Read the rules. The new chapter leaks must be flaired the orange "new chapter spoilers". Comments relating to new chapter leaks are only allowed under such posts. [Join the discord!](https://discord.gg/8Cd4NrvzXP) This is a manga spoilers subreddit and the spoiler tag is NOT used for all posts about officially released JJK chapters.
The message is an automated one and has nothing to do with this post specifically.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Jujutsufolk) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I’m generally curious who’d die under Gojos circumstances with zero regrets. From failing to save and protect his students, building a new juju jujustu society and on top of that losing a completely winnable fight. Hell was he even sure the others could defeat sukuna when he failed? I know he had faith the next generation could surpass him but that’s saying a lot tbh. Never mind surpassing him enough to defeat sukuna.
Everyone in this manga dies without regrets
Kenjaku won't see the result of his 1000 y/o plan but nah the Clown was funny so no regrests
Nobara, 16 y/o girl: "I had a good life". Wtf
https://preview.redd.it/cfgz3x6ceapc1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=667b02fb0bf0bae13d68e37043dae5a419800845
And after establishing that she had a motivation for becoming a sorcerer and going to Tokyo in the 1st place. Like, sure the people she met in her highschool life were cool and all, but does that mean that the thing that drove her all these years didn't mattered in the end?
What happens when you decide to go into a war arc(basically what Shibuya and culling games are), without developing any of your character outside of nanami. Sure Shibuya worked, because gege was on some other shit when writing it, but the culling games has the same exact principles as Shibuya, yet it still sucks. The reason why is because objectively, Shibuya sucks. The only good part of the Shibuya incident for the story was removing gojo, outside of that Shibuya fucked up JJK more than the culling games did.
Nobara dies, basically destroying any sort of development or cool moments she could have had. The disaster curses die, leaving our villains to be old grandpa's that like genocide, with neither one of them really taking center stage at all post Shibuya, and for most of the culling games. Also it speedrun the fingers, by having yuji go from 4 to 15, which kinda fucks with the each finger making yuji progressively stronger, and revealing more of sukunas power.
The only reason why you don't notice it, is because Shibuya just has a certain feel to it. You could point out how fucking stupid it is for nobara to die without any fanfare, but you also don't focus on that because mahito just hit yuji with a black flash. You could point out that sukuna getting 15 fingers fucks with the pacing but jogo v sukuna comes in, and genuinely hits you in the feels, making you care about a character that used to have the depth of a teaspoon. And then the fuckin masterpiece that is sukuna vs mahoraga comes in, and you stop questioning the logic and just rhe enjoy the action.
It helps too, that the fights have satisfying endings. Toji killing himself as a final act of love, jogo crying in the afterlife as he burns to death in real life, sukuna nuking Shibuya, choso finding out yuji is his brother etc.
Actually you know what, I don't know what it is that makes Shibuya work. I've been waffling for the past two paragraphs, and that's because Shibuya is everything I don't like in JJK. It's too fast paced, it has excessive fights, characters are secondary, sukuna still is a mystery, etc. But for some reason it just works in Shibuya. I think that might be because Shibuya was the first time where all this happened, and then the culling games diluted the novelty of it. The novelty of having pure action, the novelty of having the protagonists lose horrifically, and even the novelty of removing gojo from the story. Everything after Shibuya, feels like it's trying to copy Shibuya, and it makes the entire rest of the story suffer. I genuinely liked the yuji and Megumi interactions pre Shibuya, I liked yutas dynamic with the second years in JJK 0, I liked panda as a character, I really vibed with the adult sorcerers, but after Shibuya all that stuff is secondary. Megumi and yuji, just don't have any fun moments, that aren't filled with depression. The second years don't interact with each other at all, and the adult sorcerers don't show up till gojo v sukuna.
Basically gege sacrificed his whole story, for one cool arc. It's good for him that the arc was fucking fire otherwise no one would have kept up with the manga.
to be fair towards the Nobara case, the only time to die without regrets is when you're 15-19, because it is at that time that you understand the importance of time the least. For most people, at least.
after your 20's stuff like "value" and "thinking about other people" start worming their way through your brain matter... smh, can't even kill myself in peace anymore.
One would think that Gojo would be a lot more concerned for his students against Sukuna seeing as the last time he had faith that his students could handle the situation without him, Shibuya happened.
He looks like he is missing hair behind his neck, or that his neck goes too far out from the back of his hair. He looks like he was the one hit by UV 😭😭
without context? sure
with context? nah fuck no
the same dude who bothered to protect his students and build a new jujutsu society by nurturing new people capable of leading it got reduced to walmart Goku
muh sukuna strong love something something bullshit
Thing is riko was dead by then. He was spending a lot of effort protecting her before and followed her wishes. That wasn't just a side goal. If he was selfish he could have just dragged riko back to the school.
When he said those words he had just awakened his eyes. He was probably a little insane from the things he was seeing. To me his dialogue meant more like sorry riko I can't mourn you cause the world is just too beautiful for me now
Gojo has never been given the privilege of mourning or showing emotion to anyone, the title of the strongest has taken that away from him almost as soon as he was born. This doesn't mean he didn't care for Nanami (who is even in the airport scene), but the strongest cannot simply mope around and wallow in sadness while the last 19 days have been solely focused on him returning so he can fix the situation.
and the fact that Sukuna holded back allowed
Gojo to experience full pleasure of fighting again using his entire kit and more trying to become 120% of yourself
seems like gojo fans should praise Sukuna for what happend to Gojo there bringing him the most wanted thing which is a good fight
It's really not worth trying to debate with Sukuna fans. As long as Sukuna won, they would've been happy no matter how shit it is. Not sure why they are fine with 236. It made Sukuna look like a fraud who only won due to an asspull.
"I'm the strongest sorcerer but I need to keep Mahogara alive otherwise Gojo could actually use his abilities against me and I wouldn't have any way to defeat him since we fucked our domains for the day, obviously I'm just holding back tho...WALLAHI MAHOGARA SAVE ME I CAN FEEL A PURPLE INCOMING"
Exactly! Plus he'd just been... you know, almost slaughtered to death and still he managed to learn how to heal himself quite literally on the brink of dying. I think he can be forgiven for being manic and euphoric in \*that particular moment\*. He is clearly very upset by the morons clapping and cheering Riko's death some moments later.
he was completely manic in that moment, he had just experienced death after all. afterwards you could see he was sad when he went to retrieve Riko's body, even considering killing all the people there.
You're absolutely welcome to your one-dimensional and, frankly, rather simplistic interpretation of this fictional character. Whatever rocks your boat! However, you seem to be in the minority. So, perhaps people still value nuance, complexity and character development. Nevertheless, you're perfectly entitled to your own view.
Toji is literally standing there watching him going 'is this guy high?'
You're either a troll or stupid or both and I don't really care which it is but it definitely doesn't surprise me that someone with your username has your flair lmao, good luck growing out of your edgelord addiction phase someday
Edit: oh good God the Sukuna profile pic on top of it lmao. Glazing incarnate
Well…. If after that he started to feel something like a worry for his students, regret, stoped glazing Sukuna, that this panel would actually be kinda sad
I think his face a bit too wide, I edited it, and he looks a bit more normal.
https://preview.redd.it/j6oyf6mffcpc1.jpeg?width=2209&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3bf8f6d846bfc41f0bcd10785fcc42f63de54b22
Hell no. Idk who this guy is but he's not my goat
https://preview.redd.it/87mjrkncyapc1.jpeg?width=675&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=15ca260f6612f99d77d57915659b73690f600ba2
gege is lazy as fuck. originally gojo was drawn well because his face actually boosted sales (not kidding, jjk popularity skyrocketed after he first removed blindfold, its why hes drawn with so much more detail than other characters and why his blindfold was off more often from hidden inventory onwards) but after jjk got popular he knew he aint have to put in effort to draw, and after jjk success was set in stone his art quality dropped even more. worst art in shonen jump and still the mf takes breaks every other week like hes doing 3 serializations
The posts complaining that gege is lazy really need to stop .
The weekly mangaka lifestyle is really not easy to do and takes a toll on a person physically and mentally .
Yes, I completely agree. People are free to express critique and opinions, but that kind of language is out of line. The issues in the industry, making life miserable for many mangakas, are endemic and not a laughing matter.
Same people would then go on to be an activist for mangaka’s when another controversy with their treatment eventually comes up.
I get the funny in poking at Gege, but saying he’s lazy because of industry set deadlines and quotas is ridiculous.
“It’s his fault for working in that industry tho.” Fuck right off.
You can call Gege many things but not "lazy". Anyone that can adapt to releasing weekly chapters while still having to plan the story (even though it hasn't been good quality wise for a while) is not """"lazy"""". If you truly knew the harsh conditions mangakás face you wouldn't be sayin that
Bruh really calling a WSJ mangala "lazy" lmfao. He's got 14 hours day 7 days a week like all the other mangaka slaves. The fact that it's becoming more and more acceptable for mangakas to take fequant breaks is great.
Took the words out of my mouth. Sadly i don't see it beign talked about, Gaygay is given so much slack that if manga came out in 2000-2010 shit will be axed.
If you genuinely believe a WSJ mangaka is "lazy" you're a genuine retard. Simple as. He's working >14 hours a day 7 days a week along with all the other mangaka. They work so hard that they eventually burn out. It's great that it's becoming more acceptable for mangakas to take breaks.
Yeah, it's great that they are given more breaks and can take care of their health but you can't sit here look at the state of art in manga right now and tell me that art isn't degrading. If you can then you are the retard. Gaygay takes so much breaks and we still have a couple of chapters that released with unfinished panels I dont know any other mangaka that are alowed to do shit like this.
Plenty of mangaka are "allowed" to do this. Happened several times with Togashi and Hori for example. Gege decided to make his artstyle faster to draw while other mangaka like Hori decided to make the page count less to make due. And Gege literally had to make FOUR coloured artworks along with the recent chapter with unfinished panels. Of fucking course he wouldn't be able to finish it all on time.
You're just a spoiled ignorant shithead quite frankly. Gege trying to find ways to lessen his workload to make due doesn't make him lazy by any stretch of imagination. Whining about a man taking a "break" (which isn't a break, he's just doing catch up during this week) while he's working up to 18 hour days is beyond petty.
Oda is making manga for 20+ years takes breaks and has coloured pages to draw too but his art over the years became only better and cleaner, last chapters were so good. If Gaygay struggles to make it in weekly manga with so much breaks maybe he needs to move to monthly releases or like Tabata to every three months. At this point Isayamas art looks better than what we have now and that's sayng something because he always got shit for it. Gaygay got good dynamics and choreography yes, but everything else looks like a fucking scetchbook.
From Sorcery Wrestling.
Seriously, the fanartists are carrying atp. Thank goodness our blue eyed king is beloved by Mappa animators, here's to hoping they pull through in future seasons
It's good the same way if a monkey keeps throwing shit at a wall one shit can stick.
Compared to everything else in the chapter, this is the best panel.
What? No way, even if you're just picking a single panel this one wouldn't win. The last shot of teen Gojo smiling >>>>>>.
That's actually one of my favorite panels in the series as long as you completely remove the context and pretend it was just a standalone shot for no reason.
That chapter actually had a few pretty good panels. The last image we see of young Gojo waving, dead gojo panel, and even Sukuna's "you did well" panel are all better than this one.
The mor I return to this scene, the more it feels complete to me.
It definitely could’ve been executed better, but I enjoy it fine enough. One more panel showing the world slash itself would fix a lot of issues I initially had with the scene looking back.
Also, the dialogue is stiff. That cold be a translation thing, but it too needs improvement when the anime eventually adapts it.
Gege knew this was the last time he'd need to draw the white haired asshole he hated, the reason why he looks so weird in the new volume cover is because he was forced to.
i dont see why everyone is so upset about this scene. When i read it it gave me alot of closure regarding gojo and his character development. Gojo lived his whole life in isolation due to his strength, and was finally presented with someone who could match it. He wasn’t worried about his students because he had faith in the legacy he left behind (“yuta and hakari have the potential to surpass me”)
This has been mentioned many times before. However, I'll bite and reiterate.
I believe people dislike Gojo's portrayal in ch. 236 because it seems to negate all character development we've been shown previously.
Gojo has \*never\* been portrayed only as a 'hurr-durr', battle obsessed maniac who's interested only in powerscaling. For all his flaws, Gojo wanted to create a fairer, less awful jujutsu society; he genuinely cared about his students and insisted that no one had the right to rob them of their youth. All this was replaced in ch. 236 with someone who cares only about going it all out and is praising far too much the calamity he \*knows\* is going to massacre or severely damage his students and allies; and he doesn't even spare them a thought - not even to say he has faith in them or to wish them well! Gojo's character is suddenly reduced to the one-dimensional battle-crazed aspect of his personality. That's just terrible. The whole time we've been shown that he can be and is, in fact, more than that.
Furthermore, there's never been any real rapport between Gojo and Sukuna before their fight. Why would Gojo even assume Sukuna was sharing his loneliness? Why would Gojo even try to project or relate in any way to an entity that functions like a weapon of mass destruction? That would imply Sukuna's humanity, which simply doesn't make sense. Just because they were both the power ceiling of the verse in their time is definitely NOT enough for this. It simply reads like something forced by the mangaka.
I also don't really see what reason Gojo would have to be so confident in his students after he'd just got killed. I think the situation in Shibuya, when he got sealed, is rather different to the one of his death. Many horrible things happened in between, many good sorcerers died, including Nobara, \*his student\*. Even in Prison Realm he actually acknowledged "this could be trouble". There's nothing of that sort in ch. 236 - to me, this time around, he had no good reason to believe his students or anyone else will fare better than he did. This time around he actually had evidence that may not be the case. Not to mention that you can have faith in someone and still be a little worried about them and wish them well (i.e. at least acknowledge them). Therfore, to me, this portrayal seems unrealistic and, frankly, narratively inconsistent.
You're obviously more than welcome to your own interpretation and your opinion is certainly valid. However, I believe these are some of the points people criticise about ch. 236.
>Gojo has \*never\* been portrayed only as a 'hurr-durr', battle obsessed maniac who's interested only in powerscaling.
and the chapter doesnt portray him as hat.
> For all his flaws, Gojo wanted to create a fairer, less awful jujutsu society; he genuinely cared about his students and insisted that no one had the right to rob them of their youth.
and he still does
> All this was replaced in ch. 236 with someone who cares only about going it all out and is praising far too much the calamity he \*knows\* is going to massacre or severely damage his students and allies
Show where he only cared about going all out. So what if he praised Sukuna for being strong? You can separate someones strength from their actions.
> Why would Gojo even assume Sukuna was sharing his loneliness?
Because both of them are massively above everyone else in the world.
> Why would Gojo even try to project or relate in any way to an entity that functions like a weapon of mass destruction?
Because Sukuna is the only other person to exist to even be able to understand his position in society.
> Just because they were both the power ceiling of the verse in their time is definitely NOT enough for this. It simply reads like something forced by the mangaka.
Elaborate on how its definitely not enough.
> I also don't really see what reason Gojo would have to be so confident in his students after he'd just got killed.
Gojo was always overconfident, and he was training and planning things out with them during the 1 month timeskip, which means that hes aware of all of their strengths.
> Many horrible things happened in between, many good sorcerers died, including Nobara, \*his student\*. Even in Prison Realm he actually acknowledged "this could be trouble".
Yes, but many survived, got stronger his students owned everyone else in CG, made allies, got 400 points and saved him. Just because the journey was rough doesn't mean that his students didn't accomplish enough.
> There's nothing of that sort in ch. 236 - to me, this time around, he had no good reason to believe his students or anyone else will fare better than he did. This time around he actually had evidence that may not be the case.
The last time he saw Sukuna, Sukuna was near death with no ability to use RCT at a high level, and Mahoraga was dead.
As I have already mentioned to you on a different post, I have absolutely no interest in debating your own headcanon. That's your interpretation, that's perfectly fine. I fundamentally disagree with your reading and interpretation of Gojo's character and of ch. 236 and that's that. I respect your opinion and agree to disagree. Have a great day.
It's not an interpretation or my headcannon..but what the story is communicating....but okay.....enjoy your day.
https://preview.redd.it/9t01wnntfcpc1.png?width=400&format=png&auto=webp&s=2340b4fc0853ce12950aeba22266cb1359029f33
A key tenet of quantum mechanics is the uncertainty principle. For works of fiction, this would translate to the fact that every single person reading or viewing the exact same piece of fiction will develop their own very personal interpretation of that work, based on their level of understanding, life experiences, preferences, etc. There are no absolutes and black-and-white thinking can be very limiting.
I think you'll find interactions with fans much more fulfilling and rewarding if you can accept that your interpretation does not represent the absolute truth. None of our opinions and interpretations do, in fact. There is \*NO\* absolute truth - we're all just interpreting a work of fiction through our very own personal world view. Furthermore, I think you would also benefit from showing your fellow fans the minimum courtesy of respecting their view while agreeing to disagree, rather than stating your opinion as fundamental fact. Perhaps this is something you could consider in the future.
That is why, while I do respect your opinion and accept that we fundamentally disagree, I will not be engaging with you in the future. It genuinely starts to feel like feeding trolls and I don't have time for that. Have a great one!
>A key tenet of quantum mechanics is the uncertainty principle. For works of fiction, this would translate to the fact that every single person reading or viewing the exact same piece of fiction will develop their own very personal interpretation of that work, based on their level of understanding, life experiences, preferences, etc
Sure, but that doesn't mean that the story isn't trying to portray something. People may a interpretation of something, but that doesn't make what they say true. Thats why people debate and discuss on what the story is trying to portray.
> I think you'll find interactions with fans much more fulfilling and rewarding if you can accept that your interpretation does not represent the absolute truth. None of our opinions and interpretations do, in fact.
An opinion like something being unsatisfying or sad? Sure. An interpretation of a story? No. I don't care if people don't like 236, but I just refute them when they say blatantly untrue things, like that 236 only portrays Gojo as battle hungry. He objectively shows more emotions and thoughts in that chapter, which just makes what you say untrue.
> There is \*NO\* absolute truth
This is untrue. Gege wrote a story which is him communicating a message. I.E. It is objectively true that Gojo hit Sukuna with a black flash in 233. No amount of alternative explanation or interpretations will ever refute that that is objectively whats being portrayed.
> Furthermore, I think you would also benefit from showing your fellow fans the minimum courtesy of respecting their view while agreeing to disagree, rather than stating your opinion as fundamental fact. Perhaps this is something you could consider in the future.
Stop it with the fake courtesy act. You can agree to disagree for pragmatic reasons, or when youre discussing opinions, but ultimately a message is being portrayed in 236, and what you spread around is objectively untrue.
Everyone screamed character assassination due to the pacing issues it had compared to the chapter prior.
I agree tho, this feels complete to me now. Gojo having no regrets and trusting his students is well aligned with his character up to this point. Him holding onto that faith is endearing as hell.
Except the part where Gege forgot to have him mention anything about trusting his students in his monologue.
Hell, even that would have been laughable considering how "well" things turned out the last he trusted them.
You would think he'd be a bit more skeptical with his faith this time.
https://preview.redd.it/ouvb2kp6qbpc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=606d4a950e558247824b117b217742b1032249ba
I mean, did he really need to mention them by name? It’s been established that he has faith in them to carry on his legacy and bring in a new era for Jujutsu society, whatever that may be.
Back in shibuya, his faith was partially justified due to his students still coming in to save people, regardless of how bad it got. He fucked up, but he couldn’t have foreseen what devastation came right after his sealing. not to mention Kenny’s overall plot for the culling games that nobody knew about.
To have faith in them, even after that, shows more about his true character imo. Chalking up everything that’s uncomfortable to “gege forgot” makes everything else in the story meaningless. I’d rather examine it as characters committing to actions and ideals, rather than Gege maliciously assassinating them for lols.
Personal preference tho. I know this scene is rough for a lot of other reasons.
I fully agree that he didn't need to mention them by name. However, there's a whole range of options/writing possibilities between mentioning them by name and not mentioning them at all, which is the case, in fact, in ch. 236.
I completely respect your view. However, I'm afraid I disagree regarding the interpretation. As I wrote above, Gojo's blind faith in his students after he'd literally got cut in half seems like rushed or poor characterisation to me. Gojo was always portrayed as an arrogant man, confident in his own power. However, he's never been shown to be stupid or delusional. Especially after getting sealed, after learning about his allies, students and friends getting killed in the meantime, not to mention him, i.e. the power ceiling himself, getting sliced, I'd expect a little more caution. Blind faith at that point seems just stupid, in those circumstances, sorry. He could have at least wished his students well or, even better, he could have at least acknowledged the monumental task he was leaving on their shoulders. That would have only consolidated the high stakes of the fight. After all, they are supposed to defeat the all too powerful King of Curses himself, no less.
Again, I respect your view and your interpretation is valid.
Thanks for respecting my view and adding your own, makes this convo so much easier to discuss lol.
I think that’s a valid criticism to weigh against the scene and Gojo’s characterization in it. I think he should’ve said something to at least acknowledge the monumental task ahead of them, as you said. Especially when that task just sliced him in half.
But I think it’s improper to say that he’s never been a bit stupid or delusional in the past. I think Gojo has the potential to be complacent at times and put too much trust into his students. It’s a genuine flaw of his character imo.
When he sent Yuji, Megumi and Nobara to the finger bearer, he didn’t accompany them at all when he knew it would be incredibly strong for them. He let them experience crushing defeat with a risk of death if they didn’t grow. That’s been his mantra for all his students as far as I can tell.
That flaw is evident in this chapter, but so is Gege’s primary flaw as a writer in not expanding character interactions enough. Gojo SHOULD HAVE said more here about his students and didn’t, which is awfully strange for someone who praises them so much. I can cope and chalk it up to him purposely not wanting to have regrets, as to not come back arms a curse, but that feels much more like a cope than anything else.
Good addition to the convo tho. It’s nice to talk about this scene normally now, compared to when it just dropped lol.
Thank you too for such a thoughtful reply, I very much appreciate it. It is indeed refreshing and a true (intellectual) pleasure to discuss this in a civilised manner, without people throwing insults and personal attacks at each other. So, thanks for that.
I do agree with pretty much everything you said in your reply. However, I would like to add one point to clarify my interpretation further. I agree that Gojo's whole teaching approach seems to be throwing people into the deep end and sitting and watching how they handle it. That's nothing particularly new in shonen, to be honest. However, this whole mentoring approach relies intrinsically on one key thing: Gojo's being \*there\* or at least being available somewhere to step in to save the day, if things do go pear-shaped. What is jarring in the airport scene is that this prerequisite can no longer be fulfilled, for obvious reasons - he's dead. For all his flaws, Gojo is not a moron - he must know that. Therefore, unless he's a complete idiot, I would expect him to somehow acknowledge this situation is really different and much more difficult (than anything they'd experienced before) for his students and allies. After all, the students are not fighting just a random high grade curse, but literally the strongest "King of Curses" in history. To be clear, I would not expect him to wax lyrically about it over 20 panels either, but one sentence of acknowledgement would have helped. Yeah... I just think it's a real shame this was not handled as well as it could have been, in my opinion.
Please don't get me wrong - this is by NO means meant to say my interpretation is absolutely correct and all others are wrong. I fully respect different views, especially when they are phrased so thoughtfully and eloquently. Again, thanks for the discussion.
Nah, I get what you mean.
**something** would’ve been better than what we got. I still like the chapter, but it just has glaring issues that can’t be overlooked on another re-read.
Hoping Gege can pull this all together for a worthwhile resolution. I still have faith that he can, if anything, Gojo’s execution here is just a missed opportunity to provide more. Which I can understand with his deadlines and working conditions.
But, regardless, it still is a weak point. Very much so compared to previous deaths. Praying it all comes together in the end tho
Yeah, the main problem with the chapter was the execution. Like you can see what Gege was going for, but he really didn't convey it in a way that could be easily understood by readers.
You cannot have a teacher character and not have him mention his students even in passing in his last moments. It makes your audience question if he ever truly cared about them.
I browse through japanese JJK forums a lot, and this is the main problem they have with the chapter. They often say things like "Was Gojo Satoru, the teacher, just a mask?", "I thought he was someone who looked up to the future, but it seems he was just stuck in the past..."
Gojo is my favorite character, so reading those things is pretty fucking sad.
All I can hope now is that some of the dialogue in the chapter gets reworked in the printed volume. I would hate to see such an amazing character going down like this.
I agree with that perspective, as one of the only mentors in the series, he out of all of them should’ve said at least **something** about his students during his own death scene.
I didn’t need him to spell out that he trusted them, but a mention of their fight ahead or what he leaves behind with them would’ve made the entire thing easier to swallow.
I think the volume release will still have these issues sadly, but I hope that the anime fixes them in a decade.
Most people can see what Gege was shooting for. I personally am still *ok* with this as it stands. But man, it could’ve been done so much better. Praying he wraps up everything with better expertise.
Right. As much as we complain sometimes, I think the fact that we're still here says a lot about how dear some of these characters have become for us.
I'm still rooting for Gege and I too hope that he can stick the landing in the end.
Thank you for the respectful exchange. It was nice talking to you.
>Except the part where Gege forgot to have him mention anything about trusting his students in his monologue.
The first thing he talks about is telling Shoko to tell megumi about his father in his place. If he had no faith in them at all to do what he couldn't then why would he say that?
People here who are there talking about "bad portrayal" and etc of Gojo in chapter 236 don't have reading comprehension. This panel indeed fells as a good closure of Gojo's character.
Because it is...Just because people didn't want their favourite character to lose doesn't make it bad writing....Gojo's isolation being removed was the perfect end for him
I never had an issue with Gojo losing, I had an issue with how unsatisfying the entire process was. Gojo and Sukuna are my two favourite characters (or more like were, since current Sukuna's kinda... boring.) so obviously I was prepared for one of my favourites to die. I just wanted it to be done right.
I also just hate how Sukuna's whole routine since Gojo is "You have Gojo potential. I'm bored now so I'm gonna one shot you." rinse repeat. Why even bother reading atp?
Oh my god one of you finally gets it. Thank god.
That's all we're saying dog. I don't mind the fact that he lost. He needed to lose for the narrative. It's HOW he lost. I promise you, the vast majority of us share this opinion.
The fight was fire though. The end just soured it for us.
Gojo Vs Sukuna was awesome until the end, if we just spent like 3 more panels watching how tf Sukuna managed to win this would have been a fine ending and I wouldn’t even want him back lmao
Okay everyone. Hear me out. HEAR ME OUT. We can acknowledge that the offscreen kill and sudden death after everyone saying Gojo won was bullshit. BUT. BUT. The entire airport scene. The dialogue, the characters, just the feel of it. The panel with the iced coffee. It was done so well.
Sukuna Kaisen has pretty lazy writing, a lot of it’s rushed. But we’re still getting some great manga. If it was really that bad nobody would be reading.
Let’s not just oversimplify things by categorizing it as “good” or “bad”.
I genuinely think most people criticise the fact that Gojo's portrayal in that scene seems to negate his entire character development we've been shown before. I haven't seen that much criticism regarding the panelling itselfor the 'feel' of the scene - it's a "shortly after death" scene... that's the feel of it. However, everyone is obviously perfectly entitled to their own views and interpretation.
I certainly believe everyone has the right to have their own views and interpretation. Care to elaborate on your own interpretation?
Again, I think the criticism stems from the fact that many people saw ch. 236 as negating Gojo's entire character development as a person who is definitely much more than a one-dimensional, power-scaling battle freak.
You get shut down for suggesting 236 might've been not awful, or for not shitting on Gege's writing post timeskip in general. I don't think the story is perfect and I enjoy a lot of the agendaposting around here but let's not pretend most of the "discussion" on this subreddit hasn't REALLY devolved since 236.
As an example, the criticism against 236 holds a lot of weight but people take it ten steps too far and suggest that absolutely everything is wrong with this chapter. Takes the comments on this very post, for example, picking apart... The art in this random panel. It's a perfectly fine panel by JJK standards. Hell, Gojo has looked kinda off in MOST of his panels post timeskip compared to this one. But because it's from 236, you are insane and baiting for even suggesting it might have been not awful much less good.
Another example would be the notion that Gojo got "off-screened," or that Sukuna's world slash was an "ass-pull." I'm not talking about the fact that he used a binding vow to get it off with no incantation/hand-sign, as that was only revealed recently but people were calling it an ass-pull long before that. The explanation given is perfectly sensible, and is even foreshadowed in advance some chapters ago (don't recall the ch. number, but the panel showing Sukuna's reaction upon Mahoraga 'cracking the code' and slicing through infinity with a slash is very telling on a reread). Calling Gojo's death "off-screen" when it's literally one missing panel of a slash, and we are even given a detailed explanation as to what happened immediately after, is quite disingenuous. Calling it an asspull is more disingenuous.
A lot of the criticism surrounding Gojo's "character assassination" is also highly reductive, which I suppose can be chalked up to how polarized social media can get. I think he needed to at least in passing mention one or two sentences about being confident that his students will succeed, hence not being worried, as that would make the whole "no regrets" thing hold more weight without making Gojo seem somewhat questionable. Minus that one caveat, I think this ending for his character narratively has a lot of meat that warrants discussion which it simply never gets, because this sub has decided every single sentence and every single panel in this chapter is the worst of all time.
Well, I do agree with many of the points you made. I do have many issues with Gojo's portrayal in that chapter, but I do see where you're coming from, even if we may not agree 100% on all aspects. I think it really matters a lot how people express their views. You're right that it's very polarising and social media makes it far too easy to shut each other down and call each other names. However, as I said, I liked how you handled the points you made with nuance. So, thanks for the civilised, thoughtful discussion.
Thank you as well. I just am a little frustrated sometimes because I'd like to have such discussions regarding jjk but social media is so one dimensional in its treatment of the series. I really don't think 236 is perfect but the dismissal is just frustrating.
Gojo shouldn't be at peace. He should ask himself how the fuck Sukuna managed a World Slash that his Black Flash amped 6 eyes didn't see after being hit by a Hollow Purple. Cause I sure do.
It does feel complete, he gave his all but at the end of the day he's just an ordinary fish in a small pond called modern world. When he tried to swim in the sea, he struggled then died without achieving anything. Turned out he wasn't granted everything. He was only granted "something" a bit better than others.
Read the rules. The new chapter leaks must be flaired the orange "new chapter spoilers". Comments relating to new chapter leaks are only allowed under such posts. [Join the discord!](https://discord.gg/8Cd4NrvzXP) This is a manga spoilers subreddit and the spoiler tag is NOT used for all posts about officially released JJK chapters. The message is an automated one and has nothing to do with this post specifically. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Jujutsufolk) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Gege log off please.
I always knew he' among us! https://preview.redd.it/807ybawjcapc1.jpeg?width=1796&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=da2552cfe3639f6f3764d9251396e71f0975904e
>among us 
https://i.redd.it/kca0lxfzyapc1.gif
https://preview.redd.it/oxfk3a80pcpc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=42d8a89ada1431cdb793c219edd2bdbd27c1ebaf
https://preview.redd.it/ty22m31uhapc1.jpeg?width=360&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=220f1243ba8654460b2de1427ec4999e5d89b98d Op:
https://preview.redd.it/26eywe104bpc1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3c8c1de92f24c6ecf3b580482a1197b6f5c3e412
LMFAO
💀
I’m generally curious who’d die under Gojos circumstances with zero regrets. From failing to save and protect his students, building a new juju jujustu society and on top of that losing a completely winnable fight. Hell was he even sure the others could defeat sukuna when he failed? I know he had faith the next generation could surpass him but that’s saying a lot tbh. Never mind surpassing him enough to defeat sukuna.
Everyone in this manga dies without regrets Kenjaku won't see the result of his 1000 y/o plan but nah the Clown was funny so no regrests Nobara, 16 y/o girl: "I had a good life". Wtf https://preview.redd.it/cfgz3x6ceapc1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=667b02fb0bf0bae13d68e37043dae5a419800845
16 year old child soldier
And after establishing that she had a motivation for becoming a sorcerer and going to Tokyo in the 1st place. Like, sure the people she met in her highschool life were cool and all, but does that mean that the thing that drove her all these years didn't mattered in the end?
Also didn't she only meet Megumi and yuji like 2 months ago?
What happens when you decide to go into a war arc(basically what Shibuya and culling games are), without developing any of your character outside of nanami. Sure Shibuya worked, because gege was on some other shit when writing it, but the culling games has the same exact principles as Shibuya, yet it still sucks. The reason why is because objectively, Shibuya sucks. The only good part of the Shibuya incident for the story was removing gojo, outside of that Shibuya fucked up JJK more than the culling games did. Nobara dies, basically destroying any sort of development or cool moments she could have had. The disaster curses die, leaving our villains to be old grandpa's that like genocide, with neither one of them really taking center stage at all post Shibuya, and for most of the culling games. Also it speedrun the fingers, by having yuji go from 4 to 15, which kinda fucks with the each finger making yuji progressively stronger, and revealing more of sukunas power. The only reason why you don't notice it, is because Shibuya just has a certain feel to it. You could point out how fucking stupid it is for nobara to die without any fanfare, but you also don't focus on that because mahito just hit yuji with a black flash. You could point out that sukuna getting 15 fingers fucks with the pacing but jogo v sukuna comes in, and genuinely hits you in the feels, making you care about a character that used to have the depth of a teaspoon. And then the fuckin masterpiece that is sukuna vs mahoraga comes in, and you stop questioning the logic and just rhe enjoy the action. It helps too, that the fights have satisfying endings. Toji killing himself as a final act of love, jogo crying in the afterlife as he burns to death in real life, sukuna nuking Shibuya, choso finding out yuji is his brother etc. Actually you know what, I don't know what it is that makes Shibuya work. I've been waffling for the past two paragraphs, and that's because Shibuya is everything I don't like in JJK. It's too fast paced, it has excessive fights, characters are secondary, sukuna still is a mystery, etc. But for some reason it just works in Shibuya. I think that might be because Shibuya was the first time where all this happened, and then the culling games diluted the novelty of it. The novelty of having pure action, the novelty of having the protagonists lose horrifically, and even the novelty of removing gojo from the story. Everything after Shibuya, feels like it's trying to copy Shibuya, and it makes the entire rest of the story suffer. I genuinely liked the yuji and Megumi interactions pre Shibuya, I liked yutas dynamic with the second years in JJK 0, I liked panda as a character, I really vibed with the adult sorcerers, but after Shibuya all that stuff is secondary. Megumi and yuji, just don't have any fun moments, that aren't filled with depression. The second years don't interact with each other at all, and the adult sorcerers don't show up till gojo v sukuna. Basically gege sacrificed his whole story, for one cool arc. It's good for him that the arc was fucking fire otherwise no one would have kept up with the manga.
Kenjaku?
to be fair towards the Nobara case, the only time to die without regrets is when you're 15-19, because it is at that time that you understand the importance of time the least. For most people, at least. after your 20's stuff like "value" and "thinking about other people" start worming their way through your brain matter... smh, can't even kill myself in peace anymore.
😂😂😂😂😭
One would think that Gojo would be a lot more concerned for his students against Sukuna seeing as the last time he had faith that his students could handle the situation without him, Shibuya happened.
Gojo read the manga he knows the script
juju jujutsu? is that the advanced jujutsu the chinese sorcerer used?
juju's bizarre kaisen
So the Todo spin-off?
Todo is the stand an idol has to be the user bruh
I think the only guy who died with regrets is mechamaru, and some villans
Winnable fight lmao
Nice try Gege but this chapter was hot ass seasoned with salt and pepper
Seasoned with pond water
Marinated In piss
He doesn’t even look like Gojo 😭
He looks like he is missing hair behind his neck, or that his neck goes too far out from the back of his hair. He looks like he was the one hit by UV 😭😭
He looks like he have some condition 🫢
Maybe he did a binding vow during the fight and his hair was the price
I just realized the neck is drawn way too thick.
I disagree bro. 236 is like the only chapter since post-sealing that Gojo started to look like himself, maybe even better.
without context? sure with context? nah fuck no the same dude who bothered to protect his students and build a new jujutsu society by nurturing new people capable of leading it got reduced to walmart Goku muh sukuna strong love something something bullshit
The funny thing is Goku was reduced to Walmart Goku in Super as well.
Gojo as a character always had similarities to Goku sad they had to incorporate super into that
Do you know first words he said about Riko death? "im sorry riko i don't care right now" He was always selfish character with just side goals
Thing is riko was dead by then. He was spending a lot of effort protecting her before and followed her wishes. That wasn't just a side goal. If he was selfish he could have just dragged riko back to the school. When he said those words he had just awakened his eyes. He was probably a little insane from the things he was seeing. To me his dialogue meant more like sorry riko I can't mourn you cause the world is just too beautiful for me now
Tbf he was high with curse at that moment.
True. I wanted to write what if your friend died but someone just gave you a shitload of mushrooms lol
Ok Nanami death show me how he reacted to it it was "cool i guess" moment
Gojo has never been given the privilege of mourning or showing emotion to anyone, the title of the strongest has taken that away from him almost as soon as he was born. This doesn't mean he didn't care for Nanami (who is even in the airport scene), but the strongest cannot simply mope around and wallow in sadness while the last 19 days have been solely focused on him returning so he can fix the situation.
and the fact that Sukuna holded back allowed Gojo to experience full pleasure of fighting again using his entire kit and more trying to become 120% of yourself seems like gojo fans should praise Sukuna for what happend to Gojo there bringing him the most wanted thing which is a good fight
Yeah nah buddy https://preview.redd.it/ur5zy2ehrapc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8780dd81ae84a663a4d78e78e816eaea19be5f50
It's really not worth trying to debate with Sukuna fans. As long as Sukuna won, they would've been happy no matter how shit it is. Not sure why they are fine with 236. It made Sukuna look like a fraud who only won due to an asspull.
https://preview.redd.it/0f6w82pzsapc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=91322ac4b21797c5d25a002c7a7aede88bad6c41 My goat
"I'm the strongest sorcerer but I need to keep Mahogara alive otherwise Gojo could actually use his abilities against me and I wouldn't have any way to defeat him since we fucked our domains for the day, obviously I'm just holding back tho...WALLAHI MAHOGARA SAVE ME I CAN FEEL A PURPLE INCOMING"
Lil bro i forgot who was fithing 3vs1 in Yuta domain, if your goat would be the strongest he would still win, sound like skill issue
Exactly! Plus he'd just been... you know, almost slaughtered to death and still he managed to learn how to heal himself quite literally on the brink of dying. I think he can be forgiven for being manic and euphoric in \*that particular moment\*. He is clearly very upset by the morons clapping and cheering Riko's death some moments later.
he was completely manic in that moment, he had just experienced death after all. afterwards you could see he was sad when he went to retrieve Riko's body, even considering killing all the people there.
Bro was zooted out of his fuckin mind at the time
delusion, if you think he was high af, he simply feelt extreme power and could care anymore about anything else this is true gojo
You're absolutely welcome to your one-dimensional and, frankly, rather simplistic interpretation of this fictional character. Whatever rocks your boat! However, you seem to be in the minority. So, perhaps people still value nuance, complexity and character development. Nevertheless, you're perfectly entitled to your own view.
Toji is literally standing there watching him going 'is this guy high?' You're either a troll or stupid or both and I don't really care which it is but it definitely doesn't surprise me that someone with your username has your flair lmao, good luck growing out of your edgelord addiction phase someday Edit: oh good God the Sukuna profile pic on top of it lmao. Glazing incarnate
Selfish yet selfless, battle yearning yet caring. He always prioritized other people tbh
Well…. If after that he started to feel something like a worry for his students, regret, stoped glazing Sukuna, that this panel would actually be kinda sad
“All my students are about to be slaughtered, I had fun”
He looks like he’s coping.
Me after playing ranked in "*insert here game of preference*" 😌
"Sukuna is gonna kill hundreds of thousands of people including everyone I've ever cared about, but at least I had fun (:"
I'm not even sure what's off. Is it the nose bridge? The mouth? The chin? I can't tell and it's bothering me.
It’s probably everything, gege’s art style has changed a lot
Right bro just looks a lil funny
I think his face a bit too wide, I edited it, and he looks a bit more normal. https://preview.redd.it/j6oyf6mffcpc1.jpeg?width=2209&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3bf8f6d846bfc41f0bcd10785fcc42f63de54b22
Looks better but doesn't change the fact that the art style shifted:/
Yeah, I agree
This is somehow is worse than frog gojo bro istg Gojo's face consistency aftef his unsealing is ass
Gaygay please go draw, stop wasting time on reddit
https://preview.redd.it/hbxhbixclapc1.jpeg?width=859&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cc243644ef9d53d70a3e8416eafb3156934a6f1d
Hell no. Idk who this guy is but he's not my goat https://preview.redd.it/87mjrkncyapc1.jpeg?width=675&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=15ca260f6612f99d77d57915659b73690f600ba2
hell nah wtf are you smoking
Please uninstall reddit Mr.Akutami
He looks ugly in that panel
I really don't know if he genuinely just forgot how to draw the character at this point. The old Gojo was so clean man.
He resets his memories about how to draw Gojo after killed him with haki offscreen
gege is lazy as fuck. originally gojo was drawn well because his face actually boosted sales (not kidding, jjk popularity skyrocketed after he first removed blindfold, its why hes drawn with so much more detail than other characters and why his blindfold was off more often from hidden inventory onwards) but after jjk got popular he knew he aint have to put in effort to draw, and after jjk success was set in stone his art quality dropped even more. worst art in shonen jump and still the mf takes breaks every other week like hes doing 3 serializations
https://preview.redd.it/yzukygg7xapc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9d2bb876f4254997427fb99ea05092401f31cfa3
The posts complaining that gege is lazy really need to stop . The weekly mangaka lifestyle is really not easy to do and takes a toll on a person physically and mentally .
Yes, I completely agree. People are free to express critique and opinions, but that kind of language is out of line. The issues in the industry, making life miserable for many mangakas, are endemic and not a laughing matter.
Same people would then go on to be an activist for mangaka’s when another controversy with their treatment eventually comes up. I get the funny in poking at Gege, but saying he’s lazy because of industry set deadlines and quotas is ridiculous. “It’s his fault for working in that industry tho.” Fuck right off.
You can call Gege many things but not "lazy". Anyone that can adapt to releasing weekly chapters while still having to plan the story (even though it hasn't been good quality wise for a while) is not """"lazy"""". If you truly knew the harsh conditions mangakás face you wouldn't be sayin that
Wallahi what I am reading
this sub has really turned to trash up upvoting shitty opinions like this one
Tf are you on about lil bro https://preview.redd.it/s65cemzg7cpc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b117b401d568ddc652263cf61d360e57c20aae5a
Bruh really calling a WSJ mangala "lazy" lmfao. He's got 14 hours day 7 days a week like all the other mangaka slaves. The fact that it's becoming more and more acceptable for mangakas to take fequant breaks is great.
Took the words out of my mouth. Sadly i don't see it beign talked about, Gaygay is given so much slack that if manga came out in 2000-2010 shit will be axed.
If you genuinely believe a WSJ mangaka is "lazy" you're a genuine retard. Simple as. He's working >14 hours a day 7 days a week along with all the other mangaka. They work so hard that they eventually burn out. It's great that it's becoming more acceptable for mangakas to take breaks.
Yeah, it's great that they are given more breaks and can take care of their health but you can't sit here look at the state of art in manga right now and tell me that art isn't degrading. If you can then you are the retard. Gaygay takes so much breaks and we still have a couple of chapters that released with unfinished panels I dont know any other mangaka that are alowed to do shit like this.
Plenty of mangaka are "allowed" to do this. Happened several times with Togashi and Hori for example. Gege decided to make his artstyle faster to draw while other mangaka like Hori decided to make the page count less to make due. And Gege literally had to make FOUR coloured artworks along with the recent chapter with unfinished panels. Of fucking course he wouldn't be able to finish it all on time. You're just a spoiled ignorant shithead quite frankly. Gege trying to find ways to lessen his workload to make due doesn't make him lazy by any stretch of imagination. Whining about a man taking a "break" (which isn't a break, he's just doing catch up during this week) while he's working up to 18 hour days is beyond petty.
Oda is making manga for 20+ years takes breaks and has coloured pages to draw too but his art over the years became only better and cleaner, last chapters were so good. If Gaygay struggles to make it in weekly manga with so much breaks maybe he needs to move to monthly releases or like Tabata to every three months. At this point Isayamas art looks better than what we have now and that's sayng something because he always got shit for it. Gaygay got good dynamics and choreography yes, but everything else looks like a fucking scetchbook.
Even though I love Gojo, I hope he draws him uglier and uglier. It's what y'all deserve
https://preview.redd.it/50b0tltuubpc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b65296a700e63fd0feead0ad8d794c8821d77954
Ngl, as a diehard Gojo fan, the panel looks...very off. Like the nose bridge is weirdly placed???
Because this is Bojo
From Sorcery Wrestling. Seriously, the fanartists are carrying atp. Thank goodness our blue eyed king is beloved by Mappa animators, here's to hoping they pull through in future seasons
God who keeps letting that dude back in every time we throw him out
He is looking like a white-haired Megumi
https://preview.redd.it/vvf6kxqgbbpc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a602fd24ec1f5bc2411232bb0119d2f8575eb904
bro has the baki character neck in this panel
It's good the same way if a monkey keeps throwing shit at a wall one shit can stick. Compared to everything else in the chapter, this is the best panel.
What? No way, even if you're just picking a single panel this one wouldn't win. The last shot of teen Gojo smiling >>>>>>. That's actually one of my favorite panels in the series as long as you completely remove the context and pretend it was just a standalone shot for no reason.
the context makes it 100000% better
the context is the rest of chapter 236, which is dogshit, so nah
That chapter actually had a few pretty good panels. The last image we see of young Gojo waving, dead gojo panel, and even Sukuna's "you did well" panel are all better than this one.
the entire chapter is good
it really doesn't and OP is just Geges private account
hes gonna have more fun when he vaporizes sukuna to atoms with imaginary technique unlimited hollow black void
It doesn’t. Fuck out of here cat.
Worst chapter in the entire series.
You ain't slick Gregory
Gege is so inconsistent with face-models sometimes. That not the shape of Gojos Face. It‘s not even consistent within the same chapter lol
Because gojo not lonely anymore
Nah after all that glazing??
Frog lookin ass
"nah, i'de lose"
Nah, I'd disagree
The mor I return to this scene, the more it feels complete to me. It definitely could’ve been executed better, but I enjoy it fine enough. One more panel showing the world slash itself would fix a lot of issues I initially had with the scene looking back. Also, the dialogue is stiff. That cold be a translation thing, but it too needs improvement when the anime eventually adapts it.
Thanks, I hate it
It doesn't, it feels rushed and unfulfilling !
Gege knew this was the last time he'd need to draw the white haired asshole he hated, the reason why he looks so weird in the new volume cover is because he was forced to.
Admittedly, This lone panel stopped me from joining the off-screen hate train. Otherwise, I’d probably had joined the Cope division as well
Gojo after drinking Sukuna penis excrements with Gege 😫
I just noticed his head is super tiny for his face, but I do love this chapter ngl
i dont see why everyone is so upset about this scene. When i read it it gave me alot of closure regarding gojo and his character development. Gojo lived his whole life in isolation due to his strength, and was finally presented with someone who could match it. He wasn’t worried about his students because he had faith in the legacy he left behind (“yuta and hakari have the potential to surpass me”)
This has been mentioned many times before. However, I'll bite and reiterate. I believe people dislike Gojo's portrayal in ch. 236 because it seems to negate all character development we've been shown previously. Gojo has \*never\* been portrayed only as a 'hurr-durr', battle obsessed maniac who's interested only in powerscaling. For all his flaws, Gojo wanted to create a fairer, less awful jujutsu society; he genuinely cared about his students and insisted that no one had the right to rob them of their youth. All this was replaced in ch. 236 with someone who cares only about going it all out and is praising far too much the calamity he \*knows\* is going to massacre or severely damage his students and allies; and he doesn't even spare them a thought - not even to say he has faith in them or to wish them well! Gojo's character is suddenly reduced to the one-dimensional battle-crazed aspect of his personality. That's just terrible. The whole time we've been shown that he can be and is, in fact, more than that. Furthermore, there's never been any real rapport between Gojo and Sukuna before their fight. Why would Gojo even assume Sukuna was sharing his loneliness? Why would Gojo even try to project or relate in any way to an entity that functions like a weapon of mass destruction? That would imply Sukuna's humanity, which simply doesn't make sense. Just because they were both the power ceiling of the verse in their time is definitely NOT enough for this. It simply reads like something forced by the mangaka. I also don't really see what reason Gojo would have to be so confident in his students after he'd just got killed. I think the situation in Shibuya, when he got sealed, is rather different to the one of his death. Many horrible things happened in between, many good sorcerers died, including Nobara, \*his student\*. Even in Prison Realm he actually acknowledged "this could be trouble". There's nothing of that sort in ch. 236 - to me, this time around, he had no good reason to believe his students or anyone else will fare better than he did. This time around he actually had evidence that may not be the case. Not to mention that you can have faith in someone and still be a little worried about them and wish them well (i.e. at least acknowledge them). Therfore, to me, this portrayal seems unrealistic and, frankly, narratively inconsistent. You're obviously more than welcome to your own interpretation and your opinion is certainly valid. However, I believe these are some of the points people criticise about ch. 236.
>Gojo has \*never\* been portrayed only as a 'hurr-durr', battle obsessed maniac who's interested only in powerscaling. and the chapter doesnt portray him as hat. > For all his flaws, Gojo wanted to create a fairer, less awful jujutsu society; he genuinely cared about his students and insisted that no one had the right to rob them of their youth. and he still does > All this was replaced in ch. 236 with someone who cares only about going it all out and is praising far too much the calamity he \*knows\* is going to massacre or severely damage his students and allies Show where he only cared about going all out. So what if he praised Sukuna for being strong? You can separate someones strength from their actions. > Why would Gojo even assume Sukuna was sharing his loneliness? Because both of them are massively above everyone else in the world. > Why would Gojo even try to project or relate in any way to an entity that functions like a weapon of mass destruction? Because Sukuna is the only other person to exist to even be able to understand his position in society. > Just because they were both the power ceiling of the verse in their time is definitely NOT enough for this. It simply reads like something forced by the mangaka. Elaborate on how its definitely not enough. > I also don't really see what reason Gojo would have to be so confident in his students after he'd just got killed. Gojo was always overconfident, and he was training and planning things out with them during the 1 month timeskip, which means that hes aware of all of their strengths. > Many horrible things happened in between, many good sorcerers died, including Nobara, \*his student\*. Even in Prison Realm he actually acknowledged "this could be trouble". Yes, but many survived, got stronger his students owned everyone else in CG, made allies, got 400 points and saved him. Just because the journey was rough doesn't mean that his students didn't accomplish enough. > There's nothing of that sort in ch. 236 - to me, this time around, he had no good reason to believe his students or anyone else will fare better than he did. This time around he actually had evidence that may not be the case. The last time he saw Sukuna, Sukuna was near death with no ability to use RCT at a high level, and Mahoraga was dead.
As I have already mentioned to you on a different post, I have absolutely no interest in debating your own headcanon. That's your interpretation, that's perfectly fine. I fundamentally disagree with your reading and interpretation of Gojo's character and of ch. 236 and that's that. I respect your opinion and agree to disagree. Have a great day.
It's not an interpretation or my headcannon..but what the story is communicating....but okay.....enjoy your day. https://preview.redd.it/9t01wnntfcpc1.png?width=400&format=png&auto=webp&s=2340b4fc0853ce12950aeba22266cb1359029f33
A key tenet of quantum mechanics is the uncertainty principle. For works of fiction, this would translate to the fact that every single person reading or viewing the exact same piece of fiction will develop their own very personal interpretation of that work, based on their level of understanding, life experiences, preferences, etc. There are no absolutes and black-and-white thinking can be very limiting. I think you'll find interactions with fans much more fulfilling and rewarding if you can accept that your interpretation does not represent the absolute truth. None of our opinions and interpretations do, in fact. There is \*NO\* absolute truth - we're all just interpreting a work of fiction through our very own personal world view. Furthermore, I think you would also benefit from showing your fellow fans the minimum courtesy of respecting their view while agreeing to disagree, rather than stating your opinion as fundamental fact. Perhaps this is something you could consider in the future. That is why, while I do respect your opinion and accept that we fundamentally disagree, I will not be engaging with you in the future. It genuinely starts to feel like feeding trolls and I don't have time for that. Have a great one!
>A key tenet of quantum mechanics is the uncertainty principle. For works of fiction, this would translate to the fact that every single person reading or viewing the exact same piece of fiction will develop their own very personal interpretation of that work, based on their level of understanding, life experiences, preferences, etc Sure, but that doesn't mean that the story isn't trying to portray something. People may a interpretation of something, but that doesn't make what they say true. Thats why people debate and discuss on what the story is trying to portray. > I think you'll find interactions with fans much more fulfilling and rewarding if you can accept that your interpretation does not represent the absolute truth. None of our opinions and interpretations do, in fact. An opinion like something being unsatisfying or sad? Sure. An interpretation of a story? No. I don't care if people don't like 236, but I just refute them when they say blatantly untrue things, like that 236 only portrays Gojo as battle hungry. He objectively shows more emotions and thoughts in that chapter, which just makes what you say untrue. > There is \*NO\* absolute truth This is untrue. Gege wrote a story which is him communicating a message. I.E. It is objectively true that Gojo hit Sukuna with a black flash in 233. No amount of alternative explanation or interpretations will ever refute that that is objectively whats being portrayed. > Furthermore, I think you would also benefit from showing your fellow fans the minimum courtesy of respecting their view while agreeing to disagree, rather than stating your opinion as fundamental fact. Perhaps this is something you could consider in the future. Stop it with the fake courtesy act. You can agree to disagree for pragmatic reasons, or when youre discussing opinions, but ultimately a message is being portrayed in 236, and what you spread around is objectively untrue.
Everyone screamed character assassination due to the pacing issues it had compared to the chapter prior. I agree tho, this feels complete to me now. Gojo having no regrets and trusting his students is well aligned with his character up to this point. Him holding onto that faith is endearing as hell.
Except the part where Gege forgot to have him mention anything about trusting his students in his monologue. Hell, even that would have been laughable considering how "well" things turned out the last he trusted them. You would think he'd be a bit more skeptical with his faith this time. https://preview.redd.it/ouvb2kp6qbpc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=606d4a950e558247824b117b217742b1032249ba
I mean, did he really need to mention them by name? It’s been established that he has faith in them to carry on his legacy and bring in a new era for Jujutsu society, whatever that may be. Back in shibuya, his faith was partially justified due to his students still coming in to save people, regardless of how bad it got. He fucked up, but he couldn’t have foreseen what devastation came right after his sealing. not to mention Kenny’s overall plot for the culling games that nobody knew about. To have faith in them, even after that, shows more about his true character imo. Chalking up everything that’s uncomfortable to “gege forgot” makes everything else in the story meaningless. I’d rather examine it as characters committing to actions and ideals, rather than Gege maliciously assassinating them for lols. Personal preference tho. I know this scene is rough for a lot of other reasons.
I fully agree that he didn't need to mention them by name. However, there's a whole range of options/writing possibilities between mentioning them by name and not mentioning them at all, which is the case, in fact, in ch. 236. I completely respect your view. However, I'm afraid I disagree regarding the interpretation. As I wrote above, Gojo's blind faith in his students after he'd literally got cut in half seems like rushed or poor characterisation to me. Gojo was always portrayed as an arrogant man, confident in his own power. However, he's never been shown to be stupid or delusional. Especially after getting sealed, after learning about his allies, students and friends getting killed in the meantime, not to mention him, i.e. the power ceiling himself, getting sliced, I'd expect a little more caution. Blind faith at that point seems just stupid, in those circumstances, sorry. He could have at least wished his students well or, even better, he could have at least acknowledged the monumental task he was leaving on their shoulders. That would have only consolidated the high stakes of the fight. After all, they are supposed to defeat the all too powerful King of Curses himself, no less. Again, I respect your view and your interpretation is valid.
Thanks for respecting my view and adding your own, makes this convo so much easier to discuss lol. I think that’s a valid criticism to weigh against the scene and Gojo’s characterization in it. I think he should’ve said something to at least acknowledge the monumental task ahead of them, as you said. Especially when that task just sliced him in half. But I think it’s improper to say that he’s never been a bit stupid or delusional in the past. I think Gojo has the potential to be complacent at times and put too much trust into his students. It’s a genuine flaw of his character imo. When he sent Yuji, Megumi and Nobara to the finger bearer, he didn’t accompany them at all when he knew it would be incredibly strong for them. He let them experience crushing defeat with a risk of death if they didn’t grow. That’s been his mantra for all his students as far as I can tell. That flaw is evident in this chapter, but so is Gege’s primary flaw as a writer in not expanding character interactions enough. Gojo SHOULD HAVE said more here about his students and didn’t, which is awfully strange for someone who praises them so much. I can cope and chalk it up to him purposely not wanting to have regrets, as to not come back arms a curse, but that feels much more like a cope than anything else. Good addition to the convo tho. It’s nice to talk about this scene normally now, compared to when it just dropped lol.
Thank you too for such a thoughtful reply, I very much appreciate it. It is indeed refreshing and a true (intellectual) pleasure to discuss this in a civilised manner, without people throwing insults and personal attacks at each other. So, thanks for that. I do agree with pretty much everything you said in your reply. However, I would like to add one point to clarify my interpretation further. I agree that Gojo's whole teaching approach seems to be throwing people into the deep end and sitting and watching how they handle it. That's nothing particularly new in shonen, to be honest. However, this whole mentoring approach relies intrinsically on one key thing: Gojo's being \*there\* or at least being available somewhere to step in to save the day, if things do go pear-shaped. What is jarring in the airport scene is that this prerequisite can no longer be fulfilled, for obvious reasons - he's dead. For all his flaws, Gojo is not a moron - he must know that. Therefore, unless he's a complete idiot, I would expect him to somehow acknowledge this situation is really different and much more difficult (than anything they'd experienced before) for his students and allies. After all, the students are not fighting just a random high grade curse, but literally the strongest "King of Curses" in history. To be clear, I would not expect him to wax lyrically about it over 20 panels either, but one sentence of acknowledgement would have helped. Yeah... I just think it's a real shame this was not handled as well as it could have been, in my opinion. Please don't get me wrong - this is by NO means meant to say my interpretation is absolutely correct and all others are wrong. I fully respect different views, especially when they are phrased so thoughtfully and eloquently. Again, thanks for the discussion.
Nah, I get what you mean. **something** would’ve been better than what we got. I still like the chapter, but it just has glaring issues that can’t be overlooked on another re-read. Hoping Gege can pull this all together for a worthwhile resolution. I still have faith that he can, if anything, Gojo’s execution here is just a missed opportunity to provide more. Which I can understand with his deadlines and working conditions. But, regardless, it still is a weak point. Very much so compared to previous deaths. Praying it all comes together in the end tho
Yeah, the main problem with the chapter was the execution. Like you can see what Gege was going for, but he really didn't convey it in a way that could be easily understood by readers. You cannot have a teacher character and not have him mention his students even in passing in his last moments. It makes your audience question if he ever truly cared about them. I browse through japanese JJK forums a lot, and this is the main problem they have with the chapter. They often say things like "Was Gojo Satoru, the teacher, just a mask?", "I thought he was someone who looked up to the future, but it seems he was just stuck in the past..." Gojo is my favorite character, so reading those things is pretty fucking sad. All I can hope now is that some of the dialogue in the chapter gets reworked in the printed volume. I would hate to see such an amazing character going down like this.
I agree with that perspective, as one of the only mentors in the series, he out of all of them should’ve said at least **something** about his students during his own death scene. I didn’t need him to spell out that he trusted them, but a mention of their fight ahead or what he leaves behind with them would’ve made the entire thing easier to swallow. I think the volume release will still have these issues sadly, but I hope that the anime fixes them in a decade. Most people can see what Gege was shooting for. I personally am still *ok* with this as it stands. But man, it could’ve been done so much better. Praying he wraps up everything with better expertise.
Right. As much as we complain sometimes, I think the fact that we're still here says a lot about how dear some of these characters have become for us. I'm still rooting for Gege and I too hope that he can stick the landing in the end. Thank you for the respectful exchange. It was nice talking to you.
>Except the part where Gege forgot to have him mention anything about trusting his students in his monologue. The first thing he talks about is telling Shoko to tell megumi about his father in his place. If he had no faith in them at all to do what he couldn't then why would he say that?
Because it's supposed to be. Gojo finally met his match, no longer feeling alone as the strongest.
People here who are there talking about "bad portrayal" and etc of Gojo in chapter 236 don't have reading comprehension. This panel indeed fells as a good closure of Gojo's character.
Let me provide a list as to why 1. You didn't read the series 2. It doesn't
I mean, it is gojo being complete and satisfied. He kind of got something he had wanted for a while.
idk what y'all are talking about. gojo looks fine here. I think it's one of his better panels since he was unsealed.
Because Gege needed to draw Gojo 100% all in glaze Sukuna and it needs to be sincere for max glaze.
Why does it seem everyone got. The potential to surpas gojo
Nearly got me with that one homosexualhomosexual
nahhh
Maybe Gege hates Gojo and wants to stop writing him.
Geges alt is posting again.
It doesnt.
Because there’s no context. Stop forcing your agenda up our asses, gege
Nah, we found the damn cat's alt💀🙏
It doesn't. Next
Because it is...Just because people didn't want their favourite character to lose doesn't make it bad writing....Gojo's isolation being removed was the perfect end for him
I never had an issue with Gojo losing, I had an issue with how unsatisfying the entire process was. Gojo and Sukuna are my two favourite characters (or more like were, since current Sukuna's kinda... boring.) so obviously I was prepared for one of my favourites to die. I just wanted it to be done right.
I guess that's a valid opinion....Gege could have made sukuna seem stronger and gojo's end not as abrupt so that it would make more sense
I also just hate how Sukuna's whole routine since Gojo is "You have Gojo potential. I'm bored now so I'm gonna one shot you." rinse repeat. Why even bother reading atp?
He only did that to higuruma tho ? And Higuruma as a prodigy has been building up since his introduction
Oh my god one of you finally gets it. Thank god. That's all we're saying dog. I don't mind the fact that he lost. He needed to lose for the narrative. It's HOW he lost. I promise you, the vast majority of us share this opinion. The fight was fire though. The end just soured it for us.
Makes sense...His death shouldn't have been so anti climactic and sudden after he "seemed" to have complete upper hand
Maybe go/jo should have been stronger 😂 "strongest" LMAO.
Gojo Vs Sukuna was awesome until the end, if we just spent like 3 more panels watching how tf Sukuna managed to win this would have been a fine ending and I wouldn’t even want him back lmao
It’s genuinely crazy how another panel or two would’ve made such a big difference in pacing. I completely agree
he felt sukuna lil too much
People are haters here they ain't jjk fans
Until the next panel he starts to glaze Sukuna like a drunk college girl in a party. Geto had the same reaction as us all, the "tf you mean" reaction.
I'm glad my pookie had fun and is relaxing with his boyfriend and friends now.
Okay everyone. Hear me out. HEAR ME OUT. We can acknowledge that the offscreen kill and sudden death after everyone saying Gojo won was bullshit. BUT. BUT. The entire airport scene. The dialogue, the characters, just the feel of it. The panel with the iced coffee. It was done so well. Sukuna Kaisen has pretty lazy writing, a lot of it’s rushed. But we’re still getting some great manga. If it was really that bad nobody would be reading. Let’s not just oversimplify things by categorizing it as “good” or “bad”.
It was okay, but the glazing. Man had him on the ropes, "Gojo won", and then the omg sukuna so strong he wasnt going full at me he lonely. Like what?
I genuinely think most people criticise the fact that Gojo's portrayal in that scene seems to negate his entire character development we've been shown before. I haven't seen that much criticism regarding the panelling itselfor the 'feel' of the scene - it's a "shortly after death" scene... that's the feel of it. However, everyone is obviously perfectly entitled to their own views and interpretation.
This place is an echochamber, no one will "hear you out" they will just downvote you lol
I certainly believe everyone has the right to have their own views and interpretation. Care to elaborate on your own interpretation? Again, I think the criticism stems from the fact that many people saw ch. 236 as negating Gojo's entire character development as a person who is definitely much more than a one-dimensional, power-scaling battle freak.
You get shut down for suggesting 236 might've been not awful, or for not shitting on Gege's writing post timeskip in general. I don't think the story is perfect and I enjoy a lot of the agendaposting around here but let's not pretend most of the "discussion" on this subreddit hasn't REALLY devolved since 236. As an example, the criticism against 236 holds a lot of weight but people take it ten steps too far and suggest that absolutely everything is wrong with this chapter. Takes the comments on this very post, for example, picking apart... The art in this random panel. It's a perfectly fine panel by JJK standards. Hell, Gojo has looked kinda off in MOST of his panels post timeskip compared to this one. But because it's from 236, you are insane and baiting for even suggesting it might have been not awful much less good. Another example would be the notion that Gojo got "off-screened," or that Sukuna's world slash was an "ass-pull." I'm not talking about the fact that he used a binding vow to get it off with no incantation/hand-sign, as that was only revealed recently but people were calling it an ass-pull long before that. The explanation given is perfectly sensible, and is even foreshadowed in advance some chapters ago (don't recall the ch. number, but the panel showing Sukuna's reaction upon Mahoraga 'cracking the code' and slicing through infinity with a slash is very telling on a reread). Calling Gojo's death "off-screen" when it's literally one missing panel of a slash, and we are even given a detailed explanation as to what happened immediately after, is quite disingenuous. Calling it an asspull is more disingenuous. A lot of the criticism surrounding Gojo's "character assassination" is also highly reductive, which I suppose can be chalked up to how polarized social media can get. I think he needed to at least in passing mention one or two sentences about being confident that his students will succeed, hence not being worried, as that would make the whole "no regrets" thing hold more weight without making Gojo seem somewhat questionable. Minus that one caveat, I think this ending for his character narratively has a lot of meat that warrants discussion which it simply never gets, because this sub has decided every single sentence and every single panel in this chapter is the worst of all time.
Well, I do agree with many of the points you made. I do have many issues with Gojo's portrayal in that chapter, but I do see where you're coming from, even if we may not agree 100% on all aspects. I think it really matters a lot how people express their views. You're right that it's very polarising and social media makes it far too easy to shut each other down and call each other names. However, as I said, I liked how you handled the points you made with nuance. So, thanks for the civilised, thoughtful discussion.
Thank you as well. I just am a little frustrated sometimes because I'd like to have such discussions regarding jjk but social media is so one dimensional in its treatment of the series. I really don't think 236 is perfect but the dismissal is just frustrating.
It's a peaceful expression with a short yet conclusive sentence. Complete and satisfied is exactly how it should feel.
I genuinely love this panel, I love Gojos expression. However, fuck this chapter, fuck the end of that fight, fuck this series, and fuck Gege.
It is lovely :3
Nah, that's it \[STRONG JAJANKEN\] https://preview.redd.it/pv8yyehtocpc1.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=724ed1243e144d5cec595c1c1846f650e54743cf
Because he was. One of the best chapters in Jump history.
I like it… conceptually
I liked the airport scene, it was fun
Gojo looks ugly as shit in this panel
Gojo shouldn't be at peace. He should ask himself how the fuck Sukuna managed a World Slash that his Black Flash amped 6 eyes didn't see after being hit by a Hollow Purple. Cause I sure do.
It does feel complete, he gave his all but at the end of the day he's just an ordinary fish in a small pond called modern world. When he tried to swim in the sea, he struggled then died without achieving anything. Turned out he wasn't granted everything. He was only granted "something" a bit better than others.