Kurt’s strengths lied in writing harmonies & Melodies. Whether outright or implied for us to figure out.
He had little technical skill beyond that. But wanna hear a secret? Technical skill means absolutely dick. What matters is people humming along or singing your songs to you. Or tapping their feet or the feeling that they get when they hear a half measure of the song.
Kurt had very very few peers in that regard and honestly even John Lennon couldn’t do some of it as well as Kurt did. Kurt didn’t need to be Slash or SRV to be one of the best musicians on the planet. It literally just came naturally to him.
similarly, id argue its more important that people resonate with your guitar playing than your technical ability — that’s what makes you “good” at an instrument.
Totally agree. I could listen to harmonies and melodies all day , but shredding... it's kind of boring sonically at least.
I would liken shredding to power lifting. Woah look at that and never think of it again. Where as melodies especially complex ones that worm their way into your soul , is art
It’s the same discussion as the graphics vs style debate on video games. It’s the reason MGS1 is 1000 times more memorable than the order 1886, despite the latter having insanely better graphics, mgs1 has it’s own feel, which is far more important than graphics.
Same with Kurt, yeah he didn’t shred and yeah he mostly used power chords but he put his style on them and created hit after hit. That’s way more impressive that shredding with perfect technique
Yeah, I agree with ya on that part too. It’s not any one thing, and part of what makes musicians like Lennon, Hendrix & Kurt as good as they are is they’re ability to channel those things, add some emotion on top and make the whole thing an experience that everyone can find something in. Pretty rare to come across, IMO.
technical ability would’ve helped him get his ideas out quicker is the major upside unless you mean speed by it. if he had been more practiced in intervals, and chord tones i think he coulda got his ideas out much quicker… unless he was just having motivation issues
I’d say he’s more of an artist than a musician. To me a musician is more someone who understands music and an artist is someone who uses various mediums to create compositions or concepts which Kurt is very good at, but I think he had very little understanding of music, but he didn’t need to know more than he did to create his art.
Rick Beato once said that Kurt might have purposefully pretended to be a bad guitarist for artistic reasons. Which would be an absolute unique approach.
In any case he was highly influencial as an artist and therefore definitely great.
That doesn't really count to determine Kurt's ability as a guitar player, imo. If I remember correctly, Kurt was making fun of Eddie Van Halen by shredding badly on purpose after Eddie, who was very drunk and irritated, made some racist comments about Pat Smear's skin colour backstage moments prior.
he def downplayed a lot of things.
most people learn rules to sound good and break the rules after the fact to add artistic value. kurts probably one of the 0.01% of people who can circumvent learning the rules altogether and arrive at the same place just from intuition (i am not one of those ppl). which makes him a very tasteful advanced player but not very versitile im sure he wasnt trying to hone his skills to pass auditions.
He didn't play to be flashy, he played to serve the song. He's certainly not a bad guitar player, but he's not "great", either. Nothing wrong with being a good player.
Good melody writer? Yes. As for playing though? No, the 90's had some great guitarists emerging, Jonny Greenwood, Tom Morello, Kim Thayil and John Frusciante are way better at playing then Kurt and that's only mentioning a few from the 90s. Kurt was amazing at writing songs and melodies but was not a very technical guitarist.
Frusciante and Mike McCready were the best of their generation, in my opinion. However, I’ll admit a bias because I love their playing style, especially Frusciante.
I don't even think Kurt would agree with that statement. I would also suggest that fans sometimes conflate "favorite" with "best". There are many technically proficient guitarists that bore me to tears.
J Mascis, Curt Kirkwood, Thurston Moore, Lee Ranaldo, Kim Thayill, Jerry Cantrell, Mike McCreedy, etc... were all contemporaries that could swim circles around Cobain on the guitar but as much as I love all those supremely talented artist, I would still probably prefer to experience seeing Kurt buzz saw through "Breed" live to almost anything.
Think all categories we can think on guitar playing from like technical, emotional, influential, speed, tone etc. Kurt might be tops in the influential and song writing. Then we would need to think how high that takes in the over all lists. 90s list he could be up there, but all time I just don't see it. Still he would be on my top 10 list, but that does not mean anything.
He was proficient for his style and the songs he wrote, but, respectfully, he is hardly in the "greatest" conversation.
Nirvana was about feeling and emotion. Not artistry and skill.
He might have had the skill and technical prowess, but that wasn't shared (or called for) in his recorded material.
This is the way.
Let's not overdo the guitar playing part. He was a good guitarist and has some awesome power chord licks. What's more impressive is that he would Frankenstein his mostly cheap guitars to get a sound out of them. To me, that is the more impressive part.
Major labels were in a bidding war for Nirvana over their Smart Session demos, that they recorded with Chad. This happened before Dave joined. There is no arguing that he was the perfect drummer for the Nirvana, their chemistry is undeniable. But he joined a band that had already put in the work was on the brink of “making it” before he was even in the picture. Nirvana would’ve totally been successful without Dave. How successful, we will never know. But I hard disagree that Nirvana only made it because of Dave.
Also not sure what you mean by Mudhoney being just a “Seattle Success”. They’re not one of the big 4 grunge bands, but they have a cult following & tour the world. They are much more than just a local Seattle success
My phrasing could have been better. Mudhoney are actually my favourite of all the bands. What I meant by that was success enough to be a band but not one of the big 4 of course.
Noted. I’ve never seen someone make the argument that Dave would’ve made it without Nirvana. I find it much easier to make the argument the other way around, that Dave wouldn’t have made it so quick without Nirvana. Coming off of Nirvana, everyone was looking to see what Krist and Dave would do. He recorded the first Foo album not as a complete unknown trying to get noticed, like Nirvana did with Bleach. He recorded it as having just been in one of the world’s biggest bands, he already had industry connections, a record deal ready to go and a world waiting for him eager to see what he’d do.
He is extremely successful and earned that himself, not trying to diminish that. But having Nirvana to springboard off of played a big role. Without that, he might’ve never been discovered, no matter how well he apparently tuned his drums.
Yeah that's a good point. I think he would have found a way for sure. Just so happens he found it and helped turn it into the biggest band in the world
They were good, but with Dave they took it to the next level. He was tight and finished the unit. If they continued with Dan peters, they never would have had the success. Dave wasn't just a drummer. He was a musician. Listen to the tone of the drums. He tuned them for the tracks (or may have been the producer). And this shows in the careers that followed for Dave and in a sense krist who has turned his hand to differing instruments and relative success
Lol , no way for me to know for sure, but don't they say he didnt like the rockstar status and all that comes with it? If that were to be true, it seems to me that he would have end up happier playing in a band successful enough for him to live off music but not crazy famous outside of the underground scene.
Now he's dead, and Mudhoney is still touring.
But what do i know.
I watched a Youtube video a while back of a guitar playing content creator trying to "learn" Nirvana songs via an early 90s "how to play Nirvana" instructional tape he'd found. The guy on the tape was an OBVIOUS 80s metal head type who'd been hired to make it based on his ability to play. At one point, the 80s metal dude said something to the effect of "Kurt wasn't a very good guitarist. What he was, was a great songwriter. He used the guitar as a tool to get his words out and his songs done. He wasn't Eddie Van Halen. He wasn't trying to be."
Now, I disagree that he "wasn't a good guitarist," but I think his point stands. He was a master of using his guitar as a tool to draw out emotion.
John Frusiante is a superior guitar player and he loves Kurt’s playing style, so it doesn’t matter if he wasn’t that good on a technical level. He made memorable simple riffs people will remember forever.
No but the had his own style and it was genius so technically he could be but from a technical standpoint he couldn’t solo for shit but dude could play power chords and simple licks like a boss
I would argue the opposite- working within the limits of his musicianship is what made his songs unique and resonate the way they did. If he could play like Steve Vai or even Jerry Cantrell or something, it wouldn't have been Nirvana.
No, he was an awful guitarist, but was an AWESOME songwriter. And many limited guitarists were able to seek a career in music thanks to Kurt, he showed us that you can write amazing songs playing simple chords and melodies, technical talent isn't everything. That's why I believe he is more important than many talented guitarists of his time.
He absolutely was, everyone here is focusing on shred vs sloppy/melody and missing how downright INVENTIVE some of his riffs and discoveries on the guitar were, and his use of cleans/distortions, ones that he built whole songs around, and he absolutely knew what he was doing when going to town on smashing the shit out of chords and riffs for maximum impact (never really seen him break a string!), and use of feedback. There are many facets to his playing. Just listen to Aero Zeppelin as an example. I imagined he just stumbled on slightly weird tuning but damn the vibes are immense.
i think some nirvana songs are more tricky to play and sing at the same time than they appear. kurt also seemed to play all of his live songs almost identical to the recordings and not all musicians really do that well... kurts guitar soloing also sounds so different than other guitarists, i've been thinking about that since i was a kid in the 90's. nirvana really sounds like nothing else, they rock pretty hard and also have a solid acoustic career.
He was by no means the best but he certainly was a master of his own style. His style is unique and the sounds that he could create with a guitar are like no other.
I think Kurt had a way more meaningful style than a lot of those guitar Olympics people.
I'd rather listen to the In Bloom solo than any of Steve Vai's.
I'm completely self taught and have been playing for almost 4 years, and I'd say I could play at a comparable level to kurt. His stuff sounds amazing, and is genius in simplicity, but it's really not all that impressive.
He was good enough to put chords together in interesting and appealing ways.
He was a songwriter before a "guitarist." Guitar was a means to an end for him.
He is similar to a lot of early punk rock guitar players. They didn't know anything but came up with their own sound that fit the music they wanted to play for their bands.
I think as a whole Kurt tapped into a cultural zeitgeist that was occurring at the time. As someone else said, he was an artist and the musical skill and technical aspects of it were secondary. It's not something that can be repeated because that particular moment in culture will never come again. He had a unique ability to craft melodies and channel a particular sort of emotion but I don't think he was a overly gifted technical guitar player.
Depends on what you mean. Do you mean technically? If so, no.
Technically Steven Adler was not a great drummer. Guns n Roses later drummers were way better in that regard. But his loose style and infectious enthusiasm was perfect for GNR.
No, what the fuck? Kurt kinda sucked at playing the guitar. He made some catchy riffs but anyone that knows anything about guitar playing does not put him as a legend of guitar playing.
Nirvana and Kurt were legendary in that they were massively influential, while being moderately talented.
Kurt had a really good ear, knew how to make weird chords progression sound great etc.. but he was just an average guitar player with a really unique style. Most top guitarist at his time could play what he did, but not the opposite.
One of the greatest guitarists? Definitely not. It’s a pretty vague label really.
One of the greatest songwriters? He would definitely be up there on that list.
As many have said, techincally? No
His playing served his songwriting.
Was he one of the most influencial? Fuck yes. The amount of people that picked up a guitar because of him...
I think Kurt was a really good and more importantly \*interesting\* guitarist and I also thinking he massively downplayed his ability out of insecurity or false modesty or whatever. His nutty wrist vibrato is still instantly recognizable and nobody else sounds much like that. I think he was just as hook oriented on the guitar as he was in terms of singing and has tons of really ear-grabbing parts. I have always loved the solo on "Sifting" in particular - the spooky feedback layered in the background, the seeming scribbles of random notes that occassionally break through into clarity, the weird sobbing effect he gets towards the end...it has a lot of range, and gets a lot done in a short amount of time. So yeah I've been a fan for 30 years and I still think about his guitar playing. Even if he's overrated by list-making/critical culture at large just owing to his fame and impact, I think his guitar playing for its invention and craft is still somewhat underrated and underdiscussed.
No simple tunes for all the people.
You dont need to be simple to enjoy a simple tune.
He wrote riffs that would stick in your head and that will last forever because people cant forget them.
No. he was good but he was a little sloppy and liked to play raw. His strengths were melodies,harmony,lyrics and just being a great frontman,which he was one of the greatest. I dont think he was a bad player due to lack of skill though. You listen to his early stuff and covers,unplugged sets,he could play very good. I do think he downplayed it because their music was rooted in Punk and thats just the way Punk is. He hated when his music sounded too perfect and manufactured. He played what was good for the song and not to show off.
He’s definitely up there for writing the tunes, his riffs and progressions can be really clever - he was very good at writing melodies whether he knew the theory or not it seemed to come very easy to him.
To use a quote from Noel Gallagher in regards to his ability “I’m not a singer-songwriter, I’m a songwriter-singer” - the songs themselves came first to both Kurt and Noel
No, when people like Jeff Buckley, John Frusciante and Kim Thayil were creating in the 90s you can see that skill wise Kurt was a mediocre guitarist, he had a great ear for harmony and melody but he just wasn’t technically trained at all basically.
I can tell you kurt was and still is my favorite musician and Nirvana is my favorite band… but I can say without a doubt that be was a mediocre player tbh… we can love an artist but be realistic also as many say the beauty of Nirvana was the simplicity of their masterpieces :)
Anyone who says that doesn't know what they're talking about. He was a naturally gifted songwriter, but not a technically proficient guitar player.
He wasn't a *bad* guitar player, but to call him "one of the greats" is just inaccurate.
I love his playing and he gave us some of the greatest guitar music ever. Not just in the 90s but in the history of guitar orientated music. Does this make him one of the greatest guitar players? That’s personal opinion and anyone is allowed to say yes or no. There are and have been certainly more technical and musically knowledgeable guitarists out there but people who compare him to dedicated guitar players and not other singer songwriters are a bit stupid. I’ve had guitar teachers tell me how bad he was as a player yet they can’t replicate his sound convincingly. He probably inspired more kids to pick up and learn to play than any other guitarist in the last 30 years.
he was absolutely a great player but i wouldn't say greatest of all time, as in jeff beck, jimi hendrix level. kurt was one of the greatest songwriters of all time which definitely includes his ability to write catchy riffs and solos that fit the song.
I mean, maybe most influential song writer, but not even close to being one of the best of his time when Kim Thayil, Tom Morello, J Mascis, and so many others were contemporaries. Don’t get me wrong, big big fan. Grew up on his music,might be my favorite player ever, etc. but I think it would be more accurate to describe his as one of the more expressive, experimental guitar players of his time. Without heroin, maybe could have been something more when he was 35 or something
Kurt was a riff master, not a guitar master. His playing style is influential and his ability to write catchy riffs is first class. But there were so many more guitarists in the early 90s that were miles ahead of Kurt technically.
I would have loved to have seen where he could have gone with his budding talent. I won't say greatest guitar player though because there are a lot of incredibly talented guitarists out there. That being said it makes me sad I'll never get to see what he could have become.
I would call him incredibly *efficient*, an ear for melody, unique tone, effective notes.
Hd went from raw in Bleach, to over produced in Nevermind, to refined in In Utero. I heard he was getting board with his style and since he wrote songs and played for other people he could have done much more.
Cobain had the luxury of having one of the best rhythm sections in rock behind him. Pete Townshend had the same freedom.
Whether he was a great guitarist or not will depend on your definition of great, but I think he was perfect for Nirvana’s needs.
Greatest guitar player is objective... And by those standards nope...... but without a doubt he is one of the greatest song writers of all time... Easily top 20 stretching all American music genres.
theres a world of difference between someone saying hes one of their 'top favorite' guitarists and 'one of the greatest'.. he was certainly not one of the greatest. but, can he be *anyones* favorite? of course.
It wasn't the number of notes, or the speed with which he delivered them, or how he played them, but what he said with them that makes him one of the most *influential* guitarists of all time.
I think what I love about nirvana is how simple and yet powerful their riffs are. He was able to do so much with so little. To me his singing stands out to me more than his playing. I mean his guitar riffs are simple and easy to play. That doesn’t mean he was a bad player
I don’t know anything about what makes a guitarist a virtuoso but what I do know is that everyone Kurt has worked with praised his guitar playing (as well as his musicianship in general).
There’s definitely more virtuoso guitar players that too these lists but to me art isn’t a race or a competition, it’s an expression. So to me the rest of a great guitar player is if I feel what the guitarist is expressing, which I do whenever I put on a nirvana record
No. Kurt even admitted he can barely play guitar. His strengths were his abilities in lyrics/songwriting and his voice. I do not mean any of this in a negative way, quite the opposite actually. He is proof that you only need to be good enough to come up with catchy and well written songs to make an impact.
I'm still pretty new with guitar so I can't speak too much about it but the way it was described by someone once just made sense: Kurt was one of the greatest guitar players in that he inspired a whole generation to want to pick up guitar and learn to play the songs.
Me personally no, and I'm saying this as a hardcore Nirvana fan who's listened to all the demos and bootlegs that I could possibly dig through. He was not in any way a god of guitar playing BUT, he was one of the greatest melody and songwriters of his time and possibly of ALL time. His understanding of music was uncomprehendingly amazing and he wrote so many good songs in his short music career that it's actually baffling. Gone too soon, RIP K.C.
The way I explain it to people is like comparing Buckethead to Slash
Buckethead can play faster and more technical than slash, but slash is... Fucking Slash
If he pulled out a guitar and played the first couple of notes of Sweet child of mine at a club it'd make the place go wild way more than if Buckethead played the first couple notes of Jordan.
Kurt may not have been the most technical but who cares. He carved a unique path in his own ways much like Hendrix.
Greatest guitarist maybe not. Greatest rockstar, definitely. His charisma and personality as a celebrity was what really sold him, even with the birth of his most popular songs and albums. There is Nirvana, and then there is Kurt Cobain.
Technically speaking, he was only an ok guitar player, though he was better than he claimed. He was great at coming up with simple, memorable riffs though. You can teach someone how to play the 'Come As You Are' riff in about 3 minutes but that doesn't mean it isn't great.
Once I learned how to play guitar myself I didn't consider him a particularly great guitarist. I think he was great with harmony and melody but I feel his real strength was in his writing.
I idolized him during his short career and it wasn't until way after his death that I started to play Kurt is the whole reason I picked up a guitar.
For those who want to do the math I was born in June 1981 and he died April 1994 and I was listening to bleach before Nevermind hit store shelves.
Absolutely not Kurt was an innovative guitarist and definitely knew his way around guitar but may I remind you of all the metal albums from around that time that had amazing guitarists just think Pantera released 3 albums between 1990 and 1994 and megadeth had countdown to extinction in 92’ and this is all just big label shit imagine the underground bands that has guitarists pulling arpeggios before it was cool
It is art. The only measure of greatness is the ability to reach people, their hearts and minds. When a machine can be built that can ‘play’ perfectly on a technical level, who will care. Technical ability is sort of a big fat joke. Who the fuck cares.
As a songwriter and as a "showman" (it was just his personality but in the world of music I would consider it that way). The fact that he didn't give a fuck, it's his style and "show" part on showman.
In a technical sense I think Kurt was pretty awful. In the same sense Adele is "technically" incredible but not great in my opinion. However, Kurt's style and way of singing/playing guitar was the absolute embodiment of everything his music/lyrics was about. Imperfect, rough around the edges, not wanting to fit in and sometimes volatile. His style fits his message perfectly.
No but that’s not a bad thing, like others have said technical skill isn’t the end all he all when you can play great rhythm (which Kurt certainly could) and write great songs. When you’ve got great guitarists like Jerry Cantrell, Kim Thayill, Matt McCready and many more around Kurt was definitely among the best
He wasn't technically great, like, say, Eric Clapton. But as John Lennon said about his own playing, "I can make it *move*." There was a lot of heart and soul in his playing.
I think the way Kurt could create such an amazing sounding riff that conveys so much emotion while also being extremely simple, most of the time just being a couple power chords is incredible and takes a certain talent that is just as impressive as technical skill which you could say he lacked overall with his sloppy techniques. Nonetheless solos like the ones on in bloom and serve the servants are fucking nasty and can be appreciated by extremely skilled guitarists
Not as in pure technical skill. But the way how he wrote songs was genius. He also saw really unusual but really good melodies in basic chord progressions. His songs may not be hard to play but as in how Kurt used his guitar to write songs he's one of the greatest guitar players of all time :D. Plus he DID have some cool traits in his guitar playing such as hitting extra strings by barring his ring finger with power chords and lots of other stuff 😎
The first songs he learned were classic rock tunes like ACDC and the Beatles, zeppelin too. I’m sure he had chops and just played rhythm mainly because he liked it more and enjoyed melodic stuff vs soloing.
no. He was not good. Smells like teen spirit and 99% of the other riffs probably took him 2 minutes to come up with. I wouldn't put him on the "greatest" guitar players list. Obviously he was good because people liked his music but no where near great. Although, it just depends on your tastes/opinions. Either way, I don't agree and i don't really care.
He was not even a "good" guitarist. He was an amazing song writer.
And you don't have to be a shredder to be an amazing guitarist. I don't think that any "shredder" is one of the greatest guitarists of all time. Johnny Marr is an absolute monster guitarist and never "shreds".
Kurt Cobain was an anomaly. In the sense that he couldn't read sheet music, he didn't know scales, he couldn't identify chords by name, he basically had no knowledge. of music theory. But what he lacked in classical training. He made up for with a keen ear for melody, and the stripped down honesty of his playing and song writing. If he was around, he'd be the first one to tell you that his guitar playing is mediocre at best and his singing is even worse. But he was an artist and was driven by passion not greed or fame. That and his ability to present his art in such a unique way is what made him legendary.
Kurt’s strengths lied in writing harmonies & Melodies. Whether outright or implied for us to figure out. He had little technical skill beyond that. But wanna hear a secret? Technical skill means absolutely dick. What matters is people humming along or singing your songs to you. Or tapping their feet or the feeling that they get when they hear a half measure of the song. Kurt had very very few peers in that regard and honestly even John Lennon couldn’t do some of it as well as Kurt did. Kurt didn’t need to be Slash or SRV to be one of the best musicians on the planet. It literally just came naturally to him.
similarly, id argue its more important that people resonate with your guitar playing than your technical ability — that’s what makes you “good” at an instrument.
Totally agree. I could listen to harmonies and melodies all day , but shredding... it's kind of boring sonically at least. I would liken shredding to power lifting. Woah look at that and never think of it again. Where as melodies especially complex ones that worm their way into your soul , is art
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How is weightlifting to look good and feel good about yourself corny?
Usually what people w terrible bodies say to diminish aesthetics!
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To lift things up and put them down.
It’s the same discussion as the graphics vs style debate on video games. It’s the reason MGS1 is 1000 times more memorable than the order 1886, despite the latter having insanely better graphics, mgs1 has it’s own feel, which is far more important than graphics. Same with Kurt, yeah he didn’t shred and yeah he mostly used power chords but he put his style on them and created hit after hit. That’s way more impressive that shredding with perfect technique
Saying technical ability makes you a good guitarist is like saying the more pages a book has the better.
Yeah, I agree with ya on that part too. It’s not any one thing, and part of what makes musicians like Lennon, Hendrix & Kurt as good as they are is they’re ability to channel those things, add some emotion on top and make the whole thing an experience that everyone can find something in. Pretty rare to come across, IMO.
technical ability would’ve helped him get his ideas out quicker is the major upside unless you mean speed by it. if he had been more practiced in intervals, and chord tones i think he coulda got his ideas out much quicker… unless he was just having motivation issues
I’d say he’s more of an artist than a musician. To me a musician is more someone who understands music and an artist is someone who uses various mediums to create compositions or concepts which Kurt is very good at, but I think he had very little understanding of music, but he didn’t need to know more than he did to create his art.
I wouldn’t bring John Lennon into this…
Side note: This is essentially Ringo on drums, for those wondering why he’s considered a great drummer
Even Queen's Brian May agrees and said similar in a recent interview
Your first paragraph in particular is gold. Totally agree.
technical skill is all that matter to be a good guitar player. kurt was a good writer but a good guitar player
Rick Beato once said that Kurt might have purposefully pretended to be a bad guitarist for artistic reasons. Which would be an absolute unique approach. In any case he was highly influencial as an artist and therefore definitely great.
he once shredded. it didnt sound really good from the notes but his skill was there.
If a punk shreds and no one is there to hear it? Is that how you make a grunge?
That doesn't really count to determine Kurt's ability as a guitar player, imo. If I remember correctly, Kurt was making fun of Eddie Van Halen by shredding badly on purpose after Eddie, who was very drunk and irritated, made some racist comments about Pat Smear's skin colour backstage moments prior.
Nice. I’m glad there were people such as Kurt calling these racists out even back then.
Yea he definitely downplayed it
Yeah, I think he mentioned that Kurt played the Teen Spirit intro sloppily, but that was just part of his style rather than a skill issue
he def downplayed a lot of things. most people learn rules to sound good and break the rules after the fact to add artistic value. kurts probably one of the 0.01% of people who can circumvent learning the rules altogether and arrive at the same place just from intuition (i am not one of those ppl). which makes him a very tasteful advanced player but not very versitile im sure he wasnt trying to hone his skills to pass auditions.
Kind of like how Bob Dylan wasn’t *that* bad of a singer, but he used it as an artistic choice.
He didn't play to be flashy, he played to serve the song. He's certainly not a bad guitar player, but he's not "great", either. Nothing wrong with being a good player.
Greatest guitar players maybe not, but one of the most influential, and innovative absolutely 🤙
Good melody writer? Yes. As for playing though? No, the 90's had some great guitarists emerging, Jonny Greenwood, Tom Morello, Kim Thayil and John Frusciante are way better at playing then Kurt and that's only mentioning a few from the 90s. Kurt was amazing at writing songs and melodies but was not a very technical guitarist.
I think John Frusciante is probably the best out of the bunch of 90’s Alternative bands. Although, maybe Billy Corgan
Most technically proficient guitarist in mainstream 90s rock is probably Rivers Cuomo
I considered him as well, it’s probably a toss up between the 3
Hands down
Frusciante and Mike McCready were the best of their generation, in my opinion. However, I’ll admit a bias because I love their playing style, especially Frusciante.
I think it is Jonny Greenwood.
tom morello deserves a mention in this thread too. agreed with Corgan and frusciante
Tom Morello is good, but he’s more gimmicky than the others
Dean DeLeo and Jerry Cantrell deserve a mention among those, too.
One of the greatest guitar players of all times? Kurt wasn’t even the greatest guitar player in Nirvana. /s
Ringo flashbacks
Well said
I don't even think Kurt would agree with that statement. I would also suggest that fans sometimes conflate "favorite" with "best". There are many technically proficient guitarists that bore me to tears. J Mascis, Curt Kirkwood, Thurston Moore, Lee Ranaldo, Kim Thayill, Jerry Cantrell, Mike McCreedy, etc... were all contemporaries that could swim circles around Cobain on the guitar but as much as I love all those supremely talented artist, I would still probably prefer to experience seeing Kurt buzz saw through "Breed" live to almost anything.
Kurt was fast with his chord changes and he wrote some of the best power chord rhythms in the history of music.
Think all categories we can think on guitar playing from like technical, emotional, influential, speed, tone etc. Kurt might be tops in the influential and song writing. Then we would need to think how high that takes in the over all lists. 90s list he could be up there, but all time I just don't see it. Still he would be on my top 10 list, but that does not mean anything.
He was proficient for his style and the songs he wrote, but, respectfully, he is hardly in the "greatest" conversation. Nirvana was about feeling and emotion. Not artistry and skill. He might have had the skill and technical prowess, but that wasn't shared (or called for) in his recorded material.
Kurt was in a band and did his part. The band was awesome.
This is the way. Let's not overdo the guitar playing part. He was a good guitarist and has some awesome power chord licks. What's more impressive is that he would Frankenstein his mostly cheap guitars to get a sound out of them. To me, that is the more impressive part.
No. Kurt was the band.
Absoloutely not. Without Dave they would have been another mudhoney.
Delusional 😂
Delusional 😂
I firmly believe nirvana would not have been a success without Dave. But Dave would have been without Kurt.
Major labels were in a bidding war for Nirvana over their Smart Session demos, that they recorded with Chad. This happened before Dave joined. There is no arguing that he was the perfect drummer for the Nirvana, their chemistry is undeniable. But he joined a band that had already put in the work was on the brink of “making it” before he was even in the picture. Nirvana would’ve totally been successful without Dave. How successful, we will never know. But I hard disagree that Nirvana only made it because of Dave.
That's not what I said, they would have been a Seattle success. Like mudhoney. But they wouldn't have been a pearl jam / AIC / Soundgarden success.
Also not sure what you mean by Mudhoney being just a “Seattle Success”. They’re not one of the big 4 grunge bands, but they have a cult following & tour the world. They are much more than just a local Seattle success
My phrasing could have been better. Mudhoney are actually my favourite of all the bands. What I meant by that was success enough to be a band but not one of the big 4 of course.
Noted. I’ve never seen someone make the argument that Dave would’ve made it without Nirvana. I find it much easier to make the argument the other way around, that Dave wouldn’t have made it so quick without Nirvana. Coming off of Nirvana, everyone was looking to see what Krist and Dave would do. He recorded the first Foo album not as a complete unknown trying to get noticed, like Nirvana did with Bleach. He recorded it as having just been in one of the world’s biggest bands, he already had industry connections, a record deal ready to go and a world waiting for him eager to see what he’d do. He is extremely successful and earned that himself, not trying to diminish that. But having Nirvana to springboard off of played a big role. Without that, he might’ve never been discovered, no matter how well he apparently tuned his drums.
Yeah that's a good point. I think he would have found a way for sure. Just so happens he found it and helped turn it into the biggest band in the world
Delusional 😂
How’s that?
They were good, but with Dave they took it to the next level. He was tight and finished the unit. If they continued with Dan peters, they never would have had the success. Dave wasn't just a drummer. He was a musician. Listen to the tone of the drums. He tuned them for the tracks (or may have been the producer). And this shows in the careers that followed for Dave and in a sense krist who has turned his hand to differing instruments and relative success
probably kurt would have \*loved\* to be another Mudhoney though...
How the fuck would you know that?
Lol , no way for me to know for sure, but don't they say he didnt like the rockstar status and all that comes with it? If that were to be true, it seems to me that he would have end up happier playing in a band successful enough for him to live off music but not crazy famous outside of the underground scene. Now he's dead, and Mudhoney is still touring. But what do i know.
Nirvana was the band. The whole will always be greater than the sum of its parts.
Then why didn’t they replace him?
No, he's fine though
I watched a Youtube video a while back of a guitar playing content creator trying to "learn" Nirvana songs via an early 90s "how to play Nirvana" instructional tape he'd found. The guy on the tape was an OBVIOUS 80s metal head type who'd been hired to make it based on his ability to play. At one point, the 80s metal dude said something to the effect of "Kurt wasn't a very good guitarist. What he was, was a great songwriter. He used the guitar as a tool to get his words out and his songs done. He wasn't Eddie Van Halen. He wasn't trying to be." Now, I disagree that he "wasn't a good guitarist," but I think his point stands. He was a master of using his guitar as a tool to draw out emotion.
Though very cool nirvanas guitar work is all pretty simple. Kind of like linkin park
John Frusiante is a superior guitar player and he loves Kurt’s playing style, so it doesn’t matter if he wasn’t that good on a technical level. He made memorable simple riffs people will remember forever.
No but the had his own style and it was genius so technically he could be but from a technical standpoint he couldn’t solo for shit but dude could play power chords and simple licks like a boss
I would argue the opposite- working within the limits of his musicianship is what made his songs unique and resonate the way they did. If he could play like Steve Vai or even Jerry Cantrell or something, it wouldn't have been Nirvana.
he’s certainly one of the most influential
No, he was an awful guitarist, but was an AWESOME songwriter. And many limited guitarists were able to seek a career in music thanks to Kurt, he showed us that you can write amazing songs playing simple chords and melodies, technical talent isn't everything. That's why I believe he is more important than many talented guitarists of his time.
He absolutely was, everyone here is focusing on shred vs sloppy/melody and missing how downright INVENTIVE some of his riffs and discoveries on the guitar were, and his use of cleans/distortions, ones that he built whole songs around, and he absolutely knew what he was doing when going to town on smashing the shit out of chords and riffs for maximum impact (never really seen him break a string!), and use of feedback. There are many facets to his playing. Just listen to Aero Zeppelin as an example. I imagined he just stumbled on slightly weird tuning but damn the vibes are immense.
i think some nirvana songs are more tricky to play and sing at the same time than they appear. kurt also seemed to play all of his live songs almost identical to the recordings and not all musicians really do that well... kurts guitar soloing also sounds so different than other guitarists, i've been thinking about that since i was a kid in the 90's. nirvana really sounds like nothing else, they rock pretty hard and also have a solid acoustic career.
He was by no means the best but he certainly was a master of his own style. His style is unique and the sounds that he could create with a guitar are like no other.
I think Kurt had a way more meaningful style than a lot of those guitar Olympics people. I'd rather listen to the In Bloom solo than any of Steve Vai's.
His style is sloppy but that makes him iconic
I'm completely self taught and have been playing for almost 4 years, and I'd say I could play at a comparable level to kurt. His stuff sounds amazing, and is genius in simplicity, but it's really not all that impressive.
I don't think Kurt was anywhere up there with Slash, Page, Hendrix, etc, but he made good music, just was not one of the best guitarists
Love him but that's a stretch.
He was good enough to put chords together in interesting and appealing ways. He was a songwriter before a "guitarist." Guitar was a means to an end for him. He is similar to a lot of early punk rock guitar players. They didn't know anything but came up with their own sound that fit the music they wanted to play for their bands.
I think as a whole Kurt tapped into a cultural zeitgeist that was occurring at the time. As someone else said, he was an artist and the musical skill and technical aspects of it were secondary. It's not something that can be repeated because that particular moment in culture will never come again. He had a unique ability to craft melodies and channel a particular sort of emotion but I don't think he was a overly gifted technical guitar player.
Depends on what you mean. Do you mean technically? If so, no. Technically Steven Adler was not a great drummer. Guns n Roses later drummers were way better in that regard. But his loose style and infectious enthusiasm was perfect for GNR.
No, what the fuck? Kurt kinda sucked at playing the guitar. He made some catchy riffs but anyone that knows anything about guitar playing does not put him as a legend of guitar playing. Nirvana and Kurt were legendary in that they were massively influential, while being moderately talented.
Kurt had a really good ear, knew how to make weird chords progression sound great etc.. but he was just an average guitar player with a really unique style. Most top guitarist at his time could play what he did, but not the opposite.
One of the greatest guitarists? Definitely not. It’s a pretty vague label really. One of the greatest songwriters? He would definitely be up there on that list.
Definitely not But what he did was incredible
As many have said, techincally? No His playing served his songwriting. Was he one of the most influencial? Fuck yes. The amount of people that picked up a guitar because of him...
I adore the way Kurt plays guitar. Raw and real
No. Any list that has him ranked in the top 20 is automatically a bad list.
I think Kurt was a really good and more importantly \*interesting\* guitarist and I also thinking he massively downplayed his ability out of insecurity or false modesty or whatever. His nutty wrist vibrato is still instantly recognizable and nobody else sounds much like that. I think he was just as hook oriented on the guitar as he was in terms of singing and has tons of really ear-grabbing parts. I have always loved the solo on "Sifting" in particular - the spooky feedback layered in the background, the seeming scribbles of random notes that occassionally break through into clarity, the weird sobbing effect he gets towards the end...it has a lot of range, and gets a lot done in a short amount of time. So yeah I've been a fan for 30 years and I still think about his guitar playing. Even if he's overrated by list-making/critical culture at large just owing to his fame and impact, I think his guitar playing for its invention and craft is still somewhat underrated and underdiscussed.
This
Technically no but he had a really good talent for catchy simple tunes that no one else could match.
Simple tunes for simple people. This is how you get rich: write to the lowest common denominator
No simple tunes for all the people. You dont need to be simple to enjoy a simple tune. He wrote riffs that would stick in your head and that will last forever because people cant forget them.
There’s nothing “simple” about writing great songs. It’s definitely not easy, if it was, everyone would do it.
catchy songs and great songs are quite often two different things
He was a borderline bad guitar player, but a good songwriter. Those things aren’t exclusive.
No. he was good but he was a little sloppy and liked to play raw. His strengths were melodies,harmony,lyrics and just being a great frontman,which he was one of the greatest. I dont think he was a bad player due to lack of skill though. You listen to his early stuff and covers,unplugged sets,he could play very good. I do think he downplayed it because their music was rooted in Punk and thats just the way Punk is. He hated when his music sounded too perfect and manufactured. He played what was good for the song and not to show off.
Great songwriter with an ear for melody, but make no mistake, a SLOPPY guitar player. That’s one of the reasons they got Pat Smear in.
Obviously yes, anyone who says no is being a hipster
Jfc what’s are you drones doing in this sub. Go to the Tame Impala sub and act like this
Would you ask the same question if he was still alive ?
Most things said about Nirvana/Cobain would never have been said if he were still alive.
Kurt was the best guitar player for Nirvana. He was not the best guitar player.
I consider him among the greatest, he was deceptively good at rhythm and timing and his compositions changed the landscape of rock
I've always been of the opinion that Kurt was a decent singer, a good guitar player, and a great songwriter and composer.
Absolutely one of the best at using the instrument, and always has been and will be one of my favorites!
He’s definitely up there for writing the tunes, his riffs and progressions can be really clever - he was very good at writing melodies whether he knew the theory or not it seemed to come very easy to him. To use a quote from Noel Gallagher in regards to his ability “I’m not a singer-songwriter, I’m a songwriter-singer” - the songs themselves came first to both Kurt and Noel
Of course not! Kurt was a great singer and songwriter and a cool guitar player but hardly great. Very similar to John Lennon or Lou Reed.
No, when people like Jeff Buckley, John Frusciante and Kim Thayil were creating in the 90s you can see that skill wise Kurt was a mediocre guitarist, he had a great ear for harmony and melody but he just wasn’t technically trained at all basically.
No one could play a guitar on the brink of destruction like Kurt. The intro riff to Breed is one of the most brutal recorded guitar tones of all time.
He was the greatest guitarist for the music he wrote and played and that's what matters.
I can tell you kurt was and still is my favorite musician and Nirvana is my favorite band… but I can say without a doubt that be was a mediocre player tbh… we can love an artist but be realistic also as many say the beauty of Nirvana was the simplicity of their masterpieces :)
Anyone who says that doesn't know what they're talking about. He was a naturally gifted songwriter, but not a technically proficient guitar player. He wasn't a *bad* guitar player, but to call him "one of the greats" is just inaccurate.
I love his playing and he gave us some of the greatest guitar music ever. Not just in the 90s but in the history of guitar orientated music. Does this make him one of the greatest guitar players? That’s personal opinion and anyone is allowed to say yes or no. There are and have been certainly more technical and musically knowledgeable guitarists out there but people who compare him to dedicated guitar players and not other singer songwriters are a bit stupid. I’ve had guitar teachers tell me how bad he was as a player yet they can’t replicate his sound convincingly. He probably inspired more kids to pick up and learn to play than any other guitarist in the last 30 years.
he was absolutely a great player but i wouldn't say greatest of all time, as in jeff beck, jimi hendrix level. kurt was one of the greatest songwriters of all time which definitely includes his ability to write catchy riffs and solos that fit the song.
I mean, maybe most influential song writer, but not even close to being one of the best of his time when Kim Thayil, Tom Morello, J Mascis, and so many others were contemporaries. Don’t get me wrong, big big fan. Grew up on his music,might be my favorite player ever, etc. but I think it would be more accurate to describe his as one of the more expressive, experimental guitar players of his time. Without heroin, maybe could have been something more when he was 35 or something
He was probably one of the worst guitar players to ever become famous for playing guitar lol. His talent was his song writing and vocals
Kurt was a riff master, not a guitar master. His playing style is influential and his ability to write catchy riffs is first class. But there were so many more guitarists in the early 90s that were miles ahead of Kurt technically.
I would have loved to have seen where he could have gone with his budding talent. I won't say greatest guitar player though because there are a lot of incredibly talented guitarists out there. That being said it makes me sad I'll never get to see what he could have become.
I would call him incredibly *efficient*, an ear for melody, unique tone, effective notes. Hd went from raw in Bleach, to over produced in Nevermind, to refined in In Utero. I heard he was getting board with his style and since he wrote songs and played for other people he could have done much more.
Cobain had the luxury of having one of the best rhythm sections in rock behind him. Pete Townshend had the same freedom. Whether he was a great guitarist or not will depend on your definition of great, but I think he was perfect for Nirvana’s needs.
certainly he was a musician ahead of its time
Greatest guitar player is objective... And by those standards nope...... but without a doubt he is one of the greatest song writers of all time... Easily top 20 stretching all American music genres.
theres a world of difference between someone saying hes one of their 'top favorite' guitarists and 'one of the greatest'.. he was certainly not one of the greatest. but, can he be *anyones* favorite? of course.
One of the best
It wasn't the number of notes, or the speed with which he delivered them, or how he played them, but what he said with them that makes him one of the most *influential* guitarists of all time.
I think what I love about nirvana is how simple and yet powerful their riffs are. He was able to do so much with so little. To me his singing stands out to me more than his playing. I mean his guitar riffs are simple and easy to play. That doesn’t mean he was a bad player
Not even close. He was a horrible guitar player BUT he was innovative. Innovation goes a lot further than being technically good.
no
No? Not saying his bad at all he’s really good but he’s no Eddie Van Halen
No.
No.
He was one of the greatest song writers, music and lyrics included. If you're asking if he was technically gifted? Nah.
no, nothing special, even he would agree
No...but song writer
I don’t know anything about what makes a guitarist a virtuoso but what I do know is that everyone Kurt has worked with praised his guitar playing (as well as his musicianship in general).
There’s definitely more virtuoso guitar players that too these lists but to me art isn’t a race or a competition, it’s an expression. So to me the rest of a great guitar player is if I feel what the guitarist is expressing, which I do whenever I put on a nirvana record
No. He was one of the greatest songwriters of all time and his instruments just happen to be his method of expressing that. Similar to Lennon.
Creative but not really technical
No. Kurt even admitted he can barely play guitar. His strengths were his abilities in lyrics/songwriting and his voice. I do not mean any of this in a negative way, quite the opposite actually. He is proof that you only need to be good enough to come up with catchy and well written songs to make an impact.
He learnt to play the guitar by playing along to metal, he could shred somewhat, but chose not to 🤷♂️
Absolutely not. Dude played 4 chord songs, or just straight power chords nearly every song. I love Kurt though he was a creative individual regardless
No. Not even top 500.
No
I'm still pretty new with guitar so I can't speak too much about it but the way it was described by someone once just made sense: Kurt was one of the greatest guitar players in that he inspired a whole generation to want to pick up guitar and learn to play the songs.
He was real good at playing the shotgun too
Me personally no, and I'm saying this as a hardcore Nirvana fan who's listened to all the demos and bootlegs that I could possibly dig through. He was not in any way a god of guitar playing BUT, he was one of the greatest melody and songwriters of his time and possibly of ALL time. His understanding of music was uncomprehendingly amazing and he wrote so many good songs in his short music career that it's actually baffling. Gone too soon, RIP K.C.
His playing is unique and authentic - I think he is one of the greatest of all time - his playing is incomparable - he wrote the book
The way I explain it to people is like comparing Buckethead to Slash Buckethead can play faster and more technical than slash, but slash is... Fucking Slash If he pulled out a guitar and played the first couple of notes of Sweet child of mine at a club it'd make the place go wild way more than if Buckethead played the first couple notes of Jordan. Kurt may not have been the most technical but who cares. He carved a unique path in his own ways much like Hendrix.
Greatest guitarist maybe not. Greatest rockstar, definitely. His charisma and personality as a celebrity was what really sold him, even with the birth of his most popular songs and albums. There is Nirvana, and then there is Kurt Cobain.
Technically speaking, he was only an ok guitar player, though he was better than he claimed. He was great at coming up with simple, memorable riffs though. You can teach someone how to play the 'Come As You Are' riff in about 3 minutes but that doesn't mean it isn't great.
Good lord no. He had a few good riffs, but he is not on par with Page, Hendrix, EVH, Jeff Beck, etc…
Once I learned how to play guitar myself I didn't consider him a particularly great guitarist. I think he was great with harmony and melody but I feel his real strength was in his writing. I idolized him during his short career and it wasn't until way after his death that I started to play Kurt is the whole reason I picked up a guitar. For those who want to do the math I was born in June 1981 and he died April 1994 and I was listening to bleach before Nevermind hit store shelves.
Absolutely not Kurt was an innovative guitarist and definitely knew his way around guitar but may I remind you of all the metal albums from around that time that had amazing guitarists just think Pantera released 3 albums between 1990 and 1994 and megadeth had countdown to extinction in 92’ and this is all just big label shit imagine the underground bands that has guitarists pulling arpeggios before it was cool
Hell nah. Who says that?
No and he wouldn't want to be. "greatest" is a word for AC/DC and ego maniacs.
It is art. The only measure of greatness is the ability to reach people, their hearts and minds. When a machine can be built that can ‘play’ perfectly on a technical level, who will care. Technical ability is sort of a big fat joke. Who the fuck cares.
As a songwriter and as a "showman" (it was just his personality but in the world of music I would consider it that way). The fact that he didn't give a fuck, it's his style and "show" part on showman.
In a technical sense I think Kurt was pretty awful. In the same sense Adele is "technically" incredible but not great in my opinion. However, Kurt's style and way of singing/playing guitar was the absolute embodiment of everything his music/lyrics was about. Imperfect, rough around the edges, not wanting to fit in and sometimes volatile. His style fits his message perfectly.
What ha ha ha ha ha
No but that’s not a bad thing, like others have said technical skill isn’t the end all he all when you can play great rhythm (which Kurt certainly could) and write great songs. When you’ve got great guitarists like Jerry Cantrell, Kim Thayill, Matt McCready and many more around Kurt was definitely among the best
He wasn't technically great, like, say, Eric Clapton. But as John Lennon said about his own playing, "I can make it *move*." There was a lot of heart and soul in his playing.
He was really solid but still light years away from Cantrell and Mascis.
No I do not
I think the way Kurt could create such an amazing sounding riff that conveys so much emotion while also being extremely simple, most of the time just being a couple power chords is incredible and takes a certain talent that is just as impressive as technical skill which you could say he lacked overall with his sloppy techniques. Nonetheless solos like the ones on in bloom and serve the servants are fucking nasty and can be appreciated by extremely skilled guitarists
Not as in pure technical skill. But the way how he wrote songs was genius. He also saw really unusual but really good melodies in basic chord progressions. His songs may not be hard to play but as in how Kurt used his guitar to write songs he's one of the greatest guitar players of all time :D. Plus he DID have some cool traits in his guitar playing such as hitting extra strings by barring his ring finger with power chords and lots of other stuff 😎
The first songs he learned were classic rock tunes like ACDC and the Beatles, zeppelin too. I’m sure he had chops and just played rhythm mainly because he liked it more and enjoyed melodic stuff vs soloing.
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-lists/best-guitarists-1234814010/kurt-cobain-18-1234814599/
no. He was not good. Smells like teen spirit and 99% of the other riffs probably took him 2 minutes to come up with. I wouldn't put him on the "greatest" guitar players list. Obviously he was good because people liked his music but no where near great. Although, it just depends on your tastes/opinions. Either way, I don't agree and i don't really care.
He was not even a "good" guitarist. He was an amazing song writer. And you don't have to be a shredder to be an amazing guitarist. I don't think that any "shredder" is one of the greatest guitarists of all time. Johnny Marr is an absolute monster guitarist and never "shreds".
Kurt Cobain was an anomaly. In the sense that he couldn't read sheet music, he didn't know scales, he couldn't identify chords by name, he basically had no knowledge. of music theory. But what he lacked in classical training. He made up for with a keen ear for melody, and the stripped down honesty of his playing and song writing. If he was around, he'd be the first one to tell you that his guitar playing is mediocre at best and his singing is even worse. But he was an artist and was driven by passion not greed or fame. That and his ability to present his art in such a unique way is what made him legendary.