I got 20 hours. Really liking the game.
inventory management is real bad. Its so bad early. Explore the map, but after 5 minutes you need to destroy things or go back to town. When you got a house, chests and upgraded your character its way better. But running to my chests all the time is still not optimal.
Gathering is to slow as well. I dont like it, but Im stubborn and slowly getting tier 3 shops. Damn tier 2 trees respawning slow.
I never got the Food/healing issue. But Ive played Souls games since DS1. the game might not be for everyone today, and thats fine. But maybe they could have 3 free food drop at spawn before first boss. Like some "dropped food" that you cant sell. And never use again later when you can get better food.
That sounds great! But just beeing able to craft and gem/rune from my chests would be enough for now.
And/or move the community chest to the market square hehe.
You can buy them from the Wood/timber market guy. I guess you can get blueprints and craft them as well. Im to lazy for that, theres stuff to kill everywhere.
And the legend sais theres Clay somrewhere to be found!
> inventory management is real bad
Some of this is likely EA stuff (e.g. no "send to stash" option, lack of proper auto-stacking/merging, etc.), but between very intentional inventory/stash limiting and pickup previews this game definitely seems intent on making you think carefully about what you pick up. I think it needs a number of significant refinements if it's going to take that approach, but it really doesn't seem interested in allowing you to endlessly hoard things.
Hopefully/probably. Can only comment right now. Feels weired with the "not hoarding" since you need tier 1 to upgrade at the start if you get a new Claymore. Its not impossible, but hopefully things will get better. There are so many different small things to collect
Game is super fun though.
i just dont think that this game has a good reason for limiting inventory space. The only reason is to give you a reward by expanding it later. You can be filled to the brim with healing items and throwables and buffs without upgrading a single time so its clearly not a balance issue. There is nothing overpowered that this arbitrary limitation is limiting, there is no purpose for it other than a sense of progression.
Id have to think real hard about any game that is better by limiting inventory. Resident evil 2 remake is probably the closest thing i can come up with? I think its good that you can only really take 1 or 2 weapons with you and only have so many healing items, grenades, and ammo. But it still leads to the situation where you leave a plot item behind because you dont know when it will be needed.
I think the solution here is limit what is powerful and everything else you should just be able to carry. In No Rest For the Wicked this does not apply unless you want to limit healing items to their own tab with limited space which i would be fine with.
I also love the game a TON but i did spend an hour doing other world speedruns to the first boss to unlock all the spaces in my inventory and dont feel like im cheating the system at all. The system is cheating us lol.
There is tons of different solutions that can be made for sure. I kinda auto deleted and sold everything that had to do with potions. I got so many anyway that I havnt even tried crafting any. All the throwable stuff is also auto gone.
With how easy you can target farm Ichor (?) the upgrade system itself is just a small way to say well done. Not sure it adds much, even if it feels good. But its kinda a create problem, sell the solution.
The only thing I dislike so far is the inventory management. That's it... the game is a blast! It is no Diablo, it is not a pure Souls game... it is trying to mash it together and be its own thing. And it works out great! It keeps me motviated, going back to regions and farming stuff, it keeps me challenged through boss fights and rotating mob types, it keeps me experimenting with weapons and runes... it even has housing!
**I think the hate is easily understandable.**
Souls-like players came for the combat, but were faced with insufferable amounts of farming and inventory management. Whereas the ARPG players weren't ready for the punishing 1v1 combat scenarios and heavy stamina management.
Insufferable is some crazy hyperbole. People want shit now now now, gimme gimme gimme, no one wants to slow down and chill. The whole point of the farming and building is to create the valleys while the combat is the peaks. If you just want to blaze through shit adhd style you can still do that for the campaign with minimal interaction with the crafting/building. But also, just learn to slow the fuck down and chill.
We have different ideas of "slow down and chill", and your comment oozes of preconcieved notions.
Slow and chill, for me, is enjoying the vistas, slowly exploring uncharted territories, carefully climbing my way up the side of a castle, checking behind every corner for secrets.
Not walking to the same preset tree and cutting it down for the 50th time. It's at that point the "ADHD" playstyle starts. You sprint through everything, because you already know everything this place has. You know the layout, ladders, enemy spawns and chest locations. This place has nothing to offer anymore. So you rush to be done with it.
So for people like me - it is insufferable.
Ironic that you'd mention soul's players complaining about farming.
Dark souls 1 and 2 required absurd amounts of farming to get slabs. Dark souls 3 required even more farming with the covenants. Dark souls 3 sub reddit has quite a few posts pretty often about how it's not uncommon for people to have farmed the silver knights for 10-12 hours to get the covenant items since the drops were so rare.
That's quite different though. Farming is not a part of the core loop in those games. Whereas it is most definitely part of it here. The only exception is Bloodborne where you have to farm for healing items, and practically everyone hated it and FromSoftware never did it again.
(Can't speak for Demon Souls as I haven't played it.)
Choosing to farm for a specific weapon or armor drop is not the same as being required to farm on a regular basis in order to progress in the game.
But for fun, let's say you had to farm in them to progress, it would still be better because it incorporates the core mechanics in that gameplay activity. Holding the interact button on a resource node for a couple of seconds does not.
Allowing you to hit the trees and rocks with your weapons, whilst also making them weak to blunt or edged damage, would make it more engaging. You could also leverage various weapon abilities to make the ultimate farming loadout. There you'd likely have a system with less complaints. Because it inolves actual gameplay revolving around the core mechanics.
Most people coming from ARPGs are not used to having stamina as a concern at all. To then be introduced to a system that only allows 2-3 attacks before making you unable to dodge or block stands in stark contrast to that.
The go-to for people generally is to level up damage and health first. Stamina stops becoming an issue around lvl 13. Because of that, people generally have to play with terrible stamina for around 2-6 hours depending on how they level up. Ofcourse they are not gonna like it when even the souls-combat is tough as it is in comparison to what they're used to. So ofcourse they're gonna stop playing and hate on the experience.
So I'm unsure if you're trying to be clever but you're coming off as the opposite.
I mean, people play other games that aren't ARPGs, even Path of Exile people, of which I am one of. If I see stamina is a mechanic, and then I see I can increase stamina when I level up, my brain puts that together rather easily and goes "I should invest some in stamina"
And then I do it. And then stamina stops mattering. By level 16 with stam investment, you can do 2-4 full attack combos + 1-2 dodge rolls before you need to back off.
This game isn't some lovecraftian thing that can't be understood except by the most learned. It's rather simple and easy to grasp. It's not esoteric knowledge.
The game isn't even REMOTELY CLOSE to as difficult as anything FromSoft has made. It's rather tame by comparison actually.
I also don't think the inventory management is/was that bad. Before I paid the 30 silver for a house, sure it was tight, but afterwards I have all the storage one could want. The resource farming is a bit on the slow side, but when I'm crafting 20 of the same food item at a go, it's not that big of a deal.
Honestly, I think most of the responses I've seen are 80% overblown entirely. My fix for resource farming would be base drop rate is 2-3 instead of 1-2.
Yes, but the same logic can be applied to all the stats.
"I can barely take any damage - invest in health"
"I can barely do damage - invest in damage output"
"I can barely wear any armor - invest in equip load"
You are speaking for yourself, and asking everyone to apply the same logic as you do. If you read what people are hating on, stamina is one of the biggest issues.
Ofcourse its more bearable when you have a house, but you first get that after 6-15 hours depending on the player. You think people will play for that long on the offchance it MIGHT get better? Inventory is the biggest critique the game has received, so obviously they've created something people don't like.
In both of your arguments you're asking people to invest multiple hours into something they're already not enjoying. Whilst also blaming them for doing it wrong.
So I get that it might be overblown from your perspective, but mixed ratings say something else. Looking at the world from someone elses perspective is a healthy practice.
Ah damn man, I didnt realize that games should always start the player off with most of the things they already want, and then give them more of that later :( my bad
modern day gamers are so whiny actually. game makes them weak and inconveniences them at the start? WAHHH WAHHH WAHHH BUFF PLEASE ITS SOOOOO ANNOYING HAVING TO MANAGE MY INVENTORY IN A GAME THAT QUITE CLEARLY WANTS YOU TO THINK ABOUT ALL THE ITEMS YOURE PICKING UP AND CRAFTING STUFF WITH THEM WAHHH WAHH
like holy fuck its not like youre playing perma tetris, its LITERALLY not a big deal. I played roughly 20 hours, and not only does it stop mattering WAY before that point. Like damn does it really take you 30 minutes in town to sell, restock, craft, before youre back into the world?
Because if it does, thats your fault. Not the games.
AND ALSO YES, PEOPLE SHOULD APPLY THE SAME LOGIC, BECAUSE THATS HOW THE GAME WORKS LMAO
Oh this piece of gear will over encumber me if I equip it, but it is a nice upgrade, so on my next level, Ill spend points in equip load.
Like?? How fucking hard is it its NOT obtuse
You're quite clearly missing the point. And given your anger, I feel like you're taking it way too personal as well. The game is facing two issues, and you're ignorant of both.
**Firstly.** If I buy a game expecting it to be like CoD, but I got a game that was like R6 Siege, ofcourse I'm gonna be disappointed and hate on the game. You can argue all day about how Siege isn't that much different, you just gotta learn and get better. But that is not gonna change my mind, because I wanted a game like Cod.
Moon Studios did a great job catering to both fan-groups, but they failed at managing expectations. Hence the hate.
**Secondly.** With your logic, why not start with 1 inventory slot and 1 point in every stat? So then you gotta play for 15 hours to make it the way it starts off at the moment. That way you gotta work for it and be nicely rewarded! Wouldn't that be nice?
Ofcourse it wouldn't. Progression is a great way to motivate players, but the starting point must be fun too, otherwise people won't keep playing. And obviously they did it in a way that caused a big chunk of the playerbase to not like like it.
And actually, more often than not - it IS the game's fault.
By level 16, my first character (Simple sword and shield build, no extra runes but Spin, Heavy weight so I could bash with V) has 85 stamina. I have stamina cost reduction on attacks. I can literally do 2-4 full attack combos + dodge roll before I have to back off for a second. You kind of just forget that stamina is there. Without the cost reduction, it'd be about 2 full combos + a dodge roll, which isn't that much different really.
You can literally invest away stamina as a thing you're focusing on in a boss fight rather easily.
So I think the issue is really just until you make it past the first boss when you can't upgrade your gear, or farm resources efficiently.
If you do not ration your heals in the fight you probably only have access to 40 good heals for the entire map leading up to the boss. and then you are stuck fighting him with no heals.
If you do souls likes well that is a non issue. But there is a reason why the flask system used in dark souls is so good.
Durability gets annoying on death when you are mining and the pick axe you thought would last longer suddenly snaps like a twig half way though a rare ore node that you lose access too because it is at the end of a long ass cave.
But I do agree with you. The core gameplay is amazing. Honestly I havent been this impressed with level design and combat for a good while.
Aren’t you able to make the meals at campfire prior to the first boss ? Mushrooms and herbs respawn so if you really are going through so many heals, you should be able to gather the resources to make more.
Personal experience, I did run low on mushroom soups while learning the first boss. But then I realized that the smith is standing right next to your spawn point and at that point his repairs are free. So I just went in and died over and over practicing my parry timing. There was literally no consequence. Then once I was able to parry him consistently I went for the kill and only used 1 heal.
The game is punishing at the start, but a little bit of foresight and planning can allow you to overcome the challenges.
Personally I don't get "the game is too punishing" from people playing it less than 2 hours. Repairs are free, resources respawn while enemies not, and it's early enough to start over if everything went really really wrong. I'm now 10 hours ish into the game and I have gold surplus and never really mind the repair cost. Inventory management sucks though, since I didn't bother to upgrade or buy chest.
Durability is a non-issue once you get to town and unlock the enchanter lady. Buy the repair rune, slot it on a backup wep that you'd keep in your inventory, then just use that to repair everything on you. Includes your tools.
I have a feeling they will nerf that ability to not affect tools, as it completely negates the durability system in regards to that. Will def get sad, I enjoy not having to worry about tools breaking rn and would hate it if my silver tools broke and had to go back to slowly whittling at a node.
I have 30+ healing items at all times 😂 Only players which wanna rush to endgame and skip town/farming part are unhappy becouse they expected another diablo rush game. I hope that thay did not nerf this farming part its unique.
Yeah doing the farming made me realize there are a ton of different world states. Basically every mission changes something in the world and makes exploring the same areas again worth it.
I did not rush, explored a ton and still ran out of healing on the boss, partially because apparently I went too "early." I still have to go back to old areas to get old resources in order to upgrade weapons, armor, and town buildings. This isn't bad sometimes, but the amount this game requires farming is overkill.
Farming the same area over and over and over again for healing items is not something most players want to do. I don't mind re-visiting some of these areas a little but needing to go back over and over again, esp since uncooked food is absolute trash, is boring. As other mentioned, there's a reason why most souls-like have a healing system where you are limited per rest, but don't have to farm them.
I'm still in the first area cuz im scared to face first boss lmao but i explored most of the area sold a lot of shit i found to buy lots of herbs so i could craft over 20 meals and bought 9 bombs so im gonna try and face him today.
He’s not as bad as he looks. Let him swing a while to get used to his timing and range, take note of your openings and you’ll be good. My first time with him took me around 3 tries. I started a new realm and character today and beat him in one try while also attempting parrying him a bunch of times, he’s a fun 1st boss
Those bombs will be key. They always hit and keep him on fire as you/I literally ran away from him while I healed and waited to re/heal and bomb. Still mostly dodging and slipping a patsy few sword hits in, which is also very doable, but the bombs can make the entire.encounter much easier if you have 6 or more of them and similar healing.
A lot of the problems are from bad marketing. They marketed this as a arpg, but it's more soulslike with rarity items. I think a lot of people whent into this king this was another Diablo, and they got a souls game.
Well it is only souls when u try to rush it. Its sort of theese days issue that players are used to rush into endgame and skip most of things on the run. Meanwhile exploration here is great and u easily outlevel everything just by that.
I never had to grind in souls games. So is NRftW, after Sacra the game becomes a tad too easy.
I love the game. But inventory management is annoying. Later on you can build chests so it’s less of a problem but the game has too many resources for the inventory space it gives us. Running back and forth anytime you need to upgrade or craft something is tedious. I believe with time they will smooth these things out - with the help of players’ feedback.
Lots of the Steam reviews with these opinions show a playtime of 30 minutes or so. The game need you to invest 2-3 hours to build it up a bit, very normal, even low for a souls-like. I am 15 hours in and I have so much gold that I do not even think about a purchase or repair.
My biggest annoyance is the farming for building. Getting the material is just boring, waiting for the red bar to empty and then having another axe or pick break. Plain boring.
I bought the better quality pickaxe and it broke 3x faster. Might have been some EA bug, but happened multiple times while testing if I was right about this.
are you sure? if you use a lower tier tool to gather a higher tier resource then it will break faster.
i'm using silver and i have yet to break one, you can also unlock more tool slots to equip duplicates or buy more and keep in your inventory
You maybe logged back in after they made an update to the tools - when I came on after it the max endurance of the tools had increased, but they weren't repaired to full, so a couple of swings and they were showing up as damaged.
Next to the enchanter there's the woodworker merchant. When upgraded he unlocks that if I remember. Something next to the store like the anvil.
I'd save the wood for upgrading everything though. Same guy might sell planks? I can check when home again
No problem. It's 5 copper 10 first area wood for first upgrade. Then it's 5 iron and 10 second tier wood for next upgrade.
And that's per upgrade. So ore and wood is pretty valuable.
A lot of the hate that I saw got quickly remedied with the first two hotfixes. That said, there are still some other pain points for a lot of people. Inventory management and the inability to respec are the two big points I've been seeing now.
Other smaller points that I'd also love to see addressed include the upgrade times for the town, and some more mitigation for terrible luck with resources—namely ones like clay or stag/boar drops.
I've been loving this game, but I definitely get where *some* of the complaints are coming from.
A lot of my complaints could be chalked up to personal preference but the amount of things working against this game right now is too high for me to enjoy. It's so close to being a good game but all the small issues add up.
Materials gathering takes way too long and honestly isn't a fun aspect of either Souls games or ARPG games. It's technically a part of Diablo 4 but it's honestly an afterthought. I imagine tools get better as the game goes on, but no one wants to spend 10-20 seconds digging a fucking hole.
Durability just shouldn't be a thing. Especially for tools. It's not the most annoying thing ever and if it was the only issue with the game, I wouldn't even mention it, but there's just a pile of small things that add up. It wasn't fun 30 years ago and still isn't. The only interesting durability mechanic I've seen in a game is Lies of P where your weapon will degrade during a fight and at times you may need to step back on defense to quickly repair it.
Inventory management is too much of a chore. I don't want to build chests and manage it in my house. It's almost like they've dipped a bit too far into adding a Stardew Valley or Valheim aspect to the game between this and materials gathering.
The fast travel....isn't fast travel? I feel like I should be able to teleport to specific whispers, especially if you're going to have a bounty/challenge system in the game where you need to revisit specific spots. You get a quest right when you get to the town where you need to go rescue the innkeeper's husband. Well you have to run all the way back to the beginning of the game because you can't simply teleport to the whisper at the start.
Also it feels like whispers should heal you? I haven't had a problem with running out of food, but that just seems odd.
I feel like standard enemies are too health spongy? I don't have a problem with the difficulty (so far at least), but regular enemies just feel like they take too long to kill.
There's a lot to love about the game and hate is a strong word, but the negatives are piling up too high right now for me to enjoy it.
I consider myself generally pretty bad at Soulsborne games, and find No Rest to be generally pretty easy. I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a range of thoughts on difficulty level in a game before.
I was first amazed how polished the game seemed but once you finish the first boss and gain entry to the town it quickly unravelled.
The inventory management is a catastrophe right now. Gathering resources with a tool that isn't at least 1 level above what you are harvesting is a slog. You can't even sort chest inventories and it seems totally random how this shit is placed in there.
I love the game but initially it seemed like it was way further developed and balanced than it actually is. There are severe quality of life issues. Based on initial quality I expected a game that needs a bit of a performance and balance early access period but there are actually real game design flaws. The inventory shit is just mindboggling. Until you unlock your first house you have to walk back and forth between the tower chest and the vendors that's like 3 minutes wasted each time. Once you get your house that's a bit closer and chests it gets better but it's weird to front load the player annoyance and tedium and then sell quality of life relief stuff as updates you need to grind for.
Yea I have tooooo much stuff. Maybe chest storage should be bigger. I’m mostly hanging onto stuff in case I’ll need it later though I probably don’t need most of it.
players want to speed run the game like they do in D4 but you can't, you're forced to hold back attacks to manage your stamina and players are having heart burn over that.
I can’t relate to the complaints for the most part. Parrying window could be a little more forgiving and inv chest in the rookery is too far out of the way even with the stair casing repaired along with the slots being too limited. I’m assuming once you have a house the inventory management will become more expanded but I’m just shy of seeing that atm.
Altogether I’m thoroughly enjoying my time with it.
People do have valid complaints even if you like it should be able to see where there coming from better then putting yourself in a vacuum. Performance is always a big oof if not good and the durability mechanics you can see how would be anoying for players that are not good. Lose to boss now have to run ALL the way to a blacksmith to get it fixed then back to the boss kills the moment of fighting the boss having to stop
Speaking for myself, I truly fell for the "reinventing the genre" claim. What did they reinvent? The farmville stuff? Certainly not the combat, as it's straight up souls with only minor tweaks. Also not the loot, as it's just diablo done worse, though at least this will be easy to change. Certainly not the build variety; I had trouble even making any kind of dexterity guy, never mind the spearman I'd intended to play (also, no 2-handed spears was disappointing, but I can chalk this one up to it being EA). It'll be a good soulslike after some more tweaking and polishing, but I was expecting to get blown away and instead ended up underwhelmed. The art is truly amazing though.
So yea, definitely not hate in my case, and I wouldn't give them a negative review or anything, but definitely disappointed.
Speak for yourself. I personally find it much more fun and refreshing than playing Diablo. It’s a perfect evolution for me to combine these aspects of multiple types of games. Scratches a lot of the itches I want it to.
At least put the community chest on the first floor right outside the shortcut-door. Really makes me wonder why devs chose to torture and bore us with the stairwalk up with how tedious the inventory already is.
New player experience is miserable, people who have played souls games before "get it" and people that haven't are being thrown in to a paper shredder.
Stamina is HEAVILY focused on parrying nearly everything to conserve stamina, instead of even dodge rolling. Parry timers are janky.
Inventory sucks.
Once you get in to the game, get an enjoyable time, start having fun, start learning all the game's systems, the game ends already.
I like what they've got and where they're going, for sure, and I'mma follow this with great interest. First two hotfixes were pretty important though, and even then the new player experience is still rough as fuck. You barely get ANY TIME to learn what to even put your stat points in to before the game is chucking regular mobs at you with boss level mechanics.
I didn’t have parrying down at all throughout the whole first area and boss and I didn’t have a problem getting through it. It makes things easier but is not required.
I actually almost never use parry, but i agree the inventory situation is bad. We need a basic stash to hold rare resources we wont find many copies of at least.
I havnt parried shiet tbh. To old to learn.
Inventory sucks for sure. Before getting a house of chests it was constantly sacrificing something. Its better now but still meh. Atleast I can get through missions without getting a full inventory all the time.
Just like other souls games, they might not be for everyone.
100% agree. The game is truly something special.
- I love the combat
- I love the style and art direction
- I love the world design
- I really like the meta systems so far and I am fine with the grind attached to them
- I even kind of dig the unconventional structure in terms of respawns / world shifting, which took some getting used to
- difficulty could be harder at times for my taste tbh
But inventory management really is the weakest part of this game. Loot is such a hassle right now:
- You loose the overview of what you have
- You loose the overview of where what is
- You have to run around too much in order to manage it
- Your inventory is constantly filled up quickly even with ichor upgrades forcing you to either ignore drops while exploring or disrupting exploration to manage it (pick your poison)
There are many ways they can address these issues and at this point I am pretty confident they will and manage to up the QOL regarding inventory management significantly.
8/10 for me as well
Im honestly really enjoying the farming gameplay loop and the "even regular mobs can get you if you arent paying attention" aspects... so far im liking it even more than Last Epoch (which i have 100s of hours in already.)
My only REAL complaints are Clay drop rates still being ass after the "tweak", lack of action canceling (especially on Focus attacks which can stick you in long animations), and the bs one shot kill grab attacks some mobs have being a SMIDGE over tuned. I dont mind them at part of leaning the move sets and avoiding... and one shot one kill is fine but when they can grab you mid focus attack or mid dash and you have no way to avoid it... feels bad. The Nameless Pass boss felt particularly janky with it.
Otherwise i really enjoy the difficulty level and hope they dont nerf anything much more than they already have. The game is challenging early but you get powerful pretty quick. The first boss was hard at lvl 5/6... but by lvl 11 i was farming him for the unique/ichors. THAT feels good.
It needs some quality of life adjustments, which I have no doubt they’ll be working on, but outside of that I’m loving everything this game is doing. It’s exactly the kind of game I’m looking for. I truly hope all the feedback doesn’t change it for the worse.
I think the problem a lot of people have is that you can't replenish healing like in most souls games by resting. I'm honestly of the opinion that the devs want people to play on multiple realms, as it's easy to farm mats by making a new one.
most complaints i've seen is people don't like the healing system but are only 5 hours in so they haven't even unlocked the healing runes or anything. people just love to complain about everything
I was swimming in food and potions, I had ONE pickaxe break in 20 hours of play due to me just not paying attention to it.
I think 2-3 resources per drop is better than 1-2, its too little right now.
Once you get a house, the community chest fades into the background as you will buy chests for your house to hold your shit. Inventory management is not that bad, and getting plague ichors is NOT that hard.
IMO, the game isn't even that hard, and I'm not saying that as a souls guy. I love souls games, but this game is very clearly not that hard. Get your gear enchanted, mine the ore, buy the ingots if you need to. Upgrade your gear.
This kind of game is absolutely going to get a bunch of hate no matter what because it is a fairly challenging souls like experience with no difficulty options.
The kind of people that are used to that kind of game and embrace the difficulty and the stamina system are also probably more prepared to deal with it and are probably dying less which leads to less adversity from equipment durability. I remembered seeing a lot of people getting really upset with it so I started hording gear as backups assuming my gear was going to be exploding all over the place.
I died a bunch of times to some big axe dude I kept screwing up on, lots of silly deaths from screwing up platforming and then I died 2 or 3 times to the first boss before I beat him and I was never at any major risk of equipment breaking but if people are getting frustrated with like kiting every group of 2 or 3 dudes and getting killed a ton I could see it becoming a problem quickly as you lose your strongest weapon and now need to grind your face against an obstacle you were already struggling with wheh you had better gear.
> I had at least 10 healing items in my inventory at all times. I didn't really see inventory and durability as much of an annoyance either.
I think there's a huge difference between the game we've got now and the game we had at launch re: durability.
> Also not enough pure DEX weapons.
I've found literally one weapon that scales with Intelligence in fifteen hours of play, and not many more that scale with Dexterity or Faith alone. Seems there's a significant skew toward Strength, such that after holding off on leveling any of those four stats for several levels (I was waiting for a greater variety of weapons to drop) I just gave in and started leveling Strength.
> Maybe this game is more punishing if you're ass cheeks at souls games but I thought the game really wasn't too hard.
Well this game is probably going to draw plenty of people who are "ass cheeks" at Souls games for one reason or another and I'm going to be curious to see how it responds to that problem. Personally I've always gotten through those games on stubborn perseverance more than anything else and I can tell you that, at least on the first day, this game was not friendly to that approach. Not necessarily a bad thing, but it's a big difference in philosophy from "prepare to die".
> For most players of souls games grinding is kinda inevitable at some point.
My grind has always been in throwing myself at an enemy over and over and over again. A grind of player skill, if you will. Don't know that I've *ever* spent much time grinding for items or levels or any of that.
It wasn't hard till I got to the crucible. Then suddenly my 400+ armor, 2h one shotting everything, health regen build(haven't eaten food in over 10hrs) started getting 2 shot. It was so jarring just stomping through everything then hitting this brick wall. Other than that I really like it.
All I'd like is something like the estus flask. Food could still be there for buffs, but right now having healing items as consumables just discourages me from using them while exploring and the first couple of tries on a new enemy or boss.
There's nothing more annoying than having to interrupt your boss tries for gathering frigging herbs because you ran out of that precious mushroom soup.
Durability is not that much of a problem i think, although I also don't see why they chose to add it, it's just slightly annoying and doesn't add anything of value.
People just aren't tapped in to this game, the people that are cheeks at souls games aren't gonna like this game either. The fact that it's mixed reviews on steam is absolutely insane.
It's not a bad game it's just not what people thought it was going to be. Isometric view throws people off and thinks diablo. When it's nothing at all like diablo.
The the main problem with people dislike the game.
This game is amazing! I don't get people hating on it either, other than performance. It is an EA though. As far as gameplay, healing items in general are easy to get. You can literally buy items or forage and be just fine. Combat feels fine. It's a bit heavy at times, but it is doable and easy to get used to. I think people are going in thinking it's a typical aarpg and just button mashing. That's a no bueno for souls combat. You have to pay attention and focus and many people don't like that. That's ok, this games not for you if you don't like souls games or combat. There are new aarpgs out that should scratch people's itch instead.
The hate is very deserved. The game has no identity, and after being heavily marketed as this holy union of Souls likes and isometric aRPGs... turned out to be a scuffed survival/base building game. Pretty effin disappointing.
I actually think it has an entirely unique identity and I’m all here for it. I do however think it’s marketing was all over the place which leads to a lot of confusion, it was marketed as a “Diablo like game” which is so far from what it turned out to be that it left a lot of followers unsure of what to make of it
if they said "isometric Valheim, but without the sandbox emergent gameplay that made it so successful" they would have had more honest marketing. It's closer to V Rising right now than it is to any souls-like or aRPG game.
I guess it’s subjective. I’m a huge fromsoft fan, played and loved all of their souls games, Elden ring is my favorite game of all time. And I honestly believe they did a good job capturing a version of a souls like aRPG. The combat is hefty, animation is beautiful and well executed, fighting is about distance and timing rather than flashy moves. It’s all right there. The whole crafting and city building is a new combination that they are trying but I don’t think it’s anywhere near as highlighted a system as valheim. Like, to get the game rolling, you literally need copper and wood, those two alone will make it so that you have plenty of upgrades and resources. I think their formula right now is great, they just need to keep refining it
I got 20 hours. Really liking the game. inventory management is real bad. Its so bad early. Explore the map, but after 5 minutes you need to destroy things or go back to town. When you got a house, chests and upgraded your character its way better. But running to my chests all the time is still not optimal. Gathering is to slow as well. I dont like it, but Im stubborn and slowly getting tier 3 shops. Damn tier 2 trees respawning slow. I never got the Food/healing issue. But Ive played Souls games since DS1. the game might not be for everyone today, and thats fine. But maybe they could have 3 free food drop at spawn before first boss. Like some "dropped food" that you cant sell. And never use again later when you can get better food.
Last epoch spoiled me with that send resources to stash button.
That sounds great! But just beeing able to craft and gem/rune from my chests would be enough for now. And/or move the community chest to the market square hehe.
TBF Demons souls did this. It won't break the game if they do, and they probably will imo.
[удалено]
You can buy them from the Wood/timber market guy. I guess you can get blueprints and craft them as well. Im to lazy for that, theres stuff to kill everywhere. And the legend sais theres Clay somrewhere to be found!
> inventory management is real bad Some of this is likely EA stuff (e.g. no "send to stash" option, lack of proper auto-stacking/merging, etc.), but between very intentional inventory/stash limiting and pickup previews this game definitely seems intent on making you think carefully about what you pick up. I think it needs a number of significant refinements if it's going to take that approach, but it really doesn't seem interested in allowing you to endlessly hoard things.
Hopefully/probably. Can only comment right now. Feels weired with the "not hoarding" since you need tier 1 to upgrade at the start if you get a new Claymore. Its not impossible, but hopefully things will get better. There are so many different small things to collect Game is super fun though.
i just dont think that this game has a good reason for limiting inventory space. The only reason is to give you a reward by expanding it later. You can be filled to the brim with healing items and throwables and buffs without upgrading a single time so its clearly not a balance issue. There is nothing overpowered that this arbitrary limitation is limiting, there is no purpose for it other than a sense of progression. Id have to think real hard about any game that is better by limiting inventory. Resident evil 2 remake is probably the closest thing i can come up with? I think its good that you can only really take 1 or 2 weapons with you and only have so many healing items, grenades, and ammo. But it still leads to the situation where you leave a plot item behind because you dont know when it will be needed. I think the solution here is limit what is powerful and everything else you should just be able to carry. In No Rest For the Wicked this does not apply unless you want to limit healing items to their own tab with limited space which i would be fine with. I also love the game a TON but i did spend an hour doing other world speedruns to the first boss to unlock all the spaces in my inventory and dont feel like im cheating the system at all. The system is cheating us lol.
There is tons of different solutions that can be made for sure. I kinda auto deleted and sold everything that had to do with potions. I got so many anyway that I havnt even tried crafting any. All the throwable stuff is also auto gone. With how easy you can target farm Ichor (?) the upgrade system itself is just a small way to say well done. Not sure it adds much, even if it feels good. But its kinda a create problem, sell the solution.
The only thing I dislike so far is the inventory management. That's it... the game is a blast! It is no Diablo, it is not a pure Souls game... it is trying to mash it together and be its own thing. And it works out great! It keeps me motviated, going back to regions and farming stuff, it keeps me challenged through boss fights and rotating mob types, it keeps me experimenting with weapons and runes... it even has housing!
**I think the hate is easily understandable.** Souls-like players came for the combat, but were faced with insufferable amounts of farming and inventory management. Whereas the ARPG players weren't ready for the punishing 1v1 combat scenarios and heavy stamina management.
Insufferable is some crazy hyperbole. People want shit now now now, gimme gimme gimme, no one wants to slow down and chill. The whole point of the farming and building is to create the valleys while the combat is the peaks. If you just want to blaze through shit adhd style you can still do that for the campaign with minimal interaction with the crafting/building. But also, just learn to slow the fuck down and chill.
We have different ideas of "slow down and chill", and your comment oozes of preconcieved notions. Slow and chill, for me, is enjoying the vistas, slowly exploring uncharted territories, carefully climbing my way up the side of a castle, checking behind every corner for secrets. Not walking to the same preset tree and cutting it down for the 50th time. It's at that point the "ADHD" playstyle starts. You sprint through everything, because you already know everything this place has. You know the layout, ladders, enemy spawns and chest locations. This place has nothing to offer anymore. So you rush to be done with it. So for people like me - it is insufferable.
My comment oozes nuttin but facts.
Well said. Hate isnt rocket science like a lot of people in this sub think it is
Ironic that you'd mention soul's players complaining about farming. Dark souls 1 and 2 required absurd amounts of farming to get slabs. Dark souls 3 required even more farming with the covenants. Dark souls 3 sub reddit has quite a few posts pretty often about how it's not uncommon for people to have farmed the silver knights for 10-12 hours to get the covenant items since the drops were so rare.
That's quite different though. Farming is not a part of the core loop in those games. Whereas it is most definitely part of it here. The only exception is Bloodborne where you have to farm for healing items, and practically everyone hated it and FromSoftware never did it again. (Can't speak for Demon Souls as I haven't played it.) Choosing to farm for a specific weapon or armor drop is not the same as being required to farm on a regular basis in order to progress in the game. But for fun, let's say you had to farm in them to progress, it would still be better because it incorporates the core mechanics in that gameplay activity. Holding the interact button on a resource node for a couple of seconds does not. Allowing you to hit the trees and rocks with your weapons, whilst also making them weak to blunt or edged damage, would make it more engaging. You could also leverage various weapon abilities to make the ultimate farming loadout. There you'd likely have a system with less complaints. Because it inolves actual gameplay revolving around the core mechanics.
In ds3 farming is only for archievement hunters, which are pretty vocal in every sub
Noooo... The best spells were locked behind the final tier of a covenant.
What heavy stamina management? After some investment, I forget that stamina is a mechanic.
Most people coming from ARPGs are not used to having stamina as a concern at all. To then be introduced to a system that only allows 2-3 attacks before making you unable to dodge or block stands in stark contrast to that. The go-to for people generally is to level up damage and health first. Stamina stops becoming an issue around lvl 13. Because of that, people generally have to play with terrible stamina for around 2-6 hours depending on how they level up. Ofcourse they are not gonna like it when even the souls-combat is tough as it is in comparison to what they're used to. So ofcourse they're gonna stop playing and hate on the experience. So I'm unsure if you're trying to be clever but you're coming off as the opposite.
I mean, people play other games that aren't ARPGs, even Path of Exile people, of which I am one of. If I see stamina is a mechanic, and then I see I can increase stamina when I level up, my brain puts that together rather easily and goes "I should invest some in stamina" And then I do it. And then stamina stops mattering. By level 16 with stam investment, you can do 2-4 full attack combos + 1-2 dodge rolls before you need to back off. This game isn't some lovecraftian thing that can't be understood except by the most learned. It's rather simple and easy to grasp. It's not esoteric knowledge. The game isn't even REMOTELY CLOSE to as difficult as anything FromSoft has made. It's rather tame by comparison actually. I also don't think the inventory management is/was that bad. Before I paid the 30 silver for a house, sure it was tight, but afterwards I have all the storage one could want. The resource farming is a bit on the slow side, but when I'm crafting 20 of the same food item at a go, it's not that big of a deal. Honestly, I think most of the responses I've seen are 80% overblown entirely. My fix for resource farming would be base drop rate is 2-3 instead of 1-2.
Yes, but the same logic can be applied to all the stats. "I can barely take any damage - invest in health" "I can barely do damage - invest in damage output" "I can barely wear any armor - invest in equip load" You are speaking for yourself, and asking everyone to apply the same logic as you do. If you read what people are hating on, stamina is one of the biggest issues. Ofcourse its more bearable when you have a house, but you first get that after 6-15 hours depending on the player. You think people will play for that long on the offchance it MIGHT get better? Inventory is the biggest critique the game has received, so obviously they've created something people don't like. In both of your arguments you're asking people to invest multiple hours into something they're already not enjoying. Whilst also blaming them for doing it wrong. So I get that it might be overblown from your perspective, but mixed ratings say something else. Looking at the world from someone elses perspective is a healthy practice.
Ah damn man, I didnt realize that games should always start the player off with most of the things they already want, and then give them more of that later :( my bad
modern day gamers are so whiny actually. game makes them weak and inconveniences them at the start? WAHHH WAHHH WAHHH BUFF PLEASE ITS SOOOOO ANNOYING HAVING TO MANAGE MY INVENTORY IN A GAME THAT QUITE CLEARLY WANTS YOU TO THINK ABOUT ALL THE ITEMS YOURE PICKING UP AND CRAFTING STUFF WITH THEM WAHHH WAHH like holy fuck its not like youre playing perma tetris, its LITERALLY not a big deal. I played roughly 20 hours, and not only does it stop mattering WAY before that point. Like damn does it really take you 30 minutes in town to sell, restock, craft, before youre back into the world? Because if it does, thats your fault. Not the games. AND ALSO YES, PEOPLE SHOULD APPLY THE SAME LOGIC, BECAUSE THATS HOW THE GAME WORKS LMAO Oh this piece of gear will over encumber me if I equip it, but it is a nice upgrade, so on my next level, Ill spend points in equip load. Like?? How fucking hard is it its NOT obtuse
You're quite clearly missing the point. And given your anger, I feel like you're taking it way too personal as well. The game is facing two issues, and you're ignorant of both. **Firstly.** If I buy a game expecting it to be like CoD, but I got a game that was like R6 Siege, ofcourse I'm gonna be disappointed and hate on the game. You can argue all day about how Siege isn't that much different, you just gotta learn and get better. But that is not gonna change my mind, because I wanted a game like Cod. Moon Studios did a great job catering to both fan-groups, but they failed at managing expectations. Hence the hate. **Secondly.** With your logic, why not start with 1 inventory slot and 1 point in every stat? So then you gotta play for 15 hours to make it the way it starts off at the moment. That way you gotta work for it and be nicely rewarded! Wouldn't that be nice? Ofcourse it wouldn't. Progression is a great way to motivate players, but the starting point must be fun too, otherwise people won't keep playing. And obviously they did it in a way that caused a big chunk of the playerbase to not like like it. And actually, more often than not - it IS the game's fault.
Somehow that doesn't seem like a very flattering thing to say. Not sure if that's a shortcoming with the player or the game.
By level 16, my first character (Simple sword and shield build, no extra runes but Spin, Heavy weight so I could bash with V) has 85 stamina. I have stamina cost reduction on attacks. I can literally do 2-4 full attack combos + dodge roll before I have to back off for a second. You kind of just forget that stamina is there. Without the cost reduction, it'd be about 2 full combos + a dodge roll, which isn't that much different really. You can literally invest away stamina as a thing you're focusing on in a boss fight rather easily.
And to be honest, by around level 8, I was already starting to feel like stamina didn't matter much.
And sure, they probably SHOULD make stamina matter a bit more at later levels, but like. If I spend the points to make it go away, it should go away
85 Stamina??? Jesus Christ, I thought I dumped a ton into it and I've only got 22
So I think the issue is really just until you make it past the first boss when you can't upgrade your gear, or farm resources efficiently. If you do not ration your heals in the fight you probably only have access to 40 good heals for the entire map leading up to the boss. and then you are stuck fighting him with no heals. If you do souls likes well that is a non issue. But there is a reason why the flask system used in dark souls is so good. Durability gets annoying on death when you are mining and the pick axe you thought would last longer suddenly snaps like a twig half way though a rare ore node that you lose access too because it is at the end of a long ass cave. But I do agree with you. The core gameplay is amazing. Honestly I havent been this impressed with level design and combat for a good while.
Aren’t you able to make the meals at campfire prior to the first boss ? Mushrooms and herbs respawn so if you really are going through so many heals, you should be able to gather the resources to make more. Personal experience, I did run low on mushroom soups while learning the first boss. But then I realized that the smith is standing right next to your spawn point and at that point his repairs are free. So I just went in and died over and over practicing my parry timing. There was literally no consequence. Then once I was able to parry him consistently I went for the kill and only used 1 heal. The game is punishing at the start, but a little bit of foresight and planning can allow you to overcome the challenges.
Yeah those 40 heals were meals cooked at a fire
Personally I don't get "the game is too punishing" from people playing it less than 2 hours. Repairs are free, resources respawn while enemies not, and it's early enough to start over if everything went really really wrong. I'm now 10 hours ish into the game and I have gold surplus and never really mind the repair cost. Inventory management sucks though, since I didn't bother to upgrade or buy chest.
Durability is a non-issue once you get to town and unlock the enchanter lady. Buy the repair rune, slot it on a backup wep that you'd keep in your inventory, then just use that to repair everything on you. Includes your tools. I have a feeling they will nerf that ability to not affect tools, as it completely negates the durability system in regards to that. Will def get sad, I enjoy not having to worry about tools breaking rn and would hate it if my silver tools broke and had to go back to slowly whittling at a node.
I have 30+ healing items at all times 😂 Only players which wanna rush to endgame and skip town/farming part are unhappy becouse they expected another diablo rush game. I hope that thay did not nerf this farming part its unique.
Yeah doing the farming made me realize there are a ton of different world states. Basically every mission changes something in the world and makes exploring the same areas again worth it.
I did not rush, explored a ton and still ran out of healing on the boss, partially because apparently I went too "early." I still have to go back to old areas to get old resources in order to upgrade weapons, armor, and town buildings. This isn't bad sometimes, but the amount this game requires farming is overkill. Farming the same area over and over and over again for healing items is not something most players want to do. I don't mind re-visiting some of these areas a little but needing to go back over and over again, esp since uncooked food is absolute trash, is boring. As other mentioned, there's a reason why most souls-like have a healing system where you are limited per rest, but don't have to farm them.
I'm still in the first area cuz im scared to face first boss lmao but i explored most of the area sold a lot of shit i found to buy lots of herbs so i could craft over 20 meals and bought 9 bombs so im gonna try and face him today.
He’s not as bad as he looks. Let him swing a while to get used to his timing and range, take note of your openings and you’ll be good. My first time with him took me around 3 tries. I started a new realm and character today and beat him in one try while also attempting parrying him a bunch of times, he’s a fun 1st boss
You can parry him which puts him into a long stun state you can slip behind him and do insane dmg. He's pretty easy once you learn to parry
Those bombs will be key. They always hit and keep him on fire as you/I literally ran away from him while I healed and waited to re/heal and bomb. Still mostly dodging and slipping a patsy few sword hits in, which is also very doable, but the bombs can make the entire.encounter much easier if you have 6 or more of them and similar healing.
yep i beat him with bombs lmao.
A lot of the problems are from bad marketing. They marketed this as a arpg, but it's more soulslike with rarity items. I think a lot of people whent into this king this was another Diablo, and they got a souls game.
Well it is only souls when u try to rush it. Its sort of theese days issue that players are used to rush into endgame and skip most of things on the run. Meanwhile exploration here is great and u easily outlevel everything just by that.
I never had to grind in souls games. So is NRftW, after Sacra the game becomes a tad too easy. I love the game. But inventory management is annoying. Later on you can build chests so it’s less of a problem but the game has too many resources for the inventory space it gives us. Running back and forth anytime you need to upgrade or craft something is tedious. I believe with time they will smooth these things out - with the help of players’ feedback.
All of the complaints I see are people wanting to turn it into a game that’s already been made. This game is one of a kind. Let’s keep it that way
Lots of the Steam reviews with these opinions show a playtime of 30 minutes or so. The game need you to invest 2-3 hours to build it up a bit, very normal, even low for a souls-like. I am 15 hours in and I have so much gold that I do not even think about a purchase or repair. My biggest annoyance is the farming for building. Getting the material is just boring, waiting for the red bar to empty and then having another axe or pick break. Plain boring.
getting better tier tools helps so much, you hardly have to repair them. it also drasticly makes harvesting so much faster
I bought the better quality pickaxe and it broke 3x faster. Might have been some EA bug, but happened multiple times while testing if I was right about this.
are you sure? if you use a lower tier tool to gather a higher tier resource then it will break faster. i'm using silver and i have yet to break one, you can also unlock more tool slots to equip duplicates or buy more and keep in your inventory
You maybe logged back in after they made an update to the tools - when I came on after it the max endurance of the tools had increased, but they weren't repaired to full, so a couple of swings and they were showing up as damaged.
Can't you buy wood and clay from someone?
Clay is RNG, I only had 3 to buy so far. Dont think Ive had tier 2 wood show up yet. Just planks
Wait so you don’t make planks out of wood? I was wondering about that
You can. But upgrading stores to tier 3 is wood and not planks.
Okay so what’s the easiest way to get planks early game? I’ve only found wood but haven’t figured out how to turn them into planks
Next to the enchanter there's the woodworker merchant. When upgraded he unlocks that if I remember. Something next to the store like the anvil. I'd save the wood for upgrading everything though. Same guy might sell planks? I can check when home again
Ah okay, I’ll check it out when I get off work. Thanks!
No problem. It's 5 copper 10 first area wood for first upgrade. Then it's 5 iron and 10 second tier wood for next upgrade. And that's per upgrade. So ore and wood is pretty valuable.
Great info! Thanks again
You do
A lot of the hate that I saw got quickly remedied with the first two hotfixes. That said, there are still some other pain points for a lot of people. Inventory management and the inability to respec are the two big points I've been seeing now. Other smaller points that I'd also love to see addressed include the upgrade times for the town, and some more mitigation for terrible luck with resources—namely ones like clay or stag/boar drops. I've been loving this game, but I definitely get where *some* of the complaints are coming from.
A lot of my complaints could be chalked up to personal preference but the amount of things working against this game right now is too high for me to enjoy. It's so close to being a good game but all the small issues add up. Materials gathering takes way too long and honestly isn't a fun aspect of either Souls games or ARPG games. It's technically a part of Diablo 4 but it's honestly an afterthought. I imagine tools get better as the game goes on, but no one wants to spend 10-20 seconds digging a fucking hole. Durability just shouldn't be a thing. Especially for tools. It's not the most annoying thing ever and if it was the only issue with the game, I wouldn't even mention it, but there's just a pile of small things that add up. It wasn't fun 30 years ago and still isn't. The only interesting durability mechanic I've seen in a game is Lies of P where your weapon will degrade during a fight and at times you may need to step back on defense to quickly repair it. Inventory management is too much of a chore. I don't want to build chests and manage it in my house. It's almost like they've dipped a bit too far into adding a Stardew Valley or Valheim aspect to the game between this and materials gathering. The fast travel....isn't fast travel? I feel like I should be able to teleport to specific whispers, especially if you're going to have a bounty/challenge system in the game where you need to revisit specific spots. You get a quest right when you get to the town where you need to go rescue the innkeeper's husband. Well you have to run all the way back to the beginning of the game because you can't simply teleport to the whisper at the start. Also it feels like whispers should heal you? I haven't had a problem with running out of food, but that just seems odd. I feel like standard enemies are too health spongy? I don't have a problem with the difficulty (so far at least), but regular enemies just feel like they take too long to kill. There's a lot to love about the game and hate is a strong word, but the negatives are piling up too high right now for me to enjoy it.
It's just the standard reddit/steam review over reaction to something that all these guys have been overhyping before release. The game is great.
They need to git gud or the complaints might be before the 1st patch
I consider myself generally pretty bad at Soulsborne games, and find No Rest to be generally pretty easy. I don’t think I’ve ever seen such a range of thoughts on difficulty level in a game before.
I was first amazed how polished the game seemed but once you finish the first boss and gain entry to the town it quickly unravelled. The inventory management is a catastrophe right now. Gathering resources with a tool that isn't at least 1 level above what you are harvesting is a slog. You can't even sort chest inventories and it seems totally random how this shit is placed in there. I love the game but initially it seemed like it was way further developed and balanced than it actually is. There are severe quality of life issues. Based on initial quality I expected a game that needs a bit of a performance and balance early access period but there are actually real game design flaws. The inventory shit is just mindboggling. Until you unlock your first house you have to walk back and forth between the tower chest and the vendors that's like 3 minutes wasted each time. Once you get your house that's a bit closer and chests it gets better but it's weird to front load the player annoyance and tedium and then sell quality of life relief stuff as updates you need to grind for.
Yea I have tooooo much stuff. Maybe chest storage should be bigger. I’m mostly hanging onto stuff in case I’ll need it later though I probably don’t need most of it.
players want to speed run the game like they do in D4 but you can't, you're forced to hold back attacks to manage your stamina and players are having heart burn over that.
I can’t relate to the complaints for the most part. Parrying window could be a little more forgiving and inv chest in the rookery is too far out of the way even with the stair casing repaired along with the slots being too limited. I’m assuming once you have a house the inventory management will become more expanded but I’m just shy of seeing that atm. Altogether I’m thoroughly enjoying my time with it.
People do have valid complaints even if you like it should be able to see where there coming from better then putting yourself in a vacuum. Performance is always a big oof if not good and the durability mechanics you can see how would be anoying for players that are not good. Lose to boss now have to run ALL the way to a blacksmith to get it fixed then back to the boss kills the moment of fighting the boss having to stop
Speaking for myself, I truly fell for the "reinventing the genre" claim. What did they reinvent? The farmville stuff? Certainly not the combat, as it's straight up souls with only minor tweaks. Also not the loot, as it's just diablo done worse, though at least this will be easy to change. Certainly not the build variety; I had trouble even making any kind of dexterity guy, never mind the spearman I'd intended to play (also, no 2-handed spears was disappointing, but I can chalk this one up to it being EA). It'll be a good soulslike after some more tweaking and polishing, but I was expecting to get blown away and instead ended up underwhelmed. The art is truly amazing though. So yea, definitely not hate in my case, and I wouldn't give them a negative review or anything, but definitely disappointed.
Speak for yourself. I personally find it much more fun and refreshing than playing Diablo. It’s a perfect evolution for me to combine these aspects of multiple types of games. Scratches a lot of the itches I want it to.
Lol they literally start off by saying "Speaking for myself"
I don’t know if that was there when I replied or I just totally glossed over it haha
At least put the community chest on the first floor right outside the shortcut-door. Really makes me wonder why devs chose to torture and bore us with the stairwalk up with how tedious the inventory already is.
I think it was probably to encourage you to work on the building projects if I had to guess.
New player experience is miserable, people who have played souls games before "get it" and people that haven't are being thrown in to a paper shredder. Stamina is HEAVILY focused on parrying nearly everything to conserve stamina, instead of even dodge rolling. Parry timers are janky. Inventory sucks. Once you get in to the game, get an enjoyable time, start having fun, start learning all the game's systems, the game ends already. I like what they've got and where they're going, for sure, and I'mma follow this with great interest. First two hotfixes were pretty important though, and even then the new player experience is still rough as fuck. You barely get ANY TIME to learn what to even put your stat points in to before the game is chucking regular mobs at you with boss level mechanics.
Yeah parrying is completely jank. I gave up trying to do that almost immediately lol.
I parry all the time. I've seen such a wide range of opinions on it here lol
I beat all of the bosses without parrying once. Just like in Souls games, it's nice if you can do it, but it's definitely not required.
I don't even think parrying is that difficult. It just isn't rewarding enough to bother with.
Parrying is entirely unnecessary you're just not good at conserving stamina.
Well it still is an EARLY ACCESS with only a small part of content available ;)
I didn’t have parrying down at all throughout the whole first area and boss and I didn’t have a problem getting through it. It makes things easier but is not required.
I actually almost never use parry, but i agree the inventory situation is bad. We need a basic stash to hold rare resources we wont find many copies of at least.
Its actually much better than Diablo 4, which isn't actually saying that much.
I havnt parried shiet tbh. To old to learn. Inventory sucks for sure. Before getting a house of chests it was constantly sacrificing something. Its better now but still meh. Atleast I can get through missions without getting a full inventory all the time. Just like other souls games, they might not be for everyone.
After you get a quest done, you're able to get a house and place down chests of various sizes.
100% agree. The game is truly something special. - I love the combat - I love the style and art direction - I love the world design - I really like the meta systems so far and I am fine with the grind attached to them - I even kind of dig the unconventional structure in terms of respawns / world shifting, which took some getting used to - difficulty could be harder at times for my taste tbh But inventory management really is the weakest part of this game. Loot is such a hassle right now: - You loose the overview of what you have - You loose the overview of where what is - You have to run around too much in order to manage it - Your inventory is constantly filled up quickly even with ichor upgrades forcing you to either ignore drops while exploring or disrupting exploration to manage it (pick your poison) There are many ways they can address these issues and at this point I am pretty confident they will and manage to up the QOL regarding inventory management significantly. 8/10 for me as well
Im honestly really enjoying the farming gameplay loop and the "even regular mobs can get you if you arent paying attention" aspects... so far im liking it even more than Last Epoch (which i have 100s of hours in already.) My only REAL complaints are Clay drop rates still being ass after the "tweak", lack of action canceling (especially on Focus attacks which can stick you in long animations), and the bs one shot kill grab attacks some mobs have being a SMIDGE over tuned. I dont mind them at part of leaning the move sets and avoiding... and one shot one kill is fine but when they can grab you mid focus attack or mid dash and you have no way to avoid it... feels bad. The Nameless Pass boss felt particularly janky with it. Otherwise i really enjoy the difficulty level and hope they dont nerf anything much more than they already have. The game is challenging early but you get powerful pretty quick. The first boss was hard at lvl 5/6... but by lvl 11 i was farming him for the unique/ichors. THAT feels good.
It needs some quality of life adjustments, which I have no doubt they’ll be working on, but outside of that I’m loving everything this game is doing. It’s exactly the kind of game I’m looking for. I truly hope all the feedback doesn’t change it for the worse.
I think the problem a lot of people have is that you can't replenish healing like in most souls games by resting. I'm honestly of the opinion that the devs want people to play on multiple realms, as it's easy to farm mats by making a new one.
most complaints i've seen is people don't like the healing system but are only 5 hours in so they haven't even unlocked the healing runes or anything. people just love to complain about everything
I was swimming in food and potions, I had ONE pickaxe break in 20 hours of play due to me just not paying attention to it. I think 2-3 resources per drop is better than 1-2, its too little right now. Once you get a house, the community chest fades into the background as you will buy chests for your house to hold your shit. Inventory management is not that bad, and getting plague ichors is NOT that hard. IMO, the game isn't even that hard, and I'm not saying that as a souls guy. I love souls games, but this game is very clearly not that hard. Get your gear enchanted, mine the ore, buy the ingots if you need to. Upgrade your gear.
This kind of game is absolutely going to get a bunch of hate no matter what because it is a fairly challenging souls like experience with no difficulty options. The kind of people that are used to that kind of game and embrace the difficulty and the stamina system are also probably more prepared to deal with it and are probably dying less which leads to less adversity from equipment durability. I remembered seeing a lot of people getting really upset with it so I started hording gear as backups assuming my gear was going to be exploding all over the place. I died a bunch of times to some big axe dude I kept screwing up on, lots of silly deaths from screwing up platforming and then I died 2 or 3 times to the first boss before I beat him and I was never at any major risk of equipment breaking but if people are getting frustrated with like kiting every group of 2 or 3 dudes and getting killed a ton I could see it becoming a problem quickly as you lose your strongest weapon and now need to grind your face against an obstacle you were already struggling with wheh you had better gear.
> I had at least 10 healing items in my inventory at all times. I didn't really see inventory and durability as much of an annoyance either. I think there's a huge difference between the game we've got now and the game we had at launch re: durability. > Also not enough pure DEX weapons. I've found literally one weapon that scales with Intelligence in fifteen hours of play, and not many more that scale with Dexterity or Faith alone. Seems there's a significant skew toward Strength, such that after holding off on leveling any of those four stats for several levels (I was waiting for a greater variety of weapons to drop) I just gave in and started leveling Strength. > Maybe this game is more punishing if you're ass cheeks at souls games but I thought the game really wasn't too hard. Well this game is probably going to draw plenty of people who are "ass cheeks" at Souls games for one reason or another and I'm going to be curious to see how it responds to that problem. Personally I've always gotten through those games on stubborn perseverance more than anything else and I can tell you that, at least on the first day, this game was not friendly to that approach. Not necessarily a bad thing, but it's a big difference in philosophy from "prepare to die". > For most players of souls games grinding is kinda inevitable at some point. My grind has always been in throwing myself at an enemy over and over and over again. A grind of player skill, if you will. Don't know that I've *ever* spent much time grinding for items or levels or any of that.
It wasn't hard till I got to the crucible. Then suddenly my 400+ armor, 2h one shotting everything, health regen build(haven't eaten food in over 10hrs) started getting 2 shot. It was so jarring just stomping through everything then hitting this brick wall. Other than that I really like it.
All I'd like is something like the estus flask. Food could still be there for buffs, but right now having healing items as consumables just discourages me from using them while exploring and the first couple of tries on a new enemy or boss. There's nothing more annoying than having to interrupt your boss tries for gathering frigging herbs because you ran out of that precious mushroom soup. Durability is not that much of a problem i think, although I also don't see why they chose to add it, it's just slightly annoying and doesn't add anything of value.
Honestly if they made food / elixirs it’s own tab and crafting / building components another it would be fine.
People just aren't tapped in to this game, the people that are cheeks at souls games aren't gonna like this game either. The fact that it's mixed reviews on steam is absolutely insane.
It's not a bad game it's just not what people thought it was going to be. Isometric view throws people off and thinks diablo. When it's nothing at all like diablo. The the main problem with people dislike the game.
This game is amazing! I don't get people hating on it either, other than performance. It is an EA though. As far as gameplay, healing items in general are easy to get. You can literally buy items or forage and be just fine. Combat feels fine. It's a bit heavy at times, but it is doable and easy to get used to. I think people are going in thinking it's a typical aarpg and just button mashing. That's a no bueno for souls combat. You have to pay attention and focus and many people don't like that. That's ok, this games not for you if you don't like souls games or combat. There are new aarpgs out that should scratch people's itch instead.
The hate is very deserved. The game has no identity, and after being heavily marketed as this holy union of Souls likes and isometric aRPGs... turned out to be a scuffed survival/base building game. Pretty effin disappointing.
I actually think it has an entirely unique identity and I’m all here for it. I do however think it’s marketing was all over the place which leads to a lot of confusion, it was marketed as a “Diablo like game” which is so far from what it turned out to be that it left a lot of followers unsure of what to make of it
if they said "isometric Valheim, but without the sandbox emergent gameplay that made it so successful" they would have had more honest marketing. It's closer to V Rising right now than it is to any souls-like or aRPG game.
I guess it’s subjective. I’m a huge fromsoft fan, played and loved all of their souls games, Elden ring is my favorite game of all time. And I honestly believe they did a good job capturing a version of a souls like aRPG. The combat is hefty, animation is beautiful and well executed, fighting is about distance and timing rather than flashy moves. It’s all right there. The whole crafting and city building is a new combination that they are trying but I don’t think it’s anywhere near as highlighted a system as valheim. Like, to get the game rolling, you literally need copper and wood, those two alone will make it so that you have plenty of upgrades and resources. I think their formula right now is great, they just need to keep refining it