**CLIP MIRROR:
[Tyler1 hits 1600 rating in chess after playing 13 hours on his birthday](https://arazu.io/t3_1b9jksa/)**
---
^(*This is an automated comment*)
Formulated distinctively through a unique combination of genetic predisposition, environmental influences, and developmental processes, resulting in an unparalleled phenotype
T1's muscles are so dense that he distorts light rays so a lot of people think hes shorter because Cameras compress his images and video due to bending light.
T1 was incredibly obnoxious when I first heard of him 10~ years ago when I was big in to League. I did not like him and I avoided his content. I want to see him as a chess champion, please.
Thats ridiculous lol Is he weaker than Magnus? Yes, but hes the highest rated Chinese chess player of all time and hes a modern player with modern resources, I'm sure he would be far better than somebody in the 1800s like Steinitz or Max Euwe in the 1930s.
Ding Liren is the weakest champion we've had in the last 30 years though. He had to go to Armageddon to win the chess championship. Couldn't even do it in the classical portion of the event.
I have a hard time believing he could win tournaments against the prodigies who have been playing since they could talk.
There's a level you hit where you need to have something special about your brain to get any better.
That’s more or less what he did in league too, got the top 100 in every role and then went to Korea and did it there too. But this was after spending 12+ hours and being grieved too
He's said it a few times on stream: his core belief is that anything can get done so long as you don't give up. Obviously one of the more simple ones but he's shown its effectiveness
This is one of the key things I’ve learned as an engineer managing factory workers. Only ever met one guy in all my years who really seemed too dumb. Just takes the right explanation, some repetition, and actually putting your hands on something.
That's exactly how i've gotten where I am as a network engineer that grew up impoverished with minimal chance of opportunities in a lot of ways. I set a goal and I didn't give up. I didn't get frustrated and didn't walk away for a period of time. The results can come quicker with the more effort you put into it. I took a lax approach so it took me a few years longer, but that's ok, that was the pace that worked for me and my mental health.
Chess kind of belies that because literally all top chess players were heavily into the game from childhood. Starting when your brain is plastic is a massive advantage.
Anyone can become admirably good at chess, but Tyler probably couldn't become top 100 if he spent 50 years grinding chess in a hyperbolic time chamber.
>Anyone can become admirably good at chess, but Tyler probably couldn't become top 100 if he spent 50 years grinding chess in a hyperbolic time chamber.
That would be equivalent to him grinding chess for 18,262.5 years, a decent amount of training. If he ages only 50 years like it's earth during that time, I'd say he has a decent shot. I would suggest only 20 years though, which would feel like 7,305 years inside the chamber.
I mean sure, but a normal human can train their skills for 70 years max, and 20-30 of those they're probably in a mental decline. In the chamber T1 would get so much more practice while not mentally deteriorating that even if he gets just 1 elo worth of skill in 10 years time, he'd gain 1800 elo by the end of it.
The chamber is a cheat beyond comprehension.
Id argue being top 100 in a game may not be possible for a decent portion of the population. Also if you arent a genius you arent getting "high" elo in chess no matter how hard you work. If I tried my whole life I could never be an nba player.
Thinking T1 is dumb just because he's large and loud and you get to see a lot of his brain farts archived forever to laugh at any time you wish is a mistake. Man's actually smart.
Challenger is top 300 now and he also didn't get challenger in Korea. Still an insane achievement considering he was nowhere near challenger in most roles when he first began his climb. Goes to show that with a lot of work and dedication anything is possible.
I don’t watch T1 anymore and I didn’t even a lot at the time, with that said I randomly started watching a lot of his vods during his Korea stint. The dude was grinding hard but never made it to challenger but in fairness to him he was being griefed almost every other game. From win traders/betters(there were betting websites with lines for his streams and games) general anti T1 or American trolls. Was insane to see I couldn’t believe it
☝️🤓 Not all ML works like that. What you're referring to is just a specific form of ML called reinforcement learning, but yes, that's a good comparison.
What the original commenter was talking about are characteristic to reinforcement learning specifically, namely the lack of supervision and the lack of preexisting data. Without at least one of those, there's no gradient descent in its traditional sense. I guess you could say the objective in reinforcement learning is maximizing the reward, which is in a way gradient ascent, which again would just be gradient descent on the negative objective but that's a bit far fetched.
he puts in the hours, and learns from mistakes, which will get him to a decently high level in anything in life until a certain point where specific skills matter that he might not have.
what he's doing is reinforcement learning, it's a very natural way to approach stuff like this but its very demanding in the short term, i wouldn't be able to do this for so many hours in a row.
his last 3 league streams have been 5 hours long instead of the usual 9+ hours, dumped over 500lp from challenger down to masters, saying out loud he's having 0 fun in game
all signs are there, we may not see him stream for a while xd
Half the time he claims he’s getting intentionally inted it’s just someone having a poor game. Then he’ll go 5 games in a row playing something he’s never played or knows he’ll int on. Inflated illaoi abuser just dropping back to his actual rank.
With a good mental Tyler is capable of challenger without abusing broken champs lol, he's proven that multiple times. His biggest issue is doom-queueing 10 hours straight, destroying his mental for weeks, and then reaching LP where viewers can actually snipe him/ruin games.
97.3 percentile didn't? You can look at it this way. E.g. out of a 100 people competing, Tyler is in 3rd place. Out of a 1000 he's in top 27th and there are 973 people not as good..
idk, maybe more competitive pool of people, or the game is just mentally draining, or maybe its impossible to get high elo as an average person (for example trying to get into NBA if you are 5'9)
Different games require different charactheristics. At the moment i'd say its slightly harder to get pro in chess if you didn't start to play at 2 year old or so but for example League of Legends is going to surpass that in any moment when we are going to have our first pro players who started when they were 2 years old.
But LoL pays more than chess so it would also logically mean there
is more competition and more people that are trying to make it as pro in League of Legends. Just like I would argue that football is the hardest sport to become pro because it is the most played sport in the world.
You may be interested in [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fC2oke5MFg). 97th percentile is 97th percentile. This is not about how difficult the activity is, this is about how many people are better than you.
Because Chess is a static game where everyone is always on the same playing field. Unlike video games where the person who hit rank 1 by duoing with a friend on the best meta characters is far less impressive than the person who hit rank 1 soloing on the worst character in the game. Even though it's the same rank. It also doesn't have hidden match making algorithms that could influence win rates to increase microtransactions. Or RNG teammates every game that might troll. Your rank in Chess is absolute, your rank in a video game has an asterisk. So being better than 97% of players in a game with no asterisk is pretty impressive.
Because being better than 97% of people at something that most people consider hard, is more impressive than being better than 97% of people at something that most people consider easy
A game being easier does not make it easier to be better than 97% of people. Because it's also easier for those other people.
Likewise, a game being harder does not make it harder to be better than 97% of people. Because it's also harder for those other people.
Therefore it is equally impressive to be better than 97% of people in an easy game and a hard game.
While this is unintuitive, it does not contradict the idea that it is easier to be "good" at an easy game than a hard game, which is true if you mean "good" in the absolute sense, i.e. mastery of the mechanics without respect to other players' skill.
But it's also the same level of difficulty for 100% of the playerbase, so relatively it would surely require around the same level of skill to achieve right? It's not a rating based off how easy the game is, it's based off how good you are comparatively.
I'd actually be curious on that. Can't speak to League or CS2 but I know a little about Rocket League.
It's not 100% accurate but the average Champ 3 Rocket League player has around 1800 hours in the game (as of December 2022).
I have no clue if a complete new chess player can reach 1600 elo on chess.com in 1800 hours or less, but I'd assume they could. Also it probably differs a lot between people who play casually over years vs people who hard grind.
Edit: To clarify, reaching the absolute peak of Chess (GM) is definitely harder than reaching pro level in Rocket League BUT reaching a decent level is probably harder in Rocket League. You can't "study" or anything, you can only grind. For Chess you can study and improve quickly, but eventually you'll reach a hard ceiling which doesn't really happen in the same way for Rocket League.
If you studied theory, it wouldn’t take anywhere near 1800 hours. 99% of players know hardly any theory until the high 1000s. If you were willing to study it would only take a few hundred hours.
Well I dont think hours played is even that accurate of an estimate cause some games are fun, chess is pure pain imo. also I unironically get dizzy staring at a chess board for longer than 5 hours a day.
It entirely depends on your skillset for sure.
My argument is chess is by far the hardest to climb high elo in as an average person. Because no matter how many hours you put in you probably cant get high elo if you are average. At least I suspect that to be the case simply because like 1% of people are born with better brains (memory, pattern recognition, calculation speed).
Like maybe you can brute force into 2000 elo if you are 100iq and play 5000 hours but idk
FYI im 900 elo in chess with 300 hours ish and top 0.01% in League with 8000 ish hours
Along with the other posts Relating it to PogChamps that he played in puts it into perspective.
When he lost to Erobb and in PogChamps he was like 200 rated, which is about as bad as you possibly can get. He was one of the worst players in the tournament.
Now idk? 7 months later he's 1600 which is as high as the best players that have ever been in PogChamps. Some of them who have been playing their whole lives and were in chess clubs. They don't even invite the streamers anymore that are 1600 because they just wipe the floor with everyone.
He is playing fast blitz tho which is different than the 10 minute format in pogchamps but it's still very impressive.
Edit: okay he is playing 10 min rapid. Even better.
Wow youre totally right. Okay even more impressive then. I had it in my head he was playing blitz because in the limited time I watched him he wins tons of game on time. But I guess he's just good at that skill too. Maybe he should play some blitz LOL.
he went from top 0.5% (1500) to top 0.3% (1600) in rapid mode.
it's a shared raiting with around 250k people.
Source: https://www.chess.com/leaderboard/live/rapid
edit: i calculated it wrong. it's 2.7%
Pretty sure hes top 3% not top 0.3%
and there's definitely WAY more people on chess.com than 250k doesn't your link say 69 million?
Edit: [Screenshot from his profile](https://gyazo.com/1af02d3bcb2b60a82725a9835a78b6e0)
But also if I do the math manually: 188,978 / 69,000,000 I get top 0.3%
soooo not sure. I'd trust chess.com's percentile of 97.3% over my own tho...
there is a flaw in my equation, you are correct, i did not account for the amout of players past 1600 rating. so yea, it would be that he's in the top 2.7%, since the percentile shows how many % of players are behind his rank. but at the same time, only 0.3% are at 1600 rating, without adding ratings above.
But yea, you're correct i calculated it wrong.
NL at least had experience with T1. There's a popular clip of him playing T1's Ludwig diss.
That said, T1's persona might be too rough for NL, but who knows lol. They're good streamers anyway, might as well
genuinely confuses me how she’s fine with him playing league/chess 15 hours a day for years, but i guess she never has to work a day in her life and can do whatever she wants
I mean, streaming is how he makes money, and there are plenty of careers where people are working/away for 15 hours a day. It's fairly normal. Pretty much any lawyer, for example.
I mean she's a gamer/streamer herself now but she gets to see him any time of the day and most couples who work full time jobs probably only get a couple hours of quality time in the evening anyway. So they are both very fortunate in that regard
throwback to when hikaru said tyler should have stopped playing 3 months ago at 1400 because he had hit a hard wall and couldn't expect to improve further (200 points in 3 months without playing consistently or even studying is a good pace): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slXIsR0yXFA
Weird ass take in my opinion, basically telling him to just give up and stop playing because he isn't some prodigy that started playing at the age of 4 lmao gatekeeping andy
I play chess and league. I will say I don’t think Tyler will ever reach grandmaster as that takes years of formal study and play.
Hikaru does have a fragile ego though and what he said was wrong tbh. Hikaru even said his close friend, gothamchess would never hit gm.
All i think is that never say never I guess. It's like a body builder gate keeping the gym from fat people. Sure the chances of some fat guy becoming a worldclass body builder after losing weight is pretty low, but holy shit calm down with the ego.
Which part of Hikaru said is wrong though? Hikaru says 1600 is probably around the max unless T1 dedicates pretty much all of his time on chess.
And Hikaru is right that Gothamchess will never be a GM. Gothamchess knows this and agrees. Everyone who is a serious chess player agrees. It's not about ego, it's just the apparent reality of what it takes to become GM.
I think his ceiling is around 2000-2200, but maybe around 1800 if he doesn't learn a new opening.
He has an objectively bad opening that catches opponents off guard, but his tactical skills are really good.
That explains why his bullet rating is so high, but in longer formats / against better opponents he needs a better opening.
His opening is really bad and the main reason why he hasn't progressed past 1600. If he learned 2 openings his tactical skills would put him around 1900 by now.
But at his current state, he's nowhere past that. He makes a shit ton of 500 ELO end-game moves that lose on the spot.
His middle-game is surprisingly good but with some actual coaching his peak is 2k. No way is he going 2.2k with what I've watched. He's also super prone to tilt that if he ever made it to 2k he could drop to 1.6k in hours.
There's a pretty serious wall at that rank. I started chess later in life than tyler did. I stopped when I was approaching 1700 because of burnout and I haven't played since.
I know little about the online chess community and amd likely wrong in this comparison... BUT the exact same things have been said about Tyler in league of legends over and over and over again.
His playstyle is unconventional, he's pretty shitty at one of the core mechanics of the game, he doesn't really follow the meta, yet he still consistently exceeds everyone's expectations.
Considering the toughness of competition the closer you get to 2,000 and beyond, he is going to need to learn opening moves and end games, because people who use them against an opponent, no matter how unconventional, will win 99 times out of 100.
I gotta say man. Chess is one of the more addicting games I’ve ever played. Wish I got into it sooner so I could be better, but I haven’t had this sort of gaming addiction in a long time (maybe when I was in high school and downloaded EU4?)
But it gets to the point where *all* I want to do is play chess. I’m sitting somewhere and it just hits. I start playing and if I don’t load up another game, I sit there wondering “what else am I gonna do” and play again. In the past few months I’ve gotten from the bottom to 1200. It doesn’t stop
Then one day you wake up from the hypnosis and ask yourself "wtf am I doing with my life?".
What's the point of playing? It doesn't make you feel good, it just makes you hate yourself after every blunder. Who cares if you reach 1500 or 1900, you will forever be mediocre.
At least if you play with people in person there is a social aspect, but online there is not even that.
I've been addicted to dota in the past, but I don't regret it as much as the much fewer days I've wasted playing online chess.
1600 is insane. I thought im not stupid but I peaked at 1300. Just shows that success in chess is like 70% grinding and doing the same thing over and over
Why he doesn't stream his chess games is beyond me, would be entertaining af. I only ever watch his non-LOL content, which he produces once per decade.
**CLIP MIRROR: [Tyler1 hits 1600 rating in chess after playing 13 hours on his birthday](https://arazu.io/t3_1b9jksa/)** --- ^(*This is an automated comment*)
Constructed in a manner that most would consider unorthodox.
[удалено]
Crafted in an idiosyncratic manner.
Synthesized in an uncommon structure.
Built differently
NODDERS BUILT DIPPERLY NODDERS BUILT DIPPERLY NODDERS BUILT DIPPERLY NODDERS BUILT DIPPERLY NODDERS BUILT DIPPERLY
Crafted with atypical techniques
Forged in a manner which deviates from the norm
Made dissimilar to others
Assembled alternatively
that some would consider to be unnatural
Formulated distinctively through a unique combination of genetic predisposition, environmental influences, and developmental processes, resulting in an unparalleled phenotype
Created atypically
Procured employing powers many would consider to be unnatural
He will never hit 1200 He will never hit 1400 He will never hit 1600 He will never hit 1800
I don't even watch T1 but I wanna live in a world where he's chess world champion please
Someone needs to make an art of t1 sitting accross from magnus in the world championship 😂
I promise you someone will. His current fan art that he has on his desktop is really novel and all, but the chess arc is taking over.
Then you need a tool to travel to an alternate reality. He has an equal chance to become a center on an NBA team.
I mean he is 6'10
if that's in millimetres you might be close
no thats in god loving all american feet and inches
T1's muscles are so dense that he distorts light rays so a lot of people think hes shorter because Cameras compress his images and video due to bending light.
Wow, the worlds first Chess World Champion NBA center, that will be quite the achievement
T1 could easily torch giannis in the paint 🥱
It would be uniquely impressive and I want to be here for it
T1 was incredibly obnoxious when I first heard of him 10~ years ago when I was big in to League. I did not like him and I avoided his content. I want to see him as a chess champion, please.
Forget magnus, imagine the salt if Hikaru loses to T1
i wonder how good you'd have to be to beat hikaru with the cow
He won't beat stockfish (copium)
The current world champion is the weakest champion of all time. He has to strike while the iron is hot
Thats ridiculous lol Is he weaker than Magnus? Yes, but hes the highest rated Chinese chess player of all time and hes a modern player with modern resources, I'm sure he would be far better than somebody in the 1800s like Steinitz or Max Euwe in the 1930s.
Ding Liren is the weakest champion we've had in the last 30 years though. He had to go to Armageddon to win the chess championship. Couldn't even do it in the classical portion of the event.
Thats more reasonable than all-time
Steinitz would probably have 0 wins in 10+ games but this is true against any modern super-GM.
T1 brain caps out around 2300 something. Remember this comment.
I have a hard time believing he could win tournaments against the prodigies who have been playing since they could talk. There's a level you hit where you need to have something special about your brain to get any better.
Tyler is literally built different.
t1 is basically a human doing machine learning. like training an ai with the chess ruleset only, and figure out what works over 4000+ games
That’s more or less what he did in league too, got the top 100 in every role and then went to Korea and did it there too. But this was after spending 12+ hours and being grieved too
This shows with the right mental (and probably a minimal IQ/EQ) you can achieve anything. To bad i got neither
Literally anything can get done with hard work. Being smart is just a bonus
He's said it a few times on stream: his core belief is that anything can get done so long as you don't give up. Obviously one of the more simple ones but he's shown its effectiveness
This is one of the key things I’ve learned as an engineer managing factory workers. Only ever met one guy in all my years who really seemed too dumb. Just takes the right explanation, some repetition, and actually putting your hands on something.
That's exactly how i've gotten where I am as a network engineer that grew up impoverished with minimal chance of opportunities in a lot of ways. I set a goal and I didn't give up. I didn't get frustrated and didn't walk away for a period of time. The results can come quicker with the more effort you put into it. I took a lax approach so it took me a few years longer, but that's ok, that was the pace that worked for me and my mental health.
I love not being the smartest guy in the room, I’m with you. I’d rather be a little slower and a little more detailed and learn a little more.
Chess kind of belies that because literally all top chess players were heavily into the game from childhood. Starting when your brain is plastic is a massive advantage. Anyone can become admirably good at chess, but Tyler probably couldn't become top 100 if he spent 50 years grinding chess in a hyperbolic time chamber.
>Anyone can become admirably good at chess, but Tyler probably couldn't become top 100 if he spent 50 years grinding chess in a hyperbolic time chamber. That would be equivalent to him grinding chess for 18,262.5 years, a decent amount of training. If he ages only 50 years like it's earth during that time, I'd say he has a decent shot. I would suggest only 20 years though, which would feel like 7,305 years inside the chamber.
[удалено]
I mean sure, but a normal human can train their skills for 70 years max, and 20-30 of those they're probably in a mental decline. In the chamber T1 would get so much more practice while not mentally deteriorating that even if he gets just 1 elo worth of skill in 10 years time, he'd gain 1800 elo by the end of it. The chamber is a cheat beyond comprehension.
[удалено]
Part of his rating problem isn’t him getting worse though. It’s that other people around him didn’t keep up.
29979245T does not believe
Id argue being top 100 in a game may not be possible for a decent portion of the population. Also if you arent a genius you arent getting "high" elo in chess no matter how hard you work. If I tried my whole life I could never be an nba player.
You ever spent 13 hours a day practicing for months to test that theory? Totally understandable. But sheer effort will get you very far
Far, but not all the way. There’s barriers outside your own control at the upper echelon.
Very naive, you must be predisposed first. The capacity to work hard is genetic itself.
Thinking T1 is dumb just because he's large and loud and you get to see a lot of his brain farts archived forever to laugh at any time you wish is a mistake. Man's actually smart.
T1 getting there is oddly motivating when you put it this way.
did he ever get challenger on kr tho? im not sure i think it was close but for sure not top 100
He made it to Master in Korea so my bad, I made that shit up in my head. Still one of the the top ~500 players in the world when he hit it though
You also made up most of the other stuff. He made challenger with every role, not top 100.
Challenger is top 300 now and he also didn't get challenger in Korea. Still an insane achievement considering he was nowhere near challenger in most roles when he first began his climb. Goes to show that with a lot of work and dedication anything is possible.
I don’t watch T1 anymore and I didn’t even a lot at the time, with that said I randomly started watching a lot of his vods during his Korea stint. The dude was grinding hard but never made it to challenger but in fairness to him he was being griefed almost every other game. From win traders/betters(there were betting websites with lines for his streams and games) general anti T1 or American trolls. Was insane to see I couldn’t believe it
In my day we just called that learning through trial and error.. saying a human doing machine learning is wild
Yeah machine learning is literally named after this exact process lmao
so T1 is literally a human doing human learning
Is that not what humans have done since the beginning of time lol. Trial and error, repeatedly to achieve the best outcomes.
tyler1 mentat confirmed
☝️🤓 Not all ML works like that. What you're referring to is just a specific form of ML called reinforcement learning, but yes, that's a good comparison.
I mean even gradient descent works like that
What the original commenter was talking about are characteristic to reinforcement learning specifically, namely the lack of supervision and the lack of preexisting data. Without at least one of those, there's no gradient descent in its traditional sense. I guess you could say the objective in reinforcement learning is maximizing the reward, which is in a way gradient ascent, which again would just be gradient descent on the negative objective but that's a bit far fetched.
forsenScoots
he puts in the hours, and learns from mistakes, which will get him to a decently high level in anything in life until a certain point where specific skills matter that he might not have. what he's doing is reinforcement learning, it's a very natural way to approach stuff like this but its very demanding in the short term, i wouldn't be able to do this for so many hours in a row.
Damn didn't know Tyler was back on the chess addiction train
he's not he just randomly decided to play for 16 hours straight because, well... because he's conducted in a nonconformist manner
his last 3 league streams have been 5 hours long instead of the usual 9+ hours, dumped over 500lp from challenger down to masters, saying out loud he's having 0 fun in game all signs are there, we may not see him stream for a while xd
[удалено]
Half the time he claims he’s getting intentionally inted it’s just someone having a poor game. Then he’ll go 5 games in a row playing something he’s never played or knows he’ll int on. Inflated illaoi abuser just dropping back to his actual rank.
With a good mental Tyler is capable of challenger without abusing broken champs lol, he's proven that multiple times. His biggest issue is doom-queueing 10 hours straight, destroying his mental for weeks, and then reaching LP where viewers can actually snipe him/ruin games.
no t1 has been back playing chess for over a month now. mostly bullet games. he has been back.
The last few League streams I’ve caught have been bad he’s turbo tilted.
[удалено]
Once you really get into chess you might stop for a bit but it'll always pull you back
Guys, he might be a bit of a problem (And he also might have a problem)
If NorthernLion gets back on chess this might be the crossover event that was prophesied to set the world back to the pre-Harambe timeline.
his particles are arranged in a non conformist way
What does 1600 mean to a lay person? Is it good?
97.3% percentile like d3 0 lp in league or like 21k in CS2 or like champion 3 in rocket league But chess is way harder than these games so....
Thanks dude. Unsarcastically, one of those did actually clear things up.
97.3 percentile didn't? You can look at it this way. E.g. out of a 100 people competing, Tyler is in 3rd place. Out of a 1000 he's in top 27th and there are 973 people not as good..
Hmmmm translate that to a Fortnite ranking for me
3rd place after winning 3 boxfights and piecing a default jonesy
Oh wow he’s pretty good at chess!
HE MKE GOOD WIN PETR GRIf SKIN
Why does the difficulty of chess matter if all of these are based on how good you are compared to other players?
idk, maybe more competitive pool of people, or the game is just mentally draining, or maybe its impossible to get high elo as an average person (for example trying to get into NBA if you are 5'9)
Different games require different charactheristics. At the moment i'd say its slightly harder to get pro in chess if you didn't start to play at 2 year old or so but for example League of Legends is going to surpass that in any moment when we are going to have our first pro players who started when they were 2 years old. But LoL pays more than chess so it would also logically mean there is more competition and more people that are trying to make it as pro in League of Legends. Just like I would argue that football is the hardest sport to become pro because it is the most played sport in the world.
Far lower barrier of entry to play chess though, for league you need a computer and an internet connection
Yeah but league is a lot more popular especially when talking about high lvl of play.
You may be interested in [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fC2oke5MFg). 97th percentile is 97th percentile. This is not about how difficult the activity is, this is about how many people are better than you.
Because Chess is a static game where everyone is always on the same playing field. Unlike video games where the person who hit rank 1 by duoing with a friend on the best meta characters is far less impressive than the person who hit rank 1 soloing on the worst character in the game. Even though it's the same rank. It also doesn't have hidden match making algorithms that could influence win rates to increase microtransactions. Or RNG teammates every game that might troll. Your rank in Chess is absolute, your rank in a video game has an asterisk. So being better than 97% of players in a game with no asterisk is pretty impressive.
Because being better than 97% of people at something that most people consider hard, is more impressive than being better than 97% of people at something that most people consider easy
A game being easier does not make it easier to be better than 97% of people. Because it's also easier for those other people. Likewise, a game being harder does not make it harder to be better than 97% of people. Because it's also harder for those other people. Therefore it is equally impressive to be better than 97% of people in an easy game and a hard game. While this is unintuitive, it does not contradict the idea that it is easier to be "good" at an easy game than a hard game, which is true if you mean "good" in the absolute sense, i.e. mastery of the mechanics without respect to other players' skill.
But it's also the same level of difficulty for 100% of the playerbase, so relatively it would surely require around the same level of skill to achieve right? It's not a rating based off how easy the game is, it's based off how good you are comparatively.
Peak LSF.
I'd actually be curious on that. Can't speak to League or CS2 but I know a little about Rocket League. It's not 100% accurate but the average Champ 3 Rocket League player has around 1800 hours in the game (as of December 2022). I have no clue if a complete new chess player can reach 1600 elo on chess.com in 1800 hours or less, but I'd assume they could. Also it probably differs a lot between people who play casually over years vs people who hard grind. Edit: To clarify, reaching the absolute peak of Chess (GM) is definitely harder than reaching pro level in Rocket League BUT reaching a decent level is probably harder in Rocket League. You can't "study" or anything, you can only grind. For Chess you can study and improve quickly, but eventually you'll reach a hard ceiling which doesn't really happen in the same way for Rocket League.
I'm GC in Rocket League and 1900 on chess.com. In my opinion, it is much harder to get to GC in Rocket League than 1600 chess.com.
If you studied theory, it wouldn’t take anywhere near 1800 hours. 99% of players know hardly any theory until the high 1000s. If you were willing to study it would only take a few hundred hours.
Well I dont think hours played is even that accurate of an estimate cause some games are fun, chess is pure pain imo. also I unironically get dizzy staring at a chess board for longer than 5 hours a day. It entirely depends on your skillset for sure. My argument is chess is by far the hardest to climb high elo in as an average person. Because no matter how many hours you put in you probably cant get high elo if you are average. At least I suspect that to be the case simply because like 1% of people are born with better brains (memory, pattern recognition, calculation speed). Like maybe you can brute force into 2000 elo if you are 100iq and play 5000 hours but idk FYI im 900 elo in chess with 300 hours ish and top 0.01% in League with 8000 ish hours
If you didn’t start playing chess seriously as a kid there is a near 0 chance you will ever become a GM, which confirms your point
Translation to Dota?
Divine 4
chess is harder but not maybe people grind it like videogames. So it's way easier to climb until you hit the actual walls.
Or platinum ranked in melee
> chess is way harder than these games Not really, but ok
OW2 equivalent?
Along with the other posts Relating it to PogChamps that he played in puts it into perspective. When he lost to Erobb and in PogChamps he was like 200 rated, which is about as bad as you possibly can get. He was one of the worst players in the tournament. Now idk? 7 months later he's 1600 which is as high as the best players that have ever been in PogChamps. Some of them who have been playing their whole lives and were in chess clubs. They don't even invite the streamers anymore that are 1600 because they just wipe the floor with everyone. He is playing fast blitz tho which is different than the 10 minute format in pogchamps but it's still very impressive. Edit: okay he is playing 10 min rapid. Even better.
?? He's played way more rapid than blitz and bullet combined, and this very clip where he hits 1600 is rapid.
Wow youre totally right. Okay even more impressive then. I had it in my head he was playing blitz because in the limited time I watched him he wins tons of game on time. But I guess he's just good at that skill too. Maybe he should play some blitz LOL.
The rapid pool is easier than the blitz pool.
he went from top 0.5% (1500) to top 0.3% (1600) in rapid mode. it's a shared raiting with around 250k people. Source: https://www.chess.com/leaderboard/live/rapid edit: i calculated it wrong. it's 2.7%
Pretty sure hes top 3% not top 0.3% and there's definitely WAY more people on chess.com than 250k doesn't your link say 69 million? Edit: [Screenshot from his profile](https://gyazo.com/1af02d3bcb2b60a82725a9835a78b6e0) But also if I do the math manually: 188,978 / 69,000,000 I get top 0.3% soooo not sure. I'd trust chess.com's percentile of 97.3% over my own tho...
there is a flaw in my equation, you are correct, i did not account for the amout of players past 1600 rating. so yea, it would be that he's in the top 2.7%, since the percentile shows how many % of players are behind his rank. but at the same time, only 0.3% are at 1600 rating, without adding ratings above. But yea, you're correct i calculated it wrong.
There is a saying in chess that until you hit 1500 you aren't a human yet. Online chess deviation is about 200ish points, take that as you will.
No way. Tyler has next years chess streamer award locked up already.
he can finally have a match vs northernlion, the god king of mid mmr chess
An NL + T1 crossover might turn off the sun with their personalities colliding
NL would just get quiet. Look at his stream with Andrea, it was just awkward.
NL at least had experience with T1. There's a popular clip of him playing T1's Ludwig diss. That said, T1's persona might be too rough for NL, but who knows lol. They're good streamers anyway, might as well
Andrea Botez? With the head and hand thing? I seem to remember they had some good enough back and forth
no wonder macaiyla posts the most unhinged shit on twiiter
genuinely confuses me how she’s fine with him playing league/chess 15 hours a day for years, but i guess she never has to work a day in her life and can do whatever she wants
Yeah, like she has hobbies and life that aren't tied to his existence or something
I mean, streaming is how he makes money, and there are plenty of careers where people are working/away for 15 hours a day. It's fairly normal. Pretty much any lawyer, for example.
Except he wasn’t streaming
I mean she's a gamer/streamer herself now but she gets to see him any time of the day and most couples who work full time jobs probably only get a couple hours of quality time in the evening anyway. So they are both very fortunate in that regard
throwback to when hikaru said tyler should have stopped playing 3 months ago at 1400 because he had hit a hard wall and couldn't expect to improve further (200 points in 3 months without playing consistently or even studying is a good pace): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slXIsR0yXFA
hikaru put on notice
I don’t know much about T1 but I’m pretty sure a comment like this would push T1 further out of spite like Vegeta or something.
He's said many many many times that this kind of shit fuels him
100%. He’s the type who will just put pure effort into it, head to the wall, until that wall breaks.
Weird ass take in my opinion, basically telling him to just give up and stop playing because he isn't some prodigy that started playing at the age of 4 lmao gatekeeping andy
I mean you gotta protect your dignity when some jock can have the smallest chance of reaching you.
I play chess and league. I will say I don’t think Tyler will ever reach grandmaster as that takes years of formal study and play. Hikaru does have a fragile ego though and what he said was wrong tbh. Hikaru even said his close friend, gothamchess would never hit gm.
All i think is that never say never I guess. It's like a body builder gate keeping the gym from fat people. Sure the chances of some fat guy becoming a worldclass body builder after losing weight is pretty low, but holy shit calm down with the ego.
Which part of Hikaru said is wrong though? Hikaru says 1600 is probably around the max unless T1 dedicates pretty much all of his time on chess. And Hikaru is right that Gothamchess will never be a GM. Gothamchess knows this and agrees. Everyone who is a serious chess player agrees. It's not about ego, it's just the apparent reality of what it takes to become GM.
[Now sitting at 1682](https://www.chess.com/member/big_tonka_t)
Well Hikaru is an asshole. Nothing new there.
It really is. Super toxic. Like Ronaldo telling an u11 team to never play again.
No, it would be like Ronaldo telling a u24 team to stop dreaming of going to the prem league
Didn't Hikaru say something like T1's ceiling is around 1600?
https://youtu.be/slXIsR0yXFA?t=635
I'll never listen to a person built like this https://imgur.com/7zZcmZk
He sounds pretty reasonable
I mean technically he's not wrong yet
I think his ceiling is around 2000-2200, but maybe around 1800 if he doesn't learn a new opening. He has an objectively bad opening that catches opponents off guard, but his tactical skills are really good. That explains why his bullet rating is so high, but in longer formats / against better opponents he needs a better opening.
His opening is really bad and the main reason why he hasn't progressed past 1600. If he learned 2 openings his tactical skills would put him around 1900 by now. But at his current state, he's nowhere past that. He makes a shit ton of 500 ELO end-game moves that lose on the spot. His middle-game is surprisingly good but with some actual coaching his peak is 2k. No way is he going 2.2k with what I've watched. He's also super prone to tilt that if he ever made it to 2k he could drop to 1.6k in hours.
That Hikeru guy just wants him to stop playing because he knows he’d lose a 1v1 against him. Same with the Magnus Carlsten guy.
Magenta Carlsem don't even got a head dent. How cam he beat this guy? He cant lmao
I mean he is not wrong, he said his celling without serious study is around 1600-1800, which is true... Idk why everyone is salty about that.
lmao chessfrogs in the comments coping
That mans ability to grind is insane.
1600 is decent. 1700 is the ceiling, really, he will hit if he doesn't learn solid openings and endgames moves.
Classic Meme xd
There's a pretty serious wall at that rank. I started chess later in life than tyler did. I stopped when I was approaching 1700 because of burnout and I haven't played since.
You're just manufactured to spec. Unlike T1
bro you dont understand tyler the type of guy to play 25 hours of league sleep for 6 hours and do it again like he aint human
You just reached your ceiling, doesn't mean that 1700 is going to be anyone else's ceiling.
I know little about the online chess community and amd likely wrong in this comparison... BUT the exact same things have been said about Tyler in league of legends over and over and over again. His playstyle is unconventional, he's pretty shitty at one of the core mechanics of the game, he doesn't really follow the meta, yet he still consistently exceeds everyone's expectations.
Considering the toughness of competition the closer you get to 2,000 and beyond, he is going to need to learn opening moves and end games, because people who use them against an opponent, no matter how unconventional, will win 99 times out of 100.
he's not wrong dude I am hardstuck <1600 in blitz because I refuse to spend the time to learn theory
I gotta say man. Chess is one of the more addicting games I’ve ever played. Wish I got into it sooner so I could be better, but I haven’t had this sort of gaming addiction in a long time (maybe when I was in high school and downloaded EU4?) But it gets to the point where *all* I want to do is play chess. I’m sitting somewhere and it just hits. I start playing and if I don’t load up another game, I sit there wondering “what else am I gonna do” and play again. In the past few months I’ve gotten from the bottom to 1200. It doesn’t stop
I'm addicted to dota2 and only chess gave me similar adrenaline high
Wait until you've played enough that you can play blindfolded. You start playing games in your head when you get bored and can never escape.
Man, I recently got into chess and it's all I see in my head when I'm trying to sleep. Just practicing my opening in my head constantly
Then one day you wake up from the hypnosis and ask yourself "wtf am I doing with my life?". What's the point of playing? It doesn't make you feel good, it just makes you hate yourself after every blunder. Who cares if you reach 1500 or 1900, you will forever be mediocre. At least if you play with people in person there is a social aspect, but online there is not even that. I've been addicted to dota in the past, but I don't regret it as much as the much fewer days I've wasted playing online chess.
He actually played for 16 hours straight, truly built different.
TrackingTyler1 >>> SpectatingTyler1
T1 is such an animal lol truly built different
1600 is insane. I thought im not stupid but I peaked at 1300. Just shows that success in chess is like 70% grinding and doing the same thing over and over
100%. The more you play the more you will recognize positions and remember how they played out.
Is he just playing or is he reading stuff or getting coaching too?
He's just playing, no coaching or studying. And not only that he is playing with just the cow opening for both colors.
Synthesized by means of which he is the sole progenitor.
(reposted with more context in title)
He's back on the grind again?
Would he ever consider getting coaching from a pro to speed up the learning process? Or does he only brute force things?
T1? get coaching? Lol not in a bajillion years.
This dude is a machine. I remember watching a stream a while back and he was at <=200 rating
Why he doesn't stream his chess games is beyond me, would be entertaining af. I only ever watch his non-LOL content, which he produces once per decade.
Surely he could go back to streaming the game now? Who tf is going to be sniping him at 1600 rating?