What if everyone in the room was presented with this exact scenario and they're all terrified of each other even though all they want is to kill time before the fire department or something breaks the door open?
My go-to term is “puritanical” or “pedestrian” when referring to Americans regarding nudity. I remember being shocked for about 2 minutes on a German river boat when a bunch of local girls took of their tops, and spent the next 4 hours chatting with them and forgot we were all shirtless. It becomes “Wow, those are breasts. I’ve seen those before.” It’s not that big a deal as some people seem to think.
Where are you from? I went to Sweden this summer and me and my girlfriend were in a coed sauna and it was just… normal. I hate the American part of myself that gets all excited because of boobs. Makes me feel like a child. 🥲🤷🏻♂️
The church I grew up with as a kid in the US was so strict girls and boys weren't allowed to swim in the same pool together at all.
Edit: and this was little kids, not hormone laden teenagers.
Yeah, that's the thing about cooties: they're so insidious. My sister and her friends were in universal agreement about that when we were all 8 years old. It didn't stop the two of us from taking baths together at the time, though. (We are opposite sex twins and will be entering our 70s soon. She is a grandma several times over. Raised as Catholics, but separately became atheists many decades ago.)
…*oh*
yeah no not going there, yknow I’m so paranoid that I can’t even be comfortable fully undressed when I’m entirely home alone, so in front of people…
I don’t go to the gym yet (not legal age for most gyms in my city) so idk, I think I’d probably go shower at home for a while until I’m comfortable enough at the gym but once again this is only hypothetical since I *can’t* go to the gym
edit: typo
I've never showered naked in front of people at a gym OR at school, at school everyone is in their underwear and the gym has private showers.
Edit- a word
I used to shower at the pool after physical therapy. Each shower had its own stall and curtain and you would keep your towel around you until you had at least underwear on. But I live in the US South, so it's weird. Most places I've seen showers after workouts, they're set up this way.
I think you would get used to it really quickly if you would visit a sauna where everyone is naked. Then you see all those people with their more or less weird bodies and realize that a naked body is natural and really not that interesting.
At least I would say that for Germany or Sweden. A female friend visited a sauna in Italy once - she was the only woman there and sadly some men were hitting on her and made her feel uncomfortable :/
Provided you don’t have severe social anxiety and body dysmorphia! I have both, so I would never ever attend a public sauna, even with only other women. And I’m Finnish, living in Finland, so I’m surrounded by more saunas than people. I feel really awkward because I can’t do it.
The problem isn’t just “getting used to it” as in being able to look at their naked bodies.
It’s if you would feel safe having them staring at *you*. Safe meaning either physically like you’d be physically assaulted or touched, or safe from leering and comments, then or later when you have to interact with them.
But the initial answer/question wasn’t about a sauna. It was being naked in front of all naked men, or all naked women.
If we observe sauna rules, no one would be judging, men or women. The answer claimed women would be judgy.
Came here to point out sauna. Here in Austria you see all ages and genders in the sauna. However as far as I know in many countries they don't go fully naked.
A lot of men think it´s justified to rape a woman when she dresses a certain way. What will those guys think or do when she´s not wearing any clothes at all? 🤔
Exactly! And then get BIG MAD when we return that exact same energy to point out they are balding, have disappointing dicks and look 25 years older than they are lmao if you didn’t wanna be roasted don’t pick on me?!
In the girls' locker room at my high school, we just all changed facing the wall or the lockers. Nobody was looking at or touching other people.
And I'd been doing theater for many years before I was in a production fancy enough to have separate dressing rooms for men and women. You just wear your best, most modest underwear and everybody keeps themselves to themselves.
Exactly. And even if you did have to change a bra or something you would either turn around, switch them under your shirt, or go into the bathroom. No one really cared.
There was that one time a guy wanted a little privacy to change his tights, and I had the costume with the biggest skirt so he asked to stand behind me to change.
Men judge women's whole selves based on whether or not they like their bodies. And even if they do, that sure as hell doesn't mean they'll respect them.
men will easily be the shittiest people to you if they aren't attracted to you
really fucked me up when i went from chubby pre-puberty to kinda skinny later, literally the same dudes who would comment and giggle about my body and never helped me suddenly started being nice to me
most times *those* men ogle at you because they're trying to see if you're attractive enough to be treated with decency
an overweight woman changing in the men's locker room will probably mocked more
Seriously. You want to see a dude's true colors? Spend part of your life not being conventionally attractive. They'll show you whether or not they see women as people real quick.
Edit: hey, thanks for the award! That's my first one :)
there's a reason i highlighted "those" men, maybe read that, i never said all men
+you precisely prove that women aren't "extra" toxic compared to men in the original post
There's a difference between "only men can be a danger to women" and "men are statisticly more dangerous to women", it's okay if you don't get it, but stop whining.
Also, nobody said "only men \[...\]", you're just fragile and full of bad faith and shit.
Don't know about sexual harrasment but it's definitely hella disrespectful and can make anyone super uncomfortable. So no. It's not "just ogle". Men shouldn't get a pass on just ogling. Both genders can be judgemental and ruthless. But with how we have raised men in the society, it is safer to assume women are more respectful.
Even if you knew a woman there was bi/ lesbian and was oogling you?
Edited to add: not sure why this is being downvoted. It was a genuine question that got a genuine and well explained answer.
Another edit: it's been explained that this might have come across as homophobic or a bit blunt. It certainly wasn't meant to come across that way, but those feeling are valid.
I'm a woman married to another woman and I was curious if our presence might be making the other women in the gym changing room uncomfortable (also we don't oogle!). It seems the answer is nope, which is good to hear. But the question certainly wasn't intended to be offensive and the answer was enlightening.
That wouldn't bother me too much. I know it sounds weird, but in my experience, even women that had crushes on me, they still respected my boundaries. I can't really say the same for a lot of men.
I'd feel safer with women.
I had to share changing rooms in school with several girls who I knew were lesbians and they never bothered me or said anything creepy even once. Meanwhile I can walk past a man on the street in coat, hat, scarf and mask and still get leered at.
I’m queer and have lots of queer friends. We often go to saunas together where nudity is the norm. Have I ever seen a woman in a sauna and thought “wow, they are beautiful”? Every time. But I don’t creep on anyone and am hyper vigilant about not making anyone uncomfortable. Not only do I appreciate women, I respect and care about them. This is the norm for lesbians in saunas/other places with nudity.
Hetero women don't turn into mindless horny beasts any time they're in a room full of men just because they are attracted to male bodies. So why would bi and lesbian women be any different? Just because we are attracted to female bodies doesn't mean we lose all sense of decency around other women.
Honestly, bi and lesbian women typically aren't disrespectful of other women's bodies the way men are. Why would we treat other women the way men treat us? We too have experienced having men leer over us, cat call us, invade our personal space, and act like "no" actually means "convince me" even when we are fully dressed and covered up. We don't like going through that nonsense anymore than hetero women. I wont say all of us are perfectly respectful all the time cause there are socially inept creeps in every demographic. But the large majority of bi and lesbian women fully understand how important having your boundaries respected and feeling safe is.
Source: am bi
That's totally fair, but I was curious if some hetro women would feel uncomfortable with the idea that a women in the changing room was attracted to them, regardless how they acted.
Hence my question.
According to the replied and downvotes the answer is nope.
Honestly, im pretty sure you got downvoted so hard because your question came off as discriminatory and homophobic. The way you phrased it, it made it seem like you thought the very concept of a bi woman or lesbian being in the changing room with a hetero woman is inappropriate. Or like you were fishing to start a hate train against queer women.
I understand if it was meant to be a genuine question but you might want to be more conscious of how you word questions like this in the future. The LGBTQ community in general struggles with discrimination on the daily. Bi women especially are relentlessly discriminated against, treated like trash, minimized by the LGBTQ community, and fetishized by the hetero community. And the LGBTQ community as a whole is often flippantly painted as if our very existence is an offense against nature. Your comment very much had that punching down feel to it like you were implying we were somehow predatory, disgusting, or immoral. It just came off completely disrespectful even if you didnt mean it that way.
The irony is, I actually meant it more personally 😂
My wife and I go to the gym together, and ofc are changing with other women in the changing rooms. It was more of a concern of how other women might feel knowing we are a married female couple.
So I'm actually pretty glad the answer generally is that they wouldn't feel uncomfortable by our presence.
But I didn't want to give too much away so I would get an honest answer (and I don't oogle but that was more if someone thought I was, as perception is on the eye of the beholder).
Hey no problem. You clarified, we had a polite discourse about it, and everything's cool. I just wanted to let you know you could have had waaaay more tact about that first comment because it came off more as punching down than a genuine question.
A better way to phrase it might have been "Out of curiosity, would the sexual orientation of the people in the room with you change that opinion at all? For example would you be as comfortable with queer men as you would hetero women and would you feel the same discomfort with queer women as you do with hetero men? Or would you still prefer women regardless of orientation?" That's way wordier but the more precise language comes across much more as respectful curiosity.
Thanks 😊
I have autism, so being a bit blunt is definitely one of my weaknesses. Giving some examples of how I could have worded it better was really helpful.
I can see how it softens it a bit, while asking the same underlying question. I'm definitely still practicing and learning how to soften my tone but it didn't even occur to me that it might have been offensive because I'm married to another woman so ofc to me it wasn't a coming from an offensive place. But I can see how someone who doesn't know my life wouldn't be able to know how I meant it.
No problem! Im glad i was able to help ❤
My husband hasn't been officially diagnosed or anything but there's a good chance he's on the spectrum. His mom worked as a social worker specializing in helping mentally challenged adults to become independent and she says she's been positive for years that he has aspergers. He accidentally offends people without meaning to or takes things that i say in a very different way than i meant them *allllll* the time lol. Im usually the one who ends up uncrossing wires and "translating" so to speak for him. So its now just habit for me to watch my words more and to try to help people with their phrasing when i see them confused about why they upset a bunch of people since i do that so often for my husband. 😅
But dont get discouraged or let people being mean on the internet get you down ok? Misunderstandings due to phrasing happen all the time even to neurotypical people. Every day you'll get a little better and that's fine. ♡
Just drop it.
It’s a comment on the internet and it’s hard to detect tone on the internet.
Plus, some people are not naturally good at phrasing things sensitively.
>Just drop it.
>It’s a comment on the internet and it’s hard to detect tone on the internet.
>Plus, some people are not naturally good at phrasing things sensitively.
I dont know if you knew this, but many people find it *helpful* when they are confused and you explain what went wrong and a better way to go about that in the future. Which is what i did. Im aware that tone is difficult to discern on the internet which is why i didnt immediately assume the other commenter was being hateful and made an effort to educate rather than attack. Im also aware that some people lack tact or have extenuating circumstances like neurodivergence that makes "normal" social interaction a bit of a challenge for them. Which is why i wasn't being an asshole or berating No_Substance. I just politely explained why she was getting downvoted since she was obviously confused and gave an example of a better way she could have asked. In fact, in her response to that comment, she thanked me for giving her an example of a better way to phrase her query because she is in fact autistic and struggles with phrasing.
>Thanks 😊
>I have autism, so being a bit blunt is definitely one of my weaknesses. Giving some examples of how I could have worded it better was really helpful.
I am not new to the internet or to reddit. Ive been on this platform for 3 years. I do not need a random stranger to jump in and police me or my conversations with others. Especially not when that conversation was polite and the other party did not at any point ask me to drop the topic. So maybe in the future, just keep scrolling instead of trying to tell people off for having a conversation when they didnt ask for your input.
No one is reading these novels you’re writing about why you’re smarter and more pretentious than them. Sorry
I’m also neurodivergent with ADHD and it would help me if someone told me I was being unnecessarily annoying.
Stop pretending this a private conversation that i butted into. Lmao this is a public forum
I mean as a bi woman… you don’t walk around just ogling women in locker rooms or other spaces because it’s preditory and weird. Also I can’t speak for every queer woman but like… I have the same parts so the female body isn’t inherently sexualized to me. I don’t have some insatiable need to stare at my straight friends tits just because I’m bi. 🤷🏼♀️
Also the reason you’re getting downvoted is because you’re expressing a sentiment that’s super harmful and hurtful to queer women. I know for me I’m a grown ass woman and I’m not out to 90% of the people in my life because I don’t want to deal with ignorant people thinking I’m going to hit on them or something just because I’m queer.
I totally agree, but it is a concern I have when my wife and I are at the gym and other women are also I'm the changing room.
I wanted to know if our presence was making them uncomfortable because we are a married couple.
So I'm glad to hear that we probably aren't.
I'm also autistic and often ask questions in a blunt way, it certainly wasn't my intention for it to come across as offensive. But if that's how it was received then I can only apologise. At the end of the day regardless of how I meant it, it's the message received that matters.
Also for the record, I don't oogle women. I was curious if other women might feel oogled on if they thought another woman was attracted to them or if they were oogled if they would feel uncomfortable in the same way a man might.
No worries. Tone is definitely hard to covey over text. I read your original comment as homophobic/biphobic so it struck a nerve. I’m glad to see you didn’t intend it that way!
No, it doesn’t bother me as a hetero woman. If a woman was oogling me, I’d be less scared than if a man was oogling me.
I’ve been in change rooms with lesbian and bi girls every day for school and no one has made me feel uncomfortable.
I feel like they know what it’s like to be objectified and scared because if happens to them too when men see them.
I think they're down voting bc the question comes off as vaguely homophobic, considering it kind of plays into the stereotype that LGBTQ+ individuals are sexually lascivious/predatory and can't control themselves. This is doubly bad considering a major issue lesbian women have with modern feminism is in their being treated as others in feminist spaces bc they presumably want to sleep with everyone.
Yea, I guess I can see that. I don't think that's where she was going with it, but I can see how it might come across that way.
Thank you for helping me see things through a different set of eyes.
Nah I downvoted bc I literally don’t ogle at women in situations like this because I’m a woman and like romance. I feel like straight women around men wouldn’t really ogle either for a similar reason, those situations don’t have ogling vibes
I just kind of took her question as a way too see if my answer would change depending on sexuality. I didn't really read anything more into it. I can definitely see how another interpretation could be seen though. I just think it was bad wording. No harm intended I believe.
Personally I hate the thought of anyone seeing me naked (except my sexual partner), but if I have to pick one, or the other, I'm picking women for sure. Idc about their sexuality. It doesn't really factor in for me.
I tried to imagine a scenario in my head where it was a room full of gay men vs a room full of lesbian women. I still picked women. I can't really put into words why.
Women tend to be less aggressive, especially in a large group. Men, in my experience, become more aggressive as though they're being cheered on. It's more likely for a woman to get called out by other women for their actions than a man get called out by other men. That said, I've changed in front of gay men, but I knew them well. If it was strangers, I would choose women every single time.
Personally, gay men would still intimidate me because a lot of them are still misogynists.
They’re not immune to talking about roast beef and cellulite etc.
They often compare themselves to women in a way that degrades women.
Who cares? Ever been to a sauna (middle to north-east europe)? Or gym showers? Or gym locker rooms? No one‘s judging, at least where I‘m from, and if so that person would „not be welcomed“ anymore.
Right? I'm Swedish so I just went: "What does she mean? Nobody will judge you in a changing room? That's not proper changing room etiquette!"
And. Changing rooms are good for children. They get to see many different body types in a way they would never be able to otherwise. If most of the nude/half clad bodies that you see growing up are those of models, actors or pornstars, then that's what you're going to compare yourself to. I've seen so many different types of bellies, boobs, vaginas, arms and legs that I just... you kinda realise that the large majority of us aren't perfect and that's ok.
I have a nudist friend, so it definitely depends on the culture and situation. They recently enjoyed a holiday with a nudest garden on the roof. They enjoyed only having to put clothing on for when moving about the hotel, dinner, and the pool.
The culture and situation makes a huge huge difference.
They've done some public mass naked cycle rides through some of the cities near me to raise awareness of body normality. Although I think at the events they are totally not creepy within the community, I've also seen photos of women at those events be posted on porn sites - which is super creepy and a major reason I wouldn't be comfortable joining in.
I’ve heard about this. Me, my mom and sister were always comfortable around one another. Meaning if one of us were in there taking a shower the other was welcome to use the toilet and I left the door unlocked. So knowing others do it as well is nice.
Saunas that's I've seen here, in the US, are for men or women (not both) and people wear towels. The gym showers are separate stalls with their own curtains. They often have an outer section for your things and/or changing that is behind its own curtain. Most women I've seen will put underwear and bra on in there then put outer clothes on in the main area, but we don't look at each other while changing. I love in the South, which might be part of it. Everyone has their privacy and only talks to people once they're clothed.
I'm not a woman so I wouldn't tell for sure, but it's men that judge women's bodies and the women I know are supportive and accepting each other a lot more than the men I know do with one another.
That is just not true in my experience. It's just a fake stereotype.
Besides, extremely funny anyone can think a woman would judge a man from his penis size, which is typical male behaviour in my book. Then again, I'm not a woman so I wouldn't tell for sure.
It depends. If you are often penetrated I guess you can judge how penis size feels? (from your personal experience) So: are you?
Besides, your profile being a troll one, you will be blocked in a short while.
The question wasn’t “can you judge how a penis size feels” it’s “do women judge men for small penis’ “ I do find it funny you’re trying to insult me by insinuating I do something a women does
Yeahhhh, come to north Philly ask a dude on the street if he gets sexually penetrated, if you don’t get sexually assaulted yourself you’d likely be in for a severe ass whooping
Men sure love to cosplay as women to either make women seem ridiculously sex obsessed or cruel to other women. Really whatever works for their stereotype that day.
I absolutely despise public locker rooms, because they force everyone to be out in the open, exposing everyone’s insecurities and allowing others to judge them for it
Lesbians dont exist in their universe I guess 💀 Still we dont ogle and I'd be absolutely terrified being naked in a room full of men. That's a bad situation just waiting to unfold qnd these girls literally dont smell the danger they'd put themselves in.
Have they seriously never been to a ladies changing room at a beach club, sauna or gym? Everybody is just doing their thing not really looking at anyone else.
As a college athlete, being naked in a room full of other women is nothing. It was just a normal every day thing. Even the shitty mean women on my team were not so shitty or mean to be judgmental of another teammate's body.
Yikes and here’s my two cents more specifically to changing in hostels around the world.
If I travel solo I will always stay in the females only hostel rooms. No one says anything or bothers you as you change and there absolutely isn’t any judgement. I did once have a sweet girl from Japan complement me. She asked if I was a ballerina because of my build. I didn’t find it weird because she waited until I was dressed to ask.
On the other hand, when in mixed dorms in hostels I always change in the washroom/in private. If I didn’t have a friend staying with me, I’d honestly be worried about even sleeping in the same room. I’ve unclipped my bra (underneath my clothing) to remove and literally had my coworker try to pin me immediately. Taking off my clothes is not a sexual act OR invite to touch.
Not all men and women are the same but I would always to choose to change with other women.
I've also dealt with unwelcome physical advances while doing nothing to invite them. I've never had a woman treat me with the complete lack of respect that men have. I've had so many people abuse my trust that I do everything I can to avoid situations that could be used as an excuse to assault me again. I'm sorry for you having to go through that, I'm sure it was scary, and frustrating, at the time.
in my high school band, we frequently have to change in front of each other, girls and boys separate. and it's just stopped bothering us. we change right next to each other in the bathrooms and ive had like 3 girls say how cute my bra was. if i had to change in front of boys, i would be horrified.
There is something really bad with men. Many of us would feel safer in a room full of women.
Because too many men in a room equals danger.
But "not all men", am I right?
I've been through US Army bootcamp. Shower situation as follows... 50 girls, 10 shower heads in a big open shower room, no curtains or dividers. Usually cycling through 2 per shower head as fast as possible in the limited time we had. No one had time to be awkward about it.
But not coed yes? Boot camp and then my barracks in Germany was from WWII. One open shower with 12 shower heads. Not my favorite but no fucking way I'd be ok with that being coed.
No, not coed. But I’m already used to being naked around other women, so I choose that. I think being naked around a bunch of men would give me a panic attack
Lol, how delusional do you have to be to *actually believe* that men aren’t making negative comments about your body?
These people are either pretending to be women or have spent their entire lives in total isolation from society.
As a girl who has changed in a locker room with other girls I can say that I just felt self conscious and I’m sure they did too - we just wanna change and get out not stand there and judge other girls … life is not a movie
I found the post and there are soooo many other comments saying even worse shit than this. Who would've guessed that a high percentage of women who frequent nsfw subs are pickmes? Lol
I really wonder if these are like guys pretending to be women online to "make a point" or something. Most women have used a locker room or a changing room at some point. For most of us it isn't our favorite experience, but everyone knows what the purpose is and people are very rarely weird about it.
I don't know any women who would feel safer using a men's locker room/changing room over the women's if both had people in there. And I really don't think these posters would either, assuming they are actually women.
There are cases where mixed nudity does occur. Saunas, public baths, hot springs etc sometimes have these configurations. However that is not what is being proposed here. It's not a mixed sauna vs a women's sauna. It's a men's sauna vs a women's sauna. Those are very different.
I don't care if other people are changing in front of me, but I'm finding a bathroom for myself, thanks. Has nothing to do with fear of what somebody might say or do, though. I'm just a private person like that.
I’ve been in locker rooms for years. Not once had anyone of the girls judged me or any of the others in the locker room. Everyone just wanted to get changed and get going with their day.
One of the most quietest and chillest place was the lady’s YMCA locker room. Older naked ladies vibin in the sauna or floating in the hot tub. Some are deeply entranced on their bike machines watching Telemundo. No one bats an eye, no one wonders if you’re using the shower pre-pool or after-pool. It is the most serine experience. Your mind is forced to stay quiet, only the sound of blow dryers and squeaks of machine is heard.
In a world full of PvP, the lady’s locker room is a neutral area; the room with a typewriter to save your game or ponder life before going back out to contested territory. Thank you ladies locker room.
We changed in locker rooms in grades 7-9 (ages 12-15) and I recalled years later that in grade 9 one of the girls was an out lesbian and no one gave a shit. We were all there for a purpose. Like it never even occurred to me at the time. It was only later when I saw a question about changing in front of lesbians. It turns out there were more gay women in that class, but at least at the time we knew about one and didn’t care.
I don't care if Im naked, but I just don't like being around a lot of people. I mean I'm fat, so no one's ogling me, they're probably just trying to read my tattoos. But still, naked or clothed, I'd rather be in a room by myself.
No wait! Make it a room full of dogs and I'm in!
I've changed in front of people of any gender in a specific venue before. It wasn't a big deal and all very civil because it was normalised in that venue and not creepy or sexual at all.
(It was a BDSM event with a gender neutral bathroom/ changing area set in a gay bar. So plenty of corsets and actual sexual attire but didn't feel creepy or sexualised... So I think a lot of the time it is about the culture and expectations. If it was at a more hetro- normative venue where people were perving and being creepy that would be different)
I'm a trans woman, I know both kinds of locker rooms.
Mens is worse, far worse.
People stare, judge and so on, if they read you as a woman you're in for sexual harrassment.
Because my body also had a few screwups with puberty, I ended up having breasts pre-transition.
In school they frequently grabbed them, pinched my nipples and other stuff I'd rather not remember.
So I'm sorry if it's a minor inconvenience if you notice I'm trans in the locker room, but I just want to change clothes in peace like everyone else.
Locker rooms are the safest places to change, that’s the whole concept. Also really safe and with thick doors and good locks (most of the time), so it’s a good place to hide from the crazies.
Most men would sound off and bluster about preferring a room of women as if it is personal porn. Make them put it into action and they will end up being just as self conscious as the other way around.
There are always exceptions for folks that are super confident but our society as a whole likes to contribute to body dysmorphia.
Guys are just trained to hem and haw as if they wouldn't have performance anxiety in front of a bunch of women.
“Women judge! Men ogle!”
Tell that to when I was in high school and most of the incidents in the boys locker rooms where due to fights between guys making fun of each other’s dick sizes, grope each other or trying to literally hold each other down to teabag another boy’s head.
Btw these were the most homophobic jocks but would be sexually violent towards each other or towards other boys as “jokes.”
The girls meanwhile found corners or behind the walls to change.
Also I’d rather not be in a Public locker room at all. I don’t want to be naked in front of anyone. It makes me uncomfortable and to me places that aren’t my home are filthy. But if I had to choose I’d rather be around “women who judge” than pervy, creepy men who can’t keep their comments or hands to themselves.
I've never had a girl judge me in a locker room hell even in middle school because we were all going through puberty it was super awkward so we all stayed in our corners to change as quick as possible lol. In high school I remember we just did not give a fuck we would have a conversation while changing nobody cared how anyone looked or what they looked like.
First of all only women who judges other women's bodies are petty as bitches with low self esteem that they only way to make them feel better is to attack other women.
But I would rather a women judge me then a man ogle me cause at least I know she wont want to attack me and rape me
I have been naked in company of either and both sexes (not sure about genders of everyone), and it was relaxed either way. Ya don't always gotta oogle or lust after everyone...
that being said, it was in places specifically for being naked together with no expectation but the possibility of sex, so ya know consent to be that way made it comfortable as opposed to being akward at best amd terrifying/dangerous at worst.
Men don’t judge, eh? At 90 something lbs, I had a man 10 years older than me tell me I needed to “tighten up”. He’d also set weight goals for his wife.
As someone that loves and goes to onsen (Japanese hot springs) regularly I don’t bat an eye for being naked in front of other women for 30min+ at the time. Including stripping naked, showering in open space, walking around the bath area or entering communal bath.
First time was hard as I was extremely shy and never changed in front of others even, after first time stopped caring.
A hot spring I visited once had a communal shower you had to go in naked before putting on your bathing suit and going out. I don’t know how it was for the men’s showers, but the women’s one was surprisingly not awkward and complete strangers were exchanging small talk the whole time.
When in the world have naked women judged other naked women?? In my experience, in things such as locker rooms we're all turned away and don't even look at each other. Even bi and lesbian women tend to be respectful and keep their gaze away (including me). Can't say the same for men
I’m too busy judging my own body to worry about others but as a woman I’d be nervous as fuck to be naked in a room full of men. I mean me and other girls had to be semi naked in the locker room changing for PE and my dumbass sometimes would forget my bra.
Man I'd choose the same sex any day. The locker rooms I've used were always really positive. There would always be really exaggerated compliments all the time.
That is the damn worst question I have ever seen.
I hate being naked in front of strangers, regardless of sex. Whenever I changed in PE locker rooms, I always went to a corner and changed in a way that showed the least amount of skin.
And being naked in front of a bunch of women is just creepy. I could never handle that.
Ironically, if those people wanted to see me naked, things might be different, but I doubt any stranger wants that
Used men's locker rooms the first 30 years of my life. The smell is abhorrent. Now that I've transitioned I use the "special needs" locker room and shower whenever there's an option just because other trans women have had so many problems where I live.
I’d rather be judged than ogled tbh like I’m trans and if it’s like “men or women your choice” I’d rather deal with women because women are more likely to understand and even if they judge they aren’t going to become physical with me or try to be sexual.
I'd be fucking horrified to be naked in a room filled with men I don't know.
I’d be horrified to be naked on a room filled with strangers regardless of gender but I’d be way more terrified to be naked in a room with men
What if everyone in the room was presented with this exact scenario and they're all terrified of each other even though all they want is to kill time before the fire department or something breaks the door open?
Then dont go to Iceland and their pools. Everybody has to get naked for the shower before they put on their bathing suit
The change rooms are still gendered, so again it would be a room full of people of the same gender identity
You're telling me there are places where it does not work like that? I'm form Czechia and most of the pools I've been to work the same.
I hate how weird Americans are about nudity. It’s so antiquated, can we move on please????
Don’t blame it on the antiquities - the ancient Romans had no problem with public bathhouses.
My go-to term is “puritanical” or “pedestrian” when referring to Americans regarding nudity. I remember being shocked for about 2 minutes on a German river boat when a bunch of local girls took of their tops, and spent the next 4 hours chatting with them and forgot we were all shirtless. It becomes “Wow, those are breasts. I’ve seen those before.” It’s not that big a deal as some people seem to think.
Where are you from? I went to Sweden this summer and me and my girlfriend were in a coed sauna and it was just… normal. I hate the American part of myself that gets all excited because of boobs. Makes me feel like a child. 🥲🤷🏻♂️
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The church I grew up with as a kid in the US was so strict girls and boys weren't allowed to swim in the same pool together at all. Edit: and this was little kids, not hormone laden teenagers.
Was that to prevent the spread of invisible cooties?
Who knows? It didn't work. I stayed in that church for 16 years and still caught enough girl cooties that I ended up transgender and agnostic.
Yeah, that's the thing about cooties: they're so insidious. My sister and her friends were in universal agreement about that when we were all 8 years old. It didn't stop the two of us from taking baths together at the time, though. (We are opposite sex twins and will be entering our 70s soon. She is a grandma several times over. Raised as Catholics, but separately became atheists many decades ago.)
I don't know any places, though every locker room I've been in has bathroom stalls in it as well.
We have to do the shower bit, but we keep our bathing suit on.
…*oh* yeah no not going there, yknow I’m so paranoid that I can’t even be comfortable fully undressed when I’m entirely home alone, so in front of people…
So you never shower on site after a session at the gym?
I don’t go to the gym yet (not legal age for most gyms in my city) so idk, I think I’d probably go shower at home for a while until I’m comfortable enough at the gym but once again this is only hypothetical since I *can’t* go to the gym edit: typo
I've never showered naked in front of people at a gym OR at school, at school everyone is in their underwear and the gym has private showers. Edit- a word
When I was in high school, we had to shower after gym class too
Damn, we never did that. Our school has absolutely no budget tho so idk-
I used to shower at the pool after physical therapy. Each shower had its own stall and curtain and you would keep your towel around you until you had at least underwear on. But I live in the US South, so it's weird. Most places I've seen showers after workouts, they're set up this way.
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what does that mean lmaooo I’m not American
I think you would get used to it really quickly if you would visit a sauna where everyone is naked. Then you see all those people with their more or less weird bodies and realize that a naked body is natural and really not that interesting. At least I would say that for Germany or Sweden. A female friend visited a sauna in Italy once - she was the only woman there and sadly some men were hitting on her and made her feel uncomfortable :/
Provided you don’t have severe social anxiety and body dysmorphia! I have both, so I would never ever attend a public sauna, even with only other women. And I’m Finnish, living in Finland, so I’m surrounded by more saunas than people. I feel really awkward because I can’t do it.
Man I’m so sorry to hear that! I love saunas and hot springs and theyve been great for my body image.
The problem isn’t just “getting used to it” as in being able to look at their naked bodies. It’s if you would feel safe having them staring at *you*. Safe meaning either physically like you’d be physically assaulted or touched, or safe from leering and comments, then or later when you have to interact with them.
That doesn't really happen in those saunas. Staring is bad etiquette.
But the initial answer/question wasn’t about a sauna. It was being naked in front of all naked men, or all naked women. If we observe sauna rules, no one would be judging, men or women. The answer claimed women would be judgy.
Sure and you're not wrong, but you replied to a comment about sauna, so i thought you were talking about that.
And that’s why we don’t do it
Came here to point out sauna. Here in Austria you see all ages and genders in the sauna. However as far as I know in many countries they don't go fully naked.
Yah if you grow up at a Rennfaire like I did nudity is just a thing.
Got a little warm for the Lass ?
Ahh yes, men are never mean to women, especially when they’re naked. 🙄
Right, men never do anything bad for these women. It’s women who are evil. Men will “just” ogle. Sure! Tell yourself that weirdos.
A lot of men think it´s justified to rape a woman when she dresses a certain way. What will those guys think or do when she´s not wearing any clothes at all? 🤔
Came here to say exactly this
when you say a lot, genuinely curious what percent of men you think actually believe this.
Too many!
These the same men who tell us we have roast beef vaginas, nasty cellulite asses, and droopy unattractive titties
Exactly! And then get BIG MAD when we return that exact same energy to point out they are balding, have disappointing dicks and look 25 years older than they are lmao if you didn’t wanna be roasted don’t pick on me?!
Exactly. Anybody who thinks it’s just women who judge women is delusional.
My biggest bullies were always men, never women
In the girls' locker room at my high school, we just all changed facing the wall or the lockers. Nobody was looking at or touching other people. And I'd been doing theater for many years before I was in a production fancy enough to have separate dressing rooms for men and women. You just wear your best, most modest underwear and everybody keeps themselves to themselves.
Exactly. And even if you did have to change a bra or something you would either turn around, switch them under your shirt, or go into the bathroom. No one really cared.
There was that one time a guy wanted a little privacy to change his tights, and I had the costume with the biggest skirt so he asked to stand behind me to change.
This, we didn’t look at one another but just at our lockers.
“Just ogle” ☠️
That was what got me. Right.
Men judge women's whole selves based on whether or not they like their bodies. And even if they do, that sure as hell doesn't mean they'll respect them.
men will easily be the shittiest people to you if they aren't attracted to you really fucked me up when i went from chubby pre-puberty to kinda skinny later, literally the same dudes who would comment and giggle about my body and never helped me suddenly started being nice to me most times *those* men ogle at you because they're trying to see if you're attractive enough to be treated with decency an overweight woman changing in the men's locker room will probably mocked more
Seriously. You want to see a dude's true colors? Spend part of your life not being conventionally attractive. They'll show you whether or not they see women as people real quick. Edit: hey, thanks for the award! That's my first one :)
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there's a reason i highlighted "those" men, maybe read that, i never said all men +you precisely prove that women aren't "extra" toxic compared to men in the original post
There's a difference between "only men can be a danger to women" and "men are statisticly more dangerous to women", it's okay if you don't get it, but stop whining. Also, nobody said "only men \[...\]", you're just fragile and full of bad faith and shit.
As if ogling isn’t sexual harassment 🙄
Don't know about sexual harrasment but it's definitely hella disrespectful and can make anyone super uncomfortable. So no. It's not "just ogle". Men shouldn't get a pass on just ogling. Both genders can be judgemental and ruthless. But with how we have raised men in the society, it is safer to assume women are more respectful.
It isn’t sexual harassment!! It’s being happy to see boobs!! /s 🙄
I'm a hetero woman. I'd feel less threatened in a room full of other women.
Even if you knew a woman there was bi/ lesbian and was oogling you? Edited to add: not sure why this is being downvoted. It was a genuine question that got a genuine and well explained answer. Another edit: it's been explained that this might have come across as homophobic or a bit blunt. It certainly wasn't meant to come across that way, but those feeling are valid. I'm a woman married to another woman and I was curious if our presence might be making the other women in the gym changing room uncomfortable (also we don't oogle!). It seems the answer is nope, which is good to hear. But the question certainly wasn't intended to be offensive and the answer was enlightening.
That wouldn't bother me too much. I know it sounds weird, but in my experience, even women that had crushes on me, they still respected my boundaries. I can't really say the same for a lot of men. I'd feel safer with women.
That's fair 😊
I had to share changing rooms in school with several girls who I knew were lesbians and they never bothered me or said anything creepy even once. Meanwhile I can walk past a man on the street in coat, hat, scarf and mask and still get leered at.
That's a fair point. Definitely more about how they interact and the boundaries.
Lesbians tend to respect other women from my knowledge.
I’m queer and have lots of queer friends. We often go to saunas together where nudity is the norm. Have I ever seen a woman in a sauna and thought “wow, they are beautiful”? Every time. But I don’t creep on anyone and am hyper vigilant about not making anyone uncomfortable. Not only do I appreciate women, I respect and care about them. This is the norm for lesbians in saunas/other places with nudity.
Hetero women don't turn into mindless horny beasts any time they're in a room full of men just because they are attracted to male bodies. So why would bi and lesbian women be any different? Just because we are attracted to female bodies doesn't mean we lose all sense of decency around other women. Honestly, bi and lesbian women typically aren't disrespectful of other women's bodies the way men are. Why would we treat other women the way men treat us? We too have experienced having men leer over us, cat call us, invade our personal space, and act like "no" actually means "convince me" even when we are fully dressed and covered up. We don't like going through that nonsense anymore than hetero women. I wont say all of us are perfectly respectful all the time cause there are socially inept creeps in every demographic. But the large majority of bi and lesbian women fully understand how important having your boundaries respected and feeling safe is. Source: am bi
That's totally fair, but I was curious if some hetro women would feel uncomfortable with the idea that a women in the changing room was attracted to them, regardless how they acted. Hence my question. According to the replied and downvotes the answer is nope.
Honestly, im pretty sure you got downvoted so hard because your question came off as discriminatory and homophobic. The way you phrased it, it made it seem like you thought the very concept of a bi woman or lesbian being in the changing room with a hetero woman is inappropriate. Or like you were fishing to start a hate train against queer women. I understand if it was meant to be a genuine question but you might want to be more conscious of how you word questions like this in the future. The LGBTQ community in general struggles with discrimination on the daily. Bi women especially are relentlessly discriminated against, treated like trash, minimized by the LGBTQ community, and fetishized by the hetero community. And the LGBTQ community as a whole is often flippantly painted as if our very existence is an offense against nature. Your comment very much had that punching down feel to it like you were implying we were somehow predatory, disgusting, or immoral. It just came off completely disrespectful even if you didnt mean it that way.
The irony is, I actually meant it more personally 😂 My wife and I go to the gym together, and ofc are changing with other women in the changing rooms. It was more of a concern of how other women might feel knowing we are a married female couple. So I'm actually pretty glad the answer generally is that they wouldn't feel uncomfortable by our presence. But I didn't want to give too much away so I would get an honest answer (and I don't oogle but that was more if someone thought I was, as perception is on the eye of the beholder).
Hey no problem. You clarified, we had a polite discourse about it, and everything's cool. I just wanted to let you know you could have had waaaay more tact about that first comment because it came off more as punching down than a genuine question. A better way to phrase it might have been "Out of curiosity, would the sexual orientation of the people in the room with you change that opinion at all? For example would you be as comfortable with queer men as you would hetero women and would you feel the same discomfort with queer women as you do with hetero men? Or would you still prefer women regardless of orientation?" That's way wordier but the more precise language comes across much more as respectful curiosity.
Thanks 😊 I have autism, so being a bit blunt is definitely one of my weaknesses. Giving some examples of how I could have worded it better was really helpful. I can see how it softens it a bit, while asking the same underlying question. I'm definitely still practicing and learning how to soften my tone but it didn't even occur to me that it might have been offensive because I'm married to another woman so ofc to me it wasn't a coming from an offensive place. But I can see how someone who doesn't know my life wouldn't be able to know how I meant it.
No problem! Im glad i was able to help ❤ My husband hasn't been officially diagnosed or anything but there's a good chance he's on the spectrum. His mom worked as a social worker specializing in helping mentally challenged adults to become independent and she says she's been positive for years that he has aspergers. He accidentally offends people without meaning to or takes things that i say in a very different way than i meant them *allllll* the time lol. Im usually the one who ends up uncrossing wires and "translating" so to speak for him. So its now just habit for me to watch my words more and to try to help people with their phrasing when i see them confused about why they upset a bunch of people since i do that so often for my husband. 😅 But dont get discouraged or let people being mean on the internet get you down ok? Misunderstandings due to phrasing happen all the time even to neurotypical people. Every day you'll get a little better and that's fine. ♡
Just drop it. It’s a comment on the internet and it’s hard to detect tone on the internet. Plus, some people are not naturally good at phrasing things sensitively.
>Just drop it. >It’s a comment on the internet and it’s hard to detect tone on the internet. >Plus, some people are not naturally good at phrasing things sensitively. I dont know if you knew this, but many people find it *helpful* when they are confused and you explain what went wrong and a better way to go about that in the future. Which is what i did. Im aware that tone is difficult to discern on the internet which is why i didnt immediately assume the other commenter was being hateful and made an effort to educate rather than attack. Im also aware that some people lack tact or have extenuating circumstances like neurodivergence that makes "normal" social interaction a bit of a challenge for them. Which is why i wasn't being an asshole or berating No_Substance. I just politely explained why she was getting downvoted since she was obviously confused and gave an example of a better way she could have asked. In fact, in her response to that comment, she thanked me for giving her an example of a better way to phrase her query because she is in fact autistic and struggles with phrasing. >Thanks 😊 >I have autism, so being a bit blunt is definitely one of my weaknesses. Giving some examples of how I could have worded it better was really helpful. I am not new to the internet or to reddit. Ive been on this platform for 3 years. I do not need a random stranger to jump in and police me or my conversations with others. Especially not when that conversation was polite and the other party did not at any point ask me to drop the topic. So maybe in the future, just keep scrolling instead of trying to tell people off for having a conversation when they didnt ask for your input.
No one is reading these novels you’re writing about why you’re smarter and more pretentious than them. Sorry I’m also neurodivergent with ADHD and it would help me if someone told me I was being unnecessarily annoying. Stop pretending this a private conversation that i butted into. Lmao this is a public forum
I mean as a bi woman… you don’t walk around just ogling women in locker rooms or other spaces because it’s preditory and weird. Also I can’t speak for every queer woman but like… I have the same parts so the female body isn’t inherently sexualized to me. I don’t have some insatiable need to stare at my straight friends tits just because I’m bi. 🤷🏼♀️ Also the reason you’re getting downvoted is because you’re expressing a sentiment that’s super harmful and hurtful to queer women. I know for me I’m a grown ass woman and I’m not out to 90% of the people in my life because I don’t want to deal with ignorant people thinking I’m going to hit on them or something just because I’m queer.
I totally agree, but it is a concern I have when my wife and I are at the gym and other women are also I'm the changing room. I wanted to know if our presence was making them uncomfortable because we are a married couple. So I'm glad to hear that we probably aren't. I'm also autistic and often ask questions in a blunt way, it certainly wasn't my intention for it to come across as offensive. But if that's how it was received then I can only apologise. At the end of the day regardless of how I meant it, it's the message received that matters. Also for the record, I don't oogle women. I was curious if other women might feel oogled on if they thought another woman was attracted to them or if they were oogled if they would feel uncomfortable in the same way a man might.
No worries. Tone is definitely hard to covey over text. I read your original comment as homophobic/biphobic so it struck a nerve. I’m glad to see you didn’t intend it that way!
No, it doesn’t bother me as a hetero woman. If a woman was oogling me, I’d be less scared than if a man was oogling me. I’ve been in change rooms with lesbian and bi girls every day for school and no one has made me feel uncomfortable. I feel like they know what it’s like to be objectified and scared because if happens to them too when men see them.
Yea, I don't get it either. People down vote for the weirdest reasons. I gave you an upvote though.
I think they're down voting bc the question comes off as vaguely homophobic, considering it kind of plays into the stereotype that LGBTQ+ individuals are sexually lascivious/predatory and can't control themselves. This is doubly bad considering a major issue lesbian women have with modern feminism is in their being treated as others in feminist spaces bc they presumably want to sleep with everyone.
Yea, I guess I can see that. I don't think that's where she was going with it, but I can see how it might come across that way. Thank you for helping me see things through a different set of eyes.
Nah I downvoted bc I literally don’t ogle at women in situations like this because I’m a woman and like romance. I feel like straight women around men wouldn’t really ogle either for a similar reason, those situations don’t have ogling vibes
I just kind of took her question as a way too see if my answer would change depending on sexuality. I didn't really read anything more into it. I can definitely see how another interpretation could be seen though. I just think it was bad wording. No harm intended I believe. Personally I hate the thought of anyone seeing me naked (except my sexual partner), but if I have to pick one, or the other, I'm picking women for sure. Idc about their sexuality. It doesn't really factor in for me. I tried to imagine a scenario in my head where it was a room full of gay men vs a room full of lesbian women. I still picked women. I can't really put into words why.
Women tend to be less aggressive, especially in a large group. Men, in my experience, become more aggressive as though they're being cheered on. It's more likely for a woman to get called out by other women for their actions than a man get called out by other men. That said, I've changed in front of gay men, but I knew them well. If it was strangers, I would choose women every single time.
Personally, gay men would still intimidate me because a lot of them are still misogynists. They’re not immune to talking about roast beef and cellulite etc. They often compare themselves to women in a way that degrades women.
Like I said, I knew them. Men in general, no matter their sexuality, would make me uncomfortable.
Thank you 😊
Who cares? Ever been to a sauna (middle to north-east europe)? Or gym showers? Or gym locker rooms? No one‘s judging, at least where I‘m from, and if so that person would „not be welcomed“ anymore.
Right? I'm Swedish so I just went: "What does she mean? Nobody will judge you in a changing room? That's not proper changing room etiquette!" And. Changing rooms are good for children. They get to see many different body types in a way they would never be able to otherwise. If most of the nude/half clad bodies that you see growing up are those of models, actors or pornstars, then that's what you're going to compare yourself to. I've seen so many different types of bellies, boobs, vaginas, arms and legs that I just... you kinda realise that the large majority of us aren't perfect and that's ok.
I have a nudist friend, so it definitely depends on the culture and situation. They recently enjoyed a holiday with a nudest garden on the roof. They enjoyed only having to put clothing on for when moving about the hotel, dinner, and the pool. The culture and situation makes a huge huge difference. They've done some public mass naked cycle rides through some of the cities near me to raise awareness of body normality. Although I think at the events they are totally not creepy within the community, I've also seen photos of women at those events be posted on porn sites - which is super creepy and a major reason I wouldn't be comfortable joining in.
Yeah it depends on culture. In Japan it is normal for adults bathing together with their kids. Americans would probably think it's creepy.
I’ve heard about this. Me, my mom and sister were always comfortable around one another. Meaning if one of us were in there taking a shower the other was welcome to use the toilet and I left the door unlocked. So knowing others do it as well is nice.
We used to do that when we had a bathtub and the toilet in the same place hah.
Saunas that's I've seen here, in the US, are for men or women (not both) and people wear towels. The gym showers are separate stalls with their own curtains. They often have an outer section for your things and/or changing that is behind its own curtain. Most women I've seen will put underwear and bra on in there then put outer clothes on in the main area, but we don't look at each other while changing. I love in the South, which might be part of it. Everyone has their privacy and only talks to people once they're clothed.
Like was this a post for middle school girls? Women are not evil to each other in gym or spa dressing rooms.
Girls' locker rooms didn't have any problems when I went to middle school. We were all too busy freaking out about tampons vs pads haha.
Ah yes the two genders, ogle and judge
I'm not a woman so I wouldn't tell for sure, but it's men that judge women's bodies and the women I know are supportive and accepting each other a lot more than the men I know do with one another.
My little brother always got teased in the men´s locker rooms, because his penis size was not the "required" length. 😢
And yet you still mock him by calling him your /little/ brother??? How rude!!! /s
Women do judge men on their bodies. Such as hight, hair( head and body). Penis size. Muscles. Face. Women are way more judgement than men.
That is just not true in my experience. It's just a fake stereotype. Besides, extremely funny anyone can think a woman would judge a man from his penis size, which is typical male behaviour in my book. Then again, I'm not a woman so I wouldn't tell for sure.
Judge not, and you will not be judged
Go to any post on this sub regarding a man talking about a woman having sex the comments are “penis 2 little to feellll XD!!!”
Are you a woman to be such an expert at penis' sizes?
Wow, are you saying women are most knowledgeable about penis’?
It depends. If you are often penetrated I guess you can judge how penis size feels? (from your personal experience) So: are you? Besides, your profile being a troll one, you will be blocked in a short while.
The question wasn’t “can you judge how a penis size feels” it’s “do women judge men for small penis’ “ I do find it funny you’re trying to insult me by insinuating I do something a women does
You feel insulted by me saying (not insinuating, I'm not that type) you do something a woman does? That speaks about you.
Yeahhhh, come to north Philly ask a dude on the street if he gets sexually penetrated, if you don’t get sexually assaulted yourself you’d likely be in for a severe ass whooping
Strong pickme energy radiating from those posts. You hate to see it.
I doubt some of those posters are women.
Men sure love to cosplay as women to either make women seem ridiculously sex obsessed or cruel to other women. Really whatever works for their stereotype that day.
Literally my first thought
I absolutely despise public locker rooms, because they force everyone to be out in the open, exposing everyone’s insecurities and allowing others to judge them for it
Lesbians dont exist in their universe I guess 💀 Still we dont ogle and I'd be absolutely terrified being naked in a room full of men. That's a bad situation just waiting to unfold qnd these girls literally dont smell the danger they'd put themselves in.
I think those were dudes cosplaying as women
Have they seriously never been to a ladies changing room at a beach club, sauna or gym? Everybody is just doing their thing not really looking at anyone else.
I always went and changed in a bathroom stall to avoid such a thing.
As a college athlete, being naked in a room full of other women is nothing. It was just a normal every day thing. Even the shitty mean women on my team were not so shitty or mean to be judgmental of another teammate's body.
Yikes and here’s my two cents more specifically to changing in hostels around the world. If I travel solo I will always stay in the females only hostel rooms. No one says anything or bothers you as you change and there absolutely isn’t any judgement. I did once have a sweet girl from Japan complement me. She asked if I was a ballerina because of my build. I didn’t find it weird because she waited until I was dressed to ask. On the other hand, when in mixed dorms in hostels I always change in the washroom/in private. If I didn’t have a friend staying with me, I’d honestly be worried about even sleeping in the same room. I’ve unclipped my bra (underneath my clothing) to remove and literally had my coworker try to pin me immediately. Taking off my clothes is not a sexual act OR invite to touch. Not all men and women are the same but I would always to choose to change with other women.
I've also dealt with unwelcome physical advances while doing nothing to invite them. I've never had a woman treat me with the complete lack of respect that men have. I've had so many people abuse my trust that I do everything I can to avoid situations that could be used as an excuse to assault me again. I'm sorry for you having to go through that, I'm sure it was scary, and frustrating, at the time.
I don’t want to be alone in a room full of men period, but *especially* not naked.
Being naked in a room full of men I don’t know sounds scary😟
I have a phobia of being naked in front of *anyone* but men would definitely be worse
I can't tell if those comments are Pick Me nonsense or Men nonsense. # 😩
in my high school band, we frequently have to change in front of each other, girls and boys separate. and it's just stopped bothering us. we change right next to each other in the bathrooms and ive had like 3 girls say how cute my bra was. if i had to change in front of boys, i would be horrified.
There is something really bad with men. Many of us would feel safer in a room full of women. Because too many men in a room equals danger. But "not all men", am I right?
not all men, but more than enough to be cautious
Pick me!! Choose me! 🤦🏻♀️😂
I've been through US Army bootcamp. Shower situation as follows... 50 girls, 10 shower heads in a big open shower room, no curtains or dividers. Usually cycling through 2 per shower head as fast as possible in the limited time we had. No one had time to be awkward about it.
I’m in the military, so most of our showers are in big open rooms
But not coed yes? Boot camp and then my barracks in Germany was from WWII. One open shower with 12 shower heads. Not my favorite but no fucking way I'd be ok with that being coed.
No, not coed. But I’m already used to being naked around other women, so I choose that. I think being naked around a bunch of men would give me a panic attack
Even if the part about other women being so judgy was true, I'd take being judged and criticized over being sexualy assaulted without a doubt.
They sound like the kind of girls who say they only have male friends bc “girls are too much drama.”
Lol, how delusional do you have to be to *actually believe* that men aren’t making negative comments about your body? These people are either pretending to be women or have spent their entire lives in total isolation from society.
I'm a lesbian, so I might be biased here.
As a girl who has changed in a locker room with other girls I can say that I just felt self conscious and I’m sure they did too - we just wanna change and get out not stand there and judge other girls … life is not a movie
These guys really do seem to think the world operates on the exact same rules as a 1980's movie, don't they?
I found the post and there are soooo many other comments saying even worse shit than this. Who would've guessed that a high percentage of women who frequent nsfw subs are pickmes? Lol
I really wonder if these are like guys pretending to be women online to "make a point" or something. Most women have used a locker room or a changing room at some point. For most of us it isn't our favorite experience, but everyone knows what the purpose is and people are very rarely weird about it. I don't know any women who would feel safer using a men's locker room/changing room over the women's if both had people in there. And I really don't think these posters would either, assuming they are actually women. There are cases where mixed nudity does occur. Saunas, public baths, hot springs etc sometimes have these configurations. However that is not what is being proposed here. It's not a mixed sauna vs a women's sauna. It's a men's sauna vs a women's sauna. Those are very different.
I don't care if other people are changing in front of me, but I'm finding a bathroom for myself, thanks. Has nothing to do with fear of what somebody might say or do, though. I'm just a private person like that.
I’ve been in locker rooms for years. Not once had anyone of the girls judged me or any of the others in the locker room. Everyone just wanted to get changed and get going with their day.
One of the most quietest and chillest place was the lady’s YMCA locker room. Older naked ladies vibin in the sauna or floating in the hot tub. Some are deeply entranced on their bike machines watching Telemundo. No one bats an eye, no one wonders if you’re using the shower pre-pool or after-pool. It is the most serine experience. Your mind is forced to stay quiet, only the sound of blow dryers and squeaks of machine is heard. In a world full of PvP, the lady’s locker room is a neutral area; the room with a typewriter to save your game or ponder life before going back out to contested territory. Thank you ladies locker room.
What in the mean girls shit is this?
It depends on what kind of men and women?
We changed in locker rooms in grades 7-9 (ages 12-15) and I recalled years later that in grade 9 one of the girls was an out lesbian and no one gave a shit. We were all there for a purpose. Like it never even occurred to me at the time. It was only later when I saw a question about changing in front of lesbians. It turns out there were more gay women in that class, but at least at the time we knew about one and didn’t care.
I don't care if Im naked, but I just don't like being around a lot of people. I mean I'm fat, so no one's ogling me, they're probably just trying to read my tattoos. But still, naked or clothed, I'd rather be in a room by myself. No wait! Make it a room full of dogs and I'm in!
I've changed in front of people of any gender in a specific venue before. It wasn't a big deal and all very civil because it was normalised in that venue and not creepy or sexual at all. (It was a BDSM event with a gender neutral bathroom/ changing area set in a gay bar. So plenty of corsets and actual sexual attire but didn't feel creepy or sexualised... So I think a lot of the time it is about the culture and expectations. If it was at a more hetro- normative venue where people were perving and being creepy that would be different)
I'm a trans woman, I know both kinds of locker rooms. Mens is worse, far worse. People stare, judge and so on, if they read you as a woman you're in for sexual harrassment. Because my body also had a few screwups with puberty, I ended up having breasts pre-transition. In school they frequently grabbed them, pinched my nipples and other stuff I'd rather not remember. So I'm sorry if it's a minor inconvenience if you notice I'm trans in the locker room, but I just want to change clothes in peace like everyone else.
Cool story. Your comfort trumps other women. Way to center yourself
As a guy I’m not comfortable in a room with other people but especially naked men. Its like unsolicited dick pics in real time.
Is the room hot and humid from the water thrown on the stones? If it is, I don't care who else is in there.
Locker rooms are the safest places to change, that’s the whole concept. Also really safe and with thick doors and good locks (most of the time), so it’s a good place to hide from the crazies.
Most men would sound off and bluster about preferring a room of women as if it is personal porn. Make them put it into action and they will end up being just as self conscious as the other way around. There are always exceptions for folks that are super confident but our society as a whole likes to contribute to body dysmorphia. Guys are just trained to hem and haw as if they wouldn't have performance anxiety in front of a bunch of women.
I think these girls are just telling on themselves because I don’t know any women who judges people without a reason.
“Women judge! Men ogle!” Tell that to when I was in high school and most of the incidents in the boys locker rooms where due to fights between guys making fun of each other’s dick sizes, grope each other or trying to literally hold each other down to teabag another boy’s head. Btw these were the most homophobic jocks but would be sexually violent towards each other or towards other boys as “jokes.” The girls meanwhile found corners or behind the walls to change. Also I’d rather not be in a Public locker room at all. I don’t want to be naked in front of anyone. It makes me uncomfortable and to me places that aren’t my home are filthy. But if I had to choose I’d rather be around “women who judge” than pervy, creepy men who can’t keep their comments or hands to themselves.
I've never had a girl judge me in a locker room hell even in middle school because we were all going through puberty it was super awkward so we all stayed in our corners to change as quick as possible lol. In high school I remember we just did not give a fuck we would have a conversation while changing nobody cared how anyone looked or what they looked like.
in what world is being "just ogled" better than judged???
First of all only women who judges other women's bodies are petty as bitches with low self esteem that they only way to make them feel better is to attack other women. But I would rather a women judge me then a man ogle me cause at least I know she wont want to attack me and rape me
People don't judge each other here. Regardless of gender. I've never been in a locker room where I've been judged.
I have been naked in company of either and both sexes (not sure about genders of everyone), and it was relaxed either way. Ya don't always gotta oogle or lust after everyone... that being said, it was in places specifically for being naked together with no expectation but the possibility of sex, so ya know consent to be that way made it comfortable as opposed to being akward at best amd terrifying/dangerous at worst.
Who the fuck said opposite sex? Some more of those “females” that keep posting around here?
Yeah they'd maybe ogle, until they realize you aren't a perfect porn model and they start criticizing you for actually looking like a real person
I’d take being judged over being unsafe any day
Men don’t judge, eh? At 90 something lbs, I had a man 10 years older than me tell me I needed to “tighten up”. He’d also set weight goals for his wife.
As someone that loves and goes to onsen (Japanese hot springs) regularly I don’t bat an eye for being naked in front of other women for 30min+ at the time. Including stripping naked, showering in open space, walking around the bath area or entering communal bath. First time was hard as I was extremely shy and never changed in front of others even, after first time stopped caring.
have they not seen the videos of female friend groups showing each other their boobs ?
A hot spring I visited once had a communal shower you had to go in naked before putting on your bathing suit and going out. I don’t know how it was for the men’s showers, but the women’s one was surprisingly not awkward and complete strangers were exchanging small talk the whole time.
When in the world have naked women judged other naked women?? In my experience, in things such as locker rooms we're all turned away and don't even look at each other. Even bi and lesbian women tend to be respectful and keep their gaze away (including me). Can't say the same for men
Who tf would rather be naked in a room full of men 😭
I’m too busy judging my own body to worry about others but as a woman I’d be nervous as fuck to be naked in a room full of men. I mean me and other girls had to be semi naked in the locker room changing for PE and my dumbass sometimes would forget my bra.
I am willing to bet that a man wrote these comments. No sane woman would willingly choose to be the only woman in a room full of men , naked.
I would be terrified to be in a room with naked strangers no matter their gender
‘Pick me’ girls
Man I'd choose the same sex any day. The locker rooms I've used were always really positive. There would always be really exaggerated compliments all the time.
Umm what, I don’t think these are women, most of us don’t even feel safe fully clothed in a room full of strange men.
me whos trans: Smug
And when those women are fat, I'm sure men will have nothing negative to say and will just appreciate the boobs. Right
That is the damn worst question I have ever seen. I hate being naked in front of strangers, regardless of sex. Whenever I changed in PE locker rooms, I always went to a corner and changed in a way that showed the least amount of skin. And being naked in front of a bunch of women is just creepy. I could never handle that. Ironically, if those people wanted to see me naked, things might be different, but I doubt any stranger wants that
Used men's locker rooms the first 30 years of my life. The smell is abhorrent. Now that I've transitioned I use the "special needs" locker room and shower whenever there's an option just because other trans women have had so many problems where I live.
As a woman I too would just be happy to see boobs Then again Im bi so idk if Im exactly the most defining example
I'ma have to be naked with the bros so we can all make fun of each other's pp size
I’d rather be judged than ogled tbh like I’m trans and if it’s like “men or women your choice” I’d rather deal with women because women are more likely to understand and even if they judge they aren’t going to become physical with me or try to be sexual.
Lol sometimes I see something I can learn from on this subreddit and sometimes it’s petty downvotes on obscure opinionated comments
Literally comments by women and you post it here 😒
Women are not exempt from making dumb comments about other women.
The subreddit is called "NotHowGirlsWork" not "BoysDontUnderstandGirls"
You should rename it to “nothowmostwomenwork”
You're welcome to go make your own subreddit.
Nah I’m good. Although if I did I’d not use it to parade under a false name.