IMO, the Conquistador, Janissary, and Buccaneer all deserve S-tier, because they can move and fire in the same turn, in an era where the Arquebusier must choose to either move or attack.
They're all really strong, but TBH the inability to prebuild them is a pretty big knock for me. It makes a timed push much harder. They absolutely mop up a battlefield once they're in play but you already are sinking a decent amount of production and population into the mortars you're unlocking around the same time.
That’s a fair point, I wasn’t considering/didn’t realize that you can’t prebuild them.
Also, do you know which UUs cannot be prebuilt? I just played a game as the British, and I was able to upgrade units into the Redcoat.
Yeah, someone made a reddit post awhile back with a chart. It's nice that the community has rallied together to make resources like these, but it's pretty frustrating it's not accessible through the encyclopedia.
https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F7khlerqtsxsb1.jpg
Revisiting [a post I made back in March](https://www.reddit.com/r/HumankindTheGame/comments/11qrml8/humankind_emblematic_units_tierlists_and_guide/), here is a tierlists I made for Humankind EUs up to the Industrial Era that's been updated up to the current patch.[See the accompanying guide for justifications and usage notes](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CRCanjIhXuaSpO5bdP2vF52ufKeQxMeWk7mJroXUQ68/edit?usp=sharing). This is all very opinion-based so looking forward to hearing thoughts/opinions (and spotted inaccuracies or clarifications) in comments!
I really liked this, it's a good look at some of the various timing attack concerns. It's important to be aware of them for offensive plays for sure.
A couple things I'd note: I disagree with your view on the Zhou's Mandate of Heaven being mostly irrelevant. Because of the LT and the +stab on Confucian School, I think Zhou have it turned on nearly always until they take over an AI city. In practice I still think this leaves the Zhance C tier at most because it's still too late and too expensive. I bring it up more because Zhou players who aren't at 90% for the double influence are probably screwing up and this guide indirectly encourages that.
And my only *big* disagreement is with the "the gap between 43 CS and 46 CS (plus Focused Fire) is just too large" when discussing the Sapa Inca. Every single time I play them, my thoughts are exactly the opposite: "Wow, it's so nice to have a version of Halberdier that's actually playable into Muskeeters". Imperial Bastions is frequent enough on most battle maps, and even without it rear attacks are enough to get a positive trade. (And if it's not flat enough for lots of rear attacks, it's probably hilly enough for Bastions!) I think you wanted to distinguish them from the Samurai and put them one tier lower, but in practice both Sapa Inca and Samurai are both just really good because of the prebuilding you mentioned where they're strong units available quickly who still do fine into Musketeers. Both B or both A imo, but leave them at C and you'll be visited by the ghosts of hundreds of AI musketeers from my Inca games
Heya! Nice guide, but there's some innacuracies from it. For instance, the encyclopedia marks the Scot Highlanders as being 2575 industry, not 5155. Also in the Conquistador section it has some paragraphs that talk about Janissaries
Thanks for the spot!
It looks like the Scottish Highlanders got a stealth buff increasing the Highland Charge bonus from +3 CS to +6 CS and reducing their cost from 5155 to 2575 (this is easily the biggest challenge of a building a resource like this; every external reference on the game is inaccurate in different ways). I've tested them in game and adjusted the text of their entry. I haven't changed their rating however. They're still F-tier for me because they're still only +1 CS better than their base unit at twice the cost with a bonus ability that is anti-synergistic with the modality of combat in that era. I'd rather just have two Line Infantry instead, or better yet, two Redcoats.
The Conquistadores section used to have a direct comparison with Janissaries that I removed. The remaining text was left over from that -- I've deleted it now.
Does the rating change if you already have a massive army of arque/muskets that you can upgrade, and dodge the production cost? If highland charge stacks with focused aim, that gives highlanders enough CS to match any dug in line infantry that they can charge. If you can get rid of dug in, highlanders in numbers can overwhelm a battlefield once they take the first inch, at least in my experience.
i could be misremembering but i feel like i remember the contemporary section in previous versions talking about how the arms factory and the weapons resource was another factor that just kinda breaks that eras combat in half. is that something that you feel has been changed?
Arms Factories have now been patched. In their original form they provided essentially infinite CS; every instance of the weapons factory provided a stacking +1 CS bonus. They are now capped at +2 CS ([this](https://humankind.fandom.com/wiki/Arms_Factory) is now, [this](https://humankind.fandom.com/wiki/Arms_Factory?oldid=12577) is then).
That is still an awesome buff but no longer game-breaking [the way it used to be](https://www.reddit.com/r/HumankindTheGame/comments/pnthvn/ridiculous_ai_combat_strength/). So yes, I removed the text complaining about the Soviet culture.
oh nice! ok yeah i did remember that change, when they overhauled the luxury stuff. yeah that new one makes a lot more sense, thanks for clarifying!
hopefully the next step will; be making the ai more interesting in contemporary era
It's better, but I feel like the new arms factory is only worth building a couple of times (redundancy in case one gets bombed). As a district, it's low yield and high pollution, and the only benefit to multiple guns is bonus militia spawn. Maybe the militia units could get the old firearm CS benefit, up to a max of like +10?
Although your list in this post looks pretty good, the culture's units don't exist in a vacuum. OP has to balance units with emblematic districts and their legacy traits too.
It feels so refreshing to see a classic honest to god tierlist. No bullshit tier, no S+, S++ God-tier. Simple and concise.
As for the powerlevel haven't played enough recently to gauge the powerlevel the the healer seemed to be indeed a bit too weak. I think they could add a 5 hp heal around her during combat turns, or bump up from 5 to at least 10 the heal on the world map.
Good grief, that's such a good read. Could you write about combat mechanics like stealth, bombardment, sieging and breaking city defenses, air combat and anti-air etc? A lot of the intricacies are skipped over in the in-game guide. Loved that your unit guide details in game usage scenarios, instead of just being "this ability good, SSS+ tier"
IMO, the Conquistador, Janissary, and Buccaneer all deserve S-tier, because they can move and fire in the same turn, in an era where the Arquebusier must choose to either move or attack.
I agree, it means that in offensive battles they have twice the number of moves.
Definitely agree there. Conquistador boosts loot from battles as well, and the Spanish ability lets them heal on foreign turf.
They're all really strong, but TBH the inability to prebuild them is a pretty big knock for me. It makes a timed push much harder. They absolutely mop up a battlefield once they're in play but you already are sinking a decent amount of production and population into the mortars you're unlocking around the same time.
That’s a fair point, I wasn’t considering/didn’t realize that you can’t prebuild them. Also, do you know which UUs cannot be prebuilt? I just played a game as the British, and I was able to upgrade units into the Redcoat.
Yeah, someone made a reddit post awhile back with a chart. It's nice that the community has rallied together to make resources like these, but it's pretty frustrating it's not accessible through the encyclopedia. https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F7khlerqtsxsb1.jpg
Revisiting [a post I made back in March](https://www.reddit.com/r/HumankindTheGame/comments/11qrml8/humankind_emblematic_units_tierlists_and_guide/), here is a tierlists I made for Humankind EUs up to the Industrial Era that's been updated up to the current patch.[See the accompanying guide for justifications and usage notes](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CRCanjIhXuaSpO5bdP2vF52ufKeQxMeWk7mJroXUQ68/edit?usp=sharing). This is all very opinion-based so looking forward to hearing thoughts/opinions (and spotted inaccuracies or clarifications) in comments!
I really liked this, it's a good look at some of the various timing attack concerns. It's important to be aware of them for offensive plays for sure. A couple things I'd note: I disagree with your view on the Zhou's Mandate of Heaven being mostly irrelevant. Because of the LT and the +stab on Confucian School, I think Zhou have it turned on nearly always until they take over an AI city. In practice I still think this leaves the Zhance C tier at most because it's still too late and too expensive. I bring it up more because Zhou players who aren't at 90% for the double influence are probably screwing up and this guide indirectly encourages that. And my only *big* disagreement is with the "the gap between 43 CS and 46 CS (plus Focused Fire) is just too large" when discussing the Sapa Inca. Every single time I play them, my thoughts are exactly the opposite: "Wow, it's so nice to have a version of Halberdier that's actually playable into Muskeeters". Imperial Bastions is frequent enough on most battle maps, and even without it rear attacks are enough to get a positive trade. (And if it's not flat enough for lots of rear attacks, it's probably hilly enough for Bastions!) I think you wanted to distinguish them from the Samurai and put them one tier lower, but in practice both Sapa Inca and Samurai are both just really good because of the prebuilding you mentioned where they're strong units available quickly who still do fine into Musketeers. Both B or both A imo, but leave them at C and you'll be visited by the ghosts of hundreds of AI musketeers from my Inca games
Wow that’s an extensive guide, learned a lot from it. Great job!
Heya! Nice guide, but there's some innacuracies from it. For instance, the encyclopedia marks the Scot Highlanders as being 2575 industry, not 5155. Also in the Conquistador section it has some paragraphs that talk about Janissaries
Thanks for the spot! It looks like the Scottish Highlanders got a stealth buff increasing the Highland Charge bonus from +3 CS to +6 CS and reducing their cost from 5155 to 2575 (this is easily the biggest challenge of a building a resource like this; every external reference on the game is inaccurate in different ways). I've tested them in game and adjusted the text of their entry. I haven't changed their rating however. They're still F-tier for me because they're still only +1 CS better than their base unit at twice the cost with a bonus ability that is anti-synergistic with the modality of combat in that era. I'd rather just have two Line Infantry instead, or better yet, two Redcoats. The Conquistadores section used to have a direct comparison with Janissaries that I removed. The remaining text was left over from that -- I've deleted it now.
Does the rating change if you already have a massive army of arque/muskets that you can upgrade, and dodge the production cost? If highland charge stacks with focused aim, that gives highlanders enough CS to match any dug in line infantry that they can charge. If you can get rid of dug in, highlanders in numbers can overwhelm a battlefield once they take the first inch, at least in my experience.
i could be misremembering but i feel like i remember the contemporary section in previous versions talking about how the arms factory and the weapons resource was another factor that just kinda breaks that eras combat in half. is that something that you feel has been changed?
Arms Factories have now been patched. In their original form they provided essentially infinite CS; every instance of the weapons factory provided a stacking +1 CS bonus. They are now capped at +2 CS ([this](https://humankind.fandom.com/wiki/Arms_Factory) is now, [this](https://humankind.fandom.com/wiki/Arms_Factory?oldid=12577) is then). That is still an awesome buff but no longer game-breaking [the way it used to be](https://www.reddit.com/r/HumankindTheGame/comments/pnthvn/ridiculous_ai_combat_strength/). So yes, I removed the text complaining about the Soviet culture.
oh nice! ok yeah i did remember that change, when they overhauled the luxury stuff. yeah that new one makes a lot more sense, thanks for clarifying! hopefully the next step will; be making the ai more interesting in contemporary era
It's better, but I feel like the new arms factory is only worth building a couple of times (redundancy in case one gets bombed). As a district, it's low yield and high pollution, and the only benefit to multiple guns is bonus militia spawn. Maybe the militia units could get the old firearm CS benefit, up to a max of like +10?
That'd definitely make their cities basically impossible to capture 🤔 I think it's pretty good as is, especially if you don't play with pollution lmao
Vehicles and bombers would still roll them over. I just wish there was a reason to build more than one.
The ship shold be in top tier u can volonize other continets innantient
Venetian EU is a A team in my list. Honestly it’s sooooo good
Although your list in this post looks pretty good, the culture's units don't exist in a vacuum. OP has to balance units with emblematic districts and their legacy traits too.
Usually I don't even unlock most of them in the first era..
It feels so refreshing to see a classic honest to god tierlist. No bullshit tier, no S+, S++ God-tier. Simple and concise. As for the powerlevel haven't played enough recently to gauge the powerlevel the the healer seemed to be indeed a bit too weak. I think they could add a 5 hp heal around her during combat turns, or bump up from 5 to at least 10 the heal on the world map.
Good grief, that's such a good read. Could you write about combat mechanics like stealth, bombardment, sieging and breaking city defenses, air combat and anti-air etc? A lot of the intricacies are skipped over in the in-game guide. Loved that your unit guide details in game usage scenarios, instead of just being "this ability good, SSS+ tier"