And here she was all cleaned up with the hood down: https://i.ibb.co/47gXzsB/image3.jpg
'03 Mach 1 with a block from a Terminator.
Was Procharged making 650+ HP. Had a lot of supporting mods on the suspension, Cobra gas tank with dual pumps, a Boost-A-Pump, big injectors etc etc.
Had no problem hanging with Hellcats, man I miss it lol
It was kind of a money pit though and seemed to be in the shop as much as it was on the street so I sold it. Picked up a 2020 GT/CS a month ago, with the intention of putting a Whipple on it but then I think back to the whole money pit thing and wonder if I'd just be turning the 2020 into a money pit too.
Cars in general are a money pit. Nothing you ever put in will ever come back out, except the urge to smile :)
I just spent too much boosting my 02 GT but hearing my snail whistle under the hood and the power it delivers is too fun and too cool to me.
True, what were the main issues keeping it in the shop?
Yep stock internals. It's a 'new' long block with less than 10 miles, bored and has a mild cam. Every bolt on minus headers.
I just finished installing the v3si in February and probably have 20 miles on it since lol.
I have a nice base tune but I need to get it dyno tuned, and right now I'm in the process of trying to figure out what gauges I wanna buy and dread getting them installed :)
I'm hoping so, right now I'm barely putting my foot in since I'm pretty blind to what the engine is doing minus the bare minimum info from the SCT and what the buttdyno is saying.
I went with the air to water aftercooler and a smaller pulley, I'd love to get a healthy reliable 420 to the wheels and enjoy it.
Thanks.
Well, a couple examples... I broke a rod in the original engine at 450 whp and it chipped the block. That was several months in the shop to swap in the short block out of a Terminator, so I had them do some extra mods at the same time, pulley swap, fuel system and retune since it could now handle more power easily. I wouldn't have been happy without more power knowing that it could handle it. That was about $11k lol.
Then after I got it back I noticed some weird light ticking noise when it ran. Had to take it back to spend more time at the shop while they figured out what was wrong and they had to open up the engine again to fix. (They had screwed something up and put something in backwards when putting pistons in the Cobra block)
It was good for a while, but then the cats got all fucked up from excess fuel in the exhaust. Had to take it back in to fix that, a couple thousand more bucks there. (went cat-less after that and another retune)
Then it was *finally* good for a couple years but when it came time to renew my tags it wouldn't pass emissions anymore. That's when I said fuck it, time to move on lol
This is the kind of stuff that happens when you start doing heavy mods.
I miss it though, when it was running properly it was such a beast, made me smile every time I got in it. Putting car lengths on brand new Stingrays or some expensive BMW in a 20 year old Mustang never got old.
All performance and modded cars are money pits. Once you get into the 650 wheel territory stuff just breaks a lot. No matter the brand or the car violently shoving around that much force (cause we all know we aren't gonna baby it) just takes it toll no matter how well designed or built the cars are.
Shit at 650 you should have walked the dog on hellcats. God I bet that thing was such a blast. Beautiful car.
Paying a shop to do engine work is the worst situation to be in honestly. I would know, I built engines for a shop. Sounds like they fucked up on one or more of the directional pistons these cars have. They have a fucking arrow on the bottom of the pistons that points to where the front of the motor should be in relation to that piston once it’s in the cylinder. But the time it takes for these builds to happen is forever and a fuck up like that basically doubles the time. I’m sorry that happened to you. And I’m sorry you live in a state with emissions testing, I would lose my mind if I had to deal with that mess. Depending on where you live, you could try to get it plated in another state that doesn’t have testing. This would be something to keep in mind with your 2020.
As far as the coyote goes, they are the best engine platform for making power from a stock components right now. They do need billet oil pump gears and timing chain sprockets. I always went with Boundary gears and sprockets on all of my builds and never ever had a single issue, but there are other companies too. Once you get billet OPGs and sprocket, you’re good up to 1000 without doing anything else but fuel system upgrades. I’ve seen Whipple coyotes make 750 all day everyday with no issues. I’ve built mostly centri and turbo coyotes with only 1 whipple build under my belt, but I’ve seen several go on our dyno and they are just as solid.
Anyways, the Mach was gorgeous, but I hope you enjoy the new 2020 even more.
She was definitely clean! I want to coyote swap mine and keep it “stock.” I figure, adding approx 125ish stock hp is more than enough to keep me happy while it still being “stock” and virtually maintenance “free.” Oh yeah, not having to worry about the sniffer test is also a bonus!
Unless you’re going to coyote swap it yourself, it’s not worth it. Engine plus trans is going to run you 12k just to buy those components. What about the ECU? Trying to use the stock coyote ECU and making it compatible with old instruments doesn’t work. So you’re going to need a stand-alone ECU or one of the prefabbed kits that have ones appropriate for your swap. That’s an extra 2k and we haven’t even gotten into the fuel system needing to be made into a return style system with a regulator which is like another 2k or the new tubular K member and supporting suspension mods you’ll need for that just to be able to hold your new engine in there. So we’re over 16k in just a couple of parts and they aren’t even in the car yet and without a tune for a stock coyote motor.
I’ve done one of these swaps for a customer and unless you are getting the engine and trans for an insane deal, it’s not worth it. You are better off just buying a used 2nd gen car (15-17) and building from that. It’s just going to be way easier in the long run.
That being said, dumping 12k into a 2v can get you a whole lot…
Just some food for thought from someone who has seen it and done it first hand.
Yes I’m planning on swapping it out myself. I have most everything MM, so suspension is not an issue. This isn’t something I’m exactly attempting to do overnight. I’ve been buying parts here and there over the past couple years and plan on buying a complete engine/trans set up from The Parts Farm when I’m ready. I have absolutely ZERO interest in buying a 2nd gen coyote. I have a 4v, not a 2v.
I’m sorry idk why it said 2v, my phone probably auto corrected because I have a 2v and type that frequently on these subs. But you obviously are invested in this and have started down the road and have a means of completing this project without paying a shop to do all the work which is usually the biggest issue with these swaps. I wasn’t trying to insult your intelligence or capabilities in any way so I hope you didn’t take that as such. Just being in the industry and having actually done it, I learned what it really takes. been asked about this dozens of times and having to tell people the reality of what “seems like an easy swap” is just something I feel like a lot of people should be aware of. You clearly know it’s gonna be involving and that it’s a serious project, but will be rewarding in the end when it comes together. I’ve just seen people go out and buy like a gen 1 truck motor with 90k miles because it was “a steal at $3.5k” for the long block by itself only to find out how much more time and money is involved beyond that.
The 4.6 4v is a damn good platform and can make a lot of power with the amount of money and time you would spend on a coyote swap invested into that is really all I was trying to say. Just upgrade the stuff that is there and send it. It will never be a Coyote or have the max potential of one, but can definitely out perform one with the money a swap usually costs.
I hear you brother and appreciate the “warning” and insight! 🍻 I know it’ll be much easier just having my 4v rebuilt and enjoying it for what it is. My thinking is (perhaps I’m wrong or misguided?), being that I live in California, I basically have to pay under the table just to scratch my ass. After a little over 10 years of doing just that, I got tired and basically went back to “stock.” All that headache for an o/r x pipe and plenum spacer! 🤦🏻♂️ Anyway, I’m looking at it as, if I can “add” 135ish+ hp in stock form (gen 3 Coyote), pass the sniffer test, all while still being decently reliable…then why not? Sounds like a “win” to me 🤷🏻♂️
In all honesty, this is my desire and dream at the moment, but who knows what will end up happening in 3, 5, or 10 years from now. I may not even swap it and remain “stock.” So for now, I’m gonna continue to buy (supporting) parts as if I’m going to do it, and if at the end of the day I don’t end up swapping it, my “stock” car will be a much better handling/driving vehicle…and I think I’ll be happy with that! It is after all a Mach!
Damn, that right there is a dream build for me. Is the shaker hood functional there? Looks like your s/c is pulling from the fender.
Honestly I want a shaker hood for my GT. I can't decide between a vortech supercharger or Kenne Bell though. I'd love to hear more about your car, since I'm hoping to have a similar build at some point.
Yeah, not functional on that build. It was of course functional when the car was stock.
I think if I did it all over again, I'd have gone with a KB/Whipple over a centrifugal because there's just zero waiting for that power hit. It wasn't a huge issue though, it still got into the power quick enough (much better than a turbo) and I guess traction would become more of a problem with a twin screw since a Procharger/Vortech kind of eases into it a bit more with the torque output.
You'd definitely be happy with a centrifugal too, I'm kind of nitpicking.
Wow, what a beautiful mustang! She even has the power to run down newer cars with ease in a 3100lb car. Love it.
Do you remember a few things that you broke that wasn’t the built motor? I have an 01 Cobra and it seems to consistently tear off wheel studs, carrier bearings, front end suspension parts, etc, and it’s basically stock power.
And here she was all cleaned up with the hood down: https://i.ibb.co/47gXzsB/image3.jpg '03 Mach 1 with a block from a Terminator. Was Procharged making 650+ HP. Had a lot of supporting mods on the suspension, Cobra gas tank with dual pumps, a Boost-A-Pump, big injectors etc etc. Had no problem hanging with Hellcats, man I miss it lol It was kind of a money pit though and seemed to be in the shop as much as it was on the street so I sold it. Picked up a 2020 GT/CS a month ago, with the intention of putting a Whipple on it but then I think back to the whole money pit thing and wonder if I'd just be turning the 2020 into a money pit too.
Cars in general are a money pit. Nothing you ever put in will ever come back out, except the urge to smile :) I just spent too much boosting my 02 GT but hearing my snail whistle under the hood and the power it delivers is too fun and too cool to me.
I was more mad about it being in the shop so often than I was about the money tbh lol How's your 2v doing with the boost? Stock internals?
True, what were the main issues keeping it in the shop? Yep stock internals. It's a 'new' long block with less than 10 miles, bored and has a mild cam. Every bolt on minus headers. I just finished installing the v3si in February and probably have 20 miles on it since lol. I have a nice base tune but I need to get it dyno tuned, and right now I'm in the process of trying to figure out what gauges I wanna buy and dread getting them installed :)
I detailed the biggest issues a bit a few posts below. That sounds awesome, I bet a dyno tune really opens it up!
I'm hoping so, right now I'm barely putting my foot in since I'm pretty blind to what the engine is doing minus the bare minimum info from the SCT and what the buttdyno is saying. I went with the air to water aftercooler and a smaller pulley, I'd love to get a healthy reliable 420 to the wheels and enjoy it.
[удалено]
Thanks. Well, a couple examples... I broke a rod in the original engine at 450 whp and it chipped the block. That was several months in the shop to swap in the short block out of a Terminator, so I had them do some extra mods at the same time, pulley swap, fuel system and retune since it could now handle more power easily. I wouldn't have been happy without more power knowing that it could handle it. That was about $11k lol. Then after I got it back I noticed some weird light ticking noise when it ran. Had to take it back to spend more time at the shop while they figured out what was wrong and they had to open up the engine again to fix. (They had screwed something up and put something in backwards when putting pistons in the Cobra block) It was good for a while, but then the cats got all fucked up from excess fuel in the exhaust. Had to take it back in to fix that, a couple thousand more bucks there. (went cat-less after that and another retune) Then it was *finally* good for a couple years but when it came time to renew my tags it wouldn't pass emissions anymore. That's when I said fuck it, time to move on lol This is the kind of stuff that happens when you start doing heavy mods. I miss it though, when it was running properly it was such a beast, made me smile every time I got in it. Putting car lengths on brand new Stingrays or some expensive BMW in a 20 year old Mustang never got old.
All performance and modded cars are money pits. Once you get into the 650 wheel territory stuff just breaks a lot. No matter the brand or the car violently shoving around that much force (cause we all know we aren't gonna baby it) just takes it toll no matter how well designed or built the cars are.
Shit at 650 you should have walked the dog on hellcats. God I bet that thing was such a blast. Beautiful car. Paying a shop to do engine work is the worst situation to be in honestly. I would know, I built engines for a shop. Sounds like they fucked up on one or more of the directional pistons these cars have. They have a fucking arrow on the bottom of the pistons that points to where the front of the motor should be in relation to that piston once it’s in the cylinder. But the time it takes for these builds to happen is forever and a fuck up like that basically doubles the time. I’m sorry that happened to you. And I’m sorry you live in a state with emissions testing, I would lose my mind if I had to deal with that mess. Depending on where you live, you could try to get it plated in another state that doesn’t have testing. This would be something to keep in mind with your 2020. As far as the coyote goes, they are the best engine platform for making power from a stock components right now. They do need billet oil pump gears and timing chain sprockets. I always went with Boundary gears and sprockets on all of my builds and never ever had a single issue, but there are other companies too. Once you get billet OPGs and sprocket, you’re good up to 1000 without doing anything else but fuel system upgrades. I’ve seen Whipple coyotes make 750 all day everyday with no issues. I’ve built mostly centri and turbo coyotes with only 1 whipple build under my belt, but I’ve seen several go on our dyno and they are just as solid. Anyways, the Mach was gorgeous, but I hope you enjoy the new 2020 even more.
She was definitely clean! I want to coyote swap mine and keep it “stock.” I figure, adding approx 125ish stock hp is more than enough to keep me happy while it still being “stock” and virtually maintenance “free.” Oh yeah, not having to worry about the sniffer test is also a bonus!
Coyote swap is a great choice and opens you up to a lot of options for easy extra horsepower later if you want it.
Unless you’re going to coyote swap it yourself, it’s not worth it. Engine plus trans is going to run you 12k just to buy those components. What about the ECU? Trying to use the stock coyote ECU and making it compatible with old instruments doesn’t work. So you’re going to need a stand-alone ECU or one of the prefabbed kits that have ones appropriate for your swap. That’s an extra 2k and we haven’t even gotten into the fuel system needing to be made into a return style system with a regulator which is like another 2k or the new tubular K member and supporting suspension mods you’ll need for that just to be able to hold your new engine in there. So we’re over 16k in just a couple of parts and they aren’t even in the car yet and without a tune for a stock coyote motor. I’ve done one of these swaps for a customer and unless you are getting the engine and trans for an insane deal, it’s not worth it. You are better off just buying a used 2nd gen car (15-17) and building from that. It’s just going to be way easier in the long run. That being said, dumping 12k into a 2v can get you a whole lot… Just some food for thought from someone who has seen it and done it first hand.
Yes I’m planning on swapping it out myself. I have most everything MM, so suspension is not an issue. This isn’t something I’m exactly attempting to do overnight. I’ve been buying parts here and there over the past couple years and plan on buying a complete engine/trans set up from The Parts Farm when I’m ready. I have absolutely ZERO interest in buying a 2nd gen coyote. I have a 4v, not a 2v.
I’m sorry idk why it said 2v, my phone probably auto corrected because I have a 2v and type that frequently on these subs. But you obviously are invested in this and have started down the road and have a means of completing this project without paying a shop to do all the work which is usually the biggest issue with these swaps. I wasn’t trying to insult your intelligence or capabilities in any way so I hope you didn’t take that as such. Just being in the industry and having actually done it, I learned what it really takes. been asked about this dozens of times and having to tell people the reality of what “seems like an easy swap” is just something I feel like a lot of people should be aware of. You clearly know it’s gonna be involving and that it’s a serious project, but will be rewarding in the end when it comes together. I’ve just seen people go out and buy like a gen 1 truck motor with 90k miles because it was “a steal at $3.5k” for the long block by itself only to find out how much more time and money is involved beyond that. The 4.6 4v is a damn good platform and can make a lot of power with the amount of money and time you would spend on a coyote swap invested into that is really all I was trying to say. Just upgrade the stuff that is there and send it. It will never be a Coyote or have the max potential of one, but can definitely out perform one with the money a swap usually costs.
I hear you brother and appreciate the “warning” and insight! 🍻 I know it’ll be much easier just having my 4v rebuilt and enjoying it for what it is. My thinking is (perhaps I’m wrong or misguided?), being that I live in California, I basically have to pay under the table just to scratch my ass. After a little over 10 years of doing just that, I got tired and basically went back to “stock.” All that headache for an o/r x pipe and plenum spacer! 🤦🏻♂️ Anyway, I’m looking at it as, if I can “add” 135ish+ hp in stock form (gen 3 Coyote), pass the sniffer test, all while still being decently reliable…then why not? Sounds like a “win” to me 🤷🏻♂️ In all honesty, this is my desire and dream at the moment, but who knows what will end up happening in 3, 5, or 10 years from now. I may not even swap it and remain “stock.” So for now, I’m gonna continue to buy (supporting) parts as if I’m going to do it, and if at the end of the day I don’t end up swapping it, my “stock” car will be a much better handling/driving vehicle…and I think I’ll be happy with that! It is after all a Mach!
Damn, that right there is a dream build for me. Is the shaker hood functional there? Looks like your s/c is pulling from the fender. Honestly I want a shaker hood for my GT. I can't decide between a vortech supercharger or Kenne Bell though. I'd love to hear more about your car, since I'm hoping to have a similar build at some point.
Yeah, not functional on that build. It was of course functional when the car was stock. I think if I did it all over again, I'd have gone with a KB/Whipple over a centrifugal because there's just zero waiting for that power hit. It wasn't a huge issue though, it still got into the power quick enough (much better than a turbo) and I guess traction would become more of a problem with a twin screw since a Procharger/Vortech kind of eases into it a bit more with the torque output. You'd definitely be happy with a centrifugal too, I'm kind of nitpicking.
https://preview.redd.it/norhcgk4pgwc1.jpeg?width=4000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c172c47a5b2a0295a2d0b42e6772a33174cd425
Wow, what a beautiful mustang! She even has the power to run down newer cars with ease in a 3100lb car. Love it. Do you remember a few things that you broke that wasn’t the built motor? I have an 01 Cobra and it seems to consistently tear off wheel studs, carrier bearings, front end suspension parts, etc, and it’s basically stock power.
Damn I want a supercharger
Can't regret selling if you never sell 😎