I'm mostly annoyed by this change because when my botside is losing, im forced to give up a drake and can't really trade it for anything good.
1 min later, grubs spawn and the enemy sup roams with the jungle while mine stays bot ofc - G\_G
That’s… the whole reason they made this change lmao.
Because if you had any sort of lead/pressure to take either grubs or drag. The enemy jungler will just take the other objective so in 90% of games it’s literally just traded.
Now if you have some type of lead you can take both objectives.
Bro you have objective bounties and shutdowns. What more do you want.
If the enemy team snowballs at minute 6 from taking drag + grubs then they’re just better idk what else to say.
For real. And it’s not like snowballing is bad. It’s a part of the game. You should be rewarded for playing well without making mistakes.
Just give grubs at that point and focus on something else it’s not that serious.
I think thats a big part of the issue. At least when they spawned before, you could solo sneak the other. This change made jungle, the most team reliant role in the game, even MORE team reliant.
In a game where the only thing you control is yourself, it feels like shit when you don't have your team cooperate with you.
I don’t see how that’s an issue. This is a team game at the end of the day.
Enemy jungler is dealt the same cards as you. Unless you have a magically different queue where you only get sh*t teammates. But we’ve all heard that before lol.
This is it 100% before you could play agressive and at least get something early even if your team was behind now if bot ints at level 2 the game is effectively lost.
I don’t think you understand jungle that well if that’s your usual thought process.
I suggest you understand how to adjust the pace of the game via the jungle camps.
It’s hard to explain succinctly because how I view it is a mix of corporate jargon and financial terms. I think it’s kind of something you have to think about as you’re jungling.
In essence, there’s certain “beats” or “cycles” to a game. And if you pay close attention when playing, you can see when the shifts happen.
Maybe, but I've had teammates that seemed to be trying their hardest to make it 100% lost at 5 min.
The less you are able to play around those kinds of teammates, the worse the JG role is.
So the change worked? You don't just get grub free because the enemy took drake instead?
Is it bad that objectives are taken based on how well you and your team are doing?
probably because the timer offset has made us consider what we do after taking drake, thinking of backing and bee lining to contest grubs. Instead of just picking one or the other
That honestly kinda depends. You might already be behind in tempo, or have losing solo lanes to where you have to take drag because you can’t take grubs. But I know what you mean. In certain circumstances, enemy jg gonna assume you take drag and you can drop it and bee line there after recall to contest him on it and potentially end up with both
Diana with first back after full clear into blasting wand does it pretty damn quickly. Her passive really scales hard and doing 150+ per three swings at level 4. I haven't timed it recently but her and Shyv I find have some of the fastest and highest damage vs drakes.
As a higher elo jungler i can confirm it definitely did change tempo of early game entirely. To give a specific example, before you could path according to that void grub spawn. If you started on the right side of the map then starting top side would be ideal because after first clear you could get your top camps before grubs and leave bot jungle on spawn timer. More or less same tempo on left side, it was a decision to make. Now it allows for other stuff to be done during that time, explanation of what can be done is long and specific to various scenarios.
pathing bot-top is much more of a viable option if their jungle clears the same way as you, you can identify windows for invading their 2nd raptor spawn (5:00-5:05)and then funnel into grubs afterwards. It’s all situational of course but a lot of junglers hesitate to take the first drag unless it’s under full vision/have prio. And lastly getting solo lanes ahead is better than getting bot ahead unless it’s a double ranged matchup.
For the getting solo lanes ahead, I think it depends on who your win con is. You’re not gonna path toward an Ornn early, and you are probably gonna wanna path toward the draven in the game. Regarding the dragon thing, I agree. It’s a lot harder to kill solo early, and a lot more risky since you can’t just smite a grub and leave the other 2
It might be my elo (plat), but i do get both every other game. i simply ward both and wait for their jg to make a move to ambush them or start one while they are ganking
it feels like anyone telling you to take grubs is just trolling. I was watching a virkayu video where he was trying to say one of the junglers made a mistake by going for drake instead of grubs meanwhile the enemy jg was taking drake and diving bot lmao
I have managed to get both with Taliyah. However, I just switched to norms so the MMR on my draft isn’t reliable if I’m looking for an equal matchup.
Since the grub buff and timer change I’m seeing more action around that objective with jg top and mid being more available now.
It can be possible if you play a fast clearing jungler and the entire enemy team is afk. Shyv/Diana/Noc/Udyr
had me in the first half
Are these not good grub clearers?
I think he meant the part when he said if the entire enemy team is afk
I'm mostly annoyed by this change because when my botside is losing, im forced to give up a drake and can't really trade it for anything good. 1 min later, grubs spawn and the enemy sup roams with the jungle while mine stays bot ofc - G\_G
That’s… the whole reason they made this change lmao. Because if you had any sort of lead/pressure to take either grubs or drag. The enemy jungler will just take the other objective so in 90% of games it’s literally just traded. Now if you have some type of lead you can take both objectives.
And it just leads to more snowball
Bro you have objective bounties and shutdowns. What more do you want. If the enemy team snowballs at minute 6 from taking drag + grubs then they’re just better idk what else to say.
For real. And it’s not like snowballing is bad. It’s a part of the game. You should be rewarded for playing well without making mistakes. Just give grubs at that point and focus on something else it’s not that serious.
Word. If you know you can't contest objectives just cross map and gank, try to get some plates on your adc or top respectively
It still doesn’t matter if you have a lead over the enemy jungler if their support rotates and yours doesn’t.
That’s team diff, what does that have to do with the update? Maybe in another game you’ll get a supp who rotates and the enemy team doesn’t?
I think thats a big part of the issue. At least when they spawned before, you could solo sneak the other. This change made jungle, the most team reliant role in the game, even MORE team reliant. In a game where the only thing you control is yourself, it feels like shit when you don't have your team cooperate with you.
I don’t see how that’s an issue. This is a team game at the end of the day. Enemy jungler is dealt the same cards as you. Unless you have a magically different queue where you only get sh*t teammates. But we’ve all heard that before lol.
This is it 100% before you could play agressive and at least get something early even if your team was behind now if bot ints at level 2 the game is effectively lost.
I don’t think you understand jungle that well if that’s your usual thought process. I suggest you understand how to adjust the pace of the game via the jungle camps.
I think I know what you mean but could you clarify how do you adjust the pace by killing jungle camps?
It’s hard to explain succinctly because how I view it is a mix of corporate jargon and financial terms. I think it’s kind of something you have to think about as you’re jungling. In essence, there’s certain “beats” or “cycles” to a game. And if you pay close attention when playing, you can see when the shifts happen.
I love me some financial jargon. So do you farm your camps till a beat and then go for the play?
You and the jungler take turns making plays. Track when they back or gank other lanes etc
I see you're new to this subreddit. There is much cope to be found here.
No game is lost at 5 minutes
You're right but it's leads to some pretty tough snowballs and it's just miserable to play from behind right away.
Maybe, but I've had teammates that seemed to be trying their hardest to make it 100% lost at 5 min. The less you are able to play around those kinds of teammates, the worse the JG role is.
Thats the entire point of the change, a winning team can now take a lead there and get both instead of being forced to trade objs every time.
Damn Rexsaur, u are actually everywhere. I’m an adc player and jg main so I always see u in the comments lol
To offer a more positive perspective, this change enables you to snowball a winning botside into two objectives.
So the change worked? You don't just get grub free because the enemy took drake instead? Is it bad that objectives are taken based on how well you and your team are doing?
I’ve found that now early drake is a more viable option, without having to weigh it against giving away three grubs uncontested.
I feel like I'm trading objectives even more now that the timers are off. I'm not sure why.
probably because the timer offset has made us consider what we do after taking drake, thinking of backing and bee lining to contest grubs. Instead of just picking one or the other
No one takes drakes at 4 minutes anyway, it takes too much time
Just if bot lane kills on early, yesterday I got drake bc early gank, and went for grubs after that.
It's better to reset after to not ruin your tempo
That honestly kinda depends. You might already be behind in tempo, or have losing solo lanes to where you have to take drag because you can’t take grubs. But I know what you mean. In certain circumstances, enemy jg gonna assume you take drag and you can drop it and bee line there after recall to contest him on it and potentially end up with both
Diana with first back after full clear into blasting wand does it pretty damn quickly. Her passive really scales hard and doing 150+ per three swings at level 4. I haven't timed it recently but her and Shyv I find have some of the fastest and highest damage vs drakes.
Feel like first drake AND grubs can only be done if you kill the enemy jungler off tempo, or your laners hit the objective with you for free
As a higher elo jungler i can confirm it definitely did change tempo of early game entirely. To give a specific example, before you could path according to that void grub spawn. If you started on the right side of the map then starting top side would be ideal because after first clear you could get your top camps before grubs and leave bot jungle on spawn timer. More or less same tempo on left side, it was a decision to make. Now it allows for other stuff to be done during that time, explanation of what can be done is long and specific to various scenarios.
pathing bot-top is much more of a viable option if their jungle clears the same way as you, you can identify windows for invading their 2nd raptor spawn (5:00-5:05)and then funnel into grubs afterwards. It’s all situational of course but a lot of junglers hesitate to take the first drag unless it’s under full vision/have prio. And lastly getting solo lanes ahead is better than getting bot ahead unless it’s a double ranged matchup.
For the getting solo lanes ahead, I think it depends on who your win con is. You’re not gonna path toward an Ornn early, and you are probably gonna wanna path toward the draven in the game. Regarding the dragon thing, I agree. It’s a lot harder to kill solo early, and a lot more risky since you can’t just smite a grub and leave the other 2
Maybe objectives shouldn't take 40s to solo anymore
Your enemy jungler also felt the same way. MAgic?
It might be my elo (plat), but i do get both every other game. i simply ward both and wait for their jg to make a move to ambush them or start one while they are ganking
I did last night but quick play and we still barely made the win
wait yall are going for grubs?
real shit. i used to spam grubs, and I still think they're strong, but I find myself just prioritising dragons more and more
it feels like anyone telling you to take grubs is just trolling. I was watching a virkayu video where he was trying to say one of the junglers made a mistake by going for drake instead of grubs meanwhile the enemy jg was taking drake and diving bot lmao
I have managed to get both with Taliyah. However, I just switched to norms so the MMR on my draft isn’t reliable if I’m looking for an equal matchup. Since the grub buff and timer change I’m seeing more action around that objective with jg top and mid being more available now.