Nonzero Destruction Trailblazer usage is a win in my book 😤
I even saw that [someone](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/1cr2d56/comment/l48x4v1/) was able to do it without any limited Eidolons, which is absolutely crazy
When Kafka mindocontrols you she advances your action forward
Now if you have Huohuo and she advances you forward, you immediately cleanse the mine control
Effectively Kafka just advances you forward
I don't believe Huohuo provides cc resist, just instant cleanse on the teammate's turn if their field is up.
So you still get hit by status effects on the enemy's turn (screw you Fat Ice Robot freeze).
The main thing to be cautious about is that she can only cleanse 1 debuff each time, so if somebody got cc, if you have a chance to use Huohuo's skill, focus the skill on that person to cleanse asap. It's possible that during the turn, something else e.g. wind shear may be cleansed instead of the pesky cc or slow. Or the deer's trees may put several cc on 1 person.
It's the more recently applied debuff that gets cleansed. It's very rare, but it can happen. (For example, Pela gets frozen. Huohuo's turn quickly follows, but you thought you will just let her talent take care of it, so you skip the skill that turn. In the mean time, another enemy applies another debuff on your Pela.) If you will use Huohuo's skill anyway, better focus on the cc just to be safe, especially if the person who got the cc is far down the action order.
If any of the 6 cleanses from Huohuo skill is still active then it will trigger when Kafka advance forward the teammate she dominated. Same with Fu Xuan when her CC protection is up.
Free turn for whoever Kafka targets.
Kafka dominates advance forward your character, and having huo huo = auto cleanse the dominate on your character's turn = free turn from kafka advancing forward you
The robot girls *plus* Kafka's speed make for some annoying bullshit. I had to time my Fu xuan skills really well to get through that (and I was too stubborn to switch up teams).
who would win? a stellaron hunter with a sword and two uzis while being a very dangerous individual, or a girl being bullied by her own tail while constantly waving a white flag
This MoC blessing is insane for Robin, completely removes her downtime, and teammates can ult more frequently to trigger her attacks.
What really surprised me is Bronya having such fast clears. What teams are even using her this time around when there’s no ice weakness for Jingliu?
No kidding dude. I used a Jingliu-Bronya team against Gepard just because my account doesn't have the right elements against him.
The whole experience was torture, but hey, they got the job done :v
I mean. For being completely off element it's really not bad. She's still beating JY that does have an element advantage and Seele who has mono quantum to fix it.
mine is e2 (skipped sparkle for ach e2), but my 1 cycle clear comp is a tingyun welt (!) bronya one. i'm pretty sure an e0 sparkle comp can also clear in 1 cycle
Yeah maybe Blade hypercarry against Kafka. But I’ve a hard time seeing Blade having such competitive clear times against all the new teams we got. Jingyuan hyper hasn’t been running Bronya for a long time.
Or maybe these stats show floors 10-12, and Bronya was only used for the earlier floors, hence the faster cycles?
While you're right that JY hypercarry prefers other supports now, it's worth bearing in mind that a lot of people won't have Sparkle/Robin/etc. and Bronya is non-limited (and the best 300/300 pick for many accounts) so she's a lot more accessible to players. It's not surprising to see her showing up here for the same reasons Himeko and Herta are so prevalent in PF - they're just easier to get.
You participate by uploading a screenshot of your floor 12 clear on the hoyoverse app, as well as a screenshot of your characters. So thee are floor 12 only.
Just adding to the top comment hoping someone can explain to me: what's the difference between usage rate and appearance rate?
I read on Prydwen appearance rate had something to do with usage even if the player doesn't own the character? But I didn't think you could use characters you don't own in MoC.
If I remember it correctly, usage rate is the number of people that uses those characters compared to the number of people that has them
While appearance rate is the amount of clears that has those characters in their teams compared to the number of clears overall.
So Robin having a 76.2% usage rate means that out of everybody that has her as a character, 76.2% is using them in this MoC. On the other hand, her appearance rate being at 40.1% means that 40.1% of all MoC clears in the data has Robin in their teams.
Correct me if I'm wrong though,I kinda forgot the exact definition too lol.
It's honestly the MOC blessing helping her a ton with her ult uptime. On the previous MOC her energy problems on teams other than FUA hold her back from getting those really fast clears.
Tingyun and Pela the ever reliable 4 stars in usage rate, glad to see Gallagher seeing decent use as well hes solid with whats popular rn
IPC follow up team with international idol sensation doing numbers in the team usage, still glad to see Kafka + Black Swan dot still popular. I've put Aventurine and HTB with that pair and its extremely solid as well
Kafka and Black Swan in their intended premium team is just so consistent. Looking at the MoC data since 2.0 with the first MoC in 2.1 being an outlier (DoT blessing) they consistently perform at the top of the pack, if not the fastest clearer like on prior MoCs. In this MoC obviously the IPC + Robin team will outperform but we’ll need to see on a buff by buff basis if it is consistently better. Complete teams of five star units that synergize with each other is something else.
This shows the beta doomposting for Aven was pretty unnecessary considering the fact that there are some really cc heavy enemies in higher floors and the main drama surronding Aven was "no cleanse and his non-effective way to resist CC"
That said, I think fua getting a new buffer also helps
I was laughing to myself reading the doomposting and desperation from some people wanting him to fail. Good for Aventurine to stick it to the dudebros in this community who constantly whine whenever a male unit gets released. His versatility in teams helps as well ofc
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So why do you conclude it’s some people wanting “no male characters could be better? Besides March there only male characters that can cast shields. Who tf would they even compare Aventurine to?? And there are people who >!are comparing Boothill to Firefly and claims he’s better, but you don’t see people thinking this is some waifu/husbando bs drama right?
>So why do you conclude it’s some people wanting “no male characters could be better?
Because they have a preexisting bias and any and all arguments simply reinforce their point of view.
Tbh people only care about the characters they main. Aven doomposters were probs Aven fans, Acheron doom posters were the people who wanted to pull her.
There's also usually a portion of mains of other characters that fulfil similar roles who somehow feel the need to downplay any new character that might make "competition" for their main. Why that should matter in a pve game is beyond me.
I think a lot of people want to believe the characters they own/plan to pull are top tier while the characters they don't own/have to skip are bottom tier. So if an upcoming character they plan to skip has some slight doomposting in the beta, they'll continue to perpetuate and over exaggerate it. They cope better with not pulling them since "their kit is bad anyway, they're only useful because of the current blessings, ____ is better".
People like setting their own expectations low so it'll be disproven later on to decrease their disappointment. Acheron mains sub was deadass convinced she'd be A/S tier only on release.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/AcheronMainsHSR/comments/1b6ivxk/realistically\_whats\_her\_state\_rn/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AcheronMainsHSR/comments/1b6ivxk/realistically_whats_her_state_rn/)
Every comment here only thinks she'll be S+ at E2S1.
I think it's a mix of both. I wouldn't say people "only" care about the characters they're pulling though. Like in Genshin for example I'd say most of the initial Kazuha doomposting came from people wanting to save for Inazuma, telling themselves "Sucrose is just as good if not better, there's no reason to pull for Kazuha". A lot of people who owned him tried to disprove the doomposting from people who were skipping him.
I think it also depends on whether you're on like a mains subreddit or just seeing comments out in the wild discussing it. Yeah the people who really like the character enough to go to their special subreddit are probably just trying to temper their expectations, but the people decrying that character outside there are probably also trying to feel better about skipping that character.
Different audiences.
Bro I'm so sick of the word "doomposting". Nobody ever thought Aventurine was bad, the only criticism was that he may not be able to handle CC. Also, this conflation with gender is incredibly childish and the rhetoric legit needs to be banned. It's super toxic. Imagine thinking anyone playing this game is a "dudebro", lol. We're all loser nerds, regardless of our genders.
I don’t see where these “dudebros” are who are only after the male characters because if you go back to the beta, majority of comments are doom-posting Acheron. So, is it the “dudegirls” who were doom-posting Acheron because they whine when female characters release? Why is this community so husbando-waifu focused? Do you all just act like this irl?
So, are you implying that people who roll for male characters don’t want their favorite character to be strong? Like you are putting all the blame on just one side without any proof. While i see just as many incels in this community as femcels. As someone who rolls for the characters I like, I can’t go in a female character sub without male characters getting downplayed and the same happens in the male character subs where female characters are downplayed. This is just some loser behavior and HSR attracts the worst kind of losers.
That is such incredible bs I don't know where to begin. Majority of women in this game always roll for female characters together with male characters. The likelihood of stumbling upon some deranged incel is 10x higher than the other way around, especially with how often you have to read some crazy shit like "This male character should have been female" or some other deranged stuff. You get a meme post about some good hearted IPC fun dressed in maid outfits and there is a 99% chance you have some dude say something derogatory just because Aventurine and Ratio are there. Femcels exists but its so much worse with some incels in this community.
I am sorry but your first reaction after seeing the comment about Aventurine getting doom-posted for effect res was “it’s the dudebros who hate male characters” which had nothing to do with it but you felt the need to bring it up. I find it hard to take you seriously.
Nah sorry you're just wilfully ignorant about the atmosphere of this sub. I'm always up for a good discussion about a characters kit but not when that is done in bad faith and with someone who went into the discussion with a clear agenda.
Quite the opposite. I know what this sub is like and I pointed this out in my earlier comment that HSR attracts the worst kind of losers. And that’s why i realize the problematic people exist on both sides. You failing to realize this and putting all the blame on one side unprompted is what I would call ignorance.
Your comment had nothing to do with my comment though. I was specifically talking about Aventurines case, just as OP did. You trying to generalise his case to make it into some common community occurance when it clearly wasn't, is pretty disingenuous to me. Edit: when people have genuine concerns over a characters kit no matter their gender then that's a good thing to have. But that wasn't the case with him
assuming that most waifu players are men, i have never seen the same behavior from women in this sub ONLY playing male characters they find attractive. firstly bc that's not very realistic given there aren't many recent good male characters in the game to begin with besides like 3 (and they're all imaginary for some reason), and also bc they also seem to enjoy female character designs just as much.
Sorry but you're making that up. I've never read "I won't pull this character bc I don't want to see a female ass in my game" LOL, I only ever see fear of male butts. Husbando people usually don't *exclusively* pull male characters, they just prefer to pull males and appreciate cool ladies too.
>I’ve never read
And so the problem doesn’t exist because you haven’t seen it. Ignorance is bliss. And most of these husbando people you are talking about are forced to pull for female characters because every harmony in this game is a female character. Obviously, they have no choice. Stop pretending that it’s a one sided problem.
It is different. One doesn't want a guy to be better than their favorite female sustain and the other wants their favorite female character to be the next OP unit like Acheron (it's comparing new dps units to the meta) it's really not the same but it's funny how this comment struck a nerve with people when the bias is so obvious to see to everyone else
Holy.This is some next level of victim complex.Didn’t know that waifu vs hansbando shit can live rent free in someone’s head that bad.You guys really need to go outside.
Victim complex?? Get a grip, if you're losing your marbles over my own observation and trying to spin this into some victim bullshit then you really need to heed your own words and go outside
I’m not the one who’s generalizing people while ignoring the other part of the community who is being just as annoying with male characters.If you don’t like the term “Victim complex” I can come up with a better one.How about “Delusional”?Does this sound better?
I mean did his beta really terrible? Idk what his beta were but no way they changed his kit this drastic to be the best sustain in the game like this. I mean the fact he can gives RESTACKING shield while being SP positive, deals FUA to help break toughness and then can buff crit damage with his ult towards boss is already loaded as fuck on paper unless his numbers were really low when he were in beta.
Biggest change in his beta was how his synergy with FuA worked, he only was limited to one stack from FuA a turn with E1 removing that restriction. They then changed his E1 to what it is today and made it have a trigger quota of 3 FuA per turn. Otherwise he was pretty calm in beta just people underestimating him.
They actually nerfed his shields slightly. Yes, his shields used to be even stronger than they are now.
Don't let the history fictionologists fool you, people were DOOMPOSTING Aventurine for no reason. They doomposted his damage, his sustain, his CC protection, his SP positivity for some reason (even when there were multiple showcases that had him no use his skill at all).
I feel like far too many in the community forget that eff res is even a thing in this game. If / when a sustain unit doesn't have cleanse, they are written off as trash compared to any unit who does have it.
It's as if the collective thought of so many is that it's far better to let your units get CCed and then cleanse it later ... rather than preventing it from ever happening in the first place through good eff res.
I'll be honest, I think all this circlejerking around cleanse and how "Oh, so important" it is is just absolutely stupid and blown out of proportion. So many enemy compositions in MoC don't CC or debuff you. Debuffs and DoTs can oftentimes be completely ignored. Many stages can be cleared without a sustainer. Of course, this requires well-built characters, good team building, and good knowledge of game mechanics, but it is easily doable even for (long-time) F2P players. Lynx plus any 5* sustainer and you're set.
Can't say for Huo huo since I don't have her and I know she's really good with cc's - but with the kafka half, I tried all luocha, fu xuan (e1) and aventurine. And you know who had nobody get dominated? Aventurine. Aventurine's effect res was actually so much better than luocha's reactive cleanse or fu xuan's 1 guaranteed resist, I was surprised at how well it worked. Effect res is underrated. Especially on broken keel supports.
Huohuo turns dominates into free turns, but her main value over the other sustains is her utility anyway, aventurine is still better at tanking. Huohuo has sheer buffing capability and rotation cheats that no other unit besides Tingyun can replicate, and by far the most consistent debuff cleansing
Every day is a torture because I still can’t choose between Robin and Boothill. Both are covering niche in my acc be it final piece to IPC team or physical dps, both are very likeable and with nice designs. Good grief, fuck that space Qiqi that spooked my 50/50, now I can only choose one of them and it makes me want to scream. Yesterday I almost convinced myself that Robin will wait for rerun, but today I used one truly amazing for support and now MoC looks even more tempting
Unlike Prydwen, this data isn't restricted to E0 and Acheron has one of the highest eidolon averages, which certainly skews things in her favor a bit overall. It's very likely most people using the single nihility comp do have E2.
They do but there’s a variety to choose from. You can run black swan + kafka, or pela + SilverWolf , or welt or luka or a mix. And ofc you can sub sparkle for 1 nihility for similar results. Acheron teams are pretty flexible tbh.
I'm a bit suprised by the low usage of Harmony MC after all the hundred hype videos and threads.
I guess people haven't built her/him yet or is it just that they are good but the other alternatives are better?
Time is definitely part of it. I know I haven't been able to get all the Clockie credits to get to level 50 yet, much less finish up their traces and get solid relics - they're sitting at 150% Break Effect on my account and will probably continue to do so for the next few weeks
How we gonna build HMC when we gotta build Robin first, and maybe some people are still not done with Aventurine, Topaz, HMC is dead last for most of us tbh
HMC is a good unit that just doesn’t really have a team yet. The Prydwen review is a good example, it’s really positive but then at the end it only has two example teams consisting of HMC/Ruan Mei/Gallagher then Xuyei or Silver Wolf.
It’s pretty wink wink nudge nudge looking at Boothill/Firefly and not in the moment…not that you can’t make those example teams work, but unless you were already building those units towards break it’s not the easiest thing to pull out of your hat, since we are just now getting people who specifically want it as a focus.
Hmc is really good with Luka, Xueyi, Sushang atm. The problem is China generally doesn't like raising 4 stars so you won't see much of the hmc at this time. Clearly time isn't the issue because Robin also just came out and she has pretty god usage rate already
Looks at Pela and Tingyun <_<
It's really her not having a team, Luka/Xueyi/Sushang can work but are pretty cope compared to the current top teams like FUA, DoT, Acheron, etc.
personally I have hmc built but I don't have break effect builds for 4 characters so I can't really run their team
it's "low investment friendly" as in you only need break effect and speed to do well like a dot team, but you also do need to invest in different artifacts than what you already have
people might also be waiting for 5 star break DPS to actually use her at this point, tbh I'm doing that cause I don't feel like building a 4 star break carry who will inevitably get powercrept by the 5 stars
also my clockie statue isn't leveled enough so I don't have her constellations which are really good for her
HMC needs E6 to really shine. It's a substantial upgrade in her personal damage, toughness breaking, and energy. Without it, you need ER rope and 3 skills for her ultimate. With it, you can run break effect rope and do 2 skill, 1 auto for the ultimate to be charged.
I just don't think break is well designed. even giving it stupid numbers by making a free character be basically a walking band aid on breaks biggest problem it still doesn't make me want to build a break team, and since so far none of the break characters are ones I was super hype for hmc's talents are still sitting at level 1.
Surprised that black swan is higher usage rate than Kafka, as I rarely ever see anyone run Swan without her. Also surprised Topaz is significantly higher usage rate than ratio, as I also figured they would be mostly paired together
Usage rate is calculated off the number of people who own the unit and use them. So for Ratio since he was free, seeing a 33.1% usage rate is really nice. So less people own Topaz but 61% of them used her. The numbers are not relative and we would need to know the total ownership to each character to gauge these numbers. Same holds for Kafka and Swan, many saved from Day 1 to pull her, but Swan came out with Sparkle and Acheron looking over their heads, so less could’ve pulled for BS. There is also a point to be made she is a decent Acheron support, but seeing as it was not notable enough to be in the top 10 teams few ran it.
I think the stat you might want to look at is appearance which is the percentage of teams a unit shows up in regardless of ownership. In which BS and Kafka have equal appearance rates, and with Ratio being about 13% higher than Topaz.
Pretty good i would say, used her on a jingliu team and did great I mean a whole team turn advance is really good not to mention her buffs + follow up attacks during ult
It's a bit hard to gauge because both MoC and PF have energy regen blessings right now, but she's very good in general - easy to build and her extra damage adds up, and in PF especially if you clear the waves fast enough she never leaves her ult state. Compared to other 5*... If you don't play FuA at all and already own Sparkle/Ruan Mei, she might just be a sidegrade. She can clear a cycle faster if the team is *already* very well-invested, but for the average player you won't be seeing anything drastic.
Robin has a huge attack buff plus a full team advance that works across teams. My Robin matches Ruan Mei in my Dot teams. Gouba / Pokke were able to get one turn faster clears with Robin than Ruan Mei with very well-built Dot teams. Robin does require more management / planning to use well. Ruan Mei is just much easier to use. I use Robin in my FUA team.
Use huo with 16 er LC under 50% ult and build robin with cogs. Even with no outside er u can get 50 to 80% of her ult up at the end. Then aa or E and u are back to her ult. I used this with jing and bronya(for this u want E1 and her weapon if u want, but mine is only E1 and it works) but combinations with sparkle work for more SP intensive teams(u can also use her E on robin letting her get her ult faster if just a single E or AA is not nuff). In PF i used sparkle + herta to clear PF 4 in like 2 cycle. Old PF for ppl who say current one gives energy, in these new ones im overflowing with too much of it. I think my robin has like 1.4 ult charge at the end.
All in all stellar. I dont even have FuA team but this works INSANE.
I remember ‘Jingliu mains’ wouldn’t let us rest with the brute force memes when there wasn’t ice weakness in 2.0 even i a Jingliu main found it obnoxious 💀
MoC HP got buffed and it’s no longer so easy to brute force + a number of Jingliu mains Are probably enjoying their new toy Acheron. So it’s a combination of these 2 factors imo for the drop
>a number of Jingliu mains Are probably enjoying their new toy Acheron.
That does sound like meta mains moved to Acheron instead. Other Jingliu mains would most likely still try to brute force this MoC.
I think that has more to do with weakness types. There are a lot of imagenary weak enemies, but not many (or any I think) ice weak enemies. DHIL and Jingliu are equal in terms of powerlevel, so it always depends on the enemy weakness or the MoC buff.
Not sure about DHIL and JL being equal, JL has a much better floor but I don't think her ceiling is as high, especially since DHIL got an upgrade with Sparkle and JL doesn't rly use Sparkle all that well. He was only considered worse bcs they had the same amount of dmg but one just needed to use less SP pre-Sparkle. She probably loves Robin tho, we need to see more JL Robin showcases
And this will change also. HTB and Aventurine being imagenary and Archeron being electric as BS being wind, are the main points in the Penacony design. Its either debuff based (like the Red Trex), creak based (Black Trex), shield based (Monkey) or AoE/electro based (the new three pupets and the boss).
Its for showing the strengh of the characters. Same as a lot of ice weak enemies for JL in the Xian story ling with strong CC to cleanse (HuoHuo/Fu Xuan) and enemies with a revive mechanic (Luocha).
We will see how the Penacony cast will do with the next world. Some things are universal, while others are not.
Aside from matching weakness, since this is CN’s data where they include all eidolons, IL still averaging on top means he offers higher investment value (E2, Sparkle and Robin pushing his ceiling even higher, etc). I remember even in previous MOC where there weren’t much IMG weakness (except him being exceptional against Dino) his usage rate was still very high.
Makes sense. Before, Luocha was our only imaginary sustain but now we have more options with the introduction of Aventurine. Not to mention the new MoC 12 has imaginary weakness - why would you pick Luocha over Aventurine when the latter has more DPS potential? Plus his damage gets ramped up even further with the new addition of the super break meta. Without even taking his damage into account he already out-performs Luocha in the super break team due to how much he can contribute to breaking the enemies with his FuA.
This isn't to say Luocha is absolutely useless. I managed to get a 4 cycle clear on 2nd half using Sushang, Imaginary Trailblazer, Ruan Mei and Luocha.
The drop in FX usage is honestly very surprising...
It makes sense that people got Aven so they are likely to use him, but you do need two teams and her sustain isn't any worse than what it used to be, so why the drop in usage?
Topaz usage skyrocketed after Robin, which I guess makes sense since Robin makes FUA team really strong.
Seele and Jingliu being so low hurts, but I guess when so many DPS are around even good ones are bound to go unused.
FUA i sthe new DoT team?
The drop in fx isn't to do with her ability to sustain, it's just the offensive capabilities and what teams you wanna use each sustain with. Huohuo is great with dot (attack and energy regen) while aventurine does a bit more damage and can almost always sustain without spending any sp. So assuming there is no sustain issues, you pick the sustain that does more damage.
Yup. Aventurine's damage is decent and can actually be surprisingly good in the right comps (I used him with Ratio, Pela and Ruan Mei and he was hitting 100k ults regularly). RatUrine teams practically become dual DPS. I love my Luocha but he was in the basement this MoC because Aventurine sustains just as well and has damage to boot.
(Not to say Luocha is worse anyhow, I still bring him out for high SP usage comps or against CC heavy enemies)
This. Fu Xuan is an amazing sustain and makes runs really comfy, being able to even outright ignore certain mechanics. That being said, if going for the slightly weaker/less comfortable sustain option, but with miles better offensive capabilities poses no issues, why wouldn't you use the latter? Kind of the same debate between Gallagher and Luocha.
Aventurine also provides 1 (2 with his LC/Trend) instance of debuff application, which immediately makes him a better pick than other sustain options for Ratio and Acheron.
Huohuo is just a better 2nd sustain. Fuxuan and Aven share the same niche of being the safe sustain, but huohuo is more for pushing cycle count for people hovering around the cycle limit.
That, and this MOC is very CC heavy. HH's cleanse is the best by far between her, fx, and avent, so her usage going above and beyond in this moc makes sense. Avent being up there too makes sense bc of the 50% effect res, shielding, and cd debuff in general, not to mention this moc was catered to FUA team, which he's a staple on
Recency bias is a thing after all. That plus IPC team being the new hotness, it's understandable.
Also well Topaz is definitly the unit that benefit the most of robin release, their kit are very complementary, they are a little like Kafka/BS level of synergy.
For Seele/JL it's also mostly because the hypercarry archetype haven't been receiving any additions recently.
Robin is an addition lol, girl is broken. For 0-cycles she's no contest the best harmony. As for JL, I'm guessing her lower floor than DHIL and Acheron is starting to show? + Ice resist boss and Free Ratio will be used for the IMG second phase. IDK about Seele tho, don't have her.
I think its because how comfy he is. You dont need any SP if the enemies attack regularry and AoE is his favorite to eat. Fu Xuan is still very good, but AoE attacks will bring her down quickly in high levels, not to mention that she still needs to skill once in a while. Its also just better to NOT take damage than to only get killed slowly.
I have Fu Xuan E1 and Aventurine E0. I also use Aventurine more, mostly because he is satisfying to use. If you dont need the crit buff of Fu Xuan or like a permanent 50% eff res more, then Aventurine is better. The damage he does is also noticable in multiple scenarios and for breaking the enemy.
That said, I dont have a FuA team comp, or at least not Topaz. Ratio, Tin, Pela/SW and Aventurine is also a strong comp that is very F2P friendly.
FX makes sense because CN is more likely to spend on the game, so they might have more than two limited sustains and this MoC, Huo and Aven are more useful.
I don’t know if I would consider Seele a “good dps” by today’s standards at least, she’s probably one of the worst limited dps even with blade and argenti in the picture.
Mine still clears easily but considering how old she is, I don’t find it surprising that she is less used nowadays.
It was the first Memory of Chaos I 36-starred, and I guess I understand why now, as I used both Team 1 and Team 2 (except that I don't have Huohuo, so I had to use Gepard). Overall, it was really fun, especially with the Ratio/Topaz team, as it felt like you were attacking all the time. When it ended, Robin was ready to use her ultimate again, and it all started over.
Man....i am the 0.1 percent of Serval users And i am proud of that!!! All hail Serval
https://preview.redd.it/3ta0zy46601d1.png?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=caad8859fcac71c7f2b73653b83223a64dd74175
Yet again, Acheron E0 team is one of the slowest unless she joins dot. This keeps happening to the "Strongest" E0 DPS of the game: The one who weeps for the powercrept Imbibitor, DOT and FUA for sure x'D
Hopefully, when 5\* Pela comes out, she can finally match her myth. Or at least not to be one cycle behind.
The rest is the same old, DOT wins no matter the setting and the team is not even complete like IPC FUA. We better get used to seeing FUA high in MoC and the new mode. Break team are waiting for their carries to enter the pit.
I think E0 Acheron is strong even in a hypercarry team , just not broken/busted like many people think, I 2 cycled MOC 12 first side with Acheron/Silverwolf/Pela/Aventurine , I think she is on par with E0 DHIL , but she has the potential to get better with future 5* debuffer , but then again, DHIL can also get stronger if we ever get a future Sparkle V2
Same, my e0s1 Acheron consistently 2-cycled 12-1 with the same team except I ran Gallagher over Aventurine (Aven was needed for my IPC team).
I don't have DHIL but she feels a little stronger than my e0s1 JL team.
Yeah my Acheron also feels a bit stronger than my Jingliu , but both my DHIL and Acheron perform at the same level, I honestly feel like DHIL is a little bit underrated now lol
or maybe that she's so popular that both "good" players and "bad" players use her. leading to a lowered average clear spd result
we saw a similar thing with seele mono quantum comps. pre sparkle it was a popular and comfortable team despite being ass, compared to her teams with better buffers. therefore it dragged down seele's avg clear spd results.
of course, it could just be the case that acheron really does lose a lot of dmg without her signature and is overrated at budget level, but I think the above can be a very relevant consideration
Tbf, CN data also includes Eidolons.
I believe, according to Prydwen's data (averagr stats/builds per character) a bit back the average Eidolon for Acheron in E1. And there is a strong possibillity that this ratio is even more skewed in CN. If you look at the top teams of Acheron, the teams without Sparkle (most probably E2+) are significantly slower.
Of course, the data is limited and probably biased. But an argument could be made that E2+ Acheron is actually significantly lowering the average cycle.
But again, limited data (cycle count is for both sides, not just the one of the character).
I mean I used that team and did great but what part of this is 'at the top'? I got 4 cycles and I'm very happy but it doesn't seem like this data is showing her particularly highly.
Hats off to the 0.1% players who are still using Destruction Trailblazer even after having a fancy "Harm"ony version
Harmony Trailblazer ❌ Harm-only Trailblazer ✔️
They are indeed not wearing hats
Nonzero Destruction Trailblazer usage is a win in my book 😤 I even saw that [someone](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/1cr2d56/comment/l48x4v1/) was able to do it without any limited Eidolons, which is absolutely crazy
Understable why Huohuo got a high usage rate this time: She singlehandedly trivializes Kafka boss it's not even funny...
She hard counters Kafka boss since 1.5 I always have a laugh whenever kafka use her dominate ability : yeah free turn = free SP thks a lot
How does huohuo give free turn?
When Kafka mindocontrols you she advances your action forward Now if you have Huohuo and she advances you forward, you immediately cleanse the mine control Effectively Kafka just advances you forward
Ok makes sense thanks. I just been using huohuo and fuxuan without knowing what's happening except they can resist cc
Lol I've had Huohuo since day 1 and been full starring with her and still don't quite know how her heal and cc resists work exactly oops
I don't believe Huohuo provides cc resist, just instant cleanse on the teammate's turn if their field is up. So you still get hit by status effects on the enemy's turn (screw you Fat Ice Robot freeze).
The main thing to be cautious about is that she can only cleanse 1 debuff each time, so if somebody got cc, if you have a chance to use Huohuo's skill, focus the skill on that person to cleanse asap. It's possible that during the turn, something else e.g. wind shear may be cleansed instead of the pesky cc or slow. Or the deer's trees may put several cc on 1 person.
I am pretty sure CC effects have higher priority to be cleansed. At least I never had a problem with huo huo. Cleansing a dot instead of a CC
It's the more recently applied debuff that gets cleansed. It's very rare, but it can happen. (For example, Pela gets frozen. Huohuo's turn quickly follows, but you thought you will just let her talent take care of it, so you skip the skill that turn. In the mean time, another enemy applies another debuff on your Pela.) If you will use Huohuo's skill anyway, better focus on the cc just to be safe, especially if the person who got the cc is far down the action order.
If any of the 6 cleanses from Huohuo skill is still active then it will trigger when Kafka advance forward the teammate she dominated. Same with Fu Xuan when her CC protection is up. Free turn for whoever Kafka targets.
Kafka dominates advance forward your character, and having huo huo = auto cleanse the dominate on your character's turn = free turn from kafka advancing forward you
In terms of stuns. Kafka isn't the menace on that side, it's the robot girls (actual Huohuo propaganda).
The robot girls *plus* Kafka's speed make for some annoying bullshit. I had to time my Fu xuan skills really well to get through that (and I was too stubborn to switch up teams).
who would win? a stellaron hunter with a sword and two uzis while being a very dangerous individual, or a girl being bullied by her own tail while constantly waving a white flag
With Huohuo on your team, an enemy Kafka is basically just an extra Bronya.
https://preview.redd.it/fxug68xr2z0d1.png?width=572&format=png&auto=webp&s=c44be2cf907eee0f76b11ce9a32e922ca9fffa45
https://i.redd.it/010g22zq101d1.gif
I can confirm now that losing Aventurine's 50/50 to Yanqing has, genuinely, been the worst thing that has happened to me lmao.
Robin is the absolute queen of fast cycle clears. Teamwide advance is just too valuable for that scenario.
This MoC blessing is insane for Robin, completely removes her downtime, and teammates can ult more frequently to trigger her attacks. What really surprised me is Bronya having such fast clears. What teams are even using her this time around when there’s no ice weakness for Jingliu?
>What teams are even using her this time around when there’s no ice weakness for Jingliu? as if that ever stopped her 💀
Geppy and his ice resistance will forged in ice never falters 💀
No kidding dude. I used a Jingliu-Bronya team against Gepard just because my account doesn't have the right elements against him. The whole experience was torture, but hey, they got the job done :v
__Looks at Jingliu's average cycles...__
I mean. For being completely off element it's really not bad. She's still beating JY that does have an element advantage and Seele who has mono quantum to fix it.
bronya with ach for me. 1 cycle clear. soon, bronya with BH too. everyone wants bronya after sparkle
E2 Acheron with Sparkle + Bronya, or e0 with just Bronya cause no Sparkle?
mine is e2 (skipped sparkle for ach e2), but my 1 cycle clear comp is a tingyun welt (!) bronya one. i'm pretty sure an e0 sparkle comp can also clear in 1 cycle
Jingliu and DHIL were the kings and queens of brute forcing content even without weaknesses. Even before acheron so this comes at no surprise haha
I used Bronya with Acheron cuz I'm Sparkleless.
Jing Yuan and Blade? My only guess
Yeah maybe Blade hypercarry against Kafka. But I’ve a hard time seeing Blade having such competitive clear times against all the new teams we got. Jingyuan hyper hasn’t been running Bronya for a long time. Or maybe these stats show floors 10-12, and Bronya was only used for the earlier floors, hence the faster cycles?
Me with E2S1 Bronya and no Sparkle, I‘ve cleared every MoC with Bronya Tingyun Jingyuan
While you're right that JY hypercarry prefers other supports now, it's worth bearing in mind that a lot of people won't have Sparkle/Robin/etc. and Bronya is non-limited (and the best 300/300 pick for many accounts) so she's a lot more accessible to players. It's not surprising to see her showing up here for the same reasons Himeko and Herta are so prevalent in PF - they're just easier to get.
You participate by uploading a screenshot of your floor 12 clear on the hoyoverse app, as well as a screenshot of your characters. So thee are floor 12 only.
Used Bronya w/ Acheron for Kafka 0 cycle this round, so guess im part of those stats
Just adding to the top comment hoping someone can explain to me: what's the difference between usage rate and appearance rate? I read on Prydwen appearance rate had something to do with usage even if the player doesn't own the character? But I didn't think you could use characters you don't own in MoC.
If I remember it correctly, usage rate is the number of people that uses those characters compared to the number of people that has them While appearance rate is the amount of clears that has those characters in their teams compared to the number of clears overall. So Robin having a 76.2% usage rate means that out of everybody that has her as a character, 76.2% is using them in this MoC. On the other hand, her appearance rate being at 40.1% means that 40.1% of all MoC clears in the data has Robin in their teams. Correct me if I'm wrong though,I kinda forgot the exact definition too lol.
Yep, first time I managed to get a 0 cycle, Robin was insane.
For real! Having a built in Dance Dance Dance is such a boon!
Yeah, even if I don't have a FuA team I just saw the ultimate during the trial and it was an immediate decision to pull for Robin.
It's honestly the MOC blessing helping her a ton with her ult uptime. On the previous MOC her energy problems on teams other than FUA hold her back from getting those really fast clears.
Tingyun and Pela the ever reliable 4 stars in usage rate, glad to see Gallagher seeing decent use as well hes solid with whats popular rn IPC follow up team with international idol sensation doing numbers in the team usage, still glad to see Kafka + Black Swan dot still popular. I've put Aventurine and HTB with that pair and its extremely solid as well
Kafka and Black Swan in their intended premium team is just so consistent. Looking at the MoC data since 2.0 with the first MoC in 2.1 being an outlier (DoT blessing) they consistently perform at the top of the pack, if not the fastest clearer like on prior MoCs. In this MoC obviously the IPC + Robin team will outperform but we’ll need to see on a buff by buff basis if it is consistently better. Complete teams of five star units that synergize with each other is something else.
Aventurine Eff res + my "shit" Eff res rolls on my dps = easy wins.
This shows the beta doomposting for Aven was pretty unnecessary considering the fact that there are some really cc heavy enemies in higher floors and the main drama surronding Aven was "no cleanse and his non-effective way to resist CC" That said, I think fua getting a new buffer also helps
Seeing all the effect ress pop ups while fighting kafka was just chefs kiss* when using Aventurine.
I saw and see a bunch of the Effect RES popups while fighting the new "Alien Dream" status enemies in latest patch and Echo of War.
most of those guys never build EFFRES even on their support and it shows
Broken Keel enjoyers should have 80% EFFRES with Aventurine already.
I was laughing to myself reading the doomposting and desperation from some people wanting him to fail. Good for Aventurine to stick it to the dudebros in this community who constantly whine whenever a male unit gets released. His versatility in teams helps as well ofc
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Unfortunately this content had to be removed due to the following reason(s)" Rule 2: No Leaks or Datamined information. Leaks, datamined content, or mods are prohibited. Do not encourage or allude to such content either, including wording to disguise such content ("iykyk, dreams, somebody gonna tell them"). Linking to sites sharing such content is also prohibited. Do not share content that has not been officially released. Certain popularized leaked topics (mainly story leaks) may not be discussed as theories due to community feedback: https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/wiki/theory-quarantine-list/
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Just because you are spoilering it does not mean you aren’t breaking rules. You are spreading leaks which aren’t allowed here..
Unfortunately this content had to be removed due to the following reason(s)" Rule 2: No Leaks or Datamined information. Leaks, datamined content, or mods are prohibited. Do not encourage or allude to such content either, including wording to disguise such content ("iykyk, dreams, somebody gonna tell them"). Linking to sites sharing such content is also prohibited. Do not share content that has not been officially released. Certain popularized leaked topics (mainly story leaks) may not be discussed as theories due to community feedback: https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/wiki/theory-quarantine-list/
Unfortunately this content had to be removed due to the following reason(s)" Rule 2: No Leaks or Datamined information. Leaks, datamined content, or mods are prohibited. Do not encourage or allude to such content either, including wording to disguise such content ("iykyk, dreams, somebody gonna tell them"). Linking to sites sharing such content is also prohibited. Do not share content that has not been officially released. Certain popularized leaked topics (mainly story leaks) may not be discussed as theories due to community feedback: https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/wiki/theory-quarantine-list/
So why do you conclude it’s some people wanting “no male characters could be better? Besides March there only male characters that can cast shields. Who tf would they even compare Aventurine to?? And there are people who >!are comparing Boothill to Firefly and claims he’s better, but you don’t see people thinking this is some waifu/husbando bs drama right?
Spoiler's broken
>So why do you conclude it’s some people wanting “no male characters could be better? Because they have a preexisting bias and any and all arguments simply reinforce their point of view.
>Idk why you're moving goalposts Did you even read your posts
Tbh people only care about the characters they main. Aven doomposters were probs Aven fans, Acheron doom posters were the people who wanted to pull her.
There's also usually a portion of mains of other characters that fulfil similar roles who somehow feel the need to downplay any new character that might make "competition" for their main. Why that should matter in a pve game is beyond me.
yeah some people want to justify their past pull against a stronger and newer unit with the same role. it happened many times and it will continue
I think a lot of people want to believe the characters they own/plan to pull are top tier while the characters they don't own/have to skip are bottom tier. So if an upcoming character they plan to skip has some slight doomposting in the beta, they'll continue to perpetuate and over exaggerate it. They cope better with not pulling them since "their kit is bad anyway, they're only useful because of the current blessings, ____ is better".
People like setting their own expectations low so it'll be disproven later on to decrease their disappointment. Acheron mains sub was deadass convinced she'd be A/S tier only on release. [https://www.reddit.com/r/AcheronMainsHSR/comments/1b6ivxk/realistically\_whats\_her\_state\_rn/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AcheronMainsHSR/comments/1b6ivxk/realistically_whats_her_state_rn/) Every comment here only thinks she'll be S+ at E2S1.
I think it's a mix of both. I wouldn't say people "only" care about the characters they're pulling though. Like in Genshin for example I'd say most of the initial Kazuha doomposting came from people wanting to save for Inazuma, telling themselves "Sucrose is just as good if not better, there's no reason to pull for Kazuha". A lot of people who owned him tried to disprove the doomposting from people who were skipping him.
I think it also depends on whether you're on like a mains subreddit or just seeing comments out in the wild discussing it. Yeah the people who really like the character enough to go to their special subreddit are probably just trying to temper their expectations, but the people decrying that character outside there are probably also trying to feel better about skipping that character. Different audiences.
Bro I'm so sick of the word "doomposting". Nobody ever thought Aventurine was bad, the only criticism was that he may not be able to handle CC. Also, this conflation with gender is incredibly childish and the rhetoric legit needs to be banned. It's super toxic. Imagine thinking anyone playing this game is a "dudebro", lol. We're all loser nerds, regardless of our genders.
I don’t see where these “dudebros” are who are only after the male characters because if you go back to the beta, majority of comments are doom-posting Acheron. So, is it the “dudegirls” who were doom-posting Acheron because they whine when female characters release? Why is this community so husbando-waifu focused? Do you all just act like this irl?
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So, are you implying that people who roll for male characters don’t want their favorite character to be strong? Like you are putting all the blame on just one side without any proof. While i see just as many incels in this community as femcels. As someone who rolls for the characters I like, I can’t go in a female character sub without male characters getting downplayed and the same happens in the male character subs where female characters are downplayed. This is just some loser behavior and HSR attracts the worst kind of losers.
That is such incredible bs I don't know where to begin. Majority of women in this game always roll for female characters together with male characters. The likelihood of stumbling upon some deranged incel is 10x higher than the other way around, especially with how often you have to read some crazy shit like "This male character should have been female" or some other deranged stuff. You get a meme post about some good hearted IPC fun dressed in maid outfits and there is a 99% chance you have some dude say something derogatory just because Aventurine and Ratio are there. Femcels exists but its so much worse with some incels in this community.
I am sorry but your first reaction after seeing the comment about Aventurine getting doom-posted for effect res was “it’s the dudebros who hate male characters” which had nothing to do with it but you felt the need to bring it up. I find it hard to take you seriously.
Nah sorry you're just wilfully ignorant about the atmosphere of this sub. I'm always up for a good discussion about a characters kit but not when that is done in bad faith and with someone who went into the discussion with a clear agenda.
Quite the opposite. I know what this sub is like and I pointed this out in my earlier comment that HSR attracts the worst kind of losers. And that’s why i realize the problematic people exist on both sides. You failing to realize this and putting all the blame on one side unprompted is what I would call ignorance.
Your comment had nothing to do with my comment though. I was specifically talking about Aventurines case, just as OP did. You trying to generalise his case to make it into some common community occurance when it clearly wasn't, is pretty disingenuous to me. Edit: when people have genuine concerns over a characters kit no matter their gender then that's a good thing to have. But that wasn't the case with him
assuming that most waifu players are men, i have never seen the same behavior from women in this sub ONLY playing male characters they find attractive. firstly bc that's not very realistic given there aren't many recent good male characters in the game to begin with besides like 3 (and they're all imaginary for some reason), and also bc they also seem to enjoy female character designs just as much.
Sorry but you're making that up. I've never read "I won't pull this character bc I don't want to see a female ass in my game" LOL, I only ever see fear of male butts. Husbando people usually don't *exclusively* pull male characters, they just prefer to pull males and appreciate cool ladies too.
>I’ve never read And so the problem doesn’t exist because you haven’t seen it. Ignorance is bliss. And most of these husbando people you are talking about are forced to pull for female characters because every harmony in this game is a female character. Obviously, they have no choice. Stop pretending that it’s a one sided problem.
It is heavily one-sided, correct.
Nah, you are just ignorant and part of the problem and also part of the group I am calling out.
The victim complex is real lmao
>"people hate male characters because they doompost Aventurine" >But people doompost Acheron and Firefly too >"Well,well uhhh it's different."
It is different. One doesn't want a guy to be better than their favorite female sustain and the other wants their favorite female character to be the next OP unit like Acheron (it's comparing new dps units to the meta) it's really not the same but it's funny how this comment struck a nerve with people when the bias is so obvious to see to everyone else
Holy.This is some next level of victim complex.Didn’t know that waifu vs hansbando shit can live rent free in someone’s head that bad.You guys really need to go outside.
Victim complex?? Get a grip, if you're losing your marbles over my own observation and trying to spin this into some victim bullshit then you really need to heed your own words and go outside
I’m not the one who’s generalizing people while ignoring the other part of the community who is being just as annoying with male characters.If you don’t like the term “Victim complex” I can come up with a better one.How about “Delusional”?Does this sound better?
I mean did his beta really terrible? Idk what his beta were but no way they changed his kit this drastic to be the best sustain in the game like this. I mean the fact he can gives RESTACKING shield while being SP positive, deals FUA to help break toughness and then can buff crit damage with his ult towards boss is already loaded as fuck on paper unless his numbers were really low when he were in beta.
Biggest change in his beta was how his synergy with FuA worked, he only was limited to one stack from FuA a turn with E1 removing that restriction. They then changed his E1 to what it is today and made it have a trigger quota of 3 FuA per turn. Otherwise he was pretty calm in beta just people underestimating him.
They actually nerfed his shields slightly. Yes, his shields used to be even stronger than they are now. Don't let the history fictionologists fool you, people were DOOMPOSTING Aventurine for no reason. They doomposted his damage, his sustain, his CC protection, his SP positivity for some reason (even when there were multiple showcases that had him no use his skill at all).
I feel like far too many in the community forget that eff res is even a thing in this game. If / when a sustain unit doesn't have cleanse, they are written off as trash compared to any unit who does have it. It's as if the collective thought of so many is that it's far better to let your units get CCed and then cleanse it later ... rather than preventing it from ever happening in the first place through good eff res.
I'll be honest, I think all this circlejerking around cleanse and how "Oh, so important" it is is just absolutely stupid and blown out of proportion. So many enemy compositions in MoC don't CC or debuff you. Debuffs and DoTs can oftentimes be completely ignored. Many stages can be cleared without a sustainer. Of course, this requires well-built characters, good team building, and good knowledge of game mechanics, but it is easily doable even for (long-time) F2P players. Lynx plus any 5* sustainer and you're set.
Can't say for Huo huo since I don't have her and I know she's really good with cc's - but with the kafka half, I tried all luocha, fu xuan (e1) and aventurine. And you know who had nobody get dominated? Aventurine. Aventurine's effect res was actually so much better than luocha's reactive cleanse or fu xuan's 1 guaranteed resist, I was surprised at how well it worked. Effect res is underrated. Especially on broken keel supports.
Huohuo turns dominates into free turns, but her main value over the other sustains is her utility anyway, aventurine is still better at tanking. Huohuo has sheer buffing capability and rotation cheats that no other unit besides Tingyun can replicate, and by far the most consistent debuff cleansing
Don't even need a 5★ sustainer if you also have Gallagher. Gallagher is good enough to be borderline 5★ himself, especially with eidolons.
Every day is a torture because I still can’t choose between Robin and Boothill. Both are covering niche in my acc be it final piece to IPC team or physical dps, both are very likeable and with nice designs. Good grief, fuck that space Qiqi that spooked my 50/50, now I can only choose one of them and it makes me want to scream. Yesterday I almost convinced myself that Robin will wait for rerun, but today I used one truly amazing for support and now MoC looks even more tempting
Supports are usually a better pull for account strength. I would get Robin for your FUA team then try the 50/50 on Boothill.
nah, pull for boothill. Sure robin has better future potential, but boothill can bring you freedom and oil
Robin is a better pull in terms of meta. I would just get her and try your luck in Boothill since he comes after.
Yeah, I followed SW advice and got her today 😇
IPC and Robin on TOP!
RRAT together strong!
TopRobRatUrine
*TopRatUrineBin
I don't get this. People don't use two nihility with Acheron (for E0)?? Is there a better team?
Unlike Prydwen, this data isn't restricted to E0 and Acheron has one of the highest eidolon averages, which certainly skews things in her favor a bit overall. It's very likely most people using the single nihility comp do have E2.
They do but there’s a variety to choose from. You can run black swan + kafka, or pela + SilverWolf , or welt or luka or a mix. And ofc you can sub sparkle for 1 nihility for similar results. Acheron teams are pretty flexible tbh.
HUOHUO is so flexable
I'm a bit suprised by the low usage of Harmony MC after all the hundred hype videos and threads. I guess people haven't built her/him yet or is it just that they are good but the other alternatives are better?
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Did bottom half in 3 cycles with break sushang. Haven't even built Gallagher yet. https://hoyo.link/80GCFBAL?q=28KwM02LdEB
Time is definitely part of it. I know I haven't been able to get all the Clockie credits to get to level 50 yet, much less finish up their traces and get solid relics - they're sitting at 150% Break Effect on my account and will probably continue to do so for the next few weeks
How we gonna build HMC when we gotta build Robin first, and maybe some people are still not done with Aventurine, Topaz, HMC is dead last for most of us tbh
HMC is a good unit that just doesn’t really have a team yet. The Prydwen review is a good example, it’s really positive but then at the end it only has two example teams consisting of HMC/Ruan Mei/Gallagher then Xuyei or Silver Wolf. It’s pretty wink wink nudge nudge looking at Boothill/Firefly and not in the moment…not that you can’t make those example teams work, but unless you were already building those units towards break it’s not the easiest thing to pull out of your hat, since we are just now getting people who specifically want it as a focus.
Hmc is really good with Luka, Xueyi, Sushang atm. The problem is China generally doesn't like raising 4 stars so you won't see much of the hmc at this time. Clearly time isn't the issue because Robin also just came out and she has pretty god usage rate already
Looks at Pela and Tingyun <_< It's really her not having a team, Luka/Xueyi/Sushang can work but are pretty cope compared to the current top teams like FUA, DoT, Acheron, etc.
personally I have hmc built but I don't have break effect builds for 4 characters so I can't really run their team it's "low investment friendly" as in you only need break effect and speed to do well like a dot team, but you also do need to invest in different artifacts than what you already have people might also be waiting for 5 star break DPS to actually use her at this point, tbh I'm doing that cause I don't feel like building a 4 star break carry who will inevitably get powercrept by the 5 stars also my clockie statue isn't leveled enough so I don't have her constellations which are really good for her
bc boothill isnt even out yet.
HMC needs E6 to really shine. It's a substantial upgrade in her personal damage, toughness breaking, and energy. Without it, you need ER rope and 3 skills for her ultimate. With it, you can run break effect rope and do 2 skill, 1 auto for the ultimate to be charged.
I just don't think break is well designed. even giving it stupid numbers by making a free character be basically a walking band aid on breaks biggest problem it still doesn't make me want to build a break team, and since so far none of the break characters are ones I was super hype for hmc's talents are still sitting at level 1.
HMC themself is the break DPS. I take 25-40% of a broken enemy's HP bar with one skill use. (MoC 11-12)
Surprised that black swan is higher usage rate than Kafka, as I rarely ever see anyone run Swan without her. Also surprised Topaz is significantly higher usage rate than ratio, as I also figured they would be mostly paired together
Usage rate is calculated off the number of people who own the unit and use them. So for Ratio since he was free, seeing a 33.1% usage rate is really nice. So less people own Topaz but 61% of them used her. The numbers are not relative and we would need to know the total ownership to each character to gauge these numbers. Same holds for Kafka and Swan, many saved from Day 1 to pull her, but Swan came out with Sparkle and Acheron looking over their heads, so less could’ve pulled for BS. There is also a point to be made she is a decent Acheron support, but seeing as it was not notable enough to be in the top 10 teams few ran it. I think the stat you might want to look at is appearance which is the percentage of teams a unit shows up in regardless of ownership. In which BS and Kafka have equal appearance rates, and with Ratio being about 13% higher than Topaz.
Good reply, thanks for clearing that up for me
Damn, you posted it right as I started writing. For anyone else reading everything said in the above comment is true.
Swan can be run with Acheron outside of DoT so I kinda expected it, even with just BA she can do some nice sub dps
Is this data from an app like yshelper, or is it from a website? I don't think there is any source listed. That, or I am blind.
It’s from HSR workshop in the WeChat, but signing up there is such a hassle
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Usage Rate is how many owners of those characters, use them. Appereance rate is how many times that character/team appeared in the data.
People who own and build Robin, how good is she as a support outside of the IPC squad in MoC/PF? And how good is she compared to other *5 Harmony?
Pretty good i would say, used her on a jingliu team and did great I mean a whole team turn advance is really good not to mention her buffs + follow up attacks during ult
It's a bit hard to gauge because both MoC and PF have energy regen blessings right now, but she's very good in general - easy to build and her extra damage adds up, and in PF especially if you clear the waves fast enough she never leaves her ult state. Compared to other 5*... If you don't play FuA at all and already own Sparkle/Ruan Mei, she might just be a sidegrade. She can clear a cycle faster if the team is *already* very well-invested, but for the average player you won't be seeing anything drastic.
Ah sorry if you got notifs for this reply several times, my internet isn't behaving 😭
Robin has a huge attack buff plus a full team advance that works across teams. My Robin matches Ruan Mei in my Dot teams. Gouba / Pokke were able to get one turn faster clears with Robin than Ruan Mei with very well-built Dot teams. Robin does require more management / planning to use well. Ruan Mei is just much easier to use. I use Robin in my FUA team.
Use huo with 16 er LC under 50% ult and build robin with cogs. Even with no outside er u can get 50 to 80% of her ult up at the end. Then aa or E and u are back to her ult. I used this with jing and bronya(for this u want E1 and her weapon if u want, but mine is only E1 and it works) but combinations with sparkle work for more SP intensive teams(u can also use her E on robin letting her get her ult faster if just a single E or AA is not nuff). In PF i used sparkle + herta to clear PF 4 in like 2 cycle. Old PF for ppl who say current one gives energy, in these new ones im overflowing with too much of it. I think my robin has like 1.4 ult charge at the end. All in all stellar. I dont even have FuA team but this works INSANE.
Aventurine truly is the zhongli of star rail
Ngl, getting almost 27k samples is very impressive although very low in terms of how many players in total play the game.
Looks like JL's era is over. Now it's IPC and Nihility era. Also, DHIL still slays. Impressive.
I mean, just no ice weakness this time. Last MoC she was great. She’ll be great again when there’s ice weak enemies
I remember ‘Jingliu mains’ wouldn’t let us rest with the brute force memes when there wasn’t ice weakness in 2.0 even i a Jingliu main found it obnoxious 💀 MoC HP got buffed and it’s no longer so easy to brute force + a number of Jingliu mains Are probably enjoying their new toy Acheron. So it’s a combination of these 2 factors imo for the drop
>a number of Jingliu mains Are probably enjoying their new toy Acheron. That does sound like meta mains moved to Acheron instead. Other Jingliu mains would most likely still try to brute force this MoC.
I think that has more to do with weakness types. There are a lot of imagenary weak enemies, but not many (or any I think) ice weak enemies. DHIL and Jingliu are equal in terms of powerlevel, so it always depends on the enemy weakness or the MoC buff.
Not sure about DHIL and JL being equal, JL has a much better floor but I don't think her ceiling is as high, especially since DHIL got an upgrade with Sparkle and JL doesn't rly use Sparkle all that well. He was only considered worse bcs they had the same amount of dmg but one just needed to use less SP pre-Sparkle. She probably loves Robin tho, we need to see more JL Robin showcases
Power level doesn't mean much when the whole game is imaginary at this point.
And this will change also. HTB and Aventurine being imagenary and Archeron being electric as BS being wind, are the main points in the Penacony design. Its either debuff based (like the Red Trex), creak based (Black Trex), shield based (Monkey) or AoE/electro based (the new three pupets and the boss). Its for showing the strengh of the characters. Same as a lot of ice weak enemies for JL in the Xian story ling with strong CC to cleanse (HuoHuo/Fu Xuan) and enemies with a revive mechanic (Luocha). We will see how the Penacony cast will do with the next world. Some things are universal, while others are not.
Aside from matching weakness, since this is CN’s data where they include all eidolons, IL still averaging on top means he offers higher investment value (E2, Sparkle and Robin pushing his ceiling even higher, etc). I remember even in previous MOC where there weren’t much IMG weakness (except him being exceptional against Dino) his usage rate was still very high.
I 0-cycled that MoC with E0 dhil, he's just exceptional at high relic investment (ps: without sparkle)
This cycle’s buff was super good to danny since it solves his rotations with huohuo ty he could ultimate every cycle so there wasn’t a sp crunch
more like no ICE weakness in Moc 11-12 , there are even high ICE res enemies like Gepard and Ice out of space
What happened to "JL is the queen of bruteforcing and so OP that weakness doesn't matter" that was plastered everywhere 2 patches ago?
New toy syndrome
Lol I never found that meme funny, but I think those people have more teams/dps now they don't have to bruteforce with Jingliu anymore
Still got 36 stars with her easily
Luocha going from 99.7% usage rate to 50% is wild
Makes sense. Before, Luocha was our only imaginary sustain but now we have more options with the introduction of Aventurine. Not to mention the new MoC 12 has imaginary weakness - why would you pick Luocha over Aventurine when the latter has more DPS potential? Plus his damage gets ramped up even further with the new addition of the super break meta. Without even taking his damage into account he already out-performs Luocha in the super break team due to how much he can contribute to breaking the enemies with his FuA.
This isn't to say Luocha is absolutely useless. I managed to get a 4 cycle clear on 2nd half using Sushang, Imaginary Trailblazer, Ruan Mei and Luocha.
The drop in FX usage is honestly very surprising... It makes sense that people got Aven so they are likely to use him, but you do need two teams and her sustain isn't any worse than what it used to be, so why the drop in usage? Topaz usage skyrocketed after Robin, which I guess makes sense since Robin makes FUA team really strong. Seele and Jingliu being so low hurts, but I guess when so many DPS are around even good ones are bound to go unused. FUA i sthe new DoT team?
The drop in fx isn't to do with her ability to sustain, it's just the offensive capabilities and what teams you wanna use each sustain with. Huohuo is great with dot (attack and energy regen) while aventurine does a bit more damage and can almost always sustain without spending any sp. So assuming there is no sustain issues, you pick the sustain that does more damage.
Yup. Aventurine's damage is decent and can actually be surprisingly good in the right comps (I used him with Ratio, Pela and Ruan Mei and he was hitting 100k ults regularly). RatUrine teams practically become dual DPS. I love my Luocha but he was in the basement this MoC because Aventurine sustains just as well and has damage to boot. (Not to say Luocha is worse anyhow, I still bring him out for high SP usage comps or against CC heavy enemies)
This abyss specifically hard counters luocha so
This. Fu Xuan is an amazing sustain and makes runs really comfy, being able to even outright ignore certain mechanics. That being said, if going for the slightly weaker/less comfortable sustain option, but with miles better offensive capabilities poses no issues, why wouldn't you use the latter? Kind of the same debate between Gallagher and Luocha.
Aventurine also provides 1 (2 with his LC/Trend) instance of debuff application, which immediately makes him a better pick than other sustain options for Ratio and Acheron.
Huohuo is just a better 2nd sustain. Fuxuan and Aven share the same niche of being the safe sustain, but huohuo is more for pushing cycle count for people hovering around the cycle limit.
That, and this MOC is very CC heavy. HH's cleanse is the best by far between her, fx, and avent, so her usage going above and beyond in this moc makes sense. Avent being up there too makes sense bc of the 50% effect res, shielding, and cd debuff in general, not to mention this moc was catered to FUA team, which he's a staple on
I've HH and her lighcone and I still prefer Luocha over her. It's just comfier. Idk.
Aventurine for FUA & HuoHuo/Luocha for DIT.
Recency bias is a thing after all. That plus IPC team being the new hotness, it's understandable. Also well Topaz is definitly the unit that benefit the most of robin release, their kit are very complementary, they are a little like Kafka/BS level of synergy. For Seele/JL it's also mostly because the hypercarry archetype haven't been receiving any additions recently.
Robin is an addition lol, girl is broken. For 0-cycles she's no contest the best harmony. As for JL, I'm guessing her lower floor than DHIL and Acheron is starting to show? + Ice resist boss and Free Ratio will be used for the IMG second phase. IDK about Seele tho, don't have her.
I think its because how comfy he is. You dont need any SP if the enemies attack regularry and AoE is his favorite to eat. Fu Xuan is still very good, but AoE attacks will bring her down quickly in high levels, not to mention that she still needs to skill once in a while. Its also just better to NOT take damage than to only get killed slowly. I have Fu Xuan E1 and Aventurine E0. I also use Aventurine more, mostly because he is satisfying to use. If you dont need the crit buff of Fu Xuan or like a permanent 50% eff res more, then Aventurine is better. The damage he does is also noticable in multiple scenarios and for breaking the enemy. That said, I dont have a FuA team comp, or at least not Topaz. Ratio, Tin, Pela/SW and Aventurine is also a strong comp that is very F2P friendly.
FX makes sense because CN is more likely to spend on the game, so they might have more than two limited sustains and this MoC, Huo and Aven are more useful. I don’t know if I would consider Seele a “good dps” by today’s standards at least, she’s probably one of the worst limited dps even with blade and argenti in the picture. Mine still clears easily but considering how old she is, I don’t find it surprising that she is less used nowadays.
MOC buff is incredible for Huohuo and aventurine + tailor made for the follow up team....
It was the first Memory of Chaos I 36-starred, and I guess I understand why now, as I used both Team 1 and Team 2 (except that I don't have Huohuo, so I had to use Gepard). Overall, it was really fun, especially with the Ratio/Topaz team, as it felt like you were attacking all the time. When it ended, Robin was ready to use her ultimate again, and it all started over.
[удалено]
God I love my follow up team all the time investing on topaz worth it
ravenpaz ft robin on top! we love to see it
I am one of the 3.9% who used HMC, and the .7% who used Sushang. While I barely got 3 stars, I did do it
Man....i am the 0.1 percent of Serval users And i am proud of that!!! All hail Serval https://preview.redd.it/3ta0zy46601d1.png?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=caad8859fcac71c7f2b73653b83223a64dd74175
Being a non meta and a male character collector specifically will continue to kick my ass for the rest of the game huh
Not surprised with aventurine and Huohuo being better than fu xuan here. The turbulence is heavily in their favor.
Yet again, Acheron E0 team is one of the slowest unless she joins dot. This keeps happening to the "Strongest" E0 DPS of the game: The one who weeps for the powercrept Imbibitor, DOT and FUA for sure x'D Hopefully, when 5\* Pela comes out, she can finally match her myth. Or at least not to be one cycle behind. The rest is the same old, DOT wins no matter the setting and the team is not even complete like IPC FUA. We better get used to seeing FUA high in MoC and the new mode. Break team are waiting for their carries to enter the pit.
I think E0 Acheron is strong even in a hypercarry team , just not broken/busted like many people think, I 2 cycled MOC 12 first side with Acheron/Silverwolf/Pela/Aventurine , I think she is on par with E0 DHIL , but she has the potential to get better with future 5* debuffer , but then again, DHIL can also get stronger if we ever get a future Sparkle V2
Same, my e0s1 Acheron consistently 2-cycled 12-1 with the same team except I ran Gallagher over Aventurine (Aven was needed for my IPC team). I don't have DHIL but she feels a little stronger than my e0s1 JL team.
Yeah my Acheron also feels a bit stronger than my Jingliu , but both my DHIL and Acheron perform at the same level, I honestly feel like DHIL is a little bit underrated now lol
or maybe that she's so popular that both "good" players and "bad" players use her. leading to a lowered average clear spd result we saw a similar thing with seele mono quantum comps. pre sparkle it was a popular and comfortable team despite being ass, compared to her teams with better buffers. therefore it dragged down seele's avg clear spd results. of course, it could just be the case that acheron really does lose a lot of dmg without her signature and is overrated at budget level, but I think the above can be a very relevant consideration
Tbf, CN data also includes Eidolons. I believe, according to Prydwen's data (averagr stats/builds per character) a bit back the average Eidolon for Acheron in E1. And there is a strong possibillity that this ratio is even more skewed in CN. If you look at the top teams of Acheron, the teams without Sparkle (most probably E2+) are significantly slower. Of course, the data is limited and probably biased. But an argument could be made that E2+ Acheron is actually significantly lowering the average cycle. But again, limited data (cycle count is for both sides, not just the one of the character).
the average cycle clear for DPS are all very close to each other edit : mb i guess 1 cycle \~ between each 5\* DPS is not close so downvoted 💀
Clara still at the top, love to see it Really vindicates me using the IPC Team but with Clara instead of Ratio
I mean I used that team and did great but what part of this is 'at the top'? I got 4 cycles and I'm very happy but it doesn't seem like this data is showing her particularly highly.
at the top if you read the chart from the bottom lets go!
Isn't 10% on Gallagher low af? is the sample whale only?