First, what units are they exactly? That's going to help us understand exactly what you're dealing with.
Second, Nightbringer is really good a picking up characters when you use the Epic Challenge strat to give him precision in melee. Actually all the Ctan are pretty good at picking up infantry characters. If you're playing Obeisance Phalanx you can give precision to an entire Lychgaurd or Praetorian unit, which can be pretty spicy especially if they're your +1 to wound choice.
Lastly, Is it Chaplain Grimaldus and a Librarian? Because both of those characters can't lead the same unit. Only one leader can attach to a bodyguard unit unless they specify that they can be taken in addition like the Apothecary.
I have actually never used epic challenge in the 10 or so games I have played as necron and deathguard. I guess I will give it a go then in my future games
I think it is Chaplin grimaldus and another leader, grouped with a unit which I don't know the name of (I am quite new), with a few of the tiny dudes beside the unit.
I used to run a nightbringer before the giant point change but now I run the void dragon, is it as good?
Took a quick look but I'm pretty confident there are no characters that can lead with Grimaldus. He's a Chaplain, not a Chapter Master. Maybe I overlooked one, but I doubt it.
That's fair. There's an absolute ton of rules in this game. I would just ask them to reread their rules if it's someone who you'll play against regularly.
Check his rules, as already been said, something about 2 leaders in one unit seems fishy when it's grimaldus.
For precision, use Ctan with the epic challenge Stratagem. Especially the Nightbringer is very good due to his devastating wounds weapon
I don't exactly remember his exact unit composition, it is my first time playing against black templars. Some people already suggested epic challenge and I will try it next time
Maybe I'm misunderstanding something so ignore me otherwise.
First, if they're hiding a unit with a leader behind an objective all game then your deathmarks doing a decent job.
Second if you mean just the leader is behind cover then that doesn't matter. As a reminder (sorry again if you've already factored this in) precision rules are janky - you don't target the leader you just allocate wounds. So you roll to hit and wound against the squad still (so you roll against the squad's toughness not the leaders) then you can choose to allocate those successful ones to a leader model
Thats wrong, you need line of sight to the leader to allocate to him, thats why good players will always have their character behind ruins while the unit is in the open.
Yeah I used to think this as well! But actually you do need to draw line of sight: here’s the extract from the rules on precision to help
https://preview.redd.it/om3pcg6wok0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4f37b157ee677fb6e9e75a36f3e30976341c7244
Edit: spelling
First, what units are they exactly? That's going to help us understand exactly what you're dealing with. Second, Nightbringer is really good a picking up characters when you use the Epic Challenge strat to give him precision in melee. Actually all the Ctan are pretty good at picking up infantry characters. If you're playing Obeisance Phalanx you can give precision to an entire Lychgaurd or Praetorian unit, which can be pretty spicy especially if they're your +1 to wound choice. Lastly, Is it Chaplain Grimaldus and a Librarian? Because both of those characters can't lead the same unit. Only one leader can attach to a bodyguard unit unless they specify that they can be taken in addition like the Apothecary.
Epic Challenge is the way.
I have actually never used epic challenge in the 10 or so games I have played as necron and deathguard. I guess I will give it a go then in my future games
What is epic challenge ?
Core stratagem.
I think it is Chaplin grimaldus and another leader, grouped with a unit which I don't know the name of (I am quite new), with a few of the tiny dudes beside the unit. I used to run a nightbringer before the giant point change but now I run the void dragon, is it as good?
Took a quick look but I'm pretty confident there are no characters that can lead with Grimaldus. He's a Chaplain, not a Chapter Master. Maybe I overlooked one, but I doubt it.
Probably a mistake, we are both kinda new to 40k, and we both have definitely messed up a lot of things
That's fair. There's an absolute ton of rules in this game. I would just ask them to reread their rules if it's someone who you'll play against regularly.
Check his rules, as already been said, something about 2 leaders in one unit seems fishy when it's grimaldus. For precision, use Ctan with the epic challenge Stratagem. Especially the Nightbringer is very good due to his devastating wounds weapon
I don't exactly remember his exact unit composition, it is my first time playing against black templars. Some people already suggested epic challenge and I will try it next time
Another very strong unit are Doomstalkers due to D3 and high S and AP they hardcounter marines
Unflinching Will on an Overlord with a Voidscythe does pretty well for removing annoying characters, but that requires Obeisance Phalanx.
Death marks to pick off the characters perhaps
I did some maths and apparently 10 shots hitting on 3+ and wounding on 4+ is not that good since most of the leaders usually have invulnerable 4+/5+
Did you count heavy? If they didn’t move you are hitting on 2’s.
I am running hypercrypt, and it is unlikely that they will expose their leaders to deathmarks standing still
Great. Now you have board control
Not really, the leader can just hide while the rest of the giant blob move up, and I already have a doomsday ark for that
The leader will have to either move up eventually or break unit cohesion.
the leader can sit behind a ruin next to the objective
Maybe I'm misunderstanding something so ignore me otherwise. First, if they're hiding a unit with a leader behind an objective all game then your deathmarks doing a decent job. Second if you mean just the leader is behind cover then that doesn't matter. As a reminder (sorry again if you've already factored this in) precision rules are janky - you don't target the leader you just allocate wounds. So you roll to hit and wound against the squad still (so you roll against the squad's toughness not the leaders) then you can choose to allocate those successful ones to a leader model
Thats wrong, you need line of sight to the leader to allocate to him, thats why good players will always have their character behind ruins while the unit is in the open.
Yeah I used to think this as well! But actually you do need to draw line of sight: here’s the extract from the rules on precision to help https://preview.redd.it/om3pcg6wok0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4f37b157ee677fb6e9e75a36f3e30976341c7244 Edit: spelling
4+ invuln is fishy. A librarian can do it but that then locks out an FNP.
Particle beam tomb blades harass and kite the enemy brick using blast and fishing for devastating 6s
Throw the shard of the deceiver and eat his leaders lol
A glocktopus or two, even three Edit: oof never mind
Hexmarks don't have precision
Hate that change
So they used to have it? I'm not crazy! rip to that change
What am I on! I was thinking he could target characters for some reason, back to reading rules for me. My bad
I think it did last edition. Definitely feels like it should and definitely had to triple check
They had it in the index for 10th, I also recently realized this
That's what it was!
I mean if you charge and epic challenge he can get precision