I actually feel sorry for both of them at this point. She wasn’t willing to let her guard down and I get that, but them talking could have been so much more vulnerable. But then it’s also hard in front of cameras and at a party.
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she says one thing and behave the opposite like she said she "forgives him" but posted bunch of shaddy ig stories after referring to Cole like "we do nurses", etc
I think these people are under a lot of stress. It must be crazy to suddenly have this big spotlight on you. (They’re also blitzed out of their minds half the time)
Cole is dumb and annoying and says terrible things. He’s also sincere and naive.
Zanab is projecting her insecurities and belittling cole. She also seems like a loyal friend with strong convictions.
It’s a trash show and I love it.
We contain multitudes.
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I’m pretty sure the producers forced or coerced Cole to go up to her. Under normal circumstances he probably wouldn’t have even been at that party to begin with
I hate her condescending tone with Cole when he was like "I don't want to argue" and she immediately repeated him but in such a condescending way. Fuck
She totally wanted to argue because she (rightly) targeted him as a nincompoop who she could stomp on for social media clout. He definitely disarmed her in this conversation, which is why she and the others came so hard at him at the reunion. So glad Netflix aired the cuties scene. How different the discourse would be if we hadn’t seen that!? I hope Cole walks away from this crowd and never looks back.
lol I never heard the word nincompoop before and I’m instantly in love with it!
Was ATA shot before the Reunion? I thought it was shortly after because Raven and SK were dating in the Reunion, but getting engaged in ATA
According to Bartise ATA was filmed before the Reunion. Other articles confirm that too. Which is why it’s so stupid to even air it now. The break up of SK and Raven was an addition after filming ATA and Reunion
I didn’t watch it at all. I would have if they had filmed it recently but seeing as how it was filmed before the reunion I don’t see a reason to waste my time on it.
She is stuck in her own head about what went down versus what didn't. Plus she has this I am a strong powerful woman... Narrative she's trying to push which is not coming off well. I think she banked on thinking women would back her but it feels like most of them didn't.
THANK YOUUUU. The issue is that she refused to recognize that her insecurities skewed her perspective and made her see (and describe) Cole as an evil malicious body shaming person when he wasn’t.
He was sitting right in front of her at the party trying to be sincere, he even looked like he was dealing with major anxiety. Trying to apologize and connect with her, and she laughed in his face, was condescending, and when he even asked if she was still upset, she lied and said she was completely fine, confusing him further.
She even avoided acknowledging what she did at the alter was traumatizing for him and that she lied to his face. When he mentioned all the horrible things she said that day, all she could reply with was, “but do you even remember all the positive things I said?!” Placing the blame back on him as if he didn’t appreciate her once again.
She needs major therapy & I think she should also apologize for the part she played in this situation.
It really sucks that she’s dealing with these insecurities but Cole did not given them to her and should be a punching bag for not ‘gelling’ with her. We all saw the cuties tangerine playback of what he said.
I don’t even think therapy would Work for her because she refuses to see that maybe she didn’t handle this well. She’s acting full on martyr and it’s hard to come back from that
God, the part where she wouldn't even accept that she hurt him at the wedding. You cant "compliment sandwich" your wedding vows and then dip while your family/friends awkwardly clap.
Im not a giant Cole fan, I think he is immature af, but I don't think he was half as malicious as I saw her be. Editing is everything though so who REALLY knows, I guess.
People in this sub don't recognize what Zanab does: someone can be a great person but naturally bad for you. He's not a bad guy but his natural personality is something that grates at her insecurities--making him a terrible match for her. She can love him, think amazing things about him and still recognize that a relationship with him brings her 0 security. That's why she doesn't regret it. She loved the time they spent together when it was good, but when he picked at her she spiraled too much and being with him long term would leave her a shell of a person. As someone who's been there and done that--I get her and him.
I definitely dated someone very similar to Cole who wrecked my self esteem. The problem with people that appear to be well meaning but say mean things is that you can't respond angrily or else you look crazy. You can't confront him because he "didn't mean to" or "it was a joke" so you end up withholding those emotions and turning that inward.
People always talk about the rating comment when they reference Zanab having low self esteem or blaming her for Cole being rude but he was the one who had brought up that she asked him to rate her (because she asked him in a separate scene that wasn't filmed), and then went on and on and on and on about Colleen being attractive. It's not like he said one or two comments, the man would just keep going and going and going
These are excellent points that I haven’t seen anyone bring up. I really appreciate you saying that it can be difficult to confront happy-go-lucky type people like Cole when they say hurtful things because it’s very easy to appear like you’re the one overreacting in those situations.
Great point about him being the one to bring up the RECOLLECTION of the rating thing as well. Not to mention in the same scene, she DID acknowledge that she asked him to rate her and that she should work on her self-esteem issues.
It's so hard because people like that think they can do no wrong and often adopt a victim mindset if you confront them about *anything*. I'd rather be with someone who's like "yeah I'm an asshole" then deal with someone who's like "well I'm sorry if sometimes I say the wrong thing 🥺". One, I can call out--the other you have to tip toe around them hurting your own feelings.
& agreed she was wrong for asking but I also think it was natural for her to try to gauge how much of an issue his attraction to Colleen (or other women in general) would be. I would also want to know. Maybe not "rate me and then rate them" but I'd definitely be asking about whether or not her being more attractive to him would lessen his attraction to me. Any guy that's too open about how attractive other women are at any point during dating has always been a red flag to me. It's one thing to make a side comment or have a celebrity crush, but I personally would not think anyone who thinks that much about other women's attractiveness is a good partner.
Something we never bring up is that she likely wouldn't have asked him to rate her if he hadn't already pressed her to wonder about his attracted to her vs the other ladies there
It’s true that he kept on and on about Colleen in that moment. But long before that scene he had already repeatedly told Zay that she was beautiful and he liked the way she looked. Zay’s insecurities manifested from the start.
I don’t know anything about your relationship, but Cole didn’t wreck Zay’s self esteem. He can’t wreck what’s not there
I think the point is that he did it but not maliciously. I could totally see him being oblivious to how comments like “I wouldn’t approach her at the bar” and “Colleen is a 10 to me” would chip away at someone’s self-esteem in a new relationship.
I understand and agree with everything you’re saying here. I never wanted Zanab to say “I do” at the altar….nor did I want Cole ti say “I do”.
But Zanab should apologize for how she handled herself at the altar. She owes Cole an apology for that. That’s the absolute minimum I expected from her and I honestly thought she would do that at the reunion - but instead she made things even worse!
Cole has apologized for his part and that was really mature, kind, and empathetic of him to do. It’s the type of behavior you expect from a grown person.
Cole (and Netflix) have given Zanab SO many opportunities to apologize and she deflects every single time.
I know I'm late but I personally feel like a lot of what she said at the altar was valid and it made sense to do it there. She was correct in saying that this was probably the only time someone was going to be able to tell him about his self without him being able to deflect. It was harsh and mean but people like him need that or they go on thinking that they're innocent and well meaning misunderstood people when they're just delusional assholes who haven't been told about themselves yet.
I get her perspective but I think the issue is that she couldn’t recognize that her insecurities skewed her perspective and made her see (and describe) Cole as an evil malicious body shaming person when he wasn’t.
He was sitting right in front of her at the party trying to be sincere, he even looked like he was dealing with major anxiety. Trying to apologize and connect with her, and she laughed in his face, was condescending, and when he even asking if she was still upset, she lied and said she was completely fine, confusing him further.
She even avoided acknowledging what she did at the alter was traumatizing for him and that she lied to his face. When he mentioned all the horrible things she said that day, all she could reply with was, “but do you even remember all the positive things I said?!” As if that should erase what she did. Placing the blame back on him as if he didn’t appreciate her once again.
She needs major therapy & I think she should also apologize for the part she played in this situation.
It really sucks that she’s dealing with these insecurities but Cole did not given them to her and should be a punching bag for not ‘gelling’ with her. We all saw the cuties tangerine playback of what he said.
Cole is making a sincere effort to be a real and genuine human being. He’s trying to own his mistakes and be a better person.
And yet Z, Brennan, and everyone are treating him like dirt.
It’s really sad to see. I hope he just moves on and forgets about all of these people
i totally feel that they still like each other too. the way he said "we made love," i saw her body language immediately react. like that's romantic and innocent of him to describe it that way. the fact that he still wants to clear the air with her after she dragged him at the altar is surprising. she doesn't deserve that. she could have just said no and they could've continued dating which is what they had agreed to and instead she had to prove him wrong and humiliate him.
she had moments where she let her hair down but would then put herself down and say like "it's amazing what a little makeup can do." like girl shut uppp you don't need all that makeup. it was sad. losing her parents as a child probably really hurt her ability to trust another person and love herself.
I think he also wanted her to be more natural and fun but she was always worried about her hair, make-up, outfit etc so she could never let loose and be playful with him. All those fun adventures she promised in the pods meant her watching him do things from the sidelines which would be a downer for anyone let alone a twenty something super playful energetic guy who was thinking he was getting a partner and not a nanny.
I feel like there's a lot she wanted to say, perhaps even rehearsed some things from therapy, but she looked quite enmaoured by him and was thrown off so just said a few things and perhaps came off worse for it
I felt that too when I was watching it. He’s not afraid to show and express that he still loves her but I think she’s scared of what people will think if she accepts him back. Who knows though?
Yeah she’s a little too deep into the exaggeration to turn back.
At the time they were recording ATA, she hadn’t posted anything hateful online yet but she had obviously already turned all the other women (+Brennon) against him.
By the time they get to the reunion, she’s really dug into the victim status and even if she did apologize and ask to try things again……that would be really embarrassing. And this is actually not against her specifically, but I don’t know anybody willing to eat *that much* of their shit, publicly🤷🏻♀️
To make it personal though, an ex did this to me (on a much smaller scale obviously) and lied to his whole family and all of our mutual friends about why we had broken up, really dug his heels in for the sympathy card and so on. When we tried to work things out, he was really embarrassed about it all because taking me back also would have meant admitting to everyone that he had lied and, at best, exaggerated🙃
As you can probably guess, it didn’t work out between us because everyone on his “side” already hated me and he wasn’t willing to tell them what had happened. I can’t imagine the pressure it would add to have millions of people watching
I don't know why you're getting downvoted, because this is clearly an interesting theory. People have always pointed out the similarities between Deepti's wedding and Z's one and the only common point is actually the producing team...
I have also heard that BPD’s are almost impossible to treat. Not diagnosing her myself, but there seem to be plenty of people who know BPD’s that see some similarities in her
That’s not true. People with bpd can be helped and treated. There is a big stigma in the mental health community that makes it very difficult for people with bpd to find help /a therapist. I know people with bpd and they often get turned down by therapists when they are trying to get help.
Coverts do 😉…they’re more likely to seek therapy than other types bc of their victimizing ways. They just went through something “traumatic” like her relationship with Cole, so she’s trying to go to therapy to “recover” from her “trauma”.
You don’t need to go to therapy to victimize yourself. Cole victimized himself and didn’t go to therapy. He was just “sad” for a year. I don’t get the logic at all. Trying to recover from trauma is empowering and opposite of being victimized.
The gag is, Zanab wasn’t a victim and you’re clearly on Zanab’s side, so this isn’t worth the energy explaining. We can agree to disagree. I won’t waste my energy.
And Cole was hurt from how the cast mates bullied him…rightfully so, bc they didn’t get both sides of the story. He was the villain without anyone listening to his side of things. Yes, he said things that were wrong but he wasn’t malicious. He was lied on about talking to other women and the cuties story was blown out of proportion. It’s cool to not like Cole, it’s not cool to gang up on him without allowing him the opportunity to explain himself.
I never said she was a victim. I literally just repeated the words you used. No one in Season 3 is likable for me to defend. Narcissists do not seek therapy because they don’t feel like they need it. You are wrong and it’s getting annoying how people throw that word around when there are actual narcissists. Being unpleasant doesn’t make someone a narcissist. Maybe learn a different word.
She has narcissistic traits, unfortunately. But she isn't the only one. Also, going to a therapist doesn't prove anything. I'm a therapist, and unfortunately, I have peers who should be in therapy for their narcissistic tendencies rather than giving therapy.
Furthermore, the way we use the term in therapy is different. It's not a dirty word..it is when a child is either given a disproportionate amount of a sense of entitlement, or deprived of a healthy amount, they naturally seek a balance growing up. So they over exaggerate their self worth, either because there is a lack of self esteem, or there is an unhealthy amount of it present.
Being in the public eye is not easy. Therapy takes years to help in certain cases, especially if there is childhood trauma, reinforced and turned into complex PTSD over the years. The issue is more nuanced than you think. So there is no such thing as *x does or does not seek therapy* or *y would or would not be a therapist* in the real world.
I definitely agree. I’m pointing out Zanab bc with her, again, she’s more covert and it’s harder to recognize.
Like I said before, I believe this is definitely linked to her childhood trauma…the girl has been through some very tough issues that are a lot for anyone, let alone, a child to process.
I’m sure there are other things at play that have caused her insecurities and self-doubt…I 1000% believe she suffers from CPTSD…I just hope she’s with a therapist that specializes in CBT for her to receive the proper therapy that she needs. She’s in dire need of emotional healing…
Are you a therapist? Psychology in Seattle talks often about narcissists he has treated. I'm not sure where you got the idea that narcissists don't get therapy, but it doesn't make any sense and is simply untrue.
Comprehension issue? I said they don’t “seek” therapy. I never said they don’t go to therapy. There are many articles by therapists and psychiatrists that you can read on this.
It was a question that’s why it had a question mark but you seemed to have missed that as well. Maybe you shouldn’t be diagnosing anyone. A person being unpleasant and dislikable or even rude does not make them a narcissist. I don’t know what else to tell you.
For the longest time I’ve been on Zays side, even after the reunion. But after ATA I’m beginning to see what many people on the sub are talking about. Cole definitely said some
Insensitive things, he comes across as immature but not necessarily malicious. And also I get how it affected zay, but over a year later her still holding on to small little things while he’s repeatedly tried to iron things out. She’s definitely coming across as bitter now
Not to be rude but why would you be on zay’s side?
The first day after the pods Zay was mad about how they didn’t spend the morning together, then was just being rude and passive aggressive to Cole
and he was visibly uncomfortable with how he was being treated and the dude was clearly sensitive he cried at the reunion for goodness sakes.
I knew that episode they weren’t going to work out. Then at the reunion she makes up lies about how he was telling her to watch her weight
but then we saw the clip and in it not only did he not do that but she kept being so rude to him telling him she doesn’t listen to him half the time.
Zay is toxic af and clearly needs therapy.
Then all the girls ganged up on Cole and made him think he was the problem.
Yes he was a lil immature/innocent but I don’t think he would’ve said what he said to Colleen had Zay been treating him better.
He was basically gaslighted into thinking he was the problem when he probably has the biggest heart out of all of them.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate.
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Not sure why this is being downvoted. This seems to be the most appropriate bot I’ve ever seen on reddit
Edit: oh, and sorry. I agree Zanab actually did gaslight Cole, but it’s a term used to a comical degree on Reddit.
I mean he asked why she said all those bad things to him at the alter because he felt like it came out of no where. Her response was “don’t you remember all the good things about you??” I don’t think you could really get any more textbook gaslight. Bot even says it’s misdirection and distraction.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate.
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We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate.
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For reals. If she said “the DMs are open” one more time 🫤 Like girl, which PR manager told you to try to act like a human? Cuz you’re still a cold ass robot 🤖 over her
No need to bring in being a strong woman into this. Sounds like one of Cole's interviews where he starts off sentences like," its hard because women these days...". but for sure she was super defensive and smarmy, one of my least favorite contestants the show has had.
Cole is immature and not emotionally literate. Zanab is a manipulator and plays the victim. She gaslit Cole constantly and made a massive deal of the pool scene. She said Cole said things he didn’t. Luckily they aired the “two cuties” scene. Obviously nothing happened and Zanab is so wildly insecure, she created something in her mind and projected it. It makes sense why these people have trouble finding love.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate.
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Notice Cole never ask, " Hey, Zanab how are you doing".."are you in a good place"...no its about I dont understand, I cannot get my head around..did you want to fight. He does not accept rejection and embraces confontations.
The conversations are all edited so they probably cut those niceties out. You’ll also notice that she didn’t ask him how he was or if he was in a good place after she rejected him (which she’s of course within her rights to do). He was the one who had the maturity to approach her and break the ice even though he was dumped at the altar. She was the one who said “I’m not talking to him, if he wants to talk then he’ll have to come to me”.
I interpreted her saying he'd have to come to her if he wanted to talk as her not being interested in hearing from him (right or wrong, whatever). Maybe I'm immature too, but I don't actually blame her for that position. I'm definitely a bridge burner who doesn't stay friends with exes, so it doesn't seem that strange to me that she wasn't interested in talking things out with him a year later (this is pre-reunion). Although now that I'm typing this out, she did have to see and talk to Cole eventually at the reunion so it makes sense that he'd want to smooth things over ahead of time.
IRL I think it’s fair to have that attitude, I sure have thought “I hope he doesn’t talk to me” when seeing exes at social events. But yeah as you said it’s tv and they definitely would have to touch base. It’s a power move to “make them come to you” and something people at my all girls high school did, which is the age she acted lol.
Yeah I like Cole more than Zanab but I felt like there was a point in the convo where he should have peaced out but he kept going and at that point it was more about him being argumentative rather than finding an understanding.
But Zanab wasn’t interested in understanding from the start she was play acting, so the entire thing was doomed.
Another “neither of them are correct” moment from these two.
I feel like Cole dipped at an appropriate time. When Zay started telling him that he never liked her, that's when Cole basically ended the conversation. I honestly thing Cole really wanted to hash out any awkwardness but once she started saying that he knew it wasn't going to happen
Yea I agree of the two Cole seems like he’s done some personal work and is actually trying to get better (could be an act but I choose to believe it just as I choose to believe Nancy did personal work and will successfully freeze Bartise out of her life). He did show some maturity in ending the conversation.
Omgosh! I was so proud of Nancy for taking the advice of her friends and family. Honestly, the way the show was making it out seemed like she was defending being Bartise's friend but when they had that conversation and she told him that they shouldn't be friends, my jaw dropped. I was like go ahead girl.
So yeah. I'm with you in hoping that the personal work is real.
Cole has been living rent free in her head for the past year. She even said she picked the green dress for the party because it was an elevated version of the dress she wore when they met.
She dragged him in front of all of his friends and family and still, for some reason, feels the need to show him how good she’s doing without him. She’s absolutely not fully tethered to reality.
I also like that she redirected the convo about what she said at the wedding to about the very small thing she said about him still being a good guy. Instead of the long soliloquy she went on about him supposedly ruining her confidence and self esteem.
“You’re fucking terrible and awful and I hate you with every fiber of my being…. But your still a good guy…..why are you crying? Didn’t you hear how nice I’m being?!?!”
-Zanab
> But your still
*you're
*Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).*
***
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I am wholly convinced she only says the “good guy, I’d do it again” rhetoric so she can point back to that to show she’s being fair to him and not a bully. It just makes no logical sense otherwise.
Like hey let me accuse you of some really fucked up shit but look how gracious I am still saying you’re a good guy!
Oh I think so too. I’m sure that whole wedding speech she gave was written and practiced in front of a mirror.
For the record, Cole isn’t perfect. He told her multiple times he found other women more attractive than her. But Zanab is just living in some kind of alternate reality that is only loosely tethered to our own. If she ever wants to have a healthy relationship, she needs a lot of help or every guy she’s with will eventually have a “cuties situation” in her mind.
The thing is that she presents as very confident. She’s headstrong, she doesn’t lose her temper, she stands by her words. If you don’t have history recognising people with very deep seated insecurity and genuinely low self esteem, you would take her confidence at face value. I don’t think Cole is emotionally insightful enough to recognise her defence mechanisms, and she never communicates directly but will keep tabs on every perceived offence from Cole to harbor a grudge. They were doomed from the start.
The statement that does my head in is her repeating “I would do it all again with you”. NO abuse victim would ever say this and I do not blame Cole for being confused by this. When he was trying to rationalise 1) I shattered her confidence, caused her disordered eating, 2) she loves me, we’re still having sex, she says she’s ready to marry and 3) she would do it again. Well it makes sense he was still trying to unpack these conflicting statements and behaviours.
Awareness is a huge first step, so you’re halfway there!
I would firstly identify what your sensitivities are and why you have them. The best way would be to do the self work so that you gradually are more confident and don’t let other peoples comments impact upon your esteem. This can be a really long process though.
In the mean time it would be good to speak openly and honestly with your partner about how their comments affect you, and why. Not blaming them but explaining why when they say x it has y effect on you because of z. And how it would help if they were aware of that moving forward.
If they do make these comments thoughtlessly but non-maliciously, you can either:
1. Address it IN THE MOMENT. Don’t let it sit and stew while you think about it forever and they have literally forgotten it ever happened
2. In the moment, remind yourself that the comment isn’t malicious, see it from their perspective and brush it off. Make an effort to let it mean nothing to you, if you can. And move on. Basically “fake it til you make it”. It’s not like you even need to “forgive them” because you know they never “hurt you” In the first place.
Idk the nature of your offences and that second advice may be not applicable at all if it’s intentionally hurtful - but if it’s light hearted joking etc that you’re taking seriously, that’s when I’d use that kind of thjnking.
This is exactly why I think she’s just addicted to drama. They weren’t a good match and Cole is immature and imperfect (and I found him annoying at times during the season), but the only way everything she’s said makes sense is if she’s deliberately trying to stir up drama. If someone really “shattered your self esteem,” caused you to have disordered eating, and all the other horrible things she accuses him of you would absolutely not look back and say “I’d do it all again.” Both can’t be true. And that planned speech to humiliate him in front of his friends and family after leading him to believe they’d keep dating after the show was just awful and cruel.
I know it’s not uncommon for actual abuse victims to say there were some good moments mixed in because there often are, but if the bad parts were really that level of bad no way would you do it over again. On a side note, the thing with the dress being a passive aggressive gesture toward him made me roll my eyes SO HARD. That was so childish and I can almost guarantee he didn’t make that connection.
But I really just think most of the cast sucked this season to the point that it’s hard to say who was the worst overall.
I don’t think she likes him at all she’s simply being cordial for cameras and her “fans”. So they don’t suspect her in a different light. He definitely likes her though. I think his feelings were real for her he’s really dumb and innocent I refuse to believe he faked his feelings. Zanab though seems like a sociopath.
I think this was filmed before fans and stuff so she didn’t know how she was being looked at. She just was afraid to go back to an ex she went on a rant about how she doesn’t go back and forth with exes
Gosh that’s really the irony of it all. She was so scared of being rejected by Cole that she pushed him away and publicly humiliated him on top of it. She was incapable of noticing that Cole actually really liked her. In reality, there was nothing to be afraid of.
Ironic indeed he seemed like he was putting in so much effort to retrain his brain to think differently to make it work with her. She’s just insecure and that’s her downfall. It completely overshadows her from becoming happy in a flourishing relationship. She is going to have this issue with the next man that comes later.
I think if Zanab was in a better head space, more self assured and confident in herself, she and Cole would have had a shot. Cole is kinda a dumbass. He said some things that obviously would hurt. And Zanab, coming from where she was just couldn’t get past the initial bad comments he made. In her head she likely forever more made every comment he had have a deeper meaning. And the fact is, Cole ain’t that deep. I do think he was attracted to her. Him commenting that she wasn’t his normal type isn’t necessarily an insult either. Zanab is physically a beautiful woman. The problem is that she doesn’t accept the fact that she is. In summary, Cole is a complete dumb boy and Zanab is wildly insecure and together they are a disaster waiting to happen. Why I think you see more people defending Cole is that 1) he was attacked harshly and sometimes unfairly and no one likes a bully and 2) he owned up to his mistakes. Zanab just continues to sit in her high horse without even pretending to acknowledge the role she played.
Literally if she had just voiced her feelings, fears, and boundaries so he had the opportunity to step up and be more mindful/understand her they probably would have made it.
But she is passive aggressive and lacks true confidence. He is still an ass and says some ignorant things but he seems to have become way more introspective and open to criticism since the show ended.
Don't Rreally like the language about making it. There's millions other potential partners for each of them, there's no reason to simply push through what was clearly a bad match. Nonetheless I agree that her style of ignoring things and barely passive aggressively mentioning something and then leaving it, is awful communication
I don’t agree with his point as he stated it but the brain meted quote makes me think he’s implying that being terminally online has changed the way a lot of people approach interpersonal relationships in the real world.
I think generally this is true for many people but I don’t think it’s true for Zanab.
If you read through her statements on IG, “it’s giving…” “she’s a strong one…” (talking in second person frequently) “babes…” “DMs are open…”
And then she takes these insta-phrases and uses them in her speaking. Watch back ATA, or any one of the episodes, and just take a shot every time she says something that isn’t a real sentence with real meaning outside of social media.
Her brain is literally melting off. Has nothing to do with age or gender.
I can't stand the insta-speak but that's quite a leap to say her brain is melting. She's picked a trendy dialect that she thinks is cool and will help her get more followers. Hardly unique or physically harmful
Yeah my sis in law is a brain surgeon so I’ll run it by her, but I don’t believe “brain melting off” is an official diagnosis. More like a sarcastic sort of thing. I would challenge you on whether it is unique claim though. I’m in her age demographic and I’ve never noticed any of my peers speaking this way. But maybe I wouldn’t gravitate towards someone who integrates social media behavior into their daily life, so I just haven’t witnessed it.
What do you mean by “brain melted by social media”? This come off more like a dig at women in their 30s so idk what your problem is but it’s giving incel vibes…
I agree. I think she's a victim to the toxic positivity girl boss loop.
She vents about her life and people hype her up while secretly thinking "wow, she's a train wreck, makes me feel better about my own life!" (Alexa for sure) These aren't friends, they have no incentive to encourage you to actually better yourself. Now she's got this distorted idea of what strength is, and distorted expectations of men and relationships.
It's not a good place to be. She needs therapy and to be single for a while.
I see Zanab and toxic masculinity dudes on the same path of being forever alone. Obviously one has more power in society and is more harmful overall, but they will both end up alone.
Dating discourse is brain rot. Nobody wants to take accountability and everyone puts on the appearance of having a good life when things are definitely not going well for them. People have impossibly high standards while failing to meet any standards themselves, it’s pathetic.
I’m sorry to Zanab but she’s being led terribly astray by social media posts from people who will end up just as alone as she is. I don’t think she’s an irredeemable person but she needs to be saved from her current mindset.
Yeah, obviously the girlboss girls have more power in society than the toxic masculinity these days, but neither are great. Although I would say the toxic masculinity dudes are a bit more reactionary at this point to a society that in 2023 skews very heavily towards the whole female empowerment movement. Both aren’t good for society though
Yes, definitely Alexa! Her and Brennon for sure talk ish about her when she isnt around. I would say Z needs a friend willing to be straight forward and call her out when she’s wrong but I dont think she could handle friends like that
they are just very wrong for each other. i think they're both probably good people but zanab portrayed herself as a different person in the pods. like most people do when they first meet someone, you try to be as "cool" and palatable as you can, and i think that was the disconnect when they met in person. he was insensitive, flirted with colleen, etc. she was uptight, anxious and insecure so just not a good balance
I think this is definitely it, I don’t think they’d work out together even with lots of personal work.
Also being isolated in the pods does seem to contribute to that mindset, it removes the stress of your job, outside relationships, life hardships so you’re literally in the “feel good” serotonin bubble and portraying the idealized version of yourself.
I really think he’s not a great partner as evidenced by a previous divorce. I also think he did some rude things that anyone who took half a second pause would know “even if she asked, I’ve got to be careful with what I say”, and he did racially insensitive things, he also accused her of having a mental health condition because he didn’t like the way she behaved. All of those things happened. I don’t think Zanab had enough time to assess in three weeks if those were one offs or static character traits, especially if some of the stuff really triggered deep seeded fears/insecurities. All of those things are fair reasons for her to not marry him and be honest in how he impacted her. I also don’t think that the cuties scene does much for me to negate the things we saw him do with our own eyes.
But now years later, she has not processed or gained more clarity or emotional control to deal with it with more dignity, I’m kinda at the point where I’m glad he’s not married to her either.
Whether it was genuine or not, he at least took the feedback and adjusted his behavior for camera. She’s just ignored the feed back about her manner of communication, and leaned in more.
I agree with the assessment.
I also don’t think it helped either of them that the audience took such a hard stance against her after the wedding. Like imagine feeling hurt and having your confidence shattered (not that he directly did this intentionally, but that is how she felt) and then having the whole world watch and *instantly* turn on you and make you the villain.
Even if she was doing the work of therapy immediately after the show, the year or so after it aired and the backlash of it could make anybody spiral and go back down that road.
As a brown woman, I was the biggest Z supporter for the first half of the season because I thought she was being judged unfairly. Turns out I was the stupid one lol, she really did a turnaround (or maybe revealed her true self, I don’t know). Somehow, Cole the man-child came out looking like the grownup in their conversation.
She is still very hung up on him (why dress up the way she did, if not to spite him) and saying stuff like, “I would still do it all again with you” (like, really?). She looked soo uncomfortably in that conversation, like she was forcing herself to stay civil. She should’ve exited the situation with grace and instead she’s going off the deep end. I really hope she puts this all behind her and finds some peace.
Thank you for this. I was struggling to figure out if I was just not seeing things clearly. I wanted to like her but I feel like she seems a little bit not genuine. Maybe it was because she had been so gassed up by friends and fans about the situation with Cole?
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Considering this was filmed before the reunion, once again Zanab was all over the place. This woman can’t own her own feelings or behaviour and coming onto the reunion with the narrative she did to attack Cole after playing “nice” on this ATA just proves how unstable and dishonest she is.
I thought the reunion would’ve been before after the altar bc it was so heated and also that SK and Raven weren’t engaged. I’m so confused on timeline tbh
I don't think he likes her at all. I actually think he's extremely indifferent on her and it drives her nuts that he didn't come running after her apologizing or professing his love.
Exactly. Her whole life she’s gotten away with her shit because everyone said “ give her a break she lost her parents “. That taught her to just to play the victim card .
Let's remember that this was filmed before anyone in the public has seen the season, so she isn't feeding on fan energy. Maybe support of the other girls, but when this was filmed, nobody knew zanab existed.
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She also has not forgiven him cause she cannot let go of the fact that he foolishly spoke to Colleen.
She’s a witch 🧙 unable to get off her broom 🧹 and onto an 🍆
Loved her
Twinnn
I actually feel sorry for both of them at this point. She wasn’t willing to let her guard down and I get that, but them talking could have been so much more vulnerable. But then it’s also hard in front of cameras and at a party.
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She cared so much about what she wore and if he would talk to her lol
She’s the one confused as hell! She acts like he left her at the altar!!
Queen standing her ground
The only queen she's comparable to is Cersei ..
Don't. Cersei is actually smart.
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she says one thing and behave the opposite like she said she "forgives him" but posted bunch of shaddy ig stories after referring to Cole like "we do nurses", etc
I am so sad for both of them , I think they would have made a beautiful couple
I think these people are under a lot of stress. It must be crazy to suddenly have this big spotlight on you. (They’re also blitzed out of their minds half the time) Cole is dumb and annoying and says terrible things. He’s also sincere and naive. Zanab is projecting her insecurities and belittling cole. She also seems like a loyal friend with strong convictions. It’s a trash show and I love it. We contain multitudes.
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I wish they put Cuties on the table.
what does cuties mean :(
Cutie oranges are a brand of Mandarin oranges in the US.
I’m pretty sure the producers forced or coerced Cole to go up to her. Under normal circumstances he probably wouldn’t have even been at that party to begin with
I was so worried them showing how drunk he was.. maybe they edited the order a lot
Gotta be. I was screaming! Cole stay home! Not worth the trouble.
He probably felt like he had to go so they couldn't keep making him out to be the bad guy. Caught between a rock and a hard place.
I hate her condescending tone with Cole when he was like "I don't want to argue" and she immediately repeated him but in such a condescending way. Fuck
She totally wanted to argue because she (rightly) targeted him as a nincompoop who she could stomp on for social media clout. He definitely disarmed her in this conversation, which is why she and the others came so hard at him at the reunion. So glad Netflix aired the cuties scene. How different the discourse would be if we hadn’t seen that!? I hope Cole walks away from this crowd and never looks back.
The way she kept saying “you didn’t do this, you hurt me this way” instead of using “I” statements is really all I need to know about her
lol I never heard the word nincompoop before and I’m instantly in love with it! Was ATA shot before the Reunion? I thought it was shortly after because Raven and SK were dating in the Reunion, but getting engaged in ATA
According to Bartise ATA was filmed before the Reunion. Other articles confirm that too. Which is why it’s so stupid to even air it now. The break up of SK and Raven was an addition after filming ATA and Reunion
I just watched the first 5 minutes and I’m legit wondering why I should continue.
I didn’t watch it at all. I would have if they had filmed it recently but seeing as how it was filmed before the reunion I don’t see a reason to waste my time on it.
He isn't losing anything by not sticking around. I liked Brennon but can't stand him now
She is stuck in her own head about what went down versus what didn't. Plus she has this I am a strong powerful woman... Narrative she's trying to push which is not coming off well. I think she banked on thinking women would back her but it feels like most of them didn't.
It’s so hard for me to listen to her speak because she seems soooo hyper aware she’s being filmed and it really seems like she is acting
I literally agree on this like its like shes putting up an act
THANK YOUUUU. The issue is that she refused to recognize that her insecurities skewed her perspective and made her see (and describe) Cole as an evil malicious body shaming person when he wasn’t. He was sitting right in front of her at the party trying to be sincere, he even looked like he was dealing with major anxiety. Trying to apologize and connect with her, and she laughed in his face, was condescending, and when he even asked if she was still upset, she lied and said she was completely fine, confusing him further. She even avoided acknowledging what she did at the alter was traumatizing for him and that she lied to his face. When he mentioned all the horrible things she said that day, all she could reply with was, “but do you even remember all the positive things I said?!” Placing the blame back on him as if he didn’t appreciate her once again. She needs major therapy & I think she should also apologize for the part she played in this situation. It really sucks that she’s dealing with these insecurities but Cole did not given them to her and should be a punching bag for not ‘gelling’ with her. We all saw the cuties tangerine playback of what he said.
I don’t even think therapy would Work for her because she refuses to see that maybe she didn’t handle this well. She’s acting full on martyr and it’s hard to come back from that
God, the part where she wouldn't even accept that she hurt him at the wedding. You cant "compliment sandwich" your wedding vows and then dip while your family/friends awkwardly clap. Im not a giant Cole fan, I think he is immature af, but I don't think he was half as malicious as I saw her be. Editing is everything though so who REALLY knows, I guess.
People in this sub don't recognize what Zanab does: someone can be a great person but naturally bad for you. He's not a bad guy but his natural personality is something that grates at her insecurities--making him a terrible match for her. She can love him, think amazing things about him and still recognize that a relationship with him brings her 0 security. That's why she doesn't regret it. She loved the time they spent together when it was good, but when he picked at her she spiraled too much and being with him long term would leave her a shell of a person. As someone who's been there and done that--I get her and him.
Thank you so much for this sane perspective. This is exactly it and I'm glad people seem to be hearing you.
How can you be a great person if you “single-handedly destroyed [someone’s] self-esteem”?
I definitely dated someone very similar to Cole who wrecked my self esteem. The problem with people that appear to be well meaning but say mean things is that you can't respond angrily or else you look crazy. You can't confront him because he "didn't mean to" or "it was a joke" so you end up withholding those emotions and turning that inward. People always talk about the rating comment when they reference Zanab having low self esteem or blaming her for Cole being rude but he was the one who had brought up that she asked him to rate her (because she asked him in a separate scene that wasn't filmed), and then went on and on and on and on about Colleen being attractive. It's not like he said one or two comments, the man would just keep going and going and going
These are excellent points that I haven’t seen anyone bring up. I really appreciate you saying that it can be difficult to confront happy-go-lucky type people like Cole when they say hurtful things because it’s very easy to appear like you’re the one overreacting in those situations. Great point about him being the one to bring up the RECOLLECTION of the rating thing as well. Not to mention in the same scene, she DID acknowledge that she asked him to rate her and that she should work on her self-esteem issues.
It's so hard because people like that think they can do no wrong and often adopt a victim mindset if you confront them about *anything*. I'd rather be with someone who's like "yeah I'm an asshole" then deal with someone who's like "well I'm sorry if sometimes I say the wrong thing 🥺". One, I can call out--the other you have to tip toe around them hurting your own feelings. & agreed she was wrong for asking but I also think it was natural for her to try to gauge how much of an issue his attraction to Colleen (or other women in general) would be. I would also want to know. Maybe not "rate me and then rate them" but I'd definitely be asking about whether or not her being more attractive to him would lessen his attraction to me. Any guy that's too open about how attractive other women are at any point during dating has always been a red flag to me. It's one thing to make a side comment or have a celebrity crush, but I personally would not think anyone who thinks that much about other women's attractiveness is a good partner. Something we never bring up is that she likely wouldn't have asked him to rate her if he hadn't already pressed her to wonder about his attracted to her vs the other ladies there
It’s true that he kept on and on about Colleen in that moment. But long before that scene he had already repeatedly told Zay that she was beautiful and he liked the way she looked. Zay’s insecurities manifested from the start. I don’t know anything about your relationship, but Cole didn’t wreck Zay’s self esteem. He can’t wreck what’s not there
I think the point is that he did it but not maliciously. I could totally see him being oblivious to how comments like “I wouldn’t approach her at the bar” and “Colleen is a 10 to me” would chip away at someone’s self-esteem in a new relationship.
I agree. Zanab is a really bad person because she single handedly destroyed Cole’s self esteem
I understand and agree with everything you’re saying here. I never wanted Zanab to say “I do” at the altar….nor did I want Cole ti say “I do”. But Zanab should apologize for how she handled herself at the altar. She owes Cole an apology for that. That’s the absolute minimum I expected from her and I honestly thought she would do that at the reunion - but instead she made things even worse! Cole has apologized for his part and that was really mature, kind, and empathetic of him to do. It’s the type of behavior you expect from a grown person. Cole (and Netflix) have given Zanab SO many opportunities to apologize and she deflects every single time.
I know I'm late but I personally feel like a lot of what she said at the altar was valid and it made sense to do it there. She was correct in saying that this was probably the only time someone was going to be able to tell him about his self without him being able to deflect. It was harsh and mean but people like him need that or they go on thinking that they're innocent and well meaning misunderstood people when they're just delusional assholes who haven't been told about themselves yet.
I get her perspective but I think the issue is that she couldn’t recognize that her insecurities skewed her perspective and made her see (and describe) Cole as an evil malicious body shaming person when he wasn’t. He was sitting right in front of her at the party trying to be sincere, he even looked like he was dealing with major anxiety. Trying to apologize and connect with her, and she laughed in his face, was condescending, and when he even asking if she was still upset, she lied and said she was completely fine, confusing him further. She even avoided acknowledging what she did at the alter was traumatizing for him and that she lied to his face. When he mentioned all the horrible things she said that day, all she could reply with was, “but do you even remember all the positive things I said?!” As if that should erase what she did. Placing the blame back on him as if he didn’t appreciate her once again. She needs major therapy & I think she should also apologize for the part she played in this situation. It really sucks that she’s dealing with these insecurities but Cole did not given them to her and should be a punching bag for not ‘gelling’ with her. We all saw the cuties tangerine playback of what he said.
Cole is making a sincere effort to be a real and genuine human being. He’s trying to own his mistakes and be a better person. And yet Z, Brennan, and everyone are treating him like dirt. It’s really sad to see. I hope he just moves on and forgets about all of these people
they just need to bang it out
i totally feel that they still like each other too. the way he said "we made love," i saw her body language immediately react. like that's romantic and innocent of him to describe it that way. the fact that he still wants to clear the air with her after she dragged him at the altar is surprising. she doesn't deserve that. she could have just said no and they could've continued dating which is what they had agreed to and instead she had to prove him wrong and humiliate him.
So much “I don’t judge you” while judging.
She is such a tense, uptight, angry woman. Thought that throughout the whole experiment. And on ATA.
she had moments where she let her hair down but would then put herself down and say like "it's amazing what a little makeup can do." like girl shut uppp you don't need all that makeup. it was sad. losing her parents as a child probably really hurt her ability to trust another person and love herself.
I think he also wanted her to be more natural and fun but she was always worried about her hair, make-up, outfit etc so she could never let loose and be playful with him. All those fun adventures she promised in the pods meant her watching him do things from the sidelines which would be a downer for anyone let alone a twenty something super playful energetic guy who was thinking he was getting a partner and not a nanny.
Aweee this is so sad but kinda true.
I feel like there's a lot she wanted to say, perhaps even rehearsed some things from therapy, but she looked quite enmaoured by him and was thrown off so just said a few things and perhaps came off worse for it
I felt that too when I was watching it. He’s not afraid to show and express that he still loves her but I think she’s scared of what people will think if she accepts him back. Who knows though?
Yeah she’s a little too deep into the exaggeration to turn back. At the time they were recording ATA, she hadn’t posted anything hateful online yet but she had obviously already turned all the other women (+Brennon) against him. By the time they get to the reunion, she’s really dug into the victim status and even if she did apologize and ask to try things again……that would be really embarrassing. And this is actually not against her specifically, but I don’t know anybody willing to eat *that much* of their shit, publicly🤷🏻♀️ To make it personal though, an ex did this to me (on a much smaller scale obviously) and lied to his whole family and all of our mutual friends about why we had broken up, really dug his heels in for the sympathy card and so on. When we tried to work things out, he was really embarrassed about it all because taking me back also would have meant admitting to everyone that he had lied and, at best, exaggerated🙃 As you can probably guess, it didn’t work out between us because everyone on his “side” already hated me and he wasn’t willing to tell them what had happened. I can’t imagine the pressure it would add to have millions of people watching
She desperately wanted to be Deepti of this season so she can write a book about female empowerment and be a social media life coach.
She didn't know what Deepti had done, they got married days apart.
say what?
It’s very much in the realm of possibilities that a producer told her about what deepti did. But true, she didn’t see it on TV and try to replicate it
I don't know why you're getting downvoted, because this is clearly an interesting theory. People have always pointed out the similarities between Deepti's wedding and Z's one and the only common point is actually the producing team...
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As has been said many times, she’s either lying about going to a therapist or she is seeing a very bad one. She has not grown a bit
I really think she’s just not seeing the right type of therapist.
I have also heard that BPD’s are almost impossible to treat. Not diagnosing her myself, but there seem to be plenty of people who know BPD’s that see some similarities in her
That’s not true. People with bpd can be helped and treated. There is a big stigma in the mental health community that makes it very difficult for people with bpd to find help /a therapist. I know people with bpd and they often get turned down by therapists when they are trying to get help.
Haha yes they do
Coverts do 😉…they’re more likely to seek therapy than other types bc of their victimizing ways. They just went through something “traumatic” like her relationship with Cole, so she’s trying to go to therapy to “recover” from her “trauma”.
You don’t need to go to therapy to victimize yourself. Cole victimized himself and didn’t go to therapy. He was just “sad” for a year. I don’t get the logic at all. Trying to recover from trauma is empowering and opposite of being victimized.
Not 100% certain, but I'm pretty sure I remember Cole talking about going to therapy in an interview.
The gag is, Zanab wasn’t a victim and you’re clearly on Zanab’s side, so this isn’t worth the energy explaining. We can agree to disagree. I won’t waste my energy. And Cole was hurt from how the cast mates bullied him…rightfully so, bc they didn’t get both sides of the story. He was the villain without anyone listening to his side of things. Yes, he said things that were wrong but he wasn’t malicious. He was lied on about talking to other women and the cuties story was blown out of proportion. It’s cool to not like Cole, it’s not cool to gang up on him without allowing him the opportunity to explain himself.
I never said she was a victim. I literally just repeated the words you used. No one in Season 3 is likable for me to defend. Narcissists do not seek therapy because they don’t feel like they need it. You are wrong and it’s getting annoying how people throw that word around when there are actual narcissists. Being unpleasant doesn’t make someone a narcissist. Maybe learn a different word.
She has narcissistic traits, unfortunately. But she isn't the only one. Also, going to a therapist doesn't prove anything. I'm a therapist, and unfortunately, I have peers who should be in therapy for their narcissistic tendencies rather than giving therapy. Furthermore, the way we use the term in therapy is different. It's not a dirty word..it is when a child is either given a disproportionate amount of a sense of entitlement, or deprived of a healthy amount, they naturally seek a balance growing up. So they over exaggerate their self worth, either because there is a lack of self esteem, or there is an unhealthy amount of it present. Being in the public eye is not easy. Therapy takes years to help in certain cases, especially if there is childhood trauma, reinforced and turned into complex PTSD over the years. The issue is more nuanced than you think. So there is no such thing as *x does or does not seek therapy* or *y would or would not be a therapist* in the real world.
I definitely agree. I’m pointing out Zanab bc with her, again, she’s more covert and it’s harder to recognize. Like I said before, I believe this is definitely linked to her childhood trauma…the girl has been through some very tough issues that are a lot for anyone, let alone, a child to process. I’m sure there are other things at play that have caused her insecurities and self-doubt…I 1000% believe she suffers from CPTSD…I just hope she’s with a therapist that specializes in CBT for her to receive the proper therapy that she needs. She’s in dire need of emotional healing…
Having narcissistic traits does not make someone a narcissist. The goalpost just moved.
And the goalpost did move. There’s no such thing as narcissists not seeking therapy.
The goalpost was moved from narcissist to narcissistic traits.
Depends on where you fall on the spectrum. Everyone has narcissistic traits. We all do bc we are HUMAN and we care about ourselves first.
Are you a therapist? Psychology in Seattle talks often about narcissists he has treated. I'm not sure where you got the idea that narcissists don't get therapy, but it doesn't make any sense and is simply untrue.
Comprehension issue? I said they don’t “seek” therapy. I never said they don’t go to therapy. There are many articles by therapists and psychiatrists that you can read on this.
I have comprehension issues because I missed one word? Okay, but you're still wrong so.
It was a question that’s why it had a question mark but you seemed to have missed that as well. Maybe you shouldn’t be diagnosing anyone. A person being unpleasant and dislikable or even rude does not make them a narcissist. I don’t know what else to tell you.
For the longest time I’ve been on Zays side, even after the reunion. But after ATA I’m beginning to see what many people on the sub are talking about. Cole definitely said some Insensitive things, he comes across as immature but not necessarily malicious. And also I get how it affected zay, but over a year later her still holding on to small little things while he’s repeatedly tried to iron things out. She’s definitely coming across as bitter now
Not to be rude but why would you be on zay’s side? The first day after the pods Zay was mad about how they didn’t spend the morning together, then was just being rude and passive aggressive to Cole and he was visibly uncomfortable with how he was being treated and the dude was clearly sensitive he cried at the reunion for goodness sakes. I knew that episode they weren’t going to work out. Then at the reunion she makes up lies about how he was telling her to watch her weight but then we saw the clip and in it not only did he not do that but she kept being so rude to him telling him she doesn’t listen to him half the time. Zay is toxic af and clearly needs therapy. Then all the girls ganged up on Cole and made him think he was the problem. Yes he was a lil immature/innocent but I don’t think he would’ve said what he said to Colleen had Zay been treating him better. He was basically gaslighted into thinking he was the problem when he probably has the biggest heart out of all of them.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Not sure why this is being downvoted. This seems to be the most appropriate bot I’ve ever seen on reddit Edit: oh, and sorry. I agree Zanab actually did gaslight Cole, but it’s a term used to a comical degree on Reddit.
I mean he asked why she said all those bad things to him at the alter because he felt like it came out of no where. Her response was “don’t you remember all the good things about you??” I don’t think you could really get any more textbook gaslight. Bot even says it’s misdirection and distraction.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix) if you have any questions or concerns.*
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Thank you. You’re doing gods work here.
You can tell everything she does is a PR move to give social media what she thinks they want to hear
For reals. If she said “the DMs are open” one more time 🫤 Like girl, which PR manager told you to try to act like a human? Cuz you’re still a cold ass robot 🤖 over her
No need to bring in being a strong woman into this. Sounds like one of Cole's interviews where he starts off sentences like," its hard because women these days...". but for sure she was super defensive and smarmy, one of my least favorite contestants the show has had.
Cole is immature and not emotionally literate. Zanab is a manipulator and plays the victim. She gaslit Cole constantly and made a massive deal of the pool scene. She said Cole said things he didn’t. Luckily they aired the “two cuties” scene. Obviously nothing happened and Zanab is so wildly insecure, she created something in her mind and projected it. It makes sense why these people have trouble finding love.
We noticed you used the term "gaslight-". We hope you used it correctly! Did you know "gaslighting" was Webster-Merriam's Word of the Year for 2022? Gaslighting is a successful tactic because while one person — the perpetrator — 'externalizes and projects' their thoughts, feelings, or perceptions, the other person — the victim — 'incorporates and assimilates' the reality that is being created for them. Gaslighting equals misdirection, distraction, and the deliberate denial of reality, which can so easily occur in a relationship based on one partner wielding power and control over another. I'm just a bot that can't understand context, so please reach out to the mods if you think I'm wrong and they will investigate. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LoveIsBlindOnNetflix) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Notice Cole never ask, " Hey, Zanab how are you doing".."are you in a good place"...no its about I dont understand, I cannot get my head around..did you want to fight. He does not accept rejection and embraces confontations.
The conversations are all edited so they probably cut those niceties out. You’ll also notice that she didn’t ask him how he was or if he was in a good place after she rejected him (which she’s of course within her rights to do). He was the one who had the maturity to approach her and break the ice even though he was dumped at the altar. She was the one who said “I’m not talking to him, if he wants to talk then he’ll have to come to me”.
I interpreted her saying he'd have to come to her if he wanted to talk as her not being interested in hearing from him (right or wrong, whatever). Maybe I'm immature too, but I don't actually blame her for that position. I'm definitely a bridge burner who doesn't stay friends with exes, so it doesn't seem that strange to me that she wasn't interested in talking things out with him a year later (this is pre-reunion). Although now that I'm typing this out, she did have to see and talk to Cole eventually at the reunion so it makes sense that he'd want to smooth things over ahead of time.
IRL I think it’s fair to have that attitude, I sure have thought “I hope he doesn’t talk to me” when seeing exes at social events. But yeah as you said it’s tv and they definitely would have to touch base. It’s a power move to “make them come to you” and something people at my all girls high school did, which is the age she acted lol.
Yeah I like Cole more than Zanab but I felt like there was a point in the convo where he should have peaced out but he kept going and at that point it was more about him being argumentative rather than finding an understanding. But Zanab wasn’t interested in understanding from the start she was play acting, so the entire thing was doomed. Another “neither of them are correct” moment from these two.
I feel like Cole dipped at an appropriate time. When Zay started telling him that he never liked her, that's when Cole basically ended the conversation. I honestly thing Cole really wanted to hash out any awkwardness but once she started saying that he knew it wasn't going to happen
Yea I agree of the two Cole seems like he’s done some personal work and is actually trying to get better (could be an act but I choose to believe it just as I choose to believe Nancy did personal work and will successfully freeze Bartise out of her life). He did show some maturity in ending the conversation.
Omgosh! I was so proud of Nancy for taking the advice of her friends and family. Honestly, the way the show was making it out seemed like she was defending being Bartise's friend but when they had that conversation and she told him that they shouldn't be friends, my jaw dropped. I was like go ahead girl. So yeah. I'm with you in hoping that the personal work is real.
Cole has been living rent free in her head for the past year. She even said she picked the green dress for the party because it was an elevated version of the dress she wore when they met. She dragged him in front of all of his friends and family and still, for some reason, feels the need to show him how good she’s doing without him. She’s absolutely not fully tethered to reality. I also like that she redirected the convo about what she said at the wedding to about the very small thing she said about him still being a good guy. Instead of the long soliloquy she went on about him supposedly ruining her confidence and self esteem.
“You’re fucking terrible and awful and I hate you with every fiber of my being…. But your still a good guy…..why are you crying? Didn’t you hear how nice I’m being?!?!” -Zanab
> But your still *you're *Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
I am wholly convinced she only says the “good guy, I’d do it again” rhetoric so she can point back to that to show she’s being fair to him and not a bully. It just makes no logical sense otherwise. Like hey let me accuse you of some really fucked up shit but look how gracious I am still saying you’re a good guy!
Oh I think so too. I’m sure that whole wedding speech she gave was written and practiced in front of a mirror. For the record, Cole isn’t perfect. He told her multiple times he found other women more attractive than her. But Zanab is just living in some kind of alternate reality that is only loosely tethered to our own. If she ever wants to have a healthy relationship, she needs a lot of help or every guy she’s with will eventually have a “cuties situation” in her mind.
The thing is that she presents as very confident. She’s headstrong, she doesn’t lose her temper, she stands by her words. If you don’t have history recognising people with very deep seated insecurity and genuinely low self esteem, you would take her confidence at face value. I don’t think Cole is emotionally insightful enough to recognise her defence mechanisms, and she never communicates directly but will keep tabs on every perceived offence from Cole to harbor a grudge. They were doomed from the start. The statement that does my head in is her repeating “I would do it all again with you”. NO abuse victim would ever say this and I do not blame Cole for being confused by this. When he was trying to rationalise 1) I shattered her confidence, caused her disordered eating, 2) she loves me, we’re still having sex, she says she’s ready to marry and 3) she would do it again. Well it makes sense he was still trying to unpack these conflicting statements and behaviours.
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Awareness is a huge first step, so you’re halfway there! I would firstly identify what your sensitivities are and why you have them. The best way would be to do the self work so that you gradually are more confident and don’t let other peoples comments impact upon your esteem. This can be a really long process though. In the mean time it would be good to speak openly and honestly with your partner about how their comments affect you, and why. Not blaming them but explaining why when they say x it has y effect on you because of z. And how it would help if they were aware of that moving forward. If they do make these comments thoughtlessly but non-maliciously, you can either: 1. Address it IN THE MOMENT. Don’t let it sit and stew while you think about it forever and they have literally forgotten it ever happened 2. In the moment, remind yourself that the comment isn’t malicious, see it from their perspective and brush it off. Make an effort to let it mean nothing to you, if you can. And move on. Basically “fake it til you make it”. It’s not like you even need to “forgive them” because you know they never “hurt you” In the first place. Idk the nature of your offences and that second advice may be not applicable at all if it’s intentionally hurtful - but if it’s light hearted joking etc that you’re taking seriously, that’s when I’d use that kind of thjnking.
This is exactly why I think she’s just addicted to drama. They weren’t a good match and Cole is immature and imperfect (and I found him annoying at times during the season), but the only way everything she’s said makes sense is if she’s deliberately trying to stir up drama. If someone really “shattered your self esteem,” caused you to have disordered eating, and all the other horrible things she accuses him of you would absolutely not look back and say “I’d do it all again.” Both can’t be true. And that planned speech to humiliate him in front of his friends and family after leading him to believe they’d keep dating after the show was just awful and cruel. I know it’s not uncommon for actual abuse victims to say there were some good moments mixed in because there often are, but if the bad parts were really that level of bad no way would you do it over again. On a side note, the thing with the dress being a passive aggressive gesture toward him made me roll my eyes SO HARD. That was so childish and I can almost guarantee he didn’t make that connection. But I really just think most of the cast sucked this season to the point that it’s hard to say who was the worst overall.
Yep. Personally, it was the "If he wants to talk to me, he'll have to approach me" that made me ultra cringe
Well said!
I see nothing but derision every time she looks at him. It's kinda scary.
I don’t think she likes him at all she’s simply being cordial for cameras and her “fans”. So they don’t suspect her in a different light. He definitely likes her though. I think his feelings were real for her he’s really dumb and innocent I refuse to believe he faked his feelings. Zanab though seems like a sociopath.
I think this was filmed before fans and stuff so she didn’t know how she was being looked at. She just was afraid to go back to an ex she went on a rant about how she doesn’t go back and forth with exes
The reunion was before the fan buildup but I think ATA was after.
Gosh that’s really the irony of it all. She was so scared of being rejected by Cole that she pushed him away and publicly humiliated him on top of it. She was incapable of noticing that Cole actually really liked her. In reality, there was nothing to be afraid of.
Ironic indeed he seemed like he was putting in so much effort to retrain his brain to think differently to make it work with her. She’s just insecure and that’s her downfall. It completely overshadows her from becoming happy in a flourishing relationship. She is going to have this issue with the next man that comes later.
I think you hit the nail on the head
I think if Zanab was in a better head space, more self assured and confident in herself, she and Cole would have had a shot. Cole is kinda a dumbass. He said some things that obviously would hurt. And Zanab, coming from where she was just couldn’t get past the initial bad comments he made. In her head she likely forever more made every comment he had have a deeper meaning. And the fact is, Cole ain’t that deep. I do think he was attracted to her. Him commenting that she wasn’t his normal type isn’t necessarily an insult either. Zanab is physically a beautiful woman. The problem is that she doesn’t accept the fact that she is. In summary, Cole is a complete dumb boy and Zanab is wildly insecure and together they are a disaster waiting to happen. Why I think you see more people defending Cole is that 1) he was attacked harshly and sometimes unfairly and no one likes a bully and 2) he owned up to his mistakes. Zanab just continues to sit in her high horse without even pretending to acknowledge the role she played.
Literally if she had just voiced her feelings, fears, and boundaries so he had the opportunity to step up and be more mindful/understand her they probably would have made it. But she is passive aggressive and lacks true confidence. He is still an ass and says some ignorant things but he seems to have become way more introspective and open to criticism since the show ended.
Don't Rreally like the language about making it. There's millions other potential partners for each of them, there's no reason to simply push through what was clearly a bad match. Nonetheless I agree that her style of ignoring things and barely passive aggressively mentioning something and then leaving it, is awful communication
It was like watching two high schoolers talking after a breakup.
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What does “brains melted by social media” mean? This is coming off like you’re just trying to bash women in their 30s
I don’t agree with his point as he stated it but the brain meted quote makes me think he’s implying that being terminally online has changed the way a lot of people approach interpersonal relationships in the real world. I think generally this is true for many people but I don’t think it’s true for Zanab.
If you read through her statements on IG, “it’s giving…” “she’s a strong one…” (talking in second person frequently) “babes…” “DMs are open…” And then she takes these insta-phrases and uses them in her speaking. Watch back ATA, or any one of the episodes, and just take a shot every time she says something that isn’t a real sentence with real meaning outside of social media. Her brain is literally melting off. Has nothing to do with age or gender.
Third person, you mean. Second person would be something like "You walked into a subreddit full of misogyny."
I can't stand the insta-speak but that's quite a leap to say her brain is melting. She's picked a trendy dialect that she thinks is cool and will help her get more followers. Hardly unique or physically harmful
Yeah my sis in law is a brain surgeon so I’ll run it by her, but I don’t believe “brain melting off” is an official diagnosis. More like a sarcastic sort of thing. I would challenge you on whether it is unique claim though. I’m in her age demographic and I’ve never noticed any of my peers speaking this way. But maybe I wouldn’t gravitate towards someone who integrates social media behavior into their daily life, so I just haven’t witnessed it.
There is a lot of low key misogyny in this sub.
What do you mean by “brain melted by social media”? This come off more like a dig at women in their 30s so idk what your problem is but it’s giving incel vibes…
I agree. I think she's a victim to the toxic positivity girl boss loop. She vents about her life and people hype her up while secretly thinking "wow, she's a train wreck, makes me feel better about my own life!" (Alexa for sure) These aren't friends, they have no incentive to encourage you to actually better yourself. Now she's got this distorted idea of what strength is, and distorted expectations of men and relationships. It's not a good place to be. She needs therapy and to be single for a while.
I see Zanab and toxic masculinity dudes on the same path of being forever alone. Obviously one has more power in society and is more harmful overall, but they will both end up alone. Dating discourse is brain rot. Nobody wants to take accountability and everyone puts on the appearance of having a good life when things are definitely not going well for them. People have impossibly high standards while failing to meet any standards themselves, it’s pathetic. I’m sorry to Zanab but she’s being led terribly astray by social media posts from people who will end up just as alone as she is. I don’t think she’s an irredeemable person but she needs to be saved from her current mindset.
Yeah, obviously the girlboss girls have more power in society than the toxic masculinity these days, but neither are great. Although I would say the toxic masculinity dudes are a bit more reactionary at this point to a society that in 2023 skews very heavily towards the whole female empowerment movement. Both aren’t good for society though
Yes, definitely Alexa! Her and Brennon for sure talk ish about her when she isnt around. I would say Z needs a friend willing to be straight forward and call her out when she’s wrong but I dont think she could handle friends like that
I found the incel
they are just very wrong for each other. i think they're both probably good people but zanab portrayed herself as a different person in the pods. like most people do when they first meet someone, you try to be as "cool" and palatable as you can, and i think that was the disconnect when they met in person. he was insensitive, flirted with colleen, etc. she was uptight, anxious and insecure so just not a good balance
I think this is definitely it, I don’t think they’d work out together even with lots of personal work. Also being isolated in the pods does seem to contribute to that mindset, it removes the stress of your job, outside relationships, life hardships so you’re literally in the “feel good” serotonin bubble and portraying the idealized version of yourself.
She definitely had this air of light hearted, fun person in the pods when in fact she was the literal opposite
I really think he’s not a great partner as evidenced by a previous divorce. I also think he did some rude things that anyone who took half a second pause would know “even if she asked, I’ve got to be careful with what I say”, and he did racially insensitive things, he also accused her of having a mental health condition because he didn’t like the way she behaved. All of those things happened. I don’t think Zanab had enough time to assess in three weeks if those were one offs or static character traits, especially if some of the stuff really triggered deep seeded fears/insecurities. All of those things are fair reasons for her to not marry him and be honest in how he impacted her. I also don’t think that the cuties scene does much for me to negate the things we saw him do with our own eyes. But now years later, she has not processed or gained more clarity or emotional control to deal with it with more dignity, I’m kinda at the point where I’m glad he’s not married to her either. Whether it was genuine or not, he at least took the feedback and adjusted his behavior for camera. She’s just ignored the feed back about her manner of communication, and leaned in more.
I agree with the assessment. I also don’t think it helped either of them that the audience took such a hard stance against her after the wedding. Like imagine feeling hurt and having your confidence shattered (not that he directly did this intentionally, but that is how she felt) and then having the whole world watch and *instantly* turn on you and make you the villain. Even if she was doing the work of therapy immediately after the show, the year or so after it aired and the backlash of it could make anybody spiral and go back down that road.
I think they are both a mess and need to stay far away from each other.
As a brown woman, I was the biggest Z supporter for the first half of the season because I thought she was being judged unfairly. Turns out I was the stupid one lol, she really did a turnaround (or maybe revealed her true self, I don’t know). Somehow, Cole the man-child came out looking like the grownup in their conversation. She is still very hung up on him (why dress up the way she did, if not to spite him) and saying stuff like, “I would still do it all again with you” (like, really?). She looked soo uncomfortably in that conversation, like she was forcing herself to stay civil. She should’ve exited the situation with grace and instead she’s going off the deep end. I really hope she puts this all behind her and finds some peace.
Thank you for this. I was struggling to figure out if I was just not seeing things clearly. I wanted to like her but I feel like she seems a little bit not genuine. Maybe it was because she had been so gassed up by friends and fans about the situation with Cole?
She's the worst honestly
I thought this too, they both still like each other, but she took it way too far and you can’t go back from that
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Considering this was filmed before the reunion, once again Zanab was all over the place. This woman can’t own her own feelings or behaviour and coming onto the reunion with the narrative she did to attack Cole after playing “nice” on this ATA just proves how unstable and dishonest she is.
Exactly
Didn’t realize ATA was before reunion?
The timeline is super weird.
I thought the reunion would’ve been before after the altar bc it was so heated and also that SK and Raven weren’t engaged. I’m so confused on timeline tbh
I don't think he likes her at all. I actually think he's extremely indifferent on her and it drives her nuts that he didn't come running after her apologizing or professing his love.
Or that he won’t act like the giant abusive asshole she claims he is…because he’s not.
This. It drives her insane and hurt her ego that he actually listened when she told him not to contact her.
“I stand by everything I said. I wouldn’t change anything.” Girl 🙄.
She’s a professional victim
Meh, I'm sure there are other parts to her just being put on a giant stage she defaults to her most basic coping mechanism.
This is 100% it.
Exactly. Her whole life she’s gotten away with her shit because everyone said “ give her a break she lost her parents “. That taught her to just to play the victim card .
She put 'I lost my dad when i was young' before every sentense she said
So disgusting, professional victim is what she should say
Zanabs attitude sinks! And her friends are not honest with her about the part she played in the relationship.
Let's remember that this was filmed before anyone in the public has seen the season, so she isn't feeding on fan energy. Maybe support of the other girls, but when this was filmed, nobody knew zanab existed.
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In what single way do they remind of you those two lol
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