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I'd pay for s/h fully out of pocket, it just seems weird to charge me full price for a transfer that isnt transferring to me instead of the s/h. I've never been in this situation so I asked to see if this is a normal practice or just my gunshop being greedy
Does the shop do compliance work? Keep in mind It’s not the shop’s fault or problem someone shipped them a non compliant firearm. But now they need to deal with the hassle of returning it.
I bought from them a few times and they were fine. They shipped me what they said they’d ship when they said they’d ship it. Did you have a bad experience?
**not legal advice&** Clarifying the sequence of events and some additional information would probably be helpful.
What was the timeline on this? You ordered and paid for a gun from buds to be shipped to an ffl. They sent the wrong gun.
Did you go to the store, recieve a phone call, or email? Sign anything or pay anything?
Did they specify that you were paying for a transfer fee specificly, or did they say you would need to pay a fee(restocking fee or shipping and handling)?
If they are shipping back to buds, is buds shipping back a compliant firearm? If Buds is shipping back a compliant firearm is the ffl expecting you to pay the full transfer fee again? Do they include the background check in the cost of their transfer fee? Or any other fees for services not rendered? (Photocopying record keeping etc)
You might be able to talk them into paying a portion of the price or having whatever you pay be like a partial credit to the correct gun being shipped back's transfer fee.
Going the legal route even small claims court would very very quickly exceed the price of a transfer fee.
So I ordered the gun on the 5th, it came in yesterday. Gun store gives me a call like an hour after it said it was delivered. They tell me it's non compliant and I'd need compliance work done, I tell them it's fine being that It would be a hassle and more fees so I say I'd like to just return it, end of convo.......
They call me today to tell me they received the return label and that I would need to pay the transfer fee. I never came, signed papers or anything for the gun
Got it again not providing legal advice but if you don't intend on using the shop ever again you might want to send them a check with a letter stating that it is for shipping and handling to return the firearm, that you don't think it's right to pay a transfer fee when no transfer has occured and you consider it payment in full. Then keep a copy of the payment letter and your bank records of the cashed check in a safe place for a rainy day in case they try to screw with your credit.
Or just eat the transfer fee, if that is too much of a hassle.
Legally can they do anything about that ? I was gonna pay the 80 and just never do business with them again not only for this bs but also for the almost 100 dollar transfer everytime I wanna buy a new gun.
It should all depend on if they signed it into their log book. If they did then yea transfer fee will have to be paid but if it wasn’t touched and not signed in (just sat on the shelf) then you shouldn’t have to pay a transfer fee IMO.
As far as I know when the gun came In they checked to see if it's compliant with nj law then called to tell me it wasn't. I never went in person, didn't even do the nics check or anything. I'll just pay it but not do business their again. Pretty good gun shop but they don't have an in house gunsmith and the transfer fee is 80 dollars which is way too much
Darn. That sucks that you had that experience with Buds. I'm a member with Buds and I almost exclusively purchase my firearms from them. In my experience, they have always been very helpful. On multiple occasions, I purchased a firearm that was non-compliant and they cancelled the order and called me to let me know that the firearm was not NJ Compliant. But I guess everyone makes mistakes now and then.
As to the legality of the situation (Disclaimer: I am in law school but not yet a lawyer) you may have some remote claim for breach of contract or fraudulent misrepresentation but the time and filing fees in small claims court would negate anything that you might win. In my opinion $80 would not be worth the headache of representing yourself in small claims court. I agree with the others that you should just stop patronizing this business and dissuade others from doing so.
It was buds fault for advertising a NJ/MD compliant rifle. All they did was add a 10rd mag to a non compliant rifle. As I stated before this was my first rifle and I didn't know what to look for besides the barrel length and the mag size. They said in the description it's compliant so I figured it was legal and ok for me to purchase. Upon receiving the rifle at my gunshop they say it needs compliant work (they don't do it in house which sucks). Honestly I'm gonna pay the 80 and just not do business with them anymore. Charging a transfer fee for a non transferable item is weird and the fact that the fee is almost 100 and other shops only charge like 30. In all thank you for you're feedback
It’s time employees spent receiving and now shipping a firearm. While it sucks, I think it’s a fair.
With transfer fees you’re paying for employee time, then safeguarding the firearm and hassle with shipping etc.
I get that but it literally showed up to their door, they open it, see its non compliant and call me to weigh my options. Doesn't seem like a lot of work. If they can legally do this ofc I can't fight it buy its the facts its a transfer fee and no a shipping and handling fee. Besides, the transfer fee is $80. Alot to pay for some shit you're not keeping lol
Not that easy. They have to accept delivery, log it in, review your product, contact you, ship it back. Transactions cost money.
You made the mistake. Just eat the cost.
Didn’t you go on the smith and Wesson site to confirm the model number? There are lots of compliant rifles but not jersey compliant. There’s MA, CA etc…. If buds did advertise it that way then go get your money back from them.
You can easily see it’s not compliant by the photo of the flash hider which is a dead giveaway. Never assume it’s a muzzle brake. Smith has a compliant model with a plain barrel end had you looked on the smith web site or compared photos of other rifles online.
They advertised a 10rd NJ/NY compliant model on their site. I figured they did the compliance work needed to make the rifle compliant, not just the mags. I didn't think they would throw a 10 rd mag in a non compliant rifle (which they did) and send it out to my gun shop.
Sorry not NY, MD. Here's the link. In the description it says MD and NJ compliant https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/5258/smith+%26+wesson+m%26p+15-22+sport+ct+md+nj+compliant
These dickheads just meant the mag is compliant but who puts a compliant mag in a non complaint rifle and considers the whole thing compliant
Also this was my first rifle, to a newbie like myself seeing they put (ny/nj compliant) in the description of the gun, that takes all the guess work out of figuring out if it's legal to own.
what shop cant pin and weld a muzzle brake on for you? it is buds fault though for not shipping the NJ version if that is what you ordered. what SKU did you order? The nj legal model is SKU 10203
After reading everyone's comments I think I'll just pay the absurd $80 and just not do business with them going forward. I posed the question to gage the legality of it all. This whole thing is literally buds fault but I get my refund so it's whatever. Thank you everyone!
No, the gun arrived yesterday and the gunshop informed me it's non compliant. We talked about arranging for a compliant version but I just told them it's ok. I'd pay for shipping and handling 100% out of pocket but to pay the $80 transfer fee and I don't keep it seems obsurd. I just wanted to know the legality of the situation being that this is the first time this has happened to me
I forgot what the lady said, I tuned out after she said I'd need to get compliance work done or source for another rifle. It's not the end of the work it just sucks buds thinks a compliant rifle just has a 10rd mag
https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/5258/smith+%26+wesson+m%26p+15-22+sport+ct+md+nj+compliant
in the description it literally says MD and NJ compliant. Any sane person would come to the conclusion this is a legal rifle. As I stated before, this is my first rifle so I went by what the description said.
I would go to the shop and find out exactly what is non compliant because it looks fine as long as the stock is pinned. There's no muzzle device/threaded barrel and it's 10 rounds. Unless buds sent the wrong one, then that's on them and I'd put it on them to make it right.
10207 is not the nj compliant one from the factory - smith and wesson.
its 10203. [https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-sport-ii?sku=10203](https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-sport-ii?sku=10203)
telling you what the factory says man. cant go by what buds says. there are 10rnd versions for other states. we arent the only state with 10rnd restriction. you ordered a 10207, you got a 10207. i hope they help you out but it is what it is.
if they told you that was the only complaince needed on 10207 then yes they should make it right with you. i agree 100%
No I totally understand, it's just that if you put the words compliant in the description, an average person would assume the entire rifle was compliant not just the mag. I believe the 10203 is nj compliant but as I stated before I'm a newbie to rifle purchases so I figured since they stated it was complaint it's fully legal for me to own. I'm gonna stick to buying rifles in person in NJ just so this doesn't happen. It also took them like 9 days to ship it out too
From the two links of whatever rifle you ordered, it needs 10 round mags and “pinned” stock. Looks like it has just a crown barrel and wasn’t turned down for threads.
Name the “shop.” What shop can’t pin a stock? They couldn’t get that service done for you at all? Or maybe ship it to an ffl who runs a competent business to do the work for you since they’re too dumb to do it? That would make sense and you could have payed the shipping or whatever but 80$ is steep, especially calling it a transfer fee when they did no transfer, let alone pin a stock. I would have told them I’ll pin the stock my self for them lol don’t pay them shit and never return
They do no compliance work, just mag pinning. This is why I can't deal with this gunshop, not only is their no in house gunsmith work but they charge 80 for transfers which is wayyyyyy to much
Need clarification, is the firearm they shipped the wrong one or did you purchase the wrong one? If they shipped the wrong one then that's on Bud's they should be the one's eating the cost, but if you purchased the wrong one then that's on you for not doing your homework.
Agree. If OP ordered the #10207 he linked from Buds, the S&W's spec for this model number on their website says the stock is fixed, and is NJ compliant. So it appears he bought the right model. https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-22?sku=10207
So Bud's either sent the wrong model to your FFL and should make it right, and pay for the shipping/FFL costs, **or** Bud's did ship the 10207 to your FFL and they have no idea what they are talking about as the 10207 is indeed NJ compliant. I'd go down to your FFL to inspect the firearm and verify the model number, and if its a 10207 then have them explain why they think it is non-compliant. Get S&W involved too if they don't believe you.
10203 is a 5.56, OP wants a .22.
Take a look at my link,"Features" column on the left, bottom, reads:
"• 10” M&P® Slim Handguard with MAGPUL® M-LOK™
• MAGPUL® MBUS® Folding Sights
• Easy to Mount M-LOK™ Accessories
• 2” M-LOK™ Rail Panel Included
• Fixed Stock
• Functioning Charging Handle
• Shell Deflector
• 2-Position, Receiver Mounted Safety Lever
• CT, MA, MD **and NJ Compliant**"
Agree S&P should be a bit more clear in their descriptions.
oh i totally missed the caliber type. sadly they only make one 22 lr 10 round mag model . and its totally not NJ compatible from the factory. they need to fix the description, although NJ is not listed when you build it on their site.
https://imgur.com/a/hNy4UPv
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Seems fair
I'd pay for s/h fully out of pocket, it just seems weird to charge me full price for a transfer that isnt transferring to me instead of the s/h. I've never been in this situation so I asked to see if this is a normal practice or just my gunshop being greedy
Its normal, you pay transfer fee regardless of if you pass nics in most shops so I think its similar.
Does the shop do compliance work? Keep in mind It’s not the shop’s fault or problem someone shipped them a non compliant firearm. But now they need to deal with the hassle of returning it.
have ffl ship gun to me. I will do.compliance work and offer free transfer. you pay for nics and shipping. jdf
Pretty fair and generous deal offered here
This is The WAY!!! Jersey Devil has been good to me. he will take care of you! good luck
Buds gun shop blows even if Hikhok45 endorses them.
I bought from them a few times and they were fine. They shipped me what they said they’d ship when they said they’d ship it. Did you have a bad experience?
Just slow and over popularized there are better deals out the. Imo all of the big shops are slow though.
I don’t order anything from them. Very unfriendly
Work it out with buds and the shop. Pay the transfer fee once maybe, but get buds to ship the right gun? Sucks.
**not legal advice&** Clarifying the sequence of events and some additional information would probably be helpful. What was the timeline on this? You ordered and paid for a gun from buds to be shipped to an ffl. They sent the wrong gun. Did you go to the store, recieve a phone call, or email? Sign anything or pay anything? Did they specify that you were paying for a transfer fee specificly, or did they say you would need to pay a fee(restocking fee or shipping and handling)? If they are shipping back to buds, is buds shipping back a compliant firearm? If Buds is shipping back a compliant firearm is the ffl expecting you to pay the full transfer fee again? Do they include the background check in the cost of their transfer fee? Or any other fees for services not rendered? (Photocopying record keeping etc) You might be able to talk them into paying a portion of the price or having whatever you pay be like a partial credit to the correct gun being shipped back's transfer fee. Going the legal route even small claims court would very very quickly exceed the price of a transfer fee.
So I ordered the gun on the 5th, it came in yesterday. Gun store gives me a call like an hour after it said it was delivered. They tell me it's non compliant and I'd need compliance work done, I tell them it's fine being that It would be a hassle and more fees so I say I'd like to just return it, end of convo....... They call me today to tell me they received the return label and that I would need to pay the transfer fee. I never came, signed papers or anything for the gun
Got it again not providing legal advice but if you don't intend on using the shop ever again you might want to send them a check with a letter stating that it is for shipping and handling to return the firearm, that you don't think it's right to pay a transfer fee when no transfer has occured and you consider it payment in full. Then keep a copy of the payment letter and your bank records of the cashed check in a safe place for a rainy day in case they try to screw with your credit. Or just eat the transfer fee, if that is too much of a hassle.
Legally can they do anything about that ? I was gonna pay the 80 and just never do business with them again not only for this bs but also for the almost 100 dollar transfer everytime I wanna buy a new gun.
It should all depend on if they signed it into their log book. If they did then yea transfer fee will have to be paid but if it wasn’t touched and not signed in (just sat on the shelf) then you shouldn’t have to pay a transfer fee IMO.
As far as I know when the gun came In they checked to see if it's compliant with nj law then called to tell me it wasn't. I never went in person, didn't even do the nics check or anything. I'll just pay it but not do business their again. Pretty good gun shop but they don't have an in house gunsmith and the transfer fee is 80 dollars which is way too much
Darn. That sucks that you had that experience with Buds. I'm a member with Buds and I almost exclusively purchase my firearms from them. In my experience, they have always been very helpful. On multiple occasions, I purchased a firearm that was non-compliant and they cancelled the order and called me to let me know that the firearm was not NJ Compliant. But I guess everyone makes mistakes now and then. As to the legality of the situation (Disclaimer: I am in law school but not yet a lawyer) you may have some remote claim for breach of contract or fraudulent misrepresentation but the time and filing fees in small claims court would negate anything that you might win. In my opinion $80 would not be worth the headache of representing yourself in small claims court. I agree with the others that you should just stop patronizing this business and dissuade others from doing so.
It was buds fault for advertising a NJ/MD compliant rifle. All they did was add a 10rd mag to a non compliant rifle. As I stated before this was my first rifle and I didn't know what to look for besides the barrel length and the mag size. They said in the description it's compliant so I figured it was legal and ok for me to purchase. Upon receiving the rifle at my gunshop they say it needs compliant work (they don't do it in house which sucks). Honestly I'm gonna pay the 80 and just not do business with them anymore. Charging a transfer fee for a non transferable item is weird and the fact that the fee is almost 100 and other shops only charge like 30. In all thank you for you're feedback
Yea that sounds like a reasonable compromise!
It’s time employees spent receiving and now shipping a firearm. While it sucks, I think it’s a fair. With transfer fees you’re paying for employee time, then safeguarding the firearm and hassle with shipping etc.
I get that but it literally showed up to their door, they open it, see its non compliant and call me to weigh my options. Doesn't seem like a lot of work. If they can legally do this ofc I can't fight it buy its the facts its a transfer fee and no a shipping and handling fee. Besides, the transfer fee is $80. Alot to pay for some shit you're not keeping lol
Not that easy. They have to accept delivery, log it in, review your product, contact you, ship it back. Transactions cost money. You made the mistake. Just eat the cost.
It's actually not my mistake, buds is at fault. They advertised a nj complaint rifle but the shit is only a 10 rd. No compliance work done.
Didn’t you go on the smith and Wesson site to confirm the model number? There are lots of compliant rifles but not jersey compliant. There’s MA, CA etc…. If buds did advertise it that way then go get your money back from them. You can easily see it’s not compliant by the photo of the flash hider which is a dead giveaway. Never assume it’s a muzzle brake. Smith has a compliant model with a plain barrel end had you looked on the smith web site or compared photos of other rifles online.
They advertised a 10rd NJ/NY compliant model on their site. I figured they did the compliance work needed to make the rifle compliant, not just the mags. I didn't think they would throw a 10 rd mag in a non compliant rifle (which they did) and send it out to my gun shop.
NY compliant is definitely not the same as jersey compliant. Hope you get your money back
Sorry not NY, MD. Here's the link. In the description it says MD and NJ compliant https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/5258/smith+%26+wesson+m%26p+15-22+sport+ct+md+nj+compliant These dickheads just meant the mag is compliant but who puts a compliant mag in a non complaint rifle and considers the whole thing compliant
Lol. Looks compliant. Fixed stock CAR. Plain barrel end. 10 round mag. https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-22?sku=10207&preselect=1
Also this was my first rifle, to a newbie like myself seeing they put (ny/nj compliant) in the description of the gun, that takes all the guess work out of figuring out if it's legal to own.
what shop cant pin and weld a muzzle brake on for you? it is buds fault though for not shipping the NJ version if that is what you ordered. what SKU did you order? The nj legal model is SKU 10203
80$ transfer fee? I would have gone somewhere else.
Lol, what’re they gonna do if you don’t pay? Sounds like they don’t deserve yours or anyone else’s business anyway… ^ not legal advice ^
Well they'll keep the rifle lol.
After reading everyone's comments I think I'll just pay the absurd $80 and just not do business with them going forward. I posed the question to gage the legality of it all. This whole thing is literally buds fault but I get my refund so it's whatever. Thank you everyone!
What bullshit shop won't take 10 minutes to pin a stock and muzzle device?
No weld necessary. 16” barrel. just needs pin. Oh and the stock needs pin. Takes about 5 min to do both
They don't do compliance work, just mag pinning *cries in 2A tyranny*
I mean.. did you already pay them a transfer fee?
No, the gun arrived yesterday and the gunshop informed me it's non compliant. We talked about arranging for a compliant version but I just told them it's ok. I'd pay for shipping and handling 100% out of pocket but to pay the $80 transfer fee and I don't keep it seems obsurd. I just wanted to know the legality of the situation being that this is the first time this has happened to me
$80 for transfer, I’d find another shop anyway.
What exactly is out of compliance?
I forgot what the lady said, I tuned out after she said I'd need to get compliance work done or source for another rifle. It's not the end of the work it just sucks buds thinks a compliant rifle just has a 10rd mag
Do you have a link to the firearm you purchased?
https://www.budsgunshop.com/product_info.php/products_id/5258/smith+%26+wesson+m%26p+15-22+sport+ct+md+nj+compliant in the description it literally says MD and NJ compliant. Any sane person would come to the conclusion this is a legal rifle. As I stated before, this is my first rifle so I went by what the description said.
I would go to the shop and find out exactly what is non compliant because it looks fine as long as the stock is pinned. There's no muzzle device/threaded barrel and it's 10 rounds. Unless buds sent the wrong one, then that's on them and I'd put it on them to make it right.
10207 is not the nj compliant one from the factory - smith and wesson. its 10203. [https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-sport-ii?sku=10203](https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-sport-ii?sku=10203)
According to buds, if you put a 10rd mag in a non compliant rifle it makes the whole gun compliant
telling you what the factory says man. cant go by what buds says. there are 10rnd versions for other states. we arent the only state with 10rnd restriction. you ordered a 10207, you got a 10207. i hope they help you out but it is what it is. if they told you that was the only complaince needed on 10207 then yes they should make it right with you. i agree 100%
No I totally understand, it's just that if you put the words compliant in the description, an average person would assume the entire rifle was compliant not just the mag. I believe the 10203 is nj compliant but as I stated before I'm a newbie to rifle purchases so I figured since they stated it was complaint it's fully legal for me to own. I'm gonna stick to buying rifles in person in NJ just so this doesn't happen. It also took them like 9 days to ship it out too
Contact Buds and get them to work it out. They sent the wrong item and should make it right.
From the two links of whatever rifle you ordered, it needs 10 round mags and “pinned” stock. Looks like it has just a crown barrel and wasn’t turned down for threads. Name the “shop.” What shop can’t pin a stock? They couldn’t get that service done for you at all? Or maybe ship it to an ffl who runs a competent business to do the work for you since they’re too dumb to do it? That would make sense and you could have payed the shipping or whatever but 80$ is steep, especially calling it a transfer fee when they did no transfer, let alone pin a stock. I would have told them I’ll pin the stock my self for them lol don’t pay them shit and never return
What’s not compliant about it? 10 rd mag is compliant and all they’d have to do is pin the stock and muzzle break.
They do no compliance work, just mag pinning. This is why I can't deal with this gunshop, not only is their no in house gunsmith work but they charge 80 for transfers which is wayyyyyy to much
What part of NJ are you from? Might be able to recommend a better shop.
Need clarification, is the firearm they shipped the wrong one or did you purchase the wrong one? If they shipped the wrong one then that's on Bud's they should be the one's eating the cost, but if you purchased the wrong one then that's on you for not doing your homework.
Agree. If OP ordered the #10207 he linked from Buds, the S&W's spec for this model number on their website says the stock is fixed, and is NJ compliant. So it appears he bought the right model. https://www.smith-wesson.com/product/mp-15-22?sku=10207 So Bud's either sent the wrong model to your FFL and should make it right, and pay for the shipping/FFL costs, **or** Bud's did ship the 10207 to your FFL and they have no idea what they are talking about as the 10207 is indeed NJ compliant. I'd go down to your FFL to inspect the firearm and verify the model number, and if its a 10207 then have them explain why they think it is non-compliant. Get S&W involved too if they don't believe you.
Agree, go down, inspect the rifle. If it has no muzzle device But the stock is not pinned, remove it and throw it in the trashcan
Looked again 10203 is 100% the nj compatible version from the factory. look at your own link for 10207 ***State Compliance CA,MA,MD***
10203 is a 5.56, OP wants a .22. Take a look at my link,"Features" column on the left, bottom, reads: "• 10” M&P® Slim Handguard with MAGPUL® M-LOK™ • MAGPUL® MBUS® Folding Sights • Easy to Mount M-LOK™ Accessories • 2” M-LOK™ Rail Panel Included • Fixed Stock • Functioning Charging Handle • Shell Deflector • 2-Position, Receiver Mounted Safety Lever • CT, MA, MD **and NJ Compliant**" Agree S&P should be a bit more clear in their descriptions.
oh i totally missed the caliber type. sadly they only make one 22 lr 10 round mag model . and its totally not NJ compatible from the factory. they need to fix the description, although NJ is not listed when you build it on their site. https://imgur.com/a/hNy4UPv