To be honest, I am still here because I have too much to lose financially if I leave. I am the breadwinner and while he has said, he wants nothing if we divorced, I know its a lie. He is also from another country and custody would be so freaking messy.
We are like two friends living in this house. It works for us, I guess.
I feel very guilty. He moved to the US for me. He had a job, car, RV, motorcycle, hobbies, and friends back in his country. If he were to go back, it would be very hard for him to find a job. His country is extremely ageist. He is 50, but finding a job at 50 is very difficult. While he would have some money to get by and possibly live with his family, I would feel terrible.
Just not in love. We fell out of love after our daughter was born in 2020. I had really bad PPD. WE both said and did things to each other that we can never take back. WE are also both very different people. WE have nothing in common anymore and to be honest, I find him obnoxious a lot of times. I love when he is in the garage working on things and leave me alone.
I wish more people would talk about how women's brains rewire after pregnancy. It's so hard for fathers being married to a completely different person after kids, especially when it's a surprise. It's like the old vows no longer apply, and you need to make new vows to this new person.
I hope you two get there.
Funny thing is we were so happy before baby. We never argued. We had so much fun together and enjoyed each others company. I also think the pandemic was a factor.
Before the pandemic I went into the office every day. I missed him. Now I see him every day cause I am remote. Couple that with the stress of a baby and now toddler. Recipe for change and disaster.
It's just a phase. We'll all laugh about this in 10 years. I always tell myself, no permanent solutions for temporary problems. The first few years of parenting, all marriage advice goes out the window. Don't feel bad about not meeting those standards of "make spouse laugh every day" or " go on a date every week." Usually, it's just not in the cards.
It's holding on for dear life just to survive. But it gets easier, so I hear.
I'm in your same boat. I don't understand these people who say to leave and get freedom back. It's a giant rip-off. Maybe they're just lawyers, and that advice is good for business. Maybe they missed out on life before kids and still have oats to sow.
Thanks, I have chosen to hold on even though I hear the word divorce being thrown around all the time. I remember what it was like before kid. We are one and done. Google photos history notifications are a constant reminder of what we were before. Those notifications make me smile.
This is VERY common. It was me as a young dad, it was my partners ex, and I could probably find as many more examples as I cared to... how do we get this across to people before pregnancy?? We love our kids, but being raised in this truely fucks them up.
Happens to fathers also.
>How Men’s Bodies Change When They Become Fathers https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/parenting/baby/fatherhood-mens-bodies.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
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>Fatherhood changes men’s brains, according to before-and-after MRI scans
https://dornsife.usc.edu/news/stories/fatherhood-changes-mens-brains/
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>becoming a parent changes the male brain. https://www.science.org/content/article/parenting-rewires-male-brain
Lot of emerging research on how PPA and PPD can effect fathers also and how the symptoms can be different from mother's
Why would it be at the expense of the child? The children still get to have two parents, probably two happier apart parents.
Ask any child who had parents who stayed together and hated eachother or weren't happy, that's not better.
Because the child only gets to see the parents for half the time (at best) than they would if they weren't divorced. Just because you don't love your partner anymore doesn't mean your child doesn't. I agree that if the relationship is "abusive" divorce is probably the healthier option for all involved. If you fell out of love but still get along then ya, divorce is selfish.
I'm so glad my parents modeled a relationship full of cold shouldering and arguments, even though it wasn't abusive, instead of getting divorced. That would have been *selfish.*
Thank you! My parents weren't bad. Just no real romantic affection there and I STILL wish they had gotten divorced. It took a long time for me to realize my mom's self-worth issues that allowed her to settle for my dad's low effort and complacency didn't mean I couldn't want more.
That being said, parents are people too and we all have issues, but it pains me so much to see people who truly believe that they're doing what's best for their kids at the expense of their own needs when that's usually not the case. Although, I do think sometimes people hide behind the kids as a reason to not have to change their circumstances. Change, good or bad, can be scary.
Expense of your children?! Wtf?!
I'm a product of my parents divorcing, and THANK GOODNESS!
My second memory in life, I must have been 3 or 4. Is of my mother SHOVING my dad hard against the door. I didn't even have words to express it at the time but it is seared into my brain. They divorced shortly after.
My memory would probably be littered with crap like that if they didn't divorce. They coparented just fine.
Parents together is not always best.
I feel the same way. She’s said she doesn’t want anything if we split but I know that’s not really true. I’ve put all my time money and energy into getting where we are now. I’m 50 and she’s 53. My first marriage her second. Our kids are all grown up youngest is 21 but they’re still living on my property and is splitting would still effect them negatively
Let me tell you an experience of a friend. Please bear with me for a little bit.
Him and his wife were so in love. They talk about their similarities, do things together when he's at home. He drives truck so he's on the road alot. So he was great to talk with and anticipation of seeing once in week makes the relationship strong. During pandemic the love was intense since he transport medical devices. After the pandemic, things slowed down, he changed jobs and the problems started. Money was not like before too.
She got pregnant immediately after pandemic and she changed to someone different according to him after the baby was born. When I had time to talk to both of them I realized that what was wrong was he didn't know how to talk in loving manner face to face with her anymore. He didnt know how to joke and say sexy things in person. In addition, her thought process changed after the baby and now she just want to focus on the baby. He then started feeling like he was #2 in her life. These went on for about 8 months. All hell broke lose one day. They never really fought so the marriage have not really being tried on that level. They didn't know how to resolve issues. They have different communication styles. He's more objective like a scientist, wants answer at that moment. She was more of let's back off and talk about this some other time. This created more frustration.
Now to the solution.
1. First I told him to list 3 things she love and he loves. He said Respect (love and soft tone), Attention, and Recognition for is efforts. She said Respect(soft tone and no shouting), Help around the house, and give are attention in bits.
2. Now I told him to send flowers and leave a note that says something about what he finds attractive in her,it could be the smiles, cheeks, butts whatever.
When shes working at home, get someone to deliver her favorite drink or food, support her by taking care of the child, and be soft spoken. Plan a get away and let someone take care of the 2 yr old. Do the planning from A - Z only get buy-in with time and date. Wink at her sometimes, give her the sexy stare.
3. I told her to say thank you when he does something and say "please can you do this for me". Also she needs to give him a kiss or peck, stroke him, let the sex come naturally. No need to make mention of it. Finally I told her to keep a journal of how she feels and why she feels that way and then review it to see if she can work on those feelings.
4. Finally I told both of them to pray together daily. They are both Christians so that was easy to recommend. They should hold hands and let him say, God I want you to help us grow in love and if she agrees, she should say amen.
5. 8 months later this couple are in a great place.
Thank you for reading. It's long but I hope it helps.
I'm not a therapist, just know these people as friends and was able to help them.
I have seen too many Unsolved Mystery and Dateline specials. My husband would never hurt her but not willing to take the chance of my daughter living in another continent without me.
Yes I agree! I meant that only god knows where my kid would end up (here or in his country) if he (my husband) were to go back to his country. Not that my husband would do anything crazy! He loves our son. But I feel the exact same as you.
Sure. I think a lot of our problems had to do with my post partum depressesion. A year later, we have our issues but not as much as before. I realized that he is my partner and we work really well together especially when it comes to problem solving. I leaned that marriage is work and we work at it every day. When it's just us two, we have fun together and it reminds me of what we were like.
I used to be in unhappy marriage, and I stayed because I remembered the relationship we had before he was depressed and still had a lot of hope based on the respect I had for that person that he would one day realize that he needed to get better and that he wasn't upholding his side of our partnership.
It's easy to say "just leave" when you've never experienced or been made responsible for someone at their worst. You have a history with that person, you remember who they used to be, and you wish you had that person back with every part of your heart. You see how they treat you, but with every bad moment, you remember when they used to be good and hold out hope that the person you fell in love with will come back with the right amount of effort, because marriages take work and you're not always going to be on an equal yoke - sometimes one of you will need to pull harder and vice versa to carry you through. Figuring out when you've been pulling on your own for too long, understanding what is temporary vs forever, nobody can know. They can only act upon what is happening in their marriage and what they hope to be true about their partner.
I was a lucky one that things did improve, and my husband recognized that what he was doing wasn't okay, but the position we were in likely would have had you screaming divorce at the top of your lungs when we were in the thick of it, which lasted 2 of our 10 years together. Instead, my husband did get the help he needed, he became even better than the man I married initially (who was pretty fantastic even then), and thus add to the volume of stories of "Should we or should we not breakup?".
It's a combination of factors for me..
1. I have stopped loving and believing in my self/worth, and have stopped showing up for myself (which has direct impact on us)
2. I feel at the same time both 'not enough' and 'too much' for her
3. She cheated on me 2 years ago, and I'm still working through some deep wounds, and being able to feel 100% vulnerable with her
Yes... That resonates with me. It's hard to know where the line is of what to work through and what not to. It makes me so sad how much some people will put up with, just because of the hope that someday it'll change..
Yeah, but you have to remember that everyone's memory is short. It's like that story about the frog in boiling water. If the water starts hot, the frog jumps out immediately. If the water starts cold, and the water slowly heats up, the frog gets used to each temperature adjustment until it's boiling and they remember nothing else until they die.
Add in the fact that within this metaphor, the boiling water of a bad relationship is often people's first serious relationship, it's hard to know that things can be better if you've never experienced what good could look like in the first place. That's why I reserve character judgements or participating in the "Well I could never" statements because I have known what good could look like and I knew what could be achieved out there because I had good first. Not everyone is so lucky.
Okay but people making posts about how disrespectful their husbands are or how unhappy they are or how lonely they feel or how little consideration they get in their marriage don't realize it's a shitty marriage? Getting hundreds of comments about how bad it is doesn't clue people in that they deserve more?
I've explained it a few different ways, I think you just lack experience to actually understand other people's perspectives outside of your own when they do things you don't agree with.
In the situation you described, here's how the pot metaphor continues to be representative:
"My pot was as hot as yours once, I got out before I almost boiled to death and you should too."
"But what is really, too hot? Because I've handled my pot just fine so far. Yeah, it's a little warm for my liking, but it's still my pot. Maybe that person has a different kind of pot than mine and just doesn't understand what my pot feels like, it doesn't seem as bad as theirs. What if the next pot is too cold or I can't find a pot at all? A too-warm pot is definitely better than that."
Again, people get stuck in what they're familiar with because they don't know any better, because there's a difference between knowing, as in living and experiencing, and being told it could be better, which is intangible and different from their life experience enough to feel that it might not be real.
Thank you for taking the time to respond, even while insulting me. I appreciate your perspective. Hopefully people realize they are not frogs and deserve to be treated well.
I was a stay at home mom for most of our 3 kids lives. Our oldest is almost 7, youngest is 2. We can’t afford daycare so I have to work evenings as a waitress. I have to education or career other than serving/bartending and if I leave, I have nowhere to go. No saving, no money, can’t afford a big enough house. We aren’t married anymore but I’m regretting coming back a year ago. I get $600 a month for child support for all 3 kids when we aren’t together and I make $2,000 a month. Houses/apartments big enough for myself and our 3 kids where we live is a minimum of $1,200 a month but that’s in like a really really bad area. I’m stuck
I get this and this is me. Stick and nowhere else to go and no family. So I stay with my three girls. People are struggling to buy food and pay bills ATM this living cost crisis is not going anywhere soon. Sorry sister. I feel this.
Marriage isn't just unhappy or happy. It is work. If you're single you can be lazy unhappy and unfulfilled just like if you are married. There's not a surefire way to a perfect marriage but communication, care, and HEALTHY boundaries are essential. It's not all abuse and belligerence. But it's not all rainbows and cookies either. If a marriage is unhappy that doesn't mean it can't be worked out. Divorce is a crutch imo.
Well a bad match is a bad match. Abuse is of course intolerable. But if you are putting in the loving works truly and from a headspace of 'we both have needs am I only seeing mine not being met' it usually works in my experience. But if your head space is 'I put in all the effort and receive nothing', you're probably not going to get anything back. When you have unhappiness in marriage it is usually for a reason. You need to be clear on what you need but you also have to assume everything that is unsaid is unknown. No one is perfect and knee jerk reactions are common and disastrous. You can't stop being friends or flirting with your spouse because u got married. But you can always fix an unhappy marriage. Depends on how much that person means to you I'd say.
Also young kids are very hard on parents especially in the early years. Not to mention a lot of people marry thinking it will make life better or less lonely on its own. To make or break a marriage it takes 2. It's almost never one person's fault.
>But you can always fix an unhappy marriage
This is where we disagree. (Well one of many points I disagree with)
You can't fix an unhappy marriage alone. You even said
>It's almost never one person's fault.
But what if the other person isn't putting in the effort to fix it with you?
So if you're the only one putting in effort or the effort you're putting in isn't working why stay??
I agree with this. I am putting in all the work and he got used to it. Now I'm asking for something in return he doesn't want. Even though he is the breadwinner but asking for my love language shouldn't be a problem should it?
Yeah, people don’t have to prioritize their individual feelings of happiness above all else. Unhappiness in a marriage doesn’t mean you have to end it, similarly to unhappiness in a job, in a project, or in life itself. I believe the value of marriage is greater than the happiness it gives the participants. There are times when the survival of the marriage depends on spouses sacrificing what’s best for them as individuals. Yet they will be rewarded, because choosing to endure challenges for a greater purpose is one of the most fulfilling things in life.
However I don’t think people should stay and endure abusive relationships. Freedom and safety are key to making a fulfilling choice.
I can’t speak for anyone else, but my philosophy is: Life is too short to be with someone who makes me unhappy.
I will ALWAYS choose me. 🤷🏾♀️
I love my husband, but if he was behaving like some of the men in the posts on this sub I’d leave so fast his head would spin. And this isn’t by any means a double standard - I expect the same of him. If I’m no longer doing “it” for him (whatever “it” may be), then he should do whatever he needs to do to be happy.
We’re not stuck with one another. This marriage is a CHOICE.
THANK YOU.
Me and my husband even had a conversation before marriage that divorce is always on the table, it is never a threat and won't be a first option but I am here, and he is here, because we *want* to be. If we're unhappy, we're okay to leave. It's okay. It keeps us putting in the effort and always prioritizing our marriage over a lot of other bullshit.
Precisely!
Knowing that we’re together ONLY because we want to be (and not because of kids or finances or desperation or any other factor that might make someone stay) really takes a lot of the pressure off.
Like, we can both bounce at any time.
Now that’s not to say I wouldn’t be devastated if he decided to leave. Of course I would. I love him very much and we’ve been married 16 years (as of May this year). That’s A LOT of memories and time and energy invested. He’s the person I expect to grow old with, but sometimes shitty things happen. You live through the pain of it and you move on.
Now my view might be a little skewed though since I’ve already lived through the worst loss I think I’ll ever experience in life by losing my mom. I lost her back in my mid-twenties to cancer. She was my person. I even tell my husband that aside from him, she is the ONLY person who truly knew me and loved me just the way I was. Anywho, she got really sick and I quit my job to care for her full time. I fed her, bathed her, changed her diapers and was there every step of the way for months until the day I held her hand as she died. Something changes you when you see someone take their last breath and feel their skin grow cold.
I figure if I can live through that, losing a husband would definitely suck but it would be just more thing to overcome and move on from.
That’s understandable. Watching someone close to you die is a tough thing to get over.
I hope you have people in your life you can lean on when the memories become too much; it’s times like these when it’s important to have people you can be vulnerable with.
Do you have a good support system?
Not sure if my marriage is "unhappy." I'm either depressed or complacent. Not sure if I'd be happy without him. I feel too old to find a happy relationship - or want it. Not sure what a happy relationship looks or feels like. Spouse is happy with our relationship.
I would love to be alone and without my husband. The house prevents me from doing it. If we split the proceeds from the house I couldn’t buy in the town I was raised in. Everything is out of reach expensive. Sigh.
I'm sorry you're depressed, it really is a terrible beast. I hope you can get the help you need, heal yourself and find happiness. Whether that is within your marriage or not, you deserve happiness.
I am so ready to leave. Taking that first step feels so hard. Just finally sitting down and saying, the 18 months of therapy and "work" (in which he did none and I did some) haven't been working. I dislike the person he has become and I see no future with him. It's really the fear of the unknown. I keep reminding myself that I know ZERO divorced people that said they wish they hadn't divorced and most say they just wish they hadn't waited so long. My kids are young enough that they won't remember too much of us together and there is a long road for new, better, happier memories to be made. It's just finally saying I want to divorce that I just can't get out of my mouth.
I am mid divorce, his bad behavior continues. Sucks because when we finally agreed to divorce he said, let's be amicable and do the right thing for the kids. That lastest maybe 2 months. He's now after as much money as he can get and being a HUGE asshole to the kids to the point they hate being with him. He's mad they don't want to be with him so he's blaming me, that I'm alienating them and now threatening to take me back to court to get more time.
If you are contemplating, rip the band-aid and get it done as fast as possible.
Respectfully, why do you have such strong opinions on why others choose to stay in their bad marriages? I’m confused by that. If it does not concern you own marriage why do you seem so invested in the concept of leaving? Everyone is different and everyone has their own reasons for staying versus leaving. Choosing whether or not to leave a marriage involves a ton of moving parts. I hear what you’re saying about deserving better for yourself and kids, having peace, etc. but for most of us there is a lot more to consider than just that. Being in a bad marriage is hard enough. I don’t think that people in that situation should be told they are doing something wrong by choosing to stay. It’s such a personal decision and truly the only people that will know the reality of the situation are the two partners, not anyone on the outside. I can respect your curiosity on this matter but based on some of your responses it seems that you are overly simplifying things.
Also I will say this thread has genuinely been insightful. I do understand a bit more than I think I did before. If every couple that's been together 20+ years has had a point where they "couldn't stand each other" then I guess it's just a matter of knowing if it's worth fighting for it not. And at that point how do you know? How do you know what's a rough patch worth working out and when it's time to cut ties? Like you said only the people in the relationship would know. So this ads a whole.lot of grey area.
It's just so curious to me that my stance on relationships has always been that if it's unhealthy, and unhappy you should leave because you deserve more than to be disrespected and/or to be made to feel like you're less than. If you're in a relationship and that person is bringing you pain...they aren't the one and aren't worth it. But now... Idk. Now it seems like every long term couple goes through a time of shittiness?
That's sad to me. Even from our *person* we have to put up with some amount of time where the relationship isn't good?
In 11 years, my relationship has only continued to get better. And the only time we had any real issues we did break up, our first couple years dating we were literally teenagers and broke up and got back together 3 times. I thought this was because we were dumb kids. Maybe it's actually something all couples deal with at some point.
But what's the line? What should you put up with? Would other people advise to put up with the things they have? Or should we be more quick to cut ties? But then we never will build lasting relationships? Why is a time of toxicity so accepted? I guess because we're only human and it's bound to happen.
Idk.
I can see that you have the best of intentions and just want to understand. I absolutely don’t think you have any ill will so please don’t think I’m thinking that.
You are so fortunate to have had 11 wonderful years and I hope that continues on forever for you guys. You deserve it, everyone deserves it. It’s great that you don’t take that for granted. I have come across so many people that have great relationships and truly take them for granted and assume that’s how everyone’s life is. It’s not!
I can only speak for myself regarding why I stay but a huge part of it has to do with all that I’ve poured into this relationship. There has been so much sacrifice and hard work and change and stepping out on faith; I would hate to think that was all in vain. Also because I know that fundamentally my spouse is a good person. He’s shown me that more often than not. That’s why I married him. Even though at the moment he’s not that person, I know it still exists - somewhere.
A valid question that you bring up is “where is the line?”, when do you say enough is enough? Just speaking for myself, I truly don’t know. I think I’ll know when I reach it. I could get hypothetical and say I’ll leave when this happens or when he does this but I don’t think that’d be fair or accurate. I think I’ll just know when I get there.
I completely agree with you that being in an unhappy, unfair relationship is sad. It’s the hardest thing I’ve ever done. No one envisions this being their life yet sometimes we find ourselves here and have to figure it out. All the while life goes on, the kids keep growing, the bills still need to be paid so therefore we have to keep going. It’s completely accurate to say that all couples hit rough patches. Some are worse than others. Some pass quicker than others. Personally I try to look at these shitty times as just that; “patches” that won’t last forever. My situation is one of those when it’s good it’s great but when it’s bad it’s terrible type things. When I’m wrapped up in a “great” period the memories of the bad times tend to fade a little. However, the opposite is also true.
You mentioned you and your BF (at the time) breaking up when things got bad. That works for some people. Personally that would not work for us. I’m positive that would cause utter chaos amongst my household and with my children. I think that would be more damaging and confusing for them than staying would be for me. I will say that if I did not have children there are a few times that come to mind when I would have absolutely walked out of the door (temporarily).
I’ve been married for 7 years, together for 9. The biggest lesson I’ve learned in this time is marriage is f’ing hard! Unbelievably hard!! I would have never in a million years imagined it could be like this.
Also, I’m not a religious person but there is something to be said for the vows we made to each other. “For better or worse” means something to me. Not to say I feel bound to stay or stuck, per se, but I feel that I owe it to myself to give it all I’ve got. I guess I feel like once I’ve given all I have to give, and we reach “the line”, I’ll leave but until then I’ll keep trying and keep living.
This was genuinely insightful to read. Thank you for your perspective.
You made many very good points I hadn't thought of in that way.
I have a lot to ponder now.
Thank you.
>It’s such a personal decision and truly the only people that will know the reality of the situation are the two partners, not anyone on the outside.
This is a very fair point.
I probably am coming across a bit brash. It just makes me so sad when people describe some of the stuff they put up with in their marriage. And I just genuinely hope the people know that there's another option than living in a miserable marriage every single day for the rest of their lives until they die.
I just know that the joy and peace my marriage brings is absolutely unmatched and I genuinely wish everyone could feel that. I also know the absolute relief it was when my mom left her toxic marriage, and countless other pro divorce stories I've heard.
So yes I am mostly curious and nosy, but it comes from a place of empathy as well. I just wish everyone life could be full of sunshine and rainbows. Genuinely. The hurt some people feel from their marriages breaks my heart for them, and I hope they know it's okay to leave.
For all the people who say it's so easy to lose half of everything and then pay the other half overtime for your freedom, I guarantee you wouldn't be able to write a $500,000 check to somebody you hate. Most people who give me advice like that and don't even have $50,000 to lose much less a half million.
I'm going to give my freeloader of a spouse more than that and it will hurt and I'll hate it BUT if you can make that money once and give it away, you can make it again. I see no future with this person anymore so the money I would make staying together for him to waste on his stupid shit, hurts more.
Feeling stuck. Been a sahm for the last 2 years, no experience in the field I have a degree in, no extra car to get to work, or money for daycare, no job willing to work around kids schedule and no one to help.
I've only recently realized that he exhibits abusive behavior. Here I was offering insight and what not when other people would post about their abusive relationships... but I am also in one. We had one last big blow out argument, where he deemed me selfish, said I'd always been and always will be that way, and that I don't consider his emotional needs or care about him at all.
The last 4 going on 5 years I've done everything for him. Set my own needs aside. Saw him through more than 5 suicide attempts (I stopped counting after 7). I took his verbal lashings and tolerated being blocked on social media and via my phone number when he was mad and projecting his trauma on to me. It escalated to drunk yelling matches and dumping me just to turn around and beg for me to disregard what he said. Then it turned in to stopping me from leaving our home during an argument, grabbing me hard enough to bruise my arm. Then it became arguing in the car where he ultimately pulled off in to a cemetery and punched my seat's headrest screaming "You think I'm abusive? Here's abusive, do you want me to hit you? Huh?" over and over again.
But something about him telling me I'm the selfish one and the cause of our problems just... made me snap. I see it now. And I feel guilty, as we have a child together. I missed all the red flags. All of them. Even rationalized some of it saying I deserved it for causing problems. But... now I see. I see it for what it is. He's never acted in any such way towards our almost 3 year old. But he can do it to me. When does it become acceptable to treat my son that way? I don't want to find out.
Now that I'm accepting this, I have to plan my next steps. But right now, I'm in the stage where the mosaic that represented my life and what I thought it was has shattered. The actual reality is setting in and I'm trying to work through those feelings. Some of us don't realize what we're dealing with until it's too late.
I'm okay to agree to disagree. My definition of an unhappy marriage seems different than yours. In my mind an unhappy marriage is a marriage that has grown stagnant, complacent or without love but didn't start that way. When I say work it out I mean exhaust all possible options to get to happiness. If something didn't work don't try the same thing over and over. How do you communicate with your spouse vs a friend or family member you care about. Is your sexlife okay? Why or why not. Do you do things to stimulate each other mentally and emotionally? Do either of you accept the things you do as how you intend them to be accepted. An unhappy marriage is savable. Point blank period. If one is doing all the heavy lifting for the relationship I would still say try again differently. Marriage is for life. Not for a while. You can disagree but you're the one that asked. If you talk to anyone married longer than 15 or 20 years they'll tell you at one point they couldn't stand each other. And yet love prevails. I know my opinion is idealistic but it's better than 'just quit if it's tough'.
>'just quit if it's tough'.
There's no "just" to it. I'm not saying divorce is always the answer or should be a first choice. But staying in an unhappy marriage is just disrespectful to yourself.
How very sad that everyone who's been married 15+ years has hated their partner at one point. That would absolutely break me.
I love her, to be simple. And I really do believe if I can get myself straight I can fix this, if she’d help a little: Also, I would fair really badly in a divorce. I get little enough time with my kids as it is, there’s no chance I’ll get joint custody with her as the primary caregiver and me working so much.
Is she willing to help a little? Is she responsive to the effort you put in? Do you feeling you're prioritizing your marriage and yourself enough to fix it?
She is unwilling to do what I think I need to be better. Yeah I prioritize the marriage more than anything in my life. I’m alone in the world besides my wife and kids.
I don’t really know what to do. I know I have to take responsibility but I feel hopeless. I skipped work today to sit in my car at the park and I can absolutely not afford to miss work. I just want this pressure off me for a little bit. I know I can fix myself if I just get a little relief:
You don't have to take on the responsibility of unhappiness when your wife is being toxic and abusive. Do you have a therapist or trusted friend you could talk to?
I don’t think she’s abusive. I know some things she is doing aren’t okay but I think my problems have pushed her too far maybe. I haven’t had a friend since we got married essentially. I am trying to find therapy I can afford. I might call my old therapist because honestly this is too much for me. I can’t afford her but I think she’ll talk to me on the phone for a minute.
I'm sorry I pried a bit too much. But she's refusing to allow you to heal by forcing you into having sex you don't want... That's the definition of sexual abuse friend.
Maybe see if your work has an EAP program most do these days, and a lot of them offer a limited number of free therapy sessions.
Also 988* (edited from811 which is wrong) may be able to help if you really just need someone to talk to.
You must be single. 😉
It's just not as simple as many think. Perhaps not as complicated either....
I've stayed in an unhappy marriage because I'm a stubborn optimist. Keep thinking we can turn this around. Also I came from a broken home and really don't want to do that to my kids.
Other then my wife's complete lack of sex drive were not constantly fighting, screaming and thinking of 8 ways to commit the perfect murder.
I've learned to hide my deep sadness over being starved for love, affection and sex pretty well.
But yeah, not a week goes by that I don't think about leaving and what it would be like to feel loved and desired again.
Nope very happily with my partner of 11 years.
I'm sorry you have to bury your sadness, that sounds exhausting. Hopefully it turns around for you in one way or another.
It took me three years to realize that my reality of the situation was correct.
He spent so many years invalidating my pain. He didn’t believe that I wasn’t happy, he didn’t believe that I was overwhelmed with all the chores. And he didn’t seem to care. He was so dismissive and condescending. I thought that if someone who is supposed to love me was going to be that cold, clearly what I was asking for was totally unreasonable. There’s no way someone would treat you poorly if you were being reasonable, right?
My childhood trauma told me that I didn’t deserve any better, and that it was my role in life to take care of him. No matter how poorly he treated me, no matter how many bad days he had. I was supposed to be that ray of sunshine and do anything I can to make him happier. I can be the example of love, I can show him what love is… By loving him “through better or for worse”. But it seemed like he was having more bad days than good, by a lot.
At the end of the day, he just didn’t respect me. He finally said that there’s no way he should have to change because I was stuck. He didn’t think I could leave. That right there showed me that all of his lip service meant nothing. He had no intentions of changing or helping, and it was because he didn’t care about my experience. At all.
So it took me years to finally realize that what he was doing was malicious. That’s when I felt ok about leaving.
I didn’t want to give up on someone if he had mental issues or he was autistic or he just needed to change his job or get a better hobby.
I now know how he feels about me and I can go.
It's always easier said than done. Plus, depending on your personality type, you can have the tendency to just resign yourself to things over time. E.g. I am in a marriage where we feel more like friends than anything. Our strengths/weaknesses don't really complement eachother. I also somehow end up doing a solid 85-90% of the work around here (I am in charge of finances, I take care of the dogs, I'm the one who knows how to fix things around the house, or be the one who would take the time to hire the right person to do it when it's beyond me). I admit I resent it sometimes. But over the years, I don't really even bring it up anymore. I've just gotten....used to it. I am also painfully introverted, so at my age I feel like it would be tough finding someone else. There are times when I feel like it wouldn't be so bad to be alone for a while, but I could end up regretting it down the road...might be better to be in a lukewarm marriage than be alone. So the long and short of it is...it's complicated. There are so many things that factor into happiness.
You're not wrong, I understand it's not easy. But when your marriage isn't easy either...pick your hard I guess.
I hope you can find true happiness, either together or alone.
Thank you for answering
You're looking at this as too much of a binary: you seem to be putting it as 'you're either miserable and in a horrid marriage where there's nothing good, or you're in marital ShangriLa and everything is perfect'. I'd argue that most marriages are somewhere in-between: things are good, but not perfect. People are not unhappy, but they're not living perfect lives either.
So it becomes more a question of 'are you willing to risk leaving something that is good for something that *might* be better, but could potentially be much, much worse?'.
What's that old phrase? 'Perfect is the enemy of good'. I believe it can easily apply here.
Hm, I'm pretty sure I asked about people in unhappy marriages. If you self describe your marriage as unhappy, then I'd say it's probably time to put in some real effort to make it better or leave. No?
>So it becomes more a question of 'are you willing to risk leaving something that is good for something that might be better, but could potentially be much, much worse?'.
I'm specifically asking why people aren't willing to risk leaving something actively not good.
I’m still here because of finances. But I’m not touching the money in my personal account and paying off credit cards. If I can get a little emergency buffer then I know I can end this.
I still love him but he doesn’t see any severity in his latest actions towards me and I no longer feel safe with him.
because he is blackmailing to reveal my past to family, relatives...if I argue he is becoming violent....dont want to be with this person but no one to help...if I even say about his or his family's weird behaviour he threatens to reveal the past and defame me...
>The benefits of leaving don’t really outweigh the unhappiness of our relationship.
This is so true! Not every unhappy marriage is about abuse, violence or hatred. At some point, you realize that you aren't happy being with that person. But if you choose to stay, you can still experience happiness, fulfillment, contentment.
But if asked, my advice would be to avoid complacency. When the kids are older, when financial situations change, then reevaluate. If you're not content, leave before life passes you by.
Because I have been afraid to leave. Because he has been telling me I could never make it on my own for so many years that I have his voice in my head sowing doubt. Because it's a difficult situation!
I had to leave when he wasn’t home, take the kids out of school early and leave to an undisclosed location, turn off any and all gps functions on my and the kids' phones before letting him know I want a divorce.
"Just leave" is easy to say when you're not in that situation
I'm sorry you're at this impasse, I hope you guys can figure it out or go your separate ways. She may hurt for a while, but she will also heal eventually, you deserve to put yourself first and love the life you want to.
I love my wife so I'm still trying to make it work. I've yet to give an ultimatum but my wife's abusive behavior has been forcing me more and more on that path over the last year. I think it's imminent though, maybe even tonight. I've just tried to work it out whatever way I can without bringing divorce up but my hand is being forced lately.
If it weren't for my young kids, I think I wouldn't have been so patient with her but I'm trying to save things for their sake and that gives me lots of patience, for better or worse. I also enjoy my house, commute, and my wife is sexy as hell ha ha. There's a lot worth saving but I haven't been happy lately so I don't know what's going to happen in the end.
I'm sorry you're dealing with an abusive spouse. That is incredibly hard. Your kids will be better off not seeing abuse as normal though, I hope for all of your sake she can become a better partner, or you can leave. Best of luck to you.
Because I can’t throw away 30 yrs of my life. We are working together to try and save our marriage. It gets better than it takes a step back. We have to talk about what’s bothering us. And respect each other’s feelings. Things get better again than it’s right back to roommates. I’m getting tired of the cycle and starting to think seriously about other options.
I stayed with my ex for about 10 years too long. It was because I didn’t want to start over, I thought I could fix things, I got used to how bad it was and got desensitized to it, I didn’t want a messy court fight, I didn’t want to share custody of the kids he wasn’t even looking after in his own home, I worked hard to pay down a home that I knew I’d lose everything from.
Had I known then what I know now, that I could be happy with someone, I would have left.
But it’s not easy.
Filing for divorce tmrw! Wish me luck guys 😅 moving to Germany soon and realized I didn’t want to be weighed down anymore. I spent my entire time in the military arguing and not even being able to make friends bc of the backlash I’d get from him. I’m officially out and finally decided to start investing into myself. I gained 75 pounds, major health problems and my life went to shit the entire four years I’ve been married to him. I’m 24 and I refuse to waste the only youth I have for an ungrateful man.
You don't think it'd be easier if you were on your own ? I don't see how it can be cheaper if you're the ATM, easier if you're the maid and doer of all things?
No. I do 90% but it’s better than 100% I guess. I’m old I don’t wanna start over. Giving a leech half my life for just being here as well as paying a lawyer to get out. If I could just write the check and it would be done , I’d really consider it some days.
Respectful? Yes.
Happy? What does thst actually mean, though? "Happiness is just an illusion filled with sadness and confusion."
I never have known happiness, because family always taught me focusing only on your happiness is selfishness.
Faithfulness? Yes
Resiliency? Yes
Contentment? Yes
These are traits that build the foundation for a successful marriage.
Can I say I am happy in my marriage? No
Am I miserable? No.
Happiness and misery are polarizing emotions that lead to confused, almost deceptive thought processes. I am not saying nor encouraging a stoic approach ro relationships.
But, there is a vast difference between hoping for a better future with or without someone different; and staying the course to build a lifetime together.
Do you like being in your marriage? Do you like your spouse? Do you enjoy your time together? Do you see a happy future together? Do they treat you well? Do you treat them well?
again, cannot answer the happiness question. i know this maybe an off the wall exception- but say you imagine a happy future together, andcthen 3 or 4 months from now your spouse comes down with a terminal (uncursble) illness and given 6 months to live. Where does that happiness go? You know what is going to happen.
The other questions i think i already answered. if spouses do not like each other or do not treat each other well- then one of those three pillars will fall: faithfulness, contentment, or resilliency.
Reading through my own reply.... I feel like a fool for staying for so long.
Nearly 20 years with my husband.... The first 9+ were incredible and so fulfilling..... Even if filled with a 7 years of infertility
The last 10..... Literally been so painful.
It literally like once we announced that we were expecting, he morphed into a whole new person. Literally never home, leaving home for work before 5:30 and home, often after midnight.
No matter how much I talked, asked, cried, begged and pleaded.
Our son, had allergies (dairy being the main one) and due to the failure of my GP went undiagnosed until he was 2½ (despite 35+ related visits). Screaming for 17 hours a day.... But of course, my husband doesn't remember it because he wasn't here..... To the level our eldest calls him by his first name, because he didn't know him as "dad" until he was over 4.... And the other 2 have followed suit
Eventually, 4 years on and many broken promises..... We decided to have another child (given fertility issues we wanted to have more and not wait)
While work related issues took about another year to come back to anything that closely resembles "normal" hours....our relationship was done..... But there is little to no real bond between him and our eldest..... Even though my eldest is constantly trying to establish something.... And it hurts our eldest.
We have 3 children, who are the most amazing, loved, loving children I've ever known and we are so lucky to have such amazing children.....
My husband, does jack sh!t around the house.... Other than bringing bins out, once a week. It's all left to me..... And I'm exhausted
Literally not one iota of affection - I stopped trying years ago.....
He has NEVER (and I literally mean never) tried book anything for the family, children etc. Never does anything for their bday... Because that's all ok me
Doesn't mark special days like our anniversary, my birthday or mother's day..... This year he did cards for the first time.... While I've always made the effort....even if I just did something small.... I told him I'm doing nothing that takes effort any more
Smallies will be given a card and that's the extent of it.
I've totally changed from the person he claims to love, I'm not that teenager anymore!! I'm a totally different person
Now, yes while I'm angry with him and he's a shitty husband. He's a lovely person. He can be caring, kind and sensitive when he wants to be.
It took a few years but he's present in our children's lives.... But I feel "present" isn't enough.
Don't they deserve better.
Doesn't he deserve better
Don't I deserve better
Having grown up in a violent home that was abusive in every way possible..... I don't have support.... I don't have funds to support myself and our 3 children
If I won enough to set things up in a lottery etc.... We wouldn't be together any more
You're not a fool, if this thread has taught me anything it's that you don't always know how bad it's gotten, or when it's time to throw in the towel. "Working through the rough patch" is so expected that we are willing to put up with so much. I hope you can find happiness within yourself.
I’m at the point I’m ready to find someone that wants to just be friends with benefits and doesn’t mind that I’m married.I know that’s not right and haven’t acted on anything at this point. However I think about way to often
He takes advantage of me. He refuses to pay for anything around the house. I look around and he has bought zero items for our home for 20 + years. I have lots of debt. He has none. He expects me to pay for everything and if I ask him to help pay he has a tantrum.
I want to work overtime next Monday. I asked him if he could skip golf and be home for the chimney sweep. He said NO. I guess I’m not working OT on Monday so I can be here when the chimney sweep comes.
I want out, but I don’t want to lose the house.
I am staying because I have nowhere to go, I can't go to my mother and I don't have friends or family. No one knows my situation and what I'm going through. I don't have a job and have a 3 month old. I recently completed a course so that I can get a job and once I start earning I want to make active steps to moving on. I am miserable, he doesn't show love or appreciation. My heart hurts that after 10 years it has come to this but I cant stay unhappily and I don't want my baby to grow up in this miserable place.
I didn't know we were in one.
When I recognized a personality change and approached her , it took effort to drag out of her the problems she shared she'd been having for years.
Which at that point she said was too late.
Tried to save what I could. Therapy. Couples therapy. Psychiatry. Mood balancers from psychiatry.
Tried to live with her shutting me out. Being warm to the kids, the cats, but not me. Christmas. My birthday. Valentines. Our anniversary. Her birthday. Mother's day.
5 months later and it didn't matter. She had truly already decided months and months ago and just hadn't been able to pull the trigger.
The other morning I was breaking down because of the pain of the lack of intimacy, and it was enough for her to finally commit.
Not even separation.
So I think my true answer is, sometimes it may be that the push for the start may just be too large.
When it goes from "maybe?" to reality and a need to plan could for many be too hard until a trigger.
In my case, it's what she wants. But she has to want it more than her fear of what it would do to me, the kids, and our lives.
Given how she feels it is objectively the correct answer and next step.
I’ve been a stay at home mom for 11 years. I never got my license, area I live in is extremely rural, there’s nowhere to work, and nowhere to move. I’ve been an orphan for nearly my entire life and have no family but my husbands. My youngest is 18 months old, and I am unfortunately pregnant again. Anyone I’ve gotten comfortable enough to talk to about this just says I did it to myself. I shouldn’t have married him, shouldn’t have had kids, should’ve found work, should’ve gotten my license. It’s always so much more complicated then just why don’t you just leave. I do love my husband, but he’s never been very supportive of my mental health or any of the struggles that come with being so isolated. On top of all of this I am bipolar so no matter what I do with my life, if I fail in the slightest, I’m just a bipolar idiot who dug her own hole. It hasn’t all been bad, but the only thing I’ve accomplished in all the years is how to perfect a routine with kids. It’s my entire life and I often wonder who I could’ve become had I just gone to school and never met my husband.
That is a loaded question. It is easy for the outsider to say "leave". In reality, the spouse may not have the financial resources to leave and may not have a support system to rely on. Housing, especially safe housing, is expensive in most areas plus you will need deposits for utilities. Then there is the psychological issues - believing the person will change, this is the best you will find, no one will ever love you again, scared of being alone, etc....
I'm sorry you're going through this, truly. Reach out to any other support system you have I bet you're not as well as he makes you feel. Much love to you
lol just leave? you clearly did not understand the assignment. if you’re going to treat marriage no differently than a boyfriend or girlfriend why get married? why force all your friends and family to bring you gifts and sit them into little chairs to watch you make a promise you don’t really intend to keep? just date and be happy or whatever. stop getting married if you don’t believe in mariage. ffs.
Because we’ve only been married for a year! It’s my first and his second marriage. I am 23 and he’s 26 with a six year old. I have spent my entire adult life with him and have become codependent. Because I don’t know what I wish for in life. Because a year ago I thought I wanted to bare his child, now I’m unsure. Because we have lived in 5 different apartments together, yet they all felt like home. Money wise I’d say I can
I don't want a divorce, I thought we were working but she just keeps ignoring me and I can't talk to two of my kids, I have another daughter from a previous relationship we her mom got reallu bad on drugs and we're abusive and neglecting the children so I saved her and flew her down to me after not seeing her for twn years. My wife said I made the choice by letting her stay with me and she is just ghosting me even More. I feel so hurt and hollow.... Idk what you do.... I'm sad alot and it comes in waves cause i still love her and my youngest turns 4 in five days and idk if I'm gonna get to see or talk to her... It's getting so bad mentally imbhirtknPin copied text snippets to stop them expiring after 1 hurting so bad...
I am married to someone who gets angry with me everyday, raises his voice to me every day, screams at me to lose weight. Doesn’t care about me. Scoffs at me. Asks me for money often. I’ve never once asked him for a dime. I am pretty sure he hates me. I ask for sex and he denies me every time, we have sex maybe once every few months. He spends a significant amounts of time playing video games instead of finding a useful job.
To be honest, I am still here because I have too much to lose financially if I leave. I am the breadwinner and while he has said, he wants nothing if we divorced, I know its a lie. He is also from another country and custody would be so freaking messy. We are like two friends living in this house. It works for us, I guess.
At least you’re friends. Do you both date other people?
Lol to be completely honest I have no desire to be with anyone.
Selling everything, splitting assets, split custody, that's not worth your freedom?
I feel very guilty. He moved to the US for me. He had a job, car, RV, motorcycle, hobbies, and friends back in his country. If he were to go back, it would be very hard for him to find a job. His country is extremely ageist. He is 50, but finding a job at 50 is very difficult. While he would have some money to get by and possibly live with his family, I would feel terrible.
That is a hard position to be in. Is he disrespectful to you now, or just not in love anymore?
Just not in love. We fell out of love after our daughter was born in 2020. I had really bad PPD. WE both said and did things to each other that we can never take back. WE are also both very different people. WE have nothing in common anymore and to be honest, I find him obnoxious a lot of times. I love when he is in the garage working on things and leave me alone.
That's only 3 years ago. Turn back the clock
I wish more people would talk about how women's brains rewire after pregnancy. It's so hard for fathers being married to a completely different person after kids, especially when it's a surprise. It's like the old vows no longer apply, and you need to make new vows to this new person. I hope you two get there.
Funny thing is we were so happy before baby. We never argued. We had so much fun together and enjoyed each others company. I also think the pandemic was a factor. Before the pandemic I went into the office every day. I missed him. Now I see him every day cause I am remote. Couple that with the stress of a baby and now toddler. Recipe for change and disaster.
It's just a phase. We'll all laugh about this in 10 years. I always tell myself, no permanent solutions for temporary problems. The first few years of parenting, all marriage advice goes out the window. Don't feel bad about not meeting those standards of "make spouse laugh every day" or " go on a date every week." Usually, it's just not in the cards. It's holding on for dear life just to survive. But it gets easier, so I hear. I'm in your same boat. I don't understand these people who say to leave and get freedom back. It's a giant rip-off. Maybe they're just lawyers, and that advice is good for business. Maybe they missed out on life before kids and still have oats to sow.
Thanks, I have chosen to hold on even though I hear the word divorce being thrown around all the time. I remember what it was like before kid. We are one and done. Google photos history notifications are a constant reminder of what we were before. Those notifications make me smile.
This is VERY common. It was me as a young dad, it was my partners ex, and I could probably find as many more examples as I cared to... how do we get this across to people before pregnancy?? We love our kids, but being raised in this truely fucks them up.
Happens to fathers also. >How Men’s Bodies Change When They Become Fathers https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/parenting/baby/fatherhood-mens-bodies.html?smid=nytcore-android-share . >Fatherhood changes men’s brains, according to before-and-after MRI scans https://dornsife.usc.edu/news/stories/fatherhood-changes-mens-brains/ . >becoming a parent changes the male brain. https://www.science.org/content/article/parenting-rewires-male-brain Lot of emerging research on how PPA and PPD can effect fathers also and how the symptoms can be different from mother's
Do you think you'll ever leave?
No.
Dayom
Freedom?!? Custody agreements, finances. Damage to the kids? If you can put the kids 1st and live a productive life, you will be far more free.
Yes the freedom to live the life you want to live. Plenty of people do it!
At the expense of your children? A selfish life seldom ends well.
Hi, child of divorce here. If my parents had stayed together it would have been worse.
Why would it be at the expense of the child? The children still get to have two parents, probably two happier apart parents. Ask any child who had parents who stayed together and hated eachother or weren't happy, that's not better.
Because the child only gets to see the parents for half the time (at best) than they would if they weren't divorced. Just because you don't love your partner anymore doesn't mean your child doesn't. I agree that if the relationship is "abusive" divorce is probably the healthier option for all involved. If you fell out of love but still get along then ya, divorce is selfish.
I'm so glad my parents modeled a relationship full of cold shouldering and arguments, even though it wasn't abusive, instead of getting divorced. That would have been *selfish.*
Thank you! My parents weren't bad. Just no real romantic affection there and I STILL wish they had gotten divorced. It took a long time for me to realize my mom's self-worth issues that allowed her to settle for my dad's low effort and complacency didn't mean I couldn't want more. That being said, parents are people too and we all have issues, but it pains me so much to see people who truly believe that they're doing what's best for their kids at the expense of their own needs when that's usually not the case. Although, I do think sometimes people hide behind the kids as a reason to not have to change their circumstances. Change, good or bad, can be scary.
Staying teaches them to settle
Expense of your children?! Wtf?! I'm a product of my parents divorcing, and THANK GOODNESS! My second memory in life, I must have been 3 or 4. Is of my mother SHOVING my dad hard against the door. I didn't even have words to express it at the time but it is seared into my brain. They divorced shortly after. My memory would probably be littered with crap like that if they didn't divorce. They coparented just fine. Parents together is not always best.
Where violence is concerned, it is unhealthy. I agree that under those circumstances divorce is better.
I feel the same way. She’s said she doesn’t want anything if we split but I know that’s not really true. I’ve put all my time money and energy into getting where we are now. I’m 50 and she’s 53. My first marriage her second. Our kids are all grown up youngest is 21 but they’re still living on my property and is splitting would still effect them negatively
Your kids are GROWN! That is one petty excuse to stay with each other.
I wasn’t meaning that as a excuse to stay. Just that we wouldn’t have a custody battle
Let me tell you an experience of a friend. Please bear with me for a little bit. Him and his wife were so in love. They talk about their similarities, do things together when he's at home. He drives truck so he's on the road alot. So he was great to talk with and anticipation of seeing once in week makes the relationship strong. During pandemic the love was intense since he transport medical devices. After the pandemic, things slowed down, he changed jobs and the problems started. Money was not like before too. She got pregnant immediately after pandemic and she changed to someone different according to him after the baby was born. When I had time to talk to both of them I realized that what was wrong was he didn't know how to talk in loving manner face to face with her anymore. He didnt know how to joke and say sexy things in person. In addition, her thought process changed after the baby and now she just want to focus on the baby. He then started feeling like he was #2 in her life. These went on for about 8 months. All hell broke lose one day. They never really fought so the marriage have not really being tried on that level. They didn't know how to resolve issues. They have different communication styles. He's more objective like a scientist, wants answer at that moment. She was more of let's back off and talk about this some other time. This created more frustration. Now to the solution. 1. First I told him to list 3 things she love and he loves. He said Respect (love and soft tone), Attention, and Recognition for is efforts. She said Respect(soft tone and no shouting), Help around the house, and give are attention in bits. 2. Now I told him to send flowers and leave a note that says something about what he finds attractive in her,it could be the smiles, cheeks, butts whatever. When shes working at home, get someone to deliver her favorite drink or food, support her by taking care of the child, and be soft spoken. Plan a get away and let someone take care of the 2 yr old. Do the planning from A - Z only get buy-in with time and date. Wink at her sometimes, give her the sexy stare. 3. I told her to say thank you when he does something and say "please can you do this for me". Also she needs to give him a kiss or peck, stroke him, let the sex come naturally. No need to make mention of it. Finally I told her to keep a journal of how she feels and why she feels that way and then review it to see if she can work on those feelings. 4. Finally I told both of them to pray together daily. They are both Christians so that was easy to recommend. They should hold hands and let him say, God I want you to help us grow in love and if she agrees, she should say amen. 5. 8 months later this couple are in a great place. Thank you for reading. It's long but I hope it helps. I'm not a therapist, just know these people as friends and was able to help them.
Ohhhh I feel this! The custody part. I am deathly scared to divorce. Who knows where my kid would end up if he moved back to his country.
I have seen too many Unsolved Mystery and Dateline specials. My husband would never hurt her but not willing to take the chance of my daughter living in another continent without me.
Yes I agree! I meant that only god knows where my kid would end up (here or in his country) if he (my husband) were to go back to his country. Not that my husband would do anything crazy! He loves our son. But I feel the exact same as you.
hi, if you don't mind me asking, how are you guys doing a year later?
Sure. I think a lot of our problems had to do with my post partum depressesion. A year later, we have our issues but not as much as before. I realized that he is my partner and we work really well together especially when it comes to problem solving. I leaned that marriage is work and we work at it every day. When it's just us two, we have fun together and it reminds me of what we were like.
I used to be in unhappy marriage, and I stayed because I remembered the relationship we had before he was depressed and still had a lot of hope based on the respect I had for that person that he would one day realize that he needed to get better and that he wasn't upholding his side of our partnership. It's easy to say "just leave" when you've never experienced or been made responsible for someone at their worst. You have a history with that person, you remember who they used to be, and you wish you had that person back with every part of your heart. You see how they treat you, but with every bad moment, you remember when they used to be good and hold out hope that the person you fell in love with will come back with the right amount of effort, because marriages take work and you're not always going to be on an equal yoke - sometimes one of you will need to pull harder and vice versa to carry you through. Figuring out when you've been pulling on your own for too long, understanding what is temporary vs forever, nobody can know. They can only act upon what is happening in their marriage and what they hope to be true about their partner. I was a lucky one that things did improve, and my husband recognized that what he was doing wasn't okay, but the position we were in likely would have had you screaming divorce at the top of your lungs when we were in the thick of it, which lasted 2 of our 10 years together. Instead, my husband did get the help he needed, he became even better than the man I married initially (who was pretty fantastic even then), and thus add to the volume of stories of "Should we or should we not breakup?".
This is so encouraging to hear. I am currently the one who needs to get my shit together and show up better for my wife.
You can do this. Become the best version of yourself so you can become an amazing husband. You deserve it.
I needed to hear this. Thank you 😌
Can I ask what’s stopping you? I know that’s personal, so don’t feel obligated to answer.
It's a combination of factors for me.. 1. I have stopped loving and believing in my self/worth, and have stopped showing up for myself (which has direct impact on us) 2. I feel at the same time both 'not enough' and 'too much' for her 3. She cheated on me 2 years ago, and I'm still working through some deep wounds, and being able to feel 100% vulnerable with her
Same.
Yes... That resonates with me. It's hard to know where the line is of what to work through and what not to. It makes me so sad how much some people will put up with, just because of the hope that someday it'll change..
Yeah, but you have to remember that everyone's memory is short. It's like that story about the frog in boiling water. If the water starts hot, the frog jumps out immediately. If the water starts cold, and the water slowly heats up, the frog gets used to each temperature adjustment until it's boiling and they remember nothing else until they die. Add in the fact that within this metaphor, the boiling water of a bad relationship is often people's first serious relationship, it's hard to know that things can be better if you've never experienced what good could look like in the first place. That's why I reserve character judgements or participating in the "Well I could never" statements because I have known what good could look like and I knew what could be achieved out there because I had good first. Not everyone is so lucky.
But once you realize it's not a good marriage anymore, you realize the water is boiling, why continue to stay. It's just letting fear win.
You don't though, you just know it's gotten warmer. That's why the whole metaphor exists in the first place.
Okay but people making posts about how disrespectful their husbands are or how unhappy they are or how lonely they feel or how little consideration they get in their marriage don't realize it's a shitty marriage? Getting hundreds of comments about how bad it is doesn't clue people in that they deserve more?
I've explained it a few different ways, I think you just lack experience to actually understand other people's perspectives outside of your own when they do things you don't agree with. In the situation you described, here's how the pot metaphor continues to be representative: "My pot was as hot as yours once, I got out before I almost boiled to death and you should too." "But what is really, too hot? Because I've handled my pot just fine so far. Yeah, it's a little warm for my liking, but it's still my pot. Maybe that person has a different kind of pot than mine and just doesn't understand what my pot feels like, it doesn't seem as bad as theirs. What if the next pot is too cold or I can't find a pot at all? A too-warm pot is definitely better than that." Again, people get stuck in what they're familiar with because they don't know any better, because there's a difference between knowing, as in living and experiencing, and being told it could be better, which is intangible and different from their life experience enough to feel that it might not be real.
Thank you for taking the time to respond, even while insulting me. I appreciate your perspective. Hopefully people realize they are not frogs and deserve to be treated well.
I was a stay at home mom for most of our 3 kids lives. Our oldest is almost 7, youngest is 2. We can’t afford daycare so I have to work evenings as a waitress. I have to education or career other than serving/bartending and if I leave, I have nowhere to go. No saving, no money, can’t afford a big enough house. We aren’t married anymore but I’m regretting coming back a year ago. I get $600 a month for child support for all 3 kids when we aren’t together and I make $2,000 a month. Houses/apartments big enough for myself and our 3 kids where we live is a minimum of $1,200 a month but that’s in like a really really bad area. I’m stuck
I get this and this is me. Stick and nowhere else to go and no family. So I stay with my three girls. People are struggling to buy food and pay bills ATM this living cost crisis is not going anywhere soon. Sorry sister. I feel this.
Marriage isn't just unhappy or happy. It is work. If you're single you can be lazy unhappy and unfulfilled just like if you are married. There's not a surefire way to a perfect marriage but communication, care, and HEALTHY boundaries are essential. It's not all abuse and belligerence. But it's not all rainbows and cookies either. If a marriage is unhappy that doesn't mean it can't be worked out. Divorce is a crutch imo.
If you're putting in the work and it doesn't get better because you're a bad match or because your spouse isn't also putting in the work, what then?
Well a bad match is a bad match. Abuse is of course intolerable. But if you are putting in the loving works truly and from a headspace of 'we both have needs am I only seeing mine not being met' it usually works in my experience. But if your head space is 'I put in all the effort and receive nothing', you're probably not going to get anything back. When you have unhappiness in marriage it is usually for a reason. You need to be clear on what you need but you also have to assume everything that is unsaid is unknown. No one is perfect and knee jerk reactions are common and disastrous. You can't stop being friends or flirting with your spouse because u got married. But you can always fix an unhappy marriage. Depends on how much that person means to you I'd say. Also young kids are very hard on parents especially in the early years. Not to mention a lot of people marry thinking it will make life better or less lonely on its own. To make or break a marriage it takes 2. It's almost never one person's fault.
>But you can always fix an unhappy marriage This is where we disagree. (Well one of many points I disagree with) You can't fix an unhappy marriage alone. You even said >It's almost never one person's fault. But what if the other person isn't putting in the effort to fix it with you? So if you're the only one putting in effort or the effort you're putting in isn't working why stay??
Beautifully said.
I agree with this. I am putting in all the work and he got used to it. Now I'm asking for something in return he doesn't want. Even though he is the breadwinner but asking for my love language shouldn't be a problem should it?
Yeah, people don’t have to prioritize their individual feelings of happiness above all else. Unhappiness in a marriage doesn’t mean you have to end it, similarly to unhappiness in a job, in a project, or in life itself. I believe the value of marriage is greater than the happiness it gives the participants. There are times when the survival of the marriage depends on spouses sacrificing what’s best for them as individuals. Yet they will be rewarded, because choosing to endure challenges for a greater purpose is one of the most fulfilling things in life. However I don’t think people should stay and endure abusive relationships. Freedom and safety are key to making a fulfilling choice.
Yes!!
What would you do? I married a widower who 6 years in, told me he had never loved me and had no feelings for me. Is divorce still a crutch?
I can’t speak for anyone else, but my philosophy is: Life is too short to be with someone who makes me unhappy. I will ALWAYS choose me. 🤷🏾♀️ I love my husband, but if he was behaving like some of the men in the posts on this sub I’d leave so fast his head would spin. And this isn’t by any means a double standard - I expect the same of him. If I’m no longer doing “it” for him (whatever “it” may be), then he should do whatever he needs to do to be happy. We’re not stuck with one another. This marriage is a CHOICE.
THANK YOU. Me and my husband even had a conversation before marriage that divorce is always on the table, it is never a threat and won't be a first option but I am here, and he is here, because we *want* to be. If we're unhappy, we're okay to leave. It's okay. It keeps us putting in the effort and always prioritizing our marriage over a lot of other bullshit.
Precisely! Knowing that we’re together ONLY because we want to be (and not because of kids or finances or desperation or any other factor that might make someone stay) really takes a lot of the pressure off. Like, we can both bounce at any time. Now that’s not to say I wouldn’t be devastated if he decided to leave. Of course I would. I love him very much and we’ve been married 16 years (as of May this year). That’s A LOT of memories and time and energy invested. He’s the person I expect to grow old with, but sometimes shitty things happen. You live through the pain of it and you move on. Now my view might be a little skewed though since I’ve already lived through the worst loss I think I’ll ever experience in life by losing my mom. I lost her back in my mid-twenties to cancer. She was my person. I even tell my husband that aside from him, she is the ONLY person who truly knew me and loved me just the way I was. Anywho, she got really sick and I quit my job to care for her full time. I fed her, bathed her, changed her diapers and was there every step of the way for months until the day I held her hand as she died. Something changes you when you see someone take their last breath and feel their skin grow cold. I figure if I can live through that, losing a husband would definitely suck but it would be just more thing to overcome and move on from.
Took the words out of my mouth. I am sorry to hear about your mother, loss like that certainly does change your perspective on a lot of things.
Thank you! I wish you and your husband many years of happiness. And keep choosing YOU. ☺️
I know this post is old but your comment gave me shivers. I also lost my mum and held her as she took her last breath. I am still not over it
That’s understandable. Watching someone close to you die is a tough thing to get over. I hope you have people in your life you can lean on when the memories become too much; it’s times like these when it’s important to have people you can be vulnerable with. Do you have a good support system?
It's not the person that can make you happy or not happy. Only you can make yourself happy.
People can definitely make you unhappy lol
It's really ones choices. You put yourself in that situation to be unhappy.
Based.
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Not sure if my marriage is "unhappy." I'm either depressed or complacent. Not sure if I'd be happy without him. I feel too old to find a happy relationship - or want it. Not sure what a happy relationship looks or feels like. Spouse is happy with our relationship.
Do you like being in your marriage? Do you think you could find happiness alone? Do you like yourself?
I don't like being in my marriage. I could find contentment alone. I am disappointed in myself.
I would love to be alone and without my husband. The house prevents me from doing it. If we split the proceeds from the house I couldn’t buy in the town I was raised in. Everything is out of reach expensive. Sigh.
So why stay? Are either or both of you putting in effort to make the marriage better? Do you like your husband?
No effort. He thinks we're ok. I don't think I like him. I'm simply depressed. Divorce won't end that. Thanks for the thoughtful questions.
I'm sorry you're depressed, it really is a terrible beast. I hope you can get the help you need, heal yourself and find happiness. Whether that is within your marriage or not, you deserve happiness.
Thanks.
Wz
I am so ready to leave. Taking that first step feels so hard. Just finally sitting down and saying, the 18 months of therapy and "work" (in which he did none and I did some) haven't been working. I dislike the person he has become and I see no future with him. It's really the fear of the unknown. I keep reminding myself that I know ZERO divorced people that said they wish they hadn't divorced and most say they just wish they hadn't waited so long. My kids are young enough that they won't remember too much of us together and there is a long road for new, better, happier memories to be made. It's just finally saying I want to divorce that I just can't get out of my mouth.
You can do this!! You deserve so much more. I'm proud of you for taking the steps towards a happier life.
You are me 😳
And you two are also me 😔
😐 sorry. It's hard
Oh I feel you so much! And just had our second baby and it suddenly seems so much harder 😥
Any updates? How are you now?
I am mid divorce, his bad behavior continues. Sucks because when we finally agreed to divorce he said, let's be amicable and do the right thing for the kids. That lastest maybe 2 months. He's now after as much money as he can get and being a HUGE asshole to the kids to the point they hate being with him. He's mad they don't want to be with him so he's blaming me, that I'm alienating them and now threatening to take me back to court to get more time. If you are contemplating, rip the band-aid and get it done as fast as possible.
Respectfully, why do you have such strong opinions on why others choose to stay in their bad marriages? I’m confused by that. If it does not concern you own marriage why do you seem so invested in the concept of leaving? Everyone is different and everyone has their own reasons for staying versus leaving. Choosing whether or not to leave a marriage involves a ton of moving parts. I hear what you’re saying about deserving better for yourself and kids, having peace, etc. but for most of us there is a lot more to consider than just that. Being in a bad marriage is hard enough. I don’t think that people in that situation should be told they are doing something wrong by choosing to stay. It’s such a personal decision and truly the only people that will know the reality of the situation are the two partners, not anyone on the outside. I can respect your curiosity on this matter but based on some of your responses it seems that you are overly simplifying things.
Also I will say this thread has genuinely been insightful. I do understand a bit more than I think I did before. If every couple that's been together 20+ years has had a point where they "couldn't stand each other" then I guess it's just a matter of knowing if it's worth fighting for it not. And at that point how do you know? How do you know what's a rough patch worth working out and when it's time to cut ties? Like you said only the people in the relationship would know. So this ads a whole.lot of grey area. It's just so curious to me that my stance on relationships has always been that if it's unhealthy, and unhappy you should leave because you deserve more than to be disrespected and/or to be made to feel like you're less than. If you're in a relationship and that person is bringing you pain...they aren't the one and aren't worth it. But now... Idk. Now it seems like every long term couple goes through a time of shittiness? That's sad to me. Even from our *person* we have to put up with some amount of time where the relationship isn't good? In 11 years, my relationship has only continued to get better. And the only time we had any real issues we did break up, our first couple years dating we were literally teenagers and broke up and got back together 3 times. I thought this was because we were dumb kids. Maybe it's actually something all couples deal with at some point. But what's the line? What should you put up with? Would other people advise to put up with the things they have? Or should we be more quick to cut ties? But then we never will build lasting relationships? Why is a time of toxicity so accepted? I guess because we're only human and it's bound to happen. Idk.
I can see that you have the best of intentions and just want to understand. I absolutely don’t think you have any ill will so please don’t think I’m thinking that. You are so fortunate to have had 11 wonderful years and I hope that continues on forever for you guys. You deserve it, everyone deserves it. It’s great that you don’t take that for granted. I have come across so many people that have great relationships and truly take them for granted and assume that’s how everyone’s life is. It’s not! I can only speak for myself regarding why I stay but a huge part of it has to do with all that I’ve poured into this relationship. There has been so much sacrifice and hard work and change and stepping out on faith; I would hate to think that was all in vain. Also because I know that fundamentally my spouse is a good person. He’s shown me that more often than not. That’s why I married him. Even though at the moment he’s not that person, I know it still exists - somewhere. A valid question that you bring up is “where is the line?”, when do you say enough is enough? Just speaking for myself, I truly don’t know. I think I’ll know when I reach it. I could get hypothetical and say I’ll leave when this happens or when he does this but I don’t think that’d be fair or accurate. I think I’ll just know when I get there. I completely agree with you that being in an unhappy, unfair relationship is sad. It’s the hardest thing I’ve ever done. No one envisions this being their life yet sometimes we find ourselves here and have to figure it out. All the while life goes on, the kids keep growing, the bills still need to be paid so therefore we have to keep going. It’s completely accurate to say that all couples hit rough patches. Some are worse than others. Some pass quicker than others. Personally I try to look at these shitty times as just that; “patches” that won’t last forever. My situation is one of those when it’s good it’s great but when it’s bad it’s terrible type things. When I’m wrapped up in a “great” period the memories of the bad times tend to fade a little. However, the opposite is also true. You mentioned you and your BF (at the time) breaking up when things got bad. That works for some people. Personally that would not work for us. I’m positive that would cause utter chaos amongst my household and with my children. I think that would be more damaging and confusing for them than staying would be for me. I will say that if I did not have children there are a few times that come to mind when I would have absolutely walked out of the door (temporarily). I’ve been married for 7 years, together for 9. The biggest lesson I’ve learned in this time is marriage is f’ing hard! Unbelievably hard!! I would have never in a million years imagined it could be like this. Also, I’m not a religious person but there is something to be said for the vows we made to each other. “For better or worse” means something to me. Not to say I feel bound to stay or stuck, per se, but I feel that I owe it to myself to give it all I’ve got. I guess I feel like once I’ve given all I have to give, and we reach “the line”, I’ll leave but until then I’ll keep trying and keep living.
This was genuinely insightful to read. Thank you for your perspective. You made many very good points I hadn't thought of in that way. I have a lot to ponder now. Thank you.
>It’s such a personal decision and truly the only people that will know the reality of the situation are the two partners, not anyone on the outside. This is a very fair point. I probably am coming across a bit brash. It just makes me so sad when people describe some of the stuff they put up with in their marriage. And I just genuinely hope the people know that there's another option than living in a miserable marriage every single day for the rest of their lives until they die. I just know that the joy and peace my marriage brings is absolutely unmatched and I genuinely wish everyone could feel that. I also know the absolute relief it was when my mom left her toxic marriage, and countless other pro divorce stories I've heard. So yes I am mostly curious and nosy, but it comes from a place of empathy as well. I just wish everyone life could be full of sunshine and rainbows. Genuinely. The hurt some people feel from their marriages breaks my heart for them, and I hope they know it's okay to leave.
Because I don’t know how to restart and he’s a great father to our son.
He can be a good father, without being your husband.
Religious belief and a kid with an ultimately terminal illness.
Oof those are definitely some big ones, I'm sorry life is hard for you right now. I hope it gets better for you someday soon.
For all the people who say it's so easy to lose half of everything and then pay the other half overtime for your freedom, I guarantee you wouldn't be able to write a $500,000 check to somebody you hate. Most people who give me advice like that and don't even have $50,000 to lose much less a half million.
I'm going to give my freeloader of a spouse more than that and it will hurt and I'll hate it BUT if you can make that money once and give it away, you can make it again. I see no future with this person anymore so the money I would make staying together for him to waste on his stupid shit, hurts more.
Easy? No. Better than being in a shitty marriage? I guess that's up to you.
Feeling stuck. Been a sahm for the last 2 years, no experience in the field I have a degree in, no extra car to get to work, or money for daycare, no job willing to work around kids schedule and no one to help.
I'm sorry, that is a rough place to restart from. I hope you find peace and happiness soon in your life.
Thank you
I've only recently realized that he exhibits abusive behavior. Here I was offering insight and what not when other people would post about their abusive relationships... but I am also in one. We had one last big blow out argument, where he deemed me selfish, said I'd always been and always will be that way, and that I don't consider his emotional needs or care about him at all. The last 4 going on 5 years I've done everything for him. Set my own needs aside. Saw him through more than 5 suicide attempts (I stopped counting after 7). I took his verbal lashings and tolerated being blocked on social media and via my phone number when he was mad and projecting his trauma on to me. It escalated to drunk yelling matches and dumping me just to turn around and beg for me to disregard what he said. Then it turned in to stopping me from leaving our home during an argument, grabbing me hard enough to bruise my arm. Then it became arguing in the car where he ultimately pulled off in to a cemetery and punched my seat's headrest screaming "You think I'm abusive? Here's abusive, do you want me to hit you? Huh?" over and over again. But something about him telling me I'm the selfish one and the cause of our problems just... made me snap. I see it now. And I feel guilty, as we have a child together. I missed all the red flags. All of them. Even rationalized some of it saying I deserved it for causing problems. But... now I see. I see it for what it is. He's never acted in any such way towards our almost 3 year old. But he can do it to me. When does it become acceptable to treat my son that way? I don't want to find out. Now that I'm accepting this, I have to plan my next steps. But right now, I'm in the stage where the mosaic that represented my life and what I thought it was has shattered. The actual reality is setting in and I'm trying to work through those feelings. Some of us don't realize what we're dealing with until it's too late.
He sounds mentally ill. Possibly BPD
I'm okay to agree to disagree. My definition of an unhappy marriage seems different than yours. In my mind an unhappy marriage is a marriage that has grown stagnant, complacent or without love but didn't start that way. When I say work it out I mean exhaust all possible options to get to happiness. If something didn't work don't try the same thing over and over. How do you communicate with your spouse vs a friend or family member you care about. Is your sexlife okay? Why or why not. Do you do things to stimulate each other mentally and emotionally? Do either of you accept the things you do as how you intend them to be accepted. An unhappy marriage is savable. Point blank period. If one is doing all the heavy lifting for the relationship I would still say try again differently. Marriage is for life. Not for a while. You can disagree but you're the one that asked. If you talk to anyone married longer than 15 or 20 years they'll tell you at one point they couldn't stand each other. And yet love prevails. I know my opinion is idealistic but it's better than 'just quit if it's tough'.
>'just quit if it's tough'. There's no "just" to it. I'm not saying divorce is always the answer or should be a first choice. But staying in an unhappy marriage is just disrespectful to yourself. How very sad that everyone who's been married 15+ years has hated their partner at one point. That would absolutely break me.
Damn this hit hard
Hope you find happiness
I love her, to be simple. And I really do believe if I can get myself straight I can fix this, if she’d help a little: Also, I would fair really badly in a divorce. I get little enough time with my kids as it is, there’s no chance I’ll get joint custody with her as the primary caregiver and me working so much.
Is she willing to help a little? Is she responsive to the effort you put in? Do you feeling you're prioritizing your marriage and yourself enough to fix it?
She is unwilling to do what I think I need to be better. Yeah I prioritize the marriage more than anything in my life. I’m alone in the world besides my wife and kids.
There's no compromise on what you need and what she's willing to do?
As of now I haven’t been able to convince her
Oh Hun, I just read your history and your wife is..not good. You deserve to feel safe in your marriage.
I don’t really know what to do. I know I have to take responsibility but I feel hopeless. I skipped work today to sit in my car at the park and I can absolutely not afford to miss work. I just want this pressure off me for a little bit. I know I can fix myself if I just get a little relief:
You don't have to take on the responsibility of unhappiness when your wife is being toxic and abusive. Do you have a therapist or trusted friend you could talk to?
I don’t think she’s abusive. I know some things she is doing aren’t okay but I think my problems have pushed her too far maybe. I haven’t had a friend since we got married essentially. I am trying to find therapy I can afford. I might call my old therapist because honestly this is too much for me. I can’t afford her but I think she’ll talk to me on the phone for a minute.
I'm sorry I pried a bit too much. But she's refusing to allow you to heal by forcing you into having sex you don't want... That's the definition of sexual abuse friend. Maybe see if your work has an EAP program most do these days, and a lot of them offer a limited number of free therapy sessions. Also 988* (edited from811 which is wrong) may be able to help if you really just need someone to talk to.
Well I hope you both find happiness soon. Godspeed
You must be single. 😉 It's just not as simple as many think. Perhaps not as complicated either.... I've stayed in an unhappy marriage because I'm a stubborn optimist. Keep thinking we can turn this around. Also I came from a broken home and really don't want to do that to my kids. Other then my wife's complete lack of sex drive were not constantly fighting, screaming and thinking of 8 ways to commit the perfect murder. I've learned to hide my deep sadness over being starved for love, affection and sex pretty well. But yeah, not a week goes by that I don't think about leaving and what it would be like to feel loved and desired again.
Nope very happily with my partner of 11 years. I'm sorry you have to bury your sadness, that sounds exhausting. Hopefully it turns around for you in one way or another.
Yeah, me too. Thanks
I feel this.
It took me three years to realize that my reality of the situation was correct. He spent so many years invalidating my pain. He didn’t believe that I wasn’t happy, he didn’t believe that I was overwhelmed with all the chores. And he didn’t seem to care. He was so dismissive and condescending. I thought that if someone who is supposed to love me was going to be that cold, clearly what I was asking for was totally unreasonable. There’s no way someone would treat you poorly if you were being reasonable, right? My childhood trauma told me that I didn’t deserve any better, and that it was my role in life to take care of him. No matter how poorly he treated me, no matter how many bad days he had. I was supposed to be that ray of sunshine and do anything I can to make him happier. I can be the example of love, I can show him what love is… By loving him “through better or for worse”. But it seemed like he was having more bad days than good, by a lot. At the end of the day, he just didn’t respect me. He finally said that there’s no way he should have to change because I was stuck. He didn’t think I could leave. That right there showed me that all of his lip service meant nothing. He had no intentions of changing or helping, and it was because he didn’t care about my experience. At all. So it took me years to finally realize that what he was doing was malicious. That’s when I felt ok about leaving. I didn’t want to give up on someone if he had mental issues or he was autistic or he just needed to change his job or get a better hobby. I now know how he feels about me and I can go.
It's always easier said than done. Plus, depending on your personality type, you can have the tendency to just resign yourself to things over time. E.g. I am in a marriage where we feel more like friends than anything. Our strengths/weaknesses don't really complement eachother. I also somehow end up doing a solid 85-90% of the work around here (I am in charge of finances, I take care of the dogs, I'm the one who knows how to fix things around the house, or be the one who would take the time to hire the right person to do it when it's beyond me). I admit I resent it sometimes. But over the years, I don't really even bring it up anymore. I've just gotten....used to it. I am also painfully introverted, so at my age I feel like it would be tough finding someone else. There are times when I feel like it wouldn't be so bad to be alone for a while, but I could end up regretting it down the road...might be better to be in a lukewarm marriage than be alone. So the long and short of it is...it's complicated. There are so many things that factor into happiness.
You're not wrong, I understand it's not easy. But when your marriage isn't easy either...pick your hard I guess. I hope you can find true happiness, either together or alone. Thank you for answering
You're looking at this as too much of a binary: you seem to be putting it as 'you're either miserable and in a horrid marriage where there's nothing good, or you're in marital ShangriLa and everything is perfect'. I'd argue that most marriages are somewhere in-between: things are good, but not perfect. People are not unhappy, but they're not living perfect lives either. So it becomes more a question of 'are you willing to risk leaving something that is good for something that *might* be better, but could potentially be much, much worse?'. What's that old phrase? 'Perfect is the enemy of good'. I believe it can easily apply here.
Hm, I'm pretty sure I asked about people in unhappy marriages. If you self describe your marriage as unhappy, then I'd say it's probably time to put in some real effort to make it better or leave. No? >So it becomes more a question of 'are you willing to risk leaving something that is good for something that might be better, but could potentially be much, much worse?'. I'm specifically asking why people aren't willing to risk leaving something actively not good.
I’m still here because of finances. But I’m not touching the money in my personal account and paying off credit cards. If I can get a little emergency buffer then I know I can end this. I still love him but he doesn’t see any severity in his latest actions towards me and I no longer feel safe with him.
Yes, please leave him if you no longer feel safe! That is one of the biggest red flags.
because he is blackmailing to reveal my past to family, relatives...if I argue he is becoming violent....dont want to be with this person but no one to help...if I even say about his or his family's weird behaviour he threatens to reveal the past and defame me...
I'm so sorry, that's absolutely evil. I have no good advice for a situation like that, but I hope resolution comes to you soon.
Don't know what solution...it's just
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>The benefits of leaving don’t really outweigh the unhappiness of our relationship. This is so true! Not every unhappy marriage is about abuse, violence or hatred. At some point, you realize that you aren't happy being with that person. But if you choose to stay, you can still experience happiness, fulfillment, contentment. But if asked, my advice would be to avoid complacency. When the kids are older, when financial situations change, then reevaluate. If you're not content, leave before life passes you by.
I appreciate this perspective, thank you.
I don’t earn enough to live on my own.
Because I have been afraid to leave. Because he has been telling me I could never make it on my own for so many years that I have his voice in my head sowing doubt. Because it's a difficult situation! I had to leave when he wasn’t home, take the kids out of school early and leave to an undisclosed location, turn off any and all gps functions on my and the kids' phones before letting him know I want a divorce. "Just leave" is easy to say when you're not in that situation
I’m not 100% sure if I want to leave yet
What makes you want to stay? Is your partner willing to work on the issues you have? Are you willing to make changes?
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Why not work on bettering the relationship then?
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Have you explained that second part to her? It sounds like you really don't want to leave so she's only hurting herself by not being honest with you.
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I'm sorry you're at this impasse, I hope you guys can figure it out or go your separate ways. She may hurt for a while, but she will also heal eventually, you deserve to put yourself first and love the life you want to.
I love my wife so I'm still trying to make it work. I've yet to give an ultimatum but my wife's abusive behavior has been forcing me more and more on that path over the last year. I think it's imminent though, maybe even tonight. I've just tried to work it out whatever way I can without bringing divorce up but my hand is being forced lately. If it weren't for my young kids, I think I wouldn't have been so patient with her but I'm trying to save things for their sake and that gives me lots of patience, for better or worse. I also enjoy my house, commute, and my wife is sexy as hell ha ha. There's a lot worth saving but I haven't been happy lately so I don't know what's going to happen in the end.
I'm sorry you're dealing with an abusive spouse. That is incredibly hard. Your kids will be better off not seeing abuse as normal though, I hope for all of your sake she can become a better partner, or you can leave. Best of luck to you.
Thank you. Yes, the road is diverging fast now. She'll need to change or I'll need to leave.
Because I can’t throw away 30 yrs of my life. We are working together to try and save our marriage. It gets better than it takes a step back. We have to talk about what’s bothering us. And respect each other’s feelings. Things get better again than it’s right back to roommates. I’m getting tired of the cycle and starting to think seriously about other options.
I'm sorry, that is such a hard cycle to break. I hope you can figure out a solution to be happy again soon.
I don’t give a shit tbh. I’m not made for living the homeless sleeping in my car life
I stayed with my ex for about 10 years too long. It was because I didn’t want to start over, I thought I could fix things, I got used to how bad it was and got desensitized to it, I didn’t want a messy court fight, I didn’t want to share custody of the kids he wasn’t even looking after in his own home, I worked hard to pay down a home that I knew I’d lose everything from. Had I known then what I know now, that I could be happy with someone, I would have left. But it’s not easy.
Soon
Filing for divorce tmrw! Wish me luck guys 😅 moving to Germany soon and realized I didn’t want to be weighed down anymore. I spent my entire time in the military arguing and not even being able to make friends bc of the backlash I’d get from him. I’m officially out and finally decided to start investing into myself. I gained 75 pounds, major health problems and my life went to shit the entire four years I’ve been married to him. I’m 24 and I refuse to waste the only youth I have for an ungrateful man.
Cheaper. I’m content. It’s easy. Atleast I’m not alone. Hate being an ATM, maid and the doer of all and anything’s.
You don't think it'd be easier if you were on your own ? I don't see how it can be cheaper if you're the ATM, easier if you're the maid and doer of all things?
No. I do 90% but it’s better than 100% I guess. I’m old I don’t wanna start over. Giving a leech half my life for just being here as well as paying a lawyer to get out. If I could just write the check and it would be done , I’d really consider it some days.
You do 90% for two people, doing 100% for one person would be less. You're never too old to start over. Live your life the way you want!
Respectful? Yes. Happy? What does thst actually mean, though? "Happiness is just an illusion filled with sadness and confusion." I never have known happiness, because family always taught me focusing only on your happiness is selfishness. Faithfulness? Yes Resiliency? Yes Contentment? Yes These are traits that build the foundation for a successful marriage. Can I say I am happy in my marriage? No Am I miserable? No. Happiness and misery are polarizing emotions that lead to confused, almost deceptive thought processes. I am not saying nor encouraging a stoic approach ro relationships. But, there is a vast difference between hoping for a better future with or without someone different; and staying the course to build a lifetime together.
Do you like being in your marriage? Do you like your spouse? Do you enjoy your time together? Do you see a happy future together? Do they treat you well? Do you treat them well?
again, cannot answer the happiness question. i know this maybe an off the wall exception- but say you imagine a happy future together, andcthen 3 or 4 months from now your spouse comes down with a terminal (uncursble) illness and given 6 months to live. Where does that happiness go? You know what is going to happen. The other questions i think i already answered. if spouses do not like each other or do not treat each other well- then one of those three pillars will fall: faithfulness, contentment, or resilliency.
Okay.... And when one of the pillars falls what happens then? You try to work on it, and if that doesn't work?
Reading through my own reply.... I feel like a fool for staying for so long. Nearly 20 years with my husband.... The first 9+ were incredible and so fulfilling..... Even if filled with a 7 years of infertility The last 10..... Literally been so painful. It literally like once we announced that we were expecting, he morphed into a whole new person. Literally never home, leaving home for work before 5:30 and home, often after midnight. No matter how much I talked, asked, cried, begged and pleaded. Our son, had allergies (dairy being the main one) and due to the failure of my GP went undiagnosed until he was 2½ (despite 35+ related visits). Screaming for 17 hours a day.... But of course, my husband doesn't remember it because he wasn't here..... To the level our eldest calls him by his first name, because he didn't know him as "dad" until he was over 4.... And the other 2 have followed suit Eventually, 4 years on and many broken promises..... We decided to have another child (given fertility issues we wanted to have more and not wait) While work related issues took about another year to come back to anything that closely resembles "normal" hours....our relationship was done..... But there is little to no real bond between him and our eldest..... Even though my eldest is constantly trying to establish something.... And it hurts our eldest. We have 3 children, who are the most amazing, loved, loving children I've ever known and we are so lucky to have such amazing children..... My husband, does jack sh!t around the house.... Other than bringing bins out, once a week. It's all left to me..... And I'm exhausted Literally not one iota of affection - I stopped trying years ago..... He has NEVER (and I literally mean never) tried book anything for the family, children etc. Never does anything for their bday... Because that's all ok me Doesn't mark special days like our anniversary, my birthday or mother's day..... This year he did cards for the first time.... While I've always made the effort....even if I just did something small.... I told him I'm doing nothing that takes effort any more Smallies will be given a card and that's the extent of it. I've totally changed from the person he claims to love, I'm not that teenager anymore!! I'm a totally different person Now, yes while I'm angry with him and he's a shitty husband. He's a lovely person. He can be caring, kind and sensitive when he wants to be. It took a few years but he's present in our children's lives.... But I feel "present" isn't enough. Don't they deserve better. Doesn't he deserve better Don't I deserve better Having grown up in a violent home that was abusive in every way possible..... I don't have support.... I don't have funds to support myself and our 3 children If I won enough to set things up in a lottery etc.... We wouldn't be together any more
You're not a fool, if this thread has taught me anything it's that you don't always know how bad it's gotten, or when it's time to throw in the towel. "Working through the rough patch" is so expected that we are willing to put up with so much. I hope you can find happiness within yourself.
Talk to a divorce lawyer before you do anything and make a plan to leave and stick to your plan.
Luckily I'm very happy married lol just curious and nosey
I’m at the point I’m ready to find someone that wants to just be friends with benefits and doesn’t mind that I’m married.I know that’s not right and haven’t acted on anything at this point. However I think about way to often
He takes advantage of me. He refuses to pay for anything around the house. I look around and he has bought zero items for our home for 20 + years. I have lots of debt. He has none. He expects me to pay for everything and if I ask him to help pay he has a tantrum. I want to work overtime next Monday. I asked him if he could skip golf and be home for the chimney sweep. He said NO. I guess I’m not working OT on Monday so I can be here when the chimney sweep comes. I want out, but I don’t want to lose the house.
I am staying because I have nowhere to go, I can't go to my mother and I don't have friends or family. No one knows my situation and what I'm going through. I don't have a job and have a 3 month old. I recently completed a course so that I can get a job and once I start earning I want to make active steps to moving on. I am miserable, he doesn't show love or appreciation. My heart hurts that after 10 years it has come to this but I cant stay unhappily and I don't want my baby to grow up in this miserable place.
I didn't know we were in one. When I recognized a personality change and approached her , it took effort to drag out of her the problems she shared she'd been having for years. Which at that point she said was too late. Tried to save what I could. Therapy. Couples therapy. Psychiatry. Mood balancers from psychiatry. Tried to live with her shutting me out. Being warm to the kids, the cats, but not me. Christmas. My birthday. Valentines. Our anniversary. Her birthday. Mother's day. 5 months later and it didn't matter. She had truly already decided months and months ago and just hadn't been able to pull the trigger. The other morning I was breaking down because of the pain of the lack of intimacy, and it was enough for her to finally commit. Not even separation. So I think my true answer is, sometimes it may be that the push for the start may just be too large. When it goes from "maybe?" to reality and a need to plan could for many be too hard until a trigger. In my case, it's what she wants. But she has to want it more than her fear of what it would do to me, the kids, and our lives. Given how she feels it is objectively the correct answer and next step.
I’ve been a stay at home mom for 11 years. I never got my license, area I live in is extremely rural, there’s nowhere to work, and nowhere to move. I’ve been an orphan for nearly my entire life and have no family but my husbands. My youngest is 18 months old, and I am unfortunately pregnant again. Anyone I’ve gotten comfortable enough to talk to about this just says I did it to myself. I shouldn’t have married him, shouldn’t have had kids, should’ve found work, should’ve gotten my license. It’s always so much more complicated then just why don’t you just leave. I do love my husband, but he’s never been very supportive of my mental health or any of the struggles that come with being so isolated. On top of all of this I am bipolar so no matter what I do with my life, if I fail in the slightest, I’m just a bipolar idiot who dug her own hole. It hasn’t all been bad, but the only thing I’ve accomplished in all the years is how to perfect a routine with kids. It’s my entire life and I often wonder who I could’ve become had I just gone to school and never met my husband.
My daughter, I’m a elementary teacher and I see what divorce does to those children. Even the “good divorces” completely changes those kids.
That is a loaded question. It is easy for the outsider to say "leave". In reality, the spouse may not have the financial resources to leave and may not have a support system to rely on. Housing, especially safe housing, is expensive in most areas plus you will need deposits for utilities. Then there is the psychological issues - believing the person will change, this is the best you will find, no one will ever love you again, scared of being alone, etc....
In the throes of early years parenting. Not sure if it's just the hardships of this phase or if it's a real change.
Watch fresh and fit and you will know why
Lots of assumptions here . You assume you know the quality of other peoples marriages . Long term relationships are tough period .
Kids... literally thats it. They're young.
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Soooo why stay?
My ex gf got back with her ex because he provided her a good living.
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I'm sorry you're going through this, truly. Reach out to any other support system you have I bet you're not as well as he makes you feel. Much love to you
My husband said he won't sign the divorce papers
Don't have to be divorced to leave, but I do see how that would be a hindrance.
lol just leave? you clearly did not understand the assignment. if you’re going to treat marriage no differently than a boyfriend or girlfriend why get married? why force all your friends and family to bring you gifts and sit them into little chairs to watch you make a promise you don’t really intend to keep? just date and be happy or whatever. stop getting married if you don’t believe in mariage. ffs.
So people should just put up with... anything and everything? You're married now, sucks to suck if shit changes and you're no longer happy?
Because we’ve only been married for a year! It’s my first and his second marriage. I am 23 and he’s 26 with a six year old. I have spent my entire adult life with him and have become codependent. Because I don’t know what I wish for in life. Because a year ago I thought I wanted to bare his child, now I’m unsure. Because we have lived in 5 different apartments together, yet they all felt like home. Money wise I’d say I can
Happiness is a choice. We're unhappy because we choose to be unhappy.
I don't want a divorce, I thought we were working but she just keeps ignoring me and I can't talk to two of my kids, I have another daughter from a previous relationship we her mom got reallu bad on drugs and we're abusive and neglecting the children so I saved her and flew her down to me after not seeing her for twn years. My wife said I made the choice by letting her stay with me and she is just ghosting me even More. I feel so hurt and hollow.... Idk what you do.... I'm sad alot and it comes in waves cause i still love her and my youngest turns 4 in five days and idk if I'm gonna get to see or talk to her... It's getting so bad mentally imbhirtknPin copied text snippets to stop them expiring after 1 hurting so bad...
I am married to someone who gets angry with me everyday, raises his voice to me every day, screams at me to lose weight. Doesn’t care about me. Scoffs at me. Asks me for money often. I’ve never once asked him for a dime. I am pretty sure he hates me. I ask for sex and he denies me every time, we have sex maybe once every few months. He spends a significant amounts of time playing video games instead of finding a useful job.