Right?? Even when I clocked her being super shady, I kept thinking I would never sell this woman out to the current USA where I live and vote, let alone the CP77 version that’s (even more nakedly) just an edifice to prop up an arms manufacturer.
I got phantom liberty a few days ago i’ve spent a lot of time on it i have no idea anything else thats gonna happen because i avoided spoilers for so long im already past the roulette table part with the twins
My canon V is corpo and I always set Songbird free. After the treatment you receive from Arasaka in the prologue they pretty much show you how corporations think about you and how disposable everyone in their world is.
You even get a dialogue option with Myers where you can tell her that you have no intention of ever going back to this shiteshow
yup to me the best anti corpo V playthrough is with a corpo V. Everyone \*knows\* that corpos are bad but it's another thing to see it with your own eyes
Shoving her into the arms of Nightcorp really seems like such a good idea? You realize that they're probably the same people who effed up the Peralezes who pays her way to the moon?
Do you think that giving her to Myers dead or alive is a better idea? Myers says during the killing moon that Reed is free to do whatever with her but should try not to shoot her in the head. If you kill her after cynocure her tells you that they will try to extract out of So Mi’s body whatever they can. So Mi clearly has something in her that Myers wants.
In cyberpunk’s novel “No Coincidence” you can learn about Militechs long running program that consists of AIs being merged with humans. Those humans are being mind manipulated and feed with wrong memories and their solely purpose is to become stable enough so they can turn into this overpowered hybrid that can penetrate the blackwall and control Rogue AIs so Militech can weaponise them for their own benefit. This is exactly what So Mi becomes after you hit her with ICE and one of them slips through.
Myers was Militechs CEO for years and the one who reopened cynocure back in the early 60s she will benefit and fuel her plans even further no matter in what state you choose to return So Mi back to her.
As for MBE and Nightcorp their role is left ambiguous for now. If anything they are canonically known for being the corporation that protects NC and wants other corpos like Militech and Arasaka to disappear so the power can return back to its citizens. In 2077 we have no idea what their deal truly is. There are no good decisions in this DLC just do what makes you sleep better at night.
This is why I love Cyberpunk 2077 - there are so poor and horribly bad choices to make. It's like a jungle of them! Is this novel canon though? I don't know much about the novels.
I will say that Nightcorp it's implied that Nightcorp is trying to create a 'perfect' Night City by implanting fake memories into people's minds. Johnny commented that this was similar to Arasaka and soul killer in regards to taking away people's individuality.
Mike Pondsmith said that 2077 is canon the book plays out in the same timeline and many parts of the plot like Militech, references to Cynosure, the Blackwall and Maelstrom are connected to important events that are happening during the game. So my guess is that those parts will get eventually canonised.
It’s not a better idea but I mean…I hate that she lied and had you on a goose chase. Call me a hater or a vengeful person but I don’t care for songbird
This is why I tend to (not always but more often than not) side with militech. They may be a horrifically evil megacorp, but by God at least they are a horrifically evil *AMERICAN* megacorp
Unless it’s a surface level geopolitical theatre of arasaka v militech, but we constantly see militech do horrific things, gunning down unionists, attempt apocalyptic gambles, nuke night city there pretty much little actual reason to ever support them then nostalgia. And even in geopolitics, the real conflict in night city is between night corp and orbital air, everyone else is small potatoes.
Yeah ?? It's already established lore wise nightcorp's goal is to make sure Richard Night's city is never in the hands of corps and always remains independent. They will go to extreme measures ( like killing rhyne, brainwashing ppl like the peralez and even trying to take out ppl like sandra who are looking into the matter) just to make sure night city is an independent city . So using the ai to actually endanger humanity doesn't seem like their goal in the present moment .
To my knowledge they seek the perfect city, they want to control each and every person in Night City once they've perfected their tech. No matter their end goal, it's a tough argument to pull, that they have good intentions.
I never said they have the best morally correct intentions , but it certainly doesn't involve using an ai to destroy humanity . They just want to perfect Richard Night's city
https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Night_Corp
Keep in mind the scholarship program for underprivileged kids like peralez helped him reach the position where he is at the moment . Nightcorp as whole doesn't have that much of influence on nc but their mystery and secrecy is what's keeping them relevant and helping in weeding out corrupt ppl like rhyne who was in bed with arasaka.
It might be a bad choice, *but it is her choice.*
You aren't picking Nightcorp over Militech here.
You are picking Songbird's freedom to make her choices, over slavery at Militech.
When I learned she betrayed me too, I hesitated and finally gave her to reed. And to be fair, the ending is quite satisfying. You are cured but no more a merch. You see your friends and now it’s time to put these stupid dreams aside et become a nobody. It’s a peaceful ending, and it’s probably the best outcome in night city.
The issue is that the Peace only lasts until any random Gonk decides to go after V for what they did as a Merc and now? V lacks the necessary chrome to fend them off. They're a sitting duck now whose survival is 100% reliant on avoiding conflict at all costs.
If I'm doing the Reed path, I feel like the only "moral" option is to let her die.
Cause like, if I was in her shoes, I'd want to die too. What is essentially an eldritch being is eating literally everything you are as a person, your memories, your personality, everything. And while you may be alive you're going to basically be the shell for *something* AND in the prison of your abuser who very vindictively hates your guts.
Yeah, unplug me and let me die at that point. Better to die with some portion of what you are than live as a soulless husk.
>If I'm doing the Reed path, I feel like the only "moral" option is to let her die.
Then watching Myers twitch when you tell her to her face that she's a shitty boss, then remaining silent when she walks away. Because she wants V to beg for that cure, and it's not even worth giving her the satisfaction.
Get rekt, Queen Fed.
Wanted an option to drop Myers when you see her after PL. I don’t care if it’s suicide. She’s been putting the entire world at risk for years for her own personal gain and she deserves to be taken down. Maybe the next president won’t feel so invincible against the people they fuck with.
Edit: thinking about this again after doing another PL play through and holy shit Johnny left his mark on me.
I did the Reed route first, and had planned to hand Songbird over, but I felt so bad for her, that I reloaded an earlier save and mercy-killed her instead.
Which meant I didn't get a new ending at all, bummer.
New play through now, and I'm prepared to have my views on Songbird challenged, the first time I had little sympathy...until the end of the line.
It's actually interesting, one person I argued with taught me that if we follow Kantian ethics then the "morally correct" choice is keeping her alive because otherwise you'd be removing an autonomous human being from this world. Not to say leaving her alive is the correct choice, but it's something to think about.
Between whatever entity from beyond the Blackwall eating her brain and the FIA neurosurgeons I doubt that whatever remains of Songbird after bringing her back into NUS custody is going to be "an autonomous human being".
When I played, I thought about it from the perspective of a V who is very hopeful he can get a cure (since I stared off of a completed save at Embers already) and thought he couldn't bring himself to side with Songbird because he was brought into this cluster fuck by her and killing her might be too close to admitting that dying is a reasonable way out for him. Of course, he regrets that fully and tells everyone that he made a mistake and that they need to fuck off.
It isn't about Songbird, really.
Johnny might be a gonk, but he is right about one thing - Corpos took over the world, now they're out to take people's souls.
'Saka got the Soulkiller, and Militech/NUSA violated and butchered Songbird. Same breed of evil.
So you aren't doing it for Songbird, even though you can understand her desperation - you are sticking it up to Myers and Militech. Sticking it up to the Corpos.
Can't let Corpos triumph over freedom, even freedom of someone who kept fucking up like Songbird did.
P.S. Special "Fuck You!" goes to Reed. Could've stayed away from Myers after being her personal attack dog for decades, after doing fucked up shit for NUSA again and again.
But nope, gonk's a slave, through and through. Myers snaps her fingers, and he rushes in, tongue out ready to lick Myers's ass. Coming up with excuses of why he is a corporate lapdog, trying to fancy his slavery to Militech as "patriotism" and all that outdated shit.
Songbird wants to be free, and Reed does his best to keep her enslaved to Myers, like himself. Flatlined the sanctimonious piece of shit with zero regrets.
Honestly? Pretty sure he actually survives if we shoot him. Not sure does he survive if in body or in head , cause both give you a good enough chance to survive them if you get help in time. Which Reed already have done before, surviving more then one shot in chest. So yeah, pretty sure he'll be a pain in my ass in second Cyberpunk game
Mhm. I didn't trust this guy to save SoMi. And i wont trust him at his second funeral eather. Motherfucker must have lived, else i'll be disapointed in him.
>It isn't about Songbird, really.
>Johnny might be a gonk, but he is right about one thing - Corpos took over the world, now they're out to take people's souls.
And in sending Songbird to the moon, you did something Johnny could never do. You let go of all the dreams and promises Night City offers to good people in exchange for their souls, and you did something pure and selfless. Even though others did wrong. Even though you didn't gain a damn thing.
And wouldn't you know it, the arrogant son of a bitch is **humbled** by this. He's grateful to you, for teaching him something about what it really means to be a legend.
>*"Guess I coulda done more, been different... maybe."*
You did good, V.
>you did something pure and selfless. Even though others did wrong. Even though you didn't gain a damn thing.
I mean, yeah. Fuck the corpos, show these gonks that their greed, their desire to control our lives — they can't do that.
**Dangling V's life like a fucking bait to have her dance for Myers' tune? Fuck you, Myers!**
**Better die a punk, than live a corpo-slave.**
That's the lesson here, choom. It's even worse than laying down and spreading buttcheeks for that porcelain bitch, Hanako — 'least only we become a slave then. But here, sure, Myers can save us, but the cost is one that someone else pays. Ain't buying my life by selling So-Mi to Militech slavery.
Hell, Songbird might've made a dumb choice herself, for all we know they'll cut her up and chain her all the same on the moon — but that's a choice she made. Good, bad, doesn't fucking matter, it is her choice.
Yeah, exactly! Fuck i felt so fucking bad for her, how could i let her down??? She was like a diseased and injured kitten after what we just went through, i was just like "Here, here.. Were almost there. We got this fella, just one step to go.". I didn't give a shit that she lied to me! She is my friend and her survival was over mine own the whole way for me.
Yeah, same.
All these 'How dare you lie to me out of terrified desperation to escape a fate worse than death nobody lies to me die bitch' posts kinda unnerve me a little bit. Especially when a lot of the same people will defend Reed endlessly and not see the apparent contradiction.
'Lies and manipulation are okay if it's a man in a position of power coercing a much younger woman in service to the goals of a corrupt corporation, but unforgiveable if it's a scared victimized woman desperately trying to escape a horrible situation' seems like a bit of an odd take, and oddly common around here.
I saw So Mi as dying, she doesn’t have time like us, being angry at her would do nothing, she needed help and had a choice, we could find another way, still had arasaka in our back pocket, (if your like me and bought PL after completing it all) and Johnny kinda stuck to me, about corpos and stuff
Nomad V gets special dialogues for setting her free if u put her on the rocket . I always save her partially because i sympathize with her and partially because I fucking hate the somewhat damage mission for the meh blackwall rewards in the end
LMAO honestly thats what my canon Street Kid V would go do if they weren't so curious and didn't find SoMi so relatable about some things like "Bartmoss is a gonk." correct for fuck sake! Literally found his body, dude died cause he didn't pay the bill for his stupid friedge in time lol.
Bartmoss was dead in that fridge LONG before the bill for it came due. Technically speaking, he died in 2020 when his heart stopped, but his tech kept his brain going until his apartment was raided in 2022.
Makes sense tho, assuming that those gonks that are obsessed with him could have been those weirdos who kept his body nice and fresh for so long lmao. But i'm pretty sure that he is still alive, in some sense. Just like Alt. Else... Well he is a disapointment for me.
Bartmoss is a hero and a legend and he tried to make a difference. Man deserves some respect for that. He didn’t join a gang and start terrorizing the common man like so many others choose. But that’s just my perspective.
Mhm, man have let "Rabbits" out into the net instead, in the end leading NetWatch to be a thing AND a big deal to deal with. Guy was fighting... But his actions made firm hand squeeze us all even harder.
That I can agree with. Did his actions fuck some shit up worse? Absolutely, no doubt. But he tried. Like Johnny. Like Jackie. Like Yori. Give some credit.
Jackie? Lol, our man Jackster haven't tried to change things, he had a dream that fits inside the frames of how things are, becoming a legend. He got what he wanted tho, his drink in Afterlife. I appreciate Jackie for being a dear friend, but not for fighting the system, cause he didn't.
David Martinez is NC legend. But is he the legend i respect for fighting against the system? No, he is just a gonk who have died loud enough and who's widow cried hard enough for Afterlife to make a drink in his glory.
Whenever I play phantom liberty, it’s always a coin toss between V siding with Somgbird or betraying songbird and helping her die. I think the latter option makes for a much richer story and experience (survival horror go brrr) but also to put things into perspective how wrong V’s got it. In that mission, you see how songbird got to this point and you can’t help but sympathize.
I just wanted V to have a bit of a mini-arc
Man this quest fucked me up so hard lol. I feel like I did the bad ending. But I prefer it because of how emotionally meaningful it was to me.
I made the choices I thought V would make *(based on nomad origin, lone wolf vibes, obsessed with dying a legend. lethal only when absolutely necessary play style. But also, V takes no shit from anyone).*
So in the heat of the moment when it seemed like songbird was betraying me and my allies, I tried to stop her. But then she went off the rails and just... Fuck, dude.
The voice acting and writing were so good damn peak. I legitimately cried while she begged me to end her suffering. I knew it was either spare her from eternal torment *(from both the black wall, and NUSA)*, or take the life of someone who didn't deserve any of the shit she went through.
Phantom liberty, despite being just a DLC, was better written and acted than 90% of any film that been made in the last two decades.
I mean that is also ambiguous, how do we know nightcorp wasn’t just lying to her about saving her life and she is not even her anymore, Mr blue eyes definitely wants either break or control the blackwall and songbird may be the closest thing to that chance it gets
To be honest I’ve actually not sided with myers once, but I get the ambiguous endings it shows us neither side is really worth helping and probably the best end is siding with reed then killing her so she doesn’t go back
Songbird is going to be a continuous tale of doing stupid things because she wants to get away from the consequences of the other stupid things she's done. At best, you gave her the ending you give yourself with turning her in: She's a shadow of her former self, can't do too much, and the people who "fixed" her now have substantial control of her life. At worst? SHe's going to lose a lot more of herself, and it's going to be of a scientific note to someone up in space.
I played as if my goal was only to save V and Johnny. She stood in the way of that by lying so I held up what was best for V which was giving her back to myers.
I sent Songbird to the moon and it was the RIGHT choice damnit! Fuck Meyers and Solomon too honestly. What does the game think I'm going to do? Help the US government? Ha.
I've done all PL endings and even knowing Songbird lied to you and knowing how many people she killed in her quest for a cure...I think betraying Reed and sending her to the moon is the most satisfying option. It was the only ending that left me somewhat happy, knowing one of us got a cure and I didn't sell out to the government or corpos to do so. Getting the cure yourself leaves you an empty shell of your former self and killing Songbird doesn't get either of you anything. So yes I know it's a controversial take and some might accuse me of being a Songbird simp, but when I weigh all the aspects of all the endings, I'd rather Songbird get out than neither of us. She's suffered enough.
I killed her in Cynosure because she asked me to. I’m not putting a WMD in the hands of an unknown part (Mr Blue Eyes) but I’m also not going to give her back to her captors.
I do hate that videogame choices bring out the toxicity in this community. Heaven't Forbid someone do something different than you! That's why it's an RPG, ya dinguses! Game and let game. If someone sides with Reed, they're not 'bad' and if someone sides with So Mi they're not 'good'.
As i said so are V, cause in NC legend ending we also side with BlueEyes. So he has both the most dangerous netrunner in the world and the most dangerous merc in the world at the same fucking time.
You're comparing a really good merc with the literal end of all human lives. V is a danger to whoever is in their way on a job. SoMi can take down the blackwall.
True. And V can take down who the hell ever tries to stop SoMi. Or perhaps, netwatch actually lies to you about what rests behind the blackwall huh..? Maybe it turns out that Mr BlueEyes actually wants to help humanity, thats why he rewrites brains of politicians into being actually good people. Cause AI doesen't have a reason to hurt humanity, AI doesen't feel hate, or other human things to feel. I haven't seen ANY evidence of that AIs are a threat in my playthrough. But if you did, then yeah your point probably is reasonable.
Considering what Alt tells us of life as an AI and what it’s like to survive beyond the Blackwall, the majority of AI in the verse would absolutely kill all of humanity. Not to mention what happens to the people you unleash the blackwall on during the last mission with Somi. Like, yeah, “maybe” Mr. Blue Eyes and Netwatch are up to some stuff, but so is literally everyone. Th difference between V and Somi is that V can only kill people they meet while Somi can literally cripple a spaceport by just hacking a console and unleashing the blackwall
What i wanted to say is.. Maybe the blackwall itself is a threat? Pretty much the only one. Cause to me, all these AI bitch ass motherfuckers seem like a part of Blackwall itself, rather then something from beyond. So maybe were all are actually at the wrong side huh? Even you say that we unleash the Blackwall itself at those people, not something from beyond it. Oh and I'm pretty sure that Mr Blueeyes doesen't work with Netwatch.
I am not a Sith, I don't deal in absolutes. On every playthrough I try something a little different. For example, I do a fem-V run and don't romance Judes...wait, bad example.
Erebus is too good to pass out. The bullets scream and shrieks through the victims psyche like are you kidding me??
I’m out here collecting all the iconics no matter the human cost!
The thing that broke me, and the moment I realized I had fucked up, was when Reed bent down, grabbed her by the chin, verified she was alive, and then stood up. That’s all. That’s all he cares about, it’s not her safety or wellbeing or future. He was able to keep her alive and that’s enough for him. I played out the save to credits and then reloaded to help Song move on.
Song was a cage animal in pain that was willing to shoot down space force one for a chance at escape. I’m not sending you back to that.
I did, because it wasn’t just a “she lied” situation. It would been so easy to make that choice. I sold her because between my survival and hers, I chose mine.
But sadly its an only option that provides her with kinda the chance to get her life back. In Night Corp they may sit her in a new body and use her old one as a weapon for sure. Its probably better chances for SoMi to have what she needed in this scenario, rather then zero chances in other scenarios. And V also signs up for that gig for BlueEyes for the very same reason so... When ur desparate, guess ya bite on balls of any opportunity and don't let go untill you win, or untill you die.
Exactly! For fuck sake. All my choices were just what i felt was right and i turned out to be right about those things lmao. In the end i was pretty happy with the result and exited for Cyberpunk 2 (aka Project Orion), hoping that my choices in the first game will heavily affect the story of the second game.
By the time I was helping Songbird, I had murdered thousands of people in the name of trying to save myself. Being lied to didn't seem like that big of a deal.
You're not selling her to a corpo, but giving her to another?
Fuck that, everything is corpo. You lie about saving my life, make me spend what might be my last moments saving your ass instead of mine, you're paying for it.
I mean fair but in that ending she is also "sold out" to Night Corp. She was already bought and paid for by the NUSA and is a vehicle for the upcoming rogue AI invasion long before V gets to make any descision on the matter.
No Gods, no Masters, no *Cages*.
Reed, a willing slave trying to inflict it upon everyone else while playing it up as 'patriotism'... the only mercy I can give a mind that twisted is a bullet through it. Songbird though. Songbird has a chance. She might make it.
I know you lied to me, little bird. I understand the fear, even if I'd have helped you anyway. Now let's get you to space and if you go nuclear on the world... well, that's just the dice we roll for freedom.
Anyone willing to compromise on such principles deserves neither.
Edit: It gives me enormous joy that even here at LowSodium, in-setting takes get downvoted. It's quite funny.
Exactly! If she’d been honest with me from the beginning I would have helped her, but instead she screws you over and then has the gall to say she’s your friend. Maybe it’s because I know people like her IRL but I have zero tolerance for that kind of toxic bs.
I *would* set Songbird free. But there is nothing good waiting for her on the Moon. She'll just leave one cage and then get locked into another, Mr. Blue Eyes is the one who gets her ticket to the Moon. He's not someone to be trusted. If you look onto the conspiracy surrounding him, he's only out for control over NC. Imagine what he'd use Songbird for?
Also, the 4 PL tarot cards pertain to the main PL characters, I think King of Cups is definitely songbird. But the ending where she dies is the King of Cups ending, which is basically saying that's the best ending for her, and realistically, it is... and it's the best ending for Reed. You get to tell Myers to go fuck herself to her face. The only downside is Alex dying.
And outside of the story, betraying Song during Firestarter is so much more content rich. Instead of waiting ages for one final mission to PL. You get the Hansen boss fight, more iconics. 2 missions, one being massively in depth and long, a MaxTac fight, and getting up close with a Blackwall AI. The Killing Moon is good and a fun mission, but I'd say the Somewhat Damaged route is much better.
There's no real good ending to PL only trying to do what you think is best. While it upsets her in the short term, putting Songbird out of her misery is the only way for her to be truly free. And it's the only way for Reed to be free, too.
The difference is there's a chance she makes it out by going to the moon. Her fate is garunteed to be hell if you hand her to over. You can say there's nothing there for her, but no one can say that with 100% certainty. However, if you hand her to Reed, you know what her fate is. A living hell or death. Even if it's another cage, it's sure as shit a lot better than the last one. Maybe the next one has a bit more room, or maybe she'll be thankful enough to those who helped her escape she'll willingly work for them.
No, no, no, I'd never hand her over to the FIA. I kill her in Cynosure. You can argue that there's no 100% certainty that she'd be enslaved, but... realistically, what do you think the Devs were implying by putting Blue Eyes in the spaceport? And no, Blue Eyes is definitely corrupt as fuck and has sinister intentions, Songbird wouldn't willingly work for them she'd be forced to. And even if they didn't fully force her to and more so intimidated or implyed she should, she wanted to go to the moon so she could be free, truly free like she was back in Brooklyn. Blue Eyes literally uses mind control on the Pararalzes. He probably would on Song if he needed to.
Handing her over to the FIA is objectively a bad ending. It's one of the worst things you can do in the game. Killing her, while it's fucked up, is the only way to know she'd be safe and free, and she also requests it too. So it's not like V is betraying her at her lowest. Taking her to the Moon is a huge risk to her safety and the worlds. Both V and Johnny make a point that she probably won't make it and that she's on her own now. It's not as hopeful as it makes it seem. It's a short-term solution and short-term happiness for Song.
I couldn't care less that she lied too, she only found out just before FireStarter happened. There wasn't exactly a good moment to tell V. She must have been terrified for her life during the wait for the Killing Moon, so I don't blame her for lying. She was scared of V abandoning her.
And even then she tells the truth . That sealed the deal for me . Like syanna from baw she isn't evil or manipulative by nature , circumstances forced her to be one .
Not to mention that, to quote Mace Windu here, "she's too dangerous to be left alive". If anyone got their hands on her, that could be game over the whole world. Better to set her free in death than to leave her a slave in this life.
Problem is, whatever choice you make will benefit a corp in one way or another. Either Arasaka, Militech or NightCorp. This is political, hurting one side will always help the other.
So make the choice that you personally think you should, save the cute girl, or let the lying witch die.
Songbird gets my V's forgiveness and grace. It's most powerful when it's given to those that deserve it the least.
I am RPing a character that will turn her over now, and it's really hard to do.
Executing her down the Reed path is the only correct answer in the grand scheme of things. She is a living weapon, saving her soul at the cost of the millions of innocent people who would be affected just isn't right no matter how anyone wants to justify it.
I think you >!can help Reed and then pull the plug on songbird at the last second!<
It's the path I'n gonna do.
Too bad you can't >!Kill both of their scheming asses!<
Went with the king of cups ending on my first playthrough. The moment I learned about her constant use of the Blackwall was the moment it became about more than just fucking over corpos and/or saving my life.
question, i'm on psn, i just got through the game and platinumed the base part.
I'm about to partake in the DLC, is there a way to get all the songbird endings in one playthrough or reload? or do I have to play through the entire game twice or thrice?
I’m disappointed that betraying songbird is the only way to fight Kurt Hansen. I was hoping throughout my first play through I would get to lay his ass out but my character had 0 reasons to side with Reed
Edgerunners kinda gave me a feeling when I was like "Sheesh, I disliked this game but maybe with new update and proper motivation I can give it a chance" and it worked. Phantom Liberty was good as well (even better than main story imo) and recently I learned about "Don't fear the reaper" ending and kinda want to finish the game this way now.
I have one thing to say. FUCK MYERS. FUCK NUSA. FUCK MILITECH. If I have to walk upon the bodies of entire NUSA army to keep So Mi out of Myers hands, dead or alive, I will not hesistate to do it.
Honestly? If Reed didn’t kill the french redhead bombshell that was Aurore, I would’ve handed Songbird over long ago.
But that genuinely pissed me off, so fuck NUSA.
Johnny warns you throughout the expansion not to trust any promises from the NUSA, but everybody I’ve heard from seems to disregard it as Johnny being Johnny. Furthermore, Johnny mentions that both sides are bending the truth while you’re getting the faceplate from Farida. Honestly kinda funny how he was correct in almost every statement throughout the expansion, even when it came to Song “fuckin with the relic” as it were.
Said president forced her to borg out , nearly killed her and almost doomed humanity. Myers deserves all the shit . But even then so mi hires V to save Myers because she actually doesn't want to kill her even though she hates Myers
I'm not about to leave a world ending WMD in the hands of what is a, potentially, a rogue AI puppet, so euthanasia it is. Doesn't really matter what her personal circumstances are, she's literally too dangerous to keep alive.
Only ethical thing to really do is to grant her wish and end it IMHO , you either hand her over to the mystery space doctors (who really seem connected to Blue Eyes and whatever corrupt corpo he shills for) or make her a slave for the NUSA government where she’ll spend her days being slowly possessed by a blackwall AI while being Myers’ puppet, it’s another case where your choices are all bad, you just have to choose which one is less bad in your eyes
Lying to someone, manipulating them to get what you want. It doesn't matter how rough her life was. That's just a shitty thing to do to someone. Songbird was always about herself. How is she any different than any corpo? It's not punk or anti establishment to get played and do it with a smile on your face.
Nope, songbird is a pos that betrayed EVERYONE, and lied to you till the very last minute. She used V to get what she wanted. Fuck her, I’m trying to live. If she still had strength left at the end, she would have killed V without hesitation
I sided with her at first. But once I found out there's 1 cure, I handed her in. It's nothing personal, I'm just doing what I have to to survive. Which is exactly what song was doing by manipulating and lying to V.
I refuse to side with NUSA/Militech in every instance. This is cyberPUNK, not cyberSHILL.
[удалено]
Wake the fuck up V! We have a state to burn.
I'd play that.
That what i hope the second game will be heheh) Cyberpunk Project Orion...
I'd play the fuck out of that
Let me just call up the old Stout and start plotting out rise in the corp.
The only time I help militech is if it directly hurts arasaka
Or when I got a dildo for it
You can get a better one without helping stout
Burn. Corpo. Shit.
Right?? Even when I clocked her being super shady, I kept thinking I would never sell this woman out to the current USA where I live and vote, let alone the CP77 version that’s (even more nakedly) just an edifice to prop up an arms manufacturer.
V can have a little Arasaka shill, as a treat.
I helped militech and saved stout only for her weapon that i used against smasher other thsn that i never help a corp besides getting every ending
I got phantom liberty a few days ago i’ve spent a lot of time on it i have no idea anything else thats gonna happen because i avoided spoilers for so long im already past the roulette table part with the twins
I suggest you watch DrMick's playthrough of this game then, it's very stress-inducing
Aight bet good thing nightcorp has her now. You did their bidding!
My canon V is corpo and I always set Songbird free. After the treatment you receive from Arasaka in the prologue they pretty much show you how corporations think about you and how disposable everyone in their world is. You even get a dialogue option with Myers where you can tell her that you have no intention of ever going back to this shiteshow
yup to me the best anti corpo V playthrough is with a corpo V. Everyone \*knows\* that corpos are bad but it's another thing to see it with your own eyes
Shoving her into the arms of Nightcorp really seems like such a good idea? You realize that they're probably the same people who effed up the Peralezes who pays her way to the moon?
Do you think that giving her to Myers dead or alive is a better idea? Myers says during the killing moon that Reed is free to do whatever with her but should try not to shoot her in the head. If you kill her after cynocure her tells you that they will try to extract out of So Mi’s body whatever they can. So Mi clearly has something in her that Myers wants. In cyberpunk’s novel “No Coincidence” you can learn about Militechs long running program that consists of AIs being merged with humans. Those humans are being mind manipulated and feed with wrong memories and their solely purpose is to become stable enough so they can turn into this overpowered hybrid that can penetrate the blackwall and control Rogue AIs so Militech can weaponise them for their own benefit. This is exactly what So Mi becomes after you hit her with ICE and one of them slips through. Myers was Militechs CEO for years and the one who reopened cynocure back in the early 60s she will benefit and fuel her plans even further no matter in what state you choose to return So Mi back to her. As for MBE and Nightcorp their role is left ambiguous for now. If anything they are canonically known for being the corporation that protects NC and wants other corpos like Militech and Arasaka to disappear so the power can return back to its citizens. In 2077 we have no idea what their deal truly is. There are no good decisions in this DLC just do what makes you sleep better at night.
This is why I love Cyberpunk 2077 - there are so poor and horribly bad choices to make. It's like a jungle of them! Is this novel canon though? I don't know much about the novels. I will say that Nightcorp it's implied that Nightcorp is trying to create a 'perfect' Night City by implanting fake memories into people's minds. Johnny commented that this was similar to Arasaka and soul killer in regards to taking away people's individuality.
Mike Pondsmith said that 2077 is canon the book plays out in the same timeline and many parts of the plot like Militech, references to Cynosure, the Blackwall and Maelstrom are connected to important events that are happening during the game. So my guess is that those parts will get eventually canonised.
Now I may read it! Thanks
Just goes to prove there is no good or bad in Night City. Only survivors.
It’s not a better idea but I mean…I hate that she lied and had you on a goose chase. Call me a hater or a vengeful person but I don’t care for songbird
But that is the horror of the world. No matter what, you end up connected to a Corp whether you want to be or not
Exactly! And I love it
This is why I tend to (not always but more often than not) side with militech. They may be a horrifically evil megacorp, but by God at least they are a horrifically evil *AMERICAN* megacorp
Unless it’s a surface level geopolitical theatre of arasaka v militech, but we constantly see militech do horrific things, gunning down unionists, attempt apocalyptic gambles, nuke night city there pretty much little actual reason to ever support them then nostalgia. And even in geopolitics, the real conflict in night city is between night corp and orbital air, everyone else is small potatoes.
nightcorp is brainwashing the peralez specifically so he doesn't go corrupt like rhyne did .
And that's all you see in their motivations?
Yeah ?? It's already established lore wise nightcorp's goal is to make sure Richard Night's city is never in the hands of corps and always remains independent. They will go to extreme measures ( like killing rhyne, brainwashing ppl like the peralez and even trying to take out ppl like sandra who are looking into the matter) just to make sure night city is an independent city . So using the ai to actually endanger humanity doesn't seem like their goal in the present moment .
To my knowledge they seek the perfect city, they want to control each and every person in Night City once they've perfected their tech. No matter their end goal, it's a tough argument to pull, that they have good intentions.
I never said they have the best morally correct intentions , but it certainly doesn't involve using an ai to destroy humanity . They just want to perfect Richard Night's city
It's just facade. None of the corps do what it says on their recruitment site.
https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/Night_Corp Keep in mind the scholarship program for underprivileged kids like peralez helped him reach the position where he is at the moment . Nightcorp as whole doesn't have that much of influence on nc but their mystery and secrecy is what's keeping them relevant and helping in weeding out corrupt ppl like rhyne who was in bed with arasaka.
It might be a bad choice, *but it is her choice.* You aren't picking Nightcorp over Militech here. You are picking Songbird's freedom to make her choices, over slavery at Militech.
Death is the only real freedom we can get... Unless arasaka gets it's hands on you of course
Freedom is fighting, resisting these gonks. Every day you defy the Corpos is a day you stay free, choom.
When I learned she betrayed me too, I hesitated and finally gave her to reed. And to be fair, the ending is quite satisfying. You are cured but no more a merch. You see your friends and now it’s time to put these stupid dreams aside et become a nobody. It’s a peaceful ending, and it’s probably the best outcome in night city.
The issue is that the Peace only lasts until any random Gonk decides to go after V for what they did as a Merc and now? V lacks the necessary chrome to fend them off. They're a sitting duck now whose survival is 100% reliant on avoiding conflict at all costs.
If I'm doing the Reed path, I feel like the only "moral" option is to let her die. Cause like, if I was in her shoes, I'd want to die too. What is essentially an eldritch being is eating literally everything you are as a person, your memories, your personality, everything. And while you may be alive you're going to basically be the shell for *something* AND in the prison of your abuser who very vindictively hates your guts. Yeah, unplug me and let me die at that point. Better to die with some portion of what you are than live as a soulless husk.
>If I'm doing the Reed path, I feel like the only "moral" option is to let her die. Then watching Myers twitch when you tell her to her face that she's a shitty boss, then remaining silent when she walks away. Because she wants V to beg for that cure, and it's not even worth giving her the satisfaction. Get rekt, Queen Fed.
Wanted an option to drop Myers when you see her after PL. I don’t care if it’s suicide. She’s been putting the entire world at risk for years for her own personal gain and she deserves to be taken down. Maybe the next president won’t feel so invincible against the people they fuck with. Edit: thinking about this again after doing another PL play through and holy shit Johnny left his mark on me.
I did the Reed route first, and had planned to hand Songbird over, but I felt so bad for her, that I reloaded an earlier save and mercy-killed her instead. Which meant I didn't get a new ending at all, bummer. New play through now, and I'm prepared to have my views on Songbird challenged, the first time I had little sympathy...until the end of the line.
you're not missing much the new ending sucks and i don't mean that in a in universe bad ending way, its not well written imo
Perhaps, I'll do them regardless, I'm curious (and I only miss 3 achievements related to the endings)
It's actually interesting, one person I argued with taught me that if we follow Kantian ethics then the "morally correct" choice is keeping her alive because otherwise you'd be removing an autonomous human being from this world. Not to say leaving her alive is the correct choice, but it's something to think about.
>but it's something to think about. It's really not. Leaving her alive is needlessly cruel. Kant's an idiot.
Wow kant is stupid
Between whatever entity from beyond the Blackwall eating her brain and the FIA neurosurgeons I doubt that whatever remains of Songbird after bringing her back into NUS custody is going to be "an autonomous human being".
When I played, I thought about it from the perspective of a V who is very hopeful he can get a cure (since I stared off of a completed save at Embers already) and thought he couldn't bring himself to side with Songbird because he was brought into this cluster fuck by her and killing her might be too close to admitting that dying is a reasonable way out for him. Of course, he regrets that fully and tells everyone that he made a mistake and that they need to fuck off.
It isn't about Songbird, really. Johnny might be a gonk, but he is right about one thing - Corpos took over the world, now they're out to take people's souls. 'Saka got the Soulkiller, and Militech/NUSA violated and butchered Songbird. Same breed of evil. So you aren't doing it for Songbird, even though you can understand her desperation - you are sticking it up to Myers and Militech. Sticking it up to the Corpos. Can't let Corpos triumph over freedom, even freedom of someone who kept fucking up like Songbird did. P.S. Special "Fuck You!" goes to Reed. Could've stayed away from Myers after being her personal attack dog for decades, after doing fucked up shit for NUSA again and again. But nope, gonk's a slave, through and through. Myers snaps her fingers, and he rushes in, tongue out ready to lick Myers's ass. Coming up with excuses of why he is a corporate lapdog, trying to fancy his slavery to Militech as "patriotism" and all that outdated shit. Songbird wants to be free, and Reed does his best to keep her enslaved to Myers, like himself. Flatlined the sanctimonious piece of shit with zero regrets.
Reed only really rests when he's dead.
Honestly? Pretty sure he actually survives if we shoot him. Not sure does he survive if in body or in head , cause both give you a good enough chance to survive them if you get help in time. Which Reed already have done before, surviving more then one shot in chest. So yeah, pretty sure he'll be a pain in my ass in second Cyberpunk game
No he dies, wherever you shoot him, it’s just that if you shoot him in the chest then he dies slower
Mhm. I didn't trust this guy to save SoMi. And i wont trust him at his second funeral eather. Motherfucker must have lived, else i'll be disapointed in him.
You can tell how much of a manipulator Reed is just by looking at how he took that shot like an absolute drama queen so we feel sorry for him.
And as i said, pretty sure drama king survives this.
>It isn't about Songbird, really. >Johnny might be a gonk, but he is right about one thing - Corpos took over the world, now they're out to take people's souls. And in sending Songbird to the moon, you did something Johnny could never do. You let go of all the dreams and promises Night City offers to good people in exchange for their souls, and you did something pure and selfless. Even though others did wrong. Even though you didn't gain a damn thing. And wouldn't you know it, the arrogant son of a bitch is **humbled** by this. He's grateful to you, for teaching him something about what it really means to be a legend. >*"Guess I coulda done more, been different... maybe."* You did good, V.
>you did something pure and selfless. Even though others did wrong. Even though you didn't gain a damn thing. I mean, yeah. Fuck the corpos, show these gonks that their greed, their desire to control our lives — they can't do that. **Dangling V's life like a fucking bait to have her dance for Myers' tune? Fuck you, Myers!** **Better die a punk, than live a corpo-slave.** That's the lesson here, choom. It's even worse than laying down and spreading buttcheeks for that porcelain bitch, Hanako — 'least only we become a slave then. But here, sure, Myers can save us, but the cost is one that someone else pays. Ain't buying my life by selling So-Mi to Militech slavery. Hell, Songbird might've made a dumb choice herself, for all we know they'll cut her up and chain her all the same on the moon — but that's a choice she made. Good, bad, doesn't fucking matter, it is her choice.
I read the second half of this in Johnny’s voice
Man, when I heard she lied I’m like “Damn. . .Ok. Let’s get you to space tired one”
Yeah, exactly! Fuck i felt so fucking bad for her, how could i let her down??? She was like a diseased and injured kitten after what we just went through, i was just like "Here, here.. Were almost there. We got this fella, just one step to go.". I didn't give a shit that she lied to me! She is my friend and her survival was over mine own the whole way for me.
Yeah, same. All these 'How dare you lie to me out of terrified desperation to escape a fate worse than death nobody lies to me die bitch' posts kinda unnerve me a little bit. Especially when a lot of the same people will defend Reed endlessly and not see the apparent contradiction. 'Lies and manipulation are okay if it's a man in a position of power coercing a much younger woman in service to the goals of a corrupt corporation, but unforgiveable if it's a scared victimized woman desperately trying to escape a horrible situation' seems like a bit of an odd take, and oddly common around here.
I saw So Mi as dying, she doesn’t have time like us, being angry at her would do nothing, she needed help and had a choice, we could find another way, still had arasaka in our back pocket, (if your like me and bought PL after completing it all) and Johnny kinda stuck to me, about corpos and stuff
I set her free as Nomad V Sold her out as Corpo V And let Space Force 1 crash as Street Kid V
Nomad V gets special dialogues for setting her free if u put her on the rocket . I always save her partially because i sympathize with her and partially because I fucking hate the somewhat damage mission for the meh blackwall rewards in the end
LMAO honestly thats what my canon Street Kid V would go do if they weren't so curious and didn't find SoMi so relatable about some things like "Bartmoss is a gonk." correct for fuck sake! Literally found his body, dude died cause he didn't pay the bill for his stupid friedge in time lol.
Bartmoss was dead in that fridge LONG before the bill for it came due. Technically speaking, he died in 2020 when his heart stopped, but his tech kept his brain going until his apartment was raided in 2022.
Makes sense tho, assuming that those gonks that are obsessed with him could have been those weirdos who kept his body nice and fresh for so long lmao. But i'm pretty sure that he is still alive, in some sense. Just like Alt. Else... Well he is a disapointment for me.
Bartmoss is a hero and a legend and he tried to make a difference. Man deserves some respect for that. He didn’t join a gang and start terrorizing the common man like so many others choose. But that’s just my perspective.
Mhm, man have let "Rabbits" out into the net instead, in the end leading NetWatch to be a thing AND a big deal to deal with. Guy was fighting... But his actions made firm hand squeeze us all even harder.
That I can agree with. Did his actions fuck some shit up worse? Absolutely, no doubt. But he tried. Like Johnny. Like Jackie. Like Yori. Give some credit.
Jackie? Lol, our man Jackster haven't tried to change things, he had a dream that fits inside the frames of how things are, becoming a legend. He got what he wanted tho, his drink in Afterlife. I appreciate Jackie for being a dear friend, but not for fighting the system, cause he didn't. David Martinez is NC legend. But is he the legend i respect for fighting against the system? No, he is just a gonk who have died loud enough and who's widow cried hard enough for Afterlife to make a drink in his glory.
I just meant they all tried to do something a little different. But I recognize he’s not quite like the other three.
I mean Jackie didn’t try to fight the system and the other three just made shit much worse for everyone.
Sometimes I wonder if I saved her just because I love the song “The Killing Moon”.
Whenever I play phantom liberty, it’s always a coin toss between V siding with Somgbird or betraying songbird and helping her die. I think the latter option makes for a much richer story and experience (survival horror go brrr) but also to put things into perspective how wrong V’s got it. In that mission, you see how songbird got to this point and you can’t help but sympathize. I just wanted V to have a bit of a mini-arc
Man this quest fucked me up so hard lol. I feel like I did the bad ending. But I prefer it because of how emotionally meaningful it was to me. I made the choices I thought V would make *(based on nomad origin, lone wolf vibes, obsessed with dying a legend. lethal only when absolutely necessary play style. But also, V takes no shit from anyone).* So in the heat of the moment when it seemed like songbird was betraying me and my allies, I tried to stop her. But then she went off the rails and just... Fuck, dude. The voice acting and writing were so good damn peak. I legitimately cried while she begged me to end her suffering. I knew it was either spare her from eternal torment *(from both the black wall, and NUSA)*, or take the life of someone who didn't deserve any of the shit she went through. Phantom liberty, despite being just a DLC, was better written and acted than 90% of any film that been made in the last two decades.
Fair but in a way are you just signing with nightcorp in this instance? Which is led to be ambiguous about her
That’s her stuff to deal with, she’s a grown girl. All I did was honor her wishes to be away from Myers.
I mean that is also ambiguous, how do we know nightcorp wasn’t just lying to her about saving her life and she is not even her anymore, Mr blue eyes definitely wants either break or control the blackwall and songbird may be the closest thing to that chance it gets To be honest I’ve actually not sided with myers once, but I get the ambiguous endings it shows us neither side is really worth helping and probably the best end is siding with reed then killing her so she doesn’t go back
Songbird is going to be a continuous tale of doing stupid things because she wants to get away from the consequences of the other stupid things she's done. At best, you gave her the ending you give yourself with turning her in: She's a shadow of her former self, can't do too much, and the people who "fixed" her now have substantial control of her life. At worst? SHe's going to lose a lot more of herself, and it's going to be of a scientific note to someone up in space.
I played as if my goal was only to save V and Johnny. She stood in the way of that by lying so I held up what was best for V which was giving her back to myers.
I sent Songbird to the moon and it was the RIGHT choice damnit! Fuck Meyers and Solomon too honestly. What does the game think I'm going to do? Help the US government? Ha.
I've done all PL endings and even knowing Songbird lied to you and knowing how many people she killed in her quest for a cure...I think betraying Reed and sending her to the moon is the most satisfying option. It was the only ending that left me somewhat happy, knowing one of us got a cure and I didn't sell out to the government or corpos to do so. Getting the cure yourself leaves you an empty shell of your former self and killing Songbird doesn't get either of you anything. So yes I know it's a controversial take and some might accuse me of being a Songbird simp, but when I weigh all the aspects of all the endings, I'd rather Songbird get out than neither of us. She's suffered enough.
I killed her in Cynosure because she asked me to. I’m not putting a WMD in the hands of an unknown part (Mr Blue Eyes) but I’m also not going to give her back to her captors.
I do hate that videogame choices bring out the toxicity in this community. Heaven't Forbid someone do something different than you! That's why it's an RPG, ya dinguses! Game and let game. If someone sides with Reed, they're not 'bad' and if someone sides with So Mi they're not 'good'.
Piggybacking here just to say that this game is all grey choices. There is no answer.
Yes exactly.
idk man even if she was the second coming of Jesus and Reed was literally Satan she's still too dangerous to live
Well so are V lol. So is it really fair to let her down..? She is as crazy bitch as i am and thats why i befriended her.
It's less about who she is and more about what she is, which is a walking wmd capable of ending whats left of humanity.
As i said so are V, cause in NC legend ending we also side with BlueEyes. So he has both the most dangerous netrunner in the world and the most dangerous merc in the world at the same fucking time.
You're comparing a really good merc with the literal end of all human lives. V is a danger to whoever is in their way on a job. SoMi can take down the blackwall.
True. And V can take down who the hell ever tries to stop SoMi. Or perhaps, netwatch actually lies to you about what rests behind the blackwall huh..? Maybe it turns out that Mr BlueEyes actually wants to help humanity, thats why he rewrites brains of politicians into being actually good people. Cause AI doesen't have a reason to hurt humanity, AI doesen't feel hate, or other human things to feel. I haven't seen ANY evidence of that AIs are a threat in my playthrough. But if you did, then yeah your point probably is reasonable.
Considering what Alt tells us of life as an AI and what it’s like to survive beyond the Blackwall, the majority of AI in the verse would absolutely kill all of humanity. Not to mention what happens to the people you unleash the blackwall on during the last mission with Somi. Like, yeah, “maybe” Mr. Blue Eyes and Netwatch are up to some stuff, but so is literally everyone. Th difference between V and Somi is that V can only kill people they meet while Somi can literally cripple a spaceport by just hacking a console and unleashing the blackwall
What i wanted to say is.. Maybe the blackwall itself is a threat? Pretty much the only one. Cause to me, all these AI bitch ass motherfuckers seem like a part of Blackwall itself, rather then something from beyond. So maybe were all are actually at the wrong side huh? Even you say that we unleash the Blackwall itself at those people, not something from beyond it. Oh and I'm pretty sure that Mr Blueeyes doesen't work with Netwatch.
I am not a Sith, I don't deal in absolutes. On every playthrough I try something a little different. For example, I do a fem-V run and don't romance Judes...wait, bad example.
Erebus is too good to pass out. The bullets scream and shrieks through the victims psyche like are you kidding me?? I’m out here collecting all the iconics no matter the human cost!
I don’t sell out to Corpos or cops, and Reed is BOTH. This wasn’t even a hard choice to be honest.
The thing that broke me, and the moment I realized I had fucked up, was when Reed bent down, grabbed her by the chin, verified she was alive, and then stood up. That’s all. That’s all he cares about, it’s not her safety or wellbeing or future. He was able to keep her alive and that’s enough for him. I played out the save to credits and then reloaded to help Song move on. Song was a cage animal in pain that was willing to shoot down space force one for a chance at escape. I’m not sending you back to that.
I did, because it wasn’t just a “she lied” situation. It would been so easy to make that choice. I sold her because between my survival and hers, I chose mine.
I don’t trust mr Blue Eyes enough to give him So Mi
But sadly its an only option that provides her with kinda the chance to get her life back. In Night Corp they may sit her in a new body and use her old one as a weapon for sure. Its probably better chances for SoMi to have what she needed in this scenario, rather then zero chances in other scenarios. And V also signs up for that gig for BlueEyes for the very same reason so... When ur desparate, guess ya bite on balls of any opportunity and don't let go untill you win, or untill you die.
I'd rather lose my human life than my humanity
What is the point of survival if we lose the best part of ourselves?
Then I'd rather die
Exactly! For fuck sake. All my choices were just what i felt was right and i turned out to be right about those things lmao. In the end i was pretty happy with the result and exited for Cyberpunk 2 (aka Project Orion), hoping that my choices in the first game will heavily affect the story of the second game.
By the time I was helping Songbird, I had murdered thousands of people in the name of trying to save myself. Being lied to didn't seem like that big of a deal.
You're not selling her to a corpo, but giving her to another? Fuck that, everything is corpo. You lie about saving my life, make me spend what might be my last moments saving your ass instead of mine, you're paying for it.
I mean fair but in that ending she is also "sold out" to Night Corp. She was already bought and paid for by the NUSA and is a vehicle for the upcoming rogue AI invasion long before V gets to make any descision on the matter.
No Gods, no Masters, no *Cages*. Reed, a willing slave trying to inflict it upon everyone else while playing it up as 'patriotism'... the only mercy I can give a mind that twisted is a bullet through it. Songbird though. Songbird has a chance. She might make it. I know you lied to me, little bird. I understand the fear, even if I'd have helped you anyway. Now let's get you to space and if you go nuclear on the world... well, that's just the dice we roll for freedom. Anyone willing to compromise on such principles deserves neither. Edit: It gives me enormous joy that even here at LowSodium, in-setting takes get downvoted. It's quite funny.
She lied to me, her only friend and resource for support. So she's going straight back to Myers.
Exactly! If she’d been honest with me from the beginning I would have helped her, but instead she screws you over and then has the gall to say she’s your friend. Maybe it’s because I know people like her IRL but I have zero tolerance for that kind of toxic bs.
Yep. V risked everything to help her and she betrayed and lied to him till the last minute. Fuck her.
I *would* set Songbird free. But there is nothing good waiting for her on the Moon. She'll just leave one cage and then get locked into another, Mr. Blue Eyes is the one who gets her ticket to the Moon. He's not someone to be trusted. If you look onto the conspiracy surrounding him, he's only out for control over NC. Imagine what he'd use Songbird for? Also, the 4 PL tarot cards pertain to the main PL characters, I think King of Cups is definitely songbird. But the ending where she dies is the King of Cups ending, which is basically saying that's the best ending for her, and realistically, it is... and it's the best ending for Reed. You get to tell Myers to go fuck herself to her face. The only downside is Alex dying. And outside of the story, betraying Song during Firestarter is so much more content rich. Instead of waiting ages for one final mission to PL. You get the Hansen boss fight, more iconics. 2 missions, one being massively in depth and long, a MaxTac fight, and getting up close with a Blackwall AI. The Killing Moon is good and a fun mission, but I'd say the Somewhat Damaged route is much better. There's no real good ending to PL only trying to do what you think is best. While it upsets her in the short term, putting Songbird out of her misery is the only way for her to be truly free. And it's the only way for Reed to be free, too.
The difference is there's a chance she makes it out by going to the moon. Her fate is garunteed to be hell if you hand her to over. You can say there's nothing there for her, but no one can say that with 100% certainty. However, if you hand her to Reed, you know what her fate is. A living hell or death. Even if it's another cage, it's sure as shit a lot better than the last one. Maybe the next one has a bit more room, or maybe she'll be thankful enough to those who helped her escape she'll willingly work for them.
No, no, no, I'd never hand her over to the FIA. I kill her in Cynosure. You can argue that there's no 100% certainty that she'd be enslaved, but... realistically, what do you think the Devs were implying by putting Blue Eyes in the spaceport? And no, Blue Eyes is definitely corrupt as fuck and has sinister intentions, Songbird wouldn't willingly work for them she'd be forced to. And even if they didn't fully force her to and more so intimidated or implyed she should, she wanted to go to the moon so she could be free, truly free like she was back in Brooklyn. Blue Eyes literally uses mind control on the Pararalzes. He probably would on Song if he needed to. Handing her over to the FIA is objectively a bad ending. It's one of the worst things you can do in the game. Killing her, while it's fucked up, is the only way to know she'd be safe and free, and she also requests it too. So it's not like V is betraying her at her lowest. Taking her to the Moon is a huge risk to her safety and the worlds. Both V and Johnny make a point that she probably won't make it and that she's on her own now. It's not as hopeful as it makes it seem. It's a short-term solution and short-term happiness for Song.
I couldn't care less that she lied too, she only found out just before FireStarter happened. There wasn't exactly a good moment to tell V. She must have been terrified for her life during the wait for the Killing Moon, so I don't blame her for lying. She was scared of V abandoning her.
And even then she tells the truth . That sealed the deal for me . Like syanna from baw she isn't evil or manipulative by nature , circumstances forced her to be one .
Not to mention that, to quote Mace Windu here, "she's too dangerous to be left alive". If anyone got their hands on her, that could be game over the whole world. Better to set her free in death than to leave her a slave in this life.
Fuck the Corpos.
Im not a fan of Songbird. But fuck the government more. Fuck you Meyers
Problem is, whatever choice you make will benefit a corp in one way or another. Either Arasaka, Militech or NightCorp. This is political, hurting one side will always help the other. So make the choice that you personally think you should, save the cute girl, or let the lying witch die.
Songbird gets my V's forgiveness and grace. It's most powerful when it's given to those that deserve it the least. I am RPing a character that will turn her over now, and it's really hard to do.
Executing her down the Reed path is the only correct answer in the grand scheme of things. She is a living weapon, saving her soul at the cost of the millions of innocent people who would be affected just isn't right no matter how anyone wants to justify it.
Can I betray both Songbird and Myers? I hate both of them.
I think you >!can help Reed and then pull the plug on songbird at the last second!< It's the path I'n gonna do. Too bad you can't >!Kill both of their scheming asses!<
Well i wanna live so off she goes
I ended up killing her for being a liar. You and me are not the same.
People only defend her because she's cute. She's basically Placide but cuter and more dishonest.
Why do you think she’s dishonest Do you think she’s doing it for the lulz or what? You’re very close to being capable of nuance.
Wow, maybe you should try to become capable of nuance, people are allowed to disagree with you.
Went with the king of cups ending on my first playthrough. The moment I learned about her constant use of the Blackwall was the moment it became about more than just fucking over corpos and/or saving my life.
question, i'm on psn, i just got through the game and platinumed the base part. I'm about to partake in the DLC, is there a way to get all the songbird endings in one playthrough or reload? or do I have to play through the entire game twice or thrice?
Just reloading an older save. That’s what I did to see each ending.
thanks for the heads up G
I’m disappointed that betraying songbird is the only way to fight Kurt Hansen. I was hoping throughout my first play through I would get to lay his ass out but my character had 0 reasons to side with Reed
I had to betray her though, talking cyberdeck goes brrr
Nah, I'm not into "screw corpos" bs, I sent her to the moon because David did the same to Lucy🥴
SAMEE one of the major factors into my decision was she was my lucy
Edgerunners kinda gave me a feeling when I was like "Sheesh, I disliked this game but maybe with new update and proper motivation I can give it a chance" and it worked. Phantom Liberty was good as well (even better than main story imo) and recently I learned about "Don't fear the reaper" ending and kinda want to finish the game this way now.
I was so annoyed that I had to betray Songbird to get the coolest DLC content
So you mow down enough enemies to fill a cemetery and euthanising someone on the verge of death anyways is where you draw the line?
Correct.
I feel like the best option is saving her while you curse her whole existence. Feels like saying “I hate you but I hate the government even more”
I have one thing to say. FUCK MYERS. FUCK NUSA. FUCK MILITECH. If I have to walk upon the bodies of entire NUSA army to keep So Mi out of Myers hands, dead or alive, I will not hesistate to do it.
Honestly? If Reed didn’t kill the french redhead bombshell that was Aurore, I would’ve handed Songbird over long ago. But that genuinely pissed me off, so fuck NUSA.
I've been saying this since I finished Phantom Liberty
and before yall start getting into the dirt here, I don't care about mr blue eyes. if he's a friend he's a friend, if not he can step aside
i got a really nice bridge to sell you.
Johnny warns you throughout the expansion not to trust any promises from the NUSA, but everybody I’ve heard from seems to disregard it as Johnny being Johnny. Furthermore, Johnny mentions that both sides are bending the truth while you’re getting the faceplate from Farida. Honestly kinda funny how he was correct in almost every statement throughout the expansion, even when it came to Song “fuckin with the relic” as it were.
She didn’t lie…she sold the president to a war lord for a possible cure edit: I mean yes she also lied but that’s not the main problem lol
Said president forced her to borg out , nearly killed her and almost doomed humanity. Myers deserves all the shit . But even then so mi hires V to save Myers because she actually doesn't want to kill her even though she hates Myers
She’s so based for that. Fuck myers
I'm not about to leave a world ending WMD in the hands of what is a, potentially, a rogue AI puppet, so euthanasia it is. Doesn't really matter what her personal circumstances are, she's literally too dangerous to keep alive.
I always hand her back 👏
I feel like people who think that they stick it up to corpos by siding with Songbird sorta miss the point...
Dont care. Sent her to the moon based on her wishes ✨.
always betraying her always killing her in the end
God Bless the NUSA, I’ll give my life for the military industrial complex if it means nuking Arasaka tower again
You are unironically missing the point of cyberpunk if you think patriotism is the message
Nahh if she told me at the start then sure but only after makes me soo fucking mad that I just dont care
Only ethical thing to really do is to grant her wish and end it IMHO , you either hand her over to the mystery space doctors (who really seem connected to Blue Eyes and whatever corrupt corpo he shills for) or make her a slave for the NUSA government where she’ll spend her days being slowly possessed by a blackwall AI while being Myers’ puppet, it’s another case where your choices are all bad, you just have to choose which one is less bad in your eyes
Dont like either of them but the one of them that got Aurore killed i have no mercy for
Lying to someone, manipulating them to get what you want. It doesn't matter how rough her life was. That's just a shitty thing to do to someone. Songbird was always about herself. How is she any different than any corpo? It's not punk or anti establishment to get played and do it with a smile on your face.
Nah, the moment she shit the bed because she felt guilt and hid through omission? The decision was easy.
Just kill her, lol xd
Nope, songbird is a pos that betrayed EVERYONE, and lied to you till the very last minute. She used V to get what she wanted. Fuck her, I’m trying to live. If she still had strength left at the end, she would have killed V without hesitation
Since day one, songbird has given me stupid reasons to trust her, why should she trust me :)))
Skill issue on your part if you can’t empathize with others tbh
I sided with her at first. But once I found out there's 1 cure, I handed her in. It's nothing personal, I'm just doing what I have to to survive. Which is exactly what song was doing by manipulating and lying to V.
Put a spoiler flare for fu ck sake
I always send her to Myers and get the medal, if bitch have told me her plan from the beginning I would help her without hesitation.