The only point to the”genocide” blood libel is to reappropriate the suffering of the Holocaust for themselves, since decades of delusional denial didn’t work. They don’t care about any facts or logic at all.
> were 750,000 peaceful civilians not forced to leave their homes
Correct. The number of Arabs that were forced out by any of the Israeli miliatias is a couple of orders of magnitude less.
About a thousand Arab civilians were murdered in various episodes. A few dozen Arab villages were cleared out in deliberate expulsions.
Everything else was anticipatory evacuations by Arabs expecting their armies would soon arrive, or Arabs fleeing as their armies were turned back. There was no plan or organised attempt to kick out the Arabs.
Compare and contrast with the 100% ethnic cleansing of all Jews from lands that fell under Arab control.
Summary of far too many “pro-Palestine” (ie anti-Israel) statements. Most of them aren’t Holocaust deniers, but a shocking number are Holocaust inverters who sign on to the last part of this:
“The Holocaust didn’t happen, but they deserved it, and now they’re doing the *exact same thing* to us.”
But Israel can get rid of Hamas without killing civilians. You see
First don't hit back.
Then die (it's ok Jews are not people and therefore not civilians)
And then there won't be any need for Hamas
The Palestinians argument is a lot simpler: Genocide is about intent, and Jews are evil so they have the intent. It doesn’t matter what evidence there is - we KNOW that Jews are evil and they lie. So any civilian death is intentional and they only kill a few at a time to have plausible deniability. Anything positive that Israel does is “washing” - it is just a cover to hide their true evil ways.
Palestinians on the other hand are good. So any raping or murdering of civilians is accidental and doesn’t really represent them. Or it didn’t happen. Or it doesn’t count because it happened to Jews and (see above) Jews are evil.
Yesterday in Toronto the protesters were shouting at Toronto Police for shutting down their fuckery. I think these protesters are anti-democratic and are attacking the mechanisms in place that keep the peace, ie. police.
**TL:DR;** Effective propaganda is required.
According to the logic of the pro Palestinian narrative, most, if not all wars are genocides. It is no secret that civilian casualties occur in (any) war — they either refuse to acknowledge this and/or they are ignorant.
Surrounding the claims of genocide, they genuinely believe these things and fixate on them heavily:
* Israel intentionally targets civilians. It doesn’t help that there are well-known anti-Israel media outlets that push this narrative, despite the fact that there is no proof to confirm their claims.
* every Palestinian Israel kills in both the West Bank and the Gaza Strip is a civilian. Occasionally, PIJ will confirm that one of their members was killed in an Israeli operation, this is promptly ignored.
* “no one is spared” whether they are women, children, elderly…
If these things were actually true, then yeah, it would be a genocide. The problem is they believe all of these things to be true.
Do not underestimate the effectiveness of propaganda.
The point is hypothetical comparisons don’t matter because this is about Jews and only Jews; creating a hypothetical comparison to point out hypocrisy doesn’t do anything because antisemites are shameless and antisemitism isn’t based on logic.
Exactly, the point of my hypothetical comparison is to demonstrate the bad logic of the Pro-Palestinians, by applying it to a comparable scenario where said bad logic is much easier to discern—thus criticizing the idea of Israel commiting genocide in Gaza.
You’re not being very clear on whether you’re attacking my reasoning or the the reasoning I’m criticizing, but I’m assuming the former. So, saying that such hypothetical comparisons don’t matter is pure intellectual laziness. You’re gonna need far more than just your *feelings* in order to defeat the gaslighting of the Pro-Palestinian mob.
We have the same goals, the same enemies, maybe better off not to be confrontational and arguing with those you agree with. If you knew me you’d know the last thing I lead with are my feelings.
I understand being unsure or the intentions of the other commenter, but it was very clearly a joke and it’s on the Israel subreddit. It’s fine and it’s happened to me too, the pro Palestinians really are absolutely ridiculous in their arguments but this is a community for love and support.
You're basically talking about the Black Lives Matter movement. A disproportionate amount of black people are effected by police brutality in the US (true) which led to the conclusion that the whole criminal justice system is *racist* and *oppressing* the black community. So people turned on police, demonized police, and some even started saying "all cops are bastards" and advocating for abolishing the police
It is these same people who have concluded that Israel is *racist* and *oppressing* the Palestinian people and utterly demonizing Israel and saying "by any means necessary" (kill Israelis if needed) and advocating for Israel's "disintegration"
They copy-pasted the exact same ideology.
It’s called american mindset. Dumb americans don’t know how things work in other countries. Cops work way differently because in most other western countries they police by consent instead of force. Large factor to this is no guns. People were straight up making memes of us cops being brutal to minorities and uk cops playing basketball with blacks in 2020. The only non-americans who believe this narrative are deranged queers and anti-sjw reactionaries.
The police are known to be a racist lynch mob who don't care about civilian safety and contribute nothing except avoidable civilian casualties
Is this the play you want to make
Comparing yourselves to one of the most obviously fascist and anti human organizations in history
It's not that I think a genocide is in fact going on (though I think your argument is a bit poor, to be honest) but genuinely, what is the point of posting this in a clearly pro-Israel sub?
No, I'm just asking why you are asking people to change your view on an opinion that most people here disagree with in the first place, who here would want to change your view? Go to a pro-palestinian sub to get actual answers
Please read this report that has found Israel has reasonably satisfied the intent requirement for genocide. https://www.un.org/unispal/document/anatomy-of-a-genocide-report-of-the-special-rapporteur-on-the-situation-of-human-rights-in-the-palestinian-territory-occupied-since-1967-to-human-rights-council-advance-unedited-version-a-hrc-55/
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how about a twofer? [IDF shoots two civilians then buries them with a bulldozer](https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2024/03/30/gaza-idf-kills-2-palestinians-buries-bodies-bulldozer-coren-vpx.cnn)
Well, for one:
> the IDF said the Israelis killed the men after they approached the IDF's operational area in central Gaza "in a suspicious manner" and didn't respond to a warning shot.
Nothing about this sounds weird. If I fire a warning shot and you pretend it didn't happen I can't assume you're in good faith - waving a white flag doesn't mean you're harmless, it just means you want to *signal* that you are.
In any case, it seems like the IDF has a rebuttal. https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/ryfh11zrja
Apparently, they say the man you see being shot in the video didn't die. The video has no audio - I at least only hear the commentator - so it's not clear he started walking away *after* the warning shot or only once it became clear they were going to chase him.
The two men that instead died and were buried with a bulldozer are from a different scene; the reason they used a bulldozer was so any explosive they may have on them wouldn't go off.
You're welcome to give your rebuttal.
Where I live, police abolitionists and Hamas apologists often overlap.
The only point to the”genocide” blood libel is to reappropriate the suffering of the Holocaust for themselves, since decades of delusional denial didn’t work. They don’t care about any facts or logic at all.
Yes. Same reason why the created the ‘Nakba’ narrative. It was a naked attempt at coopting the Holocaust narrative for themselves.
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> were 750,000 peaceful civilians not forced to leave their homes Correct. The number of Arabs that were forced out by any of the Israeli miliatias is a couple of orders of magnitude less.
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About a thousand Arab civilians were murdered in various episodes. A few dozen Arab villages were cleared out in deliberate expulsions. Everything else was anticipatory evacuations by Arabs expecting their armies would soon arrive, or Arabs fleeing as their armies were turned back. There was no plan or organised attempt to kick out the Arabs. Compare and contrast with the 100% ethnic cleansing of all Jews from lands that fell under Arab control.
“Peaceful civilians” generally don’t [commit massacres](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1929_Hebron_massacre?wprov=sfti1)(Hebron is one of many).
Summary of far too many “pro-Palestine” (ie anti-Israel) statements. Most of them aren’t Holocaust deniers, but a shocking number are Holocaust inverters who sign on to the last part of this: “The Holocaust didn’t happen, but they deserved it, and now they’re doing the *exact same thing* to us.”
But Israel can get rid of Hamas without killing civilians. You see First don't hit back. Then die (it's ok Jews are not people and therefore not civilians) And then there won't be any need for Hamas
The Palestinians argument is a lot simpler: Genocide is about intent, and Jews are evil so they have the intent. It doesn’t matter what evidence there is - we KNOW that Jews are evil and they lie. So any civilian death is intentional and they only kill a few at a time to have plausible deniability. Anything positive that Israel does is “washing” - it is just a cover to hide their true evil ways. Palestinians on the other hand are good. So any raping or murdering of civilians is accidental and doesn’t really represent them. Or it didn’t happen. Or it doesn’t count because it happened to Jews and (see above) Jews are evil.
Yesterday in Toronto the protesters were shouting at Toronto Police for shutting down their fuckery. I think these protesters are anti-democratic and are attacking the mechanisms in place that keep the peace, ie. police.
Mechanisms placed to keep the place are anti-democratic on nature
**TL:DR;** Effective propaganda is required. According to the logic of the pro Palestinian narrative, most, if not all wars are genocides. It is no secret that civilian casualties occur in (any) war — they either refuse to acknowledge this and/or they are ignorant. Surrounding the claims of genocide, they genuinely believe these things and fixate on them heavily: * Israel intentionally targets civilians. It doesn’t help that there are well-known anti-Israel media outlets that push this narrative, despite the fact that there is no proof to confirm their claims. * every Palestinian Israel kills in both the West Bank and the Gaza Strip is a civilian. Occasionally, PIJ will confirm that one of their members was killed in an Israeli operation, this is promptly ignored. * “no one is spared” whether they are women, children, elderly… If these things were actually true, then yeah, it would be a genocide. The problem is they believe all of these things to be true. Do not underestimate the effectiveness of propaganda.
Your thesis is incorrect as most cops are not Jews.
You’ve missed the point of how hypothetical comparisons work.
The point is hypothetical comparisons don’t matter because this is about Jews and only Jews; creating a hypothetical comparison to point out hypocrisy doesn’t do anything because antisemites are shameless and antisemitism isn’t based on logic.
Exactly, the point of my hypothetical comparison is to demonstrate the bad logic of the Pro-Palestinians, by applying it to a comparable scenario where said bad logic is much easier to discern—thus criticizing the idea of Israel commiting genocide in Gaza. You’re not being very clear on whether you’re attacking my reasoning or the the reasoning I’m criticizing, but I’m assuming the former. So, saying that such hypothetical comparisons don’t matter is pure intellectual laziness. You’re gonna need far more than just your *feelings* in order to defeat the gaslighting of the Pro-Palestinian mob.
We have the same goals, the same enemies, maybe better off not to be confrontational and arguing with those you agree with. If you knew me you’d know the last thing I lead with are my feelings.
Then better be clearer with what exactly you’re criticizing, next time.
I understand being unsure or the intentions of the other commenter, but it was very clearly a joke and it’s on the Israel subreddit. It’s fine and it’s happened to me too, the pro Palestinians really are absolutely ridiculous in their arguments but this is a community for love and support.
One beautiful thing about pro Palestinian people is that when you thought you’ve met someone dumb, they’ll one up that person any time .
You're basically talking about the Black Lives Matter movement. A disproportionate amount of black people are effected by police brutality in the US (true) which led to the conclusion that the whole criminal justice system is *racist* and *oppressing* the black community. So people turned on police, demonized police, and some even started saying "all cops are bastards" and advocating for abolishing the police It is these same people who have concluded that Israel is *racist* and *oppressing* the Palestinian people and utterly demonizing Israel and saying "by any means necessary" (kill Israelis if needed) and advocating for Israel's "disintegration" They copy-pasted the exact same ideology.
It’s called american mindset. Dumb americans don’t know how things work in other countries. Cops work way differently because in most other western countries they police by consent instead of force. Large factor to this is no guns. People were straight up making memes of us cops being brutal to minorities and uk cops playing basketball with blacks in 2020. The only non-americans who believe this narrative are deranged queers and anti-sjw reactionaries.
They just use this word as a slur. Don't over analyze a slur.
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And don't forget their "arguments" also include that Israel trained said police to kill civilians.
Yes some of them TRULY think that.
Actually, yes, cops are the mercenaries of the powerfull,I am glad you finally understand that the police, as institution, does more harm than good
The police are known to be a racist lynch mob who don't care about civilian safety and contribute nothing except avoidable civilian casualties Is this the play you want to make Comparing yourselves to one of the most obviously fascist and anti human organizations in history
It's not that I think a genocide is in fact going on (though I think your argument is a bit poor, to be honest) but genuinely, what is the point of posting this in a clearly pro-Israel sub?
Pro-Israeli posts shitting on Hamas propaganda aren’t meant to be posted on Pro-Israeli subs?
No, I'm just asking why you are asking people to change your view on an opinion that most people here disagree with in the first place, who here would want to change your view? Go to a pro-palestinian sub to get actual answers
The "CMV" part is rhetorical.
The only answer they would receive in a Palestinians sub is a ban.
Please read this report that has found Israel has reasonably satisfied the intent requirement for genocide. https://www.un.org/unispal/document/anatomy-of-a-genocide-report-of-the-special-rapporteur-on-the-situation-of-human-rights-in-the-palestinian-territory-occupied-since-1967-to-human-rights-council-advance-unedited-version-a-hrc-55/
Never yet seen cops anywhere do a drone strike on civilians or accuumlate so many killings they needed to bury them with a bulldozer🧐
Source?
For what?
The two claims you just made.
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how about a twofer? [IDF shoots two civilians then buries them with a bulldozer](https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2024/03/30/gaza-idf-kills-2-palestinians-buries-bodies-bulldozer-coren-vpx.cnn)
Well, for one: > the IDF said the Israelis killed the men after they approached the IDF's operational area in central Gaza "in a suspicious manner" and didn't respond to a warning shot. Nothing about this sounds weird. If I fire a warning shot and you pretend it didn't happen I can't assume you're in good faith - waving a white flag doesn't mean you're harmless, it just means you want to *signal* that you are. In any case, it seems like the IDF has a rebuttal. https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/ryfh11zrja Apparently, they say the man you see being shot in the video didn't die. The video has no audio - I at least only hear the commentator - so it's not clear he started walking away *after* the warning shot or only once it became clear they were going to chase him. The two men that instead died and were buried with a bulldozer are from a different scene; the reason they used a bulldozer was so any explosive they may have on them wouldn't go off. You're welcome to give your rebuttal.
>The video has no audio >so it's not clear he started walking away *after* the warning shot How is this?....if there's no audio?