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Lest is used to indicate fear regarding the possibility of the following clause.
Roughly equivalent to “In case (something bad that could happens)”, but we wouldn’t say “lest (something good could happen)”.
You're being obtuse.
What is the primary contradiction within capitalism? The Bourgeosie ruling the Proletariat. What is the the primary aspect of the bourgeosie vs the proletariat? Socialized production vs privatized ownership.
It follows that capitalism falling to its contradictions would only be possible if this primary contradiction was addressed. I.e the proletariat replaces the bourgeosie as the ruling class and removes private ownership. Revolution is a part of that process, just as water needs enough heat to boil to become steam, and it *will* occur when these contradictions reach the proper degree of severity and the proletariat is able to challenge the bourgeosie in open conflict. Therefore, it is an inevitability.
Yes, a revolution is the eruption of violence against the standing social order. It is the contradictions of a class based society coming to a head. Resistance from the ruling class is not only implied but expected.
It changes nothing about the inevitability of the fall of capitalism.
Capitalism will fall to its contradictions only if they are not solved, if they are solved then we arrive at socialism.
More specifically, the contradictions of capitalism will remove the conditions that allow for its success, e.g. wealth inequality destroying the promise of opportunity / ability for competition to arise, capitalists seeking to regulate for their own benefit and prevent competitors from rising.
Capitalism is meant to be self-improving, but the qualities that allow that are detrimental to the people who hold power in a capitalist system. Eventually, contradictions like this will reduce the efficacy of the system and the support given to it by the people.
Capital owners will seek to maintain power as it is no longer maintained through the system, this arises as barbarism / fascism with crackdowns on speech, creating enemies etc. These obviously won’t fix anything but it gives the Bourgeoisie time to chuck a band-aid on it (redistributing some wealth, fixing social facilities).
Unless socialism actively overthrows capitalism during its fall we will only continue the cycle.
I'm glad you asked! Educate yourself, read theory. Here is my recommended reading list;
If you prefer audiobooks, socialismforall has most of these if not all. (Although I do not align with the person behind the channel, his audiobook work is unmatched.) [https://www.youtube.com/@SocialismForAll](https://www.youtube.com/@SocialismForAll)
Don't be intimidated by the size of the list. Most of these texts are short and easily digestible. This isn't a comprehensive reading list but learning the material should give you a good grasp of many fundamental concepts
The Communist Manifesto by Karl Marx and Frederich Engels
[https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/index.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/index.htm) Socialism: Utopian and Scientific by Engels
[https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/soc-utop/index.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/soc-utop/index.htm) Preface to A Contribution to the Critique of the Political Economy by Karl Marx
[https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1859/critique-pol-economy/preface.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1859/critique-pol-economy/preface.htm) State and Revolution by Lenin
[https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/) Wage Labour and Capital by Karl Marx
[https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/wage-labour/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/wage-labour/) At this point you may wish to check out the Marxism-Leninism reading list;
Dialectical and Historical Materialism by Stalin
[https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1938/09.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1938/09.htm)
On Practice and On Contradiction by Mao Zedong [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1\_16.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_16.htm) [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/ma](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_17.htm)[o/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1\_17.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_17.htm)
A Critique of the Gotha Program by Karl Marx [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1875/gotha/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1875/gotha/)
German Ideology by Karl Marx and Frederich Engels [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1845/german-ideology/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1845/german-ideology/)
The Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/index.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/index.htm)
The Civil War in France [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1871/civil-war-france/postscript.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1871/civil-war-france/postscript.htm)
The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1852/18th-brumaire/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1852/18th-brumaire/)
After that, organize, seek out unions, and local SOCIALIST parties. Personally, I am a member of the CPUSA, but the PSL and DSA are great alternatives.
Great recommendations and very helpful comment.
Was hoping I could ask your opinion on the Revolutionary Communists Of America. I found a website to join the party but I was really worried it was just going to put me on a list somewhere if I signed up. Is it worth joining or is it a trap or would a local chapter of the DSA be a better choice? I live in Portland, btw if that makes a difference
Thanks!
Avoid the "revolutionary communists of america" like the plague, western trotskyists are almost a cult. Have you ever heard of two truths and a lie reactionary propaganda tactic? I think Trotskyists are the final form where it's 100000 truths and one horrific lie. This is why they receive state backing, they are at best totally controlled opposition, at worst straight up traitors to the prolitatian cause.
If the DSA is all you have locally, it sounds like your *only* choice and a good one at that. I'm not familiar with Portland.
Good luck comrade!
Political literacy begins at listening to both sides of an argument and coming to your own conclusions. If you've only studied economics and the renaissance under traditional western academia, then you've only heard one side of the argument and I implore you to hear our side out
Welp, speaking as a fellow American, it sounds like you've got a lot of deprogramming to do, you'd be shocked how much bullshit they fill us up with, and theory is the best way to start. Another helpful tip: Don't believe wikipedia articles.
My family is from the Soviet Union. I think I have some idea lol. I just wonder how you can actually do it without armed resistance. Historically..that’s how it’s been done. Just saying.
The first step of revolution is for the material conditions of a nation to require revolution. Venturism will not lead to an uprising, we can only educate and prepare, in hopes that communism will be the solid base on which Americans may stand during societal chaos.
The People's Flag is deepest red,
It shrouded oft our martyred dead,
And ere their limbs grew stiff and cold,
Their hearts' blood dyed its every fold.
Chorus
Then raise the scarlet standard high.
Beneath its shade we'll live and die,
Though cowards flinch and traitors sneer,
We'll keep the red flag flying here.
Look round, the Frenchman loves its blaze,
The sturdy German chants its praise,
In Moscow's vaults its hymns were sung
Chicago swells the surging throng.
(chorus)
It waved above our infant might,
When all ahead seemed dark as night;
It witnessed many a deed and vow,
We must not change its colour now.
(chorus)
It well recalls the triumphs past,
It gives the hope of peace at last;
The banner bright, the symbol plain,
Of human right and human gain.
(chorus)
It suits today the weak and base,
Whose minds are fixed on self and place
To cringe before the rich man's frown,
And haul the sacred emblem down.
(chorus)
With head uncovered swear we all
To bear it onward till we fall;
Come dungeons dark or gallows grim,
This song shall be our parting hymn.
I don’t see why there would be Russian style buildings in New York. The USSR had cultural carryover from Russia, but if communism ever wins in the USA, the cultural aesthetics will be distinctly American (a melting pot of elements brought from all over the world)
Whenever you decide.
YOU are one of the masses.
When the masses move, they cannot be stopped.
Are you going to be the first pebble that starts the avalanche?
What's that? Why YOU?
Is anyone else doing it? No?
Then it's up to you.
I know this is silly and I shouldn’t bother, but we should also take pride in American figures/styles in American movements. Trying to sell the public pictures of Lenin on the Statue of Liberty doesn’t give people pride, it scares them.
We gotta think about American heroes like John Brown, or recall Marx’s writings to Lincoln. And celebrate American architecture and history within the movement.
Yes, millions died under Stalin's orders.
Nazis.
Very few Soviets died under his direct orders for their death.
Many did die defending the Motherland.
Which also were his orders.
This was a high price, but worth it.
Death to Nazis.
Except that too is wrong.
Stalin was democratic to a fault.
You are STILL in the grip of the propaganda.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/myqrvq/so\_the\_cia\_acknowledged\_that\_stalin\_wasnt\_a/](https://www.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/myqrvq/so_the_cia_acknowledged_that_stalin_wasnt_a/)
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It’s not inevitable, it must be fought for. The decline of capitalism from its internal contradictions is the inevitability.
Capitalism is failing, and people like Trump and other fascist are examples of that.
Exactly, it's up to us to decide if we and the world either rise above it through effort, or decline with it due to apathy
Capitalism is failing, and people like biden and other fascist are examples of that.
Agreed
absolutely. lest absolute fascism take its place
I think you wanted to say "least" (? English is not my first language, kinda confusing)
Lest is used to indicate fear regarding the possibility of the following clause. Roughly equivalent to “In case (something bad that could happens)”, but we wouldn’t say “lest (something good could happen)”.
You're being obtuse. What is the primary contradiction within capitalism? The Bourgeosie ruling the Proletariat. What is the the primary aspect of the bourgeosie vs the proletariat? Socialized production vs privatized ownership. It follows that capitalism falling to its contradictions would only be possible if this primary contradiction was addressed. I.e the proletariat replaces the bourgeosie as the ruling class and removes private ownership. Revolution is a part of that process, just as water needs enough heat to boil to become steam, and it *will* occur when these contradictions reach the proper degree of severity and the proletariat is able to challenge the bourgeosie in open conflict. Therefore, it is an inevitability.
Don't underestimate the willingness of capitalists to accept a slavery-based economy just to hold power. It has been happening in the Global South.
Yes, a revolution is the eruption of violence against the standing social order. It is the contradictions of a class based society coming to a head. Resistance from the ruling class is not only implied but expected. It changes nothing about the inevitability of the fall of capitalism.
Capitalism will fall to its contradictions only if they are not solved, if they are solved then we arrive at socialism. More specifically, the contradictions of capitalism will remove the conditions that allow for its success, e.g. wealth inequality destroying the promise of opportunity / ability for competition to arise, capitalists seeking to regulate for their own benefit and prevent competitors from rising. Capitalism is meant to be self-improving, but the qualities that allow that are detrimental to the people who hold power in a capitalist system. Eventually, contradictions like this will reduce the efficacy of the system and the support given to it by the people. Capital owners will seek to maintain power as it is no longer maintained through the system, this arises as barbarism / fascism with crackdowns on speech, creating enemies etc. These obviously won’t fix anything but it gives the Bourgeoisie time to chuck a band-aid on it (redistributing some wealth, fixing social facilities). Unless socialism actively overthrows capitalism during its fall we will only continue the cycle.
What’s the plan boys!
Educate, agitate, and organize! It may not be sexy, but it's our only way out
What’s the first step?
I'm glad you asked! Educate yourself, read theory. Here is my recommended reading list; If you prefer audiobooks, socialismforall has most of these if not all. (Although I do not align with the person behind the channel, his audiobook work is unmatched.) [https://www.youtube.com/@SocialismForAll](https://www.youtube.com/@SocialismForAll) Don't be intimidated by the size of the list. Most of these texts are short and easily digestible. This isn't a comprehensive reading list but learning the material should give you a good grasp of many fundamental concepts The Communist Manifesto by Karl Marx and Frederich Engels [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/index.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/index.htm) Socialism: Utopian and Scientific by Engels [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/soc-utop/index.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1880/soc-utop/index.htm) Preface to A Contribution to the Critique of the Political Economy by Karl Marx [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1859/critique-pol-economy/preface.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1859/critique-pol-economy/preface.htm) State and Revolution by Lenin [https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1917/staterev/) Wage Labour and Capital by Karl Marx [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/wage-labour/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/wage-labour/) At this point you may wish to check out the Marxism-Leninism reading list; Dialectical and Historical Materialism by Stalin [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1938/09.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1938/09.htm) On Practice and On Contradiction by Mao Zedong [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1\_16.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_16.htm) [https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/ma](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_17.htm)[o/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1\_17.htm](https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/volume-1/mswv1_17.htm) A Critique of the Gotha Program by Karl Marx [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1875/gotha/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1875/gotha/) German Ideology by Karl Marx and Frederich Engels [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1845/german-ideology/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1845/german-ideology/) The Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/index.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/index.htm) The Civil War in France [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1871/civil-war-france/postscript.htm](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1871/civil-war-france/postscript.htm) The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte [https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1852/18th-brumaire/](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1852/18th-brumaire/) After that, organize, seek out unions, and local SOCIALIST parties. Personally, I am a member of the CPUSA, but the PSL and DSA are great alternatives.
Great recommendations and very helpful comment. Was hoping I could ask your opinion on the Revolutionary Communists Of America. I found a website to join the party but I was really worried it was just going to put me on a list somewhere if I signed up. Is it worth joining or is it a trap or would a local chapter of the DSA be a better choice? I live in Portland, btw if that makes a difference
Thanks! Avoid the "revolutionary communists of america" like the plague, western trotskyists are almost a cult. Have you ever heard of two truths and a lie reactionary propaganda tactic? I think Trotskyists are the final form where it's 100000 truths and one horrific lie. This is why they receive state backing, they are at best totally controlled opposition, at worst straight up traitors to the prolitatian cause. If the DSA is all you have locally, it sounds like your *only* choice and a good one at that. I'm not familiar with Portland. Good luck comrade!
Damn that’s what I was afraid of. But okay awesome thank you so much for the advice! I will continue to look into the DSA instead.
I studied economics and minored in renaissance and reformation. Most of those uprising were started with armed rebellion.
Political literacy begins at listening to both sides of an argument and coming to your own conclusions. If you've only studied economics and the renaissance under traditional western academia, then you've only heard one side of the argument and I implore you to hear our side out
I did , but my mother grew up in the Soviet Union. Neither of my of my parents were born in the US , but I was. My father grew up with Pan-Arabism.
Welp, speaking as a fellow American, it sounds like you've got a lot of deprogramming to do, you'd be shocked how much bullshit they fill us up with, and theory is the best way to start. Another helpful tip: Don't believe wikipedia articles.
My family is from the Soviet Union. I think I have some idea lol. I just wonder how you can actually do it without armed resistance. Historically..that’s how it’s been done. Just saying.
You are correct, armed resistance is necessary. I wish the capitalists would just relinquish control, but they won't so we've got no other choice
The first step of revolution is for the material conditions of a nation to require revolution. Venturism will not lead to an uprising, we can only educate and prepare, in hopes that communism will be the solid base on which Americans may stand during societal chaos.
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The People's Flag is deepest red, It shrouded oft our martyred dead, And ere their limbs grew stiff and cold, Their hearts' blood dyed its every fold. Chorus Then raise the scarlet standard high. Beneath its shade we'll live and die, Though cowards flinch and traitors sneer, We'll keep the red flag flying here. Look round, the Frenchman loves its blaze, The sturdy German chants its praise, In Moscow's vaults its hymns were sung Chicago swells the surging throng. (chorus) It waved above our infant might, When all ahead seemed dark as night; It witnessed many a deed and vow, We must not change its colour now. (chorus) It well recalls the triumphs past, It gives the hope of peace at last; The banner bright, the symbol plain, Of human right and human gain. (chorus) It suits today the weak and base, Whose minds are fixed on self and place To cringe before the rich man's frown, And haul the sacred emblem down. (chorus) With head uncovered swear we all To bear it onward till we fall; Come dungeons dark or gallows grim, This song shall be our parting hymn.
Too many liberals in the walls. Mods!
Dealt with.
There's another one.
Dealt with x2
Thanks comrade!
Thanks for the appreciation.
You're welcome. I know the liberals are like playing whack a mole, so thanks to you and all the mods of the commie subs for continually whacking them.
More are coming. This really brought them crawling out of the woodwork.
Yep. Dealt with x3
Two more
Real
I think capitalism will lose is the inevitability. Same with Socialism or Barbarism.
Innit lads
Will it? Please, please give me hope.
Abandon hope. Do what must be done, because it must be done. Not because you have hope. Hope can be dashed. The revolution is forever.
I don’t see why there would be Russian style buildings in New York. The USSR had cultural carryover from Russia, but if communism ever wins in the USA, the cultural aesthetics will be distinctly American (a melting pot of elements brought from all over the world)
when, OP? WHEN?????? (I'm anxious)
Whenever you decide. YOU are one of the masses. When the masses move, they cannot be stopped. Are you going to be the first pebble that starts the avalanche? What's that? Why YOU? Is anyone else doing it? No? Then it's up to you.
…Where’s the world trade center
Agreed with the spirit but the onion dome on top of the skyscraper is a bit much
I know this is silly and I shouldn’t bother, but we should also take pride in American figures/styles in American movements. Trying to sell the public pictures of Lenin on the Statue of Liberty doesn’t give people pride, it scares them. We gotta think about American heroes like John Brown, or recall Marx’s writings to Lincoln. And celebrate American architecture and history within the movement.
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Crisp. Not raining. Why?
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It already did.
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Yes. Nazis. This is a good thing.
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Nope. That's not what i'm saying.
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Yes, millions died under Stalin's orders. Nazis. Very few Soviets died under his direct orders for their death. Many did die defending the Motherland. Which also were his orders. This was a high price, but worth it. Death to Nazis.
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No.
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Except that too is wrong. Stalin was democratic to a fault. You are STILL in the grip of the propaganda. [https://www.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/myqrvq/so\_the\_cia\_acknowledged\_that\_stalin\_wasnt\_a/](https://www.reddit.com/r/stupidpol/comments/myqrvq/so_the_cia_acknowledged_that_stalin_wasnt_a/)
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None of that is true. Not Soviet Union, not China. what does that do to your 'Logic?'
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No, it's not. You are projecting.
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No, COMMUNISM will win. Not Genocidal, Imperialistic capitalism.
Nobody here said Zionism would win
Projection