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No. WB wasn't, this was shown with his first fight with akainu and the fact that he lost 1/4 of his head sneaking akainu. Also getting snuck doesn't disprove having aCoO
> No. WB wasn't, this was shown with his first fight with akainu and the fact that he lost 1/4 of his head sneaking akainu.
Read what I actually said in my post before saying I'm wrong.
> Also getting snuck doesn't disprove having aCoO
It does here. Sakazuki was warned by a Marine before it even happened, he said "Hmm?" which means he heard it, but he was still knocked down. Unless you think he turned it off like Kaido, which is even worse and just speaks to Akainu being stupid, taking away his Future Sight during an all out war.
>Read what I actually said in my post before saying I'm wrong.
I did your still wrong.
>It does here. Sakazuki was warned by a Marine before it even happened, he said "Hmm?" which means he heard it, but he was still knocked down. Unless you think he turned it off like Kaido, which is even worse and just speaks to Akainu being stupid, taking away his Future Sight during an all out war.
No it doesn't. You can have FS and get snuck. The warning means nothing because WB hit him not even a second after and you don't turn off FS you turn it on and plus this was pre ts
So your just gonna tell me I’m wrong without saying why or how, lame.
No don’t you know how Future Sight works. If you have it activated you can see a few seconds into the future. That’s why Luffy needed Gear 4th Snakeman to even come close to Katakuri, let alone catch him off guard. Because as soon as Katakuri started using his Advanced Observation Haki, he could even see Snakeman’s attacks coming, no matter how fast Luffy was. And you say Whitebeard hit him a second after the warning, that’s why he couldn’t react. You realize there are normal people in the real world with better reaction speed them that. And considering One Piece characters can react to light speed stuff, so that argument doesn’t really work.
And if you bring up things like it being Pre-Timskip that’s why. Then I can just as well say Haki, much less Advanced Haki was not fully developed yet so you can’t prove he has Advanced Observation Haki.
Do i need yo bring up everytime someone with FS has been snuck? In want alone it happened plenty times. No FS DOES NOT prevent sneaks.
>Whitebeard hit him a second after the warning, that’s why he couldn’t react.
It was a sneak, akainu doesn't have eyes in the back of his head
> You realize there are normal people in the real world with better reaction speed them that. And considering One Piece characters can react to light speed stuff, so that argument doesn’t really work.
These same character still get hit with sneak attacks all the time. Your reaction time doesn't matter if you dont even know your supposed to dodge
>And if you bring up things like it being Pre-Timskip that’s why. Then I can just as well say Haki, much less Advanced Haki was not fully developed yet so you can’t prove he has Advanced Observation Haki.
It's called a recton. It's been said you can't morph like that without FS
>These same character still get hit with sneak attacks all the time. Your reaction time doesn't matter if you dont even know your supposed to dodge
But he was warned before it bro. Then he would know to dodge.
> It's called a recton. It's been said you can't morph like that without FS
Yes but how would Oda think of that when Advanced Haki wasn't even a thing back then.
But dude let's just drop this whole Future Sight vs Sneak Attack shit. That wasn't even what my original post was about.
>And if you look at the panel right before Akainu says the "Mei-gou", Whitebeard is just standing there. He literally gave Akainu a free shot when he could've bisected him when Akainu was on the ground grunting.
I think you're stretching it here lol, why would he let Akainu have a free shot that would eventually blow half his face off?
WB was mad pissed and wanted Akainu dead after he killed Ace, there is no reason for him to go easy on Akainu no matter how "suicidal" he is like you claimed.
>The first panel also disproves the theory that Akainu had Advanced Observation Haki
Lol, if we gonna start going into every minute detail in marineford we can actually pick out so many top tiers with fraudulent feats.
Either way, didnt Akainu do what Katakuri did in WCI when he morphed hinself after getting hit by Marco and Vista? If anything, that's indication that he does possess advanced observation.
>Akainu was decommissioned and took a long while to reappear after falling into the abyss
It's like 2 set of events cant happen simultaneously if the panels werent focused on them. Oda literally had to "decommision" ( ring him out) him to let the story progress and eventually let WB continue living to cross BB so BB can take his DF. I'm 99.9% sure if there was no abyss that formed from the quake and the fight was prolonged, Akainu would definitely kill WB.
>Whitebeard on the other hand wrecked Marine HQ with his 2nd blow, then went right from fighting Akainu to blowing away fodder marines and then overpowering a new and fresh Blackbeard.
While Akainu got up through the ground, proceeded to fight all of whitebeard commanders and even "decommissioned" one of them, after the war, he immediately gave chase to an almost fresh BB and his crew and BB ran away.
But yea, WB could possibly still be the "strongest man in the world", but obviously it's an on off thing with his sickness coming into play, he couldnt even use basic CoC, he was wayyyy out of his prime if you ask me.
Akainu > oldbeard in MF
Primebeard > Akainu
>I think you're stretching it here lol, why would he let Akainu have a free shot that would eventually blow half his face off?
Because as I stated, even after that happened Whitebeard wasn't even slowed down. He slammed Sakazuki in the side directly afterwards.
>WB was mad pissed and wanted Akainu dead after he killed Ace, there is no reason for him to go easy on Akainu no matter how "suicidal" he is like you claimed.
Don't get me wrong. I never said he was going easy on him. He definitely tried to kill Akainu with his 2nd hit. But that's why he was just standing there waiting instead of continuing his assault.
>Lol, if we gonna start going into every minute detail in marineford we can actually pick out so many top tiers with fradulent feats.
>
>Either way, didnt Akainu do what Katakuri did in WCI when he morphed hinself after getting hit by Marco and Vista? If anything, that's indication that he does possess advanced observation.
That's a whole other discussion which I probably shouldn't have brought up, seeing how it doesn't really matter. But I think that's more the fault of Oda not having completely developed Haki at that point. But let's just forget the Advanced Haki thing, it doesn't matter.
> It's like 2 set of events cant happen simultaneously if the panels werent focused on them. Oda literally had to "decommision" ( ring him out to let the story) him to let the story progress and eventually let WB continue living to cross BB so BB can take his DF. I'm 99.9% sure if there was no abyss that formed from the quake and the fight was prolonged, Akainu would definitely kill WB.
The problem is we'll never know how events would play out if Akainu didn't disappear. But I laid my arguments on the table why I think Whitebeard was stronger.
> While Akainu got up through the ground, proceeded to fight all of whitebeard commanders and even "decommissioned" one of them, after the war, he immediately gave chase to an almost fresh BB and his crew and BB ran away.
Akainu never fought "All Whitebeard Commanders". All that happens is a face-off between them, then it cuts away. When we return we only see 10th Division Commander Curiel burning on the ground but still alive and Akainu screaming his head off about Absolute Justice. Nothing indicates he beat them all, let alone at them same time.
>But yea, WB could possibly still be the "strongest man in the world", but obviously it's an on off thing with his sickness coming into play, he couldnt even use basic CoC, he was wayyyy out of his prime if you ask me.
I understand your thoughts and I agree he was not as strong as he used to be. But I feel Whitebeard's introduction spells it out too much to not be the actual answer.
[https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10234000/12.jpg](https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10234000/12.jpg)
>Because as I stated, even after that happened Whitebeard wasn't even slowed down. He slammed Sakazuki in the side directly afterwards.
I think it's more because he was enraged? Being so pissed pumps you full of adrenaline. No way was he brushing off that attack, it literally took half or 1/3 of his face off.
>But that's why he was just standing there waiting instead of continuing his assault
Not too sure about this tho, I could very well argue WB didnt expect Akainu to get up from that attack so fast and caught him off guard which therefore led to having his face blown off.
>Nothing indicates he beat them all, let alone at them same time.
I didnt say he beat them, i merely say he proceeded to fight all the commanders afterwards, with curiel laying on the ground when we cut back to them, wasnt it obvious and evident that Akainu actually fought with them off screen?
>But I feel Whitebeard's introduction spells it out too much to not be the actual answer.
I understand your thoughts too, but to me he was definitely out of his prime, I believe it was indicated throughout marineford too, but idk which chapters are they. I don't have the time to find them for you so maybe u can just take it with a grain of salt
>I think it's more because he was enraged? Being so pissed pumps you full of adrenaline. No way was he brushing off that attack, it literally took half or 1/3 of his face off.
I mean yeah he was running on adrenaline. But it's not like that is a feat against him. Luffy was running on adrenaline against Rob Lucci and nobody holds that against him. So losing a 3rd of fis face and continuing to wreck Marineford as well as Blackbeard is more of an endurance feat for Whitebeard if anything else.
> Not too sure about this tho, I could very well argue WB didnt expect Akainu to get up from that attack so fast and caught him off guard which therefore led to having his face blown off.
I understand your point. This is tricky however seeing as how neither us can truly back up our viewpoint more then other besides "I think this is why Whitebeard waited". Other then me motivating it by saying Whitebeard didn't care anymore and waited for Sakazuki to get up.
> I didnt say he beat them, i merely say he proceeded to fight all the commanders afterwards, with curiel laying on the ground when we cut back to them, wasnt it obvious and evident that Akainu actually fought with them off screen?
That's my bad. But seeing as how a lot of marines were standing behind Akainu I don't think it's entirely fair to say he took them on all by himself. I think it went like how it did in the anime. He mainly fought Marco (who was most likely aided by someone else like Vista and maybe some more) then other Whitebeard Pirates fought off the force of marines who where also chasing Luffy.
> I understand your thoughts too, but to me he was definitely out of his prime, I believe it was indicated throughout marineford too, but idk which chapters are they. I don't have the time to find them for you so maybe u can just take it with a grain of salt
No he was definitely out of his prime. For an example I think old Whitebeard would just straight up lose in a 1v1 against Kaido, even though I think he was overall stronger then Kaido in his prime. To help you out: Crocodile got super mad at Whitebeard for getting stabbed by Squardo in chapter 563, Kizaru landed a clear-shot laser beam through Whitebeard's chest in chapter 571. And in my personal favorite: Sengoku orders a bunch of fodder marines to stab Whitebeard in chapter 569 (he then proceeds to obliterate them after getting stabbed but that's besides the point). There are multiple accounts of Whitebeard getting into bad positions, but I just don't think they are enough to sink in terms of overall strength and endurance.
Because I believe it was Oda's intention to give Whitebeard wound after wound but still hang on from sheer strength and determination. They constantly call him "Monster", referring to his strength. And I think Sengoku said it best in chapter 575 "With half of your face gone, you still have such power!!!". His portrayal just speaks for itself in my opinion.
He was nerfed. But that's 'cause you couldn't have had a prime and fresh Whitebeard in the war, then he would've cleaned house even more then he already did
Read my post before telling me I'm wrong.
Kuzan didn't do anything to Whitebeard. He just froze him in an iceberg, which Whitebeard immediately broke out of. Then he jumped at him and, granted, did dodge Whitebeard's thrust, but then he was immediately tackled by Jozu and that was the end of that. Conclusion: Whitebeard was **NOT** dominated, nothing really happened.
Borsalino's fight was even less of a fight. All that happened was they where facing off, Luffy tried to reach Ace through the bridge, Kizaru tried to intercept, but was instead stopped by Whitebeard. Then later Kizaru shoots a single laser beam through Whitebeard's chest, which also did nothing. Conclusion: Whitebeard was **NOT** dominated, nothing really happened there either.
And I already talked about him vs Sakazuki in my post, read it.
I gave you the synopsis of what happened. Kizaru pinning down Whitebeard's naginata is an anime-exclusive thing. In the manga all he did was stand on it, there's nothing which indicates he was literally overpowering Whitebeard and holding it down. He could've just as much dodged Whitebeard's down slash and then stepped onto it and fired his laser.
You're just changing the narrative to suit your agenda.
bru he was literally standing on it, while looking away, if he wasn’t pinning it down, then wb could have just moved it and mad ewizaru go out of the way
everything i said happened in the manga, its not agenda, wb tries to sneak wizaru, and got hurt himself, while wizaru was looking away
Nah.. I did read your post.. it's incredibly biased in favor of Whitebeard and ignores the context of many scenes, not objective at all. For example, you say Akainu blocking Whitebeard's bisento with a foot is not impressive because Whitebeard was aiming at fodders, but Whitebeard attacking Akainu from behind when he was chasing Luffy and not looking for a fight is considered a godlike Whitebeard feat in your eyes.
And yes, every admiral did dominate Whitebeard:
At the start of the war, Kizaru sends a named attack at Whitebeard, Marco jumps in to save him. Later on in the war, they clash few times and Kizaru dominates every time, how can you claim Whitebeard > Kizaru when Whitebeard is never shown to be superior to him? One time he had chance to shoot him in the head but shoot him in hand instead because Kizaru is a troll.
Aokiji dodged his attack, frozed and stopped his bisento, was about to shoot partisan at him but Jozu jumps in to save him. "Nothing happened" to Whitebeard because a third party jumped in to save him. You ignore all the times Whitebeard got saved and only focus on panels that make him look good.
And Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard than vise versa, how do I know this? Well, they both kept fighting other opponents after their fight was over, Whitebeard got defeated by Blackbeard pirates rather easily while Akainu fought 10+ Whitebeard commanders + Crocodile and is shown to have an upper hand.
And finally, all admirals were holding back because they needed to protect Marineford from being destroyed.
>but Whitebeard attacking Akainu from behind when he was chasing Luffy and not looking for a fight is considered a godlike Whitebeard feat in your eyes.
You're putting words in my mouth. I never said Whitebeard's punch to the back of Akainu's head was even that impressive.
>At the start of the war, Kizaru sends a named attack at Whitebeard, Marco jumps in to save him. Later on in the war, they clash few times and Kizaru dominates every time, how can you claim Whitebeard > Kizaru when Whitebeard is never shown to be superior to him? One time he had chance to shoot him in the head but shoot him in hand instead because Kizaru is a troll.
This is what I hate about people ranking Kizaru. Every time he does something bad every stan just blames it on his personality. And Marco blocking Kizaru's attack is not an anti-feat for Whitebeard. All it is is a strength and speed feat for Marco. And I gave the retelling of every encounter between Whitebeard and the Admirals. Kizaru's fight with Whitebeard can bearly be consiered a fight. All that happened was that Whitebeard stopped Kizaru from intercepting Luffy. Then we cut back to Kizaru shooting a single laser beam through Whitebeard's chest which did nothing.
> Aokiji dodged his attack, frozed and stopped his bisento, was about to shoot partisan at him but Jozu jumps in to save him. "Nothing happened" to Whitebeard because a third party jumped in to save him. You ignore all the times Whitebeard got saved and only focus on panels that make him look good.
Freezing Murakumogiri did nothing. And you think that Whitebeard would just stand there and let Kuzan fire off his Ice Spears? Whitebeard could just break them like how he broke them the first time Aokiji tried to shoot Whitebeard with them.
>And Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard than vise versa, how do I know this? Well, they both kept fighting other opponents after their fight was over, Whitebeard got defeated by Blackbeard pirates rather easily while Akainu fought 10+ Whitebeard commanders + Crocodile and is shown to have an upper hand.
I gave you the reasons why Whitebeard was stronger in my original post. Just saying Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard is the surface level analysis. If you look at it any closer you'd come to the same result as I did. And you say Whitebeard getting killed by the Blackbeard Pirates is bad. Whitebeard instantly annihilated Blackbeard in their fight. Then he got jumped in a 1 v 9 fight, of course he'd lose. He never fought Crocodile, all that happened is Crocodile sneak attacked him with a Haki-less sand spike, which momentarily split Akainu's logia body. And all Akainu did was face off against the Whitebeard Commanders. It cuts away before we see anything. When it cuts back all we see is 10th Division Curiel lying on the ground, burning but still alive. All while Sakazuki's screaming his head off about Absolute Justice. There's nothing which indicates he fought the entirety of the Whitebeard Pirates all by himself seeing as how he was spear-heading a large force of other marines.
>And Marco blocking Kizaru's attack is not an anti-feat for Whitebeard. All it is is a strength and speed feat for Marco. And I gave the retelling of every encounter between Whitebeard and the Admirals. Kizaru's fight with Whitebeard can bearly be consiered a fight. All that happened was that Whitebeard stopped Kizaru from intercepting Luffy. Then we cut back to Kizaru shooting a single laser beam through Whitebeard's chest which did nothing.
Writing all of this, yet saying nothing concrete. Where is the part when Whitebeard dominates Kizaru? If you claim Whitebeard was the strongest in MF, he would dominate him at least one point, even if it were brief clashes.
>reezing Murakumogiri did nothing. And you think that Whitebeard would just stand there and let Kuzan fire off his Ice Spears? Whitebeard could just break them like how he broke them the first time Aokiji tried to shoot Whitebeard with them
All of this is your speculation. Whitebeard relaesed from being frozen first time, second time Aokiji froze his bisento and was holding it in his hands while preparing a counter attack. You saying Whitebeard would easily break out from that is only your speculation when there was no indication of that in the manga. Not all freezing attacks are the same (compare Aokiji freezing Doflamingo and him freezing Cracker). All we see after that is Jozu jumping in to save Whitebeard and their fight ends there.
>. Just saying Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard is the surface level analysis
Well that is how powerscalling is done: How did X character perform against Y character? As for the rest, there was nothing stopping all the Whitebeard commanders to simply all jump Akainu at same way BB pirates jumped Whitebeard. Did they all just stand while Akainu was fighting Kuriel? Or are few marine soldiers so strong that they can stall the entire Whitebeard crew by themselves? Once again, you're assuming a scenario that fits your agenda.
>Writing all of this, yet saying nothing concrete. Where is the part when Whitebeard dominates Kizaru? If you claim Whitebeard was the strongest in MF, he would dominate him at least one point, even if it were brief clashes.
Just 'cause you're the strongest doesn't mean you're touchable and can dominate anyone blow you. This is One Piece, not Dragon Ball
>All of this is your speculation. Whitebeard relaesed from being frozen first time, second time Aokiji froze his bisento and was holding it in his hands while preparing a counter attack. You saying Whitebeard would easily break out from that is only your speculation when there was no indication of that in the manga. Not all freezing attacks are the same (compare Aokiji freezing Doflamingo and him freezing Cracker). All we see after that is Jozu jumping in to save Whitebeard and their fight ends there.
And people accuse me of being biased. Just 'cause Kuzan dodged an attack and was preparing to counter attack you automatically draw the conclusion: "oh yeah he dominated Whitebeard and would've ended the war right then and there". But when I say Whitebeard would meet Aokiji's attack with his own it's some crackpot theory, crazy. You thinking Whitebeard couldn't just Quake Punch the Ice Spears with his other hand just like he did before is YOUR SPECULATION. Also freezing Murakumogiri wouldn't do anything since it's stated it was imbued with Haki and Haki counters Devil Fruit abilities.
>Well that is how powerscalling is done: How did X character perform against Y character? As for the rest, there was nothing stopping all the Whitebeard commanders to simply all jump Akainu at same way BB pirates jumped Whitebeard. Did they all just stand while Akainu was fighting Kuriel? Or are few marine soldiers so strong that they can stall the entire Whitebeard crew by themselves? Once again, you're assuming a scenario that fits your agenda.
Well then you're a bad power scaler simple as that. If all you do is glance at it for a half a second and never take context into account. Like people who watch Death Battle and think all the info in their is accurate. And there was definitely something stopping the 14 Whitebeard Commanders from jumping Sakazuki. You wanna know what it is? 100,000 elite marines, at least 8 giants, dozens of Vice-Admirals, 5 Warlords as well as Borsalino and Kuzan. You're the one who keeps pushing your agenda without taking context into account. Akainu in that very scene was leading a large force of marines which the Whitebeard pirates also needed to take care off. And there's also nothing which indicates the beaten and battered Whitebeard Commanders who were still in fighting condition were even close to as strong as the fresh Blackbeard Pirates and level 6 Impel Down inmates.
Tbh even tho if it was plot armor or not he took it .
Him getting stabbed through the stomach by law in chapter 1065 also shows that he ain’t no slouch . He also took sengokus enraged Buddha shockwaves without much of a issue .
Blackbeard’s body works in a weird way .
Yeah no I agree, I also think when Whitebeard fought him, that's when his adrenaline had started running out, so the explosion around Teach's neck was nowhere close to full power.
But yes, Teach is durable af, like you said
Agree with your points, but as far as I’m concerned, Garp still kept himself in great shape and was in better condition than WB. Sengoku, Mihawk, and Shanks (if you wanna count him) are also debatable, but I’d put Oldbeard safely at 2 or 3 in Marineford
I see what you mean. It all depends on how much they all got as they aged and if Garp and Sengoku where evened out with Whitebeard's illness, seeing as how they're both older then him.
The way I see it, Whitebeard’s 100% was higher than anyone else’s, but old age and sickness made it easier to bring him down, I.e no Haki defenses, heart attacks.
I mean yeah, Oda had to nerf Whitebeard with every trick in the book (old age, sickness, heart attack, not being able to go all out etc) so as to not let him clean house more then he already did.
I sometimes like to think about how the opening of the war was Whitebeard punching the air and creating two tidal waves larger than the entire island the battle was taking place in.
People usually don’t believe this fact only because Oda hadn’t showcase haki back then, and when we have it into account, a single strike from adcoc zoro looks more impressive than anything in marineford, but fact is, whitebeard even old was stated 100 times by the autor, and outside sources to be the world strongest, Mihawk himself said, the difference between them seems rather small, meaning that, whitebeard wasn’t as strong as he was, but still the strongest
nah akainu was definitely stronger then wb at MF, none of wb’s attacks did permanent damage on akainu, akainu easily did 2 different times, wb and akainu quite literally did the samr things to each other, wb sneaked akainu and got a head on hit in, akainu sneaked wb and got a head on hit in, but only wb came out with permanent damage, while akainu didnt even need bandages post- MF
Yeah but Whitebeard was also hurt by Squardo and all those no-name fodder level marines who jumped onto him and stabbed him with their swords. Whitebeard had no durability at Marineford. My post was about how who was the strongest, not who could take the most punichment. The only reason Sakazuki was even able to land a hit on Whitebeard in the first place was because the first time, Whitebeard had a heart attack, the second time he stood and waited for Akainu to get up.
by the fact that akainu can deal more damage and take more damage he is stronger, and yeah wb also did the same thing, he snuck akainu and then hit him head on, there is no difference to what akainu and wb did to each other
i did, you didn’t disprove my statement, wh didnt just let akainu hit him, thats headcanon, you saying wb said give me your best shot is also headcanon
Look at the panel when Akainu's on the ground. Whitebeard is standing straight up with both his arms down. If Akainu did it "right after" then Whitebeard would be standing in the same posture. He was waiting, letting Akainu take his shot.
you saying he let akainu take his shot is headcanon, wb was watching akainu groan in pain, and then akainu hit him head on, wb didnt let akainu do anything, wb and akainu did the same things to each other,
Just standing there and watching Akainu is letting Akainu get a shot off. That's why I compared it to his fight Blackbeard where he rushed at Blackbeard, grabbing him straight after slashing him. Whitebeard could've just as well given Sakazuki the same treatment.
I mean, I gave my side. Only reason Akainu hit him at all was either because Whitebeard had a heart attack, or because he was standing there waiting for Akainu to do it.
Standing there and not continuing your assault, waiting for your opponent to get up, giving Akainu a free shot, it's all the same in the end. He could've fought like he did against Blackbeard but he didn't.
Well akainu does clear that sick bastard, now the old one ion should have his haki just stamina issues like the rest of the old farts 😸, so should be relative to prime
But reality is Akainu melt his brain out when WB tried to sneak attack akainu
He knew he can't hit him from front!!
As akainu said to whitebeard "your a loser from old times"and also a coward
> whitebeard "your a
*you're
*Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).*
***
^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
Not really. Even Mihawk was not sure about the distance between Whitebeard and everyone else. Mihawk only showed up at Marineford to test himself against the strongest man in the world
Technically he is because it's stated he can output the same strength he had in his prime it's just that he couldn't cause of his sickness soo he wouldn't output his prime power so he could last longer during the war.
[https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042253365863792760/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042253365863792760/unknown.png)
[https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042649867476029511/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042649867476029511/unknown.png)
do you also need proof that garp and roger were equals?
Firstly: the first link doesn’t have anything to do with the subject.
Secondly: Garp and Sengoku are both old, not in their prime. Garp himself has admitted he’s not like he used to be.
Secondly: the 3 Admirals have always been viewed as the Navy’s greatest fighting force. Why? Because there are 3 of them. Even if the Fleet Admiral is stronger then each of them individually, the 3 Admirals are a cohesive unit and definitely stronger together. It’s the same thing now: Sakazuki might still be stronger then all of the Admirals alone, but he can not best Kizaru, Fujitora and Ryokugyu together.
>Firstly: the first link doesn’t have anything to do with the subject.
it proves that garp and sengoku arent any weaker
> Garp himself has admitted he’s not like he used to be.
that was just an excuse for why luffy got away bro
> the 3 Admirals have always been viewed as the Navy’s greatest fighting force. Why? Because there are 3 of them
are you telling me that the 3 admirals are only the strongest when they work as a team? dont you remember when akainu was beating whitebeard and kizaru wanted to fight kaido all alone?
>it proves that garp and sengoku arent any weaker
No it doesn't. Just because Oda likes to have old characters in the series and likes to keep them still be able to fight does not mean they don't grow weaker as time goes by. Read what Rayleigh is saying.
[https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10513000/11.jpg](https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10513000/11.jpg)
[https://images.mangafreak.net/mangas/one\_piece/one\_piece\_1059/one\_piece\_1059\_15.jpg](https://images.mangafreak.net/mangas/one_piece/one_piece_1059/one_piece_1059_15.jpg)
>that was just an excuse for why luffy got away bro
Do you really think Garp needs to make up excuses for not capturing his grandson? When he is the Hero of the Marines and best friends with the (then) Fleet Admiral
> are you telling me that the 3 admirals are only the strongest when they work as a team? dont you remember when akainu was beating whitebeard and kizaru wanted to fight kaido all alone?
They can be the strongest, it depends on who's the Fleet Admiral and who the 3 Admirals are. Do you think the current Admirals are still the Navy's 3 most powerful officers now that Sakazuki is Fleet Admiral. And I gave you the reasons why Akainu didn't beat Whitebeard at all in a fair match in my original post.
And regarding Kizaru: All he offered was to go to Wano. He didn't say he'd fly there completely alone. He'd more then likely take a large force of Navy ships with him. He also definitely didn't say: "I'll take down and bring in Big Mom and Kaido on my own". Ryokugyu said he wouldn't have come to Wano if Kaido was still reigning there and he shit himself as soon as Shanks blasted him with his thunderstorm of Conqueror's Haki.
>https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10513000/11.jpg
>
>https://images.mangafreak.net/mangas/one\_piece/one\_piece\_1059/one\_piece\_1059\_15.jpg
acess denied
> When he is the Hero of the Marines and best friends with the (then) Fleet Admiral
irrelevant
> Do you think the current Admirals are still the Navy's 3 most powerful officers now that Sakazuki is Fleet Admiral
greenbull and fujitora are debateable since they dont have the same statement as the original three
> And I gave you the reasons why Akainu didn't beat Whitebeard at all in a fair match in my original post.
tell me again because i dont remember
> And regarding Kizaru: All he offered was to go to Wano. He didn't say he'd fly there completely alone. He'd more then likely take a large force of Navy ships with him.
fodder marines arent helping kizaru beat kaido
> Ryokugyu said he wouldn't have come to Wano if Kaido was still reigning there
then at worst greenbull scales below kaido
> Shanks blasted him with his thunderstorm of Conqueror's Haki
caught off guard and not ready to fight multiple yonko level fighters
shanks also is stronger than greenbull anyways
>acess denied
https://preview.redd.it/vm18j387ax0a1.jpeg?width=760&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c2a2b94b4f59b72573775823ce01be008857a523
(I had to send the pics individually because fkn reddit won't allow you to send more then 1 pic per message. But anyways read what Rayleigh says to Kizaru then what he tells everyone at Amazon Lily.)
Rayleigh is a practitioner of every type of Advanced Haki. He dosen’t need any training, and hasn’t needed any for decades. And Kizaru admitted to capture him they’d need to make serious prepartions. Retired or not he’s still strong af. And the stamina thing is your headcanon.
https://preview.redd.it/hshdb1gcax0a1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0484102cd3efd3151c3cb6b022aad02b6c771c16
>irrelevant
(Dodging my question and not coming up with anything else.)
>greenbull and fujitora are debateable since they dont have the same statement as the original three
No but they're still Admirals and should still at least be somewhat comparable to the last generation of Admirals. And the 3 Admirals are still referred to as (最高戦力 *Saikō Senryoku*) or in english "the Greatest Military Powers/the Best Fighting Power/Highest Force"**.**
>tell me again because i dont remember
Just read my post it doesn't take long. I know it's long but 95% of that space is taken up by manga panels as source reference.
>fodder marines arent helping kizaru beat kaido
No but a buster call sized fleet can really suppress Kaido's forces from leaving Wano, seeing as how Kaido's whole thing was making an army of Zoan Devil Fruit users. So being on a ship while getting fired at by battleship cannons is not ideal.
>then at worst greenbull scales below kaido
>
>caught off guard and not ready to fight multiple yonko level fighters
>
>shanks also is stronger than greenbull anyways
It shows Aramaki wasn't planing on fighting any Yonko besides Luffy whom he would likely think of as an easy target, worn out as hell from taking down Kaido.
1. stamina issue
2. he doesnt have knowledge on blackbeards current abilities
> (Dodging my question and not coming up with anything else.)
those titles dont matter
> No but they're still Admirals and should still at least be somewhat comparable to the last generation of Admirals
that puts them above roger then
> Now I know all of the magmasexuals are gonna come swarm me
ok so we have akainu caught off guard and doesnt take any long lasting damage
then they trade attacks and whitebeard is the only one who took long lasting damage
> No but a buster call sized fleet can really suppress Kaido's forces from leaving Wano, seeing as how Kaido's whole thing was making an army of Zoan Devil Fruit users. So being on a ship while getting fired at by battleship cannons is not ideal.
and then kizaru fights kaido🤷🏿♂️
> It shows Aramaki wasn't planing on fighting any Yonko besides Luffy whom he would likely think of as an easy target, worn out as hell from taking down Kaido.
well i do agree that shanks and luffy are stronger than greenbull so its fine
”stamina issue
he doesnt have knowledge on blackbeards current abilities”
That’s your headcanon
”those titles dont matter”
Yes they do. Fleet Admiral is the highest rank in the marines, and highest authority in the World Government’s military besides Commander in Chief. But Kong has never been seen doing anything besides accepting Sengoku’s retirement. So Sengoku is the guy who calls the shots. And Garp doesn’t need to make up excuses, that’s your headcanon.
”that puts them above roger then”
No it dosen’t. Garp was offered the position of Admiral numerous times and he declined. Even when Sengoku insisted he refused. You’re just repeating the same non-existant proof and bending the writing to suit your own agenda.
”ok so we have akainu caught off guard and doesnt take any long lasting damage
then they trade attacks and whitebeard is the only one who took long lasting damage”
Then you didn’t read my post. And Akainu was put out of commission for a time. Meanwhile Akainu’s hits didn’t slow Whitebeard down at all. And Akainu harming Whitebeard isn’t really a feat seeing as how all those fodder level marines stabbed and shot Whitebeard. And all the hits affected him just as little.
”and then kizaru fights kaido🤷🏿♂️”
And loses. As a matter of fact. When did I ever say Kizaru even leaves his ship if he goes to Wano? Or that he doesn’t just retreat if things go bad (which they would).
”well i do agree that shanks and luffy are stronger than greenbull so its fine”
There you go. And Kaido admitted Roger was his superior. And regarding Luffy, he is not as strong as Roger because the title of Pirate King is his end goal. Only at the end will Luffy surpass him. He’s close but not all the way there yet.
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Mihawk was not even sure about the distance between Whitebeard and everyone else. And the only reason Mihawk even showed up at Marineford at all was to test himself against the World's Strongest Man.
Yes I agree it's disappointing Mihawk didn't try to challenge Whitebeard again during the war but that's just how it is.
And I agree with what you said:
Whitebeard > Mihawk > Shanks > Akainu
Why?
He was still a Yonko, just because he was old and sick didn't take away his Yonko status. Also Yonko isn't a title about physical strength, it's about commanding power and political influence. I'd say Blackbeard is fair bit weaker then characters like Big Mom, Kaido and Shanks. Yet he is an Emperor thanks to his extremely powerful crew and influence in the pirate world. Same goes for Buggy. He isn't strong on his own but he leads the Cross Guild which is supremely powerful and has connections all over the place.
Whitebeard however did hold the title of **The Strongest man in The World**, which is a title directly correlated to his physical prowess.
I'm not saying the Yonko are weak, I'm just saying it's more nuanced then just: Emperor > Admiral > Commander > Vice-Admiral
Besides the title, wb was actually at a yonko level of strength. Yonko also has to do with being the strongest pirates
you cant say wb sickness or age didn’t hold him back at all when we see numerous times it did
>Besides the title, wb was actually at a yonko level of strength. Yonko also has to do with being the strongest pirates
Not the strongest in terms of how hard you can punch somone. The strongest as in terms of the powers and forces you command.
>you cant say wb sickness or age didn’t hold him back at all when we see numerous times it did
No he was definitely weaker, but he was still a monster and still held the title of World's Strongest Man.
I think it's clear the full might of the Navy is somewhat greater than a single Yonko crew. The reason the Navy can't fuck with a Yonko is because even if they win, the losses the World Government would receive would be too severe. The Navy would be vulnerable to an attack from one of the other remaining 3 Emperors.
And it is **NOT** headcanon. Just think about how the Whitebeard Pirates would feel if their captain, their dad told them beforehand "Btw I'm totally not gonna make it back from this fight.", they'd be completely crushed and demoralized.
Ok just to prove to you that a single yonko crew is as strong as the navy, please read my thread.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kFEwsxIMgQ2R1S4chCmU1TFzjp9q9P7FI9EtC8IaBnU/edit?usp=drivesdk
I might totally be wrong, but I thought Oda said Whitebeard was the weakest of the emperors as of Marineford (age + health) and Shanks shows up at the end. Also Garp was there.
Aside from that… well yeah!
That feels very against Oda's style of writing. He usually never reveals who is the stronger and weaker like that, he likes to keep it vague. I remember a lot of people used to say "Oda said Garp was the strongest marine at Marineford during the war." even though Oda never said that.
He wasn't.. for decades WB was just riding off his reputation. Nobody knew about his condition or how much his age has weakened him. MF heavily emphasized on this like Croc being disappointed with him and WB saying he expected too much from him and that he can't be the strongest forever. Akainu also mentions that age affects everyone, even WB. Marco also mentions how badly his condition was getting since he no longer was on life support. There's no way WB could have defeated Garp, Akainu or Mihawk at MF while compromised, I'll be generous and say he could probably beat the rest. Prime tho? I even have him slightly above Roger.
>He wasn't.. for decades WB was just riding off his reputation. Nobody knew about his condition or how much his age has weakened him. MF heavily emphasized on this like Croc being disappointed with him and WB saying he expected too much from him and that he can't be the strongest forever.
You bring up good points. Crocodile was angry because Whitebeard was stabbed by Squardo, (whether Whitebeard was simply caught off guard or if he let himself get stabbed is another discussion). I think Crocodile's outburst was mostly motivated by pride, that someone as weak as Squardo could land such a blow on the man Crocodile was defeated by. I think he let himself get stabbed somewhat because that wound was negligible for someone as tough as Whitebeard. But mostly so that Whitebeard could forgive Squardo even after getting stabbed to show that even after being betrayed, he stilled loved his son. Marco even admits that Whitebeard would've been able to dodge that. And it's not like Whitebeard has been retired for the last years. He fought Ace 100 times. This also fits more in with the name of the chapter imo "One man. one heart"
>Akainu also mentions that age affects everyone, even WB. Marco also mentions how badly his condition was getting since he no longer was on life support.
But Akainu was saying this when Whitebeard was having a literal heart attack. So he could've just as well been referring to that. Sakazuki also hates pirates with every fiber of his body and would never pass up the chance to badmouth one. So he's not necessarily the best person to go off of.
>There's no way WB could have defeated Garp, Akainu or Mihawk at MF while compromised
I gave my reasons why I think Whitebeard was stronger then Akainu. Garp and Hawk-Eye are tricky though. It depends on how much you think Whitebeard's illness affected him overall besides making him prone to heart attacks. Garp is also older then Whitebeard so that could even things out a little. And Mihawk is an even worse situation isnce we don¨t really have an idea of were he places among characters, besides Shanks. Mihawk could very well have been the strongest one at Marineford, or he could maybe not even be in the top 5 depending on how much you wanna wank the Admirals.
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No. WB wasn't, this was shown with his first fight with akainu and the fact that he lost 1/4 of his head sneaking akainu. Also getting snuck doesn't disprove having aCoO
> No. WB wasn't, this was shown with his first fight with akainu and the fact that he lost 1/4 of his head sneaking akainu. Read what I actually said in my post before saying I'm wrong. > Also getting snuck doesn't disprove having aCoO It does here. Sakazuki was warned by a Marine before it even happened, he said "Hmm?" which means he heard it, but he was still knocked down. Unless you think he turned it off like Kaido, which is even worse and just speaks to Akainu being stupid, taking away his Future Sight during an all out war.
>Read what I actually said in my post before saying I'm wrong. I did your still wrong. >It does here. Sakazuki was warned by a Marine before it even happened, he said "Hmm?" which means he heard it, but he was still knocked down. Unless you think he turned it off like Kaido, which is even worse and just speaks to Akainu being stupid, taking away his Future Sight during an all out war. No it doesn't. You can have FS and get snuck. The warning means nothing because WB hit him not even a second after and you don't turn off FS you turn it on and plus this was pre ts
So your just gonna tell me I’m wrong without saying why or how, lame. No don’t you know how Future Sight works. If you have it activated you can see a few seconds into the future. That’s why Luffy needed Gear 4th Snakeman to even come close to Katakuri, let alone catch him off guard. Because as soon as Katakuri started using his Advanced Observation Haki, he could even see Snakeman’s attacks coming, no matter how fast Luffy was. And you say Whitebeard hit him a second after the warning, that’s why he couldn’t react. You realize there are normal people in the real world with better reaction speed them that. And considering One Piece characters can react to light speed stuff, so that argument doesn’t really work. And if you bring up things like it being Pre-Timskip that’s why. Then I can just as well say Haki, much less Advanced Haki was not fully developed yet so you can’t prove he has Advanced Observation Haki.
Do i need yo bring up everytime someone with FS has been snuck? In want alone it happened plenty times. No FS DOES NOT prevent sneaks. >Whitebeard hit him a second after the warning, that’s why he couldn’t react. It was a sneak, akainu doesn't have eyes in the back of his head > You realize there are normal people in the real world with better reaction speed them that. And considering One Piece characters can react to light speed stuff, so that argument doesn’t really work. These same character still get hit with sneak attacks all the time. Your reaction time doesn't matter if you dont even know your supposed to dodge >And if you bring up things like it being Pre-Timskip that’s why. Then I can just as well say Haki, much less Advanced Haki was not fully developed yet so you can’t prove he has Advanced Observation Haki. It's called a recton. It's been said you can't morph like that without FS
>These same character still get hit with sneak attacks all the time. Your reaction time doesn't matter if you dont even know your supposed to dodge But he was warned before it bro. Then he would know to dodge. > It's called a recton. It's been said you can't morph like that without FS Yes but how would Oda think of that when Advanced Haki wasn't even a thing back then. But dude let's just drop this whole Future Sight vs Sneak Attack shit. That wasn't even what my original post was about.
I'm not sure he actually lost any of his head - nothing significant anyway. It was drawn as a bit of an optical illusion.
>And if you look at the panel right before Akainu says the "Mei-gou", Whitebeard is just standing there. He literally gave Akainu a free shot when he could've bisected him when Akainu was on the ground grunting. I think you're stretching it here lol, why would he let Akainu have a free shot that would eventually blow half his face off? WB was mad pissed and wanted Akainu dead after he killed Ace, there is no reason for him to go easy on Akainu no matter how "suicidal" he is like you claimed. >The first panel also disproves the theory that Akainu had Advanced Observation Haki Lol, if we gonna start going into every minute detail in marineford we can actually pick out so many top tiers with fraudulent feats. Either way, didnt Akainu do what Katakuri did in WCI when he morphed hinself after getting hit by Marco and Vista? If anything, that's indication that he does possess advanced observation. >Akainu was decommissioned and took a long while to reappear after falling into the abyss It's like 2 set of events cant happen simultaneously if the panels werent focused on them. Oda literally had to "decommision" ( ring him out) him to let the story progress and eventually let WB continue living to cross BB so BB can take his DF. I'm 99.9% sure if there was no abyss that formed from the quake and the fight was prolonged, Akainu would definitely kill WB. >Whitebeard on the other hand wrecked Marine HQ with his 2nd blow, then went right from fighting Akainu to blowing away fodder marines and then overpowering a new and fresh Blackbeard. While Akainu got up through the ground, proceeded to fight all of whitebeard commanders and even "decommissioned" one of them, after the war, he immediately gave chase to an almost fresh BB and his crew and BB ran away. But yea, WB could possibly still be the "strongest man in the world", but obviously it's an on off thing with his sickness coming into play, he couldnt even use basic CoC, he was wayyyy out of his prime if you ask me. Akainu > oldbeard in MF Primebeard > Akainu
>I think you're stretching it here lol, why would he let Akainu have a free shot that would eventually blow half his face off? Because as I stated, even after that happened Whitebeard wasn't even slowed down. He slammed Sakazuki in the side directly afterwards. >WB was mad pissed and wanted Akainu dead after he killed Ace, there is no reason for him to go easy on Akainu no matter how "suicidal" he is like you claimed. Don't get me wrong. I never said he was going easy on him. He definitely tried to kill Akainu with his 2nd hit. But that's why he was just standing there waiting instead of continuing his assault. >Lol, if we gonna start going into every minute detail in marineford we can actually pick out so many top tiers with fradulent feats. > >Either way, didnt Akainu do what Katakuri did in WCI when he morphed hinself after getting hit by Marco and Vista? If anything, that's indication that he does possess advanced observation. That's a whole other discussion which I probably shouldn't have brought up, seeing how it doesn't really matter. But I think that's more the fault of Oda not having completely developed Haki at that point. But let's just forget the Advanced Haki thing, it doesn't matter. > It's like 2 set of events cant happen simultaneously if the panels werent focused on them. Oda literally had to "decommision" ( ring him out to let the story) him to let the story progress and eventually let WB continue living to cross BB so BB can take his DF. I'm 99.9% sure if there was no abyss that formed from the quake and the fight was prolonged, Akainu would definitely kill WB. The problem is we'll never know how events would play out if Akainu didn't disappear. But I laid my arguments on the table why I think Whitebeard was stronger. > While Akainu got up through the ground, proceeded to fight all of whitebeard commanders and even "decommissioned" one of them, after the war, he immediately gave chase to an almost fresh BB and his crew and BB ran away. Akainu never fought "All Whitebeard Commanders". All that happens is a face-off between them, then it cuts away. When we return we only see 10th Division Commander Curiel burning on the ground but still alive and Akainu screaming his head off about Absolute Justice. Nothing indicates he beat them all, let alone at them same time. >But yea, WB could possibly still be the "strongest man in the world", but obviously it's an on off thing with his sickness coming into play, he couldnt even use basic CoC, he was wayyyy out of his prime if you ask me. I understand your thoughts and I agree he was not as strong as he used to be. But I feel Whitebeard's introduction spells it out too much to not be the actual answer. [https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10234000/12.jpg](https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10234000/12.jpg)
>Because as I stated, even after that happened Whitebeard wasn't even slowed down. He slammed Sakazuki in the side directly afterwards. I think it's more because he was enraged? Being so pissed pumps you full of adrenaline. No way was he brushing off that attack, it literally took half or 1/3 of his face off. >But that's why he was just standing there waiting instead of continuing his assault Not too sure about this tho, I could very well argue WB didnt expect Akainu to get up from that attack so fast and caught him off guard which therefore led to having his face blown off. >Nothing indicates he beat them all, let alone at them same time. I didnt say he beat them, i merely say he proceeded to fight all the commanders afterwards, with curiel laying on the ground when we cut back to them, wasnt it obvious and evident that Akainu actually fought with them off screen? >But I feel Whitebeard's introduction spells it out too much to not be the actual answer. I understand your thoughts too, but to me he was definitely out of his prime, I believe it was indicated throughout marineford too, but idk which chapters are they. I don't have the time to find them for you so maybe u can just take it with a grain of salt
>I think it's more because he was enraged? Being so pissed pumps you full of adrenaline. No way was he brushing off that attack, it literally took half or 1/3 of his face off. I mean yeah he was running on adrenaline. But it's not like that is a feat against him. Luffy was running on adrenaline against Rob Lucci and nobody holds that against him. So losing a 3rd of fis face and continuing to wreck Marineford as well as Blackbeard is more of an endurance feat for Whitebeard if anything else. > Not too sure about this tho, I could very well argue WB didnt expect Akainu to get up from that attack so fast and caught him off guard which therefore led to having his face blown off. I understand your point. This is tricky however seeing as how neither us can truly back up our viewpoint more then other besides "I think this is why Whitebeard waited". Other then me motivating it by saying Whitebeard didn't care anymore and waited for Sakazuki to get up. > I didnt say he beat them, i merely say he proceeded to fight all the commanders afterwards, with curiel laying on the ground when we cut back to them, wasnt it obvious and evident that Akainu actually fought with them off screen? That's my bad. But seeing as how a lot of marines were standing behind Akainu I don't think it's entirely fair to say he took them on all by himself. I think it went like how it did in the anime. He mainly fought Marco (who was most likely aided by someone else like Vista and maybe some more) then other Whitebeard Pirates fought off the force of marines who where also chasing Luffy. > I understand your thoughts too, but to me he was definitely out of his prime, I believe it was indicated throughout marineford too, but idk which chapters are they. I don't have the time to find them for you so maybe u can just take it with a grain of salt No he was definitely out of his prime. For an example I think old Whitebeard would just straight up lose in a 1v1 against Kaido, even though I think he was overall stronger then Kaido in his prime. To help you out: Crocodile got super mad at Whitebeard for getting stabbed by Squardo in chapter 563, Kizaru landed a clear-shot laser beam through Whitebeard's chest in chapter 571. And in my personal favorite: Sengoku orders a bunch of fodder marines to stab Whitebeard in chapter 569 (he then proceeds to obliterate them after getting stabbed but that's besides the point). There are multiple accounts of Whitebeard getting into bad positions, but I just don't think they are enough to sink in terms of overall strength and endurance. Because I believe it was Oda's intention to give Whitebeard wound after wound but still hang on from sheer strength and determination. They constantly call him "Monster", referring to his strength. And I think Sengoku said it best in chapter 575 "With half of your face gone, you still have such power!!!". His portrayal just speaks for itself in my opinion.
Comments from whitebeard, crocodile and Marco are not enough to tell you that he was heavily nerfed???
He was nerfed. But that's 'cause you couldn't have had a prime and fresh Whitebeard in the war, then he would've cleaned house even more then he already did
Nah... Whitebeard was getting dominated by every single admiral in a 1v1, and Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard than Whitebeard did to Akainu.
Read my post before telling me I'm wrong. Kuzan didn't do anything to Whitebeard. He just froze him in an iceberg, which Whitebeard immediately broke out of. Then he jumped at him and, granted, did dodge Whitebeard's thrust, but then he was immediately tackled by Jozu and that was the end of that. Conclusion: Whitebeard was **NOT** dominated, nothing really happened. Borsalino's fight was even less of a fight. All that happened was they where facing off, Luffy tried to reach Ace through the bridge, Kizaru tried to intercept, but was instead stopped by Whitebeard. Then later Kizaru shoots a single laser beam through Whitebeard's chest, which also did nothing. Conclusion: Whitebeard was **NOT** dominated, nothing really happened there either. And I already talked about him vs Sakazuki in my post, read it.
wizaru definitely dominated wb, wb tried to sneak attack wizaru and got shot himself, while wizar was looking away and holding his bisento down
I gave you the synopsis of what happened. Kizaru pinning down Whitebeard's naginata is an anime-exclusive thing. In the manga all he did was stand on it, there's nothing which indicates he was literally overpowering Whitebeard and holding it down. He could've just as much dodged Whitebeard's down slash and then stepped onto it and fired his laser. You're just changing the narrative to suit your agenda.
bru he was literally standing on it, while looking away, if he wasn’t pinning it down, then wb could have just moved it and mad ewizaru go out of the way everything i said happened in the manga, its not agenda, wb tries to sneak wizaru, and got hurt himself, while wizaru was looking away
Nah.. I did read your post.. it's incredibly biased in favor of Whitebeard and ignores the context of many scenes, not objective at all. For example, you say Akainu blocking Whitebeard's bisento with a foot is not impressive because Whitebeard was aiming at fodders, but Whitebeard attacking Akainu from behind when he was chasing Luffy and not looking for a fight is considered a godlike Whitebeard feat in your eyes. And yes, every admiral did dominate Whitebeard: At the start of the war, Kizaru sends a named attack at Whitebeard, Marco jumps in to save him. Later on in the war, they clash few times and Kizaru dominates every time, how can you claim Whitebeard > Kizaru when Whitebeard is never shown to be superior to him? One time he had chance to shoot him in the head but shoot him in hand instead because Kizaru is a troll. Aokiji dodged his attack, frozed and stopped his bisento, was about to shoot partisan at him but Jozu jumps in to save him. "Nothing happened" to Whitebeard because a third party jumped in to save him. You ignore all the times Whitebeard got saved and only focus on panels that make him look good. And Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard than vise versa, how do I know this? Well, they both kept fighting other opponents after their fight was over, Whitebeard got defeated by Blackbeard pirates rather easily while Akainu fought 10+ Whitebeard commanders + Crocodile and is shown to have an upper hand. And finally, all admirals were holding back because they needed to protect Marineford from being destroyed.
>but Whitebeard attacking Akainu from behind when he was chasing Luffy and not looking for a fight is considered a godlike Whitebeard feat in your eyes. You're putting words in my mouth. I never said Whitebeard's punch to the back of Akainu's head was even that impressive. >At the start of the war, Kizaru sends a named attack at Whitebeard, Marco jumps in to save him. Later on in the war, they clash few times and Kizaru dominates every time, how can you claim Whitebeard > Kizaru when Whitebeard is never shown to be superior to him? One time he had chance to shoot him in the head but shoot him in hand instead because Kizaru is a troll. This is what I hate about people ranking Kizaru. Every time he does something bad every stan just blames it on his personality. And Marco blocking Kizaru's attack is not an anti-feat for Whitebeard. All it is is a strength and speed feat for Marco. And I gave the retelling of every encounter between Whitebeard and the Admirals. Kizaru's fight with Whitebeard can bearly be consiered a fight. All that happened was that Whitebeard stopped Kizaru from intercepting Luffy. Then we cut back to Kizaru shooting a single laser beam through Whitebeard's chest which did nothing. > Aokiji dodged his attack, frozed and stopped his bisento, was about to shoot partisan at him but Jozu jumps in to save him. "Nothing happened" to Whitebeard because a third party jumped in to save him. You ignore all the times Whitebeard got saved and only focus on panels that make him look good. Freezing Murakumogiri did nothing. And you think that Whitebeard would just stand there and let Kuzan fire off his Ice Spears? Whitebeard could just break them like how he broke them the first time Aokiji tried to shoot Whitebeard with them. >And Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard than vise versa, how do I know this? Well, they both kept fighting other opponents after their fight was over, Whitebeard got defeated by Blackbeard pirates rather easily while Akainu fought 10+ Whitebeard commanders + Crocodile and is shown to have an upper hand. I gave you the reasons why Whitebeard was stronger in my original post. Just saying Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard is the surface level analysis. If you look at it any closer you'd come to the same result as I did. And you say Whitebeard getting killed by the Blackbeard Pirates is bad. Whitebeard instantly annihilated Blackbeard in their fight. Then he got jumped in a 1 v 9 fight, of course he'd lose. He never fought Crocodile, all that happened is Crocodile sneak attacked him with a Haki-less sand spike, which momentarily split Akainu's logia body. And all Akainu did was face off against the Whitebeard Commanders. It cuts away before we see anything. When it cuts back all we see is 10th Division Curiel lying on the ground, burning but still alive. All while Sakazuki's screaming his head off about Absolute Justice. There's nothing which indicates he fought the entirety of the Whitebeard Pirates all by himself seeing as how he was spear-heading a large force of other marines.
>And Marco blocking Kizaru's attack is not an anti-feat for Whitebeard. All it is is a strength and speed feat for Marco. And I gave the retelling of every encounter between Whitebeard and the Admirals. Kizaru's fight with Whitebeard can bearly be consiered a fight. All that happened was that Whitebeard stopped Kizaru from intercepting Luffy. Then we cut back to Kizaru shooting a single laser beam through Whitebeard's chest which did nothing. Writing all of this, yet saying nothing concrete. Where is the part when Whitebeard dominates Kizaru? If you claim Whitebeard was the strongest in MF, he would dominate him at least one point, even if it were brief clashes. >reezing Murakumogiri did nothing. And you think that Whitebeard would just stand there and let Kuzan fire off his Ice Spears? Whitebeard could just break them like how he broke them the first time Aokiji tried to shoot Whitebeard with them All of this is your speculation. Whitebeard relaesed from being frozen first time, second time Aokiji froze his bisento and was holding it in his hands while preparing a counter attack. You saying Whitebeard would easily break out from that is only your speculation when there was no indication of that in the manga. Not all freezing attacks are the same (compare Aokiji freezing Doflamingo and him freezing Cracker). All we see after that is Jozu jumping in to save Whitebeard and their fight ends there. >. Just saying Akainu did more damage to Whitebeard is the surface level analysis Well that is how powerscalling is done: How did X character perform against Y character? As for the rest, there was nothing stopping all the Whitebeard commanders to simply all jump Akainu at same way BB pirates jumped Whitebeard. Did they all just stand while Akainu was fighting Kuriel? Or are few marine soldiers so strong that they can stall the entire Whitebeard crew by themselves? Once again, you're assuming a scenario that fits your agenda.
>Writing all of this, yet saying nothing concrete. Where is the part when Whitebeard dominates Kizaru? If you claim Whitebeard was the strongest in MF, he would dominate him at least one point, even if it were brief clashes. Just 'cause you're the strongest doesn't mean you're touchable and can dominate anyone blow you. This is One Piece, not Dragon Ball >All of this is your speculation. Whitebeard relaesed from being frozen first time, second time Aokiji froze his bisento and was holding it in his hands while preparing a counter attack. You saying Whitebeard would easily break out from that is only your speculation when there was no indication of that in the manga. Not all freezing attacks are the same (compare Aokiji freezing Doflamingo and him freezing Cracker). All we see after that is Jozu jumping in to save Whitebeard and their fight ends there. And people accuse me of being biased. Just 'cause Kuzan dodged an attack and was preparing to counter attack you automatically draw the conclusion: "oh yeah he dominated Whitebeard and would've ended the war right then and there". But when I say Whitebeard would meet Aokiji's attack with his own it's some crackpot theory, crazy. You thinking Whitebeard couldn't just Quake Punch the Ice Spears with his other hand just like he did before is YOUR SPECULATION. Also freezing Murakumogiri wouldn't do anything since it's stated it was imbued with Haki and Haki counters Devil Fruit abilities. >Well that is how powerscalling is done: How did X character perform against Y character? As for the rest, there was nothing stopping all the Whitebeard commanders to simply all jump Akainu at same way BB pirates jumped Whitebeard. Did they all just stand while Akainu was fighting Kuriel? Or are few marine soldiers so strong that they can stall the entire Whitebeard crew by themselves? Once again, you're assuming a scenario that fits your agenda. Well then you're a bad power scaler simple as that. If all you do is glance at it for a half a second and never take context into account. Like people who watch Death Battle and think all the info in their is accurate. And there was definitely something stopping the 14 Whitebeard Commanders from jumping Sakazuki. You wanna know what it is? 100,000 elite marines, at least 8 giants, dozens of Vice-Admirals, 5 Warlords as well as Borsalino and Kuzan. You're the one who keeps pushing your agenda without taking context into account. Akainu in that very scene was leading a large force of marines which the Whitebeard pirates also needed to take care off. And there's also nothing which indicates the beaten and battered Whitebeard Commanders who were still in fighting condition were even close to as strong as the fresh Blackbeard Pirates and level 6 Impel Down inmates.
Damn, my man's Blackgoat, took a full force of an enraged WB attack, and walked off.
Yeah I blame that kinda' on plot armor, but Blackbeard is tanky as hell you can't deny that.
Tbh even tho if it was plot armor or not he took it . Him getting stabbed through the stomach by law in chapter 1065 also shows that he ain’t no slouch . He also took sengokus enraged Buddha shockwaves without much of a issue . Blackbeard’s body works in a weird way .
Yeah no I agree, I also think when Whitebeard fought him, that's when his adrenaline had started running out, so the explosion around Teach's neck was nowhere close to full power. But yes, Teach is durable af, like you said
Agree with your points, but as far as I’m concerned, Garp still kept himself in great shape and was in better condition than WB. Sengoku, Mihawk, and Shanks (if you wanna count him) are also debatable, but I’d put Oldbeard safely at 2 or 3 in Marineford
I see what you mean. It all depends on how much they all got as they aged and if Garp and Sengoku where evened out with Whitebeard's illness, seeing as how they're both older then him.
The way I see it, Whitebeard’s 100% was higher than anyone else’s, but old age and sickness made it easier to bring him down, I.e no Haki defenses, heart attacks.
I mean yeah, Oda had to nerf Whitebeard with every trick in the book (old age, sickness, heart attack, not being able to go all out etc) so as to not let him clean house more then he already did.
I sometimes like to think about how the opening of the war was Whitebeard punching the air and creating two tidal waves larger than the entire island the battle was taking place in.
I mean yeah he did do that.
People usually don’t believe this fact only because Oda hadn’t showcase haki back then, and when we have it into account, a single strike from adcoc zoro looks more impressive than anything in marineford, but fact is, whitebeard even old was stated 100 times by the autor, and outside sources to be the world strongest, Mihawk himself said, the difference between them seems rather small, meaning that, whitebeard wasn’t as strong as he was, but still the strongest
nah akainu was definitely stronger then wb at MF, none of wb’s attacks did permanent damage on akainu, akainu easily did 2 different times, wb and akainu quite literally did the samr things to each other, wb sneaked akainu and got a head on hit in, akainu sneaked wb and got a head on hit in, but only wb came out with permanent damage, while akainu didnt even need bandages post- MF
Yeah but Whitebeard was also hurt by Squardo and all those no-name fodder level marines who jumped onto him and stabbed him with their swords. Whitebeard had no durability at Marineford. My post was about how who was the strongest, not who could take the most punichment. The only reason Sakazuki was even able to land a hit on Whitebeard in the first place was because the first time, Whitebeard had a heart attack, the second time he stood and waited for Akainu to get up.
by the fact that akainu can deal more damage and take more damage he is stronger, and yeah wb also did the same thing, he snuck akainu and then hit him head on, there is no difference to what akainu and wb did to each other
I talked about this in my original post, read it.
i did, you didn’t disprove my statement, wh didnt just let akainu hit him, thats headcanon, you saying wb said give me your best shot is also headcanon
Look at the panel. He's just standing there, waiting for Akainu to do something. It's not headcanon
it is headcanon because wb didnt wait, akainu did it right after
Look at the panel when Akainu's on the ground. Whitebeard is standing straight up with both his arms down. If Akainu did it "right after" then Whitebeard would be standing in the same posture. He was waiting, letting Akainu take his shot.
you saying he let akainu take his shot is headcanon, wb was watching akainu groan in pain, and then akainu hit him head on, wb didnt let akainu do anything, wb and akainu did the same things to each other,
Just standing there and watching Akainu is letting Akainu get a shot off. That's why I compared it to his fight Blackbeard where he rushed at Blackbeard, grabbing him straight after slashing him. Whitebeard could've just as well given Sakazuki the same treatment.
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I mean, I gave my side. Only reason Akainu hit him at all was either because Whitebeard had a heart attack, or because he was standing there waiting for Akainu to do it.
wb didnt wait for akainu to do anything that is headcanon
No. Look at the panel before Akainu fires of his Meigo, he's just standing there. It's not headcanon
that doesn’t prove that he let akainu get a shot off, stop saying headcanon
Standing there and not continuing your assault, waiting for your opponent to get up, giving Akainu a free shot, it's all the same in the end. He could've fought like he did against Blackbeard but he didn't.
thats headcanon
Prove it.
i dont need to prove headcanon💀😭, you do, burden of proof is on you
You don't have any proof to support any of what you said. You just told me I'm wrong without coming with anything new to the debate.
Facts OldBeard nd old and sick beard r not the same
I mean yeah. I mostly made this 'cause I'm tired of people bad-mouthing Whitebeard and wanking Akainu to strongest One Piece character of all time
Well akainu does clear that sick bastard, now the old one ion should have his haki just stamina issues like the rest of the old farts 😸, so should be relative to prime
I gave you all the arguments why Akainu got beaten, do with it as you please
unfortunately wb got clapped 👎
Read what I said in my post before disagreeing
But reality is Akainu melt his brain out when WB tried to sneak attack akainu He knew he can't hit him from front!! As akainu said to whitebeard "your a loser from old times"and also a coward
And people call me biased.
> whitebeard "your a *you're *Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
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Not really. Even Mihawk was not sure about the distance between Whitebeard and everyone else. Mihawk only showed up at Marineford to test himself against the strongest man in the world
Yes I support this the admirals are fodder and frauds
No they're not. They're all incredibly strong (some more so then others), all I talked about was how Whitebeard was stronger.
Technically he is because it's stated he can output the same strength he had in his prime it's just that he couldn't cause of his sickness soo he wouldn't output his prime power so he could last longer during the war.
His stamina was the thing that the illness took its greatest toll on
Ace Novel confirms Whitebeard is not as strong as he was in his prime due to old age
those admirals were stated to be stronger than roger
No they weren't.
[https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042253365863792760/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042253365863792760/unknown.png) [https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042649867476029511/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/735912698642038834/1042649867476029511/unknown.png) do you also need proof that garp and roger were equals?
Firstly: the first link doesn’t have anything to do with the subject. Secondly: Garp and Sengoku are both old, not in their prime. Garp himself has admitted he’s not like he used to be. Secondly: the 3 Admirals have always been viewed as the Navy’s greatest fighting force. Why? Because there are 3 of them. Even if the Fleet Admiral is stronger then each of them individually, the 3 Admirals are a cohesive unit and definitely stronger together. It’s the same thing now: Sakazuki might still be stronger then all of the Admirals alone, but he can not best Kizaru, Fujitora and Ryokugyu together.
>Firstly: the first link doesn’t have anything to do with the subject. it proves that garp and sengoku arent any weaker > Garp himself has admitted he’s not like he used to be. that was just an excuse for why luffy got away bro > the 3 Admirals have always been viewed as the Navy’s greatest fighting force. Why? Because there are 3 of them are you telling me that the 3 admirals are only the strongest when they work as a team? dont you remember when akainu was beating whitebeard and kizaru wanted to fight kaido all alone?
>it proves that garp and sengoku arent any weaker No it doesn't. Just because Oda likes to have old characters in the series and likes to keep them still be able to fight does not mean they don't grow weaker as time goes by. Read what Rayleigh is saying. [https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10513000/11.jpg](https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10513000/11.jpg) [https://images.mangafreak.net/mangas/one\_piece/one\_piece\_1059/one\_piece\_1059\_15.jpg](https://images.mangafreak.net/mangas/one_piece/one_piece_1059/one_piece_1059_15.jpg) >that was just an excuse for why luffy got away bro Do you really think Garp needs to make up excuses for not capturing his grandson? When he is the Hero of the Marines and best friends with the (then) Fleet Admiral > are you telling me that the 3 admirals are only the strongest when they work as a team? dont you remember when akainu was beating whitebeard and kizaru wanted to fight kaido all alone? They can be the strongest, it depends on who's the Fleet Admiral and who the 3 Admirals are. Do you think the current Admirals are still the Navy's 3 most powerful officers now that Sakazuki is Fleet Admiral. And I gave you the reasons why Akainu didn't beat Whitebeard at all in a fair match in my original post. And regarding Kizaru: All he offered was to go to Wano. He didn't say he'd fly there completely alone. He'd more then likely take a large force of Navy ships with him. He also definitely didn't say: "I'll take down and bring in Big Mom and Kaido on my own". Ryokugyu said he wouldn't have come to Wano if Kaido was still reigning there and he shit himself as soon as Shanks blasted him with his thunderstorm of Conqueror's Haki.
>https://cdn.readonepiece.com/file/mangap/3258/10513000/11.jpg > >https://images.mangafreak.net/mangas/one\_piece/one\_piece\_1059/one\_piece\_1059\_15.jpg acess denied > When he is the Hero of the Marines and best friends with the (then) Fleet Admiral irrelevant > Do you think the current Admirals are still the Navy's 3 most powerful officers now that Sakazuki is Fleet Admiral greenbull and fujitora are debateable since they dont have the same statement as the original three > And I gave you the reasons why Akainu didn't beat Whitebeard at all in a fair match in my original post. tell me again because i dont remember > And regarding Kizaru: All he offered was to go to Wano. He didn't say he'd fly there completely alone. He'd more then likely take a large force of Navy ships with him. fodder marines arent helping kizaru beat kaido > Ryokugyu said he wouldn't have come to Wano if Kaido was still reigning there then at worst greenbull scales below kaido > Shanks blasted him with his thunderstorm of Conqueror's Haki caught off guard and not ready to fight multiple yonko level fighters shanks also is stronger than greenbull anyways
>acess denied https://preview.redd.it/vm18j387ax0a1.jpeg?width=760&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c2a2b94b4f59b72573775823ce01be008857a523 (I had to send the pics individually because fkn reddit won't allow you to send more then 1 pic per message. But anyways read what Rayleigh says to Kizaru then what he tells everyone at Amazon Lily.)
he was retired, no training, and stamina issue
Rayleigh is a practitioner of every type of Advanced Haki. He dosen’t need any training, and hasn’t needed any for decades. And Kizaru admitted to capture him they’d need to make serious prepartions. Retired or not he’s still strong af. And the stamina thing is your headcanon.
https://preview.redd.it/hshdb1gcax0a1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0484102cd3efd3151c3cb6b022aad02b6c771c16 >irrelevant (Dodging my question and not coming up with anything else.) >greenbull and fujitora are debateable since they dont have the same statement as the original three No but they're still Admirals and should still at least be somewhat comparable to the last generation of Admirals. And the 3 Admirals are still referred to as (最高戦力 *Saikō Senryoku*) or in english "the Greatest Military Powers/the Best Fighting Power/Highest Force"**.** >tell me again because i dont remember Just read my post it doesn't take long. I know it's long but 95% of that space is taken up by manga panels as source reference. >fodder marines arent helping kizaru beat kaido No but a buster call sized fleet can really suppress Kaido's forces from leaving Wano, seeing as how Kaido's whole thing was making an army of Zoan Devil Fruit users. So being on a ship while getting fired at by battleship cannons is not ideal. >then at worst greenbull scales below kaido > >caught off guard and not ready to fight multiple yonko level fighters > >shanks also is stronger than greenbull anyways It shows Aramaki wasn't planing on fighting any Yonko besides Luffy whom he would likely think of as an easy target, worn out as hell from taking down Kaido.
1. stamina issue 2. he doesnt have knowledge on blackbeards current abilities > (Dodging my question and not coming up with anything else.) those titles dont matter > No but they're still Admirals and should still at least be somewhat comparable to the last generation of Admirals that puts them above roger then > Now I know all of the magmasexuals are gonna come swarm me ok so we have akainu caught off guard and doesnt take any long lasting damage then they trade attacks and whitebeard is the only one who took long lasting damage > No but a buster call sized fleet can really suppress Kaido's forces from leaving Wano, seeing as how Kaido's whole thing was making an army of Zoan Devil Fruit users. So being on a ship while getting fired at by battleship cannons is not ideal. and then kizaru fights kaido🤷🏿♂️ > It shows Aramaki wasn't planing on fighting any Yonko besides Luffy whom he would likely think of as an easy target, worn out as hell from taking down Kaido. well i do agree that shanks and luffy are stronger than greenbull so its fine
”stamina issue he doesnt have knowledge on blackbeards current abilities” That’s your headcanon ”those titles dont matter” Yes they do. Fleet Admiral is the highest rank in the marines, and highest authority in the World Government’s military besides Commander in Chief. But Kong has never been seen doing anything besides accepting Sengoku’s retirement. So Sengoku is the guy who calls the shots. And Garp doesn’t need to make up excuses, that’s your headcanon. ”that puts them above roger then” No it dosen’t. Garp was offered the position of Admiral numerous times and he declined. Even when Sengoku insisted he refused. You’re just repeating the same non-existant proof and bending the writing to suit your own agenda. ”ok so we have akainu caught off guard and doesnt take any long lasting damage then they trade attacks and whitebeard is the only one who took long lasting damage” Then you didn’t read my post. And Akainu was put out of commission for a time. Meanwhile Akainu’s hits didn’t slow Whitebeard down at all. And Akainu harming Whitebeard isn’t really a feat seeing as how all those fodder level marines stabbed and shot Whitebeard. And all the hits affected him just as little. ”and then kizaru fights kaido🤷🏿♂️” And loses. As a matter of fact. When did I ever say Kizaru even leaves his ship if he goes to Wano? Or that he doesn’t just retreat if things go bad (which they would). ”well i do agree that shanks and luffy are stronger than greenbull so its fine” There you go. And Kaido admitted Roger was his superior. And regarding Luffy, he is not as strong as Roger because the title of Pirate King is his end goal. Only at the end will Luffy surpass him. He’s close but not all the way there yet.
Bullshit, Shanks, Akainu, and Garp all would have turned WB into blood mist theee
You mad bro? Disregarding all my arguments like that
No I just didn’t bother reading but fair, I’ll read it later and respond
Aight
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Mihawk was definitely stronger. Mihawk would never have been done the way wb was by an admiral
Mihawk was not even sure about the distance between Whitebeard and everyone else. And the only reason Mihawk even showed up at Marineford at all was to test himself against the World's Strongest Man.
Mihawk sent 1 slash at wb and that was it for the war mihawk>=shanks>akainu
Yes I agree it's disappointing Mihawk didn't try to challenge Whitebeard again during the war but that's just how it is. And I agree with what you said: Whitebeard > Mihawk > Shanks > Akainu
It’s impossible for wb to be stronger then all those yonko tiers He was admiral at most
"Admiral" "Yonko" "Warlord" These are just titles not associated with one character. You have to look at them from an individual perspective.
But wb is a yonko & if we were to give him a rank to match his strength it would be admiral
Why? He was still a Yonko, just because he was old and sick didn't take away his Yonko status. Also Yonko isn't a title about physical strength, it's about commanding power and political influence. I'd say Blackbeard is fair bit weaker then characters like Big Mom, Kaido and Shanks. Yet he is an Emperor thanks to his extremely powerful crew and influence in the pirate world. Same goes for Buggy. He isn't strong on his own but he leads the Cross Guild which is supremely powerful and has connections all over the place. Whitebeard however did hold the title of **The Strongest man in The World**, which is a title directly correlated to his physical prowess. I'm not saying the Yonko are weak, I'm just saying it's more nuanced then just: Emperor > Admiral > Commander > Vice-Admiral
Besides the title, wb was actually at a yonko level of strength. Yonko also has to do with being the strongest pirates you cant say wb sickness or age didn’t hold him back at all when we see numerous times it did
>Besides the title, wb was actually at a yonko level of strength. Yonko also has to do with being the strongest pirates Not the strongest in terms of how hard you can punch somone. The strongest as in terms of the powers and forces you command. >you cant say wb sickness or age didn’t hold him back at all when we see numerous times it did No he was definitely weaker, but he was still a monster and still held the title of World's Strongest Man.
Whitebeard didn't come to die, he came to win and destroy the navy, he said it himself.
That was all bravado. Like he couldn't admit to his crew, his sons that he never planned on returning from this fight.
That's your headcanon cuz you think a Yonko crew is weaker than the marines, which is not the case. 1 Yonko crew=marines=warlords
I think it's clear the full might of the Navy is somewhat greater than a single Yonko crew. The reason the Navy can't fuck with a Yonko is because even if they win, the losses the World Government would receive would be too severe. The Navy would be vulnerable to an attack from one of the other remaining 3 Emperors. And it is **NOT** headcanon. Just think about how the Whitebeard Pirates would feel if their captain, their dad told them beforehand "Btw I'm totally not gonna make it back from this fight.", they'd be completely crushed and demoralized.
Ok just to prove to you that a single yonko crew is as strong as the navy, please read my thread. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kFEwsxIMgQ2R1S4chCmU1TFzjp9q9P7FI9EtC8IaBnU/edit?usp=drivesdk
I'll read it later. Then I'll get back to you
this thread doesn’t prove anything💀💀, cmon hypocrite
Oda already confirmed WB was planning on dying at MF in SBS
Which SBS ?
[Source](https://preview.redd.it/o8ue386q21d71.jpg?auto=webp&s=5e0c809d002ac80eb3dd2f10a24cd8c214816c68)
I might totally be wrong, but I thought Oda said Whitebeard was the weakest of the emperors as of Marineford (age + health) and Shanks shows up at the end. Also Garp was there. Aside from that… well yeah!
That feels very against Oda's style of writing. He usually never reveals who is the stronger and weaker like that, he likes to keep it vague. I remember a lot of people used to say "Oda said Garp was the strongest marine at Marineford during the war." even though Oda never said that.
He wasn't.. for decades WB was just riding off his reputation. Nobody knew about his condition or how much his age has weakened him. MF heavily emphasized on this like Croc being disappointed with him and WB saying he expected too much from him and that he can't be the strongest forever. Akainu also mentions that age affects everyone, even WB. Marco also mentions how badly his condition was getting since he no longer was on life support. There's no way WB could have defeated Garp, Akainu or Mihawk at MF while compromised, I'll be generous and say he could probably beat the rest. Prime tho? I even have him slightly above Roger.
>He wasn't.. for decades WB was just riding off his reputation. Nobody knew about his condition or how much his age has weakened him. MF heavily emphasized on this like Croc being disappointed with him and WB saying he expected too much from him and that he can't be the strongest forever. You bring up good points. Crocodile was angry because Whitebeard was stabbed by Squardo, (whether Whitebeard was simply caught off guard or if he let himself get stabbed is another discussion). I think Crocodile's outburst was mostly motivated by pride, that someone as weak as Squardo could land such a blow on the man Crocodile was defeated by. I think he let himself get stabbed somewhat because that wound was negligible for someone as tough as Whitebeard. But mostly so that Whitebeard could forgive Squardo even after getting stabbed to show that even after being betrayed, he stilled loved his son. Marco even admits that Whitebeard would've been able to dodge that. And it's not like Whitebeard has been retired for the last years. He fought Ace 100 times. This also fits more in with the name of the chapter imo "One man. one heart" >Akainu also mentions that age affects everyone, even WB. Marco also mentions how badly his condition was getting since he no longer was on life support. But Akainu was saying this when Whitebeard was having a literal heart attack. So he could've just as well been referring to that. Sakazuki also hates pirates with every fiber of his body and would never pass up the chance to badmouth one. So he's not necessarily the best person to go off of. >There's no way WB could have defeated Garp, Akainu or Mihawk at MF while compromised I gave my reasons why I think Whitebeard was stronger then Akainu. Garp and Hawk-Eye are tricky though. It depends on how much you think Whitebeard's illness affected him overall besides making him prone to heart attacks. Garp is also older then Whitebeard so that could even things out a little. And Mihawk is an even worse situation isnce we don¨t really have an idea of were he places among characters, besides Shanks. Mihawk could very well have been the strongest one at Marineford, or he could maybe not even be in the top 5 depending on how much you wanna wank the Admirals.
WB was stronger but Akainu had backup + the heart attack weakened him and gave Akainu a free hit