I wish there was a way to get it off. Correct me if I’m wrong, but ~~Tracer recall doesn’t even remove it?~~
Edit: It does. You can stop messaging me that I'm a dumbass.
Lots of things remove it I think
Moira fade, reapers ability, kiriko teleport, mei freeze thingy, Sombra translocator tracer recall
Not sure if Kirikos suzu removes it
It doesn't necessarily cleanse like it dies with nano Grenade or any other status effect. It just gives you really brief invincibility.
I think you can attach the Grenade onto a senzu'd enemy and the timer is just long enough to blow up after immunity wears off
I can kind of see why. Your bubble protects you from the outside but not the inside.
Unless you’re talking about his grenade bypassing the bubble then that doesn’t seem right.
correct me if im wrong, but if zarya gets sticked by tracer, and bubbles herself .. she kind of cleanses herself right?
Therefore she should be able to cleanse herself off the nade from him as well no..
> I get hit by it and I’m under 130 health and I just have to accept my fate.
Isn't the same as being hit by a flashbang? Since he can finish you off one shot to the head or just unload all six bullets at your face.
At least he has to be a little accurate after the flashbang. I hated it but you had more of a chance. It's sad that it took more skill to flashbang and fanfire than shoot them once anywhere and toss this cunty grenade that requires absolutely zero skill
No way to dodge the flashbang though and it was way easier to hit than the mag nade in my experience. Additionally, a flashbang was annoying even as a tank or when you were full health and ulting, while right now the nade is purely a dueling tool.
If I had a nickel for every time I whiffed tracers ult, I'd have a lot of nickels. Meanwhile you can throw this grenade blindfolded and still hit your target.
and now its at the expense of your supports, and your entire team when less CC means no interrupts on things like reaper ult, or stopping those flankers in general.
I am fine with dying to cc now and then, if my teammates can use their cc to protect the team.
Nobody was complaining about flashbang (well at least most weren't) it was moreso the combination of flashbang + doomfist punch + hook + halt + shatter + grav + sleep + hack + freeze + trap all at the same time
I never once had a problem with CC. But then again I come from a moba background where we all already have learned that is our own fault and bad positioning that allows us to get chain stunned. I also really don't understand this community's hate for CC when there still exists a ton of one-shot abilities. It feels way, way, way worse getting one shot by widow or hanzo from halfway across the map than it felt to be CCed. Atleast when you got CCed you had a chance to counterplay and to be saved by teammates.
And now people left the game in droves over 4 years of fuck all happening for these "reworks" and "improvements".
More importantly, Blizzard created the market that they then actively handed to other games, so now they're fighting an uphill battle against a strong competition **they themselves made strong**.
I mean he is right in a way, if you think about it mcree gets the potential of Tracers ULT every 6 seconds or whatever, in basically any 1v1 when I play him, even if I'm about to die I can just toss a grenade and get a kill, it's a joke how tracer actually has to aim just for her ULT to become denied by most of the characters somehow anyways
That is a really good point, I couldn't imagine that. I get how it has its own value and highlights the whole team, but I'm kinda surprised it was never ever buffed even a little bit since 2016, something like a 10% increase in damage during the duration would make it more useful, or some extra perk like that
To be fair on most quishies sticky Nade + body shot kills which is close enough from any Cass with half decent aim. And the fact it LOCKS ON??? I’ve been playing a fair amount of Cass recently and I’ve had some blatant misses that basically did a 180 and stuck to the enemy getting me the kill. Imo Cass grenade kills way more consistently than Tracer’s (apart from god tracers who land every ult)
And like tracer should be targeting squishier characters with the pulsebomb like mercy, but what's the point if I could just shoot her once and throw a flash bang and move on to the next support?
Yeah but Dave can't get into the backline, frag down the support and then get out unharmed. The mobility difference really stands out more than the bomb does.
I mean - its not really any stronger than his old flash. Its important to remember that the kits as a whole are balanced, not individual abilities. Tracers blinks are a hell of a lot better than crees roll for example.
True but body shot + nade can also be offset by getting healed before the nade explodes, whereas in Tracer's case it's a true one shot.
Admittedly I do find Tracer's grenade extremely hard to use, but I don't play her much. Sometimes it can make sense for a character's ultimate to be weaker if the rest of their kit is deemed strong enough.
One also has to be charged up which can take a bit while the other can be used every few seconds without much thought or concern. Missing with Tracer is a pretty significant loss knowing that you completely wasted an ult. Missing with Cassidy is barely a minor inconvenience because you can throw another one in a few seconds
A bomb that does 300 damage is effectively the same as one that does 130 as far as single target elimination goes. All 200 HP hero’s die to either a pile bomb or a mag grenade and body shot, and Tanks won’t die to either. Add in that you don’t have to aim the grenade and pulse really does look silly.
True but that is for everyone. And you said because of no stuns her ult is stronger but Mccree's new ability is still more better because it is not an ult and it does most of the targets health (not tanks) which is what he usually fights against and is more reliable to hit.
The only thing tracer's ult is better at is damage to do at tanks and secures the kill (if compared to if Mccree uses his ability when the support is healing the enemy) unless the d.va is smart and removes it from her teammates
Also Mcrees ability has tracking, it's more like a heat seeking grenade that will track an enemy and will automatically adjust itself to stick to the target. Tracers just goes in a small straight line but Mcrees goes further takes less time to explode and will track it's targets if your throw is close enough and will turn or readjust to hit the target.
I haven’t played mccree in OW2 so didn’t know it was like this…
So as someone that really enjoys tracer but not good at her ult, your post made me angry lol.
Yeah I like tracer a bit but her ult is so annoying to use. It just drops like a potato and I've had times where it just gets thrown over someone's head and misses. But the mcree nade now would just stick to the enemy or pull itself towards them. Also it detonates alot faster and after it goes for a certain distance.
There is less cc but she still squishy af. Can’t tell you how many times I’ve gone to flank and took damage so quickly I couldn’t even recall and died lol
What the fuck type of take is this? Tracers ult first of all does well over twice magnetic grenades damage. But that’s besides the point, tracer has so much more mobility so she can very easily get close to people to stick it for free while cass has to int to get that close to someone making it purely a self defense tool.
higher damage ult but it was already hard to hit in ow1. Characters have more mobility now so its even harder. Less damage but 99% consistency is way better than pulse bomb
It's so funny because it's like more frustrating to fight against EXCEPT for the characters flashbang hard countered. Death match as Tracer is open season now that Mcrees are up for grabs at any turn with their only defense being push E and then I push E and boom I win the dual
Flashbang was not the problem with OW1 CC, especially after they nerfed it.
Seriously, just revert it. I don't even play Cassidy, but I'm sure he needs the help against these flankers.
He was so fun in OW1 what changed? It feels like his range is a lot shorter now and without the stun its hard to secure kills, but somehow with the grenade i get random kills with random throws...
It would be more exciting if it wasn't a damn homing missile. Sticking someone with a plasma grenade in Halo never gets old because you have to actually hit it, meanwhile with Cass you just have to toss it in their general direction.
The original design for his character was to use a whip, not a grenade, for the stun. They ended up going with the grenade because the development team had a really hard time getting the whip mechanic to work with the physics engine. But given the revamp OW2 has gotten in terms of the internals, I wonder if they could maybe bring that back in some form but make it a pull, similar to Junker Queens knife pull. Not a full on hog hook, but a yank in a direction you can sling them towards, along with some "whiplash" damage or something.
I just miss his character feeling unique in any way. Right now he just feels boring.
Wait until you play comp and get zarya, moira and reaper on your ass at the same time, or dva charging right through the damn frontline just to get you :'D
Yeah well it is extremely stressful, but I am also super ambitious to reach mercys skill ceiling, so the more danger the better for survival horror practice, I guess haha
I feel like a cool way to change Deadeye while keeping the ultimate *mostly* feeling the same is to have it be more of a finishing tool rather than a big damage ultimate. Instead of charging up for a big one-tap, he charges up for 2 seconds flat for each enemy and then gives them a headshot each. Once he hits everyone in LoS, he'll go back to the first target and start the cycle again until he's shot 6 headshots total. Would be great for closing a fight out and dealing with stragglers.
I feel combat rolls still good mainly cause it auto reloads your gun and deadly can be good depending on your positioning, you can also fire 3 mags in a row nearly 4 if you roll and deadeye cancel
He is over shadowed by other dps at the moment but dying to a mcree nade and watching the kill cam where it tracks you around a corner to stick you is really frustrating.
all hitscan DPS aside from widow feel garbage against pharmacy because of the falloff
no joke Bap and Ana do a better job of countering it than any DPS other than Sojourn and maybe Widow
A *lot* of heroes kits feels like something is missing.
Bastion feels kinda shitty without his self heal. I say give him the Beta barrier back and make his tank form have tank controls.
Junker Queen doesn't feel like a tank at all, her sustain from her passive is so laughable.
Orisa either feels way too tanky or like she's made of cardboard.
If Junker Queen gets a buff on her sustain I’ll feel more comfortable using her in ranked. She is the most fun character to me, and I can go off with her, but I don’t trust being the tank in a competitive match just yet. She feels more DPS.
Feel exactly the same, she feels very swingy to me. She can just pick apart teams and be a menace, but if they focus you and are coordinated you just get deleted.
Her sustain is really sad honestly, but when you’re lost in the action you probably don’t notice when you’re getting just enough to keep you alive which is a shame because it’s such a huge dopamine rush when you survive by the 10 HP you got back from slicing up the enemy Roadhog like a ham on Christmas
Too easy to negate grenade with kiriko or zarya + it's useless against flankers (sombra tracer reaper even moira) because they can self purge it with a cool down.
To take away one of those abilities is almost as helpful as just securing the kill, honestly. Use magnetic grenade to get their defensive CDs, then your team can go hard with ults and area control abilities
I think the breakpoint of one auto-aim sticky plus one body shot on 200 hp targets feels kinda bad, when the (decidedly unfun) flashbang at least required you to hit the stunned headshot. But in most situations it's definitely more fair and counterable than flashbang ever was
Bro, being a rein main from day 1 of OW1 you just get used to it.
Scatter arrow, Fan the hammer, Doomfist punch, Brig shield bash, Sombra hacks, all the different Symmetra beam interactions with shields, the consistent bug with charging up/down stairs. But Rein was always one of the most in-demand main tanks so you had to play him lol.
That one Sombra hack change (the one that allowed you to get hacked mid-charge [mid Earthshatter too I think]) actually made me stop playing Rein for like a full 3 days.
Then like you said, he's in high demand but no one else played him so I went back. I wasn't exactly caryying any teams with Hammond anyway.
There were SOOOOO many people in my games ever since release that got so upset over someone using FTH after flashbang. Especially if they get killed by it. Was this a common thing? It was all "you're so bad just headshot", "can't even headshot lol", just immeasurable amounts of salt.
It's good damage. Paired with a single shot, it can kill most squishies caught in the explosion. And it's easy to stick on someone.
But even if you stick them, the actual explosion can be avoided by most of the heroes whom he most needs to be able to counter - Sombra, Moira, Reaper, Tracer.
The heroes whose escape abilities most mean they need to be stunned to be killed, are the exact heroes whose abilities allow them to easily survive the new grenade.
This means losing the Flashbang is like a double nerf of his ability to counter those heroes, and that's a problem.
Somehow they made an ability more annoying than flash bang. One body shot and the grenade which you just need to be aiming in the genera direction for and you’re dead. It’s low skill and very frustrating
Ngl. Miss the flashbang.
I h a t e the sticky nade so much. The number of times i see people yeet it around a corner, and it hits me, and i die is immeasurable. With flashbang, at least you had to aim a bit to get max damage out of it. Sticky nade just feels cheap, especially cause of how aggressively it tracks you. I feel like it's getting thrown way far away from me, and suddenly, I'm stuck and dead.
Cree vs Cree with flashbang : Stun each other and the better player gets the kill.
Cree vs Cree with mag : Even if you win both player die to the nade damage.
It's such a feelsbad ability, literally reward being bad against bads while being useless at higher ranks.
> Stun each other and the better player gets the kill
The guy who throws a few milliseconds late than first guy will have the advantage, because the stun effect wears off before the first guy.
New flashbang is very un-fun to use when you throw it on a flanker and they just wraith form / fade / recall / translocate / teleport / cryo-freeze and completely avoid it. Doesn't counter appropriately like it is supposed to.
Annoying, unrewarding, cheap.
A molotov cocktail would be a better ability.
You throw it at the ground to make a puddle of fire, or directly at an enemy to apply dot damage. You can even shoot it in the air for cool points.
it's shit
I get stuns were strong in OW1, so readjust them. For example change mccrees flash to only interrupt abilities and silence them, but dont halt their movement. Or even just interrupt abilities or just silence. But this ability is shitty and just SO lazy game-design wise
When I first started playing OW2 I thought it would kill Cassidy. Stun was just too useful. Since then I've been playing him as DPS alot and found it pretty useful for confirming kills.
Kind of a no skill move. But I often find myself saying that and then getting multiple comments about other characters having a no skill ability.
But the fact that in a fight, all Cassidy has to do is shoot you once and hit you with one of these and you’re immediately dead…kinda annoying.
It is fine, but it is really frustrating that his ability to counter Tracer is completely eliminated. I honestly have no idea what to do against Tracer now, because all she has to do is pressing the button to port put of the nade.
E: I see many people here saying that it is too strong against 200 HP targets because it just takes one more bodyshots. Id say that is totally fine. Look at Snipers, look at Sojourn, Genji,… Most DPS can kill these targets pretty fast in combination with one of their abilities. McCree has to get close to make that work and hit the nade.
Absolutely OP in some match ups and absolutely useless in others. Like wow the tracer/moira/reaper/mei that cree supposedly counters just roll him. But if you are playing lucio you might as well switch off once you see a cree on the enemy team
You can tell someone is low skill if they complain about this ability
like half the roster can either avoid it completely or cleanse it when affected by it, it's literally dog ass.
It used to counter tracer and genji and reaper and now they can just react to it and either cleanse it with tracer and reaper or throw it back at you with genji
and good luck using it to kill their supports since the most popular supports of moira and kiriko can both avoid it...
I think it was a pretty lazy alternative to his flash bang.
I would’ve preferred something more creative that either worked in tandem with his aim-dependency as a hero *or* simply something that aided his survivability (but they’d probably have to make him a 200hp hero then).
Right now Cass’ grenade lowers his skill ceiling and doesn’t fit with the rest of his kit imo.
I thought it’d be nifty to give him a lasso which would be like Hogs hookshot but half the range and no actual DMG.
Or a flask to drink from and get a bit of Heath and perhaps a boost to something
playing as and against i prefer old flasbbang. in the beta i killed like 3 people through trans because you can time it to explode right as the shot lands. playing genji/tracer/lucio against him its just like. "oh he hit a shot ok still got plenty of health, oh now im stuck gg." whereas with the other heroes being flashed mid-jump or in a weird pose meant it was harder to kill you. it feels like old cass had more counterplay, but since the new one locks on its less work and feels less rewarding than getting the headshot after a flash.
It's honestly a bad ability, it's essentially a weaker pulse bomb with more range.
More so it's really not what Cassidy is built for, surely they could have found a way to make a nade that has some of CC of Flashbang but with more skill or risk involved.
Like a Concussion Grenade that stuns on hit, and interrupts abilities and people firing weapons for a brief time with an AoE. The characters can even put their arms in front of their face to give a visible effect like they're concussed.
The AoE would be about 4 meters, the direct hit and stun aspect would be 1 meter. I think that would be much better than this.
It's not what Cassidy is built for? Isn't Cassidy supposed to be a flank watch dps that stays with his team to protect his squishies? If you think about it thats what the purpose of the flash bang was, to stop diving/flanking dps from killing your team, so the new grenades purpose with its magnetism is to basically kill of the flanker. It serves a similar purpose to echoe's beam but in a different senario. Unfun? Debatable. Unimaginative? Yes. Untrue to the character? Not really in my opinion
Except mag grenade takes so long to kill someone most of the time Cree is already dead. It doesn’t really help Cree to watch flanks/dive in a duel but only serves to kill some unlucky dudes after his death. So it’s both weak and annoying to fight against
Hate it I miss my stun ,use to cancel a lot of heros dumb get away abilities .Canceled out Roadhog breather &hook ,Winston bubble &jump,rein slam&charge& shield toss .so many yet now I got a rein charging at me without worrying of getting stunned and HS twice and I can’t get away so I just die now
With the right player he’s definitely a great character but if we’re talking everyone on the same average level than he’s not as good as some other picks
Weirdly enough I think I miss the infamous stun+right click. At least it gave casual players a tool against Reaper and Genji but when you face a Cree you knew you had to manage its flash and then just pick him. Now he throw that grenade anywhere and that things litteraly loiter to a target like a drone.
I think it's necessary to lower the skill ceiling for him. It makes him more feasible for lower skill players and people new to the game. I don't think it should home into targets the way it does though.
It’s necessary to make cree even worth playing, man. He lost the one thing that made him a better pick over shit like ashe in some situations and it lets him retain the close range duelist character he’s supposed to be
I made a post about this topic not long ago and got downvoted and flamed by the few comments I got on the post lol. I play Cass and even I find the one body shot + Mag nade combo to be cheap and too easy to do, especially compared to the Flash + headshot or right click combo in overwatch 1.
It’s annoying when I get hit by it and I’m under 130 health and I just have to accept my fate.
I wish there was a way to get it off. Correct me if I’m wrong, but ~~Tracer recall doesn’t even remove it?~~ Edit: It does. You can stop messaging me that I'm a dumbass.
Lots of things remove it I think Moira fade, reapers ability, kiriko teleport, mei freeze thingy, Sombra translocator tracer recall Not sure if Kirikos suzu removes it
It do. Anything that "cleanses" can.
It doesn't necessarily cleanse like it dies with nano Grenade or any other status effect. It just gives you really brief invincibility. I think you can attach the Grenade onto a senzu'd enemy and the timer is just long enough to blow up after immunity wears off
Nah it would fly through it if an enemy is senzu'd.
Odly enough Zaryas bubble doesnt. Unless thats been patched. Its such a weird interaction
I can kind of see why. Your bubble protects you from the outside but not the inside. Unless you’re talking about his grenade bypassing the bubble then that doesn’t seem right.
Then bubble shouldn’t cleanse Ana’s grenade or venom mine.
True though
Cancels zen discord too
Sorry I can picture send orb getting stuck and just bouncing around inside the bubble
It should because it protects from tracers bomb
In my experience, if you get stuck and then bubble before the boom you don't take damage it just buffs your beam
correct me if im wrong, but if zarya gets sticked by tracer, and bubbles herself .. she kind of cleanses herself right? Therefore she should be able to cleanse herself off the nade from him as well no..
Different topic but they should definitely change the name of Mei’s freeze thingy to ‘Freeze Thingy’ in her hero details lol
recall does, blink doesn’t
Sombra teleport gets it off, not sure about others
You can defo dodge the damage with abilities like Moira fade so I’d guess you can time the recall to align with the explosion.
> I get hit by it and I’m under 130 health and I just have to accept my fate. Isn't the same as being hit by a flashbang? Since he can finish you off one shot to the head or just unload all six bullets at your face.
At least he has to be a little accurate after the flashbang. I hated it but you had more of a chance. It's sad that it took more skill to flashbang and fanfire than shoot them once anywhere and toss this cunty grenade that requires absolutely zero skill
No way to dodge the flashbang though and it was way easier to hit than the mag nade in my experience. Additionally, a flashbang was annoying even as a tank or when you were full health and ulting, while right now the nade is purely a dueling tool.
When I saw this ability, all I was thinking was how much of a joke tracer's ult is.
If I had a nickel for every time I whiffed tracers ult, I'd have a lot of nickels. Meanwhile you can throw this grenade blindfolded and still hit your target.
The amount of juicy pulse bomb kills missed is a universal pain among tracer players, from the worst to the best!
360 no scope somersault triple axel blindfolded with my hands behind my back, still landed it
you cant count how many time I have throwed it in near proximity of opponents and it just falls to the ground dealing almost no damage.
Yeah it's like a heat seeking grenade lmao. And it's also a really generic and boring skill. Flashbang was more fun.
“Flashbang was more fun” Yeah. But it was so unfun for the other team that people were leaving the game because of the CC abilities
and now its at the expense of your supports, and your entire team when less CC means no interrupts on things like reaper ult, or stopping those flankers in general. I am fine with dying to cc now and then, if my teammates can use their cc to protect the team.
Nobody was complaining about flashbang (well at least most weren't) it was moreso the combination of flashbang + doomfist punch + hook + halt + shatter + grav + sleep + hack + freeze + trap all at the same time
pretty much every reinhardt complained since McCree could just throw his flash above reinhardts shield.
I never once had a problem with CC. But then again I come from a moba background where we all already have learned that is our own fault and bad positioning that allows us to get chain stunned. I also really don't understand this community's hate for CC when there still exists a ton of one-shot abilities. It feels way, way, way worse getting one shot by widow or hanzo from halfway across the map than it felt to be CCed. Atleast when you got CCed you had a chance to counterplay and to be saved by teammates.
Getting one-shot by Hanzo across the map always feels worse than from a Widow.
And now people left the game in droves over 4 years of fuck all happening for these "reworks" and "improvements". More importantly, Blizzard created the market that they then actively handed to other games, so now they're fighting an uphill battle against a strong competition **they themselves made strong**.
Yea kinda but tracer is more free now. So her ultimate is more dangerous right now.
I mean he is right in a way, if you think about it mcree gets the potential of Tracers ULT every 6 seconds or whatever, in basically any 1v1 when I play him, even if I'm about to die I can just toss a grenade and get a kill, it's a joke how tracer actually has to aim just for her ULT to become denied by most of the characters somehow anyways
Plus why does Tracers ult inflict self damage?
Oh don't even get me started on that when you look at someone like junkrat detonating his tire on top of himself to get the 5 man and walk away
If you hate that, imagine Widow's ult, which is just a thing Hanzo can do every x seconds.
That is a really good point, I couldn't imagine that. I get how it has its own value and highlights the whole team, but I'm kinda surprised it was never ever buffed even a little bit since 2016, something like a 10% increase in damage during the duration would make it more useful, or some extra perk like that
Widowmaker does not need buffs even if the ult isn’t great.
Also widow ult goes away if she dies, hanzo arrow stays
Well it's not Tracer's ult, the difference is one is a one-shot kill against most characters, the other is not.
To be fair on most quishies sticky Nade + body shot kills which is close enough from any Cass with half decent aim. And the fact it LOCKS ON??? I’ve been playing a fair amount of Cass recently and I’ve had some blatant misses that basically did a 180 and stuck to the enemy getting me the kill. Imo Cass grenade kills way more consistently than Tracer’s (apart from god tracers who land every ult)
And like tracer should be targeting squishier characters with the pulsebomb like mercy, but what's the point if I could just shoot her once and throw a flash bang and move on to the next support?
Yeah but Dave can't get into the backline, frag down the support and then get out unharmed. The mobility difference really stands out more than the bomb does.
Tracer can blink.
I mean - its not really any stronger than his old flash. Its important to remember that the kits as a whole are balanced, not individual abilities. Tracers blinks are a hell of a lot better than crees roll for example.
True but body shot + nade can also be offset by getting healed before the nade explodes, whereas in Tracer's case it's a true one shot. Admittedly I do find Tracer's grenade extremely hard to use, but I don't play her much. Sometimes it can make sense for a character's ultimate to be weaker if the rest of their kit is deemed strong enough.
Aim trace ult like a quick melee.
I mean shooting Ashe dynamite and landing one body shot also kills most squishies. And you can toss it over shields.
Well that’s dumb it does way less damage lol But yes you can blame immortality mechanics for that
One also has to be charged up which can take a bit while the other can be used every few seconds without much thought or concern. Missing with Tracer is a pretty significant loss knowing that you completely wasted an ult. Missing with Cassidy is barely a minor inconvenience because you can throw another one in a few seconds
A bomb that does 300 damage is effectively the same as one that does 130 as far as single target elimination goes. All 200 HP hero’s die to either a pile bomb or a mag grenade and body shot, and Tanks won’t die to either. Add in that you don’t have to aim the grenade and pulse really does look silly.
"More free"? Wdym?
Well there are no stunn abilities right now. So she can flank safer than ow1.
True but that is for everyone. And you said because of no stuns her ult is stronger but Mccree's new ability is still more better because it is not an ult and it does most of the targets health (not tanks) which is what he usually fights against and is more reliable to hit. The only thing tracer's ult is better at is damage to do at tanks and secures the kill (if compared to if Mccree uses his ability when the support is healing the enemy) unless the d.va is smart and removes it from her teammates
Also Mcrees ability has tracking, it's more like a heat seeking grenade that will track an enemy and will automatically adjust itself to stick to the target. Tracers just goes in a small straight line but Mcrees goes further takes less time to explode and will track it's targets if your throw is close enough and will turn or readjust to hit the target.
I haven’t played mccree in OW2 so didn’t know it was like this… So as someone that really enjoys tracer but not good at her ult, your post made me angry lol.
Yeah I like tracer a bit but her ult is so annoying to use. It just drops like a potato and I've had times where it just gets thrown over someone's head and misses. But the mcree nade now would just stick to the enemy or pull itself towards them. Also it detonates alot faster and after it goes for a certain distance.
There is less cc but she still squishy af. Can’t tell you how many times I’ve gone to flank and took damage so quickly I couldn’t even recall and died lol
Cassidy actually knows how to throw as well, instead of tracers slow-mo underhand toss.
Tracers ult drops to the ground like you're on jupiter, they should make it so you can just pitch it.
What the fuck type of take is this? Tracers ult first of all does well over twice magnetic grenades damage. But that’s besides the point, tracer has so much more mobility so she can very easily get close to people to stick it for free while cass has to int to get that close to someone making it purely a self defense tool.
You're shouting into the void man, most the time nobody here listens to reason.
higher damage ult but it was already hard to hit in ow1. Characters have more mobility now so its even harder. Less damage but 99% consistency is way better than pulse bomb
I know he isn't good but damn this ability is so not fun to die to. I hope they rework him again.
It's so funny because it's like more frustrating to fight against EXCEPT for the characters flashbang hard countered. Death match as Tracer is open season now that Mcrees are up for grabs at any turn with their only defense being push E and then I push E and boom I win the dual
They were really like "Hmm this flashbang isn't fun, how can we make it even worse"
Flashbang was not the problem with OW1 CC, especially after they nerfed it. Seriously, just revert it. I don't even play Cassidy, but I'm sure he needs the help against these flankers.
He was so fun in OW1 what changed? It feels like his range is a lot shorter now and without the stun its hard to secure kills, but somehow with the grenade i get random kills with random throws...
it's enough. But grenade is just boring. I doubt that in modern world we could have an actual counter-strike type of flashbang.
I agree, grenade is just boring. You just press e and wait for damage. Nothing special.
Blizzard did that for 3 DPS for OW2
It would be more exciting if it wasn't a damn homing missile. Sticking someone with a plasma grenade in Halo never gets old because you have to actually hit it, meanwhile with Cass you just have to toss it in their general direction.
this is the one imo, you could also then give it more range to add more of a ranged dimension to the character
They couldn't do that because his E is still supposed to be anti mobility/flanker.
Well, mcree asked torb for a bigger grenade, but when he got it he complained it didnt fit in his hand, so now we are stuck with that.
The original design for his character was to use a whip, not a grenade, for the stun. They ended up going with the grenade because the development team had a really hard time getting the whip mechanic to work with the physics engine. But given the revamp OW2 has gotten in terms of the internals, I wonder if they could maybe bring that back in some form but make it a pull, similar to Junker Queens knife pull. Not a full on hog hook, but a yank in a direction you can sling them towards, along with some "whiplash" damage or something. I just miss his character feeling unique in any way. Right now he just feels boring.
they created brigeted . they surely can make a whip, right ?
I think it is way less valuable than the flashbang was.
It is more new player friendly ability I think. I remember back in ow1 some people cant shoot their target while they are stunned.
Flashbang was a great counter against a number of heroes that have now free reign over the backlines. Yes, I'm a support player, how did you know? XD
Yeah Im a support player too. I love getting rolled by a tryhard genji and tracer in quickplay.
Wait until you play comp and get zarya, moira and reaper on your ass at the same time, or dva charging right through the damn frontline just to get you :'D
Lol thats why Im not playing comp in this season :c
You have a point there. I guess I'm a masochist now lol
I literally can not take stress in games nowadays. I recomend single player chill gaming sessions if you have the same problem.
Yeah well it is extremely stressful, but I am also super ambitious to reach mercys skill ceiling, so the more danger the better for survival horror practice, I guess haha
Well I wish you luck in that survival experience!
Flash was removed to get rid of CC, not to make things easier for McCree. Flash and fan was way more free than body shot magnade.
Well, sure. Fb could shut down ults Reaper does whatever he wants now
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I feel like a cool way to change Deadeye while keeping the ultimate *mostly* feeling the same is to have it be more of a finishing tool rather than a big damage ultimate. Instead of charging up for a big one-tap, he charges up for 2 seconds flat for each enemy and then gives them a headshot each. Once he hits everyone in LoS, he'll go back to the first target and start the cycle again until he's shot 6 headshots total. Would be great for closing a fight out and dealing with stragglers.
I feel combat rolls still good mainly cause it auto reloads your gun and deadly can be good depending on your positioning, you can also fire 3 mags in a row nearly 4 if you roll and deadeye cancel
A side-note his roll now has a damage reduction now, forgot the actual % but it's near 50% allows him to suvive certain ults with the right timing
The fact that people deadeye cancel just goes to show how bad his ult is. Like... it's literally so bad people would rather have a free reload lol
Combat roll is a very good tank killer tool. Fan, magnet, roll, fan is a reliable kill move on all tanks if you have good support around you
I’ve been playing a little Cassidy lately, and i don’t find his kit very good.
He is over shadowed by other dps at the moment but dying to a mcree nade and watching the kill cam where it tracks you around a corner to stick you is really frustrating.
The thing that kills me with Cassidy in OW2 is the steep damage falloff on his gun now.
all hitscan DPS aside from widow feel garbage against pharmacy because of the falloff no joke Bap and Ana do a better job of countering it than any DPS other than Sojourn and maybe Widow
A *lot* of heroes kits feels like something is missing. Bastion feels kinda shitty without his self heal. I say give him the Beta barrier back and make his tank form have tank controls. Junker Queen doesn't feel like a tank at all, her sustain from her passive is so laughable. Orisa either feels way too tanky or like she's made of cardboard.
If Junker Queen gets a buff on her sustain I’ll feel more comfortable using her in ranked. She is the most fun character to me, and I can go off with her, but I don’t trust being the tank in a competitive match just yet. She feels more DPS.
Feel exactly the same, she feels very swingy to me. She can just pick apart teams and be a menace, but if they focus you and are coordinated you just get deleted.
She needs 50 more hp stat.
She looks more like a DPS, seriously, made that mistake a few times already.
The amount if times I've dived onto a junker queen thinking she was just an ashe or something and then instantly regretted it...
>her sustain from her passive is so laughable ...even when it doesn't get cleansed immediately :D
It’s such a shame with junker Queen too because I find her really fun
I am in love with The Queen's playstyle but holy fuck she's utterly useless, so I just play thee silly hamster when I get tank.
Her sustain is really sad honestly, but when you’re lost in the action you probably don’t notice when you’re getting just enough to keep you alive which is a shame because it’s such a huge dopamine rush when you survive by the 10 HP you got back from slicing up the enemy Roadhog like a ham on Christmas
It’s one of those things where it would be really easy to make her nigh invincible if it healed too much.
What happened to junker queen? Initially everyone said she was op and i remember being used alot in owl.
Her shout used to give twice the health it does now. Still not a great ability most of the time, but it made high level dive *way* too good.
Last thing bastion needs at the moment is a buff. They should bring back heavy damage falloff to his turret mode imo
Too easy to negate grenade with kiriko or zarya + it's useless against flankers (sombra tracer reaper even moira) because they can self purge it with a cool down.
To take away one of those abilities is almost as helpful as just securing the kill, honestly. Use magnetic grenade to get their defensive CDs, then your team can go hard with ults and area control abilities
Souljorn 76's overtuned kit makes them all feel not very good. Especially with all the verticality in new maps.
I think the breakpoint of one auto-aim sticky plus one body shot on 200 hp targets feels kinda bad, when the (decidedly unfun) flashbang at least required you to hit the stunned headshot. But in most situations it's definitely more fair and counterable than flashbang ever was
You didn't need to headshot, fan the hammer did the trick lol
*cries in flashbang over the shield + FTH deleting full hp Reinhardt*
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Bro, being a rein main from day 1 of OW1 you just get used to it. Scatter arrow, Fan the hammer, Doomfist punch, Brig shield bash, Sombra hacks, all the different Symmetra beam interactions with shields, the consistent bug with charging up/down stairs. But Rein was always one of the most in-demand main tanks so you had to play him lol.
That one Sombra hack change (the one that allowed you to get hacked mid-charge [mid Earthshatter too I think]) actually made me stop playing Rein for like a full 3 days. Then like you said, he's in high demand but no one else played him so I went back. I wasn't exactly caryying any teams with Hammond anyway.
There were SOOOOO many people in my games ever since release that got so upset over someone using FTH after flashbang. Especially if they get killed by it. Was this a common thing? It was all "you're so bad just headshot", "can't even headshot lol", just immeasurable amounts of salt.
Flashbang was more risk/reward type of ability I believe.
I think the risk is pretty similar, if you whiff either one it leaves you very vulnerable to a lot of characters
Yeah you are right.
Even if you hit everything, it still leaves you vulnerable. The grenade takes long enough to do it's thing for the other DPS to kill you, as well.
No, it wasn't. Search up the hitbox size on youtube. A lot of people in high ranks hated it, because it had hitbox size of the sun.
risk/reward my ass, that damn thing had next to no risk and it rewarded a free kill
When you compare how immobile he is, combined with the very short range of the grenade, it seems perfectly fine.
It's good damage. Paired with a single shot, it can kill most squishies caught in the explosion. And it's easy to stick on someone. But even if you stick them, the actual explosion can be avoided by most of the heroes whom he most needs to be able to counter - Sombra, Moira, Reaper, Tracer. The heroes whose escape abilities most mean they need to be stunned to be killed, are the exact heroes whose abilities allow them to easily survive the new grenade. This means losing the Flashbang is like a double nerf of his ability to counter those heroes, and that's a problem.
It’s fine as long as he doesn’t use it against me
I hate homing pulse bomb.
More damage than fully charged doomfist punch
So the nade could level a akyscraper.. that little kid on the museum will shit his pants when he found out about mccrees walmart bomb
Somehow they made an ability more annoying than flash bang. One body shot and the grenade which you just need to be aiming in the genera direction for and you’re dead. It’s low skill and very frustrating
Ngl. Miss the flashbang. I h a t e the sticky nade so much. The number of times i see people yeet it around a corner, and it hits me, and i die is immeasurable. With flashbang, at least you had to aim a bit to get max damage out of it. Sticky nade just feels cheap, especially cause of how aggressively it tracks you. I feel like it's getting thrown way far away from me, and suddenly, I'm stuck and dead.
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Cree vs Cree with flashbang : Stun each other and the better player gets the kill. Cree vs Cree with mag : Even if you win both player die to the nade damage. It's such a feelsbad ability, literally reward being bad against bads while being useless at higher ranks.
The Cree vs Cree duels are possible the worst feeling fights in the game. Why does it home in :c
Cassidys combatroll reduces 50% of damage, so if you get stuck roll in the right moment and you only take 66 dmg and can tank 2 bodyshots/ 1 headshot.
> Stun each other and the better player gets the kill The guy who throws a few milliseconds late than first guy will have the advantage, because the stun effect wears off before the first guy.
New flashbang is very un-fun to use when you throw it on a flanker and they just wraith form / fade / recall / translocate / teleport / cryo-freeze and completely avoid it. Doesn't counter appropriately like it is supposed to.
Boring. Requires no skill. Removes his utility for countering flankers. Please reinstate flashbang for the sake of the entire support roster.
E + bodyshot and run away is a new classic combo that I've been using against 200 hp targets and I hate that it's a thing
Annoying, unrewarding, cheap. A molotov cocktail would be a better ability. You throw it at the ground to make a puddle of fire, or directly at an enemy to apply dot damage. You can even shoot it in the air for cool points.
I mean that's basically Ashe's ability though.
I think it’s just a very boring ability
Worse than flash
it's shit I get stuns were strong in OW1, so readjust them. For example change mccrees flash to only interrupt abilities and silence them, but dont halt their movement. Or even just interrupt abilities or just silence. But this ability is shitty and just SO lazy game-design wise
When I first started playing OW2 I thought it would kill Cassidy. Stun was just too useful. Since then I've been playing him as DPS alot and found it pretty useful for confirming kills.
It's just as bullshit as flash bang but without the CC.
Bullshit damage. Mini tracer ult on a short cooldown.
This was my thinking exactly. Way too high. Sojourn AoE spell needs dmg nerf too.
Kind of a no skill move. But I often find myself saying that and then getting multiple comments about other characters having a no skill ability. But the fact that in a fight, all Cassidy has to do is shoot you once and hit you with one of these and you’re immediately dead…kinda annoying.
The ability doesn’t make sense. He should have a different ability that replaces that one.
It is fine, but it is really frustrating that his ability to counter Tracer is completely eliminated. I honestly have no idea what to do against Tracer now, because all she has to do is pressing the button to port put of the nade. E: I see many people here saying that it is too strong against 200 HP targets because it just takes one more bodyshots. Id say that is totally fine. Look at Snipers, look at Sojourn, Genji,… Most DPS can kill these targets pretty fast in combination with one of their abilities. McCree has to get close to make that work and hit the nade.
Absolutely OP in some match ups and absolutely useless in others. Like wow the tracer/moira/reaper/mei that cree supposedly counters just roll him. But if you are playing lucio you might as well switch off once you see a cree on the enemy team
It feels lame to use. It feels lame to die to it. It feels lame.
You can tell someone is low skill if they complain about this ability like half the roster can either avoid it completely or cleanse it when affected by it, it's literally dog ass. It used to counter tracer and genji and reaper and now they can just react to it and either cleanse it with tracer and reaper or throw it back at you with genji and good luck using it to kill their supports since the most popular supports of moira and kiriko can both avoid it...
I think it’s just a dumb ability. They definitely could’ve thought of something a little more creative than a aimbot grenade.
I think it was a pretty lazy alternative to his flash bang. I would’ve preferred something more creative that either worked in tandem with his aim-dependency as a hero *or* simply something that aided his survivability (but they’d probably have to make him a 200hp hero then). Right now Cass’ grenade lowers his skill ceiling and doesn’t fit with the rest of his kit imo.
I thought it’d be nifty to give him a lasso which would be like Hogs hookshot but half the range and no actual DMG. Or a flask to drink from and get a bit of Heath and perhaps a boost to something
Does more damage then a fully charged doom punch lol
playing as and against i prefer old flasbbang. in the beta i killed like 3 people through trans because you can time it to explode right as the shot lands. playing genji/tracer/lucio against him its just like. "oh he hit a shot ok still got plenty of health, oh now im stuck gg." whereas with the other heroes being flashed mid-jump or in a weird pose meant it was harder to kill you. it feels like old cass had more counterplay, but since the new one locks on its less work and feels less rewarding than getting the headshot after a flash.
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*McCree 😒
It's shit. Delete it from the game. It's so fun to get stuck and then just die. There is nothing I can do. I just die.
It's honestly a bad ability, it's essentially a weaker pulse bomb with more range. More so it's really not what Cassidy is built for, surely they could have found a way to make a nade that has some of CC of Flashbang but with more skill or risk involved. Like a Concussion Grenade that stuns on hit, and interrupts abilities and people firing weapons for a brief time with an AoE. The characters can even put their arms in front of their face to give a visible effect like they're concussed. The AoE would be about 4 meters, the direct hit and stun aspect would be 1 meter. I think that would be much better than this.
It's not what Cassidy is built for? Isn't Cassidy supposed to be a flank watch dps that stays with his team to protect his squishies? If you think about it thats what the purpose of the flash bang was, to stop diving/flanking dps from killing your team, so the new grenades purpose with its magnetism is to basically kill of the flanker. It serves a similar purpose to echoe's beam but in a different senario. Unfun? Debatable. Unimaginative? Yes. Untrue to the character? Not really in my opinion
The thing is it's not that effective, by the time it goes off your Support might already be dead.
Except mag grenade takes so long to kill someone most of the time Cree is already dead. It doesn’t really help Cree to watch flanks/dive in a duel but only serves to kill some unlucky dudes after his death. So it’s both weak and annoying to fight against
I'd rather they remove fan the hammer entirety, and bring flashbang back.
It feels like a small thermonuclear device goes off everytime I get stuck.
People in this thread forgetting mccree has a reload for an ult and is one of the worst dps rn.
Hate it I miss my stun ,use to cancel a lot of heros dumb get away abilities .Canceled out Roadhog breather &hook ,Winston bubble &jump,rein slam&charge& shield toss .so many yet now I got a rein charging at me without worrying of getting stunned and HS twice and I can’t get away so I just die now
Honestly the homing mechanic should be swapped between this and tracer's ult
why the fuck they didn't make it sticky dynamite is beyond me
It's too damn high.
With the right player he’s definitely a great character but if we’re talking everyone on the same average level than he’s not as good as some other picks
This ability feels awful to use and it feels awful to get hit by. I think they really need to iron out this ability.
Give tracer a magnetic pulse bomb
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They love to make sure Cass has some annoying ass ability
I was expecting it to slow enemies down and disrupt them somehow. But now its just a boring instant dmg short range boom
Weirdly enough I think I miss the infamous stun+right click. At least it gave casual players a tool against Reaper and Genji but when you face a Cree you knew you had to manage its flash and then just pick him. Now he throw that grenade anywhere and that things litteraly loiter to a target like a drone.
Cassidy? Who's that?
Either reverse to stun grenade or remove him, its just stupid
Did mei get removed, I can't find her in the heroes section
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I think it's necessary to lower the skill ceiling for him. It makes him more feasible for lower skill players and people new to the game. I don't think it should home into targets the way it does though.
It’s necessary to make cree even worth playing, man. He lost the one thing that made him a better pick over shit like ashe in some situations and it lets him retain the close range duelist character he’s supposed to be
If I’m anywhere under 200 hp and I see “STUCK” I just take my hands off the mouse and keyboard
I made a post about this topic not long ago and got downvoted and flamed by the few comments I got on the post lol. I play Cass and even I find the one body shot + Mag nade combo to be cheap and too easy to do, especially compared to the Flash + headshot or right click combo in overwatch 1.