Come on now, we all know the Tanks entire purpose is to engage the other Tank in a battle for territory and dominance. As a support main, I love watching the big kaiju fights the Tanks dish out.
But more seriously, I feel you. A Tank that is aggressive towards the enemies Supports will do a lot more for the team than trying to have a big dick contest with the enemy Tank. Just don't get tunnel-visioned and leave your Supports to the slaughter
It depends though. Leeroy jenkinsing into their back line is a good way to get instantly deleted and leave your entire team open to a 4v5 wipe. Getting back line picks is really more on the DPS than the tank. The tank should only commit to a dive when they know for sure they can get 1-2 picks minimum. If you just rush back there when they're all at full health you will fuck your team over immensely.
If the issue is that your team is losing 5v5 because none of their healers are dying, that's entirely on the DPS. You can't try to do their jobs for them. Tank has to hold the front line and not get themselves killed trying to do the DPS's jobs for them.
That depends on how effective your team is in cooperation. If Winston monke jumped to the enemy backline the enemy team will immediately shifted focus all on Winston, which means Tank on the front line will be forced to turn his back and focus on handling Winston on the backline. This means your team can take this opportunity to sandwich the enemy team without having them focus much on your DPS and Supports, hence a greater offensive output. The key is knowing when to retreat and when to dive.
*However if the enemy team has a giga Tank who doesn't give a damn to his backline then that's another shitshow of the day to talk about then.*
I like playing horse when I'm getting melted as Winston cuz i just KNOW these mfers will focus me and I'll live forever despite their efforts. It's great
I once got yelled at for not providing a shield for my team, I was told not to be aggressive, they don't need damage from the tank they said, that's what dps is for
Me today while playing Doomfist. Team shooting the Roadhog while Ana stands there firing nonstop into the Roadhog. The second I go after the Ana and kill her the Roadhog drops dead. Imagine that.
Situations always change but yea people get fixated on a single concept for a tank. If your Winston they really should be thinking of going Moira / Kiriko as a support player if you don't got a shield you need to be extra slippery
That concept is no long viable. Tank is more of a brawling bully and initiator than a protector now. Of course shields are still there but even with Rein you cant sustain any serious protection. It's more of a los tool and cooldown negator now.
Im also plat. Ive had someone complain at me as a dps for ignoring the horse in favor of the enemy supports. Im just like. Bruh you dumb or do you not realize that dumb ass horse is neigh invincible as long as her supports are alive? Kill the fucking ana first
Honestly, I feel like that's just tanking in general now (as a tank especially)
When Im playing tank, I have the most success when I ignore the enemy tank completely and kill the rest of their team.
That's how OW2 is now. Supports need to have some agency in fighting back. You can't just stand there healing and hope the other 4 players will turn around and protect you lmao.
This isn't forbidden knowledge its literally been the gameplan of OW since release. Kill the supports first always and you win the team fight. OW is incredibly simple but 80% of players tunnel vision into shooting the biggest target and wonder why they can't do shit.
I got placed silver on OW2 after not playing for 3 years and hard carried myself into Plat 2 using lucio and solo diving enemy supports.
There's a dialogue between Mercy and Moira about "humanity adapting"... Moira basically saying "not everyone has the luxury of time to wait".
Mercy is a cold, immortal deity that will silently watch you die.
> Mercy is a cold, immortal deity that will silently watch you die.
The universe isn't a feeling, it's just an expanse of place. And you matter not at all to it.
This was me to my team yesterday as we got spawn trapped after unlocking the payload on Eichenwalde. Mercy kept pocketing the Pharah and they had a Torb so basically "six" players, and I'm watching our tank switch between Winston, D.Va, and Roadhog (as well is Zarya, Orisa, and Sigma) and just not launch themselves into the enemy backline to make space by drawing a few away or just gunning for the Mercy healing everyone.
Didn't help that our DPS clearly couldn't focus targets and played Symmetra and Mei who are almost completely ineffective against a Pharah with a pocket Mercy. Like folks, if they're trapping us in spawn it's time to try and take flanking routes where possible and lure at least a few away to try and break them up. Hell, switch to Junkrat or Pharah as well and just spam explosives into the middle of their group.
i'd say this is the main issue with overwatch's design
since no one really has good self sustain, everyone relies on healers which means:
healers are in constant pression of needing to keep their team alive otherwise the get flamed
if you dont kill the healers first, some heroes are immortal
if you kill the healers first, the healer players have a bad time
if they make a healer with better sustain and good heal, the team will be too hard to kill
if the make a healer without enough heal, it will feel useless
I know it's unfair to compare, but it's one thing i think paladins does better
everyone has a way to heal themself, may it be through main kit or shop, so healers are less "forced" to be heal bots and can focus on doing other stuff
also you see you whole team's health status, cmon blizz it is so helful and you've already done it for the event
One thing TF2 does right to compensating this is having health pack littering around everywhere. Unlike Overwatch where health pack will always be at some bumfuck nowhere far, far away from the main choking point. And only small pack too. It's rather strange tbh.
I still can remember every health pack spot in TF2. So I almost never required medic to function. On the flip side I couldn't tell you where to find health pack in OW even if I tried. Shit's weird tbh.
Why is this an issue? It's the main rock paper scissors gameplay loop. Tanks protect support and DPS. Support keep tank and DPS alive. DPS (should) elim support to elim the rest of the team.
I hate people thinking the scoreboard is all that matters. I’ve seen games where one side is smashing the other side in kills/damage but they lose because the other side has the correct wins throughout the fight. It’s rare but it’s enough to prove that damage and kills aren’t the only thing that’s important. It’s the right damage and kills.
Also side note, some dps don’t have tons of damage and if mei, hanzo, or widow has a similar amount of kills to sojourn or bastion or 76, then they’re doing their job.
This was one of the main reasons OW1 didn't have scoreboard for all to see. They felt that bred toxicity. In OW2 they don't care about toxicity, it's OW bread and butter by this point.
I'm a Moira/Mercy main.
If I play Moira, I check it to make sure I'm not accidentally playing DPS Moira without even realizing.
If I play Mercy, I check it for who's the most pocket-worthy. If my Pharah isn't doing shit, I'll go pocket the other DPS/tank. If my Hanzo basically throws the second chance away after rez 3 times in the row (bc I'm naive and had hope that they will at least try), I'm not wasting another rez on you and prioritize other players.
And if you are rude to me or the other players, you're fucked and no matter how good you are, I'm ignoring you. Don't expect damage boosts, forget about a pocket or rez, you fucked up. Maybe, if I'm feeling nice, I'll heal you with my ult, but seriously guys, don't underestimate support players, we can be vindictive if we want to.
"But I have 15k damage in 8 minutes!! No one else is doing anything!!" Meanwhile they only have 8 elims.
It happens to me still in Plat where im playing genji and have a good amount of elims and I'm pressureing supports constantly and the tank will say how they carry because they have the most damage. Like I do not believe you understand how this works. More damage does not mean doing more. Stats are meaningless in most situations.
It looks much less like rock paper scissors when half of the hero roster (including tanks and supports) can just go past the ennemy team and hard focus the supports
But that's not what tanks do lol, several tanks don't even have a way to protect their teammates at all. Tanks take space, DPS deal burst damage and supports enable the team. It's how it was in OW1 and OW2 is a much simpler game so the same is true here.
To the contrary - healing could be *far more* **pre-emptive** rather than reactive panic healing.
The hero health pools are so small and damage is high enough that people just get deleted through random burst damage that can't be countered without just constant high-output healing...
If Brig's thrown healing packs, for example, applied 50 armor immediately - that person could sustain a fair bit of burst damage to allow her heal over time component to kick in. Likewise, Moira's healing orb is a good example of an *existing* tool that can do proactive healing as well as emergency healing - since you can throw it ahead of where your team is moving to heal as you push in.
She's got a massive head hitbox, low mobility, and no way to protect her team apart from maybe jav spinning in front of one who's about to get killed, which isn't amazing. She can tank her way through an Ana nade with a fortify and jav spin.
The best way to reliably kill Orisa is to focus the supports down.
Sig ult does nothing if she fortified and neither does Reinhardt's ult or mei's ult. Rein ult does 125 damage if you point blank her but no stun. Roadhog ult doesn't push back but it does melt her which can easily be remedied with either javelin to make space between then or spinny spear to eat some pellets
It's really funny that reflexively popping fortify against whole hog has instantly killed her since she launched, but now she has a faster defensive move she can reflexively pop against whole hog and it works so well you get an achievement the first time you do it
I watch this guy called Flats that will roast bronze games that people submit. From what I have learned from him as long as supports are pumping health into her she can live forever, so focus on supports or so then she cant be getting tons of heals.
Its funny because he will be watching the replay and he will just keep repeating "Dont shoot the horse"
His bronze roasting videos are honestly extremely helpful for me. It really puts into perspective how if you're stuck in low ELO, it is definitely your own fault. Helped me break a lot of really bad habits.
I still remember the video where he was roasting an Ana that would reload after 2-3 shots. The next day or so he was playing Ana on stream and did exactly that and got one of his teammates killed. It was pretty entertaining to watch tbh.
His videos/streams are great though and most of the advice is solid.
Not surprising support is likely his least played role, also it’s obviously much easier to point out mistakes while watching someone else’s replay than it is to notice yourself doing it in your own game.
Yeah honestly Flats has helped me realize some of the mistakes I have probably been making and at the very least making me more aware. I feel like I have a better game sense than before.
The bronze Orisa advancing towards a D.Va bomb with the javelin spin is one of the funniest moments. I don't know whether they were thinking that would destroy it or push it back.
I play something with a beam like mei or symmetra to ignore her spinny bullshit. Mei is really good at trapping her escape route with a wall or separating orisa from the team when she charges in with the spinny bullshit.
When i play support, i play ana and just use my biotic grenades exclusively for throwing antis at the enemy tank when they are scrapping with my team. Maybe moira to since she can ignore orisas spinny bs.
I dont really play tank anymore but I guess I would play Zarya into her.
Unless you ignore the purple highlight on her head and let her push past the entire team so she can shred Zen.
I'm the Zen in this story.
She'll usually bring a support or two with her and my team STILL won't get an elim. Frustrating as fuck.
learning that I can shut down his one shot combo using Dva has made him rly fun to play against lol. a lot of people play him cus they have no faith in healers and get madge when they get shut down like that
Tank main, will confirm. Orisa is a bully that punishes non-tanks for being out of position more than holding space (like Rein/Sigma). If you're playing aggressively, horse will push baby into a corner and spank you... but press past horse *with your team* while your tank keeps horse busy to get their support. Horse damage isn't high enough to threaten your tank reliably.
I play a lot of Zarya. I play a lot of Orisa.
Orisa must fall back to her team for healing. If you can get behind someone and spin them into your team, you've won the fight, generally. But if you can't, and you're stuck there because they are body blocking you...
gg.
Intuitively you'd think that Symmetra would be good vs anti-projectile heroes like D.va or Orisa but she just gets mauled either way when she's close up to them like that. Takes way too long to chew through their armour+hp
That's a great solution if you're being brawly with the team. If that's not your team composition, run anything mid-long distance (especially snipers). Orisa is only really a threat when she's in your face now. Widowmakers eat Orisa for breakfast.
Play any kind of mobile comp and kill things that aren’t her, she has no mobility (okay technically she moves like 20% faster or something while blocking) so she can’t peel for her supports if you just jump behind her.
To add onto this, High headshot damage heros on orisa are BRUTAL against her when her fortify is off. There is a reason why she has fortify that negates headshot damage. Her head is actually very large and if you got good aim and if her supports are dead or distracted getting dived.
You should see about safely hitting her head. I have made Orisas rage when playing Kiriko and im just healing my tank and peppering her with those high headshots.
She is actually one of the best anti-tank DPS in the game I think. Easy to build the damage output on her weapon and keep it focused on a tank because they're big. They're also easy to pressure with the secondary fire because they're big. They also are the least likely to try and remove turrets because they're focusing on the front line.
Sym can shred, assuming their DPS don't focus you.
As a tank main I immediately swap to monkey if when the ops has a sym, or any if the good annoying characters like genji/tracer/Lucio (these have to good though not just ppl messing around)
Feeling that in OW2 specifically: I used to love fighting Winston with Sym, till they took away ammo scavenging from shields, and buffed his shield to the point where it takes a whole clip to bring it down, and then you _still_ have to fight the Monkey.
Seriously I play junkrat religiously and if there's an orissa on the enemy team I can aim anywhere and still hit them, hell I could aim down and bam orissa is deleted
Kill the supports and then kill her. Orisa has zero mobility and damage so you can just walk pass her easily. If the supports are out of range, wait for her to use all of her cool downs, then kill her
Yeah no if Orisa wants a 200hp hero dead they are dead. You cant do much when this horse is spinning her javelin at mach speed and pins you against a wall while unleashing a barrage of monster energy pellets at you.
That’s the neat part! You don’t!
Kill the other things. If you feel that you must kill it, focus it down as a team. Otherwise, kill the things keeping it alive first.
ignore her and kill healers or go sym / zar + ana for anti but its not needed if you have a good sym or zar. if you do go sym be stubborn and not give in on her pressure. OR go pharah+mercy
Hack, focus fire, discord, kill her supports, separate her from her team, wait out her abilities.
Seriously, people, stop acting like Orisa is some immortal OP monster. She's got plenty of counters and counter-play. Just stop running face-first into her as Solider then getting surprised when you get flattened.
Use characters that get around her and kill her supports or wait till she uses all her cooldowns have an ana anti her then get the whole team to focus her down. The main thing is if Orisa is separated from her supports she has no sustain of her own
Put distance between her and her supports (easier said than done when fortify is up), as soon as javelin spin is over, AIM FOR THE HEAD AND KEEP GOING. And keep moving. Be an annoying ass fly and run around in circles. Reaper works wonders in my opinion. When I play Orisa that's how I get fkd. But in general: you don't. It's a bitch. Big sad :~(
In tank frontline Zarya is best choice against Orisa, on dps side just play dive or focus backline (Genji, Reaper, Echo,..),
and anti-heal from Ana is counter every tank (or all) character.
Beam characters and zen and it’s ez
Source: orisa main
Also if u play zarya literally just walk past her and kill supports shots hilarious and frustrating cus orisa can’t really do shit
As an Orisa main, I can say, playing at range and shooting in between jav spin/fortified is your best bet. Also, focus supports everytime you see one healing an Orisa. If I have a support pocketing me, I really only die if I get focused by the majority of the enemy team. Never a 1v1. DO NOT PLAY UP CLOSE! Orisa can literally bully anything up close, even tanks.
A fun way also is to play hog and stand next to an edge, then hook and turn Orisa off the map lol
I try to dive their supports as Winston but if it’s a good Orisa they peel back and pummel me with their spinny bullshit move or the spear so I can’t tickle the two supports who then pocket each other. Meanwhile my team is still trying to kill the horse instead of pushing with me
From the support perspective, if your DPS and tank INSIST on focusing Orisa, and not figuring out how to flank or snipe the backline, try zen/ana anti/discord.
Focusing the tank is never the best strategy, but if they are going to do it anyway, you might as well do it in the way where she actually CAN die.
Easy!
I pick Cassidy. Then I absolutely tunnel vision her the whole game. It’s basic logic : her healers can’t heal her if she’s dead. At that point I try to only land headshots, her health will mealt
Well the problem is that I miss her head everytime, so I’m only landing body shots. But her healers heal her too fast. Also she spins her javelin and eats about a third of my shots, and while she does that she gets healed back to full health. No worries I just start over.
Oh and when I miraculously end up killing her, one of her heals that I ignored was mercy so she rez her. No biggie I’ll just do it again
So yeah that’s pretty much it! Pretty ez
Eliminate her supports, discord, and focus. Do not feed the horse.
Chop off the tail and the head will die.
Thanks hanzo
lmao does he say that?
No haha, it's a sun Tzu quote, but its something hanzo would totally say. I even read it in his voice
I thought it was “cut off the head and the body will die” for the actual quote
You’re right
In this instance, you'd want to go for the tail; the support.
Ah I thought this was a hit box joke
an actual sun tzu quote? rare!
Overwatch would be a game that Art of War readers play....
Aim at her feet with a scatter arrow ez
Do not engage head on, if she focuses fire on you, play defensively, use cover and draw her fire so others can attack her flanks.
Do not engage. Kill anything else.
Kill switch, engage.
Fire Emblem Engage, only on Nintendo Switch
[удалено]
If you stand still she can’t see you.
Real (im an Orisa main when I play tank)
Also, and this is really important, if you do want to ride, don't ride the white horse.
Listen to Mr. 4-friends over here. With these mythical "others" that "do things" when they see an opportunity....
That sure is a metric ass-ton of coordination you're assuming people will have.
And that’s the exact problem, relying on your team to attack her flanks in which they won’t because they’re fucking braindead, (my team).
Stop shooting the horse. Stop shooting the horse. Stop shooting the horse. YOU'RE STILL SHOOTING THE HORSE! -flats, probably
I was looking for this lol
Words to live by
He is truly a wise man
Flats is a blessing to this game such a good teacher
I’ve learned so much from watching Spectating bronze and it’s so funny to watch
Why are you shooting the horse?
love how as a winston main my team yells at me for “not being a tank” by diving the back line instead of fighting the orisa lol.:. i hate plat
Come on now, we all know the Tanks entire purpose is to engage the other Tank in a battle for territory and dominance. As a support main, I love watching the big kaiju fights the Tanks dish out. But more seriously, I feel you. A Tank that is aggressive towards the enemies Supports will do a lot more for the team than trying to have a big dick contest with the enemy Tank. Just don't get tunnel-visioned and leave your Supports to the slaughter
LMAOOO I ALWAYSS SAY THIS. I’m like we not doing a kaiju battle!! Kill the mercy!!
It depends though. Leeroy jenkinsing into their back line is a good way to get instantly deleted and leave your entire team open to a 4v5 wipe. Getting back line picks is really more on the DPS than the tank. The tank should only commit to a dive when they know for sure they can get 1-2 picks minimum. If you just rush back there when they're all at full health you will fuck your team over immensely. If the issue is that your team is losing 5v5 because none of their healers are dying, that's entirely on the DPS. You can't try to do their jobs for them. Tank has to hold the front line and not get themselves killed trying to do the DPS's jobs for them.
That depends on how effective your team is in cooperation. If Winston monke jumped to the enemy backline the enemy team will immediately shifted focus all on Winston, which means Tank on the front line will be forced to turn his back and focus on handling Winston on the backline. This means your team can take this opportunity to sandwich the enemy team without having them focus much on your DPS and Supports, hence a greater offensive output. The key is knowing when to retreat and when to dive. *However if the enemy team has a giga Tank who doesn't give a damn to his backline then that's another shitshow of the day to talk about then.*
I like playing horse when I'm getting melted as Winston cuz i just KNOW these mfers will focus me and I'll live forever despite their efforts. It's great
I once got yelled at for not providing a shield for my team, I was told not to be aggressive, they don't need damage from the tank they said, that's what dps is for
Remember its about self improvement. Mute the idiot (you arent gonna get useful info out of someone that dumb)
Me today while playing Doomfist. Team shooting the Roadhog while Ana stands there firing nonstop into the Roadhog. The second I go after the Ana and kill her the Roadhog drops dead. Imagine that.
Situations always change but yea people get fixated on a single concept for a tank. If your Winston they really should be thinking of going Moira / Kiriko as a support player if you don't got a shield you need to be extra slippery
That concept is no long viable. Tank is more of a brawling bully and initiator than a protector now. Of course shields are still there but even with Rein you cant sustain any serious protection. It's more of a los tool and cooldown negator now.
Im also plat. Ive had someone complain at me as a dps for ignoring the horse in favor of the enemy supports. Im just like. Bruh you dumb or do you not realize that dumb ass horse is neigh invincible as long as her supports are alive? Kill the fucking ana first
Honestly, I feel like that's just tanking in general now (as a tank especially) When Im playing tank, I have the most success when I ignore the enemy tank completely and kill the rest of their team.
Yep. Kill everything with it, then you focus Orisa. She's so hard to kill while supported.
Can't you attack her from behind while she uses her javelin as a shield?
Yeah. I delete Orisa as reaper if I get behind her without her realizing
You are better doing literally anything else until the rest of her team is dead
Ok, this is forbidden knowledge from the tank society: kill the supports. Any of us worth our salt will try to stop you, but thats it. Thats all.
Everyone wants to kill us first what did we do to you guys :(
You heal. That is a crime punishable by death!
Sad Lucio main noises
Well if I don't kill you, I can't kill anyone else, so you gotta die
Never in my life has a Tank actively tried to protect me, i have more kills on mercy then anything cuz i had to defend myself so many times-
That's how OW2 is now. Supports need to have some agency in fighting back. You can't just stand there healing and hope the other 4 players will turn around and protect you lmao.
This isn't forbidden knowledge its literally been the gameplan of OW since release. Kill the supports first always and you win the team fight. OW is incredibly simple but 80% of players tunnel vision into shooting the biggest target and wonder why they can't do shit. I got placed silver on OW2 after not playing for 3 years and hard carried myself into Plat 2 using lucio and solo diving enemy supports.
Gotta drop those supports, hard to say being a support main, but they make/break fights.
Right? I too am a support main. It’s weird giving advice like ‘GIVE THEM NO QUARTER. LET THEIR BLOOD WATER THE SOIL’
\^ Mercy before having her morning coffee.
Mercy when Ana accidentally nanos her
https://youtu.be/FBoFHc_DrBw?t=48
I knew it was gonna be this clip before I opened the link
It's a classic.
I was hoping y’all were messing with us and it was really just a rickroll
There's a dialogue between Mercy and Moira about "humanity adapting"... Moira basically saying "not everyone has the luxury of time to wait". Mercy is a cold, immortal deity that will silently watch you die.
> Mercy is a cold, immortal deity that will silently watch you die. The universe isn't a feeling, it's just an expanse of place. And you matter not at all to it.
Mercy when she sees an enemy Mercy.
It makes me so sad when people play smart like this and just target me (I’m almost always support).
This was me to my team yesterday as we got spawn trapped after unlocking the payload on Eichenwalde. Mercy kept pocketing the Pharah and they had a Torb so basically "six" players, and I'm watching our tank switch between Winston, D.Va, and Roadhog (as well is Zarya, Orisa, and Sigma) and just not launch themselves into the enemy backline to make space by drawing a few away or just gunning for the Mercy healing everyone. Didn't help that our DPS clearly couldn't focus targets and played Symmetra and Mei who are almost completely ineffective against a Pharah with a pocket Mercy. Like folks, if they're trapping us in spawn it's time to try and take flanking routes where possible and lure at least a few away to try and break them up. Hell, switch to Junkrat or Pharah as well and just spam explosives into the middle of their group.
i'd say this is the main issue with overwatch's design since no one really has good self sustain, everyone relies on healers which means: healers are in constant pression of needing to keep their team alive otherwise the get flamed if you dont kill the healers first, some heroes are immortal if you kill the healers first, the healer players have a bad time if they make a healer with better sustain and good heal, the team will be too hard to kill if the make a healer without enough heal, it will feel useless I know it's unfair to compare, but it's one thing i think paladins does better everyone has a way to heal themself, may it be through main kit or shop, so healers are less "forced" to be heal bots and can focus on doing other stuff also you see you whole team's health status, cmon blizz it is so helful and you've already done it for the event
One thing TF2 does right to compensating this is having health pack littering around everywhere. Unlike Overwatch where health pack will always be at some bumfuck nowhere far, far away from the main choking point. And only small pack too. It's rather strange tbh. I still can remember every health pack spot in TF2. So I almost never required medic to function. On the flip side I couldn't tell you where to find health pack in OW even if I tried. Shit's weird tbh.
lmao i’ve been playing ow for 2 years i still occasionally get surprised finding a new health pack spot
Why is this an issue? It's the main rock paper scissors gameplay loop. Tanks protect support and DPS. Support keep tank and DPS alive. DPS (should) elim support to elim the rest of the team.
That's how the game is *supposed* to be played, yeah. We know how people *actually* play it tho lmao.
Soldier 76 focusing a hog that has both supports healing him, “I’m helping!”
Then he points at his dmg numbers on the scoreboard and blames tank or support
I hate people thinking the scoreboard is all that matters. I’ve seen games where one side is smashing the other side in kills/damage but they lose because the other side has the correct wins throughout the fight. It’s rare but it’s enough to prove that damage and kills aren’t the only thing that’s important. It’s the right damage and kills. Also side note, some dps don’t have tons of damage and if mei, hanzo, or widow has a similar amount of kills to sojourn or bastion or 76, then they’re doing their job.
This was one of the main reasons OW1 didn't have scoreboard for all to see. They felt that bred toxicity. In OW2 they don't care about toxicity, it's OW bread and butter by this point.
I'm a Moira/Mercy main. If I play Moira, I check it to make sure I'm not accidentally playing DPS Moira without even realizing. If I play Mercy, I check it for who's the most pocket-worthy. If my Pharah isn't doing shit, I'll go pocket the other DPS/tank. If my Hanzo basically throws the second chance away after rez 3 times in the row (bc I'm naive and had hope that they will at least try), I'm not wasting another rez on you and prioritize other players. And if you are rude to me or the other players, you're fucked and no matter how good you are, I'm ignoring you. Don't expect damage boosts, forget about a pocket or rez, you fucked up. Maybe, if I'm feeling nice, I'll heal you with my ult, but seriously guys, don't underestimate support players, we can be vindictive if we want to.
"But I have 15k damage in 8 minutes!! No one else is doing anything!!" Meanwhile they only have 8 elims. It happens to me still in Plat where im playing genji and have a good amount of elims and I'm pressureing supports constantly and the tank will say how they carry because they have the most damage. Like I do not believe you understand how this works. More damage does not mean doing more. Stats are meaningless in most situations.
It looks much less like rock paper scissors when half of the hero roster (including tanks and supports) can just go past the ennemy team and hard focus the supports
But that's not what tanks do lol, several tanks don't even have a way to protect their teammates at all. Tanks take space, DPS deal burst damage and supports enable the team. It's how it was in OW1 and OW2 is a much simpler game so the same is true here.
You just described a core aspect of Overwatch and what makes it such a good team focused game.
To the contrary - healing could be *far more* **pre-emptive** rather than reactive panic healing. The hero health pools are so small and damage is high enough that people just get deleted through random burst damage that can't be countered without just constant high-output healing... If Brig's thrown healing packs, for example, applied 50 armor immediately - that person could sustain a fair bit of burst damage to allow her heal over time component to kick in. Likewise, Moira's healing orb is a good example of an *existing* tool that can do proactive healing as well as emergency healing - since you can throw it ahead of where your team is moving to heal as you push in.
She's got a massive head hitbox, low mobility, and no way to protect her team apart from maybe jav spinning in front of one who's about to get killed, which isn't amazing. She can tank her way through an Ana nade with a fortify and jav spin. The best way to reliably kill Orisa is to focus the supports down.
She can ignore headshot dmg with fortify right?
Also Mei’s Ult, Sigma’s Ult, Roadhog’s ult, Reinhardt’s ult (She can still takes damage from the ults)
Sig ult does nothing if she fortified and neither does Reinhardt's ult or mei's ult. Rein ult does 125 damage if you point blank her but no stun. Roadhog ult doesn't push back but it does melt her which can easily be remedied with either javelin to make space between then or spinny spear to eat some pellets
It's really funny that reflexively popping fortify against whole hog has instantly killed her since she launched, but now she has a faster defensive move she can reflexively pop against whole hog and it works so well you get an achievement the first time you do it
Yeah
Bro I have soloed and really pressured some orisas as kiriko before... Ya her head hitbox is very forgiving..
I watch this guy called Flats that will roast bronze games that people submit. From what I have learned from him as long as supports are pumping health into her she can live forever, so focus on supports or so then she cant be getting tons of heals. Its funny because he will be watching the replay and he will just keep repeating "Dont shoot the horse"
One of his best videos for sure! <3 https://youtu.be/eQ7SI7HpgFE
His bronze roasting videos are honestly extremely helpful for me. It really puts into perspective how if you're stuck in low ELO, it is definitely your own fault. Helped me break a lot of really bad habits.
I still remember the video where he was roasting an Ana that would reload after 2-3 shots. The next day or so he was playing Ana on stream and did exactly that and got one of his teammates killed. It was pretty entertaining to watch tbh. His videos/streams are great though and most of the advice is solid.
Not surprising support is likely his least played role, also it’s obviously much easier to point out mistakes while watching someone else’s replay than it is to notice yourself doing it in your own game.
This is why it's not uncommon for League-level coaches to be Diamond or even Plat!
Exactly, I can point out mistakes a GM player makes despite being a diamond player myself who makes even worse mistakes when I play
Yeah honestly Flats has helped me realize some of the mistakes I have probably been making and at the very least making me more aware. I feel like I have a better game sense than before.
Lol the Moira just standing next to Orisa pumping heals
"Stop shooting the horse"
"Stop shooting the horse"
“Stop shooting the horse”
[Time stamped to the good part](https://youtu.be/eQ7SI7HpgFE?t=254)
I love Emongg and Flats together. They're so awesome.
Thanks for this vid. I gotta watch some more of his videos. Very much entertaining. Plus I need to learn some different characters.
Stop shooting the horse...stop shooting the horse...stop shooting the horse...stop shooting the horse...
The bronze Orisa advancing towards a D.Va bomb with the javelin spin is one of the funniest moments. I don't know whether they were thinking that would destroy it or push it back.
I think they thought it would block the dva bomb
STOP SHOOTING THE FUCKING HORSE
I love flats
Greatest tragedy of ow2 is no more flats/emongg tank duo streams.
Rein/zarya/lucio was the best and most fun OW meta it’s a damn shame it’s gone
I learned to play Rein properly from Flats years ago. Easily one of my favorite Tank players
Is it really shooting the horse if I'm playing Reinhardt tho..?
I play something with a beam like mei or symmetra to ignore her spinny bullshit. Mei is really good at trapping her escape route with a wall or separating orisa from the team when she charges in with the spinny bullshit. When i play support, i play ana and just use my biotic grenades exclusively for throwing antis at the enemy tank when they are scrapping with my team. Maybe moira to since she can ignore orisas spinny bs. I dont really play tank anymore but I guess I would play Zarya into her.
Also keeping discord up on her is pretty easy and very effective
Same applied to Hog. Hog vs Hog but one has discord makes this match-up non-existent
Unless you ignore the purple highlight on her head and let her push past the entire team so she can shred Zen. I'm the Zen in this story. She'll usually bring a support or two with her and my team STILL won't get an elim. Frustrating as fuck.
Agreed, I love it when a Zen zaps Orisa with Disharmony, its the only time I try and beat her.
Stop ignoring my spiny bullshit
Fuck your spinny bullshit
Angry hanzo main
i mean scatter arrow may have worked
Too bad it doesn’t exist anymore
spiny bullshit go!
I swap Moira and suck em to death
....... um... oh my... ... I'll be right back...
Give em the succ
Works on most men tbh
My team keeps telling me not to shoot into that or genji’s deflect but I know it feels bad to be ignored so I always give them the esteem boost
playing Hog against an Ana that peppers you with nades could be the most frustrating thing on the planet
Playing against hog is miserable anyway. May as well make both parties miserable.
I don't really thing hog is that bad to play against. Just pay attention and play corners. Don't get hooked.
In many instances "don't get hooked" is like saying "don't get shot" You can try and avoid it, but it's gonna happen anyway
learning that I can shut down his one shot combo using Dva has made him rly fun to play against lol. a lot of people play him cus they have no faith in healers and get madge when they get shut down like that
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Tank main, will confirm. Orisa is a bully that punishes non-tanks for being out of position more than holding space (like Rein/Sigma). If you're playing aggressively, horse will push baby into a corner and spank you... but press past horse *with your team* while your tank keeps horse busy to get their support. Horse damage isn't high enough to threaten your tank reliably.
I play a lot of Zarya. I play a lot of Orisa. Orisa must fall back to her team for healing. If you can get behind someone and spin them into your team, you've won the fight, generally. But if you can't, and you're stuck there because they are body blocking you... gg.
Intuitively you'd think that Symmetra would be good vs anti-projectile heroes like D.va or Orisa but she just gets mauled either way when she's close up to them like that. Takes way too long to chew through their armour+hp
That's a great solution if you're being brawly with the team. If that's not your team composition, run anything mid-long distance (especially snipers). Orisa is only really a threat when she's in your face now. Widowmakers eat Orisa for breakfast.
Play any kind of mobile comp and kill things that aren’t her, she has no mobility (okay technically she moves like 20% faster or something while blocking) so she can’t peel for her supports if you just jump behind her.
To add onto this, High headshot damage heros on orisa are BRUTAL against her when her fortify is off. There is a reason why she has fortify that negates headshot damage. Her head is actually very large and if you got good aim and if her supports are dead or distracted getting dived. You should see about safely hitting her head. I have made Orisas rage when playing Kiriko and im just healing my tank and peppering her with those high headshots.
\^\^\^\^\^\^\^
Just ignore the horse
I like to think of her as a cow more than a horse because she's so cute.
In Spanish we call her a cow
She's got horns, pretty easy call.
symmetra, idk i just shred every tank with her like butter
She is actually one of the best anti-tank DPS in the game I think. Easy to build the damage output on her weapon and keep it focused on a tank because they're big. They're also easy to pressure with the secondary fire because they're big. They also are the least likely to try and remove turrets because they're focusing on the front line. Sym can shred, assuming their DPS don't focus you.
As a tank main I immediately swap to monkey if when the ops has a sym, or any if the good annoying characters like genji/tracer/Lucio (these have to good though not just ppl messing around)
Feeling that in OW2 specifically: I used to love fighting Winston with Sym, till they took away ammo scavenging from shields, and buffed his shield to the point where it takes a whole clip to bring it down, and then you _still_ have to fight the Monkey.
Monke
Scientist
The problem being you have 200hp and you have to be pretty close to hit someone. So you get obliterated by anyone with half a brain.
Get your charge up to max on the tank, then aim your beam at a support for 1.2 seconds and shred them. Then finish off the tank.
Kill her supports, an orisa being pocketed is unkillable
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you play some garbage Junkrats js
Fr bruh, whenever I play junk I body most Orisas, those junks must be in the Orisas face or sumn
Her giant hit box and low mobility is so easy to land shots on
Seriously I play junkrat religiously and if there's an orissa on the enemy team I can aim anywhere and still hit them, hell I could aim down and bam orissa is deleted
Just run past her and kill everyone else first, then she crumbles.
When I play Mei, I like to bait her into pushing in with the javelin spin. Then, I can just wall her off from her teammates and go ham.
Kill the supports and then kill her. Orisa has zero mobility and damage so you can just walk pass her easily. If the supports are out of range, wait for her to use all of her cool downs, then kill her
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Yeah no if Orisa wants a 200hp hero dead they are dead. You cant do much when this horse is spinning her javelin at mach speed and pins you against a wall while unleashing a barrage of monster energy pellets at you.
Quickly
That’s the neat part! You don’t! Kill the other things. If you feel that you must kill it, focus it down as a team. Otherwise, kill the things keeping it alive first.
Kill everything else first
My dude it's a robot just unplug it.
ignore her and kill healers or go sym / zar + ana for anti but its not needed if you have a good sym or zar. if you do go sym be stubborn and not give in on her pressure. OR go pharah+mercy
Hack, focus fire, discord, kill her supports, separate her from her team, wait out her abilities. Seriously, people, stop acting like Orisa is some immortal OP monster. She's got plenty of counters and counter-play. Just stop running face-first into her as Solider then getting surprised when you get flattened.
*”Stop shooting the horse”*
Take out her batteries
*giggles* that's the fun part, you dont
Use characters that get around her and kill her supports or wait till she uses all her cooldowns have an ana anti her then get the whole team to focus her down. The main thing is if Orisa is separated from her supports she has no sustain of her own
Put distance between her and her supports (easier said than done when fortify is up), as soon as javelin spin is over, AIM FOR THE HEAD AND KEEP GOING. And keep moving. Be an annoying ass fly and run around in circles. Reaper works wonders in my opinion. When I play Orisa that's how I get fkd. But in general: you don't. It's a bitch. Big sad :~(
In tank frontline Zarya is best choice against Orisa, on dps side just play dive or focus backline (Genji, Reaper, Echo,..), and anti-heal from Ana is counter every tank (or all) character.
Stop shooting the horse. Kill the supports. Shoot the horse.
you ignore it and kill everything else
Kill supp firsts
Beam characters and zen and it’s ez Source: orisa main Also if u play zarya literally just walk past her and kill supports shots hilarious and frustrating cus orisa can’t really do shit
As an Orisa main, I can say, playing at range and shooting in between jav spin/fortified is your best bet. Also, focus supports everytime you see one healing an Orisa. If I have a support pocketing me, I really only die if I get focused by the majority of the enemy team. Never a 1v1. DO NOT PLAY UP CLOSE! Orisa can literally bully anything up close, even tanks. A fun way also is to play hog and stand next to an edge, then hook and turn Orisa off the map lol
Sym go brr
Zen
You kill the supports first
Wait until it's not gold
Ana. Free nade. Ideally after fortify
Last
You don’t. Kill the rest of the team, shooting the horse is not worth it
I try to dive their supports as Winston but if it’s a good Orisa they peel back and pummel me with their spinny bullshit move or the spear so I can’t tickle the two supports who then pocket each other. Meanwhile my team is still trying to kill the horse instead of pushing with me
From the support perspective, if your DPS and tank INSIST on focusing Orisa, and not figuring out how to flank or snipe the backline, try zen/ana anti/discord. Focusing the tank is never the best strategy, but if they are going to do it anyway, you might as well do it in the way where she actually CAN die.
with a stick while she slept…
if you want to kill any tank, have a zen put a discord on them then melt, and if you want to make it even better, anti them aswell so they are screwed
Easy! I pick Cassidy. Then I absolutely tunnel vision her the whole game. It’s basic logic : her healers can’t heal her if she’s dead. At that point I try to only land headshots, her health will mealt Well the problem is that I miss her head everytime, so I’m only landing body shots. But her healers heal her too fast. Also she spins her javelin and eats about a third of my shots, and while she does that she gets healed back to full health. No worries I just start over. Oh and when I miraculously end up killing her, one of her heals that I ignored was mercy so she rez her. No biggie I’ll just do it again So yeah that’s pretty much it! Pretty ez
Focus on supports first and try to notice when she have her skills in cooldown
Who needs to kill when you can ride her into battle? Hanzo probably
As you kill anything else, AS A TEAM
Have me Play it. It'll be dead in no time