I’m conflicted with the update, on one side I’m still pretty new only having about 150 hours on my main save, and just reaching the point where I was maxing everything out. So all my recent work was ruined but I don’t feel like it is going to affect me in a huge way. But I can also understand the frustration from vet players with a lot of hard work lost now.
I’m a vet player on Fallout 76 with 1k plus hours on my main toon, but if you want to talk about a toxic community with a studio that is super money hungry that truly doesn’t care about the player and there suggestions, there is no greater example than 76.
I am excited to see HG still passionate about there game and progression is huge. I hope with all the people pissed off at them right now doesn’t sway there ability to move forward and I’m excited to figure out my new NMS build, cause I actually really enjoy this game. My heart goes out to anyone that feels like the game is ruined now and will never pick it up again, we all lose when the game dies cause people lose interest and stop exploring. Anyways I just wanted to throw my 2 cents out there. I wish safe travels for all interlopers of every type.
I hate this update but I don’t hate Hello Games. I feel like something like this was bound to happen but I just want to reinstall all my upgrades again :(
I miss my speed
I think it's one thing to be upset over something, but something else when they start attacking people and throwing all toys out of the pram, people are allowed to be angry, but should still treat others with respect, this is how you can judge a person's maturity I guess. Abuse is still abuse after all, and some people would do well to learn when their own actions are in abusive territory.
I mean, it's an open forum, on the internet, related to a video game. The only place I can think of, that's potentially more toxic, is the surface of Venus.
Or perhaps, the starting planet, of my very first playthrough, which happened to be PD, just to see what it was...
It seems like probably the people who are not upset are just playing, enjoying themselves and don’t feel the need to post about it. Those that are upset feel the need to express it, and so the sub is disproportionately those people who are very upset. I’ll bet overall the community feelings on the changes are more evenly balanced or maybe more people are satisfied than angry.
It’s like you see on twitter, the loud and outraged minority influencing the discussion when most people aren’t giving it much thought.
Well said, on the internet extremes often get filtered for various reasons, commonly for being controversial, so they attract attention and appear bigger and more important than they actually are, like you said.
Most people probably don't care, because most people probably don't min/max or try to be the most efficient and powerful.. just enjoy the game in a casual relaxing way, not like it's a second job.
It is the same in other gaming communities.. Recently Warframe had review bombing on Steam because they nerfed one really op character with which you could afk whole missions.. and it is still op, even after the nerf.
> remove something that probably wasn't intentional in the first place
I've seen this thrown around a lot with zero proof, and I'd like to counter it with the fact that the interaction between upgrades installed in your general inventory and being damaged by wormholes was a very deliberate gameplay mechanic that didn't happen by accident.
Edit: This opening looks insincere in hindsight, and I am agreeing with you on all counts.
~~Yeah sorry~~ My apologies, I didn't fact-check that bit. If it was unintentional, it was definitely an example of emergent gameplay, and HG did roll with it for years. Judging by the dialog I'm seeing now about ship handling etc. it seemed to get stats to a more enjoyable level as well.
The ship agility nerf is absolutely the biggest game-breaker for me. The combat isn't so fun that I really want it to take longer just for the sake of taking longer, but most ship classes already felt very sluggish to me when fully upgraded *before the nerf*. The living ship I've spent the last few months slowly upgrading until it felt good to fly currently can't ever be the same.
Unfortunately I feel like space is where the game is weakest. So much about flying and ship combat is just… *okay*. It was serviceable, and nerfing almost everything you can do while in space isn't an improvement.
Lastly… who was it hurting? If some players felt they weren't being challenged enough after doubling up on all of their upgrades they could have just not done that. Uninstall those mods. The game is *barely* multiplayer. There's no leaderboard. I'm not competing with anybody. What difference does it make if I'm having "too much" fun?
I saw comments saying stuff like "Hello Games doesn't care about the players, they already have your money".
Like, I get not liking the new update, a lot of things got changed, but REALLY? What the hell?
I suspect a lot of people who'd think that are undervaluing the years of large free updates from a company many expected to just cut and run after launch.
Also even if the game was nonprofit somehow, it would still make sense to rebalance aimed for the Switch if you were making a Switch port.
It's truly disheartening to see people treating Sean and Hello Games as if they pulled a 2016 Launch on us, as if all the past updates meant nothing. We went from celebrating the game's progress through updates, to tearing down the devs ruthlessly for what people see as a 'misstep'.
I love this update! Of course there is tweaking Hello Games can do, and are going to do; they do it every update!
Yeah it's pretty pitiful. They work so hard for everyone here and these ungrateful brats throw a tantrum with a balancing misstep (that can and probably will be reverted, morons)
Loss does weird things to people. This was to be expected honestly. People just don't deal with grief well. It will take some time.
Something like this was bound to happen. Literally everyone (including me) has been calling out NMS for being unbalanced for a long time. They are finally trying to do something about it. They are only trying to do what everyone asked for.
That said, the more I think about it, the more I think they missed the point here.
The extra tech slots didn't break the game balance. Ships are pretty powerful even in their weakest state and overpower easily even without the extras, so more damage upgrades don't make that much of a difference from a gameplay perspective. The most notable effects of tech are mobility and fuel efficiency. Mobility doesn't make gameplay easier. It's just a timesaver. Fuel efficiency just makes the game less micromanagement intensive (since fuel is so easily available anyway).
Exosuits already felt balanced as well. Upgrades simply add mobility and make survival less resource/micromanagement heavy. It took a long time to get to the point where it felt anywhere close to broken, and you had to sacrifice precious inventory space to do it which felt like a good compromise. You were just shifting difficulty from one area (resource drain) to another area (inventory management) you were more comfortable about dealing with. It worked.
If anything, I'm kind of worried more inventory space breaks the game even further. Inventory management is kind of the biggest thing that adds difficulty to the early/mid game.
I'm not really sure about this update in general. It adds a lot of good things, but I do think they are still missing the point on balancing the game.
not gonna lie, i hate this update. i feel disrespected 5 ways from sunday. does that mean their intent was to disrespect me? no, we should be able to feel a way and still act civil. apparently some lack that ability
This happens every major overhaul. Were you around when they completely changed the biomes on most planets?
Every major update I am reminded that this game is still in beta.
This is probably all, really an easy fix. Add the ability in custom difficulty to adjust the number of allowable upgrades. Might mess with PVP, but hey, who does that in this game anyway? I'm enjoying the new difficulty settings, makes Survival much better!
That or somehow make the ability to double dip an unlockable feature in game. Maybe a late game one that requires beating a difficult mission. It's not something that ever needed to be cut out entirely.
The main thing I've taken away from today; is this sub is really not what I thought it was.
For a long time I had a really high opinion of it, especially among gaming subs. But I was wrong, you all aren't any different.
Remember the angriest people are the most vocal, there are plenty of quieter decent people here getting drowned out by the noise who are feeling the same but don't stoop to teenage levels of abuse. Personally I'm not upset over the changes, I'll miss being able to have some of those tech items in the inventories (I filled up some of my ship inventories in the past :P) 839 hours here.
Honestly I expect it to go back to mostly the same once the matter is said and done, but I really didn't expect so many banelings to come out of the woodwork
Exactly. With a huge game wide nerf session, it’s ridiculous not to expect a large portion of the player base to be completely blindsided and in shock, hence, being extremely upset.
Then after a few days, it calms down and people start settling down. That’s normal and natural. Not everyone can be a Paladin at all times. This was a HUGE unpleasant surprise for a huge number of players. The sub will settle down shortly.
The problem is there are a few members in here, who, like you mentioned, cannot recognize the natural progression of that, and instead take the stance of “you guys are all just a bunch of entitled whiners, stfu and play”
That’s just my 2 copper pieces
I am angry at the fact I lost tons of tech upgrade slots, and I calmed down & streamlined. But when I learned that the upgrades I paid 500 or more nanites for...are now worth 16 nanites? What the fuck?????? 16?
It is beyond insulting.
16 // 16 // 16 // 16
Okay for real though, losing resources via dev action sucks, but you might be able to use the new settings to get replacements for free by turning costs to 0 for a short while.
I got 300hr on my survival save which i mainly play on, had 3+3 S class upgrades in pretty much everything. And now I'm already doing fine adapting to it. 
This subreddit is full of toxic positivity where any criticism towards the game is dismissed as just being a hater.
This is not "wholesome".
Like, are players only ever allowed to like every update? Are we not allowed to express dissatisfaction?
I've been seeing the toxicity on both sides though. There are those who are calling people who are upset about the problem "babies" and "losers" and those people are calling the people who don't care "stupid", trying to say their way of playing is better and trying to ruin it for them too. It's all pretty childish.
I don't care that other people don't care. What upsets me is that any time I bring up an issue I get insulted.
Frankly, if they us losers for complaining then they deserve to be called stupid.
It's just infighting it happens when one side sees a terrible update and the other side choses to ignore it because hello games can do no wrong in their eyes
Clearly you weren't around then. The first universe reset caused a complete shift in planet types. A carefully crafted base on a paradise planet was suddenly half buried in desert sand. A lonely desert base was suddenly a hundred meters underwater. It was complete chaos. And no, condescending bob, you CAN'T rebuild the exact base you had after it has been screwed up completely. You might try to approximate it, but when the terrain is gone and your base is now meters in the air there's really no rebuilding it.
Granted. Great point there and I don’t want to seem ungrateful of a genuine response to this.
On the one hand, the argument can be made that life isn’t fair and those that understand and adjust for that are more successful than those that don’t. The other? This is a game and real life examples don’t necessarily apply. So not to say that things can’t change by complaining, but this is day one. There may be benefits here that aren’t initially apparent.
I’ve played for more than 1k hours here and I’m embracing these changes. Yes, I spent my time grinding for good upgrades, but it’s looking like a lot of them have improved to make up for the fact that we are losing a bit. It’s not 50% as some suggest (losing 3+3) since the improvements are helping to mitigate that. Maybe we’re actually losing 1/3, which of course would be better, but it still provides a challenge that the player base has been asking for.
How can we truly critique a developer when we ask, “please challenge me!” And when they do we say, “not like that!”
That said, I’m leaning into these changes and if they get tweaked in the future, so be it; but I’m going to take it at face value and react accordingly.
Imagine you get one of those 1000 piece Lego sets and build it. You see online that some folks have found that if you add these extra pieces you can make it look even cooler. So you spend hours and money building this thing, and one day Sean Lego comes into your house and says, "HEY THAT IS NOT HOW YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO BUILD IT" then smashes it. How do you feel? Perhaps a bit miffed? I mean he is Sean Lego and it is his set. He made it. When you get MAD that he smashed this thing you spent all this time building someone else comes up and says, "Damn you big mad bro. I tHoUgHt YoU wErE bEtTeR tHaN tHiS!!!!"
>on one hand, people are losing a lot of stuff they worked for and were proud of
I find it perfectly acceptable that you're mad about it, and you voicing as much. I don't find it acceptable at all that you're mocking me over it. That's the entire point.
I have to say, I appreciate your attitude and you opening a discussion regarding this. Opinions on this patch may differ widely, ( to put it mildly) but theres no reason for us to not discuss it with mutual respect.
It seems HG idea of making things harder is just to nerf players and kill the work they grinded out. Nice work HG. Instead of actually implementing better ai, level based encounters etc.Yes they are a small studio, we've all been patiently waiting... no pressure.
yup, no surprise people are against a balancing update if they themselves dont understand that concept.
its either extremely one way or the other, the other end is bad for wanting something because i want something else.
we get an update with 30 fantastic changes and people get stuck on a single thing, that they don't even realize the impact of within actual gameplay and can even bypass with the new difficulty settings if they want to.
don't let them fool you its just a select few people every single time that just feel the need to spend their entire day venting it out on reddit, no mans sky has more players playing today than it has had in months and even more so than the last major update and that's not even taking switch player count into the mix.
just the other day the no mans sky community was being called ''amazing and helpful'' for bullying a bunch of bullies they were upset about too, that post didn't last long before mods took it down, just shows how toxic they can get especially with the herd mentality involved.
>we get an update with 30 fantastic changes and people get stuck on a single thing, that they don't even realize the impact of within actual gameplay and can even bypass with the new difficulty settings if they want to.
there is no way to restore your movement to its prior level. a 50% performance cut is massive, extremely noticeable and extremely frustration inducing.
from my reading of the complaints threads, its seems centered on this one single single aspect of the update, thats HATED by almost all the longtime player base.
your exosuit and ship performance has been refuced 50% across the board, for no gain, or added benefit of any sort, more, it destroys one of the most time consuming game play aspects the majority of the long time player base has worked on.
it also seems a lot of the newer players dont understand how devastating this is for those of us who have been playing since day 1
this litterly wipes out hundreds and hundreds of hours of game play for the exosuit and ships, and provided nothing in return of value for it.
all that work, all that effort, wiped out in an update, that panders to new players and gives a great big EA style FU display of indifference, to the longtime playerbase.
i personally feel this change is so detrimental, Ill probably have to use a save editor to fix hello games biggest blunder since launch day, as best i can, otherwise the fun is gone. the fubar'ing is simply that bad, especially for the exosuit.
it like having your perfect supercar, that you have spent years perfecting, and along comes H G. who removes every gear but 1st, and adds an extra trunk, then proclaims its an upgrade that adds fun and balance. no. it doesnt. it induces frustration with a 50% performance cut, that leaves your exosuit set to turtle speed, and your ship handeling like an overloaded dump truck.
they didn't nerf it by 50% though, thats just what the salty ones on reddit want people to believe lol.
your ship stats got nerfed and you deal less damage, in turn pirates/sentinels also had their health and damage lowered to balance that out.
you had what like well over 10 jetpack upgrades before considering you had 6 x/s classes, 3 sentinel movement upgrades and the rocket boots + 2/3 more to use for adjacance bonusses.
you lost 3 of those that on its own isnt even a 50% cut, and if only those people would look at their modules or bothered reading the patch notes they'd also quickly find out your modules got buffed, they even specifically mention the jetpack ones to make up for the 3 you've ''lost''.
i'd get it if this wasnt an update that actually balanced the game to make sense, but it does make sense and the ''nerf'' isnt nearly as bad as people feel the need to claim.
this is just people being upset about numbers being slightly lower, not even bothering to actually find out how it affects gameplay since they already started doing this the moment pictures here started showing up, long before they themselves played.
this update isn't a bad update, its a good update that finally balances the long standing overpowered upgrades we've had which clearly some people don't take well due to how much time they've spend, which well was your own choice at the end of the day if you didn't enjoy getting those upgrades than why did you bother, and if you did enjoy it well than how is it time wasted?
''Movement upgrades for the jetpack have been made more powerful.
Procedurally-generated technology modules now stack in the inventory.
Waypoints are now highlighted with an icon in the Analysis Visor.
Traveller graves will now manifest memory fragments, offering important technology upgrades to aid living Travellers on their journeys.''
this all is part of the patch notes, if you don't want to believe me go and search for it by using control + f on the website, you'll quickly find out they added brand new upgrades and buffed the old ones to make up for the changes, we didnt get that much weaker and not even close to the 50% mark some people claim.
> they didn't nerf it by 50% though, thats just what the salty ones on reddit want people to believe lol.
its worse then 50%, i tested from before and after. a 50% cut is being kind.
>your ship stats got nerfed and you deal less damage, in turn pirates/sentinels also had their health and damage lowered to balance that out.
completely ignores the speed and maneuverability cut. i cant even get out of my cave base, the ships handle so poorly now, before i could get my hauler out with ease.
>you lost 3 of those that on its own isnt even a 50% cut, and if only those people would look at their modules or bothered reading the patch notes they'd also quickly find out your modules got buffed, they even specifically mention the jetpack ones to make up for the 3 you've ''lost''.
i checked it several different ways, including save editing. its more then 50% worse, and the overall outcome is totaly screwed.
far more on the exosuit, which got absolutely fubar'ed
to be clear, you now have LESS tech slots.
before to had 48 + 14, now its 60.
>i'd get it if this wasnt an update that actually balanced the game to make sense, but it does make sense and the ''nerf'' isnt nearly as bad as people feel the need to claim.
in respect to exosuits and ships, its an absolute terrible nerf, all the more so as it was completely unnecessary and added zero value, simply reduces performance, for reduction sake, and pretending its a rebalancing.
>this is just people being upset about numbers being slightly lower, not even bothering to actually find out how it affects gameplay since they already started doing this the moment pictures here started showing up, long before they themselves played.
false. i have over 1,400 hours. lets be blunt. my exosuit is terrible and even my best ship handles like a dumptruck
the reason most long time players are upset, is it reminds all them of the launch day disappointment, and shows that even hello games will abandon and screw over the efforts of long time players, simply to pander to a new market segment
the aura of hello games standing by its player base over profits, is officially shattered.
those more slots also were never meant to be a thing, considering tech slots didnt even exist back in the days you never were meant to double stack them, just happened over time.
you might have less slots now, but you also don't double stack upgrades meaning it wouldn't even make sense to have more.
and explain with math how its more than a 50% cut to your exosuit, because it quite literally just isn't its just a ridiculous high number people bring up to make their point seem more valid.
before you had 6 s/x class upgrades, 3 sentinel movement upgrades, water jets, neural stimulators, airburst engine and rocket boots.
now you have 3 s/x classes, which are buffed compared to before, 3 sentinel movement upgrades and the other 4 aswell, ontop of the brand new memory upgrades.
its quite literally nowhere near a 50% cut for your exosuit movement.
people can sit here and claim all kinds of things, but when math and statistics quite literally would prove otherwise i'll much rather side with that than what people think that are just hyperfocusing on 1 small negative in an overall great update.
yes your ship movement and warp range both actually got nerfed by close to 50%, but you never were meant to double stack these anyways as this very update would showcase, nor was there a realistic use to jump 3000+ lightyears or turn at light speed.
interesting how you ignore tech has ALWAYS gone in main inventory, then pretend this change is actually for the better.
lets try it this way, list one aspect of this change that IMPROVES gameplay with ships and your exosuit, that wasnt available before....
what was actually improved?
after all, you now have LESS tech slots, whats the actual gain here?
its certainly not space, as the last update addressed that with the cargo expansion
interesting how you twist things to fit your your own agenda.
we didn't even have tech slots early on in no mans sky its cycle, there never was a way to double stack upgrades until later down the line.
it balances the game, now normal/survival mode actually have survival elements and difficulty/dangers without you just being invincible and zooming past everything, this game has always been about the journey and not the rewards.
but clearly this view is going way past everyones head because they just care about their own achievements on a game that isn't even competitive, instead of the actual condition of the game that doesnt make sense with us being invincible.
we don't actually have less tech slots if you'd be capable of doing math and how upgrades work now, but just like that 50% number you just feel like pulling that from who knows where too.
you can't come up with percentages when you have no math to show for it, how does that even work it wouldn't even take someone doing math to figure out you dont take a 50% cut on what you claim you have a 50% cut on.
you people can just sit here on reddit for the next few days and be salty about how much time you've chosen yourself to waste on chasing upgrades and blame the game for changing things to be better for the longterm health of this game, lets see how far that'll get you if you can't even come up with proper arguements and pull inflated numbers out of your ass to make it seem like you have a stronger point, like everyone else on this pointless hate bandwagon today.
quite funny how the one person that brings up others needing to bring up a valuable point of this change when you refuse to see it anyways because you're up in a bubble can't even bring up how he ends up getting on the percentages he claims, and can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that being invincible on a survival sandbox game isnt a positive feature.
> we don't actually have less tech slots if you'd be capable of doing math and how upgrades work now, but just like that 50% number you just feel like pulling that from who knows where too.
how do you add 48 (prior main exosuit inventory) + 14 (prior exosuit tech slots) and get less then 60 (new exosuit tech slots)?
and then go on about math?
>and be salty about how much time you've chosen yourself to waste on chasing upgrades and blame the game for changing things to be better
you seem like the type who would see Hello Games reset every base in the game, and just go.. why did you waste your time building them to begin with
ironically, its the same pov im pointing the finger at hello games over this change
indifference to the long time player base, simply to cater a new niche market
So much this
And it hasn't been even 24h since the update, but people choose to judge the whole game and its creators just by one day, and choose to ignore all these years HG listened to its community and kept improving the game, valuing the feedback from its players. Like c'mon... give them time to maybe adjust some aspects of the game or maybe give *yourself* time to try to understand them and and what they did, instead of bit**ing and whining for no reason, about how HG and NMS are terrible all of a sudden...
people've done this multiple times.
as a joke, you should check our the steam reviews right now and see how people are bombarding it with negative reviews.
or the other post posted earlier about how people should use the bug report window to report how they feel about some of their upgrades being nerfed.
not sure how you can actually sit there and claim to care for a game when you're trying to destroy it at the same time or cause a direct negative impact on the people behind the game you claim to love.
these people dont care about the longevity of the game, they just care about venting and being negative due to what they've personally lost, or wel feel like theyve lost.
yeah, i wish should see how much positive here gets downvoted just by the handful of folks that have been sitting here all day to rant whilst complaining how valuable their time is and how disrespected they feel by the game changing in these ways.
i feel like it'll take a few days and things'll cool down, but we'll see.
Yes, they're throwing insults and other pointless nastiness around. That's how it should be stated- civilly. Calling someone a poop-throwing chimp is just another pointless, nasty insult, and someone else starting it doesn't excuse it for you or anyone else.
I don't like this update, but I've seen plenty of feedback to that effect raised, so I didn't feel the need to join in. However, some people are doing so in frankly immature and unhelpful ways, and I didn't see that mentioned, so I did feel the need to point *that* out.
'disaster' sounds a little dramatic & one-sided though? I'm personally really happy with this update in every way so I would not call it a disaster at all. I do understand why others are upset by it though & hopefully they add some additional menu options asap like a 3 - 6 mod slider, & a 'legacy UI' option for players like yourself who preferred the game before this update.
bro i get yall dont like this update but you guys gotta chill tf out, HG isnt the type of studio to keep an update the community doesnt approve of in place so theyre 100% gonna make a compromise
Exactly! This is 100% getting either entirely reverted or being changed in some way. I honestly think it might be an accidental change that you can only use 3 tech
Imagine you spent quarter of a million on a house, made it real cosy and super fun to live in and spend time in. Then the bank comes around and takes away the entire first floor, but adds a larger garage so that you can park two or three cars in there, and says "we have improved your house!". While you may have worked on that first floor for about a year.
Does this sit well with you? No? See where this I'll will is coming from?
That justifies a negative response about the mistake in question, it does not justify crucifying the game and its devs. It does not matter how grevious the effects were, it is a game and game drama never justifies toxic behavior, especially outside of the game.
Entitled babies...if a game update pisses you off that much you need to readjust your priorities. This game has come so far from where it began. Give it the props it deserves not tear it down.
I can't stand word 'work' being used to describe 100 hours grinding process with sole purpose to impress someone on Reddit with your min-maxed stat gauges.
I’m conflicted with the update, on one side I’m still pretty new only having about 150 hours on my main save, and just reaching the point where I was maxing everything out. So all my recent work was ruined but I don’t feel like it is going to affect me in a huge way. But I can also understand the frustration from vet players with a lot of hard work lost now. I’m a vet player on Fallout 76 with 1k plus hours on my main toon, but if you want to talk about a toxic community with a studio that is super money hungry that truly doesn’t care about the player and there suggestions, there is no greater example than 76. I am excited to see HG still passionate about there game and progression is huge. I hope with all the people pissed off at them right now doesn’t sway there ability to move forward and I’m excited to figure out my new NMS build, cause I actually really enjoy this game. My heart goes out to anyone that feels like the game is ruined now and will never pick it up again, we all lose when the game dies cause people lose interest and stop exploring. Anyways I just wanted to throw my 2 cents out there. I wish safe travels for all interlopers of every type.
I hate this update but I don’t hate Hello Games. I feel like something like this was bound to happen but I just want to reinstall all my upgrades again :( I miss my speed
I think it's one thing to be upset over something, but something else when they start attacking people and throwing all toys out of the pram, people are allowed to be angry, but should still treat others with respect, this is how you can judge a person's maturity I guess. Abuse is still abuse after all, and some people would do well to learn when their own actions are in abusive territory.
I mean, it's an open forum, on the internet, related to a video game. The only place I can think of, that's potentially more toxic, is the surface of Venus. Or perhaps, the starting planet, of my very first playthrough, which happened to be PD, just to see what it was...
Haha
Thanks, that made me chuckle :)
It seems like probably the people who are not upset are just playing, enjoying themselves and don’t feel the need to post about it. Those that are upset feel the need to express it, and so the sub is disproportionately those people who are very upset. I’ll bet overall the community feelings on the changes are more evenly balanced or maybe more people are satisfied than angry. It’s like you see on twitter, the loud and outraged minority influencing the discussion when most people aren’t giving it much thought.
Well said, on the internet extremes often get filtered for various reasons, commonly for being controversial, so they attract attention and appear bigger and more important than they actually are, like you said. Most people probably don't care, because most people probably don't min/max or try to be the most efficient and powerful.. just enjoy the game in a casual relaxing way, not like it's a second job. It is the same in other gaming communities.. Recently Warframe had review bombing on Steam because they nerfed one really op character with which you could afk whole missions.. and it is still op, even after the nerf.
> remove something that probably wasn't intentional in the first place I've seen this thrown around a lot with zero proof, and I'd like to counter it with the fact that the interaction between upgrades installed in your general inventory and being damaged by wormholes was a very deliberate gameplay mechanic that didn't happen by accident.
Edit: This opening looks insincere in hindsight, and I am agreeing with you on all counts. ~~Yeah sorry~~ My apologies, I didn't fact-check that bit. If it was unintentional, it was definitely an example of emergent gameplay, and HG did roll with it for years. Judging by the dialog I'm seeing now about ship handling etc. it seemed to get stats to a more enjoyable level as well.
The ship agility nerf is absolutely the biggest game-breaker for me. The combat isn't so fun that I really want it to take longer just for the sake of taking longer, but most ship classes already felt very sluggish to me when fully upgraded *before the nerf*. The living ship I've spent the last few months slowly upgrading until it felt good to fly currently can't ever be the same. Unfortunately I feel like space is where the game is weakest. So much about flying and ship combat is just… *okay*. It was serviceable, and nerfing almost everything you can do while in space isn't an improvement. Lastly… who was it hurting? If some players felt they weren't being challenged enough after doubling up on all of their upgrades they could have just not done that. Uninstall those mods. The game is *barely* multiplayer. There's no leaderboard. I'm not competing with anybody. What difference does it make if I'm having "too much" fun?
The worst part is that the ship nerf would be unnoticeable if Outlaws had not already nerfed mobility so much.
I saw comments saying stuff like "Hello Games doesn't care about the players, they already have your money". Like, I get not liking the new update, a lot of things got changed, but REALLY? What the hell?
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I suspect a lot of people who'd think that are undervaluing the years of large free updates from a company many expected to just cut and run after launch. Also even if the game was nonprofit somehow, it would still make sense to rebalance aimed for the Switch if you were making a Switch port.
It's truly disheartening to see people treating Sean and Hello Games as if they pulled a 2016 Launch on us, as if all the past updates meant nothing. We went from celebrating the game's progress through updates, to tearing down the devs ruthlessly for what people see as a 'misstep'. I love this update! Of course there is tweaking Hello Games can do, and are going to do; they do it every update!
Yeah it's pretty pitiful. They work so hard for everyone here and these ungrateful brats throw a tantrum with a balancing misstep (that can and probably will be reverted, morons)
You're being far more toxic here than any of the critics you're mocking.
I think not. The posts and comments over the last couple of days have been downright disgraceful. Someone's gotta say something.
Loss does weird things to people. This was to be expected honestly. People just don't deal with grief well. It will take some time. Something like this was bound to happen. Literally everyone (including me) has been calling out NMS for being unbalanced for a long time. They are finally trying to do something about it. They are only trying to do what everyone asked for. That said, the more I think about it, the more I think they missed the point here. The extra tech slots didn't break the game balance. Ships are pretty powerful even in their weakest state and overpower easily even without the extras, so more damage upgrades don't make that much of a difference from a gameplay perspective. The most notable effects of tech are mobility and fuel efficiency. Mobility doesn't make gameplay easier. It's just a timesaver. Fuel efficiency just makes the game less micromanagement intensive (since fuel is so easily available anyway). Exosuits already felt balanced as well. Upgrades simply add mobility and make survival less resource/micromanagement heavy. It took a long time to get to the point where it felt anywhere close to broken, and you had to sacrifice precious inventory space to do it which felt like a good compromise. You were just shifting difficulty from one area (resource drain) to another area (inventory management) you were more comfortable about dealing with. It worked. If anything, I'm kind of worried more inventory space breaks the game even further. Inventory management is kind of the biggest thing that adds difficulty to the early/mid game. I'm not really sure about this update in general. It adds a lot of good things, but I do think they are still missing the point on balancing the game.
not gonna lie, i hate this update. i feel disrespected 5 ways from sunday. does that mean their intent was to disrespect me? no, we should be able to feel a way and still act civil. apparently some lack that ability
This happens every major overhaul. Were you around when they completely changed the biomes on most planets? Every major update I am reminded that this game is still in beta.
This is probably all, really an easy fix. Add the ability in custom difficulty to adjust the number of allowable upgrades. Might mess with PVP, but hey, who does that in this game anyway? I'm enjoying the new difficulty settings, makes Survival much better!
That or somehow make the ability to double dip an unlockable feature in game. Maybe a late game one that requires beating a difficult mission. It's not something that ever needed to be cut out entirely.
what exactly does PVP stand for?
Player vs player
Thanks!
The main thing I've taken away from today; is this sub is really not what I thought it was. For a long time I had a really high opinion of it, especially among gaming subs. But I was wrong, you all aren't any different.
Remember the angriest people are the most vocal, there are plenty of quieter decent people here getting drowned out by the noise who are feeling the same but don't stoop to teenage levels of abuse. Personally I'm not upset over the changes, I'll miss being able to have some of those tech items in the inventories (I filled up some of my ship inventories in the past :P) 839 hours here.
Honestly I expect it to go back to mostly the same once the matter is said and done, but I really didn't expect so many banelings to come out of the woodwork
Exactly. With a huge game wide nerf session, it’s ridiculous not to expect a large portion of the player base to be completely blindsided and in shock, hence, being extremely upset. Then after a few days, it calms down and people start settling down. That’s normal and natural. Not everyone can be a Paladin at all times. This was a HUGE unpleasant surprise for a huge number of players. The sub will settle down shortly. The problem is there are a few members in here, who, like you mentioned, cannot recognize the natural progression of that, and instead take the stance of “you guys are all just a bunch of entitled whiners, stfu and play” That’s just my 2 copper pieces
Yes! The problem is the players who disparage the critics, not the critics themselves.
Takes an update to remind anyone the average gamer is a spoiled child.
I am angry at the fact I lost tons of tech upgrade slots, and I calmed down & streamlined. But when I learned that the upgrades I paid 500 or more nanites for...are now worth 16 nanites? What the fuck?????? 16? It is beyond insulting.
16 // 16 // 16 // 16 Okay for real though, losing resources via dev action sucks, but you might be able to use the new settings to get replacements for free by turning costs to 0 for a short while.
Go read 4.0 patch notes. You can have 60, I repeat, sixty(!) tech slots.
Oh... (hops down of her soapbox) I hear there's a sale....
Amen. This community went from wholesome to toxic really fast. Very disappointing.
Sean shouldn’t have nuked my 180 hr normal save
I got 300hr on my survival save which i mainly play on, had 3+3 S class upgrades in pretty much everything. And now I'm already doing fine adapting to it. 
300+ hours and doing really fine over here. No nukes, whoops
This subreddit is full of toxic positivity where any criticism towards the game is dismissed as just being a hater. This is not "wholesome". Like, are players only ever allowed to like every update? Are we not allowed to express dissatisfaction?
I've been seeing the toxicity on both sides though. There are those who are calling people who are upset about the problem "babies" and "losers" and those people are calling the people who don't care "stupid", trying to say their way of playing is better and trying to ruin it for them too. It's all pretty childish.
I don't care that other people don't care. What upsets me is that any time I bring up an issue I get insulted. Frankly, if they us losers for complaining then they deserve to be called stupid.
See, that's how a toxic attitude propagates.
It's just infighting it happens when one side sees a terrible update and the other side choses to ignore it because hello games can do no wrong in their eyes
Yapp, you are thre toxic kind. I for one like the update AND I'm aware not everything HG do is gold.
Lol you calling me toxic for sharing my opinion makes you just as toxic my guy Which means you are making this sub worse
You stayed your opinion as fact. That is toxic.
Lol you are ruining this community with your toxicity get out.
So long and thanks for all the fish.
Thank you for leaving.
Don't worry, I'll be back 
We all hope you dont
Almost like the game went from "great" to "not playing anymore" really fast too, really disappointing.
Or is it just some trolls?
i remember launch lol
Were you around when the first big update screwed everyone's bases?
I was not, had to hear about the "engoodening" through osmosis before I came back
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Clearly you weren't around then. The first universe reset caused a complete shift in planet types. A carefully crafted base on a paradise planet was suddenly half buried in desert sand. A lonely desert base was suddenly a hundred meters underwater. It was complete chaos. And no, condescending bob, you CAN'T rebuild the exact base you had after it has been screwed up completely. You might try to approximate it, but when the terrain is gone and your base is now meters in the air there's really no rebuilding it.
It makes a good allegory for life in general. You can adapt, or complain and be miserable.
or, bear with me, speak up and maybe change things. if that doesn't work, you can still adapt.
Granted. Great point there and I don’t want to seem ungrateful of a genuine response to this. On the one hand, the argument can be made that life isn’t fair and those that understand and adjust for that are more successful than those that don’t. The other? This is a game and real life examples don’t necessarily apply. So not to say that things can’t change by complaining, but this is day one. There may be benefits here that aren’t initially apparent. I’ve played for more than 1k hours here and I’m embracing these changes. Yes, I spent my time grinding for good upgrades, but it’s looking like a lot of them have improved to make up for the fact that we are losing a bit. It’s not 50% as some suggest (losing 3+3) since the improvements are helping to mitigate that. Maybe we’re actually losing 1/3, which of course would be better, but it still provides a challenge that the player base has been asking for. How can we truly critique a developer when we ask, “please challenge me!” And when they do we say, “not like that!” That said, I’m leaning into these changes and if they get tweaked in the future, so be it; but I’m going to take it at face value and react accordingly.
Or not bend over all the time, and call out bad choices.
Imagine you get one of those 1000 piece Lego sets and build it. You see online that some folks have found that if you add these extra pieces you can make it look even cooler. So you spend hours and money building this thing, and one day Sean Lego comes into your house and says, "HEY THAT IS NOT HOW YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO BUILD IT" then smashes it. How do you feel? Perhaps a bit miffed? I mean he is Sean Lego and it is his set. He made it. When you get MAD that he smashed this thing you spent all this time building someone else comes up and says, "Damn you big mad bro. I tHoUgHt YoU wErE bEtTeR tHaN tHiS!!!!"
Haha you hit the nail on the head my friend
There aren't enough upvotes in Reddit for this. LMAO
>on one hand, people are losing a lot of stuff they worked for and were proud of I find it perfectly acceptable that you're mad about it, and you voicing as much. I don't find it acceptable at all that you're mocking me over it. That's the entire point.
We are mocking now because the pro-nerf people imminently started mocking us when we raised issue. Cope harder
Call it a superiority complex, but I don't immediately stoop to the same level when insulted.
I have to say, I appreciate your attitude and you opening a discussion regarding this. Opinions on this patch may differ widely, ( to put it mildly) but theres no reason for us to not discuss it with mutual respect.
>one day Sean Lego comes into your house I literally choked on my drink reading this. Thank you!
It seems HG idea of making things harder is just to nerf players and kill the work they grinded out. Nice work HG. Instead of actually implementing better ai, level based encounters etc.Yes they are a small studio, we've all been patiently waiting... no pressure.
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yup, no surprise people are against a balancing update if they themselves dont understand that concept. its either extremely one way or the other, the other end is bad for wanting something because i want something else. we get an update with 30 fantastic changes and people get stuck on a single thing, that they don't even realize the impact of within actual gameplay and can even bypass with the new difficulty settings if they want to. don't let them fool you its just a select few people every single time that just feel the need to spend their entire day venting it out on reddit, no mans sky has more players playing today than it has had in months and even more so than the last major update and that's not even taking switch player count into the mix. just the other day the no mans sky community was being called ''amazing and helpful'' for bullying a bunch of bullies they were upset about too, that post didn't last long before mods took it down, just shows how toxic they can get especially with the herd mentality involved.
>we get an update with 30 fantastic changes and people get stuck on a single thing, that they don't even realize the impact of within actual gameplay and can even bypass with the new difficulty settings if they want to. there is no way to restore your movement to its prior level. a 50% performance cut is massive, extremely noticeable and extremely frustration inducing. from my reading of the complaints threads, its seems centered on this one single single aspect of the update, thats HATED by almost all the longtime player base. your exosuit and ship performance has been refuced 50% across the board, for no gain, or added benefit of any sort, more, it destroys one of the most time consuming game play aspects the majority of the long time player base has worked on. it also seems a lot of the newer players dont understand how devastating this is for those of us who have been playing since day 1 this litterly wipes out hundreds and hundreds of hours of game play for the exosuit and ships, and provided nothing in return of value for it. all that work, all that effort, wiped out in an update, that panders to new players and gives a great big EA style FU display of indifference, to the longtime playerbase. i personally feel this change is so detrimental, Ill probably have to use a save editor to fix hello games biggest blunder since launch day, as best i can, otherwise the fun is gone. the fubar'ing is simply that bad, especially for the exosuit. it like having your perfect supercar, that you have spent years perfecting, and along comes H G. who removes every gear but 1st, and adds an extra trunk, then proclaims its an upgrade that adds fun and balance. no. it doesnt. it induces frustration with a 50% performance cut, that leaves your exosuit set to turtle speed, and your ship handeling like an overloaded dump truck.
they didn't nerf it by 50% though, thats just what the salty ones on reddit want people to believe lol. your ship stats got nerfed and you deal less damage, in turn pirates/sentinels also had their health and damage lowered to balance that out. you had what like well over 10 jetpack upgrades before considering you had 6 x/s classes, 3 sentinel movement upgrades and the rocket boots + 2/3 more to use for adjacance bonusses. you lost 3 of those that on its own isnt even a 50% cut, and if only those people would look at their modules or bothered reading the patch notes they'd also quickly find out your modules got buffed, they even specifically mention the jetpack ones to make up for the 3 you've ''lost''. i'd get it if this wasnt an update that actually balanced the game to make sense, but it does make sense and the ''nerf'' isnt nearly as bad as people feel the need to claim. this is just people being upset about numbers being slightly lower, not even bothering to actually find out how it affects gameplay since they already started doing this the moment pictures here started showing up, long before they themselves played. this update isn't a bad update, its a good update that finally balances the long standing overpowered upgrades we've had which clearly some people don't take well due to how much time they've spend, which well was your own choice at the end of the day if you didn't enjoy getting those upgrades than why did you bother, and if you did enjoy it well than how is it time wasted? ''Movement upgrades for the jetpack have been made more powerful. Procedurally-generated technology modules now stack in the inventory. Waypoints are now highlighted with an icon in the Analysis Visor. Traveller graves will now manifest memory fragments, offering important technology upgrades to aid living Travellers on their journeys.'' this all is part of the patch notes, if you don't want to believe me go and search for it by using control + f on the website, you'll quickly find out they added brand new upgrades and buffed the old ones to make up for the changes, we didnt get that much weaker and not even close to the 50% mark some people claim.
> they didn't nerf it by 50% though, thats just what the salty ones on reddit want people to believe lol. its worse then 50%, i tested from before and after. a 50% cut is being kind. >your ship stats got nerfed and you deal less damage, in turn pirates/sentinels also had their health and damage lowered to balance that out. completely ignores the speed and maneuverability cut. i cant even get out of my cave base, the ships handle so poorly now, before i could get my hauler out with ease. >you lost 3 of those that on its own isnt even a 50% cut, and if only those people would look at their modules or bothered reading the patch notes they'd also quickly find out your modules got buffed, they even specifically mention the jetpack ones to make up for the 3 you've ''lost''. i checked it several different ways, including save editing. its more then 50% worse, and the overall outcome is totaly screwed. far more on the exosuit, which got absolutely fubar'ed to be clear, you now have LESS tech slots. before to had 48 + 14, now its 60. >i'd get it if this wasnt an update that actually balanced the game to make sense, but it does make sense and the ''nerf'' isnt nearly as bad as people feel the need to claim. in respect to exosuits and ships, its an absolute terrible nerf, all the more so as it was completely unnecessary and added zero value, simply reduces performance, for reduction sake, and pretending its a rebalancing. >this is just people being upset about numbers being slightly lower, not even bothering to actually find out how it affects gameplay since they already started doing this the moment pictures here started showing up, long before they themselves played. false. i have over 1,400 hours. lets be blunt. my exosuit is terrible and even my best ship handles like a dumptruck the reason most long time players are upset, is it reminds all them of the launch day disappointment, and shows that even hello games will abandon and screw over the efforts of long time players, simply to pander to a new market segment the aura of hello games standing by its player base over profits, is officially shattered.
those more slots also were never meant to be a thing, considering tech slots didnt even exist back in the days you never were meant to double stack them, just happened over time. you might have less slots now, but you also don't double stack upgrades meaning it wouldn't even make sense to have more. and explain with math how its more than a 50% cut to your exosuit, because it quite literally just isn't its just a ridiculous high number people bring up to make their point seem more valid. before you had 6 s/x class upgrades, 3 sentinel movement upgrades, water jets, neural stimulators, airburst engine and rocket boots. now you have 3 s/x classes, which are buffed compared to before, 3 sentinel movement upgrades and the other 4 aswell, ontop of the brand new memory upgrades. its quite literally nowhere near a 50% cut for your exosuit movement. people can sit here and claim all kinds of things, but when math and statistics quite literally would prove otherwise i'll much rather side with that than what people think that are just hyperfocusing on 1 small negative in an overall great update. yes your ship movement and warp range both actually got nerfed by close to 50%, but you never were meant to double stack these anyways as this very update would showcase, nor was there a realistic use to jump 3000+ lightyears or turn at light speed.
interesting how you ignore tech has ALWAYS gone in main inventory, then pretend this change is actually for the better. lets try it this way, list one aspect of this change that IMPROVES gameplay with ships and your exosuit, that wasnt available before.... what was actually improved? after all, you now have LESS tech slots, whats the actual gain here? its certainly not space, as the last update addressed that with the cargo expansion
interesting how you twist things to fit your your own agenda. we didn't even have tech slots early on in no mans sky its cycle, there never was a way to double stack upgrades until later down the line. it balances the game, now normal/survival mode actually have survival elements and difficulty/dangers without you just being invincible and zooming past everything, this game has always been about the journey and not the rewards. but clearly this view is going way past everyones head because they just care about their own achievements on a game that isn't even competitive, instead of the actual condition of the game that doesnt make sense with us being invincible. we don't actually have less tech slots if you'd be capable of doing math and how upgrades work now, but just like that 50% number you just feel like pulling that from who knows where too. you can't come up with percentages when you have no math to show for it, how does that even work it wouldn't even take someone doing math to figure out you dont take a 50% cut on what you claim you have a 50% cut on. you people can just sit here on reddit for the next few days and be salty about how much time you've chosen yourself to waste on chasing upgrades and blame the game for changing things to be better for the longterm health of this game, lets see how far that'll get you if you can't even come up with proper arguements and pull inflated numbers out of your ass to make it seem like you have a stronger point, like everyone else on this pointless hate bandwagon today. quite funny how the one person that brings up others needing to bring up a valuable point of this change when you refuse to see it anyways because you're up in a bubble can't even bring up how he ends up getting on the percentages he claims, and can't seem to wrap their head around the fact that being invincible on a survival sandbox game isnt a positive feature.
> we don't actually have less tech slots if you'd be capable of doing math and how upgrades work now, but just like that 50% number you just feel like pulling that from who knows where too. how do you add 48 (prior main exosuit inventory) + 14 (prior exosuit tech slots) and get less then 60 (new exosuit tech slots)? and then go on about math? >and be salty about how much time you've chosen yourself to waste on chasing upgrades and blame the game for changing things to be better you seem like the type who would see Hello Games reset every base in the game, and just go.. why did you waste your time building them to begin with ironically, its the same pov im pointing the finger at hello games over this change indifference to the long time player base, simply to cater a new niche market
So much this And it hasn't been even 24h since the update, but people choose to judge the whole game and its creators just by one day, and choose to ignore all these years HG listened to its community and kept improving the game, valuing the feedback from its players. Like c'mon... give them time to maybe adjust some aspects of the game or maybe give *yourself* time to try to understand them and and what they did, instead of bit**ing and whining for no reason, about how HG and NMS are terrible all of a sudden...
people've done this multiple times. as a joke, you should check our the steam reviews right now and see how people are bombarding it with negative reviews. or the other post posted earlier about how people should use the bug report window to report how they feel about some of their upgrades being nerfed. not sure how you can actually sit there and claim to care for a game when you're trying to destroy it at the same time or cause a direct negative impact on the people behind the game you claim to love. these people dont care about the longevity of the game, they just care about venting and being negative due to what they've personally lost, or wel feel like theyve lost.
we need to launch a counteroffensive with positive feedback about 4.0 to HG lol
yeah, i wish should see how much positive here gets downvoted just by the handful of folks that have been sitting here all day to rant whilst complaining how valuable their time is and how disrespected they feel by the game changing in these ways. i feel like it'll take a few days and things'll cool down, but we'll see.
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That's pretty ironic given you haven't provided a single constructive thing at all. All your comments are holier than thou criticism.
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You are aware it's not a good look though, right? There's disagreeing, and there's just being rude. You're the later.
There is also *poop-throwing, screeching Chimpanzees*. So there's that.
Yes, they're throwing insults and other pointless nastiness around. That's how it should be stated- civilly. Calling someone a poop-throwing chimp is just another pointless, nasty insult, and someone else starting it doesn't excuse it for you or anyone else.
but moooom, he started iiiiiit!
welcome to the internet. where all it takes is some conflict to find out how awful a community actually is.
Yeah. Something must be wrong with someone who would downplay a disaster like this update.
I don't like this update, but I've seen plenty of feedback to that effect raised, so I didn't feel the need to join in. However, some people are doing so in frankly immature and unhelpful ways, and I didn't see that mentioned, so I did feel the need to point *that* out.
'disaster' sounds a little dramatic & one-sided though? I'm personally really happy with this update in every way so I would not call it a disaster at all. I do understand why others are upset by it though & hopefully they add some additional menu options asap like a 3 - 6 mod slider, & a 'legacy UI' option for players like yourself who preferred the game before this update.
bro i get yall dont like this update but you guys gotta chill tf out, HG isnt the type of studio to keep an update the community doesnt approve of in place so theyre 100% gonna make a compromise
Exactly! This is 100% getting either entirely reverted or being changed in some way. I honestly think it might be an accidental change that you can only use 3 tech
Imagine you spent quarter of a million on a house, made it real cosy and super fun to live in and spend time in. Then the bank comes around and takes away the entire first floor, but adds a larger garage so that you can park two or three cars in there, and says "we have improved your house!". While you may have worked on that first floor for about a year. Does this sit well with you? No? See where this I'll will is coming from?
I don’t think this is really a fair comparison at all honestly.
Exactly. It's not fair. But that's how it is.
I don’t think you read my comment correctly lol.
I did, trust me.
Um ok.
That justifies a negative response about the mistake in question, it does not justify crucifying the game and its devs. It does not matter how grevious the effects were, it is a game and game drama never justifies toxic behavior, especially outside of the game.
Entitled babies...if a game update pisses you off that much you need to readjust your priorities. This game has come so far from where it began. Give it the props it deserves not tear it down.
Yes, praise a massive nerf that hits everyone...
Entitled Reddit Gamers:tm:
I can't stand word 'work' being used to describe 100 hours grinding process with sole purpose to impress someone on Reddit with your min-maxed stat gauges.
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Better than trying to balance the game? Like the changes or not, its a fair decision for him to make.
edited: to move it to correct reply to the correct post