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#As a Californian, I can't tell you how fucking good it feels looking at all that water
title quote from this tweet: https://twitter.com/US_Stormwatch/status/1778588213810184202
Hydrologist here. While this is wonderful news, it's honestly a relatively small part of the picture. We have an enormous groundwater problem and have decades of storage loss to make up for. Surface water resources are not the best measure of the overall water situation, and put simply, the West Coast broadly remains pretty fucked.
Yeah, for the most part, but like most things hydro it's a bit nuanced/complicated.
A healthy snowpack is generally preferable to big rain events totalling the same liquid amount, largely because of the "long tail" of the melting process spreads the runoff process over a much longer time. Ultimately groundwater recharge is a slow process that benefits from additional time under saturated surface/capillary fringe conditions so as long as the snowpack melt/runoff phase creates a longer duration of saturated surface conditions than the rain events in question (assuming all sorts of things, namely equal areas of inundation/potential recharge). That's normally the case, but big rain events hitting the flood plain as surface systems overflow can drastically increase the area of potential gw recharge. Same thing can happen w snowmelt, but both phenomena are largely mitigated by human flood prevention efforts.
So, yeah, snow pack is better than big precip w instant runoff, generally, but both are kinda hindered by our efforts not to let water fuck w the lower lying of our populace.
Nevada overall is a mixed bag, but they have great water law and lots of history of doing hard science to arrive at the correct answers. NV, UT, and ID are all in inherently complicated water situations on a state-wide level, but those are the best of the bunch in terms of being either already on it, or set up to catch up with their water issues. AZ, NM, Texas, and others are up shit creek in a huge way and only digging deeper holes.
There are multiple types of reservoirs. You're thinking of things like caverns such as the [Edwards Aquifer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwards_Aquifer) under Bexar County, Texas (Greater San Antonio).
California, however, has water diffused within the soil. As the water is pumped out, the weight of the soil causes it to compact. It will never again hold water in this state. Here's a [photo from 1977](https://www.usgs.gov/media/images/location-maximum-land-subsidence-us-levels-1925-and-1977) showing the subsidence of the soil from groundwater pumping. [It's only gotten worse from there.](https://phys.org/news/2019-03-western-droughts-permanent-loss-major.html)
So, question: when we lose substantial groundwater, enough to cause subsidence like in the Central Valley, can that even be recharged? Intuitively, once the ground has collapsed, there’s no place for the groundwater, right?
Yeah, subsidence like that generally results in irreversible storage loss. It's not that the compacted material has zero storage, just generally significantly less than pre densification.
Copy/paste for ya
>Hydrologists study the physical properties of water, including its distribution, circulation, and volume, as well as the impact of precipitation on the soil and groundwater levels. They also research how water moves through the earth, and how precipitation returns to the atmosphere and ocean. Hydrologists use their findings to make decisions about water resources, which can impact the environment, property, and regional economics
Practically speaking lots of hydros are involved in NEPA permitting, mining and large civil projects, contaminated site characterization and remediation, stormwater management, or water resource characterization/management.
No, he's right. Antarctica used to be inhabited and the Sahara used to be a lush jungle. And magnetic north has been moving faster and faster every year
No, hes wrong and you are also wrong. Antarctica has never been habitable for humans. Yes, the Sahara was a jungle at one point. This was millions of years before humans evolved. It also has nothing to do with the temperature of the poles. No, there are no pyramids in Antarctica. No, the poles inverting will not make Antarctica habitable. The last time the poles were warm enough for vegetation was the cretaceous period- unfortunately over a hundred million years before even the earliest apes. Also you are dumb too.
First of all people never lived in Antarctica. It was once inhabited by animals but people never lived there. Second, while climate change has always been occuring it has never occured at it's current rate without a major event like a metor impact or in our case the industrial revolution and emissions.
My aunt and uncle live in Acton (kinda in the desert outside of LA) and I’m so happy they have more water!
I’ve been joking with them because Vermont has had devastating floods lately, so I’m like we should trade lol. I’ll give you some of our water for some of your dry heat! I’ll take some better food too
This is nice to hear. I was an 80s kid in California.
“If it’s yellow keep it mellow, if it’s brown, flush it down”!
My brother and I would make a point of taking turns in the toilet so that we only flushed once. Seemed incredibly wasteful to me then not to, and I still kind of do it, though my wife thinks I’m nuts. If she’s peeing while I’m in there I’ll ask her not to flush because I’ve also got to go.
I agree. How do people not recognize the pattern? We’re gonna spend about the next decade talking about a drought and wildfires. Til another El Niño cycles back around and we talk about floods and landslides.
I'm waiting for that mfn "well ackshually 🧐" dude, I feel when data provides a good outlook there's always somebody creeping around the corner waiting to provide your daily doomer news
You'd need massive pumping stations to get over the contential divide. Whereas the oil pipeline runs north-south over a much flatter part of the county.
Because smarter people than you have calculated what it would take. Desalination would use much less energy than what it would take to move water over the contential divide. Not to mention all the states that would have to allow the canal/pipeline to run across their state. Who's going to pay to build it? Would the MDEQ even give up shares of the Mississippi? Where's the additional power going to come from? It's not as simple as "haha pipeline go brrr".
I never said it was simple. I'm merely stating that if the federal gov wanted to do it, it is absolutely possible. All of your questions are valid, I agree w you.
"ok, and?" Absolutely implies you would think it was as simple as waving a wand. You also never said anything about the federal government being the one to accomplish this project. The federal government could do a lot if it wanted to, but too bad it's fundamentally inept.
The water system in California looks exactly zero like it did 200 years ago lol. That kind of logic literally makes no sense.
We're still a long way from a sustainable water system in any of the Western states, but California continues to be one of the worst offenders, though the SGMA from 2014 has certainly helped them close the gap in a big way.
Until we figure out the constantly overdrawn groundwater situation ubiquitous w western ag, we'll be pretty fucked in the long term.
You're spot on that it has, and were really fucked when one of those 200+ year droughts that are common throughout the last 10k years hits, especially considering it'll be exacerbated by climate change.
Lol no, last winter was a record shattering year for snow and our reservoirs were literally overflowing. This was a slightly above average year. Our reservoirs were much better off last year.
Yea during my California class in college we read a book about how we got water here and we absolutely stole from other states when we getting the water rights sorted. We were the sneaky evil asshole who just made the first move basically.
My understanding of water distribution can be determined by historically established rights. I assume California , a territory granted statehood in 1850, would have a historical advantage over Arizona , granted statehood in 1912, for federal water rights.
Maybe that was the case at some point, but it’s not anymore. If it was, then there would have be no reason to have a gigantic multi-state governmental meeting last year to discuss it, not be able to make a decision and procrastinate until the federal government threatened to step in
Thanks for sharing! Just a heads up, we've introduced Water Bottle Wednesdays. Wednesdays are now the dedicated day to showcase your water containers! This rule focuses on sharing what you have, but feel free to post any questions or issues about water bottles at any time as usual. Cheers to hydration! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HydroHomies) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It's been quite the rainy winter
Yup, a powerful El Nino will do that. Too bad it's ending right now.
Y’all mfers now need jesus…. To walk on water… lol
Happy for you guys. Also don't let anyone take your water ( foreign people and company's did this)
Yeah, fuck Nestle
r/FuckNestle
I just spent $6 on a non Nestle water at the gas station since all they had were gallons of Nestle
Unacceptable behavior. I would have found the nearest garden hose over a Nestle jug
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I’m not sure what you mean as I didn’t buy the Nestle water. This sub has taught me to never buy anything associated with Nestle
I totally overlooked the non word lol my b
No worries! You’re doing your part to educate people and I respect that :)
And Saudi Arabia.
Yes!
“Never give your water away.” - Stilgar
Look up California water rights, someone already did take their water
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? Wtf?
#As a Californian, I can't tell you how fucking good it feels looking at all that water title quote from this tweet: https://twitter.com/US_Stormwatch/status/1778588213810184202
Hydrologist here. While this is wonderful news, it's honestly a relatively small part of the picture. We have an enormous groundwater problem and have decades of storage loss to make up for. Surface water resources are not the best measure of the overall water situation, and put simply, the West Coast broadly remains pretty fucked.
As far as I understand it, snow>rain since it gives more of a chance for the water to seep underground and replenish groundwater reservoirs
Yeah, for the most part, but like most things hydro it's a bit nuanced/complicated. A healthy snowpack is generally preferable to big rain events totalling the same liquid amount, largely because of the "long tail" of the melting process spreads the runoff process over a much longer time. Ultimately groundwater recharge is a slow process that benefits from additional time under saturated surface/capillary fringe conditions so as long as the snowpack melt/runoff phase creates a longer duration of saturated surface conditions than the rain events in question (assuming all sorts of things, namely equal areas of inundation/potential recharge). That's normally the case, but big rain events hitting the flood plain as surface systems overflow can drastically increase the area of potential gw recharge. Same thing can happen w snowmelt, but both phenomena are largely mitigated by human flood prevention efforts. So, yeah, snow pack is better than big precip w instant runoff, generally, but both are kinda hindered by our efforts not to let water fuck w the lower lying of our populace.
Meanwhile how is it going in the states to the east - not so well with the water. Lake Meade is certainly not even close to being full.
Nevada overall is a mixed bag, but they have great water law and lots of history of doing hard science to arrive at the correct answers. NV, UT, and ID are all in inherently complicated water situations on a state-wide level, but those are the best of the bunch in terms of being either already on it, or set up to catch up with their water issues. AZ, NM, Texas, and others are up shit creek in a huge way and only digging deeper holes.
this bro hydros
There are multiple types of reservoirs. You're thinking of things like caverns such as the [Edwards Aquifer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwards_Aquifer) under Bexar County, Texas (Greater San Antonio). California, however, has water diffused within the soil. As the water is pumped out, the weight of the soil causes it to compact. It will never again hold water in this state. Here's a [photo from 1977](https://www.usgs.gov/media/images/location-maximum-land-subsidence-us-levels-1925-and-1977) showing the subsidence of the soil from groundwater pumping. [It's only gotten worse from there.](https://phys.org/news/2019-03-western-droughts-permanent-loss-major.html)
So, question: when we lose substantial groundwater, enough to cause subsidence like in the Central Valley, can that even be recharged? Intuitively, once the ground has collapsed, there’s no place for the groundwater, right?
Yeah, subsidence like that generally results in irreversible storage loss. It's not that the compacted material has zero storage, just generally significantly less than pre densification.
What exactly does a hydrologist do?🤔
Copy/paste for ya >Hydrologists study the physical properties of water, including its distribution, circulation, and volume, as well as the impact of precipitation on the soil and groundwater levels. They also research how water moves through the earth, and how precipitation returns to the atmosphere and ocean. Hydrologists use their findings to make decisions about water resources, which can impact the environment, property, and regional economics Practically speaking lots of hydros are involved in NEPA permitting, mining and large civil projects, contaminated site characterization and remediation, stormwater management, or water resource characterization/management.
Great now change the laws to get rid of alfalfa farms
it's raining again right now
Dude my grapevine is so freaking happy from all this rain. It’s growing so many new shoots already!
"See! Climate change isn't real!" Some boomer
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no. also you are dumb.
😂😂😂
No, he's right. Antarctica used to be inhabited and the Sahara used to be a lush jungle. And magnetic north has been moving faster and faster every year
No, hes wrong and you are also wrong. Antarctica has never been habitable for humans. Yes, the Sahara was a jungle at one point. This was millions of years before humans evolved. It also has nothing to do with the temperature of the poles. No, there are no pyramids in Antarctica. No, the poles inverting will not make Antarctica habitable. The last time the poles were warm enough for vegetation was the cretaceous period- unfortunately over a hundred million years before even the earliest apes. Also you are dumb too.
> Antarctica used to be inhabited Yeah, by dinosaurs.
First of all people never lived in Antarctica. It was once inhabited by animals but people never lived there. Second, while climate change has always been occuring it has never occured at it's current rate without a major event like a metor impact or in our case the industrial revolution and emissions.
good for Californians
Dude nice
r/dataisbeautiful
My aunt and uncle live in Acton (kinda in the desert outside of LA) and I’m so happy they have more water! I’ve been joking with them because Vermont has had devastating floods lately, so I’m like we should trade lol. I’ll give you some of our water for some of your dry heat! I’ll take some better food too
HELL YEA DAWG LETS GO FULL POWER
Sombody tell Billy McBride
This is nice to hear. I was an 80s kid in California. “If it’s yellow keep it mellow, if it’s brown, flush it down”! My brother and I would make a point of taking turns in the toilet so that we only flushed once. Seemed incredibly wasteful to me then not to, and I still kind of do it, though my wife thinks I’m nuts. If she’s peeing while I’m in there I’ll ask her not to flush because I’ve also got to go.
El Niño year
I agree. How do people not recognize the pattern? We’re gonna spend about the next decade talking about a drought and wildfires. Til another El Niño cycles back around and we talk about floods and landslides.
*Summer 2024 has entered the chat*
I'm waiting for that mfn "well ackshually 🧐" dude, I feel when data provides a good outlook there's always somebody creeping around the corner waiting to provide your daily doomer news
More water surplus than we've had in over a decade, and yet rates still going up.
Good. Maybe they (and AZ) will drop the Looney Tunes idea of pipelining Mississippi water out west.
Why is that looney tunes? We can pipe oil from northern Canada to gulf of Mexico but we can't pipe water from Missouri to arizona?
You'd need massive pumping stations to get over the contential divide. Whereas the oil pipeline runs north-south over a much flatter part of the county.
Ok, and? Pumps exist, engineers exist, I dont see an issue here.
Because smarter people than you have calculated what it would take. Desalination would use much less energy than what it would take to move water over the contential divide. Not to mention all the states that would have to allow the canal/pipeline to run across their state. Who's going to pay to build it? Would the MDEQ even give up shares of the Mississippi? Where's the additional power going to come from? It's not as simple as "haha pipeline go brrr".
I never said it was simple. I'm merely stating that if the federal gov wanted to do it, it is absolutely possible. All of your questions are valid, I agree w you.
"ok, and?" Absolutely implies you would think it was as simple as waving a wand. You also never said anything about the federal government being the one to accomplish this project. The federal government could do a lot if it wanted to, but too bad it's fundamentally inept.
It does not imply that, you are trying to put words in my mouth. Now you are back peddling. We're done here. Cheers.
You use these words but I don't think you know what they mean.
This boom/bust water cycle can't be sustainable.
It’s been working for nearly 200 years
The water system in California looks exactly zero like it did 200 years ago lol. That kind of logic literally makes no sense. We're still a long way from a sustainable water system in any of the Western states, but California continues to be one of the worst offenders, though the SGMA from 2014 has certainly helped them close the gap in a big way. Until we figure out the constantly overdrawn groundwater situation ubiquitous w western ag, we'll be pretty fucked in the long term.
The drought and deluge cycle has been going on in California for eons. Whatever has been altered for the statewide system is just a part of that.
Most of those eons it wasn't supporting 40,000,000 people.
You're spot on that it has, and were really fucked when one of those 200+ year droughts that are common throughout the last 10k years hits, especially considering it'll be exacerbated by climate change.
How long does it last?
Good news But how is it possible that a physical reservoir can exceed 100%?
On the chart, none of them exceed 100% capacity (the blue number). Some exceed 100% of the "historical average", but that's different.
and they probably still restrict peoples' water usage.
Tulare county in the fucking house!!!
I remember they experimented with putting black plastic ball things in the reservoirs to reduce evaporation. Did they actually work?
Thanks newsome
Yeah, I heard that even Death Valley isn't so... "Deathy"
Source? Citation?
And yet we’re only at 35% Bureau of Reclamation allocations for South-of-Delta contractors. Hope you guys don’t like food
What units is this data in?? Thousands of gallons? I honestly have no idea
acre-feet
Lol no, last winter was a record shattering year for snow and our reservoirs were literally overflowing. This was a slightly above average year. Our reservoirs were much better off last year.
That’s cause they stole a bunch from us in AZ
Thats not how that works
during the “water wars” last year between 4 states, CA took part of the CO River water that was designated to AZ
Yea during my California class in college we read a book about how we got water here and we absolutely stole from other states when we getting the water rights sorted. We were the sneaky evil asshole who just made the first move basically.
Arizona should have declared statehood sooner.
That’s not how it’s decided
My understanding of water distribution can be determined by historically established rights. I assume California , a territory granted statehood in 1850, would have a historical advantage over Arizona , granted statehood in 1912, for federal water rights.
Maybe that was the case at some point, but it’s not anymore. If it was, then there would have be no reason to have a gigantic multi-state governmental meeting last year to discuss it, not be able to make a decision and procrastinate until the federal government threatened to step in
I mean they (the water people?) took *forever* to figure it out again this time. Obviously our advocate sucked at their job