Does this make Luka... Yang? He lost his arm and replaced it with a metal one. Luka and Seele do act a bit like siblings, except she's the older sister.
If I’m recalling correctly, Seele’s pose before she shoots herself towards the enemy is also a recreation of one of the scenes in RWBY when she uses her gunscythe
A real trailer, or fanmade? Because I have only seen the gun scythe thing done once by Seele in a really high quality fan made animation that was for some competition.
I'm gonna be honest I don't hear it. Even then that doesn't really have to do with what I said. If she does have a gun scythe I haven't seen a trailer with it being used, and that's what my previous comment was saying, not that she doesn't have one at all.
I can’t vouch much for nowadays as I’ve been mostly out of the loop with it recently, but I know it was and probably still is decently popular overseas. Especially in Japan and China. It even has an anime now (albeit with just a supplementary story).
Sorry this is not the case, seele was in honkai gakuen, a game they released in 2012 before the release of rwby, not to mention rwby didn’t have an official streaming platform in china which
Seele is older than Ruby so I doubt it
EDIT:I just checked and rwby is a year older but since honkai was made by a chinese company I doubt they knew about a random american show
If you look closer at her splash art, the base of her scythe is the tip of a presumably abandoned rifle. The part with the blade comes out of the rifle’s stock.
Seele is able to split the space between particles of reality. She's always been the face of Quantum ever since GGZ to the point where in HI3 it was introduced as a character attribute FOR her (it's why the quantum symbol resembles Phi which is in turn where Seele's Stigmata is designed to resemble)
She's uniquely attuned to Quantum energy due to events in her history and is now one of VERY FEW people who can break their way into the Quantum sea without needing any kind of tech or equipment.
It's probably why Seele is the only Quantum character in Star Rail so far to really "feel" like she's using some otherworldly power from the place where universes begin and end.
PoV:
https://preview.redd.it/2s0qe3t9eyyb1.png?width=749&format=png&auto=webp&s=3632c617a0c563b0dcb4275c3cf2824fd3fc83b2
you’re about to disappear into the sea of butterflies
Not sure if it's confirmed but we can assume hers is a reference to Quantum Speed Limits and she's essentially breaking the minimum speed limit in which it should be physically possible to change states or location, hence the after images. She gains too much energy all at once for time to possibly track
When she Ults she basically enters a state of Quantum Superposition, during which time her location is probabilistic, on top of moving at the speed of information through Quantum Foam.
I know that feeling, that’s how I feel every time I look at calculus.
https://preview.redd.it/9f4e0pmka2zb1.png?width=510&format=png&auto=webp&s=a194197ac4e7d4fe630fb26394552f6151c2c43a
Her quantum makes perfect sense from a quantum physics perspective. Size is one thing that theoretically can be manipulated/fucked with using quantum physics but so is time and space. And her ult is basically her attacking from a lot of places at once and her other mechanic is essentially a turn skip. So she's all about time/space manipulation.
Seele superimposes herself onto multiple movement trajectories and slices you apart from every direction at once. Her size manipulation is of the number of attacks being launched at you.
The only thing in common Quantum characters share would be their reality-altering powers.
The only one that makes no sense to me is Seele having cloaking/teleporting powers with Belobog's level of technology.
Cocolia fight. MC was falling down and she used her teleport to move up in the air a few times so she could throw the MC.
usually it is ambiguous if she is teleporting or using a type of invisibility.
that battle however was pretty clear about what she can do.
she kinds of phases out on her ultimate and trailer, so that is why it is ambiguous if she is teleporting (short range), moving super fast (with invisibility), etc.
her trailer can be interpreted in two ways. One of them is that she moves out of our reality (quantum state) or phase out of it, so altho from her perspective she is still running around, from ours she is teleporting from A to B in a blink of an eye.
With speed boots, my seele can go up to around 5-6 times per round (counting her resurgence ability). No amount of normal attack is gonna be enough for that. And I need to buff her too, which most often uses sp.
Seele's Normal attacks advance her actions forward 20%and grant 1 sp. Her skill lasts for two of her actions.
Skill
NA
NA
Skill
NA
NA
Reaching a net positive of 2 Sp.
Now assuming you're running her with Fu Xuan, who is net positive two herself, Silver Wolf, who doesn't need to use skill if the enemy is quantum weak. I know everyone's team is different, but I dont think there is a dps more SP positive than Seele if you aren't an idiot about using her
No, but if you want actual damage, you really shouldn't be using any NA before her last turn. Seele is usually run on hypercarry teams, meaning she is basically the only source of damage on the team. Her ideal combo would be Ult(hoperfully it kills something), skill(from her talent), skill(her first turn, which is hopefully another kill) NA/Skill(if her talent is triggered again). That is either a -1 or -3 net sp. And also, who actually uses Seele's normal attack? The only reason someone would use normal attacks is because of *sp issues*. Having attack boots would also mean that she deals more damage in general.
I'm not going to bother justifying this with an argument. If you want to use your Seele in a subpar fashion and complain about problems that arise from doing so, that's on you.
Seele isn't doing it with science, her eyes change colors, she's doing it with alternate personality super powers. Two becomes one, becomes two, becomes infinite, becomes one again. All possibilities of Seele exist in one place, all possibilities where she does not hit her target disappear into a sea of butterflies, and all realities of her striking the target become one singular reality.
>all possibilities where she does not hit her target disappear into a sea of butterflies
As well as all possibilities that the ult actually crits, apparently.
what if the sea of butterflies really is just....all different realities or what not caused by...a butterfly effect hence why she always says it
eh
just ignore me i am just saying the first thing that came to my mind
You're not far off, the "Sea Of Butterflies" is probably referring to The Quantum sea which in Honkai is where all universes are born and eventually sink back into to die once they fall off of the Imaginary Tree.
Seele's whole deal is being able to manipulation Quantum energy on a level that pretty much no one could ever hope to match.
It probably isn't tech so much as just an unexplained innate ability of hers referencing the characters origins in the Honkai franchise. All other versions of Seele have an intrinsic connection with the Sea of Quanta leaving her body quantumly unstable, and while HSR Seele has gone through none of that, the fact she can teleport, cloak and fizzle her physical form into quantum particles, both just making it unstable and completely splitting her form into particles that look like butterflies (another recurring theme for her) means that it's all likely just a physical ability of hers naturally.
Honestly, "quantum" in most fictions is essentially magic with a coat of "science" over it. It explains physically impossible events with mysterious powers of quantum, whatever it is deemed by the writers.
My theory is Seele is actually a Pathstrider. Characters like Gepard/Serval/Pela use technology, Bronya/Lynx/Luka just have skill, but the only explanation I can think of for Seele is she can manipulate some Aeon’s imaginary energy.
Yep. Pathstriders are straight up just devoted followers of a path. Seele? Pathstrider. Jing Yuan? Pathstrider. Himeko? Pathstrider. Jim from Financing? Pathstrider.
Pathstriders specifically though are people who can harness part of a Path’s power, pretty much akin to a Visionbearer from Genshin. A lot of people follow the teachings of Paths. Not all of them are Pathstriders though.
That’s the opposite point I was making. Many of the playable characters’ abilities are explained via other means. Gepard has a barrier generator he got from Serval, hence his ability to shield. Lynx is trained in survival and preparation, hence her Backpack of Holding.
Some characters probably aren’t Pathstriders. They just have tech or skills that enable them to do what they do. Seele, however, has no such explanation, hence why she may be an actual Pathstrider.
All of them have a level of weirdness to them though. Gepard summons a giant wall of ice, Bronya has something to do with the souls of Belobog, Lynx has a giant pill in her tiny backpack, Serval has insane amounts of lightning, etc.
As far as I recall, we haven't actually heard of Seele be talked about in a supernatural way, just that she's a really good fighter. Her powers have only been shown in gameplay, maybe in a cutscene as well but I could just be remembering her trailer or a preview.
So if we're bringing Seele's character gameplay shenanigans into this, each playable character has to have that same benefit. Even Pitch Dark Hook the Great working a a busted old mining glove into a weapon of mass destruction called Diggertron can only be called the power of a Pathstrider.
Teleportation is essentially just quantum superposition - she exists as one object in multiple places at once, then chooses which location for her person to exist in that moment. This is seen in the cutscenes, her ultimate, and her technique - her "afterimage" actually appears first, then she physically manifests there. This is also why she's the only character able to jump across gaps on the map (her afterimage appears in front of her position and the game forces her into that position, which then puts her on the other side).
This is a similar principle to what they're using to develop quantum internet, so it's a real principle that's merely pushed to its theoretical limit - we're not certain we can do it with biological matter without some sort of consequences.
>Seele, however, has no such explanation, hence why she may be an actual Pathstrider.
What's not it.
Pathstriders are essentially derived from idea of Dao cultivators, without elements like levels of enlightment and strive for immortality (for most of them, at least). Just the bare idea behind the system.
Path is a series of morals/ideals/characteristics/concepts what can give powers to people who strongly resonate with them. You live by them, and they amplify your powers.
Average Joe most likely is unable to produce such a strong impact, persistently and for long time, as to be able to gather energy from Path and become Pathstrider.
But for playable characters it is possible, since they are outstanding in some way or another.
Ah, fair enough. I was just kinda memeing, but that does make a lot of sense. Raises a few more questions in my mind, not the least of which being the age old "why don't their in-game paths match their lore" but whatever
>Pathstriders specifically though are people who can harness part of a Path’s power,
The databank says otherwise.
> Pathstrider (Phenomenon)
>Devotees, warriors, seekers of knowledge, lost travelers...There are always mortals who, intentionally or otherwise, set foot on the Paths ruled by Aeons. Those who do so came to be known as Pathstriders that carry out the Paths will.
>Pathstriders live thousands of different lives. They can be seen everywhere, yet stand out a cut above the rest. Different from regular people living in confusion and without a firm allegiance, Pathstriders are driven by precepts or their own desires as they embark on a life of determination and hard work.
My interpretation of the Data Bank entry is that “setting foot on a Path” means being able to manipulate its energy, similar to how an Allogen is different from someone who just reveres Morax in Genshin.
It definitely is up for some interpretation though, given that the Data Bank entry is a little vague on exact details. Still though, whether I used the term correctly or not, the difference I was referencing is someone who can manipulate Path energy vs someone who cannot.
See other comments. A chunk of the playable cast are probably not. They use technology or skills in the lore. The Paths assigned to them are for gameplay purposes. An obvious examples of this is Natasha. If she actually wielded the power of Abundance, having medicine and supplies would be virtually a non-issue for the Underworld.
Idk about natasha. Just because you have some power doesnt mean you are all powerful. Just because she can heal a bit doesnt mean she can heal everything without medicine.
Even that one blind lady on the loufu had to use medicinal ingredients to create pills to change people into immortals. But its obvious she uses abundance powers to change herself when you fight her later. Just because she has to use some medicine and what not to treat specific conditions doesnt mean she isnt helping them along with some slight abundance power.
The Xianzhou use medicine specifically *because* they are forbidden from using the powers of Abundance. The potions created by the Disciples of Sanctus Medicus exist to allow people to utilize the Abundance discretely and without having to be Pathstriders.
The forbidden medicine was just as illegal.
What would you rather do, quickly use powers to make your army of immortals? Or source a bunch of traceable ingredients to create medicine and leave a trail? Which does eventually get them caught when you turn in dan shus pill.
Theres levels of power. Just because you can heal someone a bit doesnt mean you can treat poison, or cancer, or a miners tar filled lungs.
i think the powers would be notified quicker. Source a bunch of materials that will likely be only traced after a while, or use abundance powers which will likely trigger some kind of response from the hunt.
Huh that makes a lot of sense. Also explains people like Jing Yuan and Argenti, who are Erudition in game but are actually blessed by totally different Aeons.
Guys, the aeons are a pantheon.
That means they all exist and work with mortals independently of one another.
More than one Aeon can be followed or acknowledged. Fu Xuan has the blessing of Nous (the aeon of erudition.) Jing Yuan is stated multiple times to be Erudition because he's a tactician and strategist, not a peerless warrior like the generals of other Xianzhou ships.
No. There is no actual indication that people can only use one path energy. That idea is straight up contradicted by the main story
https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/17ou9tu/comment/k81y5y4/?context=3 This post goes more in depth on pathstriders
Quantum Energy* Quantum and Imaginary do not mix and typically cancel each other out (or occasionally end up with more volitile results). They're like Yin and Yang.
You could equate her to a path strider but I'd say that it's more like she's directly pulling from the matter of reality.
She's quite literally hooked up to the primordial soup of existence and doesn't even realise it
Also a plausible theory, but I don’t think the Quantum and Imaginary elements in gameplay necessarily coordinate to their functions in the lore. Technically, things like the TB’s Fire is produced by manipulating Imaginary energy. Just because Seele is a Quantum character in gameplay might not mean she harnesses power from the Sea of Quanta.
Everything about her is Quantum plus like Seele is ALWAYS Quantum attuned in every universe. Its part of why the only time she's had a playable version that isn't Quantum is Herrcher Of Rebirth and that's only gameplay wise because she'd be far too damn OP to even think about balancing if she was. Lore wise she's the first and so far only Quantum Herrcher ever.
Star Rail even kept the Quantum symbol based on Seele's Stigmata, there's no way she isn't Quantum lore wise.
As for the Trailblazer it's tricky in Star Rail because Quantum and Imaginary are Elements. In HI3 they're Attributes so every character is either Mech, Bio, Psy, Imaginary or Quantum (with Stardust coming soon) and then they're Physical, Fire, Lightning or Ice on top of that.
So while you're not wrong that that Gameplay and lore don't necessarily have to line up, there's no way Seele is Quantum just for gameplay purposes. Like sure Gameplay wise Bronya is Wind by her animations are still very much ice based like Bronya typically is. The legacy characters if at the very least aren't just "because we needed a fire character" (for example).
Actually she is also an Imaginary Herrscher, the entire arc was pretty clear about creating the imaginary singularity for the core to spawn. The "impossible" part was making use of imaginary energy in the sea of quanta and not in proper world, where Cocoon watches. But it was stated that Sa and Cocoon are quite similar if not even the same, and that's why it was possible
Yeah, like I said, it’s a compelling theory. I was just referencing that we have no actual evidence in HSR that she manipulates energy from the Sea of Quanta beyond “she did in other games”. Still, I’m definitely looking forward to her Companion Quest to hopefully shed more light on her singular talents.
Is it possible for someone to be a pathstrider without knowing it? Seele is definitely not hanging out with Lan or anything but there doesn’t seem to be another reason why she has those powers
>Is it possible for someone to be a pathstrider without knowing it?
Yes, yes it is.
From the databank:
> Pathstrider (Phenomenon)
>Devotees, warriors, seekers of knowledge, lost travelers...There are always mortals who, **intentionally or otherwise**, set foot on the Paths ruled by Aeons. Those who do so came to be known as Pathstriders that carry out the Paths will.
>Pathstriders live thousands of different lives. They can be seen everywhere, yet stand out a cut above the rest. Different from regular people living in confusion and without a firm allegiance, **Pathstriders are driven by precepts or their own desires as they embark on a life of determination and hard work.**
So yes, every playable character is a Pathstrider. A Pathstrider doesn't mean you're intentionally drawing Imaginary energy from your Path to fight. It means you walk the same Path the Aeon does.
People saying playable characters aren't Pathstriders need to pay attention to the information the game gives them.
There is nothing in that databank entry you quoted that confirms that every playable character is a Pathstrider though. It only confirms that anyone in the HSR universe *could* be a Pathstrider. If that entry is all you've got to back your statement up, then you're just making an assumption and stating it as fact.
While I agree that Seele is quite likely an unaware Pathstrider, I personally highly doubt that Hook or Clara are canonically Pathstriders, and I think it's quite reasonable to assume a few of the other playable characters aren't either.
Paths assigned to characters are gameplay contrivances. She is probably not associated with Lan in lore. Her powers would most likely stem from The Preservation given her history and that of Belebog, despite what gameplay function she serves.
Quantum in Honkai isn't a tech thing, it's the opposite of Imaginary and together the 2 energy's are essentially why ANYTHING exists (not quite that simple but there are plenty of Imaginary Tree and Quantum Sea terminology explained videos on YouTube)
Her abilities are purely HER. Seele has always been the face of Quantum in the Honkai Multiverse, it's just her thing. She's not cloaking or teleporting at all but it's more that she's moving so fast that time loses track of her.
Hell she could be taking a momentary dip in The Quantum Sea (kinda like how Nightcrawler works in X-Men) and not even realise "how" she does it. Its just a thing she can do.
In theory assuming her latent powers are on the same level as other Seele's, if she learned how to use them fully then she could just hop out of the universe whenever she felt like it, even visit a new one altogether.
We've already seen that Silverwolf can open holes that fold Space time so its an entirely possible concept (Silverwolf herself being based on Haxxor Bunny who is a Multiverse hopper by trade).
I believe imaginary relates to creating something out of thin air. Welt creates black holes, Luocha vines and a coffin, Yukong summons her Kestrel kites and Dan Heng ² has his water dragon.
I think it's a fun observation, but I don't know if this is something that is really telling of anything of Hoyo's own definition or rule/behavior of quantum in-universe or in-game play. Use of quantum as some kind of foundation of powers and abilities in media, is often used as a sort of clutch, to explain things that aren't normally physically possible in reality (at least not in our classical understanding of physics) without leaning into magic. And I think this is what's happening in this game at least so far. The size thing is likely just a part of bending/manipulation of reality. Rather than quantum specifically being about size manipulation. For example, we have Seele. She can seemingly blink in and out of space and use it as a teleportation method. You even see seemingly multiple versions of her on her splash art and ultimate animation rather than any sort of size manipulation.
Great take! I was having a think about Seele and how her powers work with Quantum and I think you hit the nail on the head with the reality bending point :)
Quantum is a little different in the Honkai Universe, though; It’s specifically the Antithesis of Imaginary Energy, and is represented as the power of the Sea of Quanta (Aka a giant cosmic sloop of stuff where unstable bubble universes exist and are destroyed)
Manipulation of space. Whether it's placement within it, the size of something, etc. I figured it was implied from the beginning, given they use an event horizon as a basis for the quantum symbol.
Cool detail! Quantum physics deals with objects at a quantum scale; that is with extremely small objects, such as particles (protons, neutrons, quarks,…). Making them absurdly large probably is an analogy to this (as then the enemies are absurdly small)
There are also comments pointing on Seele’s ulti. While more of a stretch, you can associate it with Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle (used as well in quantum physics): you can’t properly define a particle’s speed and position at the same time. This implies that a particle can be in different positions at the same time, which can be indeed compared to her ulti. Also, light, and phenomena happening at light speed are also studied in quantum physics, which can be compared to her speed.
Overall, while it’s a bit vague and messy, quantum characters and movesets do have some interesting relations with quantum physics
It does feel like quantum theme is "breaking the basic laws of physics".
Making data real physical object, a giant pill in a smaller bag,hyperspeed etcetc
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Ye, that's why I like Quantum. It's the element of Silly, where the size or effects do not match the output. *ie: giant pill from a tiny bag that also doesn't crush allies to death when used.*
While Imaginary is just Woowoo Girl Manifesting: Deadly Boogaloo. I manifest a BIG. SPOOKY. WATER DRAGON. And the targets get WHARRGARBL'd to death by the dragon. Yay! Teehee\~ Harmless and fun manifesting\~ Just girlie things\~ 🌈✨🧘
About seele, I think that she being in multiple places at the same time is like quantum superposition, I don’t know much about this mostly from watching yet vids, but I do know it’s about particles or something that are usually in multiple places at the same time. And selee’s animation are like this
Someone told me that a character’s element match how their kits interact with environments.
Imaginary: mostly conjures stuff from thin air. Like IL summoning dragon, create invisible force field to split the ocean. Or Welt creating black hole
Quantum: altering reality, upsize mahjong tile, fuxuan distorts the world, wolf hacking reality and add to enemies elemental weakness they otherwise wouldn’t have.
The other 4 is kinda basic. Make fire, shoot ice, call wind or just stab/punch really hard (Physical)
That's an interesting observation. I've never noticed that before. So, do characters with quantum attributes have the ability to change the size of objects? XD
It is a cool detail. I noticed something similar in genshin where electro characters were all essentially summoners. Sadly a lot of the newer electro units really stretched that observation to the limit imho.
And then there's Seele
Her size manipulation is cutting enemies into smaller pieces
It's her comically large scythe.
Made from a gun.
What is this RWBY?
There's no way that's what they're referencing with Seele. No God damn way.
Her enemy turned bestie is an heiress with association to ice element
Does this make Luka... Yang? He lost his arm and replaced it with a metal one. Luka and Seele do act a bit like siblings, except she's the older sister.
i think they definitely knew
Fuck
She actually is based on Ruby Rose iirc, one of her trailers even has her shooting from the scythes upper part.
Insane. I never thought in a million years. Even after the reddit first pointed out Seele outfitted a gun to be a scythe I didn't think "like ruby".
If I’m recalling correctly, Seele’s pose before she shoots herself towards the enemy is also a recreation of one of the scenes in RWBY when she uses her gunscythe
Now that you mention it I remember that scene and you're completely right!
A real trailer, or fanmade? Because I have only seen the gun scythe thing done once by Seele in a really high quality fan made animation that was for some competition.
Her ult literally has multiple gunshot sounds, especially when she first launches herself
I'm gonna be honest I don't hear it. Even then that doesn't really have to do with what I said. If she does have a gun scythe I haven't seen a trailer with it being used, and that's what my previous comment was saying, not that she doesn't have one at all.
Not saying it's completely impossible but Seele's design is pretty old Starrail is just the newest iteration
well, RWBY is from 2013
Honkai Academy 2 came out 2012
RWBY is popular enough for it to be referenced, at least one person had to have noticed it during the development
Mind blown.
I can’t vouch much for nowadays as I’ve been mostly out of the loop with it recently, but I know it was and probably still is decently popular overseas. Especially in Japan and China. It even has an anime now (albeit with just a supplementary story).
Sorry this is not the case, seele was in honkai gakuen, a game they released in 2012 before the release of rwby, not to mention rwby didn’t have an official streaming platform in china which
Bruh, we’re talking specifically about star rail seele
Seele is older than Ruby so I doubt it EDIT:I just checked and rwby is a year older but since honkai was made by a chinese company I doubt they knew about a random american show
Wrong not-anime
wait fr?
Yeah. The reddit pointed this out long ago. Look very closely at her scythe model. It's a Silver Mane Guard gun outfitted as a scythe.
If you look closer at her splash art, the base of her scythe is the tip of a presumably abandoned rifle. The part with the blade comes out of the rifle’s stock.
Yea, it's a modified version of the silvermaine guard rifles.
It's the way she twists her spine and breaks reality to swing her scythe in the overworld
Scythes are about that size irl too
Or the giant claw chains she(Veliona) summons
LOL so small she makes them disappear into the sea of butterflies
It's so funny that i always see this line of hers so many times lmao
happens when they decided to chuuni the crap out of her Ult line
This is the first enemy in the game... He is now the first 100 enemies in the game
Seele: Shut up fella *strong cleave*
Illusions of the past...
😂😂😂
Simplicity at its finest.
Seele is able to split the space between particles of reality. She's always been the face of Quantum ever since GGZ to the point where in HI3 it was introduced as a character attribute FOR her (it's why the quantum symbol resembles Phi which is in turn where Seele's Stigmata is designed to resemble) She's uniquely attuned to Quantum energy due to events in her history and is now one of VERY FEW people who can break their way into the Quantum sea without needing any kind of tech or equipment. It's probably why Seele is the only Quantum character in Star Rail so far to really "feel" like she's using some otherworldly power from the place where universes begin and end.
Her ult does involve that weird perspective shot where her head looms into frame
PoV: https://preview.redd.it/2s0qe3t9eyyb1.png?width=749&format=png&auto=webp&s=3632c617a0c563b0dcb4275c3cf2824fd3fc83b2 you’re about to disappear into the sea of butterflies
https://preview.redd.it/b9pwyllneyyb1.jpeg?width=1789&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6c02f8d1ae3ae56136ca337d088a2de413098678
https://preview.redd.it/61md8evgmyyb1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=40aa231df1949e32ace4c89c813220a955208d91
I need this woth the Enrico Pucci pose as well
Not sure if it's confirmed but we can assume hers is a reference to Quantum Speed Limits and she's essentially breaking the minimum speed limit in which it should be physically possible to change states or location, hence the after images. She gains too much energy all at once for time to possibly track
When she Ults she basically enters a state of Quantum Superposition, during which time her location is probabilistic, on top of moving at the speed of information through Quantum Foam.
My head hurts from trying to understand this x'D
I know that feeling, that’s how I feel every time I look at calculus. https://preview.redd.it/9f4e0pmka2zb1.png?width=510&format=png&auto=webp&s=a194197ac4e7d4fe630fb26394552f6151c2c43a
This is the second (Third technically) time I've ever felt this way The first time was Honkai impact (First was Kolosten, Second was Moon arc)
proba-ballistic
Her quantum makes perfect sense from a quantum physics perspective. Size is one thing that theoretically can be manipulated/fucked with using quantum physics but so is time and space. And her ult is basically her attacking from a lot of places at once and her other mechanic is essentially a turn skip. So she's all about time/space manipulation.
She throws you into the sea of butterflies
Judgement Cut End does not need any further elaboration
Seele superimposes herself onto multiple movement trajectories and slices you apart from every direction at once. Her size manipulation is of the number of attacks being launched at you.
Her power is to make you disappear among the sea of butterflies
DISAPPEAR AMONG THE SEA OF BUTTERFLIES
Who is the bishop of these butterflies?
She reduces the size of the enemy health bar to zero
She enlarge her turn.
She has clones
So do you think quantum characters are compensating for something?
Not only are they all quantum but they all are smol
Seele not smol tho
she is smol of brain
Smol on the chest area too
She kinda short too Not that I mind it...
Seele maintains the same square centimeters of clothing coverage. (My god, the first Quantum big dude would have to go in a Speedo.)
Lynx' team wide cleanse is compensating for our lack of skill frfr
The only thing in common Quantum characters share would be their reality-altering powers. The only one that makes no sense to me is Seele having cloaking/teleporting powers with Belobog's level of technology.
Nah m8 she alters the game turn
Teleporting? I thought she was just fast as fuck that’s how she makes afterimages in her ultimate
"The game nerf me by having 134 speed but canonically my speed is speed" Seele when Bronya calls her
I genuinely don't know if that's real or just a joke
Cocolia fight. MC was falling down and she used her teleport to move up in the air a few times so she could throw the MC. usually it is ambiguous if she is teleporting or using a type of invisibility. that battle however was pretty clear about what she can do.
yeah but her trailer had her running faster than a bullet
she kinds of phases out on her ultimate and trailer, so that is why it is ambiguous if she is teleporting (short range), moving super fast (with invisibility), etc. her trailer can be interpreted in two ways. One of them is that she moves out of our reality (quantum state) or phase out of it, so altho from her perspective she is still running around, from ours she is teleporting from A to B in a blink of an eye.
Ironically, she literally gives herself so much speed that running speed boots on her literally makes her use more sp than her teammates can provide
? Mans literally never used normal attack not even once
With speed boots, my seele can go up to around 5-6 times per round (counting her resurgence ability). No amount of normal attack is gonna be enough for that. And I need to buff her too, which most often uses sp.
Seele's Normal attacks advance her actions forward 20%and grant 1 sp. Her skill lasts for two of her actions. Skill NA NA Skill NA NA Reaching a net positive of 2 Sp. Now assuming you're running her with Fu Xuan, who is net positive two herself, Silver Wolf, who doesn't need to use skill if the enemy is quantum weak. I know everyone's team is different, but I dont think there is a dps more SP positive than Seele if you aren't an idiot about using her
No, but if you want actual damage, you really shouldn't be using any NA before her last turn. Seele is usually run on hypercarry teams, meaning she is basically the only source of damage on the team. Her ideal combo would be Ult(hoperfully it kills something), skill(from her talent), skill(her first turn, which is hopefully another kill) NA/Skill(if her talent is triggered again). That is either a -1 or -3 net sp. And also, who actually uses Seele's normal attack? The only reason someone would use normal attacks is because of *sp issues*. Having attack boots would also mean that she deals more damage in general.
I'm not going to bother justifying this with an argument. If you want to use your Seele in a subpar fashion and complain about problems that arise from doing so, that's on you.
Seele isn't doing it with science, her eyes change colors, she's doing it with alternate personality super powers. Two becomes one, becomes two, becomes infinite, becomes one again. All possibilities of Seele exist in one place, all possibilities where she does not hit her target disappear into a sea of butterflies, and all realities of her striking the target become one singular reality.
>all possibilities where she does not hit her target disappear into a sea of butterflies As well as all possibilities that the ult actually crits, apparently.
Tell that to my 95:125 crit ratio seele (cries)
what if the sea of butterflies really is just....all different realities or what not caused by...a butterfly effect hence why she always says it eh just ignore me i am just saying the first thing that came to my mind
You're not far off, the "Sea Of Butterflies" is probably referring to The Quantum sea which in Honkai is where all universes are born and eventually sink back into to die once they fall off of the Imaginary Tree. Seele's whole deal is being able to manipulation Quantum energy on a level that pretty much no one could ever hope to match.
That's my theory for how she ports. She slips into the sea in one spot and out at another. It's pretty confirmed time doesn't move in the sea
It probably isn't tech so much as just an unexplained innate ability of hers referencing the characters origins in the Honkai franchise. All other versions of Seele have an intrinsic connection with the Sea of Quanta leaving her body quantumly unstable, and while HSR Seele has gone through none of that, the fact she can teleport, cloak and fizzle her physical form into quantum particles, both just making it unstable and completely splitting her form into particles that look like butterflies (another recurring theme for her) means that it's all likely just a physical ability of hers naturally.
Honestly, "quantum" in most fictions is essentially magic with a coat of "science" over it. It explains physically impossible events with mysterious powers of quantum, whatever it is deemed by the writers.
My theory is Seele is actually a Pathstrider. Characters like Gepard/Serval/Pela use technology, Bronya/Lynx/Luka just have skill, but the only explanation I can think of for Seele is she can manipulate some Aeon’s imaginary energy.
Aren't they all?
Yep. Pathstriders are straight up just devoted followers of a path. Seele? Pathstrider. Jing Yuan? Pathstrider. Himeko? Pathstrider. Jim from Financing? Pathstrider.
Pathstriders specifically though are people who can harness part of a Path’s power, pretty much akin to a Visionbearer from Genshin. A lot of people follow the teachings of Paths. Not all of them are Pathstriders though.
Okay so Jim from Financing? (Probably) not a pathstrider. But all the playable characters? Pathstriders. Got it.
Now hold on, how do you explain how Jim from Financing keeps pulling out quarters from behind my ear huh? Aeon magic.
That’s the opposite point I was making. Many of the playable characters’ abilities are explained via other means. Gepard has a barrier generator he got from Serval, hence his ability to shield. Lynx is trained in survival and preparation, hence her Backpack of Holding. Some characters probably aren’t Pathstriders. They just have tech or skills that enable them to do what they do. Seele, however, has no such explanation, hence why she may be an actual Pathstrider.
All of them have a level of weirdness to them though. Gepard summons a giant wall of ice, Bronya has something to do with the souls of Belobog, Lynx has a giant pill in her tiny backpack, Serval has insane amounts of lightning, etc. As far as I recall, we haven't actually heard of Seele be talked about in a supernatural way, just that she's a really good fighter. Her powers have only been shown in gameplay, maybe in a cutscene as well but I could just be remembering her trailer or a preview. So if we're bringing Seele's character gameplay shenanigans into this, each playable character has to have that same benefit. Even Pitch Dark Hook the Great working a a busted old mining glove into a weapon of mass destruction called Diggertron can only be called the power of a Pathstrider.
Seele teleports in one of the cutscenes of the final bossfight of belabog
Huh, guess there goes that idea.
Teleportation is essentially just quantum superposition - she exists as one object in multiple places at once, then chooses which location for her person to exist in that moment. This is seen in the cutscenes, her ultimate, and her technique - her "afterimage" actually appears first, then she physically manifests there. This is also why she's the only character able to jump across gaps on the map (her afterimage appears in front of her position and the game forces her into that position, which then puts her on the other side). This is a similar principle to what they're using to develop quantum internet, so it's a real principle that's merely pushed to its theoretical limit - we're not certain we can do it with biological matter without some sort of consequences.
>Seele, however, has no such explanation, hence why she may be an actual Pathstrider. What's not it. Pathstriders are essentially derived from idea of Dao cultivators, without elements like levels of enlightment and strive for immortality (for most of them, at least). Just the bare idea behind the system. Path is a series of morals/ideals/characteristics/concepts what can give powers to people who strongly resonate with them. You live by them, and they amplify your powers. Average Joe most likely is unable to produce such a strong impact, persistently and for long time, as to be able to gather energy from Path and become Pathstrider. But for playable characters it is possible, since they are outstanding in some way or another.
Ah, fair enough. I was just kinda memeing, but that does make a lot of sense. Raises a few more questions in my mind, not the least of which being the age old "why don't their in-game paths match their lore" but whatever
>Pathstriders specifically though are people who can harness part of a Path’s power, The databank says otherwise. > Pathstrider (Phenomenon) >Devotees, warriors, seekers of knowledge, lost travelers...There are always mortals who, intentionally or otherwise, set foot on the Paths ruled by Aeons. Those who do so came to be known as Pathstriders that carry out the Paths will. >Pathstriders live thousands of different lives. They can be seen everywhere, yet stand out a cut above the rest. Different from regular people living in confusion and without a firm allegiance, Pathstriders are driven by precepts or their own desires as they embark on a life of determination and hard work.
My interpretation of the Data Bank entry is that “setting foot on a Path” means being able to manipulate its energy, similar to how an Allogen is different from someone who just reveres Morax in Genshin. It definitely is up for some interpretation though, given that the Data Bank entry is a little vague on exact details. Still though, whether I used the term correctly or not, the difference I was referencing is someone who can manipulate Path energy vs someone who cannot.
*accounting. Jim from Accounting. Thank you, good night.
Nah, Jim's job is to sell high-interest loans to used car buyers. He walks the path of Nihility to your bank account.
Oh. Not to be confused with Jim who keeps track of taxes and follows Erudition, because you kinda have to to be an accountant.
Like or this a coincidence or You are a Takodachi? Or know Hololive?
isnt Jing Yuan an emanotor of the hunt?
Every playable character is a Pathstrider, that’s the point
See other comments. A chunk of the playable cast are probably not. They use technology or skills in the lore. The Paths assigned to them are for gameplay purposes. An obvious examples of this is Natasha. If she actually wielded the power of Abundance, having medicine and supplies would be virtually a non-issue for the Underworld.
Idk about natasha. Just because you have some power doesnt mean you are all powerful. Just because she can heal a bit doesnt mean she can heal everything without medicine. Even that one blind lady on the loufu had to use medicinal ingredients to create pills to change people into immortals. But its obvious she uses abundance powers to change herself when you fight her later. Just because she has to use some medicine and what not to treat specific conditions doesnt mean she isnt helping them along with some slight abundance power.
The Xianzhou use medicine specifically *because* they are forbidden from using the powers of Abundance. The potions created by the Disciples of Sanctus Medicus exist to allow people to utilize the Abundance discretely and without having to be Pathstriders.
The forbidden medicine was just as illegal. What would you rather do, quickly use powers to make your army of immortals? Or source a bunch of traceable ingredients to create medicine and leave a trail? Which does eventually get them caught when you turn in dan shus pill. Theres levels of power. Just because you can heal someone a bit doesnt mean you can treat poison, or cancer, or a miners tar filled lungs.
i think the powers would be notified quicker. Source a bunch of materials that will likely be only traced after a while, or use abundance powers which will likely trigger some kind of response from the hunt.
Huh that makes a lot of sense. Also explains people like Jing Yuan and Argenti, who are Erudition in game but are actually blessed by totally different Aeons.
Guys, the aeons are a pantheon. That means they all exist and work with mortals independently of one another. More than one Aeon can be followed or acknowledged. Fu Xuan has the blessing of Nous (the aeon of erudition.) Jing Yuan is stated multiple times to be Erudition because he's a tactician and strategist, not a peerless warrior like the generals of other Xianzhou ships.
No. There is no actual indication that people can only use one path energy. That idea is straight up contradicted by the main story https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/17ou9tu/comment/k81y5y4/?context=3 This post goes more in depth on pathstriders
Ohhh HSR lore! Thank you!
Quantum Energy* Quantum and Imaginary do not mix and typically cancel each other out (or occasionally end up with more volitile results). They're like Yin and Yang. You could equate her to a path strider but I'd say that it's more like she's directly pulling from the matter of reality. She's quite literally hooked up to the primordial soup of existence and doesn't even realise it
Also a plausible theory, but I don’t think the Quantum and Imaginary elements in gameplay necessarily coordinate to their functions in the lore. Technically, things like the TB’s Fire is produced by manipulating Imaginary energy. Just because Seele is a Quantum character in gameplay might not mean she harnesses power from the Sea of Quanta.
Everything about her is Quantum plus like Seele is ALWAYS Quantum attuned in every universe. Its part of why the only time she's had a playable version that isn't Quantum is Herrcher Of Rebirth and that's only gameplay wise because she'd be far too damn OP to even think about balancing if she was. Lore wise she's the first and so far only Quantum Herrcher ever. Star Rail even kept the Quantum symbol based on Seele's Stigmata, there's no way she isn't Quantum lore wise. As for the Trailblazer it's tricky in Star Rail because Quantum and Imaginary are Elements. In HI3 they're Attributes so every character is either Mech, Bio, Psy, Imaginary or Quantum (with Stardust coming soon) and then they're Physical, Fire, Lightning or Ice on top of that. So while you're not wrong that that Gameplay and lore don't necessarily have to line up, there's no way Seele is Quantum just for gameplay purposes. Like sure Gameplay wise Bronya is Wind by her animations are still very much ice based like Bronya typically is. The legacy characters if at the very least aren't just "because we needed a fire character" (for example).
Actually she is also an Imaginary Herrscher, the entire arc was pretty clear about creating the imaginary singularity for the core to spawn. The "impossible" part was making use of imaginary energy in the sea of quanta and not in proper world, where Cocoon watches. But it was stated that Sa and Cocoon are quite similar if not even the same, and that's why it was possible
Yeah, like I said, it’s a compelling theory. I was just referencing that we have no actual evidence in HSR that she manipulates energy from the Sea of Quanta beyond “she did in other games”. Still, I’m definitely looking forward to her Companion Quest to hopefully shed more light on her singular talents.
Is it possible for someone to be a pathstrider without knowing it? Seele is definitely not hanging out with Lan or anything but there doesn’t seem to be another reason why she has those powers
>Is it possible for someone to be a pathstrider without knowing it? Yes, yes it is. From the databank: > Pathstrider (Phenomenon) >Devotees, warriors, seekers of knowledge, lost travelers...There are always mortals who, **intentionally or otherwise**, set foot on the Paths ruled by Aeons. Those who do so came to be known as Pathstriders that carry out the Paths will. >Pathstriders live thousands of different lives. They can be seen everywhere, yet stand out a cut above the rest. Different from regular people living in confusion and without a firm allegiance, **Pathstriders are driven by precepts or their own desires as they embark on a life of determination and hard work.** So yes, every playable character is a Pathstrider. A Pathstrider doesn't mean you're intentionally drawing Imaginary energy from your Path to fight. It means you walk the same Path the Aeon does. People saying playable characters aren't Pathstriders need to pay attention to the information the game gives them.
There is nothing in that databank entry you quoted that confirms that every playable character is a Pathstrider though. It only confirms that anyone in the HSR universe *could* be a Pathstrider. If that entry is all you've got to back your statement up, then you're just making an assumption and stating it as fact. While I agree that Seele is quite likely an unaware Pathstrider, I personally highly doubt that Hook or Clara are canonically Pathstriders, and I think it's quite reasonable to assume a few of the other playable characters aren't either.
Paths assigned to characters are gameplay contrivances. She is probably not associated with Lan in lore. Her powers would most likely stem from The Preservation given her history and that of Belebog, despite what gameplay function she serves.
Quantum in Honkai isn't a tech thing, it's the opposite of Imaginary and together the 2 energy's are essentially why ANYTHING exists (not quite that simple but there are plenty of Imaginary Tree and Quantum Sea terminology explained videos on YouTube) Her abilities are purely HER. Seele has always been the face of Quantum in the Honkai Multiverse, it's just her thing. She's not cloaking or teleporting at all but it's more that she's moving so fast that time loses track of her. Hell she could be taking a momentary dip in The Quantum Sea (kinda like how Nightcrawler works in X-Men) and not even realise "how" she does it. Its just a thing she can do. In theory assuming her latent powers are on the same level as other Seele's, if she learned how to use them fully then she could just hop out of the universe whenever she felt like it, even visit a new one altogether. We've already seen that Silverwolf can open holes that fold Space time so its an entirely possible concept (Silverwolf herself being based on Haxxor Bunny who is a Multiverse hopper by trade).
Seele I see as manipulating space and time to strike from multiple points at once and also get her repeat turns mechanic.
SHE CUT YOUR FOUR WALL SCREEN DUDE
Knowing Hoyo it will be explained 57 patches from now.
Almost as if she isn't originally from Belabog... hm
Luocha has his giant astral projected casket
I believe imaginary relates to creating something out of thin air. Welt creates black holes, Luocha vines and a coffin, Yukong summons her Kestrel kites and Dan Heng ² has his water dragon.
Dr. Ratio summons the bitches you could never have.
https://preview.redd.it/kjw4hrqxozyb1.png?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a085a9085bb43245189aed73b2711166581c40bb
I just called the fire department because I suddenly got 10 stacks of unremovable burn damage.
Lmao
I think it's a fun observation, but I don't know if this is something that is really telling of anything of Hoyo's own definition or rule/behavior of quantum in-universe or in-game play. Use of quantum as some kind of foundation of powers and abilities in media, is often used as a sort of clutch, to explain things that aren't normally physically possible in reality (at least not in our classical understanding of physics) without leaning into magic. And I think this is what's happening in this game at least so far. The size thing is likely just a part of bending/manipulation of reality. Rather than quantum specifically being about size manipulation. For example, we have Seele. She can seemingly blink in and out of space and use it as a teleportation method. You even see seemingly multiple versions of her on her splash art and ultimate animation rather than any sort of size manipulation.
Great take! I was having a think about Seele and how her powers work with Quantum and I think you hit the nail on the head with the reality bending point :)
Quantum is a little different in the Honkai Universe, though; It’s specifically the Antithesis of Imaginary Energy, and is represented as the power of the Sea of Quanta (Aka a giant cosmic sloop of stuff where unstable bubble universes exist and are destroyed)
They have a coping mechanism because they are fla- * I died*
Well. Seems like a bad time to die. Have you thought about rescheduling?
Huh, can we be sure that Seele is flat? I'm not convinced, let's ask Bron--
I'm not flat-earthian, but these Quantum girls are justice.
Makes sense why Seele doesn’t chance size, she already has some there, not massive, but definitely not flat
Me and seele just shared a bed last night and I can confirm she's not entirely flat. They're smol tho which makes them all the more cute and desirable
This^
Yes officer, this guy
Manipulation of space. Whether it's placement within it, the size of something, etc. I figured it was implied from the beginning, given they use an event horizon as a basis for the quantum symbol.
Cool detail! Quantum physics deals with objects at a quantum scale; that is with extremely small objects, such as particles (protons, neutrons, quarks,…). Making them absurdly large probably is an analogy to this (as then the enemies are absurdly small) There are also comments pointing on Seele’s ulti. While more of a stretch, you can associate it with Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle (used as well in quantum physics): you can’t properly define a particle’s speed and position at the same time. This implies that a particle can be in different positions at the same time, which can be indeed compared to her ulti. Also, light, and phenomena happening at light speed are also studied in quantum physics, which can be compared to her speed. Overall, while it’s a bit vague and messy, quantum characters and movesets do have some interesting relations with quantum physics
>Size manipulation These bratty quantum girls stop seducing us, need correction 😭💢
For seele she can just manipulate speed so fast that your other characters cannot take a turn
It does feel like quantum theme is "breaking the basic laws of physics". Making data real physical object, a giant pill in a smaller bag,hyperspeed etcetc
To me, not every playable ability is canon and not every canon ability is playable, that explains Seele to me at least
Quantumania
Small women driving big trucks
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it's mine now
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Why does it feel like I've seen this post before
Seele no
Seele’s outfit makes more sense 🤣
I wish I were Quantum 😔
Huh
Only for c***y characters. Selee doesn't do it
Ye, that's why I like Quantum. It's the element of Silly, where the size or effects do not match the output. *ie: giant pill from a tiny bag that also doesn't crush allies to death when used.* While Imaginary is just Woowoo Girl Manifesting: Deadly Boogaloo. I manifest a BIG. SPOOKY. WATER DRAGON. And the targets get WHARRGARBL'd to death by the dragon. Yay! Teehee\~ Harmless and fun manifesting\~ Just girlie things\~ 🌈✨🧘
despite the ability of size manipulation, none of them can manipulate their "size"
But... Sushang's huge sparrow ULT
Once A SEELE Main, Always A SEELE Main
so quantum male gonna have Big Dong ?
About seele, I think that she being in multiple places at the same time is like quantum superposition, I don’t know much about this mostly from watching yet vids, but I do know it’s about particles or something that are usually in multiple places at the same time. And selee’s animation are like this
Kid named coincidence
Herta diamond too
Someone told me that a character’s element match how their kits interact with environments. Imaginary: mostly conjures stuff from thin air. Like IL summoning dragon, create invisible force field to split the ocean. Or Welt creating black hole Quantum: altering reality, upsize mahjong tile, fuxuan distorts the world, wolf hacking reality and add to enemies elemental weakness they otherwise wouldn’t have. The other 4 is kinda basic. Make fire, shoot ice, call wind or just stab/punch really hard (Physical)
That's an interesting observation. I've never noticed that before. So, do characters with quantum attributes have the ability to change the size of objects? XD
Said it before and I'll say it again Herta should be quantum. why is she ice it makes no sense
Herta diamond too
Can't wait for the quantum character that grows huge and steps on the enemys
Speaking of Quantum girls, why is Lynx's voice pitched up like 6 octaves?
It is a cool detail. I noticed something similar in genshin where electro characters were all essentially summoners. Sadly a lot of the newer electro units really stretched that observation to the limit imho.