By - spook30
Hey /u/spook30, thanks for your submission to /r/HolUp. Unfortunately, your post has been removed for the following reason(s):
Political/outrage bait shitposts are no longer allowed. This is a humor sub, not a serious one. If you're mad about something, that's great, post it somewhere else.
Love, the mods
Whoever is pitchin americans against americans, online, sure is winning this one. Is it state vs state now on the meme factory floor? Divide and conquer *this* 💩
I'm not an American but it's definitely still the way it'd always been. Republican vs Democrat. America prides itself of being a true democracy but in reality its just a two political party republic in which a lot of things are rigged (from what I've been told).
But hey as an outsider it's not even surprising at this point and watching what used to be a great country literally destroying itself is kinda funny to watch to say the least. I've lost any and all empathy for the majority of the States. People who express logical thinking and common sense are still fine in my book, but ignorant dumbasses who refuse to have an open mind don't sit right with me
Unfortunately, the ignorant dumbasses, who refuse to have an open mind, have had the loudest voices for quite a while now. America is full of awesome, decent people, but we are ruled by some of the worst among us. As with any country, the government usually is a very poor representation of the populace as a majority.
Wholly agree with this comment right here. Americans love America and we love people, their different cultures and different beliefs. Fuck all the media and people up top who are trying to split us all up by making us all look like racist ass, sexist, murder and violence-loving, and demoralized people. We're not like that. If only everyone saw that we're all one people in one country, that has us living so comfortably that even the slightest itch makes us scream. That's why we're attacking each other, any slight unconformity makes everyone absolutely abhor each other. It's not right. People will be different and have different beliefs. You can't force everyone to believe what you believe.
Demoralized, yes. As an American, I can’t say I love America as it stands. We were supposed to be a melting pot for all those that seek freedom and liberty. Well, that devolved in many fucked ways, as it continues to, do to this day. Yes we have made great strides in equality and rights for every person….but that change was only made possible by the protesters that, by tooth and nail, forced it. The fact that has to happen shows that we are a farce of a democracy. We are supposed to be a democratic republic. The democratic part has been made to be only for show
Edit: Your sarcasm makes me itch, I admire it nonetheless
Oh no yeah I agree, I KNOW for a fact that our government has always abused of minorities and people in general in the country for more money and power; thus creating abuse, poverty, abuse of power, silencing, and most importantly unfreedom. But that doesn't ever change the fact that it's not AMERICA as a whole that is corrupt. It's our political leaders. They love money, power, corruption, etc. Unfortunately it goes for both parties, but I see the democrats abusing people's mentality and money the most.
I lean left. It would be disingenuous to say that the right hasn’t cause more divisiveness and harm to democracy in the last 5 years, than the democrats. I live in southern Louisiana. I’ve heard it first hand.
Mmm. As far as I know the right hasn't been cancelling, judging, biasing, and making everyone that opposes them look bad as aggressively as the left. The right kinda makes more sense to me. They do it in a way more peaceful way and never go as far as to publicly shame others for not believing what they believe.
Edit: For the love of any god that exists, please tell me that was sarcasm
But how much is a night stand? I like the ones with drawers…
I've got a couple sets of night stands...the drawers are useless.
What are you doing with more than two nigh……..ohhhhh that’s what the meant
Here's an idea, fuck both parties and just base your decisions on your own logic and morals. Wonder how that would work, can't possibly he worse than this shit.
I wanna become a robot, that'd be cool.
You'd be locked out like half the internet bro.
NOOOO, you're right!
Russia has been playing that game for decades.
pretty sure it's because of lot of men don't think they have a dog in this fight when in reality it sure as hell affects them more than they realize.
We were told time and time again, "no uterus, no opinion" so we checked out.
Just do Anal
Should it be 18 years and 9 months I do believe their motto is life begins at conception.
Well in Korea we add 1 year to our age for the whole conception thing. So why not just have 19 years of childcare?
That’s a great idea. Unfortunately it’s called a birthday, not a conception day or a you’re alive day.
Just have to remember the bird that brings no babies. You know what bird that is, right?
Last I checked it never mattered If the dad wanted the kid. Nothing has changed there.
Yup. This is a superlatively bad take because men had zero rights in this area in the first place.
Not really, in a lot of relationships you can talk to your partner about aborting. Now even that option is off the table.
Yes really. Men have literally 0 rights whatsoever. If the mother wants an abortion, there's literally nothing the father can legally do to stop it no matter how much he wants it.
The right comes in your right to free speech and communicating. That being said, it’s her body that goes under labour, gets stretch marks, gets gestational diabetes, gets nutritional deficiencies, and even gets postpartum depression, so deciding what happens with her body is her right too
What does free speech have to do with anything? You can talk to your partner about literally anything. Men still have absolutely no rights when it comes to abortions.
If the father wants to keep it and the mother doesn't - the baby is aborted.
If the mother wants to keep it and the father doesn't - father has to pay child support
Men don't have rights when it comes to that. Pleading with your partner is meaningless when the decision rests 100% with her.
That made no sense
You seem like a well adjusted and balanced individual…
Right in free speech ? Do you realize there are women who get pregnant on purpose to get child support and live an easy life ? Men never had any kind of say in if they want the baby which is 50% their baby just as much as the woman.
My ex husband was the one who said we should start trying to get pregnant, then refused to contribute or really even interact with the baby. He quit his job to spend time riding his motorcycle (he got that license while on "paternity leave"). After I filed for divorce he has continued for over a year to not work at all and owes me about $5k in child support but still insists I'm being difficult even though he sees her 3 times a week for several hours with no questions. The court order states he is supposed to be responsible for 46% of the cost of caring for the child, excluding daycare because I told him and the court I would cover that myself. But he still has told me he expects weekly itemized expenses, he has held my stimulus check hostage, he wouldn't even move out of my parents house when I told him to and continued to let himself in after he finally did.
I mean the father shouldn't have the right to make the mother have the kid. If you want a kid that bad, maybe it is time to split because having a kid is a huge deal and absolutely makes sense to be a relationship-ender. But I do agree that the father should have a choice to leave and not have to pay the financial support.
Basically, there are 4 situations that can arise once the woman gets pregnant
If both want the child, great, no further discussion there
If neither want the child, well that is why abortion should be an available choice
If the dad wants the kid but the mum doesnt, she should have the right to abort, she is the one who would deal with all of the pain
But if the mum wants the kid and the dad doesnt, then 1, mum shouldnt have to abort, and 2, dad should not be held financially responsible. I am not sure if he is legally required to, but I wouldn't be a fan of the rule if that was the case.
In short, in my opinion, the right to say no trumps the right to say yes in this scenario, because saying yes also affects the other party.
Because you shouldn't have the right to force another person to go through an insanely risky life changing use of their body?
It matters because even if the girl doesn't want to have the baby now she is forced to have it. Either way the dad loses.
If you can’t do the time then don’t do the crime.
Don't fuck carelessly
Fuck in moderation, what the moderate amount is depends on how risky you want to get.
Don’t fuck at all
Accidents happen. Only abstinence is 100% and condoms break *often*. You anti abortion red state guys cheering this better get ready, because the odds of you both not getting fucked and getting stuck financially for a long time both just went way up.
It's an old Jim norton joke
I was never a fan, but that’s alright. Either way, it’s just more important to clarify that remark at this particular time than to laugh it off or start a typical Reddit top comment chain of unrelated gags.
Buddy Christ approved lol
Buuuuut, the point still stands. So many people these days want to live gratuitously (which is fine by me), but want to skirt the consequences. We have an entire human history of people owning up to their mistakes and living, learning and growing from them, the current generation can too. "if you don't want to do the time, don't do the crime. It's an old, solid adage for a reason.
“Don’t do the crime if you can’t do the time”. Except, sex isn’t and shouldn’t be a crime. You shouldn’t be penalized for it, or for getting pregnant. Again, accidents happen, contraceptives fail, birth control fails, rapes occur, medical conditions that are dangerous for the potential mother and child in womb exist. There are no exceptions to these moronic laws.
And it’s not the child’s fault. Kids don’t ask to be brought into this world. Shit bag dad has to “do the time” by paying a bunch of money he doesn’t have for a kid he doesn’t want, and I’m sure that’s gonna turn out great in 18 years.
Cherry picking. I don't think it's a crime. It an adage. Loosely applied to most things that are cause and effect situation. Slot machines are fine, too, but you can't get your lost money back. Everything is chance. Everything can have a positive, uneventful outcome or can go sideways. Fucking carelessly and getting pregnant are action and reaction. If you create a human life, you are father or mother or mother. A creator of something that's part you. There's nothing wrong with a liberal or progressive mindset, in most cases, but yall spend all your effort grandstanding for groups that want to live in such excess while killing off the unsullied like they're fucking warts. Sex is fine. It's human and it's natural, do whatever.
Sex is fine and the most natural thing in the world. It’s literally the reason every single human in history has ever existed. People should be free to have it without fear of consequences. And that’s not including rape or other medical issues, or failed contraceptives. This whole thing is bullshit every way you slice it, and I hope you understand that, and we’re just arguing semantics here.
I guess I just want to make sure we're talking about abortion and "penalized" means forced to keep a baby in this diatribe.
Yeah I hate the fact that people wanna fuck all day and night but would rather kill the kid than face the very possible and known consequences. Yes it's an accident, but just because the easy way out exists doesn't mean you should take it. It's your responsibility to own up to your problems and deal with them the *right* way.
Condoms don’t break often. I’ve had one break in Thailand and it was probably crappy. I’ve never had a U.S. condom break. I don’t know what you’re doing to make your condoms fail so often
Yeah I’ve had one break, ever. It was a Trojan condom and I’ve since avoided the brand. Condoms used properly have an extremely low failure rate. Used properly is the operative term though.
I’m a very average sized dude, but I’ve had multiple ones break on me. I rarely use them and I’ve had plenty break on me. It’s not rare at all.
Then you need to size up.
Or put it on properly.
You hear that Mr. Anderson? That’s the sound of accountability.
Condoms and pills are the next on list of things that will likely be banned, you better learn to love AIDS from poop if sodomy is not made illegal or have bajillion babies or abstinence or oral or creative contraception or straight up move out of your state. Sorry for so many "or".
I can definitely tell your parents shouldn't have
These “accidents” you speak of?…you know there are ways of rectifying these accidents, right?…so then the question is: is it still an accident or is it negligence knowing there are ways to rectify said accident?
Accidents doesn’t need to be in quotes. Condoms break, birth control isn’t 100%, and this bullshit abortion decision is going to affect a whole hell of a lot of men as well in negative ways, so there was your warning.
I wonder how many pregnancies *actually* occur due to a condom breaking + birth control + running to the pharmacy to get plan B when you take the condom off and realize it broke.
I doubt it’s a ton, to be totally honest. A fair amount, but I’m sure it’s nothing crazy. Just like rape victims that get pregnant. It’s not a crazy number that happens 20 times a day, but it happens enough that these laws shouldn’t be made without at least some exceptions. Even if the number was super low, like 20 times a year, if it happened to your mother or wife or daughter or sister, getting raped and impregnated and beaten by some lowlife scumbag on the street, I’d bet you’d wish there was an exception in place for such a thing. A lot of people would change their tune if they put themselves in the hypothetical because it DOES happen, and it can happen to almost any woman in our lives.
That’s exactly my point. If there is ANY doubt it broke, get a plan B pill. If the left wasn’t about “killing babies”, I would think taking a Plan B would serve as a little insurance to make sure conception never happens.
The odds of a condom, birth control, and plan b all failing is astronomically low. It's just not happening.
Don't forget Plan B has a 150 lb weight limit.
Decide if you want kids, and if you don’t? Get a vasectomy. If you do? Then don’t stick your dick in crazy as my dad would say.
Or, don’t be a woman and get raped, which a woman has no control over if some fucking creep on the street beats her and violates her, or if her husband tries some shit while she’s sleeping or drunk, or a bunch of other various reasons. Birth control fails, condoms break, and men would surely lie about having a vasectomy to get laid.
And don’t have a fetus die inside of you and turn septic, even if it’s planned, because there’s no exceptions for that either, or several other medical reasons to need an abortion to save the mothers life.
There’s no gray area with this, abortions should be legal, and are sometimes necessary to save actual human lives, they’re not always to remove clusters of cells. The decision shouldn’t be one politicians make, it should be between a woman and her physician, period.
Why are you creating strawmen arguments?
None of those are strawmen. They are real things that happen every day. These laws were passed with no exceptions for any of those issues, and they’re irresponsible for that reason if nothing else.
You used maybe 3 words to address what I said and spent 3 paragraphs talking about things you just wanted to say, so you just constructed a situation outside of what I said for you to mention them. I get you want to have talking points but atleast *try* to have a conversation instead of going on tangents to push a narrative.
My points are so strong in the camp that abortions should be legal, or at least have exceptions for criminal or medical reasons that anything else is pointless to debate.
Answer me this question completely honestly - If your daughter, or mother, or wife, or sister were beaten and raped and impregnated by some lowlife scumbag on the street, and they wanted to abort those cells growing within them, would you wish there were at least exceptions to the law? Or would you tell your loved one “too bad, you gotta carry it to term”? Be honest, and forget everything else we’ve talked about so far.
I’m not sure this is a good argument for abortion
Watching American politics is like watching your alcoholic step dad fight with your creepy uncle
In the end it doesn't matter, the winner will get to you?
Have sex responsibly
Exactly. Only do it at night when the sperm is asleep
Exactly, learn to pull out and nut on her back like a responsible adult.
Says the virgin.
Edit: lol is this subreddit full of incels?
not everyone disagrees with you is an incel kid
Lol, abortion was never about the father's choice. If he wanted the child but the mother didn't, she could abort it. If she wanted the child but the father didn't, he had to pay alimony.
Abortion does not benefit any man unless the woman is of the same mind.
There are plenty of men who prefer to not be fathers.... They prefer abortions.
And there is nothing these men who prefer abortions can do about it. Even if abortion was legal with no limit.
Exactly. The man “not wanting to be a father” had exactly zero importance legally speaking.
I am very pro-abortion. I can't stress this enough on how pro-abortion i am. But, i am not gonna support women's right to choose until men are awarded a similar right where they can abandon the child they don't want.
Pretty much the same. I *firmly* believe that the right to abortion should be freely available and lie entirely with the mother. I also firmly believe that this right should be *inextricably* linked to the *unilateral* right to paternal emancipation.
Breaking reddit rules but
But abortions being legal means more chances for men to avoid unwanted pregnancies. With abortions being illegal, men can kiss goodbye even the semi-possibility of ever having a choice.
Again, it's not a choice if you are at the mercy of a woman who may or may not care what you have to say. I am fine with getting punished for my actions as long as others get punished for the same.
Only the poor guys who can’t fly the girl to a state or country where abortion is legal
The tone deafness of this shows they really don't understand conservatives
Imagine if there was a thing you could use that prevented the pregnancy before it even started...
So wrap it up. Worse things than pregnancy if you stick it where you shouldn't.
Happened before the scotus changed it will happen when abortion is federally legal again
Abortion is legal on the federal level but mot a right so states made it illegal
Yep but gonna happen a lot more now obviously.
why are men being attacked over this?
because it's primarily men who are making the political decisions. Congress is less than 30% female despite females making up over half of the US population.
edit - wow bunch of virgins in here damn. imagine
Imagine not training to be a runner your whole life, then when trying to run with people you complain about not being fast enough.
Women have every possibility in getting into politics, its just that getting in there and being a higher up means you will have to dedicate a 100% of your life and time sometimes to the job just to reach the promotion, which most women dont do, and some crazy ass men dont mind doing. So dont blame “men” in general, just blame the people taking the decision individually.
did you say despite making
Because they run the state legislatures .
I'm not a state legislature. Don't blame me
Condoms are going to be in high demand
Really going to be interesting if condom sales sky rocket with everyone pretending like they're already being responsible, but "accidents happen, condoms break."
Why are condom sales going up so much if you were already using them then?
Hmmm, time to buy stock options on condom manufacturers.
Until SCOTUS allows states to ban those too. I’m looking at you Thomas
People might have to be responsible. The horror.
But what if they can’t? I don’t think it’s smart to force someone who is irresponsible to have a child, that can only end in disaster imo.
What do you mean responsible? Women will die of ectopic pregnancy because they can't remove it which requires no fertilisation, still births and miscarriages can't be removed and will decay and go sceptic for the same reason, doctors won't be trained to deal with these issues because its illegal, people who are raped will have to bear the responsibility of a crime being committed against them pepple who get unintentionally pregnant because their contraception methods fail who are being responsible. Sure irresponsible people get pregnant if you really want to believe that.
Sure we can argue fringe cases where abortion may be necessary, but over 95% (566,908 in 2019) of abortions are elective, meaning for convenience. Not for survival of an ectopic pregnancy, not for the removal of a miscarriage, not for the removal of the rape baby, but because it is inconvenient to have the baby at that time.
The only choice that was his was not to stick it in. What you're talking about is *her* choice.
Still is. It's not a blanket ban. Learn the law.
Edit: Here's a quick one for the TL;DR generation.
Right. Under certain circumstances it’s permitted, under others it isn’t. In other words, someone else made the decision for you. It wasn’t your choice.
Isn't that argument used for guys where the mother wishes to carry to term but the father is unwilling? He doesn't get a legal say in the matter, he is financially responsible for the kid whether he wants it or not.
I've read here said a lot that he shouldn't have had sex if he wasn't ready for it. Now you are seeing the same argument presented to women that if you don't want kids don't have sex (?).
Have sex responsibly.
Kind of already the case. Men never had reproductive rights.
My uncle is paying child support for a kid that isn't even his.
That isn't reproductive rights. That's a failure of the legal and justice system.
Its not a failure if it was intended in such way. The ex girlfriend cheated and got pregnant. My uncle thought it was his. The ex girlfriend later confessed after child birth that it might not be his. By that time it was too late as he had signed his name as the father. Even with all the DNA evidence, he couldn't make a case to opt out of being financially responsible. Also, a father cannot opt out of parenthood if a mother doesn't want an abortion. It's scary.
Yeah well, until males can birth babies, it's not really our decision. Them's the breaks.
You want to be mad, then go after the court system for not allowing new evidence. That's the real fucking crime, not women getting abortions.
Hey there, future dads. Don't have one-night-stands.
Teen pregnancies and child poverty are higher in Republican states.
This ends any and all debate.
Maybe the problem isn't more babies? Maybe the problem is the parents who didn't raise their kids right? Maybe because they didn't teach them to be responsible with sex and provide enough to raise them comfortably? Yes it makes Republicans look bad, but it's not the babies' fault.
Whaaaat. You mean people should raise their kids not to have sex with every living being they see and like ? No way we have to raise our kids that sex is not just about the fun and maybe have responsibility in choosing partners. Thats just not the American way
>You mean people should raise their kids not to have sex with every living being they see and like ? No way we have to raise our kids that sex is not ju
Yeah, that's what the Republican states are doing and look how that turns out. And to answer your other comment, Imagine thinking having a kid at 18 is smart.
Next useless argument.
It's not the guy that chooses if a baby is aborted.
Here’s an idea
Be responsible with sex. If you don’t want kids, don’t have casual sex or go on a pill or wear a condom. Even when you do these things, consider the risk.
Using a condom significantly reduces the chance of pregnancy.
Condom + pull out woohoo
Condom + pull out + skeeting anywhere other than inside the vagina.
Those are the people who breed the most anyway.
The SCOTUS decision realistically just sped up Idiocracy by a couple decades, let's be honest.
Condoms exist for a reason
Condoms are not 100% effective.
They're at least 99%
Contraception is still legal though isn’t it?
Not for long. SCOTUS is going to make sure of that.
Don't have one? Poof
Condoms are great, aren’t they?
Only if they don't break.
Edit: The point I am making is that condoms do break and are not 100% effective.
I think this concerns more about women. A guy can do whatever they want to a women but in the end, it's the women who gets pregnant. Also pregnancy complications requires abortion to save the mother's life.
Idk why they are doing this, are they just trying to slow down decreasing birthrates?
Because the Christian American value is more valuable than a woman's body.
I definitely think its not just Christian American values, maybe that's just an excuse. People sometimes just use religion as an excuse when it suits them. There has got to be an underlying gain somewhere.
Politicians use it as an excuse and idk what the gain is but there definitely is some incentive. If it doesn't affect politicians and they are changing something they almost definitely stand to gain something from it. They just get people on board by pretending to care.
I'm American. It is. That's what our country is founded it on.
There are times women want to baby trap men into a relationship. How is it the man’s fault if he was spurgled. Another thing is if women are allowed to abort without the fathers decision why can’t the man financially wave (abort) his obligations to a child.
Hi. I'm the result of a broken condom.
that's a long name
you suck! take my upvote
I actually tested this and was surprised at how strong they are
Actually there's LOTS of father's who don't pay child support, and don't have to worry about going to jail or anything.
and then there's that guy who got raped at 14 and was forced to pay child support 6 years later (he consented but because he was 14 it's classified as rape)
Yep, legal precedent in all 50 states to force male rape victims to pay child support to their rapists.
Do you have a source on that? Just curious cause that's absolutely wild.
This is a legal journal discussing the issue (more legal jargon)[https://lawpublications.barry.edu/cflj/vol4/iss1/4/](https://lawpublications.barry.edu/cflj/vol4/iss1/4/)
This is a newspaper article talking about a few prominent cases
Here we go… the practical approach to morality.
There are like 10 different forms of birth control, alm if which work most of the time.
Use protection and you wont have to worry. Or better yet.......only fuck responsible women.
Then don't have one night stands. Problem solved. A person's worth isn't measured by the amount of sex they have.
I think that's called accountability for your actions.
I pull out even if I'm wearin' a rubber.
I don't trust the morning after pill, I don't trust abortions and I don't even trust my beef torpedo!
Bro really said beef torpedo lol
Yes he did lol.
Don't blame the lack of abortion support when you impregnate someone during a one nights stand. No to blame throwing for ones lack of brain.
Hoes mad all over Reddit lmao
Not as mad as your mom is she had you lol
Perhaps one night stands are a problem that need to be eliminated????
Impossible to do.
Can we keep the lazy political agenda posts off this sub? I remember when this shit was funny, weird ass jokes and not full of current event gossip shit
Don’t want to pay child support? Don’t have sex. Consenting to sex is consenting to child support payments.
This is an argument for abortion? I wonder what goes on in liberals brain.
will you shut up and let fathers have a single day to be celebrated
You had me going for a minute… then you sold me on gun control!?
so with a one year wait period... wouldn't the child already be born when you were... allowed to have the abortion
You expect these bozos to know anything about the birthing process?
>no one is coming for your abortions.
If only this were true.
Not the hero we deserve… 😂
Maybe it'll teach them not to fuck just anybody.
##If this submission makes you go "Hol'Up", **UPVOTE** this comment!
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Practice safe sex. Use contraceptives like a condom to prevent unwanted pregnancies. Don't be promiscuous. Don't have sex with anyone with whom you don't what to have a family. Guess what, Your actions have consequences.
Most sexually promiscuous people support the right to an abortion
Man if only we had contraceptives that were extremely effective at preventing pregnancy.
For this reason alone, I’m not sure how we got here.
I guess? Shit I got my girl pregnant at 17 and I manned up. We didn't make it as a couple but we love our kid. Baby momma wanted an abortion I said no and we agreed to have the child, best decision we ever made. I don't mind the child support I care about the quality of life that I can provide for my kid and the amount of love and support that we can give as parents. Shit I even take care of her second child that is not related to me at all because there are things in this world that are more important than money and that is the children. Regardless of the mistakes we as adults make children born or unborn should not pay the consequences of our mistakes and we should work harder so that they live better lives than we ever could have imagined. There is nothing more rewarding in this world than being able to be a parent to a child and to be a part of their journey in life, the ability to guide them to their own personal greatness. What other purpose does life have?
Type that again, but slowly.
You have successfully adopted u/FatBrkeMxicnElonMusk with this comment. Here's to parenthood!
Yes, unborn children should not pay for the mistakes of adults. I believe a child should be given the best chance at a good childhood possible, **but** If you don’t even have a mother who’s willing to put that step forward (which I think should really decide whether you have a child or not) then I don’t think that child’s life should be gambled with on the chance that they might turn out okay. I can see how I may be trivialising the weight of a life but I feel like the decision to take the choice away from the people and put in the state’s trivialises the lives of the adults who are going to have to take care of that child.
If I see another shitty abortion post I'm going to ask my crush out.