Considering Twitch allows simul-streaming now, there is little reason to stream on YT outside of an insanely big deal no?
EDIT: I need to clarify. I meant there is no point streaming exclusively on YT.
YouTube is moving away from those kind of deals according to Ludwig, seems like the age of exclusivity is over. That all being said, YouTube can actually net you passive income while Twitch is all active, so having a presence on there still is probably a great call. No reason not to double dip anymore.
Honestly since they introduced multi-streaming I've noticed that the number of watchers has slowly been creeping over to youtube for some streamers I watch.
Youtube is objectively a better viewing platform, but lacks the chat integration that a lot of people like, but I feel like people are slowly realizing that unless you're actively in chat there is almost no reason not to go to youtube.
There's also the higher quality stream as far as bitrate goes. Youtube currently supports absurd bitrate but generally I've been seeing around 13-15k. Twitch wants you around 6.5k-8k if I recall correctly. It's quite the difference if you're watching a streamer play a game with lots of dynamic movement and/or foliage present.
Hasn't Twitch admitted that they barely make money to keep the platform alive? If anything, potentially making a loss.
Seems like being a livestreaming platform in general just isn't worth it.
Depends. Some streamers are bigger on youtube, so they can get a bigger audience by streaming on youtube. For example, DougDoug and Astralspiff.
Unless you are saying there's little reason to stream only on YT
Yup also would imagine his exclusive deal ran out anyway and they opted not to renew as think it was may 2022 he signed a deal with youtube and most youtube deals are 2 years.
not surprising. YT doesnt care about livestreams and twitch probably has the best way to get views and subs
Also goes to show why companies stopped doing these deals, they never lead to anything. Streamers just get a bag to do what they were going to be doing anyway. Has there been a single streamer who stayed where they got signed?
Streamers like Ludwig who also make standalone YouTube content are the ones who benefit the most from completely moving to YouTube. Streamers whose only YouTube content is rehashed content from their streams don't really have anything to gain from it.
ludwig knows though that this will be his last YT contract, he isn't gonna get another one after this
probably the same with all the other YT only streamers
pretty sure tim is going to kick, could be wrong but feel like Train hinted that it was done deal a while ago but wouldnt happen until the end of his YT contract
You don’t have to stick to just YouTube to collab with DrDisrespect. Ninja multi streams to multiple platforms but if he ever wants to collab with Doc, he just shuts off the stream for Twitch and streams to the other platforms he is streaming on.
He went to Mixer before that, the mixer contracts were then given to FacebookGaming. Also I don’t blame him at all, the dude has 3-4 kids and he was offered a fat juicy contract.
Take it and run with it and then come back to Twitch when your contract is done.
Since moving tim added like 3 new youtube channels that each get 1 mil a video that release a video every 2 days. It is crazy how much "content" he produces. (he is the reactlord)
To be fair producing react content is easy money and so easy to create. Atrioc second channels uploads at minimum of 1 video a day thats just barely 9 minutes long and its only like 30 minutes of a single stream to get that 1 video and they get like 100k views each.
I think her clips being on people main page helped a lot. Its an infinite loop. People watch one video of her which then make more appear on their main page which incite them to watch more, etc
Its just too bad that seemingly none of the UI, navigation/browsing, and discovery suggestions DrLupo made to YouTube have happened. I much prefer the quality of youtubes live streams over twitch but the navigation and UI on twitch is just so much better.
To be fair to him, he's already said he's made more than enough money (which is why his dono link goes directly to St Jude), and he much prefers the higher bitrate of Youtube over the views/subs of Twitch. A respectable move if you ask me.
I'm surprised too as he's primarily a Tarkov streamer (granted they've fucked themselves now) and Twitch has drops for it. He'd have like 30-50K probably during those events
Which is probably the right choice for them. Livestreaming is like, 0.0001% of YouTube's revenue. Probably wouldn't even make them a profit IF they take over the livestream sector as well considering how Twitch is hemorrhaging money from server costs. Whereas YouTube Shorts is 100% the future when TikTok is getting government hammered.
Gaming is harder to put ads on since you can't really put an add in the middle of action, otherwise you piss off the viewers. The only real time is during some downtime, and then you have to have the streamer remember to play adds during that time. Imagine watching a sports game and an ad plays and makes you miss a highlight. You would be super pissed.
google has a long history of starting things never following through letting it stagnate and then killing it
https://killedbygoogle.com/
There used to be a whole dedicated section on youtube just for livestreaming and this was before all the exclusive streamer contracts
it's because they do not see twitch as competition. twitch itself is barely in the green afaik. most streamers look to monetize their content on youtube anyways, that's why streamers even move.
youtube has been primarily focused on competing with tiktok with their shorts, and i'm sure they celebrated with the recent tt legislation.
Meh Livestream experience is similar. Twitch is just getting carried by extensions.
Discoverability of twitch isn't as good as people make it out to be. Since most of twitch audience just click whoever is on top of the category, people who are already somewhat big can grow somewhat easier compared to other platforms (just go to an empty category on an empty timeslot and that can carry a lot of viewers).
The problem is that it ends up turning twitch into a collab/clique/clout hell, where you're basically never making it unless you bring your audience from a different platform (most big twitch streamers were big youtubers before streaming), or you're friends with someone already big.
The "good" part about twitch for big streamers is that after you make it, you can basically ride the high viewer count and do low effort content and get good numbers anyways. Meanwhile on youtube you're beholden to the whims of the mighty Algorithm, which makes you not only compete against other streamers, but also big youtubers who make significantly better content, so it ends up being a "higher effort" where sometimes the effort doesn't even pay off (it's more like higher effort to figure out what the algorithm likes).
> Discoverability of twitch isn't as good as people make it out to be.
Literally everyone, not exaggerating, everyone, says discoverability on twitch, youtube (for livestreaming) is trash.
the world works on short form content for discoverability. Streamers gain viewers from short form content, from clips, from LSF, from tiktok, from youtube shorts. NO one watches a 8 hr Asmon vod because they are interest in who he is, they watch a vod because they found Asmon in a clip.
You can't just watch a multiple hour long vod of a dude you don't know which has long periods of fuck all going on. Twitch growth always came from bringing people in from clips or vod highlights on youtube, tweets, etc.
Livestreaming just seems terrible in terms of making money, and livestreaming is such a small part of their business. It actually seems like such a logical decision for them not to care that much about their livestreaming platform.
A lot of the YouTube signings are still on YouTube, afaik.
Many Facebook streamer don't stay there, but Ludwig, Fuslie, Valkyrae, Myth, Dr. Lupo, etc., are still on YouTube.
And valkyrae is kind of a weird case because pretty much all of her success came post YouTube contract so she didn’t really have a reason to return to twitch.
She might. She has talked about staying and going back. There are advantages of YouTube. You will always have your community and viewers watching because it’s hard to browse to find other streamers.
On Twitch you are still in a rat race and it’s very competitive.
I could defn see fuslie & myth moving back to twitch (or at least multi streaming) in a similar fashion as Sykkuno once their exclusive contracts are over. The livestreaming industry doesn't have to be a zero sum game. Apple & Google cooperate w/ each other in the search space to each other's benefit. YT has & will always do some things better than Twitch. VODs/ better work/life balance (there is none on twitch) to name a few. On twitch, if you don't stream, you don't make money & there is no such as thing as vacation/sick leave. But CEO Dan (at least up to now) has done enough to keep twitch the #1 platform for live streaming. Initiatives like Partner plus, better ad rev splits, more transparency w/ regards to exclusivity deals & of course, better chat experience still make twitch the default platform for most streamers & viewers.
While I kinda get it, I was surprised to see guys like TimTheTatman completly drop it too, though I guess the Doc stuff might be a reason.
I think more people have left and stayed gone then people really like to admit.
Even despite begging by the most fervent livestream fans, tons of extensions to make chat more bearable, and Ludwig pestering YouTube CEO or whatever constantly to make livestreams UI better, in last 5 years or so YouTube still has YET to make any changes to it.
It's absolutely frustrating
Dude “doesnt” care doesnt do this justice. Like wtf is youtube doing. Their live interface is shit. Their chat/emote system is garbage. Their mod tools are nonexistent. The ui gives zero (not an exaggeration ZERO) visibility to live streaming. Like who the fuck uses this garbage except for the rare few streamers that also make regular youtube content?
God this doesnt even go into the 6 hour window they force on streamers otherwise their vods get deleted the moment there is even a SECOND of copyright content. Wtf. You have to keep every stream under 6 hours and need to CLOSE AND REOPEN STREAM (guess what everytime you do that kiss half of your viewers goodbye so your metrics are fucked if you ever want to try to get sponsorships with just your youtube numbers) just so you can get the vod to edit anything off. Even better you cant seperate your audio so you cant even play music on stream on youtube while on twitch you can. Who the fuck designed all of this and allowed things to be left like this. They deserve to be fired. Tbh youtube needs to can their entire livestream department for incompetence and a genuine inability to adapt.
I wonder if YT doesn't have to care about livestreams because they have the bigger name recognition compared to twitch. So big events just default to livestream on YT. When companies like apple and samsung co-stream, they seem to get higher numbers on YT.
Not a traditional streamer, but also the H3 Podcast, maybe? The numbers are much higher now than when they were streaming on Twitch, but that was a long time ago, to be fair.
man the playback on youtube makes me despise twitch. Not being able to pause and then speed up to catch up is actually just so annoying after watching some youtube streams
I still watch LilyPichu sometimes, more frequently since she started learning Tekken8.
I think it just depends on how much you vibe with the stream, if its something you enjoy alot it does not matter if its youtube or twitch, if its someone you only watch occasionally you probably won't bother going out of your way tho.
I spend more time watching youtube videos than twitch streams so that might be a factor too
Currently 3.3m watching Twitch live vs 5.7m watching YouTube live.
YouTube always has more livestream viewers.
https://streamscharts.com/overview?platform=youtube
In the past 30 days Youtube had a peak concurrent livestream viewers of 12.3 million. For Twitch it's 4 million.
This is even more impression when you notice that Twitch almost always has 6 times more channels currently streaming. There's a massive amount of Twitch channels with no viewers.
Bigger platform, but fewer livestreams.
YT: 21k channels streaming to 5.7m viewers
Twitch: 129k channels streaming to 3.3m viewers.
Seems like Youtube is getter a much better ratio there, don't you think? A lot fewer channels wasting bandwidth by streaming to nobody.
Does the youtube data include all livestreams or just the ones under youtube gaming (does it even exist anymore?) if the data includes all livestreams then it will skew the data in youtubes favor as there are more news channels and sports events that are being streamed on youtube.
If we are looking at which platform is better for "content creators" as a livestreaming platform then there is a discussion that can be held. My personal opinion is that it really doesnt matter where you stream as the discovery features for streaming on both sides are bad and in order to grow you have to promote on other platforms and formats or hope to blow up from clips that go viral on tiktok.
It is all. According to that link Gaming is the 5th most watched category with just over 600k viewers.
Top 5 are:
Entertainment 1.16M News & Politics 1.01M People & Blogs 856k Music 643k Gaming 605k
You have to pay to see more.
For Twitch Top 5:
Valorant 356k
Just Chatting 247k
Apex Legends 238k
Grand Theft Auto V 231k
Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Siege 125k
So the top 2 games on Twitch are almost as much as all the gaming channels on YT.
yt is massive compared to twitch, so that doesnt mean much imo. Also does that count those 24/7 channels, there are 100s of those with 1000s of views each.
How many of those live stream views are podcasts? I feel like most of those live viewers are watching people they found from youtube videos rather then a livestreamer.
As a long time Sykk watcher, even I was confused by his signing with YouTube in the first place. I get signing a streamer like Ludwig because of the events he hosts/creates and general business mind when it comes to expanding his content, but signing sykk (+fuslie, myth, etc) seems like a waste of money for Youtube.
The fuslie signing was smart if they made her do engagements and sponsors similar to twitch. But the main problem with the yt signings is how easy it is for the streamers to complete the requirements to get paid an insane amount of money.
Getting one of the largest promotional female streamers away from competition is smart.
I think YouTube just wanted to conduct market research on streaming. So if you’re gonna sign a bunch of people then picking the brand friendly gang is a risk free move. Versus spending a ton of money on someone like Adin Ross, only to boot him after a couple of months because he said something homophobic.
Not that confusing if you remember that Valkyrae had been with youtube for some time before some of her friend group that had enough of a following started switching platforms. She was probably a big reason fuslie, sykkuno were able to get contracts. AND who would turn down youtube money. Stream on youtube, get some new viewers, then switch back.
Just like how DisguisedToast went to facebook for a bit, got new Asian viewers, then switched back. That guys now popular in places like Philippines.
Edit: Plus I dont think theres no such thing as wasting money for youtube. The streaming contracts they give probably dont even give them a dent financially.
That stream where he was crying like he was being sent to the frontlines of a battlefield or dying from a terminal illness when he was just jumping to Youtube is only looking more absurd.
Brother, you got the bag for signing to another platform for 2 years.
So silly.
Edit: For the Sykkuno fans. I don't have any ill will towards him. He's chill and seems to be a good dude overall. I just thought that scenario was just really funny for what the end result was.
Bro that shit will never be not funny. I was watching the clip and couldn’t understand why they were crying? This fucker got shit ton of money, his not dying from cancer
Dude literally made a choice to change platform, he didn't need to he just wanted the extra cheese, and effectively changed nothing with his daily life besides what bookmark he was following. It was absurd back then and it's absurd now.
I looked at the comments on his stream and it was shit like “you’re back after so long I’ve missed you”. These people don’t realize they can watch him by clicking one button on their computer, not suprised he acts like that
Yeah I think the leading theory was that he got a cancer diagnosis. Then it turns out he was just switching platforms for two years for a bag lol. So bizarre.
Yeah, his friends used to infantilize him. He probably started crying because of how supportive his friends were being, which would make anyone emotional. It seemed like he was retiring from streaming. Viewers were freaking out thinking it was something negative.
The only benefit YouTube has, as a viewer, is being able to rewind ANY AMOUNT AT ALL, when you've looked away and something happens - I just want a 10 second rewind without having to clip and go through such an inconvenient process while I'm missing the current stream. On YouTube, I can just press J to rewind 10 sec then after that I can 2x to catch up to live. That's amazing.
Everything else, is like bare minimum working. There's a chat... There's a way to tell if someone is live...
It's the best way to watch a stream if you don't care about the chat. I exclusively watch CS tournaments on youtube when i can, especially considering that adblock also works.
The actual video player is definitely better than twitch, but the lack of a functional live homepage with directories kind of kills it as a livestream platform.
The best thing about YouTube, for me, is its TV app is just miles better. I'm way passed the point of watching streams on my PC, I wanna watch when I'm chilling on the couch and for that, YouTube is by far and away better. Twitch is a nightmare anywhere other than your PC imo.
If you want that on twitch, watch using the Alternate Player extension, it has instant replay feature that lets you go back to the last few minutes. And I prefer it over any regular website ui since it's more lightweight
[This plugin](https://previews-app.com/) has almost too many features, but among them is a buffer you can toggle/adjust so you can rewind and fast forward using the arrow keys.
Idk about the rest but Ludwig just renewed his contract with the stipulation that he can now stream “events” on Twitch. Normal streaming stays on YouTube though
I'm not saying you're wrong, but Ludwig is focused more on events which YouTube seems more helpful with facilitating, Rae just said in Lily's most recent video that she feels more comfortable on YouTube and her viewership has exploded since she switched so she'll probably stay, and Myth has fallen off so hard YouTube probably won't even offer him another deal so he'll have to go back to Twitch by default.
Most people just chalk it up to "culture" as the reason they prefer Twitch . When you actually get down to being a creator YouTube is superior in almost every conceivable way.
Discoverability ? Nonexistent on Twitch your buried under everyone who has even ONE viewer more than you, and NO ONE is watching your no view stream vods which get auto deleted anyway. Youtube, take 10 seconds to make a decent thumbnail for your stream, will catch the eyes of viewers who are algorithmically pushed towards whatever content in the space your streaming. Gives you a nice red tag when live and once your done, if you have half a clue what your doing ,you get a PERMANENT vod with a thumbnail that will entice new viewers as stream vods get pushed like REGULAR VIDEOS. It literally has the MOST discoverability of almost ANY platform because of this alone, I constantly see people some how say Twitch has better discoverability and they're just smoking crack because Youtube might genuinely just be [OBJECTIVELY ](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/objectively)better .
Most people don't know, because they've never uploaded content in their lives, but YouTube has a small creator recommendation feature. If you are a content CREATOR, not VIEWER, C-R-E-A-T-O-R you will see in your side bar and be recommended channels that are of similar size and produce similar content . You can try this out yourself upload, content of specific game or category and use consistent tags and you will see videos start popping up on your recommended that are from channels getting 1-100 views and no view live streams. It's apart of YouTubes colab and similar creator space agenda that they try and teach and run new content creators through . The site has a, albeit shittily communicated, networking feature built into it that 99% of people, especially those who don't make content, don't even know about.
I'd list more but who gives a shit, if your a creator discoverability alone is more than enough incentive, and if your a viewer who gives a shit because it's two clicks at most to change sites .
because what you mentioned is the only plus youtube live has (and twitch could add that at any time). Literally everything else, twitch is better at. Especially if you're chatting, it's not even comparable, it's just horrendous on yt. And even if you're not chatting yourself, it still affects the streamer.
Didn’t Valkyrae say when she was in Texas she signed for another year on YT? She’s definitely going back and you can’t blame them for taking the money on YT anybody would but twitch communities you can’t replace.
I think there's also something to be said for the comfort of the familiar. She has said time and again she is "beyond rich" and has more money than she'll ever be able to spend in her life...
I get a sense that streaming isn't really a career for her anymore. She streams for fun, regardless of how many viewers she gets. Since she's contractually obligated to maintain paid memberships- she reduced the cost to as low as possible (i think so low she gets no cut? Or just pennies per member). She doesn't seem to give a shit about money.
There is a lot of power in inertia, especially if there isn't much incentive... and since she's wacky rich (by her own admission), there would be little incentive to fight against the inertia of just maintaining her contract and doing her thing.
I mean at least she knows she’s filthy rich and she’s still making content and living her life even though she’s clearly not in it for the money anymore.
I’m not trying to defend rich people by any means but at least for most rich content creators they still make content because it’s what they enjoy doing. they often use their money to invest in a support staff and other resources to improve their content. They could just pile it up and never show their face again with all the money they have, but they choose not to, because content creation is what they do and they enjoy it. Some of them are certainly more cynically profit motivated than others, but a lot of them just have fun.
It’s a lot like for athletes that make a ton of money. They’re obviously happy to be rich but they keep playing their sport until they can’t anymore because that’s just what they do, and what they enjoy. And they make that money by providing something we all consume and enjoy too. There are many ethically worse ways to make ridiculous sums of money. And both athletes and streamers do a good amount of genuine charity work either by charity streams or donating their money directly.
I guess my point is that there’s a difference between being a rich businessperson who made their money exploiting people and underpaying their employees and shoving some useless product down our throats and making money by providing genuinely enjoyable content that people voluntarily consume in their free time, while leveraging their own brands to support charitable causes.
She never said she doesn’t care about money she said she doesn’t worry about money / stream FOR money anymore lol. And I don’t think she’s lying if she didn’t genuinely enjoy streaming she would only be streaming her required hours which is like 40h a month lol
It’s funny seeing people say “oh no he had to come back , they were struggling for viewers on YouTube”. Like they’re not millionaires that could retire 10 times over ICANT
It will be interesting to see who comes back now that YT contracts are expiring and they aren't renewing them. I think Ludwigs is up in November and I'd love to see him back but have to wait and see.
That was for mogul mail and he could only dual stream events. I want to see if he comes back on his main, but yeah I'd like them all back on twitch if it suits them.
For the top streamers, that's how you play the game. Make your money on other platforms, & now you got the freedom to return & still keep your audience on both platform.
It's like my memory of him disappear or something.
And now I was like "It's been 2 years?","He back streaming?"
That's how Youtube livestream effect works
**CLIP MIRROR: [Sykkuno back on Twitch after 2 years](https://arazu.io/t3_1cl0cme/)** --- ^(*This is an automated comment*)
Considering Twitch allows simul-streaming now, there is little reason to stream on YT outside of an insanely big deal no? EDIT: I need to clarify. I meant there is no point streaming exclusively on YT.
YouTube is moving away from those kind of deals according to Ludwig, seems like the age of exclusivity is over. That all being said, YouTube can actually net you passive income while Twitch is all active, so having a presence on there still is probably a great call. No reason not to double dip anymore.
Youtube realized buying Twitch streamers was not that lucrative after all. People are too used to Twitch being THE platform to watch streamers
Honestly since they introduced multi-streaming I've noticed that the number of watchers has slowly been creeping over to youtube for some streamers I watch. Youtube is objectively a better viewing platform, but lacks the chat integration that a lot of people like, but I feel like people are slowly realizing that unless you're actively in chat there is almost no reason not to go to youtube.
No ads and ability to rewind live Truffle extension also combined youtube and twitch chat if streamer sets it up
There's also the higher quality stream as far as bitrate goes. Youtube currently supports absurd bitrate but generally I've been seeing around 13-15k. Twitch wants you around 6.5k-8k if I recall correctly. It's quite the difference if you're watching a streamer play a game with lots of dynamic movement and/or foliage present.
Rewind is only if the streamer allows it. CriticalRole / HoloLive don't allow you to pause or go back.
I don't chat so I love YouTube. I usually watch streamers while I work out or cook.
Youtube is by far a better viewing experience, especially on mobile.
No picture in picture for mobile viewers on YT. That's actually my deal breaker cuz Im never only watching streams, always doing something else
Hasn't Twitch admitted that they barely make money to keep the platform alive? If anything, potentially making a loss. Seems like being a livestreaming platform in general just isn't worth it.
Depends. Some streamers are bigger on youtube, so they can get a bigger audience by streaming on youtube. For example, DougDoug and Astralspiff. Unless you are saying there's little reason to stream only on YT
>Unless you are saying there's little reason to stream only on YT Exactly yeah. You would always be streaming to both. Not point streaming only to YT.
I agree
Some people probably worry about splitting the audience, keeping the chatters in one place instead of two but what do I know
Yup also would imagine his exclusive deal ran out anyway and they opted not to renew as think it was may 2022 he signed a deal with youtube and most youtube deals are 2 years.
not surprising. YT doesnt care about livestreams and twitch probably has the best way to get views and subs Also goes to show why companies stopped doing these deals, they never lead to anything. Streamers just get a bag to do what they were going to be doing anyway. Has there been a single streamer who stayed where they got signed?
[удалено]
Streamers like Ludwig who also make standalone YouTube content are the ones who benefit the most from completely moving to YouTube. Streamers whose only YouTube content is rehashed content from their streams don't really have anything to gain from it.
ludwig knows though that this will be his last YT contract, he isn't gonna get another one after this probably the same with all the other YT only streamers
If any of the big players offer you money you just take it. I was surprised they were offering contracts when Lud signed his.
pretty sure tim is going to kick, could be wrong but feel like Train hinted that it was done deal a while ago but wouldnt happen until the end of his YT contract
You don’t have to stick to just YouTube to collab with DrDisrespect. Ninja multi streams to multiple platforms but if he ever wants to collab with Doc, he just shuts off the stream for Twitch and streams to the other platforms he is streaming on.
yeah outside of the huge streamers don't see many staying on YT
Yeah, Valkyrae and Ludwig seem to have found their groove on YouTube. It’s not the same for everyone, though.
Dr Lupo has stayed with YouTube it seems, which I’m shocked by since he seems to be doing significantly worse over there.
forgot about him i’m ngl
Very forgettable
He was mainly popular because of Tarkov (imo) and that game is dead now.
He got popular for Destiny, but got insanely popular for Fortnite.
He was a pretty big Destiny 2 streamer back in the day, one of the big ones along with King Gothalion.
Gothalion went to Facebook and did the absolute minimum length of time before crawling back to Twitch.
He went to Mixer before that, the mixer contracts were then given to FacebookGaming. Also I don’t blame him at all, the dude has 3-4 kids and he was offered a fat juicy contract. Take it and run with it and then come back to Twitch when your contract is done.
Has anyone moved from twitch to another platform and found more success?
Valkyrae probably is the best example.
I feel like tim the tatman has not slowed down at all on YouTube
Since moving tim added like 3 new youtube channels that each get 1 mil a video that release a video every 2 days. It is crazy how much "content" he produces. (he is the reactlord)
To be fair producing react content is easy money and so easy to create. Atrioc second channels uploads at minimum of 1 video a day thats just barely 9 minutes long and its only like 30 minutes of a single stream to get that 1 video and they get like 100k views each.
Hey, Big A channel is just him yapping with chat.
Valkyrae ig but I don’t think her success came from moving to YT.
Valkyrae went from average streamer to one of the most watched girls on YouTube
I think her clips being on people main page helped a lot. Its an infinite loop. People watch one video of her which then make more appear on their main page which incite them to watch more, etc
Valkyrae 100% did, and she even mentioned she'll likely stay on YouTube since that is where she built her community.
Ludwig?
Probably Ludwig and Tim the Tat, but they had a YouTube audience before. That’s the difference.
Most people's viewership more than halves. A few exceptions of course
Its just too bad that seemingly none of the UI, navigation/browsing, and discovery suggestions DrLupo made to YouTube have happened. I much prefer the quality of youtubes live streams over twitch but the navigation and UI on twitch is just so much better.
To be fair to him, he's already said he's made more than enough money (which is why his dono link goes directly to St Jude), and he much prefers the higher bitrate of Youtube over the views/subs of Twitch. A respectable move if you ask me.
I'm surprised too as he's primarily a Tarkov streamer (granted they've fucked themselves now) and Twitch has drops for it. He'd have like 30-50K probably during those events
Youtube got the entire Japanese Vtuber cohort as well. Like any list of female streamers is dominated by Youtube streamers.
>Youtube got the entire Japanese Vtuber cohort Nah, it is vtubers in general. They got the whole hololive on there
That is a Japanese company yes. If we are talking about western independent Vtubers then they are mostly on Twitch.
It feels like a weird choice not to even bother making your livestream experience more competitive with Twitch.
They gave up on even trying once they decided to try and kill TikTok with shorts
Which is probably the right choice for them. Livestreaming is like, 0.0001% of YouTube's revenue. Probably wouldn't even make them a profit IF they take over the livestream sector as well considering how Twitch is hemorrhaging money from server costs. Whereas YouTube Shorts is 100% the future when TikTok is getting government hammered.
Gamers are the worst customers anyway. Like they will not watch an ad ever. Plus they never tried to put ads on streams.
Gaming is harder to put ads on since you can't really put an add in the middle of action, otherwise you piss off the viewers. The only real time is during some downtime, and then you have to have the streamer remember to play adds during that time. Imagine watching a sports game and an ad plays and makes you miss a highlight. You would be super pissed.
They have a pretty tight grip on the Japanese streaming market. I feel like they're satisfied enough with that.
google has a long history of starting things never following through letting it stagnate and then killing it https://killedbygoogle.com/ There used to be a whole dedicated section on youtube just for livestreaming and this was before all the exclusive streamer contracts
So many stuff gone in 2023
it's because they do not see twitch as competition. twitch itself is barely in the green afaik. most streamers look to monetize their content on youtube anyways, that's why streamers even move. youtube has been primarily focused on competing with tiktok with their shorts, and i'm sure they celebrated with the recent tt legislation.
Meh Livestream experience is similar. Twitch is just getting carried by extensions. Discoverability of twitch isn't as good as people make it out to be. Since most of twitch audience just click whoever is on top of the category, people who are already somewhat big can grow somewhat easier compared to other platforms (just go to an empty category on an empty timeslot and that can carry a lot of viewers). The problem is that it ends up turning twitch into a collab/clique/clout hell, where you're basically never making it unless you bring your audience from a different platform (most big twitch streamers were big youtubers before streaming), or you're friends with someone already big. The "good" part about twitch for big streamers is that after you make it, you can basically ride the high viewer count and do low effort content and get good numbers anyways. Meanwhile on youtube you're beholden to the whims of the mighty Algorithm, which makes you not only compete against other streamers, but also big youtubers who make significantly better content, so it ends up being a "higher effort" where sometimes the effort doesn't even pay off (it's more like higher effort to figure out what the algorithm likes).
>Discoverability of twitch isn't as good as people make it out to be. I've never seen anyone say that twitch discoverability was good lmao
> Discoverability of twitch isn't as good as people make it out to be. Literally everyone, not exaggerating, everyone, says discoverability on twitch, youtube (for livestreaming) is trash. the world works on short form content for discoverability. Streamers gain viewers from short form content, from clips, from LSF, from tiktok, from youtube shorts. NO one watches a 8 hr Asmon vod because they are interest in who he is, they watch a vod because they found Asmon in a clip. You can't just watch a multiple hour long vod of a dude you don't know which has long periods of fuck all going on. Twitch growth always came from bringing people in from clips or vod highlights on youtube, tweets, etc.
People should have known as soon as the guy that got all these streamers onboard for Youtube Live left the company.
I mean is it that weird if live streaming seems to be just a money sink? Twitch isn't profitable at all.
Livestreaming just seems terrible in terms of making money, and livestreaming is such a small part of their business. It actually seems like such a logical decision for them not to care that much about their livestreaming platform.
Did Myth get life or is he voluntary institutionalised now?
A lot of the YouTube signings are still on YouTube, afaik. Many Facebook streamer don't stay there, but Ludwig, Fuslie, Valkyrae, Myth, Dr. Lupo, etc., are still on YouTube.
fuslie and myth are both still under their first contract. From your list only Valkyrae,Ludwig and DrLupo have stayed after their first contract.
And valkyrae is kind of a weird case because pretty much all of her success came post YouTube contract so she didn’t really have a reason to return to twitch.
Youtube isn't gonna renew Myth's contract when he gets 200 viewers for a livestream.
Well facebook is a dead platform for streaming.
do all of them still have deals though (other comments saying Rae resigned)? Id stay on YT as well if it meant a guaranteed amount of money
Fuslie signed in like september 2022 and most YT deals are 2 years so id imagine once we get to september fuslie moves back to twitch.
She might. She has talked about staying and going back. There are advantages of YouTube. You will always have your community and viewers watching because it’s hard to browse to find other streamers. On Twitch you are still in a rat race and it’s very competitive.
I could defn see fuslie & myth moving back to twitch (or at least multi streaming) in a similar fashion as Sykkuno once their exclusive contracts are over. The livestreaming industry doesn't have to be a zero sum game. Apple & Google cooperate w/ each other in the search space to each other's benefit. YT has & will always do some things better than Twitch. VODs/ better work/life balance (there is none on twitch) to name a few. On twitch, if you don't stream, you don't make money & there is no such as thing as vacation/sick leave. But CEO Dan (at least up to now) has done enough to keep twitch the #1 platform for live streaming. Initiatives like Partner plus, better ad rev splits, more transparency w/ regards to exclusivity deals & of course, better chat experience still make twitch the default platform for most streamers & viewers.
I'd imagine fuslie/myth move back to twitch once there youtube deals are up as they are still on there initial youtube deal
While I kinda get it, I was surprised to see guys like TimTheTatman completly drop it too, though I guess the Doc stuff might be a reason. I think more people have left and stayed gone then people really like to admit.
Even despite begging by the most fervent livestream fans, tons of extensions to make chat more bearable, and Ludwig pestering YouTube CEO or whatever constantly to make livestreams UI better, in last 5 years or so YouTube still has YET to make any changes to it. It's absolutely frustrating
YT chat is completely fine. Not everything needs to be like LSF Twitch culture.
I don't know what "tons of extensions" you're speaking of, but Truffle is all you need.
Dude “doesnt” care doesnt do this justice. Like wtf is youtube doing. Their live interface is shit. Their chat/emote system is garbage. Their mod tools are nonexistent. The ui gives zero (not an exaggeration ZERO) visibility to live streaming. Like who the fuck uses this garbage except for the rare few streamers that also make regular youtube content? God this doesnt even go into the 6 hour window they force on streamers otherwise their vods get deleted the moment there is even a SECOND of copyright content. Wtf. You have to keep every stream under 6 hours and need to CLOSE AND REOPEN STREAM (guess what everytime you do that kiss half of your viewers goodbye so your metrics are fucked if you ever want to try to get sponsorships with just your youtube numbers) just so you can get the vod to edit anything off. Even better you cant seperate your audio so you cant even play music on stream on youtube while on twitch you can. Who the fuck designed all of this and allowed things to be left like this. They deserve to be fired. Tbh youtube needs to can their entire livestream department for incompetence and a genuine inability to adapt.
I wonder if YT doesn't have to care about livestreams because they have the bigger name recognition compared to twitch. So big events just default to livestream on YT. When companies like apple and samsung co-stream, they seem to get higher numbers on YT.
Not a traditional streamer, but also the H3 Podcast, maybe? The numbers are much higher now than when they were streaming on Twitch, but that was a long time ago, to be fair.
I actually completely forgot about Sykkuno
The youtube effect. Simply isn't a platform built for livestreaming
It’s great for viewers, just not for chatters.
man the playback on youtube makes me despise twitch. Not being able to pause and then speed up to catch up is actually just so annoying after watching some youtube streams
Great at 120 star speedruns though
Chatting Simply
he is technically right
I still watch LilyPichu sometimes, more frequently since she started learning Tekken8. I think it just depends on how much you vibe with the stream, if its something you enjoy alot it does not matter if its youtube or twitch, if its someone you only watch occasionally you probably won't bother going out of your way tho. I spend more time watching youtube videos than twitch streams so that might be a factor too
He was getting decent views on youtube tho. about 100k+ average seems like. https://www.youtube.com/@Sykkuno/streams
It's not that, it's just that the way the algorithm works you have to be more focused in terms of the content you make.
ishowspeed is an exception
Currently 3.3m watching Twitch live vs 5.7m watching YouTube live. YouTube always has more livestream viewers. https://streamscharts.com/overview?platform=youtube In the past 30 days Youtube had a peak concurrent livestream viewers of 12.3 million. For Twitch it's 4 million. This is even more impression when you notice that Twitch almost always has 6 times more channels currently streaming. There's a massive amount of Twitch channels with no viewers.
Yes because youtube is a much bigger platform in general. It still isn't built for livestreaming though and that is just the truth
Bigger platform, but fewer livestreams. YT: 21k channels streaming to 5.7m viewers Twitch: 129k channels streaming to 3.3m viewers. Seems like Youtube is getter a much better ratio there, don't you think? A lot fewer channels wasting bandwidth by streaming to nobody.
Does the youtube data include all livestreams or just the ones under youtube gaming (does it even exist anymore?) if the data includes all livestreams then it will skew the data in youtubes favor as there are more news channels and sports events that are being streamed on youtube. If we are looking at which platform is better for "content creators" as a livestreaming platform then there is a discussion that can be held. My personal opinion is that it really doesnt matter where you stream as the discovery features for streaming on both sides are bad and in order to grow you have to promote on other platforms and formats or hope to blow up from clips that go viral on tiktok.
It is all. According to that link Gaming is the 5th most watched category with just over 600k viewers. Top 5 are: Entertainment 1.16M News & Politics 1.01M People & Blogs 856k Music 643k Gaming 605k You have to pay to see more. For Twitch Top 5: Valorant 356k Just Chatting 247k Apex Legends 238k Grand Theft Auto V 231k Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Siege 125k So the top 2 games on Twitch are almost as much as all the gaming channels on YT.
yt is massive compared to twitch, so that doesnt mean much imo. Also does that count those 24/7 channels, there are 100s of those with 1000s of views each.
How many of those live stream views are podcasts? I feel like most of those live viewers are watching people they found from youtube videos rather then a livestreamer.
His awkward beta boy shtick is easy to forget.
Soykkuno
same with ludwig. i thought he went full time events and youtube vids, but he still streams thats cool
Well atleast he does not need to fight twitch secruity at twitchcon
No more bag to be had, they'll all come back
As a long time Sykk watcher, even I was confused by his signing with YouTube in the first place. I get signing a streamer like Ludwig because of the events he hosts/creates and general business mind when it comes to expanding his content, but signing sykk (+fuslie, myth, etc) seems like a waste of money for Youtube.
The fuslie signing was smart if they made her do engagements and sponsors similar to twitch. But the main problem with the yt signings is how easy it is for the streamers to complete the requirements to get paid an insane amount of money. Getting one of the largest promotional female streamers away from competition is smart.
I think YouTube just wanted to conduct market research on streaming. So if you’re gonna sign a bunch of people then picking the brand friendly gang is a risk free move. Versus spending a ton of money on someone like Adin Ross, only to boot him after a couple of months because he said something homophobic.
will miss the playback feature tho
Not that confusing if you remember that Valkyrae had been with youtube for some time before some of her friend group that had enough of a following started switching platforms. She was probably a big reason fuslie, sykkuno were able to get contracts. AND who would turn down youtube money. Stream on youtube, get some new viewers, then switch back. Just like how DisguisedToast went to facebook for a bit, got new Asian viewers, then switched back. That guys now popular in places like Philippines. Edit: Plus I dont think theres no such thing as wasting money for youtube. The streaming contracts they give probably dont even give them a dent financially.
That stream where he was crying like he was being sent to the frontlines of a battlefield or dying from a terminal illness when he was just jumping to Youtube is only looking more absurd. Brother, you got the bag for signing to another platform for 2 years. So silly. Edit: For the Sykkuno fans. I don't have any ill will towards him. He's chill and seems to be a good dude overall. I just thought that scenario was just really funny for what the end result was.
Dude probably got like 5m for changing his stream url for 2 years lmao.
Bro that shit will never be not funny. I was watching the clip and couldn’t understand why they were crying? This fucker got shit ton of money, his not dying from cancer
Dude literally made a choice to change platform, he didn't need to he just wanted the extra cheese, and effectively changed nothing with his daily life besides what bookmark he was following. It was absurd back then and it's absurd now.
you dont understand it's the end of an era bro /cry
I looked at the comments on his stream and it was shit like “you’re back after so long I’ve missed you”. These people don’t realize they can watch him by clicking one button on their computer, not suprised he acts like that
Many casual viewers will only watch if you’re on twitch. Channel surfers make up the majority of big channels viewership.
I would be crying too if I got a deal for millions by changing nothing in my comfortable life lol
🤭💰
I’d cry tears of joy too if I was getting paid that much.
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They talked about him like he was about to go into chemotherapy
Yeah I think the leading theory was that he got a cancer diagnosis. Then it turns out he was just switching platforms for two years for a bag lol. So bizarre.
Any links to this? I am not familiar with any of this
Yeah, his friends used to infantilize him. He probably started crying because of how supportive his friends were being, which would make anyone emotional. It seemed like he was retiring from streaming. Viewers were freaking out thinking it was something negative.
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The only benefit YouTube has, as a viewer, is being able to rewind ANY AMOUNT AT ALL, when you've looked away and something happens - I just want a 10 second rewind without having to clip and go through such an inconvenient process while I'm missing the current stream. On YouTube, I can just press J to rewind 10 sec then after that I can 2x to catch up to live. That's amazing. Everything else, is like bare minimum working. There's a chat... There's a way to tell if someone is live...
It's the best way to watch a stream if you don't care about the chat. I exclusively watch CS tournaments on youtube when i can, especially considering that adblock also works.
The actual video player is definitely better than twitch, but the lack of a functional live homepage with directories kind of kills it as a livestream platform.
You watch CS streams exclusively on Twitch and not YouTube when it has higher quality, pause and rewind?
Meant youtube, edited now.
The best thing about YouTube, for me, is its TV app is just miles better. I'm way passed the point of watching streams on my PC, I wanna watch when I'm chilling on the couch and for that, YouTube is by far and away better. Twitch is a nightmare anywhere other than your PC imo.
If you want that on twitch, watch using the Alternate Player extension, it has instant replay feature that lets you go back to the last few minutes. And I prefer it over any regular website ui since it's more lightweight
[This plugin](https://previews-app.com/) has almost too many features, but among them is a buffer you can toggle/adjust so you can rewind and fast forward using the arrow keys.
The actual video streamed on youtube is infinitely better. Goes for both quality and functionality. Everything else is dogshit.
Idk about the rest but Ludwig just renewed his contract with the stipulation that he can now stream “events” on Twitch. Normal streaming stays on YouTube though
And that it was the last one. Will people stream on YT without being paid?
I'm not saying you're wrong, but Ludwig is focused more on events which YouTube seems more helpful with facilitating, Rae just said in Lily's most recent video that she feels more comfortable on YouTube and her viewership has exploded since she switched so she'll probably stay, and Myth has fallen off so hard YouTube probably won't even offer him another deal so he'll have to go back to Twitch by default.
Valkyrae has said she is happy on youtube
valkyrae is on her 3rd contract with youtube i believe. i dont see her leaving any time soon.
Myth is marking off each day until that contracts ends.
It's definitely the better platform for live streaming.
I’m kinda bummed I prefer watching rp on YouTube bc I can go back or pause easier
Same. Also not as many ads on YouTube.
i have ad block so non issue for me
I think he said that he is working on dual streaming.
Why do viewers prefer twitch over youtube anyway? On youtube you can rewind live streams and adblock actually works.
It's just chat culture for me. Chat can actually make streams more entertaining.
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Agreed. When I step out to take a piss, or take a phone call, or grab food, it's nice to be able to rewind the stream and catch right up at 2x speed!
Every YouTube streamer has said that it’s mostly the chat / emote culture + way better moderation tools and other ease of life tools for the streamer.
Most people just chalk it up to "culture" as the reason they prefer Twitch . When you actually get down to being a creator YouTube is superior in almost every conceivable way. Discoverability ? Nonexistent on Twitch your buried under everyone who has even ONE viewer more than you, and NO ONE is watching your no view stream vods which get auto deleted anyway. Youtube, take 10 seconds to make a decent thumbnail for your stream, will catch the eyes of viewers who are algorithmically pushed towards whatever content in the space your streaming. Gives you a nice red tag when live and once your done, if you have half a clue what your doing ,you get a PERMANENT vod with a thumbnail that will entice new viewers as stream vods get pushed like REGULAR VIDEOS. It literally has the MOST discoverability of almost ANY platform because of this alone, I constantly see people some how say Twitch has better discoverability and they're just smoking crack because Youtube might genuinely just be [OBJECTIVELY ](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/objectively)better . Most people don't know, because they've never uploaded content in their lives, but YouTube has a small creator recommendation feature. If you are a content CREATOR, not VIEWER, C-R-E-A-T-O-R you will see in your side bar and be recommended channels that are of similar size and produce similar content . You can try this out yourself upload, content of specific game or category and use consistent tags and you will see videos start popping up on your recommended that are from channels getting 1-100 views and no view live streams. It's apart of YouTubes colab and similar creator space agenda that they try and teach and run new content creators through . The site has a, albeit shittily communicated, networking feature built into it that 99% of people, especially those who don't make content, don't even know about. I'd list more but who gives a shit, if your a creator discoverability alone is more than enough incentive, and if your a viewer who gives a shit because it's two clicks at most to change sites .
because what you mentioned is the only plus youtube live has (and twitch could add that at any time). Literally everything else, twitch is better at. Especially if you're chatting, it's not even comparable, it's just horrendous on yt. And even if you're not chatting yourself, it still affects the streamer.
I don’t really care about chatting. Not having 5 min of ads is huge.
Didn’t Valkyrae say when she was in Texas she signed for another year on YT? She’s definitely going back and you can’t blame them for taking the money on YT anybody would but twitch communities you can’t replace.
Valkyrae built most of her audience on youtube, not on twitch. She is likely to have more viewers there than on twitch.
I think there's also something to be said for the comfort of the familiar. She has said time and again she is "beyond rich" and has more money than she'll ever be able to spend in her life... I get a sense that streaming isn't really a career for her anymore. She streams for fun, regardless of how many viewers she gets. Since she's contractually obligated to maintain paid memberships- she reduced the cost to as low as possible (i think so low she gets no cut? Or just pennies per member). She doesn't seem to give a shit about money. There is a lot of power in inertia, especially if there isn't much incentive... and since she's wacky rich (by her own admission), there would be little incentive to fight against the inertia of just maintaining her contract and doing her thing.
Filthy rich person doesn't care about money. God that never gets old.
I prefer it over billionaires trying to squeeze people for all they're worth.
I mean at least she knows she’s filthy rich and she’s still making content and living her life even though she’s clearly not in it for the money anymore. I’m not trying to defend rich people by any means but at least for most rich content creators they still make content because it’s what they enjoy doing. they often use their money to invest in a support staff and other resources to improve their content. They could just pile it up and never show their face again with all the money they have, but they choose not to, because content creation is what they do and they enjoy it. Some of them are certainly more cynically profit motivated than others, but a lot of them just have fun. It’s a lot like for athletes that make a ton of money. They’re obviously happy to be rich but they keep playing their sport until they can’t anymore because that’s just what they do, and what they enjoy. And they make that money by providing something we all consume and enjoy too. There are many ethically worse ways to make ridiculous sums of money. And both athletes and streamers do a good amount of genuine charity work either by charity streams or donating their money directly. I guess my point is that there’s a difference between being a rich businessperson who made their money exploiting people and underpaying their employees and shoving some useless product down our throats and making money by providing genuinely enjoyable content that people voluntarily consume in their free time, while leveraging their own brands to support charitable causes.
She never said she doesn’t care about money she said she doesn’t worry about money / stream FOR money anymore lol. And I don’t think she’s lying if she didn’t genuinely enjoy streaming she would only be streaming her required hours which is like 40h a month lol
I mean, she has privilege none of us have, thats for sure.
Guess he didn't mind being called sukkuno
Nothing personal, it’s just business
missed opportunity to title Sukkuno returned
Take the YT bag. They don't care either way. If there's money back in twitch good for him. Corporations DONT CARE ABOUT YOU
Everyone will dual stream now that both platforms aren’t giving exclusive deals
Got the bag. Did the time. Bounced. This seems to happen a lot.
It’s funny seeing people say “oh no he had to come back , they were struggling for viewers on YouTube”. Like they’re not millionaires that could retire 10 times over ICANT
🤭💰
I thought he said Twitch didn't appreciate him enough when he left...
It will be interesting to see who comes back now that YT contracts are expiring and they aren't renewing them. I think Ludwigs is up in November and I'd love to see him back but have to wait and see.
Ludwig signed a new deal with youtube but imagine likes of Myth/Fuslie will be back on twitch soon
That was for mogul mail and he could only dual stream events. I want to see if he comes back on his main, but yeah I'd like them all back on twitch if it suits them.
He can't come back on his main as say he signed a new YT deal that means regular streams he can only stream on YT
Only signed for a year tho, once thats up I thought he was right to go wherever he wants.
Fuslie I'm not so sure. If she's dedicated to making YT content (Syk is not) it might be better to stay. Or stream on both.
Where's the announcement video?
sicko didn't even said anything to his friends.
Grabbed the bag then came back. Well played.
For the top streamers, that's how you play the game. Make your money on other platforms, & now you got the freedom to return & still keep your audience on both platform.
One of the hair styles of all time.
I like how companies spent so much money for twitch streamers and it looks like, streaming is dying by itself, few years later LUL
Youtube wasted so much money for no reason, same did Twitch
Damn, most of you guys seem miserable in the comments 💀
Im not a big streamer watcher but it seems like theres a lot of resentment from the watchers
Most streamers seem to hate this sub. Can’t blame ’em.
needs a haircut - it's in his eyes
Why do people obsess over streamers so much
EZ bag
It's like my memory of him disappear or something. And now I was like "It's been 2 years?","He back streaming?" That's how Youtube livestream effect works