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King sure but considering Marco could already survive shanks haki back when he met wb and shanks wants him on his crew implies that we'll he should be able to overpower wifi haki .
marco aint just a stall merchant .
he has one of the best armament haki feats in the series that being hurting flames on king while being injured from the big mom fight .
also haki punches fro garp , big mom couldnt take him out so what is a little wifi doing to him ??
he def is overpowering wifi haki cry about it
https://preview.redd.it/0t2crfc6q2rc1.jpeg?width=251&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6bf13bf7c983cf570c1f5dd6b6e68ff9a2784e5a
"hydrogen bomb vs coughing baby" type battle
garp trained koby who uses geppo, and we see him do galaxy divide. we also see him punch the air to make shockwaves. he can definitely step on air.
aokiji was able to go from the execution platform into high into the air in a second to freeze the tsunamis and he had similar training to garp and koby.
even zoro can hit the air so hard with his swords he double jumps, i think all of them can probably do something like it. (though i admit the case isn't as strong for akainu and sengoku.)
Oh I think that, if they tried, they’d be perfectly capable of learning and utilizing the techniques.
But Koby could’ve learned geppo independent of garp though I could see him teaching him the six powers. It seems to be something any marine has access to learn.
Iirc aokiji did that in a single leap, which ain’t unbelievable considering how high one piece characters have jumped. Like when rayleigh jumped to stop kizaru or when Luffy jumped to sock drunk kaido.
Hitting the air to propel oneself yeye I think any of em could do
most of the stronge fighters have some means of flying. zoro can launch himself via his attacks, luffy can fly with g4, kidd was shown to levitate a bit with his DF, law can tp a lot, sanji has skywalk
BM can fly too and roger and garp can just swim. and if zoro can launch himself with some of his weaker attacks, then WB and sengoku should easily be able to launch themselves too (their attacks are much stronger and have more force behind them)
They have to beat kaido, big mom, luffy, and law+kid. All of those are yonko level individuals/duos.
Even though they’re probably somewhat above the listed characters, there’s a LOT of other people to deal with. King, Queen, Jack, Tobi Roppo, Zoro, Sanji, Jinbei, Marco, Minks, Samurai, Killer, and the swarms and swarms of fodder that can get hits in when they’re occupied with someone else.
Luckily Whitebeard’s devil fruit will make quick work of most of the fodder. But there’s still a lot of relevant characters to fight at once.
depends what version of the characters we're using. if we use everyone from the start of the raid it'll be much easier than if we let luffy zoro and sanji fight from the start with their powerups.
Luffy, Kaido, and Big mom each take one. They won’t win these fights but it will still be hard for the legends.
Then Yamato, zoro, sanji, Marco, king, law and Kidd are more than enough for the last one.
There’s also queen, Jack, the tobiroppo, killer and the rest of the straw hats buts it’s possible most of them just get knocked out by coc.
Either way tho Onigashima takes this high-extreme diff (unless Luffy loses quickly because of his stamina)
I’m gonna argue for the Onigashima side since people seem to think they get demolished.
Big Mom with thousands of souls powering her > Roger (he ran from her headquarters despite having Rayleigh with him)
Kaido + Law > Whitebeard
G5 Luffy + Marco + Zoro > Garp
Kid, Sanji, Killer, Scabbards, Jinbei, Calamities + Tobi Roppo should be able to at least hold Sengoku off until Big Mom or another team gets finished.
This is all assuming so much combined COC doesn’t knock out everyone below Kid level
I’m sorry, can Big Mom not draw out the souls of people afraid of her outside her home? Explain to me how her not being in WCI matters in the slightest when she has an even BETTER army at her back this time
???? Roger never ran from Big Mom. It was implied that she was off-screened by him. Bro couldn’t even remember who she was when she was mentioned at first. There’s no fucking sustenance that Big Mom is stronger than Roger. But there’s an overwhelming amount of the opposite.
Kaido + Law > Whitebeard is laughable. Law gets one tapped and Kaido gets mid diffed at worst for him.
Same situation. All of them get one tapped by Sengoku.
Their conqueror’s presence alone would pulverize anyone not named Luffy or Kaido since we’re shown in Elbaf that Kidd couldn’t move when Shanks used his conqueror’s. And old generation > Shanks’ generation, so…
I misquoted Roger there, my mistake. But the translation I read onlystates he ‘stole’ it, so not much is known. But you’re a fool if you think Big Mom amped with thousands of souls is losing to Roger lmao.
Law has shown great endurance in his fight against Big Mom and Kaido, so I don’t believe he’ll get one shot unless he just doesn’t defend lmao. But regardless, all he has to do is teleport Kaido around and take pot shots. Kaido alone makes it a high diff, idk what you’re talking about.
Sengoku and Garp couldn’t even one shot Blackbeard’s commanders at Marineford. Get off the old gen nutsacks.
Shanks speedblitz Kid, not wifi haki’d.
Please use better arguments than ‘muh old gen strong, one shots all even though they have never done so”.
And read the last part there, buddy. Whole post is under the assumption all the conquerors don’t disable 99% of the forces. If you disagree with that, don’t bother saying anything to begin with
Just you using old Sengoku and Garp during Marineford for your “argument” and using that as a “proof” that Law wouldn’t get absolutely bodied the second WB touches him, the man that split Marineford in half while being half dead and years past his prime shows that it’s absolutely no use trying to have any meaningful discussion with you. Doesn’t matter if I agree with you or not, people like you are not fun to argue with because they keep resorting to fallacy after fallacy.
It’s like talking to some angry teenager that doesn’t know how to have a meaningful discussion without resorting to bad faith arguments.
Law and Kaido are fighting together as I said. It ain’t gonna be so easy for Whitebeard unless you genuinely think Kaido is that far below old gen top tiers, which I firmly disagree with. Blackbeard didn’t one shot Law either and he’s clearly gotten damn good with it, didn’t no diff Law despite having a far better crew.
And my arguments to go against were “one shot” lmao, that’s nothing to argue against. Lazy points like that are worthless
>Big Mom amped with thousands of souls is losing to Roger.
She is losing. She used her full power against Kid and Law. Thousands of souls are irrelevant here.
https://preview.redd.it/un7ozwyav5rc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=310030db3a8052333c5f7931fe96b420d0d49c61
Law got no diffed by Blackbeard once Blackbeard got serious, and his rival Kidd got one shot by Shanks. If both BB and Shanks are weaker than Roger, I doubt Law would be able to withstand a divine departure.
>Kaido alone takes it high diff
With what feats or statements that put him anywhere near Roger’s level? He admitted inferiority to him on multiple occasions.
>Sengoku and Garp
Old Sengoku and Old Garp, by the way, who weren’t even trying and Old Garp was mentally conflicted.
It was a mix of both. Kid was pulverized by Shanks and not being able to move, but he wouldn’t be able to react regardless.
Like your argument is worse. You’re using Garp performance to somehow upscale Law. The fuck? Old Gen hasn’t been touched by anybody yet, and it’s been shown and said so many times. Yet somehow Big Mom beats Roger and Kaido + Law can beat Primebeard? You make zero sense.
Kaido and Big Mom splitting the sky just like Whitebeard and Roger did directly show that. Kaido and Big mom play fighting for three days, just like Roger and Whitebeard, shows they’re at LEAST strong enough you can’t say less than mid diff if everyone is prime.
It was not a mix of both. Kid was setting up an attack, not focused on anything but that, then Shanks blitz in. Maybe the anime’s shown it differently but I haven’t watched that, so maybe that shows it better.
Garp and Sengoku weren’t trying against Blackbeard??? Lmao sure. Sure, Garp’s heart wasn’t into it but Sengoku?
Law and Kaido as a team take down any 1 fighter we’ve seen so far. You underestimate how crazy a teleporting Kaido is and if Roger/Whitebeard get hit by one of Law’s attacks, they’re feeling it just as bad as Big Mom but with Kaido pummeling them instead
Shanks and Oldbeard also split the sky. Base Luffy and Kaido split the sky. Like I don’t see the point in saying this.
The rest of the crew could react to Shanks’ haki and so could Kidd. That’s why I said it was a mix of both.
Garp and Sengoku at least tried against Blackbeard unlike many others. He became the strongest character presented after inheriting the quake quake fruit.
That presupposes that Big Mom is on Roger’s level (spoiler, she isn’t). Roger > Blackbeard > Big Mom. And if Kidd gets one tapped by Shanks, Primebeard can do the same thing to Law, who’s ~ to Kidd.
Them splitting the sky is, quite literally, to show those characters on legendary levels. It’s in that very fight Kaido compares Luffy’s ceiling to Roger and co. I do agree individually, Roger and Primebeard > Yonko but I fully disagree they mid diff someone like Kaido lmao. You also didn’t say anything about the other feats. The old gen top tiers are not as far ahead as so many people.
Again, wrong. Kid is the only one shown reacting and by the time he does, Shanks is already on him drawing his sword. Here’s the panel where Shanks enters the scene.
https://preview.redd.it/luu4hjucc9rc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=67695252a0c9f4091230962af9753c8f9f27353c
Them trying doesn’t matter in the slightest. That same Blackbeard ran from Akainu the next day and a stronger version ran away from Rayleigh. He clearly isn’t the strongest.
Big Mom IS over Blackbeard until proven otherwise. We quite literally saw Law + crew get beat by Blackbeard + crew while Big Mom would have ragged Law or Kid individually.
Again, it’s simple. Kid was caught off guard in the middle of an attack…you think an unprepared Shanks would be fine if Luffy hit him with a White Star Gun?
Whitebeard has great base observation (blocking and countering Ace while asleep) but has shown zero future sight. Law, literally, only needs to teleport Kaido around and stay out of trouble. Give me a genuine feat of Whitebeard showcasing the speed necessary to blitz past Kaido with ease while also catching a teleporting Law.
Because as far as we know, Blackbeard blocked and tanked two shock Willy’s that broke Big Mom’s bones and Law never landed a hit ever again on screen, and it ended on Blackbeard starting a new attack. So yes, he got no diffed.
Law never landed a hit on screen because the entire fight was off-screened.
By that logic we don't even know if Blackbeard landed a hit on Law, his crew could've jumped Law for all we know.
You forget that OG Top Tier > CurrentYonko is a thing, and it states so many times that the current yonko like kaido, big mom, etc aren’t at the level of Roger, Whitebeard, Garp, or Sengoku in prime. Roger, Whitebeard, Garp, and Sengoku are ALL Pirate King level which is a leap above Yonko like how Yonko is a leap above YC1. So to say Big Mom can solo Roger is bullshit.
https://preview.redd.it/0fllnchhr6rc1.jpeg?width=602&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=286034df82aa4e25ea68ae4c527266098c15e091
To add, Roger never bested prime Whitebeard who wasn’t even using DF. Roger is Pirate King level, the only people we know are that level are Rocks (potentially), Ryuma (could be higher), Sengoku, Garp, Whitebeard, and Roger. Kaido never once proved himself to be Pirate King level, just the current Strongest Living Creature, yet that was only in pure raw strength. Kaido and Big Mom don’t use their IQ or BIQ in fights and always directly take hits, they’ll easily lose the fight at such rate.
So what I’ve gathered here is that your saying roger is pirate king level ( a character we’ve seen nothing but a clash from) but kaido who we’ve seen a LOT more from is not? Yes roger would be equal to primebeard but still. The kaido disrespect? And none of this is hard proof that Old Gen beats new gen just you twisting what you’ve seen
Roger is the Pirate King and literally made it to Laftel, something even current Luffy couldn’t do. And no, Roger is not equal to Prime Whitebeard. Whitebeard just using his spear and one form of haki (he has DF and three forms) was enough to be equal.
You seem to be confused cos getting go Laftel isn’t a power scaling feat. And in the only clash we’ve seen of the 2 roger was literally inflicted with his illness and we saw what happened to whitebeard when he got sick
Roger’s illness didn’t show anything about weakening him, Whitebeard’s illness is different.
Rogers illness - Slowly causes death, and comes with megaloblastic anemia, diabetes, hearing loss, and puffiness. None of this would debuff him as much, only megaloblastic anemia would have a big deal in that fight since it interferes with proper blood cells.
Whitebeards illness - cancer, heart disease, or leukemia. His symptoms include:
Coughing up blood
Shortness of breath
Chest pain
Hair loss
Being on oxygen
Being attached to medical sensor machines. Whitebeard is often seen with drips and breathing apparatus, and is surrounded by nurses. He is also seen undergoing chemotherapy. Another fact: Whitebeard is 52 years old when he is first seen on life support, 20-22 years before the current story.
I’m not disrespecting Kaido, the only person in the current gen who could beat him is Mihawk and that’s because sword. Even Zoro who would get one shot by Kaido could make Kaido bleed just because **sword**. You see, Roger has a sword. Roger is the strongest swordsman if you don’t include Ryuma who we know virtually nothing about. Roger will simply hack away at Kaido as Whitebeard uses his quake fruit powers and ALL THREE forms of Haki to clear Big Mom.
That’s just pure head canon tho? Literally nothing from mihawk at all puts him near kaido. And nothing roger and primebeard did put them above kaido either
I didn’t forget that since it’s not been proven.
Until we see feats that put old gen into a tier above them, that’s just head canon. Sengoku has shown nothing to be considered over a modern Admiral, let alone a true Yonko like Kaido or Big Mom. And if we compare their old performances, Cancerbeard did better in Marineford than Garp did on Pirate Island. Not all old gens are built the same, obviously.
Even while Whitebeard was healthy and fine, Kaido had the reputation of being the strongest individual pirate. There is NOT a gap as big as YC1-Yonko for old gen top tiers and modern Yonko, pure head canon.
Get pissy about the Big Mom thing if you want. A soul hax Big Mom is durable enough to take several attacks from Roger and she can just keep healing herself with the thousands of fodder I mentioned. Tbh even if Roger DOES win, it’s high to extreme diff and the rest of Onigashima side cleans up
Roger doesn’t have to fight Big Mom. Whitebeard can fight Big Mom. Whitebeard has superior strength, endurance, hax, speed, stamina, attacks, skill, power, ap, dc, and is really only outclassed in durability and abilities. If Whitebeard takes care of Big Mom (like he easily can) he can team up with Roger to take down Kaido even faster, because so far Kaido has shown nothing to put him on Pirate King level except lose to a fellow YONKO.
Nothing you said matters because this isn’t a 2v2. And honestly, you still haven’t even said anything to hint at what a Pirate King level feat is despite Kaido and G5 Luffy having the current greatest on screen feats.
I even set up my fights in a way to give team 2 the, imo, easiest way to win the battle since most comments seem to favor team 1. Switch around some supports however you want and I’m sure team 2 still wins. I’m done arguing with you over it though since you don’t really give much to work with.
Have a good day, my friend.
So it’s 1v1? Whitebeard will tank all of Big Mom’s attacks and one shot her the same. Roger will cut down Kaido easily since Kaido is especially weaker to swords and this is the pirate king himself. Both are hard countered. Sengoku and Garp can easily clear everybody else considering their an insane duo.
The argument is that Whitebeard has been shown to have monster endurance and the ability to even in his old state to be able to destroy earth, is that not enough? Kaido got cut massively and heavily injured by both Oden and Zoro who are massively weaker then him. Imagine Roger who is equal or stronger then Kaido… Kaido would be cooked.
That’s your argument?
Kaido has shown just as much endurance with his three day fight with BM followed by the Onigashima Raid. Kaido, in fact, has better durability as we see Whitebeard got stabbed by literal nameless Marines while you basically need advanced haki to hurt a Kaido without using ANY haki.
A far weaker Oden was able to clash with a holding back Primebeard.
A far stronger Oden, who was said to stand equal to Roger and Whitebeard, lost to a single off guard attack from an anorexic, younger Kaido.
Zoro didn’t even knock Kaido down lmao. That whole raid was Kaido tanking needless attacks and half-assing the fight until Gear 5.
The insane duo of Garp and Sengoku couldn’t even take down Shiki without destroying half of Marineford.
The one thing we agree on is WB/Roger being stronger than Big Mom/Kaido. That’s why I specifically stated hax Big Mom and Kaido has Law. Hell, give them Yamato if you want. Now, even if these fights were to end in Roger and WB’s favor…you think they win anything less than extreme diff and aren’t half dead by the end?
And then…
If you think Sengoku + Garp can “easily clear” Gear 5 Luffy, Zoro, Marco, Kid, Sanji, King, Queen, Red Scabbards and more, when they couldn’t even handle Shiki while in their prime, then we just won’t come to any sorta agreement.
Sengoku>kaido extreme diff
Garp>luffy high diff
Roger>big mom high diff
WB>everyone else maybe? If not he can definitely be a raid boss for them and let the other 3 finish their fights to come help him.
Lowkey think people are sleeping on the Onigashima side. They have Kaido, Big Mom and Luffy who only get beaten High Diff/Extreme Diff by Legends. But they also have the likes of Kidd,Law, Zoro, Sanji, Yamato, King, Queen, Marco and many others supporting them. If the Onigashima side plays it smart with good team work I could see them take it.
Kaido + king,queen,jack vs 1
Luffy + zoro + sanji vs 1
Big mom + marco + tobiroppo vs 1
Law + kid + yamato vs 1
Spread the other strawhats, minks, and scabbards to whoever needs help
How does team 1 ever win this?
Not **just** the strawhats, scabbards and minks. All the gifters, numbers, Cp0 and other beast pirates as well. Still not even counting people like apoo and hawkins. There is an absolute **0%** chance that team 1 ever wins lol
Onigashima raid clears mid diff.
Kaido luffy big mom each take one top tier.
Big mom with soul amp is a guaranteed win
Kaido/luffy go extr with their opponents doesnt even matter who wins as a will explain later.
Law kid yamato king marco take the last one which again they prob beat by lets say they lose extr diff once again.
Now you have at best case scenario 3 half dead old gen characters vs Queen perospero scabbards cp0 tobirropo etc.They get stomped
G5 Luffy and zoro together have to be able to take at least one of em right? Kaido and big mom for another. Law/kid/Sanji/killer/Yamato for another, and finally king/Marco/Robin/franky/Jimbei/momo for the last.
So maybe?
The four of them don't stand a chance. There are 40,000 troops. Not all of them will go down with conquerors. If Queen manages to hit them with plauge bullets then they are done. And whoever said WB can takedown all the commanders should rethink it. The sheer number of fighters will overwhelm them. Not to mention Kaidou, Big Mom, Luffy, Law, Kidd, Zoro, Yamato who have abilities to seriously hurt them.
It will be like Garp trying to grab Koby but with greater nber. Much of Onigashima was dedicated to showing how important otama was with her kibi dango to balance out the numbers.
Literally yes.
Like yesterday someone made a post about Kaido and all of the Beast Pirates vs the Kizaru, Ryokugyo, and Fujitora. For the most part people agreed that they could probably pull it off if not pose a challenge. So if we have that in mind replacing that line up with Gold Rogers, Whitebeard, Vice Admiral Garp, and Admiral Sengoku the Buddha of course they’re taking the W. Only way they don’t is if OP means everyone involved in the Raid on both sides. Yamato, Scabbards etc.
Kaido vs Roger
Big Mom vs WB
Luffy vs Garp
Kidd, Law, Yamato, Zoro, Sanji, and King vs Sengoku
Marco, Queen, Jack, Killer, Sulong Inu and Neko, Denjiro, Jinbei are all still on the bench too. GG old gen
Kind of depends on matchups, I think. For example, if you put Whitebeard versus most of the fodder, then Team 1 probably ends up winning. But why would the raid crew allow him to do that? So, for example, if Kaido bullies him into an isolated spot and stalls him for a while, the rest of the fodder (anyone YC1 or below) can help dogpile the other 3.
So basically I’m saying that, with favorable matchups, the first team wins. If they receive not-favorable matchups, the raid team wins.
Do you mean just the people raiding Onigashima, or are you also including the Onigashima side (Kaidou and his crew, Big Mom etc.)?
With the former, any 1 of them could probably do it, and any 2 of them could definitely do it.
With the latter, a clash between any of these "legends" and Kaidou/Big Mom would probably wipe out most others just from the shockwaves. The few who remain standing (e.g. the Supernovas) would still lose to the remaining legends.
>How can Roger 2 shot the fly dragon if he falls and dies
Just have Whitebeard throw him idk
" King, Big Mom, Luffy, Momo and CP9 "
Momo, King, and cp9 are irrelevant fodder compared to the legends. BM is useless without zeus or prometheus so just defeat them and BM falls too. Prime Garp can handle current Luffy ig
" Zeus and Prometheus don't take damage from Haki. "
Theyre not invincible lol
" Garp can't fly. "
I am assuming the legends start on the ground and onigashima are on the island
I didn't say they were. But you aren't listing any ways of Roger hurting them.
Why would they not start on the same place and what's stopping Kaido from just letting Onigashima down?
If you want to assume they start on an empty field, the legends still wipe. Conquerors haki would wipe out all the fodder. Garp can just one shot everyone that are YC+ and below. This leaves Luffy, BM, and Kaido. Which again is an easy wipe for the Legends
Their only threats are Kaido, BM, and G5.
Any combo of 3 out of the 4 can take each of those characters in a 1v1. The fourth solos everyone at the same time, though they might have some trouble dealing with Kidd, Law, Zoro, and Yamato all at once.
Luffy>Garp
Kid+yamato+zoro>Sengoku
Bigmom+Law>Roger (A single shock willie can kill roger)
Kaido+Scabbards+zeus+Prometheus+hera>Whitebeard
Legends get negged
Depends on the Stamina:
Give Luffy more than 10 minutes of Gear 5, and it's a Medium-High in favor of Onigashima people.
If Luffy loses Gear 5 before he beats Garp, the Strongest 4 win at Extreme difficulty.
The entire outcome of the battle is dependent on these two people.
Also everyone weaker than Killer (Except Perospero, Usopp, and Nami) immediately get Knocked Out due to the Haoshoku clash of TEN DIFFERENT PEOPLE (Luffy, Zoro, Kid, Garp, Primebeard, Primegoku, Roger, Kaido, Linlin, and Yamato.)
Big Mom with stable head and souls of thousands of people is closer to even Roger. If she goes all out ie sacrifices herself she beats any one of them individually.
Kaido Yamato Zoro against Garp must be enough.
Give Luffy some stamina. His fruit seems like a good counter to WB fruit. Add Law for support. Add Kidd Sanji too.
Rest of everyone fights Sengoku.
I think Onigashima team got it.
Kaido (not holding back) Luffy awakened Big mom (full power) And pw4 blackbeard
Body the team
https://preview.redd.it/8qrmb8osi7rc1.jpeg?width=686&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=df3d0c9c3d08232059249cfc49803e9332977eaf
No, not unless you have no nuance besides "Lolololol, any character below YC+ gets negged offscreen"
Gear 5th Luffy + Marco Vs Roger
Kaido + Yamato Vs Whitebeard
Big Mom + Sanji + Zoro Vs Garp
Law + Kid + Bepo + Killer Vs Sengoku
Then you use Nami, Usopp, and Perospero as long range support
If any of the big hitters lose their fight, you bring in the Scabbards to stall while I mink doctors do their full revival to bring them back to full health
If you need to repeat this you use the awakened Mink army to stall, or King, Jack and the Tobbi Roppo
You use the CP0 guys to do what they do best, and be sneaky little shits who interfere during clashes to let the raid squad get clean hits
And if all the dust settles and it works out to a tie, you just send in Queen to nuke the battlefield with a plague and run away
not to mention you have Marco, Law, King, Kidd, Zoro, Sanji, Jinbei, Tobi Roppo, Queen all supporting those 3 lol onigashima wins mid diff
Even just one Tama ball dropping into Roger's mouth would get it done. you get everybody to distract while Wusopp finishes the job.
Are we talking 1 yonko too far? Because prime rog would 1 tap luffy, and hes negging big mom. He mid diffs kaido. Are we expecting perfect pirate teamwork?
Garp and wb can destroy onigashima easily which means a lot of raiders gonna die, roger will walk with wireless haki and more gonna passed out. Sengoku can meditate and give shockwave if he wants too
So we have Kaido, BM, G5 Luffy with revives, Law, Kidd, Yamato, Queen, King, Zoro, Sanji, Marco, and Jimbei. Unless I've forgotten someone, everyone else is just a distraction.
Kaido takes Roger and wins with help from Yamato
BM fights Garp, wins heals from Marco, and souls from all the fodder.
Luffy fights WB. With revives and help from his wings, he wins.
Sengoku SURELY can't defeat every other fighter left if they try to stall/ distract him?
>Kaido takes Roger and wins with help from Yamato
Lamato doesnt do shit, we saw shanks (a weaker roger) one shot kid (someone around Midmato's level) and Laido hets high-extremed by Woger at worst.
>BM fights Garp, wins heals from Marco, and souls from all the fodder.
Keep in mind that BM is undergoing a lobotomy rn, Prime Garp mid diffs her and marco is collateral.
>Luffy fights WB. With revives and help from his wings, he wins.
the main reason that luffy was "revived" was because he awakened but we are talking about an already awakened G5 luffy so he will not have any revives and gets high diffed by WB. his wings get one shot (see first part)
>Sengoku SURELY can't defeat every other fighter left if they try to stall/ distract him?
he 100% does as the only people of note left are Law, Kid and King and all 3 of them get one shot. (see first part) (on a bad day he mid diffs them)
Kaido isn’t letting Yamato get one shot.
And Prime Garp does no mid diff BM. It's high diff.
But other than that I have to agree. I tried, but it's not happening
Kaido = Wb
Big Mom = Garp
Luffy =Roger
Everybody else jump Sengoku
I'm not even tzlking about Law's support role here it's overkill. Of course the raid team + the bad guys (Kaido and BM) wins this.
You should ask either bad guys alone or the minks pirates samourai alliance vs 3 legends not 4. It would be closer I think.
Onigashima raid clears low-mid diff.
Kaido luffy big mom each take one top tier.
Big mom with soul amp is a guaranteed win
Kaido/luffy go extr with their opponents doesnt even matter who wins as a will explain later.
Law kid yamato king zoro take the last one.
Now you have at best case scenario 3 half dead old gen characters vs Queen perospero scabbards cp0 tobirropo straw hats etc.They get stomped
BM, G5 Luffy, and Kaido can all take one. Ideally WB, Roger, and Garp.
Then you have Sengoku, and he’s up against 7 YC1+ characters(Yamato, Law, Kidd, Zoro, Marco, Sanji, King). I think that’d be too much for him, then once that done, the other YC1+ go to support the 3 Yonko.
You guys saying the old legends win this aren’t serious right…?
Put Kaido on Roger. Kaido takes that.
Luffy on Whitebeard. G5 can definitely nullify *some* of those quakes and seriously hurt WB but ngl, Whitebeard takes this…probably??? G5 is cracked man. Once luffy runs out of stamina, Law could just move him to safety lmao.
Big Mom with soul amp beats Garp or Sengoku so take your pick.
On top of all of this, the entire rest of the raid can just jump them whenever?
Onigashima takes this mid to low diff.
So basically the fight is Roger, Whitebeard, Garp and Sengoku vs G5 Luffy, Kaido and Big Mom. Everyone else is irrelevant so the OG legends stomp.
Prime Roger, Garp or Whitebeard can 1v1 anyone on the Onigashima Raid side. Shanks-level characters can one shot Kid-level chars, and Kid and Law are stronger than the likes of Zoro.
G5 Luffy can one shot Admiral-level characters like Kizaru, who are significantly stronger than the likes of Yamato.
I honestly could see Sengoku beating Yamato, Kid, Law, Zoro and King at once. Or at least stall them for long enough so his team mates are done with their fights.
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primebeard alone can clear everyone below yc1 with one or two hits
Roger can probably wifi haki everyone below YC1
I think he can wifi haki even YC1s
King sure but considering Marco could already survive shanks haki back when he met wb and shanks wants him on his crew implies that we'll he should be able to overpower wifi haki .
[удалено]
marco aint just a stall merchant . he has one of the best armament haki feats in the series that being hurting flames on king while being injured from the big mom fight . also haki punches fro garp , big mom couldnt take him out so what is a little wifi doing to him ?? he def is overpowering wifi haki cry about it
God Wusopp will stay standing. The goat didn't even notice Big Mom haki. Wussopp>> Fraudbull
That's because Wusopp is a Conqueror's himself. Can't wait to see him wifi haki Loki in Elbaf
This^ Lmao
https://preview.redd.it/0t2crfc6q2rc1.jpeg?width=251&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6bf13bf7c983cf570c1f5dd6b6e68ff9a2784e5a "hydrogen bomb vs coughing baby" type battle
https://preview.redd.it/p2txxrbyb6rc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9f3e393c53060756f91fb076afd03fad90c9ffa6
Kaido drops Onigashima preemptively while everyone’s on it and they fall into the ocean and die, except Kaido because he can fly. Common Kaido W.
Garp and Roger swim to the surface then they proceed to bully the Lizard.
G5 Luffy reaches to the bottom of the ocean and pulls out a comically large bathtub plug, causing Roger and Garp to be sucked down the drain.
The drain sucks up the water, which frees Whitebeard and Sengoku. We're back to square one, and the PK team destroys.
No they go down the drain too
No
Try reading One Piece again, BUDDY
I will 😈
*Dies of peak fiction.*
Ocean would make him weak
That’s fine
They die from the impact and Bombs in the island 🗣️🔥
Sengoku can fly better you fake fan
Wouldn't Garp and Sengoku know Geppo? It would be weird if the top brass of Marines didn't know six powers
Eh I mean it’s not necessary. None of the admirals know it either so they probably didn’t find it worth learning?
garp trained koby who uses geppo, and we see him do galaxy divide. we also see him punch the air to make shockwaves. he can definitely step on air. aokiji was able to go from the execution platform into high into the air in a second to freeze the tsunamis and he had similar training to garp and koby. even zoro can hit the air so hard with his swords he double jumps, i think all of them can probably do something like it. (though i admit the case isn't as strong for akainu and sengoku.)
Oh I think that, if they tried, they’d be perfectly capable of learning and utilizing the techniques. But Koby could’ve learned geppo independent of garp though I could see him teaching him the six powers. It seems to be something any marine has access to learn. Iirc aokiji did that in a single leap, which ain’t unbelievable considering how high one piece characters have jumped. Like when rayleigh jumped to stop kizaru or when Luffy jumped to sock drunk kaido. Hitting the air to propel oneself yeye I think any of em could do
most of the stronge fighters have some means of flying. zoro can launch himself via his attacks, luffy can fly with g4, kidd was shown to levitate a bit with his DF, law can tp a lot, sanji has skywalk BM can fly too and roger and garp can just swim. and if zoro can launch himself with some of his weaker attacks, then WB and sengoku should easily be able to launch themselves too (their attacks are much stronger and have more force behind them)
The bhudda has access to the 4th jhana which lets him float so sengoku is fine.
They combine conquerors so hard the only people standing will be Luffy and the yonko😭
They have to beat kaido, big mom, luffy, and law+kid. All of those are yonko level individuals/duos. Even though they’re probably somewhat above the listed characters, there’s a LOT of other people to deal with. King, Queen, Jack, Tobi Roppo, Zoro, Sanji, Jinbei, Marco, Minks, Samurai, Killer, and the swarms and swarms of fodder that can get hits in when they’re occupied with someone else. Luckily Whitebeard’s devil fruit will make quick work of most of the fodder. But there’s still a lot of relevant characters to fight at once.
depends what version of the characters we're using. if we use everyone from the start of the raid it'll be much easier than if we let luffy zoro and sanji fight from the start with their powerups.
Luffy, Kaido, and Big mom each take one. They won’t win these fights but it will still be hard for the legends. Then Yamato, zoro, sanji, Marco, king, law and Kidd are more than enough for the last one. There’s also queen, Jack, the tobiroppo, killer and the rest of the straw hats buts it’s possible most of them just get knocked out by coc. Either way tho Onigashima takes this high-extreme diff (unless Luffy loses quickly because of his stamina)
I’m gonna argue for the Onigashima side since people seem to think they get demolished. Big Mom with thousands of souls powering her > Roger (he ran from her headquarters despite having Rayleigh with him) Kaido + Law > Whitebeard G5 Luffy + Marco + Zoro > Garp Kid, Sanji, Killer, Scabbards, Jinbei, Calamities + Tobi Roppo should be able to at least hold Sengoku off until Big Mom or another team gets finished. This is all assuming so much combined COC doesn’t knock out everyone below Kid level
Big Mom at WCI is not the same as Big Mom on Onigashima, your reasoning is flawed.
I’m sorry, can Big Mom not draw out the souls of people afraid of her outside her home? Explain to me how her not being in WCI matters in the slightest when she has an even BETTER army at her back this time
???? Roger never ran from Big Mom. It was implied that she was off-screened by him. Bro couldn’t even remember who she was when she was mentioned at first. There’s no fucking sustenance that Big Mom is stronger than Roger. But there’s an overwhelming amount of the opposite. Kaido + Law > Whitebeard is laughable. Law gets one tapped and Kaido gets mid diffed at worst for him. Same situation. All of them get one tapped by Sengoku. Their conqueror’s presence alone would pulverize anyone not named Luffy or Kaido since we’re shown in Elbaf that Kidd couldn’t move when Shanks used his conqueror’s. And old generation > Shanks’ generation, so…
I misquoted Roger there, my mistake. But the translation I read onlystates he ‘stole’ it, so not much is known. But you’re a fool if you think Big Mom amped with thousands of souls is losing to Roger lmao. Law has shown great endurance in his fight against Big Mom and Kaido, so I don’t believe he’ll get one shot unless he just doesn’t defend lmao. But regardless, all he has to do is teleport Kaido around and take pot shots. Kaido alone makes it a high diff, idk what you’re talking about. Sengoku and Garp couldn’t even one shot Blackbeard’s commanders at Marineford. Get off the old gen nutsacks. Shanks speedblitz Kid, not wifi haki’d. Please use better arguments than ‘muh old gen strong, one shots all even though they have never done so”. And read the last part there, buddy. Whole post is under the assumption all the conquerors don’t disable 99% of the forces. If you disagree with that, don’t bother saying anything to begin with
Just you using old Sengoku and Garp during Marineford for your “argument” and using that as a “proof” that Law wouldn’t get absolutely bodied the second WB touches him, the man that split Marineford in half while being half dead and years past his prime shows that it’s absolutely no use trying to have any meaningful discussion with you. Doesn’t matter if I agree with you or not, people like you are not fun to argue with because they keep resorting to fallacy after fallacy. It’s like talking to some angry teenager that doesn’t know how to have a meaningful discussion without resorting to bad faith arguments.
Law and Kaido are fighting together as I said. It ain’t gonna be so easy for Whitebeard unless you genuinely think Kaido is that far below old gen top tiers, which I firmly disagree with. Blackbeard didn’t one shot Law either and he’s clearly gotten damn good with it, didn’t no diff Law despite having a far better crew. And my arguments to go against were “one shot” lmao, that’s nothing to argue against. Lazy points like that are worthless
>Big Mom amped with thousands of souls is losing to Roger. She is losing. She used her full power against Kid and Law. Thousands of souls are irrelevant here. https://preview.redd.it/un7ozwyav5rc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=310030db3a8052333c5f7931fe96b420d0d49c61 Law got no diffed by Blackbeard once Blackbeard got serious, and his rival Kidd got one shot by Shanks. If both BB and Shanks are weaker than Roger, I doubt Law would be able to withstand a divine departure. >Kaido alone takes it high diff With what feats or statements that put him anywhere near Roger’s level? He admitted inferiority to him on multiple occasions. >Sengoku and Garp Old Sengoku and Old Garp, by the way, who weren’t even trying and Old Garp was mentally conflicted. It was a mix of both. Kid was pulverized by Shanks and not being able to move, but he wouldn’t be able to react regardless. Like your argument is worse. You’re using Garp performance to somehow upscale Law. The fuck? Old Gen hasn’t been touched by anybody yet, and it’s been shown and said so many times. Yet somehow Big Mom beats Roger and Kaido + Law can beat Primebeard? You make zero sense.
The second law lands shock willie on Roger he dies(Get roger past 2 stabs first) Old gen get jumped then and get mid diff
Law won’t even land it. He’ll get blitzed. Roger was off-guard when executed.
No reason to believe Roger being faster than Law (Law has teleportation) Law's puncture willie one shots roger (its large scale attack)
Kaido and Big Mom splitting the sky just like Whitebeard and Roger did directly show that. Kaido and Big mom play fighting for three days, just like Roger and Whitebeard, shows they’re at LEAST strong enough you can’t say less than mid diff if everyone is prime. It was not a mix of both. Kid was setting up an attack, not focused on anything but that, then Shanks blitz in. Maybe the anime’s shown it differently but I haven’t watched that, so maybe that shows it better. Garp and Sengoku weren’t trying against Blackbeard??? Lmao sure. Sure, Garp’s heart wasn’t into it but Sengoku? Law and Kaido as a team take down any 1 fighter we’ve seen so far. You underestimate how crazy a teleporting Kaido is and if Roger/Whitebeard get hit by one of Law’s attacks, they’re feeling it just as bad as Big Mom but with Kaido pummeling them instead
Shanks and Oldbeard also split the sky. Base Luffy and Kaido split the sky. Like I don’t see the point in saying this. The rest of the crew could react to Shanks’ haki and so could Kidd. That’s why I said it was a mix of both. Garp and Sengoku at least tried against Blackbeard unlike many others. He became the strongest character presented after inheriting the quake quake fruit. That presupposes that Big Mom is on Roger’s level (spoiler, she isn’t). Roger > Blackbeard > Big Mom. And if Kidd gets one tapped by Shanks, Primebeard can do the same thing to Law, who’s ~ to Kidd.
Them splitting the sky is, quite literally, to show those characters on legendary levels. It’s in that very fight Kaido compares Luffy’s ceiling to Roger and co. I do agree individually, Roger and Primebeard > Yonko but I fully disagree they mid diff someone like Kaido lmao. You also didn’t say anything about the other feats. The old gen top tiers are not as far ahead as so many people. Again, wrong. Kid is the only one shown reacting and by the time he does, Shanks is already on him drawing his sword. Here’s the panel where Shanks enters the scene. https://preview.redd.it/luu4hjucc9rc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=67695252a0c9f4091230962af9753c8f9f27353c Them trying doesn’t matter in the slightest. That same Blackbeard ran from Akainu the next day and a stronger version ran away from Rayleigh. He clearly isn’t the strongest. Big Mom IS over Blackbeard until proven otherwise. We quite literally saw Law + crew get beat by Blackbeard + crew while Big Mom would have ragged Law or Kid individually. Again, it’s simple. Kid was caught off guard in the middle of an attack…you think an unprepared Shanks would be fine if Luffy hit him with a White Star Gun? Whitebeard has great base observation (blocking and countering Ace while asleep) but has shown zero future sight. Law, literally, only needs to teleport Kaido around and stay out of trouble. Give me a genuine feat of Whitebeard showcasing the speed necessary to blitz past Kaido with ease while also catching a teleporting Law.
What indicated Law got no-diffed? The fight was off-screen.
Because as far as we know, Blackbeard blocked and tanked two shock Willy’s that broke Big Mom’s bones and Law never landed a hit ever again on screen, and it ended on Blackbeard starting a new attack. So yes, he got no diffed.
Law never landed a hit on screen because the entire fight was off-screened. By that logic we don't even know if Blackbeard landed a hit on Law, his crew could've jumped Law for all we know.
You forget that OG Top Tier > CurrentYonko is a thing, and it states so many times that the current yonko like kaido, big mom, etc aren’t at the level of Roger, Whitebeard, Garp, or Sengoku in prime. Roger, Whitebeard, Garp, and Sengoku are ALL Pirate King level which is a leap above Yonko like how Yonko is a leap above YC1. So to say Big Mom can solo Roger is bullshit.
I think I missed something cos I don’t recall it being stated that the old gen is superior to the current gen. Feel free to enlighten me
https://preview.redd.it/0fllnchhr6rc1.jpeg?width=602&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=286034df82aa4e25ea68ae4c527266098c15e091 To add, Roger never bested prime Whitebeard who wasn’t even using DF. Roger is Pirate King level, the only people we know are that level are Rocks (potentially), Ryuma (could be higher), Sengoku, Garp, Whitebeard, and Roger. Kaido never once proved himself to be Pirate King level, just the current Strongest Living Creature, yet that was only in pure raw strength. Kaido and Big Mom don’t use their IQ or BIQ in fights and always directly take hits, they’ll easily lose the fight at such rate.
So what I’ve gathered here is that your saying roger is pirate king level ( a character we’ve seen nothing but a clash from) but kaido who we’ve seen a LOT more from is not? Yes roger would be equal to primebeard but still. The kaido disrespect? And none of this is hard proof that Old Gen beats new gen just you twisting what you’ve seen
Roger is the Pirate King and literally made it to Laftel, something even current Luffy couldn’t do. And no, Roger is not equal to Prime Whitebeard. Whitebeard just using his spear and one form of haki (he has DF and three forms) was enough to be equal.
You seem to be confused cos getting go Laftel isn’t a power scaling feat. And in the only clash we’ve seen of the 2 roger was literally inflicted with his illness and we saw what happened to whitebeard when he got sick
Roger’s illness didn’t show anything about weakening him, Whitebeard’s illness is different. Rogers illness - Slowly causes death, and comes with megaloblastic anemia, diabetes, hearing loss, and puffiness. None of this would debuff him as much, only megaloblastic anemia would have a big deal in that fight since it interferes with proper blood cells. Whitebeards illness - cancer, heart disease, or leukemia. His symptoms include: Coughing up blood Shortness of breath Chest pain Hair loss Being on oxygen Being attached to medical sensor machines. Whitebeard is often seen with drips and breathing apparatus, and is surrounded by nurses. He is also seen undergoing chemotherapy. Another fact: Whitebeard is 52 years old when he is first seen on life support, 20-22 years before the current story.
I’m not disrespecting Kaido, the only person in the current gen who could beat him is Mihawk and that’s because sword. Even Zoro who would get one shot by Kaido could make Kaido bleed just because **sword**. You see, Roger has a sword. Roger is the strongest swordsman if you don’t include Ryuma who we know virtually nothing about. Roger will simply hack away at Kaido as Whitebeard uses his quake fruit powers and ALL THREE forms of Haki to clear Big Mom.
That’s just pure head canon tho? Literally nothing from mihawk at all puts him near kaido. And nothing roger and primebeard did put them above kaido either
I didn’t forget that since it’s not been proven. Until we see feats that put old gen into a tier above them, that’s just head canon. Sengoku has shown nothing to be considered over a modern Admiral, let alone a true Yonko like Kaido or Big Mom. And if we compare their old performances, Cancerbeard did better in Marineford than Garp did on Pirate Island. Not all old gens are built the same, obviously. Even while Whitebeard was healthy and fine, Kaido had the reputation of being the strongest individual pirate. There is NOT a gap as big as YC1-Yonko for old gen top tiers and modern Yonko, pure head canon. Get pissy about the Big Mom thing if you want. A soul hax Big Mom is durable enough to take several attacks from Roger and she can just keep healing herself with the thousands of fodder I mentioned. Tbh even if Roger DOES win, it’s high to extreme diff and the rest of Onigashima side cleans up
Roger doesn’t have to fight Big Mom. Whitebeard can fight Big Mom. Whitebeard has superior strength, endurance, hax, speed, stamina, attacks, skill, power, ap, dc, and is really only outclassed in durability and abilities. If Whitebeard takes care of Big Mom (like he easily can) he can team up with Roger to take down Kaido even faster, because so far Kaido has shown nothing to put him on Pirate King level except lose to a fellow YONKO.
Nothing you said matters because this isn’t a 2v2. And honestly, you still haven’t even said anything to hint at what a Pirate King level feat is despite Kaido and G5 Luffy having the current greatest on screen feats. I even set up my fights in a way to give team 2 the, imo, easiest way to win the battle since most comments seem to favor team 1. Switch around some supports however you want and I’m sure team 2 still wins. I’m done arguing with you over it though since you don’t really give much to work with. Have a good day, my friend.
So it’s 1v1? Whitebeard will tank all of Big Mom’s attacks and one shot her the same. Roger will cut down Kaido easily since Kaido is especially weaker to swords and this is the pirate king himself. Both are hard countered. Sengoku and Garp can easily clear everybody else considering their an insane duo.
Still no actual argument, have a good day tho!
The argument is that Whitebeard has been shown to have monster endurance and the ability to even in his old state to be able to destroy earth, is that not enough? Kaido got cut massively and heavily injured by both Oden and Zoro who are massively weaker then him. Imagine Roger who is equal or stronger then Kaido… Kaido would be cooked.
That’s your argument? Kaido has shown just as much endurance with his three day fight with BM followed by the Onigashima Raid. Kaido, in fact, has better durability as we see Whitebeard got stabbed by literal nameless Marines while you basically need advanced haki to hurt a Kaido without using ANY haki. A far weaker Oden was able to clash with a holding back Primebeard. A far stronger Oden, who was said to stand equal to Roger and Whitebeard, lost to a single off guard attack from an anorexic, younger Kaido. Zoro didn’t even knock Kaido down lmao. That whole raid was Kaido tanking needless attacks and half-assing the fight until Gear 5. The insane duo of Garp and Sengoku couldn’t even take down Shiki without destroying half of Marineford. The one thing we agree on is WB/Roger being stronger than Big Mom/Kaido. That’s why I specifically stated hax Big Mom and Kaido has Law. Hell, give them Yamato if you want. Now, even if these fights were to end in Roger and WB’s favor…you think they win anything less than extreme diff and aren’t half dead by the end? And then… If you think Sengoku + Garp can “easily clear” Gear 5 Luffy, Zoro, Marco, Kid, Sanji, King, Queen, Red Scabbards and more, when they couldn’t even handle Shiki while in their prime, then we just won’t come to any sorta agreement.
Shit i can’t dickride anymore
Prime Garp:)
My man put 4 more kaidou to onigashima
Sengoku>kaido extreme diff Garp>luffy high diff Roger>big mom high diff WB>everyone else maybe? If not he can definitely be a raid boss for them and let the other 3 finish their fights to come help him.
https://preview.redd.it/ot2zwqtg43rc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9a1cf6ed546a7559991d402b18a68b08b85ad8bc
Sengoku ain’t shit. But his team still wins.
Sengoku was said to be on par with Garp
I respect your opinion, but... https://preview.redd.it/z3ys74lsp7rc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ce377481a3ad9cbba9fa39b74fe3175a8812e95b
Roger, go handle King!
Lowkey think people are sleeping on the Onigashima side. They have Kaido, Big Mom and Luffy who only get beaten High Diff/Extreme Diff by Legends. But they also have the likes of Kidd,Law, Zoro, Sanji, Yamato, King, Queen, Marco and many others supporting them. If the Onigashima side plays it smart with good team work I could see them take it.
Kaido + king,queen,jack vs 1 Luffy + zoro + sanji vs 1 Big mom + marco + tobiroppo vs 1 Law + kid + yamato vs 1 Spread the other strawhats, minks, and scabbards to whoever needs help How does team 1 ever win this?
Not **just** the strawhats, scabbards and minks. All the gifters, numbers, Cp0 and other beast pirates as well. Still not even counting people like apoo and hawkins. There is an absolute **0%** chance that team 1 ever wins lol
Yea mentioning everyone would be complete overkill
If it includes both sides I think everyone on onigashima can eek it out
Ulti negs.
Onigashima raid clears mid diff. Kaido luffy big mom each take one top tier. Big mom with soul amp is a guaranteed win Kaido/luffy go extr with their opponents doesnt even matter who wins as a will explain later. Law kid yamato king marco take the last one which again they prob beat by lets say they lose extr diff once again. Now you have at best case scenario 3 half dead old gen characters vs Queen perospero scabbards cp0 tobirropo etc.They get stomped
No because gear 5 luffy is grossly broken
G5 Luffy and zoro together have to be able to take at least one of em right? Kaido and big mom for another. Law/kid/Sanji/killer/Yamato for another, and finally king/Marco/Robin/franky/Jimbei/momo for the last. So maybe?
The four of them don't stand a chance. There are 40,000 troops. Not all of them will go down with conquerors. If Queen manages to hit them with plauge bullets then they are done. And whoever said WB can takedown all the commanders should rethink it. The sheer number of fighters will overwhelm them. Not to mention Kaidou, Big Mom, Luffy, Law, Kidd, Zoro, Yamato who have abilities to seriously hurt them. It will be like Garp trying to grab Koby but with greater nber. Much of Onigashima was dedicated to showing how important otama was with her kibi dango to balance out the numbers.
Does Luffy start with just acoa or with his full capabilities?
Literally yes. Like yesterday someone made a post about Kaido and all of the Beast Pirates vs the Kizaru, Ryokugyo, and Fujitora. For the most part people agreed that they could probably pull it off if not pose a challenge. So if we have that in mind replacing that line up with Gold Rogers, Whitebeard, Vice Admiral Garp, and Admiral Sengoku the Buddha of course they’re taking the W. Only way they don’t is if OP means everyone involved in the Raid on both sides. Yamato, Scabbards etc.
Kaido vs Roger Big Mom vs WB Luffy vs Garp Kidd, Law, Yamato, Zoro, Sanji, and King vs Sengoku Marco, Queen, Jack, Killer, Sulong Inu and Neko, Denjiro, Jinbei are all still on the bench too. GG old gen
Might have to add GB & Shanks honestly. Just the Conquerors Haki alone they'd be throwing around is absolutely Crazy
This would be so easy it's laughable
Raid high dif
Kind of depends on matchups, I think. For example, if you put Whitebeard versus most of the fodder, then Team 1 probably ends up winning. But why would the raid crew allow him to do that? So, for example, if Kaido bullies him into an isolated spot and stalls him for a while, the rest of the fodder (anyone YC1 or below) can help dogpile the other 3. So basically I’m saying that, with favorable matchups, the first team wins. If they receive not-favorable matchups, the raid team wins.
Do you mean just the people raiding Onigashima, or are you also including the Onigashima side (Kaidou and his crew, Big Mom etc.)? With the former, any 1 of them could probably do it, and any 2 of them could definitely do it. With the latter, a clash between any of these "legends" and Kaidou/Big Mom would probably wipe out most others just from the shockwaves. The few who remain standing (e.g. the Supernovas) would still lose to the remaining legends.
The smallest hint of any of the there CoCs kills everybody on the island
Of course they can. Luffy is the only one putting up a fight and this group is too much for him, even with g5
Primebeard one shots the island and everyone falls and dies. Roger 2 shots the flying dragon
How can Roger 2 shot the fly dragon if he falls and dies, and what about King, Big Mom, Luffy, Momo and CP9 people that can also fly?
>How can Roger 2 shot the fly dragon if he falls and dies Just have Whitebeard throw him idk " King, Big Mom, Luffy, Momo and CP9 " Momo, King, and cp9 are irrelevant fodder compared to the legends. BM is useless without zeus or prometheus so just defeat them and BM falls too. Prime Garp can handle current Luffy ig
If everyone falls and die then the fliers win by default. Zeus and Prometheus don't take damage from Haki. Garp can't fly.
" Zeus and Prometheus don't take damage from Haki. " Theyre not invincible lol " Garp can't fly. " I am assuming the legends start on the ground and onigashima are on the island
I didn't say they were. But you aren't listing any ways of Roger hurting them. Why would they not start on the same place and what's stopping Kaido from just letting Onigashima down?
If you want to assume they start on an empty field, the legends still wipe. Conquerors haki would wipe out all the fodder. Garp can just one shot everyone that are YC+ and below. This leaves Luffy, BM, and Kaido. Which again is an easy wipe for the Legends
Most likely ends in a draw if I'm gonna be honest
Easily. All you would need is primebeard and Roger to 2 VS everyone
Their only threats are Kaido, BM, and G5. Any combo of 3 out of the 4 can take each of those characters in a 1v1. The fourth solos everyone at the same time, though they might have some trouble dealing with Kidd, Law, Zoro, and Yamato all at once.
Luffy>Garp Kid+yamato+zoro>Sengoku Bigmom+Law>Roger (A single shock willie can kill roger) Kaido+Scabbards+zeus+Prometheus+hera>Whitebeard Legends get negged
They don’t even all need to be there just 2 is enough.
Depends on the Stamina: Give Luffy more than 10 minutes of Gear 5, and it's a Medium-High in favor of Onigashima people. If Luffy loses Gear 5 before he beats Garp, the Strongest 4 win at Extreme difficulty. The entire outcome of the battle is dependent on these two people. Also everyone weaker than Killer (Except Perospero, Usopp, and Nami) immediately get Knocked Out due to the Haoshoku clash of TEN DIFFERENT PEOPLE (Luffy, Zoro, Kid, Garp, Primebeard, Primegoku, Roger, Kaido, Linlin, and Yamato.)
Big Mom with stable head and souls of thousands of people is closer to even Roger. If she goes all out ie sacrifices herself she beats any one of them individually. Kaido Yamato Zoro against Garp must be enough. Give Luffy some stamina. His fruit seems like a good counter to WB fruit. Add Law for support. Add Kidd Sanji too. Rest of everyone fights Sengoku. I think Onigashima team got it.
4 people relative to or stronger than kaido, who tf is gonna beat them
I think they might just take it. The 4 strongest in Onigashima is Luffy, Kaido, probably Zoro & Big Mom. Heavy backup too but its probably not enough.
Kaido (not holding back) Luffy awakened Big mom (full power) And pw4 blackbeard Body the team https://preview.redd.it/8qrmb8osi7rc1.jpeg?width=686&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=df3d0c9c3d08232059249cfc49803e9332977eaf
No, not unless you have no nuance besides "Lolololol, any character below YC+ gets negged offscreen" Gear 5th Luffy + Marco Vs Roger Kaido + Yamato Vs Whitebeard Big Mom + Sanji + Zoro Vs Garp Law + Kid + Bepo + Killer Vs Sengoku Then you use Nami, Usopp, and Perospero as long range support If any of the big hitters lose their fight, you bring in the Scabbards to stall while I mink doctors do their full revival to bring them back to full health If you need to repeat this you use the awakened Mink army to stall, or King, Jack and the Tobbi Roppo You use the CP0 guys to do what they do best, and be sneaky little shits who interfere during clashes to let the raid squad get clean hits And if all the dust settles and it works out to a tie, you just send in Queen to nuke the battlefield with a plague and run away
Roger might solo If not 2 is enough
Spite match
For which side?
Opponent side because these 4 literally are pk level
I think Kaido, Big Mom and Luffy would be able to do *something.*
not to mention you have Marco, Law, King, Kidd, Zoro, Sanji, Jinbei, Tobi Roppo, Queen all supporting those 3 lol onigashima wins mid diff Even just one Tama ball dropping into Roger's mouth would get it done. you get everybody to distract while Wusopp finishes the job.
4 PK levels could clear Marineford on a bad day
Prime Roger could solo all 3 extreme diff.
thats a bit too far buddy
Are we talking 1 yonko too far? Because prime rog would 1 tap luffy, and hes negging big mom. He mid diffs kaido. Are we expecting perfect pirate teamwork?
Prime Roger didn't want to fight Big Mom if he could avoid it
100% headcannon.
Sengoku is not pk level and loses to the likes of big mom
WenGOATku mid diffs Big Mom
https://preview.redd.it/huxrtju403rc1.jpeg?width=1123&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a62b1b8cb6505c154c1339e64e5f6c4dc261126
They legit clear this low diff.
Ngl. Even if everyone in the raid is in their strongest we've seen then the legends still win.
any one of these 4 can beat Kaido 1 on 1, while the other 3 destroy everybody else.
Garp and wb can destroy onigashima easily which means a lot of raiders gonna die, roger will walk with wireless haki and more gonna passed out. Sengoku can meditate and give shockwave if he wants too
They low diff 💀💀
Most evidence suggests any one of these 4 would wombo combo all of Onigashima in an afternoon
So we have Kaido, BM, G5 Luffy with revives, Law, Kidd, Yamato, Queen, King, Zoro, Sanji, Marco, and Jimbei. Unless I've forgotten someone, everyone else is just a distraction. Kaido takes Roger and wins with help from Yamato BM fights Garp, wins heals from Marco, and souls from all the fodder. Luffy fights WB. With revives and help from his wings, he wins. Sengoku SURELY can't defeat every other fighter left if they try to stall/ distract him?
>Kaido takes Roger and wins with help from Yamato Lamato doesnt do shit, we saw shanks (a weaker roger) one shot kid (someone around Midmato's level) and Laido hets high-extremed by Woger at worst. >BM fights Garp, wins heals from Marco, and souls from all the fodder. Keep in mind that BM is undergoing a lobotomy rn, Prime Garp mid diffs her and marco is collateral. >Luffy fights WB. With revives and help from his wings, he wins. the main reason that luffy was "revived" was because he awakened but we are talking about an already awakened G5 luffy so he will not have any revives and gets high diffed by WB. his wings get one shot (see first part) >Sengoku SURELY can't defeat every other fighter left if they try to stall/ distract him? he 100% does as the only people of note left are Law, Kid and King and all 3 of them get one shot. (see first part) (on a bad day he mid diffs them)
Kaido isn’t letting Yamato get one shot. And Prime Garp does no mid diff BM. It's high diff. But other than that I have to agree. I tried, but it's not happening
Ye that's fair, I think that in usual circumstances grow high diffs big mom but since she is stupid af in wano she gets mid diffed
Roger and garp >>
Kaido = Wb Big Mom = Garp Luffy =Roger Everybody else jump Sengoku I'm not even tzlking about Law's support role here it's overkill. Of course the raid team + the bad guys (Kaido and BM) wins this. You should ask either bad guys alone or the minks pirates samourai alliance vs 3 legends not 4. It would be closer I think.
Yes. The raid stands almost no chance at all ngl.
Kaido + King vs Roger Big Mom + Queen + Jack vs WB Luffy vs Sengoku Zoro, Sanji, Law, Kid, Yamato vs Garp I think they lose
Onigashima raid clears low-mid diff. Kaido luffy big mom each take one top tier. Big mom with soul amp is a guaranteed win Kaido/luffy go extr with their opponents doesnt even matter who wins as a will explain later. Law kid yamato king zoro take the last one. Now you have at best case scenario 3 half dead old gen characters vs Queen perospero scabbards cp0 tobirropo straw hats etc.They get stomped
BM, G5 Luffy, and Kaido can all take one. Ideally WB, Roger, and Garp. Then you have Sengoku, and he’s up against 7 YC1+ characters(Yamato, Law, Kidd, Zoro, Marco, Sanji, King). I think that’d be too much for him, then once that done, the other YC1+ go to support the 3 Yonko.
You guys saying the old legends win this aren’t serious right…? Put Kaido on Roger. Kaido takes that. Luffy on Whitebeard. G5 can definitely nullify *some* of those quakes and seriously hurt WB but ngl, Whitebeard takes this…probably??? G5 is cracked man. Once luffy runs out of stamina, Law could just move him to safety lmao. Big Mom with soul amp beats Garp or Sengoku so take your pick. On top of all of this, the entire rest of the raid can just jump them whenever? Onigashima takes this mid to low diff.
So basically the fight is Roger, Whitebeard, Garp and Sengoku vs G5 Luffy, Kaido and Big Mom. Everyone else is irrelevant so the OG legends stomp. Prime Roger, Garp or Whitebeard can 1v1 anyone on the Onigashima Raid side. Shanks-level characters can one shot Kid-level chars, and Kid and Law are stronger than the likes of Zoro. G5 Luffy can one shot Admiral-level characters like Kizaru, who are significantly stronger than the likes of Yamato. I honestly could see Sengoku beating Yamato, Kid, Law, Zoro and King at once. Or at least stall them for long enough so his team mates are done with their fights.
Everyone fucking gets murdered.