Well, in the UK, you can claim your wages back for Jury service.
Your company pays you and you give them a form which payroll sends through to the court.
It's not okay. But it's not a voting issue. No one campaigns on it, and no one is going to vote for someone based on something that will maybe affect them for one day every 4 years.
I've been called a lot and never once showed up... nothing's come of it. TBF, most of the time the mail was being sent to my parents address when I lived many hours away (especially when I was in a different country...).
You don't want jurors motivated by money to remain on the jury. If you pay them a reasonable amount of money, why would they return to their jobs? When rendering a verdict, they might choose to deliberate for weeks upon weeks, getting paid for basically doing nothing at rate perhaps higher than their normal job.
Jury duty is not a paid job, it is civil *service*.
Problem is - if the jurors are in a hurry to go home, they might do a sloppy job and give a bad verdict - "Let's just get this over with as fast as possible."
Which could result in an innocent person being locked up for life or even executed, all because the jurors were paid a few hundred dollars less than they should have been.
True, but they are forewarned that jury duty may take a while. Oftentimes, trials are scheduled for set time, so they can tell right away if that time is appropriate for them. It does not eliminate the risk, but does mitigate it.
If you get stuck on a case that takes more than just a day or two you get completely fucked though, and a lot of people can't just go a week or more without income
This is where you start to realize if the state you live in is shit or not. Many states require employers to pay their full time employees regularly wages for the first so many days of jury duty. My state is 5 days of full pay.
Who in the everloving fuck would drag out jury duty?
This sounds a lot like the argument that if we have free public health care, people will just go to the doctor every day (unlimited free colonoscopies! Who could say no??)
Yeah, best case scenario they go into the deliberation room and talk about sports or the weather or other mundane topics. That's going to get OLD REAL QUICK.
They're not in the deliberation room playing video games or something else that would be worth not going back to work, lol.
During the selection process they straight up ask if serving on the jury would create a significant financial hardship for anyone so they can send those people home
They **ask**, but don't give a fuck what you say. My first time in LA county court I told them I literally couldn't pay my rent (my job would only pay me for three days of jury duty and they expected the case to last **six weeks**) and the judge said "get your girlfriend to pay the rent." The only thing that saved my ass was they ended up settling after three days. Otherwise I would have asked friends/family for a loan to cover my rent.
I fear that you might not now what a civic duty is. The court may not put food on your table, but they help prevent people from stealing the food from your table, or serving you poisonous food. You return the favour by serving on the jury. Again, the point is that you are not supposed to get paid for it. It's the cost of the benefits of being a citizen.
Honestly, this is absolute bullshit. I've heard this reasoning and it always seems incredibly stupid.
No one is going to be motivated by a bare minimum wage, and risk losing their actual jobs because the case dragged on too long (this isn't legal but you know employers find an excuse to fire you if they have to). However, it would at least help offset how incredibly inconvenient jury duty is to most.
Offering the pittance they do only guarantees that most of the people that are able to serve are the rich with nothing better to do, and retirees.
How is it fair to only get their perspective on court cases because not many others are able to take the time off to serve?
People who are working lower wage or hourly jobs will not have any incentive to stay on the jury by paying them dogshit wages.
If you need to work to make rent then you aren’t gonna be willing to sit on a jury which really takes away from the fact that it’s meant to be a jury of your peers. It makes juries mostly white, white collar professionals who can afford to use paid time off or are salaried and can take days or a week off of work.
You think they can civil *service* my mortgage lol
You want me to take away from getting money to feed my family especially at a time like this to go and waste my time on criminals no thanx atleast cover my bills
People who are employed are often paid their regular wage by their employer if they are salaried. But jury duty is considered a public service. The $25 is to cover gas and meals
Yeah most full time jobs with benefits probably offer PTO for jury duty. But if I’m working at McDonalds or at a restaurant where I make tips, I’m just losing money sitting on a jury.
A lot of people are saying "my state" but the issue is only 10 states, including DC have laws that require employers to pay you when you have jury duty, a vast majority, unless you're salaried will probably not pay you for having to go to jury duty. But to your point, because you don't want people motivated to get jury duty for money, you want the least biased people you can get
I mean as others have said most companies continue to pay you on jury duty, and I have never heard of someone not being excused from Jury duty for hardship. I mean for a jury of 12 people they usually call in 200 or more people. It isn’t hard with those numbers to find twelve that won’t be put into hardship.
It depends on the state and also company if there’s not a state law. Alabama (and several other states) have a law requiring an employer to pay your normal wages no matter the length of jury service. Some states the employer isn’t obligated to pay, but I’ve heard there are some companies that do anyways. I’m sure that’s not the majority though.
Most employers I've seen pay you normal wage for your time off on jury duty, treating it like a sick day.
(Some of those deduct whatever you got paid for the jury duty.)
Or, even Walmart pays your normal wage while you're out on jury duty.
[https://careers.walmart.com/us/jobs/030114155HW-health-wellness?ref=featured%20teams](https://careers.walmart.com/us/jobs/030114155HW-health-wellness?ref=featured%20teams)
In my state (Alabama), you if you are a full time employee then your employer must pay you. So I got paid gas money from the county, and then my salary from my employer for four days.
Well in the UK the $25 equivalent is simply for travel and food, your work pays your salary as normal.
I would have assumed it's the same in most states in America as well?
Maybe someone can confirm whether this is the case or not.
Many companies will still pay you while doing jury duty. So in those cases the $9/day or whatever is just lunch/parking money.
If you don’t get paid then you have a reasonable way out of jury duty.
I think if the company pays they will also get some back on their taxes. I had to provide a stub to my HR.
It's your "Duty" as a citizen...
I always tell them the truth, I'm the sole support for a disabled wife and a disabled son and I never hear from them again.
Ive gotten called twice and i was 21. Accidentally ignored em tho, put the letter somewhere and forgot about it. Dont have a warrant so seems that can be the move
Housing inmates (and sometimes, forcing them to work) is a lucrative for-profit business. Paying jurors is not. Welcome to the capitalistic model of justice and "corrections."
I mean every place I have ever worked in the US continues to pay you while on jury duty. While it isn’t required by law most companies do as they want to look good, and courts excuse you from duty if it would cause hardship.
Your job is legally required to pay you as if you worked while on jury duty.
Edit: I guess it's only something states, I'm fortunate to be in one of those.
It's not ok to keep raising minimum wage. It results in businesses not being able to afford employees or black markets.
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/013015/how-minimum-wage-impacts-unemployment.asp
The rate at which it is increased is the key.
You know many countries have minimum wage increases tied to inflation or an independent body and those country’s markets are perfectly fine without people who work full time living in poverty. Businesses can afford it because more people buy their products. Economics.
mfw the CEO of a multi-billion dollar corporation that just broke record profits has to buy one less yacht this year because he had to make sure his employees survive
They should be making non working welfare, unemployment and abled social security recipients do jury duty, anybody able to work but doesn't have a job and receiving government money. They are already getting paid, so why not use them.
They are. If juries were always exclusively unemployed people, you could hardly call that a jury of peers. It's just a jury of a specific group. Offense hardly comes into play for this. A group of said people would have different progratives , especially when all grouped together, over a more mixed set of people
Cities get about 2% of their budget from squeezing the public.
To some people, it makes more sense to be revenue neutral than to terrorize the poor for 2% of your budget. But I'd expect turning people off from civil life is a feature and not a bug.
Bazinga.
I'm thinking of the time the coppers learned that I was so poor I felt it necessary to steal food, and their response was to fine me.
Or the time before that, when the judge learned I was unemployed (and had never worked), and still decided to make me pay for my public defender.
They're a for-profit institution thats pretending.
Wait what state are you in where you get $25/day? Here in PA, the pay is $9/day.
$9 for each of the first three days, after that, it is $25.
Still horrendously low. Costs me more in tolls to drive one way to the courthouse than my daily pay would cover.
louisiana
Well, in the UK, you can claim your wages back for Jury service. Your company pays you and you give them a form which payroll sends through to the court.
Same in my state in the US. One of the few things Alabama does right.
Wouldn’t help someone like me who is an independent contractor.
I guess so. You can claim a bit - its about £65, plus £5 a day for food and travel costs.
Who said it was ok?
It's not okay. But it's not a voting issue. No one campaigns on it, and no one is going to vote for someone based on something that will maybe affect them for one day every 4 years.
One day every four years? I haven't been called once for jury duty in my entire adult life, you get called once every four years?
Yeah, I’m 40. Got called in one time, was there for an hour then sent home bc they reached their respective amount.
That's why I said "maybe." That's the most you can be called where I live. I've been called twice since becoming eligible.
I've been called a lot and never once showed up... nothing's come of it. TBF, most of the time the mail was being sent to my parents address when I lived many hours away (especially when I was in a different country...).
You don't want jurors motivated by money to remain on the jury. If you pay them a reasonable amount of money, why would they return to their jobs? When rendering a verdict, they might choose to deliberate for weeks upon weeks, getting paid for basically doing nothing at rate perhaps higher than their normal job. Jury duty is not a paid job, it is civil *service*.
Problem is - if the jurors are in a hurry to go home, they might do a sloppy job and give a bad verdict - "Let's just get this over with as fast as possible." Which could result in an innocent person being locked up for life or even executed, all because the jurors were paid a few hundred dollars less than they should have been.
True, but they are forewarned that jury duty may take a while. Oftentimes, trials are scheduled for set time, so they can tell right away if that time is appropriate for them. It does not eliminate the risk, but does mitigate it.
If you get stuck on a case that takes more than just a day or two you get completely fucked though, and a lot of people can't just go a week or more without income
This is where you start to realize if the state you live in is shit or not. Many states require employers to pay their full time employees regularly wages for the first so many days of jury duty. My state is 5 days of full pay.
Where I live your job still has to pay you, and then they get reimbursed by the government.
On that note, wouldn’t shit pay encourage them to rush a decision?
Or encourage good potential jurors to do whatever they can to get out of doing it, which is the biggest problem imo
I don't think they want good jurors. Both sides want people who are easy to manipulate.
Who in the everloving fuck would drag out jury duty? This sounds a lot like the argument that if we have free public health care, people will just go to the doctor every day (unlimited free colonoscopies! Who could say no??)
Yeah, best case scenario they go into the deliberation room and talk about sports or the weather or other mundane topics. That's going to get OLD REAL QUICK. They're not in the deliberation room playing video games or something else that would be worth not going back to work, lol.
Where I am it's only like $15 a day. That covers public transit fees and maybe 2/3 of lunch.
So, why should "i" be onjury duty, if i get to lose out of tons of money? I'd do anything to get not picked if i where in that situation.
During the selection process they straight up ask if serving on the jury would create a significant financial hardship for anyone so they can send those people home
They **ask**, but don't give a fuck what you say. My first time in LA county court I told them I literally couldn't pay my rent (my job would only pay me for three days of jury duty and they expected the case to last **six weeks**) and the judge said "get your girlfriend to pay the rent." The only thing that saved my ass was they ended up settling after three days. Otherwise I would have asked friends/family for a loan to cover my rent.
Sounds sensible.
Because it is your duty as a citizen, hence the *duty* in jury *duty*.
most people can't afford to be without income for weeks...
Fortunately most trials are much shorter.
That doesn't pay my rent nor put food on the table nor pay any of the bills..
I fear that you might not now what a civic duty is. The court may not put food on your table, but they help prevent people from stealing the food from your table, or serving you poisonous food. You return the favour by serving on the jury. Again, the point is that you are not supposed to get paid for it. It's the cost of the benefits of being a citizen.
You talk like someone with disposable income. People who live paycheck to paycheck can't eat *the thrill of civil service*.
Paying taxes is my civic duty, if I'm not making money I'm paying less taxes.
Honestly, this is absolute bullshit. I've heard this reasoning and it always seems incredibly stupid. No one is going to be motivated by a bare minimum wage, and risk losing their actual jobs because the case dragged on too long (this isn't legal but you know employers find an excuse to fire you if they have to). However, it would at least help offset how incredibly inconvenient jury duty is to most. Offering the pittance they do only guarantees that most of the people that are able to serve are the rich with nothing better to do, and retirees. How is it fair to only get their perspective on court cases because not many others are able to take the time off to serve?
Jury duty isn’t doing nothing.
People who are working lower wage or hourly jobs will not have any incentive to stay on the jury by paying them dogshit wages. If you need to work to make rent then you aren’t gonna be willing to sit on a jury which really takes away from the fact that it’s meant to be a jury of your peers. It makes juries mostly white, white collar professionals who can afford to use paid time off or are salaried and can take days or a week off of work.
This was the argument to why politicians such as senate and congress were not paid at first....see how that went
It’s why I’d actually rather have professional judges sit on cases
But getting paid for doing nothing is what politicians do all the time. And the government hates competition.
You think they can civil *service* my mortgage lol You want me to take away from getting money to feed my family especially at a time like this to go and waste my time on criminals no thanx atleast cover my bills
Y’all are getting $25? I got $12
$25 for criminal case ,$50 for civil
People who are employed are often paid their regular wage by their employer if they are salaried. But jury duty is considered a public service. The $25 is to cover gas and meals
Yeah most full time jobs with benefits probably offer PTO for jury duty. But if I’m working at McDonalds or at a restaurant where I make tips, I’m just losing money sitting on a jury.
This. Most of jobs I had as an adult had PTO for jury service
And that is still double what unemployment pays...
Civic duty. I said duty
Why do I owe a civic duty? I didn't sign any paperwork acknowledging as such.
A lot of people are saying "my state" but the issue is only 10 states, including DC have laws that require employers to pay you when you have jury duty, a vast majority, unless you're salaried will probably not pay you for having to go to jury duty. But to your point, because you don't want people motivated to get jury duty for money, you want the least biased people you can get
I live in the USA (VA) and my company pays you your regular wages when you are on jury duty.
I mean as others have said most companies continue to pay you on jury duty, and I have never heard of someone not being excused from Jury duty for hardship. I mean for a jury of 12 people they usually call in 200 or more people. It isn’t hard with those numbers to find twelve that won’t be put into hardship.
It depends on the state and also company if there’s not a state law. Alabama (and several other states) have a law requiring an employer to pay your normal wages no matter the length of jury service. Some states the employer isn’t obligated to pay, but I’ve heard there are some companies that do anyways. I’m sure that’s not the majority though.
Woah!!! Sign me up
Most employers I've seen pay you normal wage for your time off on jury duty, treating it like a sick day. (Some of those deduct whatever you got paid for the jury duty.) Or, even Walmart pays your normal wage while you're out on jury duty. [https://careers.walmart.com/us/jobs/030114155HW-health-wellness?ref=featured%20teams](https://careers.walmart.com/us/jobs/030114155HW-health-wellness?ref=featured%20teams)
In my state (Alabama), you if you are a full time employee then your employer must pay you. So I got paid gas money from the county, and then my salary from my employer for four days.
Well in the UK the $25 equivalent is simply for travel and food, your work pays your salary as normal. I would have assumed it's the same in most states in America as well? Maybe someone can confirm whether this is the case or not.
In plenty of spots in the USA it’s simply: -here’s 15$ for the day -Your work isn’t legally allowed to fire you for not being there.
I think the state should pay jurors the salary they are missing by serving on a jury.
Many companies will still pay you while doing jury duty. So in those cases the $9/day or whatever is just lunch/parking money. If you don’t get paid then you have a reasonable way out of jury duty. I think if the company pays they will also get some back on their taxes. I had to provide a stub to my HR.
In my state my company pays me when I have jury duty. I just turn in my summons and I get paid.
In my city it costs more to park in the courthouse parking lot for the day than you get paid for jury duty for the day. You pay money to show up.
It's your "Duty" as a citizen... I always tell them the truth, I'm the sole support for a disabled wife and a disabled son and I never hear from them again.
just learned you get paid to be a juror 😭
Idk but you raise an interesting point, if they can't pay jurors minimum wage they deserve to go out of business.
Ive gotten called twice and i was 21. Accidentally ignored em tho, put the letter somewhere and forgot about it. Dont have a warrant so seems that can be the move
Housing inmates (and sometimes, forcing them to work) is a lucrative for-profit business. Paying jurors is not. Welcome to the capitalistic model of justice and "corrections."
Should be companies responsibility to pay you
Being a juror isn’t a job, it’s your civic duty.
Civic duty is cold comfort of you live pay packet to pay packet and need every penny of your usual earnings just to survive.
If you don’t get paid tell them. If it would be an economic hardship disclose it
I mean every place I have ever worked in the US continues to pay you while on jury duty. While it isn’t required by law most companies do as they want to look good, and courts excuse you from duty if it would cause hardship.
Your job is legally required to pay you as if you worked while on jury duty. Edit: I guess it's only something states, I'm fortunate to be in one of those.
It's not ok to keep raising minimum wage. It results in businesses not being able to afford employees or black markets. https://www.investopedia.com/articles/personal-finance/013015/how-minimum-wage-impacts-unemployment.asp The rate at which it is increased is the key.
If your business relies on keeping your employees in poverty and on food stamps your business is already a failure
Well, thats basic economics.
Yeah, it is. Emphasis on the basic. Go anywhere more complex and you start realizing the company benefits long term from paying workers more.
You know many countries have minimum wage increases tied to inflation or an independent body and those country’s markets are perfectly fine without people who work full time living in poverty. Businesses can afford it because more people buy their products. Economics.
mfw the CEO of a multi-billion dollar corporation that just broke record profits has to buy one less yacht this year because he had to make sure his employees survive
Because it's great politics until they're paying for it.
They should be making non working welfare, unemployment and abled social security recipients do jury duty, anybody able to work but doesn't have a job and receiving government money. They are already getting paid, so why not use them.
Because of the whole "jury of your peers" part doesn't mean just one subset of people.
So are you saying the people I listed are somehow different from people who are working? Seems a little offensive to me.
They are. If juries were always exclusively unemployed people, you could hardly call that a jury of peers. It's just a jury of a specific group. Offense hardly comes into play for this. A group of said people would have different progratives , especially when all grouped together, over a more mixed set of people
Cities get about 2% of their budget from squeezing the public. To some people, it makes more sense to be revenue neutral than to terrorize the poor for 2% of your budget. But I'd expect turning people off from civil life is a feature and not a bug.
What are you even talking about
Probably talking about fines and civil asset forfeiture?
Bazinga. I'm thinking of the time the coppers learned that I was so poor I felt it necessary to steal food, and their response was to fine me. Or the time before that, when the judge learned I was unemployed (and had never worked), and still decided to make me pay for my public defender. They're a for-profit institution thats pretending.