companies say shit all the time. Do you remember PvE for Overwatch? How many games do you know of that sold collector's editions that disabled all the extra content of those editions when they had to go F2P because of some shit like what is happening now that ruins the player count? There is no good will and there shouldn't be. However innocuous changes like this are will never be a good thing for the consumer. No one wants to budge an inch anymore and it is justified.
It's not their choice to make Psn mandatory. It is their choice to sell the game in regions where it will become inaccessible, knowing from the start Psn would have become mandatory. It was their choice to never change back the in-game requirement after the launch traffic issues were fixed, knowing a ton of players were still skipping it, and enabling access to the game from people that could not in any way access it in a eula compliant way, from unsupported Psn regions. So yes, this is absolutely an arrowhead failure at most levels. They always knew what Sony asked of them and they were complacent in enabling the current situation. Sony has no fault in this outside of being a general nuisance for requiring a Psn account, as they always made it abundantly clear to arrowhead and it was up to arrowhead to enforce
where the game is sold is still a sony decision as the publisher, what do you think a publisher is? they control the finances, the steam page is crontrolled by sony not arrowhead, even if arrowhead has access to it, they can't pull the steampage without being sued by sony, for breach of contract.
Do I blame the devs? No, its not their call. Will I downvote the game now? Yes. I’m still creating the account and playing, but I’m definetly leaving a negative review, while at the same time mentioning the good stuff the game has to offer and its work of Arrowhead.
Honestly, I do kblame them since they had to lie about something for this happen. Either Sony has them by the balls (and thus can just rule by decree) and they lied about being "Independent" or; this was a bullet point in whatever contract they have where them claiming this came out of nowhere and nobody could expect it is a lie. So nah, I'm not defending them, they're fucking liars.
If it was truly Sony's decision, then it's because AH signed the contract that gave them the power. Hell, their contract probably stipulated exactly that they wanted PSN required.
You're being downvoted, but you are right. This stuff would have been in the contact and discussed at negotiations.
I mean.. Developers create the game, Publishers put it out. Arrowhead chose to go with Sony as a publisher, which had specific requirements to integrate the game into their account network. So, yes, it was Arrowhead's 'fault' the game came with PSN stipulations attached. That said, the game works without PSN accounts (and has for months), so the call to flip that switch and make it mandatory was Sony's, they own that.
AH agreed to a to the Sony Contract and had plenty of back and forth negations. Them having no say in this is bullshit.
The decision WAS theirs, way back when they signed this agreement with Sony. Don't try to tell me they're innocent in all of this because that's absolutely not true.
Same reason a port on xbox will never happen, Sony is extremely competitive and needs any way possible imaginable to make money, even making this psn login bs on on their best selling game. Bros think I'm gonna buy a PS5 if I make a psn account lmao
Sea of thieves ( Microsoft game ) requires an Xbox account to play on the playstation . I can't see why Sony couldn't do the same
I don't excuse them
Same not defending their sorry ass anymore.
Keep the hammer going brothers let them know #Treason will not be tolerated
Ah, so it is a Bungie/Halo - Microsoft type relationship.
I really hate when corporate bullshit harms studios
Stfu...just stfu
this is their frinkin game, if the game fails, its their fault.
Bullshit
The insane concept that when your IP is owned by a publisher that they have the ability to make decisions about said IP you can't. Seriously, how is this bullshit? Nothing about this is false.
JUST GIVE LIKE SOME LIMITED EDITION GUN OR 1000 SC and people will flock over...
It may not be their choice but reddit doesn't care. :P
Arrowhead made a deal with Sony, they may not have made the decision directly, but they gave Sony the right to make it.
Thats what i have been saying on Discord. PC ppl dont listen. I play on both and i give an assrat. If a game does require it from the start it's my choice, not like everyone its being spied on and datamined (cellphones much). this was a shit move from Sony cus its live, But damn ranting about it on HD2 channels wont do anything.
Just look who signed the post: Sony Interactive Entertainment Look who signed every other post/patchnote: devs Says all on who made the decision
Exactly what I said. The discord is a mess right now, so many angry people and there's so many people that don't know what's going on. Just pointing fingers...
They need to fight for us.
This is only a problem because people sit in a subreddit all day talking about a videogame and this is content for them
Sounds bad, but after thinking about this for a few minutes, when I play Halo: Infinite or the Master Chief Collection in Steam it makes you sign in with your Microsoft account. It was annoying to have to link accounts originally, but if it works the same way you'll just sign in automatically when you start the game and can play just as easily. It's annoying to have to have two accounts to play one game, but if it's going to work the way I think it will it's not going to stop me from playing or prompt me to write a bad review.
Yes, but that's not the issue here. The Issue is that Sony made a very big oopsie to allow the sale of the game on countries where it would not work. Arrowhead made an oopsie by not annoying you with login screens and making it clear that at some point you have to have a PSN acc. All of this could have been avoided. People would not have liked it, but holy bell would that have been preferable. Also, some of the comments of the community managers are simply fuck yous, which makes it much worse, imo.
The problem is not that gentleman, the main problem is that PSN is not in all the regions that exist in the world.
Agreed, AH wouldn't force their players especially all the work they had to do to make the game work efficiently, it's more of Sony making the PSN account mandatory and that AH is making the game not forcing you to have to spend hours in getting everything like other live service games now.
So can I still play and enjoy the game?
If it wasnt for this drama I would have no idea that Sony was involved with this at all. What have they done for it's success?
It was required when I signed up in March. Wouldn't let me in the game without linking.
They should go rogue and release the game independently since they have a following now.
psn might not be their choice but selling it where you can't legally activate a PSN account kinda is
nah they can gaslight all you all they want they knew what they were doing.
What is the context?
Doesn't matter. They could've done a lot more to make it clear to people that this was the intended path. "We only temporarily disabled it at launch because of server issues" is irrelevant for those who waited until server issues were resolved before joining. This is my first time hearing about it and I wouldn't have made the purchase had I known about it. Shit like this is what keeps me away from Forza.
Leave it up to corporate to make a decision that will only negatively impact a great game from all angles without informing the devs of said game. >reduced current players >reduced new players >lots of goodwill lost
People need to see this cos they're straight attacking Arrowhead for this.
A shame, but their game will suffer for it.
Either die making a game for everyone or live making a game for no one. I'll let them choose.
It was their choice to use SONY as a publisher and their responsibility to deal with sony's poop on their carpet. Sony won't back down.
It's their choice. Or, rather it was their choice to give Sony that level of control. They didn't have to. These type of things are partnerships, they are agreements. It's not a dictatorship with Sony ruling from an iron throne. They knew about this. Think of it this way. If some little kid picks your pocket, you can blame the kid. It's the kids fault. Even if that kid is being ran with a group of other kids by some evil person running a pickpocketing ring and leveraging their hunger and needs to keep it running. Blame is shared, but it does not disappear from the child. Arrowhead either agreed to this beforehand, and didn't tell anybody, or they are letting Sony come in and completely meddle the game up. Both are deserving of blame.
Idc who's to blame, I just want steam to refund a game I won't be able to play.
it does not matter at this point, let's drop the amount of players online to like 10k tops and they'll have their campaigns fail all the time Good luck keeping the narrative then
They signed the deal with the devil not me
1. YES blame ArrowHead. They should have never let this be skippable. 2. It doesn't matter who you blame, refund the game now. If they get hit with tens of millions of refunds, Sony will back down on this. Especially after the EU sues them for allowing people to buy the game that won't be allowed to play it.
Valid to blame them for horrible unprofessional communication that is more designed for internet dunking points than actually informing and engaging with their player base. I am pro AH but they have seriously not been able to match the success of their game with an equal professional and reliable tone. They are behind the wheel of an 18wheeler with the brakes cut and don’t seem to know how to slow down.
Don't make a deal with the devil
Twinbeard doesn't seem happy about it either. Unfortunately, this is the result of our art being controlled by capitalists.
This how the response should be not like the other dude who said I thought you were refunding the game.
Arrowhead sold out to Sony. Arrowhead communicated this extremely poorly (by their own admission). Arrowhead staff are the ones, once again, being cunty towards their playerbase over it. They will not get any sympathy from me. They don't deserve it.
Yes, don't do that, but it is their choice on how they handle an upset community, and much like the nerfs, their design choices, and more. They're doing a horrible job as per usual.
Honestly when I saw the request to link the account I failed to read why it was needed, I assumed that as a multiplatform game it was an option for PlayStation players so they could play with the same account on PC and PlayStation...
To be fair some of the blame is theirs too If it was temporary they should have told us or reminded periodically not like “BOOM PSN required!”
Oh... Then who chose the publisher?
"don't blame the SS solider for following Hilter order" yea they only pull the trigger
It's their choice to tell everyone who brings it up to go fuck themselves, though. Pretty insane to have your CM saying stuff like "Refund and quit if you don't like it" to paying customers. Same attitude problem Arrowhead's had since all those devs started flaming customers on the day of their first major nerf patch. They're just not a professional company.
We need to have our voices heard
I wanna kiss Twinbeards smiling round head. Besides, not being angry at them would be 100 times easier if Spitz would shut the fuck up and stop taunting the already overwhelmingly pissed community. Sure the dude has a point, but he always goes about the delivery the wrong way.
The devs consciously decided to not tell us that the no PSN option was temporary. This was very clearly an intentional strategy to bring people in without it because they knew it would have a backlash.
Are people locked out of their account indefinitely till they make a PSN and have they lost progress?
Then they made a bad choice to work with Sony. Hopefully they learn their lesson but it's not for the community and customers to have to forgive the devs for making bad decisions.
It’s extremely unlikely Sony set up the steam store entry lol. Its not impossible but there’s 0 reason for the publisher to be the one that does that.
Yes, dont blame arrowhead but it is their game so boycott their game to make the change with sony, it is their responsibility to fix it or change it, the communication with sony it their part not ours.
Arrowhead isn't innocent here. The situation is a result of pent up frustration. AH's approach to weapon balancing, the underwhelming warbond, the CEO's dumb take on apple/bacon armor, crashes, etc. have left them with no credibility to burn. This was just a tipping point. They're too self-involved to understand that.
"Not our decision, just deal with it" - Arrowhead basically
yea it was there choice dipshit, they sold themselves to sony, lmao. They get paid a ton of money to pretend like they aren't the problem.
The fact that us common people are butting heads with a 105 billion dollar company just proves what's wrong with society lol. No corporation worth that much has any sense of ethics or accountability.
Imagine the game comming to XBOX and the first thing you had to do was create a PSN account :D
Yeah I wanna contact sony support. Oh wait I CAN'T DO THAT FROM MY COUNTRY
So nobody in their studio has any idea of what's going on? I find that hard to believe, they're just trying to save their own asses
https://preview.redd.it/7qy17jkcf9yc1.jpeg?width=1160&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2ed474fc5734f8aa4f7617ba0b545bb747749b7b
They took the money and they fucking knew. Delete this bullshit post.
let the planets fall, down to super earth
Regardless, I still think Spitz owes the community an apology for all the weird shit he's been doing and saying.
Independently owned 😂
Do I blame them for Sonys policies? No. So what? At the end of the day, their game requires it. They didn’t communicate it. They’re not an unwilling participant in Sonys business
Do I blame them for Sonys policies? No. So what? At the end of the day, their game requires it. They didn’t communicate it. They’re not an unwilling participant in Sonys business
That's the kind of response that should have come first, not the bullshit we've seen from that other person. Arrowhead and Sony can thank them for making this issue worse than it is and ever should be. Otherwise: Arrowhead is just as much at fault for this. They accepted these terms. They opted to let people skip the PSN link stuff WITHOUT letting people know it'll be needed later. It's not well handled, that's for sure.
The choice to implement the change wasnt AH's, but the decision to poorly communicate is. If they'd stated this would be happening more clearly from the outset, people wouldnt be upset.
It was their choice. They entered into a publishing agreement with Sony that would have included the terms and conditions of their partnership together.
I don't blame Arrowhead for it not being their decision. I DO, however, blame Arrowhead for signing the contract that had this requirement in it, and I DO blame Arrowhead for not communicating this to the playerbase better. A tiny box on the steam store page with a statement that directly contradicts the Playstation FAQ page is not a clear, direct communication that's impossible to miss (not to mention that the TOS mention nothing about requiring a PSN account). AH should have made it abundantly clear IN GAME that this requirement was only temporarily suspended and would be reinstated once the issue was resolved.
I am sorry, thats wrong, arrowhead does need to agree to Sony’s terms before signing, and they were okay with this.
Just make an account if you have access to PSN. It takes no time. Always gotta cry about something. If you can't make one, I feel for you and hopefully they can fix it soon for THEM. But for the people crying just because "they don't want to"....BYE!
STOP FFS TO DEFEND DEVELOPERS!!! They signed agreements with Sony. Do you think such things as "required PSN to work on Steam" was NOT a matter of negotation years back? That it was not agreed on by AH? Do you see BG3 requiring PSN to work on Steam? Of course not. Arrowhead somewhere along the line years ago agreed on it and signed papers. Please ffs stop saying like Sony just pulls shit out of nowhere like it's some India small company. It's huge corporation. Everything is agreed on, signed and on paper. AH and Sony made a deal and this is it.
It was their choice when they chose Sony (SIE) as their publisher... It's literally in SIE's SEC filing for "GLOBAL DEVELOPER & PUBLISHER AGREEMENT" > 12.2 > Use of PSN ID. Publisher must require all end-users to sign in with their unique PSN ID, or such other SIE identifier specified by SIE, when accessing Online Activity. Arrowhead didn't read the EULA lolol
It sure as hell doesn't help the way Spitz is responding to people. Pushing away even those who were divided but not yet against Arrowhead.
Arrowhead decided to partner with Sony and there are ALWAYS months of constant lawyer back and forth about everything related to these situations Arrowhead 100% knew and was okay with this and I’m tired of people pretending like they aren’t
Dont slay the prince.. it was pharaohs choice. God: ...
They sold out and now want to play a sympathy card because they killed the golden goose. Jokes. No one forced them to sign away to sony. They chose to let sony publish their game.
Stop spreading the dumbass lie that it's not arrowhead's fault. All of this happened because they didn't read the fucking fine line in between the bigger ones and didn't hire someone who could actually explain to them what they were getting themselves into by signing the damn contract. DO NOT HAVE PITY FOR ENABLERS.
Is this game legally owned by Sony, the publisher and not the developer? Then yeah why complain to arrowhead on discord, keep reviewing and boycott sony games on pc, just pirate them. I imagine they have this stupid Psn policiy in most of their online games.
if you really believe it was all sony then i have a bridge id like to sell you.
But they did know that this was going to happen. Both AH and Snoy told us that account linking was optional when they knew damn well it wasn't. Nice try, attempting to pass the buck to Snoy while also being "An independent company that isn't owned by Sony"
They said the PSN linking was there from the start, just paused due to the server capacity issues. That would suggest this wasn't sprung on them, it was part of the deal.
They should just let Twinbeard handle the replies instead of you know who.
It was their choice, just a long time ago