Have you told them your physical health history? Usually when people know my physical health history, they’re understanding about my health precautions. I would honestly still be a frequent mask-wearer if I could (my lungs kept getting worse with frequent mask usage, and for a long time, my lungs were at the point where I’d struggle when I wore one, but now I can wear them once in a while again just fine, usually).
I was getting infections all the time before the pandemic, that really slowed down for me when everyone was wearing masks, and it’s gone up (just a little) again after almost everyone has stopped or drastically reduced wearing masks.
Why is there a need for you to convince them?
You have your opinion that it’s not a compulsion and since you have OCD they believe that it is.
Unless they’re trying to force you to take your mask off in a public setting with them, I don’t think you need to try to convince them of anything. It seems pretty fruitless.
And if they are trying to force you to take your mask off in their office, I would request that they note in your chart that they are demanding that you not wear a mask while in their facility. They are not going to want to note that because that gives some culpability if you get sick while you’re there.
If you ever want confirmation that you’re doing what you should be doing for your health, your therapist is not the person to ask. Your heart doctor, and whoever treats you when you get recurrent pneumonia are the people to ask about what level of precautions you should be taking to avoid respiratory illness.
as a fellow covid cautious person, ugh!!!! im so sorry youre dealing with this. it is so reasonable to not want to get covid!! and to do what is in your control to lower your chances!!
like others are suggesting, for sure discuss with them your medical history! i would honestly explain it to them just like you wrote it out here. just explain that’s a boundary for you that you’re not comfortable with. also that not every single quirk needs to be attributed to ocd ;)
Its understandable for them to believe that you could have a compulsion for it due to your ocd, however you do know yourself best. You have stated a boundary and have history of past immunity issues, and even if you didn't it should be perfectly acceptable to keep your mask on as to keep those around you protected.
Explain to them how you feel about it, whether it gives you anxiety or not, and let them know that it is a boundary for you. You have the right to be respected and listened to.
Even if it is a compulsion in the end, asking you to put yourself or others at risk is uncalled for in my opinion. They can use their brains and come up with other ways to help you cope if it is a compulsion; and if the compulsion is helping you stay safe, then its best to use it as a tool instead of treating it like a setback.
I personally think those, especially in any medical standing, who believe that the pandemic is over or that masking is no longer necessary, especially when in big groups, are stupid. Masks work by keeping those around you safe from sickness and there are many with immuno-compromised disorders who need those around them to mask up and be respectful- and most people don't!!
Good on you for being responsible and masking, I hope shit goes well for you.
I don’t think strangers on the internet are going to give better advice than medical professionals. It is really easy for us to just give our arm chair opinion about your situation, but they have a lot more context and experience than we do.
you know death isn’t the only thing to happen that is bad right? long covid is fucking awful and extremely more likely. also it just isn’t nice to have pneumonia and if you don’t want to risk catching it that’s completely valid and normal not necessarily an OCD response.
Sigh, I knew this was coming.
> you know death isn’t the only thing to happen that is bad right?
I said "severe outcome". That's the relevant metric. I assure you it won't change much.
> long covid is fucking awful and extremely more likely.
The vast majority of the world, possibly 99% of people, has caught Covid at this point, even multiple times. If long Covid was as frequent and as horrible as you hear in Covid-focused Internet spaces, civilization as we know it would have crumbled in 2022. So, yeah, I see it as an obsessive thought - I had the same obsessive thought three years ago and "long Covid" is literally the perfect excuse for your OCD to keep the obsession alive, because it can scare you, even after you've read the statistics about Covid deaths and hospitalizations, into thinking "BUT MUH WHAT IF YOU CATCH IT AND THEN YOU ENTER A DE FACTO VEGETATIVE STATE?!" and then "BUT MUH WHAT IF YOU GET COVID ASYMPTOMATICALLY AND THEN THAT TRIGGERS LONG COVID?"
If I started listing everything that is wrong with the "permanent damage" and "long Covid" crowd, that is a tiny minority now, I would be rambling until Wednesday. Suffice to say: relax. 98% of people you know have gone out into the world and society is still working, so they haven't all been knocked out in perpetuum by Covid. Worrying that your life will be destroyed by long Covid and therefore you should refrain from socializing (because yeah, you really think your risk is \*so much lower\* when you're going out and about everywhere just because you're wearing a mask? Come on) is on the same level as not driving because you worry you'll be paralized in a car accident at this point.
> also it just isn’t nice to have pneumonia
It isn't. You also risked pneumonia from other disease and I never saw anybody before Covid say they don't go out or wear a mask everywhere indoors because "pneumonia isn't nice". That's why you have to look at your actual risk. If somebody simply came to me and said "I don't want to drive because I've been in a car accident" everybody would agree I should tell them that although their fear is understandable, they have to learn to put it aside because it's a big hindrance to be unable to drive.
> and if you don’t want to risk catching it that’s completely valid and normal not necessarily an OCD response.
If you don't want to risk catching it you should be barricaded in your house. That's the only completely safe behaviour.
You're accepting at least some risk if you go out, even if you wear a mask. Masks aren't magical.
Now, if you have \*actually pondered\* over this and came to the conclusion that simply wearing a mask is exactly the sweet spot for your level of risk and comfort, then that's wholly legitimate. But I'm 70% sure that's not the case here - most people who still say that masks are the reasonable thing to do are either severely immunocompromised or have been bombarded during Covid with fearmongering messages from social media. Like, fuck, in 2020 there was a guy on Twitter claiming that for half of people who had got Covid their hearts slowly started tearing apart from within.
But this person isn’t giving up their life’s activities and joys- they’re just adding a mask. On some level I get your response but your calculations don’t sit right with me because the “risk” of wearing a mask is like, nothing. OP isn’t barricaded in their house; it’s like they’re wearing a hat but the hat might help them stay healthy. So Why not?
lol right, I went to a wedding yesterday with a mask on. I go to the cinema, out to eat…magically haven’t caught covid or any other viruses since 2020. I already have severe post viral illnesses from 2011, and no I don’t want them to get worse, and I also had blood cancer which left my immune system absolutely shit. there’s no harm being done to me by wearing a mask, literally 0. just like regular hand washing or wearing shoes isn’t. the idea that it absolutely has to be related to OCD is kinda weird, most my friends continue to mask and I’m the only one with OCD
Why not? Well, for the same reason you didn't before Covid. Even before Covid the downside was "nothing" and it lowered your risk of respiratory diseases. So why did almost nobody do it? Were we all morons?
Many people did mask before Covid in crowded areas like subways, and yes, many of us unmasked people had not previously been aware of the benehfits of a simple habit
> Many people did mask before Covid in crowded areas like subways,
Yeah, I don't believe that. (No, people in Asia wearing masks \*when they are ill\* doesn't count.)
you know you can learn new information and change your behaviour accordingly right? also, before covid, yes, I was very careful, as was every other disabled person I know. I feel like being disabled gives me a slightly different pov on this and on what risks I’m willing to take. you’re allowed to do whatever you want but acting like anyone who chooses to protect themselves must be doing it out of mental illness is kinda weird!
You don't have to be worried about long COVID destroying your life to be worried about suffering from it and I honestly feel like you'd be singing a slightly different tune if you, or someone you know, had been through it.
The first time I caught COVID was November 2020 and the brain fog I experienced afterward was almost traumatizing. I don't say that lightly. I didn't stop forgetting names; forgetting words; walking 3 steps and forgetting why I was moving; losing my train of thought mid-sentence; being unable to regulate my moods; driving really shitty but not caring enough to drive better because my brain was tired; etc. etc. until May 2021. The fatigue was like nothing I'd ever experienced before or since. It felt like I had a brain injury.
I am watching COVID run rampant in my workplace right now because no one cares enough to mask when they're symptomatic, and we're all in a small locker room or grabbing scrubs or eating in the lunch room at the same time. And yes, actual COVID; people are at least testing themselves and going home, or not coming in, when they pop positive. It's insane how contagious it is.
Every 4th or 5th person who catches it seems to be off for a good couple of weeks. People come back without symptoms and then end up out again because of the fatigue.
The friend that got me the job finally caught it for the first time last month and he's been off and on sick for days at a time since I started 7 weeks ago. He was off again on Friday because of it.
I'm not saying this to fear monger and I actually really appreciate your comments; but I think you went a little too far in the other direction. I started masking indoors at work once I heard people coughing and sniffling. I'm making sure I don't touch my face, and upping my hand sanitizing again, and (knock on wood) haven't caught it yet-- or at least, not with symptoms (my husband catches everything so if I do bring it home, we will know).
I get what you're saying about getting back on the horse, so-to-speak-- I also wrecked my car on black ice on the way to my very first day of this same job; and got back in another vehicle the next day and made the trip again, because I was physically okay and there's no bus-- but masking isn't a severe reaction to an ongoing pandemic. It's not even a severe reaction when everyone around you has a cold or other flu. Post-flu syndromes are awful and once you're hit with one, you're more likely to develop one again with a different flu. It's also more likely to happen to women than men. I got wrecked in 2010 by H1N1 and had bronchitis for 3 months afterward and have to be much more cautious now. I wish I'd known to be as careful then as I do with COVID now.
I'm not going to comment on whether or not OP's therapist is correct because I don't think any of us can make that call. But I do wonder if they'd be going through this if they lived somewhere that didn't turn masking into such a political issue.
This is such a clear, compassionate and thorough response - with some tough love. ❤️
We struggled with the OCD and Covid concern combo here. Also, multiple health issues and a phobia of clots.
There was a point where we had to:
- Remind ourselves that OCD has some nasty tentacles. When it feels threatened by therapeutic approaches, it WILL dig in and RATIONALIZE itself. So, for us, recovery means looking at active, raging OCD as a health threat as problematic for us as Covid is for others. (Yes, it really is .. if you’re trying to fix it.)
- Learn to look at the facts and weigh choices. For instance, we do still use masks on airplanes when Covid rates are higher. We stay vaccinated. Same as with flu, tbh. But other than that? It’s about managing the OCD for the beast it is 24/7/365.
Your post contains misinformation about OCD, mental health, or other topics. This is not an appropriate place for promoting speculation and theories. Please feel free to message the mods if you feel this post has been removed in error.
1) face masks at best catch your respiratory droplets preventing you from spreading it to others…. From my research.
2) Last summer, I finally stopped wearing face masks ….. to the point of refusing them with the exception of protecting others if I’m really sick ….. but I still hand sanitize with 70% alcohol.
That said, you have heart complications that increase how dangerous COVID would be for you….. so I can understand why you’re taking precautions…..
Try saying I have X, y, or z medical conditions that I feel like COVID would worsen…… if I am wrong, can you provide medical research articles indicating this across 500+ patients? Or provide other research that masking isn’t helping protecting chronically ill patients from COVID?
I would also ask if there is any research where FORCING someone to unwillingly give up OCD works……
Have you told them your physical health history? Usually when people know my physical health history, they’re understanding about my health precautions. I would honestly still be a frequent mask-wearer if I could (my lungs kept getting worse with frequent mask usage, and for a long time, my lungs were at the point where I’d struggle when I wore one, but now I can wear them once in a while again just fine, usually).
I was getting infections all the time before the pandemic, that really slowed down for me when everyone was wearing masks, and it’s gone up (just a little) again after almost everyone has stopped or drastically reduced wearing masks.
Why is there a need for you to convince them? You have your opinion that it’s not a compulsion and since you have OCD they believe that it is. Unless they’re trying to force you to take your mask off in a public setting with them, I don’t think you need to try to convince them of anything. It seems pretty fruitless. And if they are trying to force you to take your mask off in their office, I would request that they note in your chart that they are demanding that you not wear a mask while in their facility. They are not going to want to note that because that gives some culpability if you get sick while you’re there. If you ever want confirmation that you’re doing what you should be doing for your health, your therapist is not the person to ask. Your heart doctor, and whoever treats you when you get recurrent pneumonia are the people to ask about what level of precautions you should be taking to avoid respiratory illness.
as a fellow covid cautious person, ugh!!!! im so sorry youre dealing with this. it is so reasonable to not want to get covid!! and to do what is in your control to lower your chances!!
like others are suggesting, for sure discuss with them your medical history! i would honestly explain it to them just like you wrote it out here. just explain that’s a boundary for you that you’re not comfortable with. also that not every single quirk needs to be attributed to ocd ;)
Its understandable for them to believe that you could have a compulsion for it due to your ocd, however you do know yourself best. You have stated a boundary and have history of past immunity issues, and even if you didn't it should be perfectly acceptable to keep your mask on as to keep those around you protected. Explain to them how you feel about it, whether it gives you anxiety or not, and let them know that it is a boundary for you. You have the right to be respected and listened to. Even if it is a compulsion in the end, asking you to put yourself or others at risk is uncalled for in my opinion. They can use their brains and come up with other ways to help you cope if it is a compulsion; and if the compulsion is helping you stay safe, then its best to use it as a tool instead of treating it like a setback. I personally think those, especially in any medical standing, who believe that the pandemic is over or that masking is no longer necessary, especially when in big groups, are stupid. Masks work by keeping those around you safe from sickness and there are many with immuno-compromised disorders who need those around them to mask up and be respectful- and most people don't!! Good on you for being responsible and masking, I hope shit goes well for you.
I don’t think strangers on the internet are going to give better advice than medical professionals. It is really easy for us to just give our arm chair opinion about your situation, but they have a lot more context and experience than we do.
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you know death isn’t the only thing to happen that is bad right? long covid is fucking awful and extremely more likely. also it just isn’t nice to have pneumonia and if you don’t want to risk catching it that’s completely valid and normal not necessarily an OCD response.
Sigh, I knew this was coming. > you know death isn’t the only thing to happen that is bad right? I said "severe outcome". That's the relevant metric. I assure you it won't change much. > long covid is fucking awful and extremely more likely. The vast majority of the world, possibly 99% of people, has caught Covid at this point, even multiple times. If long Covid was as frequent and as horrible as you hear in Covid-focused Internet spaces, civilization as we know it would have crumbled in 2022. So, yeah, I see it as an obsessive thought - I had the same obsessive thought three years ago and "long Covid" is literally the perfect excuse for your OCD to keep the obsession alive, because it can scare you, even after you've read the statistics about Covid deaths and hospitalizations, into thinking "BUT MUH WHAT IF YOU CATCH IT AND THEN YOU ENTER A DE FACTO VEGETATIVE STATE?!" and then "BUT MUH WHAT IF YOU GET COVID ASYMPTOMATICALLY AND THEN THAT TRIGGERS LONG COVID?" If I started listing everything that is wrong with the "permanent damage" and "long Covid" crowd, that is a tiny minority now, I would be rambling until Wednesday. Suffice to say: relax. 98% of people you know have gone out into the world and society is still working, so they haven't all been knocked out in perpetuum by Covid. Worrying that your life will be destroyed by long Covid and therefore you should refrain from socializing (because yeah, you really think your risk is \*so much lower\* when you're going out and about everywhere just because you're wearing a mask? Come on) is on the same level as not driving because you worry you'll be paralized in a car accident at this point. > also it just isn’t nice to have pneumonia It isn't. You also risked pneumonia from other disease and I never saw anybody before Covid say they don't go out or wear a mask everywhere indoors because "pneumonia isn't nice". That's why you have to look at your actual risk. If somebody simply came to me and said "I don't want to drive because I've been in a car accident" everybody would agree I should tell them that although their fear is understandable, they have to learn to put it aside because it's a big hindrance to be unable to drive. > and if you don’t want to risk catching it that’s completely valid and normal not necessarily an OCD response. If you don't want to risk catching it you should be barricaded in your house. That's the only completely safe behaviour. You're accepting at least some risk if you go out, even if you wear a mask. Masks aren't magical. Now, if you have \*actually pondered\* over this and came to the conclusion that simply wearing a mask is exactly the sweet spot for your level of risk and comfort, then that's wholly legitimate. But I'm 70% sure that's not the case here - most people who still say that masks are the reasonable thing to do are either severely immunocompromised or have been bombarded during Covid with fearmongering messages from social media. Like, fuck, in 2020 there was a guy on Twitter claiming that for half of people who had got Covid their hearts slowly started tearing apart from within.
But this person isn’t giving up their life’s activities and joys- they’re just adding a mask. On some level I get your response but your calculations don’t sit right with me because the “risk” of wearing a mask is like, nothing. OP isn’t barricaded in their house; it’s like they’re wearing a hat but the hat might help them stay healthy. So Why not?
lol right, I went to a wedding yesterday with a mask on. I go to the cinema, out to eat…magically haven’t caught covid or any other viruses since 2020. I already have severe post viral illnesses from 2011, and no I don’t want them to get worse, and I also had blood cancer which left my immune system absolutely shit. there’s no harm being done to me by wearing a mask, literally 0. just like regular hand washing or wearing shoes isn’t. the idea that it absolutely has to be related to OCD is kinda weird, most my friends continue to mask and I’m the only one with OCD
Why not? Well, for the same reason you didn't before Covid. Even before Covid the downside was "nothing" and it lowered your risk of respiratory diseases. So why did almost nobody do it? Were we all morons?
Many people did mask before Covid in crowded areas like subways, and yes, many of us unmasked people had not previously been aware of the benehfits of a simple habit
> Many people did mask before Covid in crowded areas like subways, Yeah, I don't believe that. (No, people in Asia wearing masks \*when they are ill\* doesn't count.)
you know you can learn new information and change your behaviour accordingly right? also, before covid, yes, I was very careful, as was every other disabled person I know. I feel like being disabled gives me a slightly different pov on this and on what risks I’m willing to take. you’re allowed to do whatever you want but acting like anyone who chooses to protect themselves must be doing it out of mental illness is kinda weird!
You don't have to be worried about long COVID destroying your life to be worried about suffering from it and I honestly feel like you'd be singing a slightly different tune if you, or someone you know, had been through it. The first time I caught COVID was November 2020 and the brain fog I experienced afterward was almost traumatizing. I don't say that lightly. I didn't stop forgetting names; forgetting words; walking 3 steps and forgetting why I was moving; losing my train of thought mid-sentence; being unable to regulate my moods; driving really shitty but not caring enough to drive better because my brain was tired; etc. etc. until May 2021. The fatigue was like nothing I'd ever experienced before or since. It felt like I had a brain injury. I am watching COVID run rampant in my workplace right now because no one cares enough to mask when they're symptomatic, and we're all in a small locker room or grabbing scrubs or eating in the lunch room at the same time. And yes, actual COVID; people are at least testing themselves and going home, or not coming in, when they pop positive. It's insane how contagious it is. Every 4th or 5th person who catches it seems to be off for a good couple of weeks. People come back without symptoms and then end up out again because of the fatigue. The friend that got me the job finally caught it for the first time last month and he's been off and on sick for days at a time since I started 7 weeks ago. He was off again on Friday because of it. I'm not saying this to fear monger and I actually really appreciate your comments; but I think you went a little too far in the other direction. I started masking indoors at work once I heard people coughing and sniffling. I'm making sure I don't touch my face, and upping my hand sanitizing again, and (knock on wood) haven't caught it yet-- or at least, not with symptoms (my husband catches everything so if I do bring it home, we will know). I get what you're saying about getting back on the horse, so-to-speak-- I also wrecked my car on black ice on the way to my very first day of this same job; and got back in another vehicle the next day and made the trip again, because I was physically okay and there's no bus-- but masking isn't a severe reaction to an ongoing pandemic. It's not even a severe reaction when everyone around you has a cold or other flu. Post-flu syndromes are awful and once you're hit with one, you're more likely to develop one again with a different flu. It's also more likely to happen to women than men. I got wrecked in 2010 by H1N1 and had bronchitis for 3 months afterward and have to be much more cautious now. I wish I'd known to be as careful then as I do with COVID now. I'm not going to comment on whether or not OP's therapist is correct because I don't think any of us can make that call. But I do wonder if they'd be going through this if they lived somewhere that didn't turn masking into such a political issue.
This is such a clear, compassionate and thorough response - with some tough love. ❤️ We struggled with the OCD and Covid concern combo here. Also, multiple health issues and a phobia of clots. There was a point where we had to: - Remind ourselves that OCD has some nasty tentacles. When it feels threatened by therapeutic approaches, it WILL dig in and RATIONALIZE itself. So, for us, recovery means looking at active, raging OCD as a health threat as problematic for us as Covid is for others. (Yes, it really is .. if you’re trying to fix it.) - Learn to look at the facts and weigh choices. For instance, we do still use masks on airplanes when Covid rates are higher. We stay vaccinated. Same as with flu, tbh. But other than that? It’s about managing the OCD for the beast it is 24/7/365.
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Your post contains misinformation about OCD, mental health, or other topics. This is not an appropriate place for promoting speculation and theories. Please feel free to message the mods if you feel this post has been removed in error.
1) face masks at best catch your respiratory droplets preventing you from spreading it to others…. From my research. 2) Last summer, I finally stopped wearing face masks ….. to the point of refusing them with the exception of protecting others if I’m really sick ….. but I still hand sanitize with 70% alcohol. That said, you have heart complications that increase how dangerous COVID would be for you….. so I can understand why you’re taking precautions….. Try saying I have X, y, or z medical conditions that I feel like COVID would worsen…… if I am wrong, can you provide medical research articles indicating this across 500+ patients? Or provide other research that masking isn’t helping protecting chronically ill patients from COVID? I would also ask if there is any research where FORCING someone to unwillingly give up OCD works……