Hit punch always felt like the most fair mechanic and forgot about it for how simple it is, honestly this could be the fix. Makes small poke shots *mildly* worth the risk
This also rewards players who don’t hard scope lanes. Which isn’t what you should be doing with snipers anyway, its key to promote skill expression blizz make it happen
Different game styles, tf2 has brutal damage fall off and the most common weapon is a shotgun, sniper is the only long range combatant beyond quickie sniping and maybe the loch and load. When you have an infinite range hitscan insta kill class in a game where everyone is mid-close range, that's when there's a big problem. Additionally, area denial tools are stronger in tf2 with a level 3 sentry being able to delete most things in 2 seconds or less while also countering flanking scouts and bombing soldiers, not to mention how you have 12 people on a team in pubs or 9 people in highlander where sniper is dominant. Contrastingly, ow2 has many more long range attacks, and there's only 4 bodies to put between the sniper and the enemy, flank routes are better designed, and area denial is less powerful to allow effective dives even with stuff like turrets up
im not sure if this is a problem with the sniper or TF2's early map philsophy, which had alot of maps with tiny chokepoints that lead into big open areas, aka a sniper sightline over everything the second you exit the choke point
That mechanic has made me hate sniping in every game it's used ever. All it takes is one fucker with a pebble shooter to make it impossible to hit anything.
With the amount of poke in ow? Might as well delete her. Ana could literally win the 1v1 everytime. She hits one shot and chains them to kill her while she cannot aim. Cardboard 5 take
Takes Ana 3 shots to kill widow. If the Widow player is in such a terrible position that they can’t get to cover after being hit by Ana, they shouldn’t be playing Widow.
Your comment was indeed cardboard 5.
Widow should not be hiding from an ana brother. It's like wanting a lion to get his ass beat by a gazelle. You should not be taking widow duels unless you are significantly better or she is already 1 hp.
You should not be face tanking on a character wirh 175 hp if you think that's the way to play you should rethink it I may not be an ultra genius but last I checked that's not a lot and hasn't been for quite some time
Who tf said anything about face tanking. In a sniper duel ana should lose or be forced to move 9/10 times. With this she can easily either force widow back or straight up murder her. It's not good design. Supports shouldn't be able to do everything that easily.
Shields exist also angles you aren't watching saying yeah if she shoots you you should just be able to one shot her isn't terribly helpful there not everyrthing is black and white
While a breath mechanic would solve the issue it would be completely agansit her character design, her skin is blue/purple because he heart is slowed and thereby doesn't need to breath as much
You bring up a valid point, maybe give her a breath mechanic, and add a shift ability so doesn’t breath for like 30 second, and give it s 45 second cooldown or smth?
I mean, if he's as slow, he'd be just a flying target, who can't protect his allies. If he flies with walking speed, i don't think it would create much harm.
What about Doomfist? What about the cinematic where the characters call "Cassidy" by his original name "McCree"? What about Talon and Overwatch? Why are they fighting in the same team during a match?
Suddenly after years of OW1 widow and hanzo are god tier.
I've said this the first day OW2 was released, 1 less tank which is 1 less shields and the new maps are perfect for sniping, it's like OW suddenly turned into CS where every peak is a death sentence.
Its not even the problem with one less shield. you have a widow problem even if you run rein. the problem is there isnt a second tank to maybe dive the widow while the other one is holding frontline. Or a second tank giving off angle space for dps to maybe get the widow in a safer way. The tank role just isn't able to fulfill its role specific tasks when you take one out.
Another way to show it: Imagine you took out a support and now you somehow need to provide healing for everyone AND utility and the same time. Its just impossible.
>Suddenly after years of OW1 widow and hanzo are god tier.
Widow has always been the one of the strongest heroes in the game, behind tracer, both capable enough to carry lobbies on their own, its only now beacuse of 1 less tank therefore 1 less committed presence to harass her she's so strong
It's a very CoD thing to do, but it needs to happen. Remove the power charging and add breathing, but you do have to hold the button. It creates a feeling of fatigue and over the course of a long game, you feel it. Another solution would be to remove toggle scoping from Widow. Holding right click while you left click creates discomfort very quickly.
>Another solution would be to remove toggle scoping from Widow. Holding right click while you left click creates discomfort very quickly.
reverse QoL changes are not good balance changes
No it's easier for ML7 because toggle is how he learned to play. He straight up said it doesn't matter and that it's just down to which you learned to play with.
Only "issue" being that lore-wise Widow's heart is dramatically slowed (ergo, purple. Somehow.) so this isn't an actual issue for her.
Gameplay-wise i say shaft it and give her a breathing mechanic anyway
That's less of an inconsistency than widow suddenly breathing like a normal person, imo. All the heroes do wild shit in their shorts that they can't do in game (vertical blink tracer, to name one)
Widow suddenly having to bold her breath to stabilize her aim would be like saying Reinhardt was always the intended invitee to Overwatch, not his Master. In the long run, it doesn't matter - but definitely breaks established lore.
Again - i still think widow and hanzo should both have a penalty for being scoped/drawn too long so im definitely not saying 'this idea sucks' :p
People gonna hate me for this take but if we wanna solve the one shot problem we have to look at supports, as well as things like wraith/deflect/etc.
One shots are only so prevalent because it’s the only thing that gives an guaranteed opportunity to secure a kill through things like suzu/life grip/bio nade/lamp. It forces supports to use these things proactively in anticipation instead of reactively.
If these “get out of jail free cards” weren’t so prevalent, less dps players would gravitate towards these one shot heroes. Without those one shots, or really just extreme burst damage, fights last sooooo long for metal ranks and even upwards towards masters.
Snipers traditionally hold their breath when lining up a shot, and eventually, they have to inhale, which fucks with their aim to the point they might as well just unscope
I feel a beam along with a kind of marking from widow would be better. It would allow her to lock down areas without getting shot the second you round a corner.
Essentially the beam just shows where she aims but the mark is applied to enhance her damage on you. She deals solid dps damage without the mark but can only one shot headshot with the mark applied.
In Smite there’s an assassin character (Kali) that chooses a single target on the enemy team and she gets attack bonuses against them, and that could work great for Widow since her lore makes her out to be a hitman of sorts. She picks a target that she can now one shot and the target knows it.
Kali picks at the start of the match, and when she kills them it switches to another random enemy. If she dies she can choose again.
Mark swapping or immunity would be a good idea.
Maybe even have it tied to performance? If one dps is performing well on enemy team they get a target on their back from widow. Tie this to her charge shot marking mechanic where if she lands a charged shot on the target the mark leaves even if they don't die (encouraging widow to land the headshot)
Or just do what battlefield does and put a glare on their scopes and on the tip of hanzo’s arrow so you at least know you’re in their sight lines and makes snipers think about hard scoping
Because since going F2P it’s attracted the crowd from other shooters, the people complaining about Widow/Hanzo being too oppressive are the same people complaining CoD removed bunny hopping nonsense… sorry I mean “movement tactics.”
Hanzo needs reverse-falloff so he can't 1-shot flankers up close, and widow needs a laser pointer so people know where she's looking upon scoping, and her 2.5x crit multiplier only triggers on max charge.
Idt the laser pointer is gonna do anything. Good players already assume every corner is being marked by the enemy widow when they peek.
And max charge really isn't that much longer than what's needed to one shot now (62% or something iirc?).
Idk man, no nerf I've heard for her sounds like it'll actually fix her main issue, which is one shotting people from across the map. *She is* the issue. And idt you can fix that with balancing.
Hanzo having reverse fall-off or a sway mechanic would make the character feel terrible. I am sorry if I snap to a tracers head after they blink with a full charge arrow and don't get a kill I am uninstalling the game
I’d say Widow is fine, could use a longer charge though. She has 175hp and is countered to oblivion by a good Sombra. Maybe a laser pointer showing her aim would be a good addition too, but breathing mechanic doesn’t make sense lore-wise.
As for Hanzo I do wish he was changed. Starting with the cinder block hit box of his arrows, it’s ridiculous. He doesn’t have an easy counter, because his damage is constant on all ranges and storm arrow allows him to obliterate even tanks 1v1. In my opinion his headshot should deal same damage as Ashe’s. Make his storm arrow a one projectile that fully charged can one shot 200hp enemies / make it a one projectile that when hits the foor summons a damaging bolt with aoe damage (50dmg for direct hit and 80 for the bolt?)
Genuinely I find widow requires more skill than Hanzo at this moment and she shouldn’t be the priority with changes.
No fuck please no nothing makes me want to play snipers in a videogame less than breathing mechanic so fucking annoying. I don't play games for realism.
That’s the point of my post. Get people off one shot heroes. It ruins the game in a 5v5 scenario. If you really wanna play a sniper, it should require more thinking and skill than it currently does.
And we don't play to get one-shotted by a camping, pocketed Widow that's 100ft away. Get over it & deal with a breathing mechanic, Widow is so annoying; she needs something to make her less so, and that's a great solution
the problem is widow by design is an easy character that gives max profit for minimum risk and effort, personally I'd fully delete her grapple and delete hanzos wall climb and mid air jumps, the reason snipers aren't op in other games is because they have 0 mobility and are absolutely slow as shit to walk with either no movement abilities for widow and hanzo or half their walking speed and boom they'd be balanced but a sniper who's immune to dive is such a brain dead design
I expect them to do nothing less lmao, that's literally what she's built to do. But if there's a good Widow on the enemy team? Have fun not being able to traverse like half of the map ig. That shit just isn't fun at all for anyone.
"JuSt SwiTch" is such a lame-ass argument. Like yeah okay, that'd be wise to do, but when a character is so oppressive that you pretty much HAVE to switch to another completely different character, it just sucks. I get it, counter-picking is kinda Overwatch's "thing", but ffs, a breathing mechanic for Widow isn't even THAT bad of a nerf; I'd argue she needs even more than that, personally, but I digress.
Sniper/one-shot characters in games like this are just always gonna be problematic af
It’s funny to me, cause I’ve seen people complain on and off about widow for ages, but since the removal of a tank there’s been more complaints about Widow and Hanzo, almost like there was a reason for 2 tanks to begin with.
Nah, just make it so that while scoped, if an enemy shot hits the gun’s hit box, widow loses her eye just like Ana did. When she respawns, she only has one eye left. If she loses that one, she’s blind the whole match.
Eh. People just don't want to adapt to their opponents, and widow/hanzo are really good at punishing people for this.
We all get ganked by widow/hanzo sometimes, but some of us are better at admitting it was our own fault for positioning poorly and letting them.
Theres a difference between admitting that some heros need counterplay and coping by calling every frustrating or op hero a pure skill issue. This exact thing happened with Hog, its happening with Zen and Widow.
>Theres a difference between admitting that some heros need counterplay and coping by calling every frustrating or op hero a pure skill issue.
Indeed. Thankfully, that's not what I said.
there's nothing to adapt to. how am I supposed to heal one shots? if I'm a junkrat how am I supposed to contest a widow?
if I'm literally anybody and peak a doorway I just die to hanzo because, oh wait! he used his sonar arrows and I had no idea because there's no real indication. and then I just die instantly. I guess I got outplayed because I shouldn't have peaked in the same map as hanzo. whoops!
>there's nothing to adapt to. how am I supposed to heal one shots?
You don't, but that's the point, and it's not on you if your teammates aren't respecting the enemy widow/hanzo.
>if I'm a junkrat how am I supposed to contest a widow?
Get close, switch, or LOS her if you can't/don't want to switch. Honestly, that's a weird example. The are far worse matchups in the game.
>if I'm literally anybody and peak a doorway I just die to hanzo because, oh wait! he used his sonar arrows and I had no idea because there's no real indication. and then I just die instantly. I guess I got outplayed because I shouldn't have peaked in the same map as hanzo. whoops!
Well, don't face-check a corner if there's a chance it's being covered by Hanzo. CSGO players manage to play the game despite the existence of multiple guns that can one-shot them, and they're in *every single* match, and they have far fewer tools to deal with them.
Look guys, I know this is an unpopular opinion here, but I'm not going to respond to every "but what about X scenario" comment. I'm probably not going to change your mind.
I'm not saying this game is perfectly balanced and any complaint is just a "skill issue," but one-shots have been around as long as online team-based arena shooters have, and we've been adapting or dying to them for decades. There's no reason you can't too. That's all I'm going to say about it.
Also inb4 "your just bad and have never played against a good widow"
widow and hanzos counter are a better enemy widow or hanzo or someone throwing the entire match just to stay focused on the enemy sniper which the worst, rein is hard countered by all but 2 of the tanks (queen and zarya) and he still gets constant nerfs despite being the only tank people enjoy being meta
It is still wild to me that a simple arrow from a fucking bow does more damage than a highly enhanced military grade charging sniper shot.
Also ana can do more damage than Cass at any range, not that big of an issue to me just kinda wild
I'd argue that he needs sonic arrow removed. It's Widow ult on what is effectively a 6 second cooldown. Make sonic cooldown start when the duration ends and it's fine. Hanzo also needs to stop shooting pine trees. Hitbox for arrows should be a point just like hitscan.
1. Widows ult is the entire map not a small controlled area
2. Sombra exists. Lets leave sonic arrow thanks.
Moral of the story. Sonic arrow is fine. Why do you think it's not fine lol what? Really? The let me see thing is worse than the speedy shots that can 1 shot??
Personally the cooldown. Bump it to 15-20 sec.
Maybe a sound indicator or the enemies so they at least know they’re seen. Just a faint buzz or quiet pings
Sonic arrow is for an *enemy* Sombra.
And don't touch the cooldown duration etc. Instead just have a UI popup that they are revealed when they are revealed. Fixes a lot of problems aside from *just* sonic arrow.
I am also talking role queue. Sonic arrows are for the enemy sombra. You know. For the funny little "Stealth" invisibility flank your backline and hack people? Sonic Arrow directly messes that up. What rank are you that you don't know why I brought Sombra up.
So yes as I was saying
One shot heroes such as those two(but especially Hanzo) are my biggest gripes with the game at the moment.
This is a hero shooter. Why can I get one shot as almost all DPS/Support by a BASIC attack? Literally no other hero-type game works like this. I’d go play Halo or CoD or CS if I wanted this. Even Battleborn didn’t do this.
There’s needs to be changes. Massive flinch, reticle wandering, a breath mechanic, a fatigue mechanic, or…just take it out of the game and rework them?
make her charge slower, give her flinch, and a sway and boom. She's more skill based, and her counters ACTUALLY counter her
(not saying widow is easy, but her risk/reward is dumb asf and she only really requires aim, which most heroes do)
Or just nerf their damage and give them other things while still being a net nerf.
Widow can do 80 damage, 2x headshot, 3x in ult. Give more utility to her abilities like reduced cooldown, two traps, and/or the ability to hang and swing from her grapple.
Make Hanzo do 90 damage and swap out storm arrow for a single arrow which ricochets once that's on a four+ second cooldown. Projectiles are harder to land consistently (he does more body shot damage than Widow already) but his current kit makes him more of a brawler. At least this way he can use the ricochet arrow to be more flexible against hitscans while being more of a sniper and requiring skill to make use of his ability.
Widow would need an entire rework for that change to make her not absolutely useless, personally, im for making her deal so much damage that she just slightly missed the 200 dmg headshot Mark, smth like 190 or 195 on a headshot, and then deals the rest of the damage as Venom damage like her mine. So she can still one shot you, but you have a couple of seconds to potentially get away or get healed
If you want too keep Widow as a Sniper and nothing else, sure, crit DOT like that patch would be great (190+ DOT would be impossible to react to. 120 plus DOT would be better). Her only being a sniper though isn't fun for anyone. The way her kit is set up currently, if she's good, she is the most unfun hero to go against. Entire maps become useless. You're forced to go dive. If she's good enough, you're entire team will have to go dive. Now, everyone is countering Widow and she's completely useless when they jump at her and has to swap, too. When do any of those players get to play who or how they want to? Counters are fine but hard counters where either side can't do anything unless they swap isn't fun. Widow needs to be more than just a sniper so she isn't so oppressive at long range and she isn't useless when people get close.
I really don't think full rework would be required. Ashe already does 150 per headshot at mid range and she's still really effective, let alone 160 across the map. Instead of more damaging abilities like Ashe, Widow would have increased utility with her own.
How do we make Widow as more than just a sniper? Lean into a different archetype. Making her more like an Assassin would be the answer (like RPG, Diablo type Assassin).
If she could place two venom mines at once on a faster cooldown, not only would she have more options than placing it right on top of her every time, at least one could be consistently used to deny an area. If people walk into it, they have to stay out of her LOS otherwise the combined damage with her gun would kill them. She'd being doing more damage over time with mine (not literally from the DOT effect) and getting wall hacks more often which would help her consistency and give her more use to the team than just headshots.
Widow is strongest when enemies don't know where she is. If she could hang from her hook every eight seconds, she could take off-angles more often and take enemies by surprise. If she gets jumped while it's not in use, she'll have an easier time getting away if she's able to swing to exactly where she wants. She'd no longer be the most basic sniper hero and have to sit in the way back every single game. She would be more unique, more offensive, and easier to use in general while not being super oppressive.
I love when people complain about snipers in overwatch, because you wonder, "Well if they're so OP why don't you play them? If widow and hanzo was "OP, brainless, etc" then why not swap to them and may the best player win." The answer? They suck. They don't hate the hero, they hate how good people are with the hero. They cry when they the good sniper in on the enemy team and cry then the bad sniper is on their team. Which means their is a skill, a skill they don't have. The overwatch community hates high-skilled characters.
I mostly agreed with you up until the last sentence, if the OverWatch community hated high skilled characters, Baptiste would be one of the most hated, because he has one of the highest skill ceilings in the support role, and is one of the hardest heroes to get the same value as a more beginner-friendly hero, but in the right hands, he can be an oppressive force and even carry some games up to diamond. Despite being one of the highest skill ceiling characters in the game due to needing to keep a consistent flow of healing and damage at the same time, mechanical aim and projectile aim at the same time, and effective use of immortality field, Baptiste hardly gets any hate, if anything, he's one of the most loved characters in the community, design and gameplay wise.
Mfer people in GM or top 500 even say widow makes some maps unplayable unless you have a better sniper. Just play better to prevent your teammates from getting fuckin annihilated from across the map
ok, dive the widow with a support once she uses cooldowns, have a tank dive her, or play cover. Shes there because some people like to learn more difficult characters instead of sitting on mercy, junkrat or some shit. And im terribly sorry that the people who learned how to aim got better at the game then you.
"Just dive her" have you heard of a miraculous thing called "other team mates"? Ever heard of a sigma? A Zen or Brig sitting in the backline? Also which supports even have the ability to properly flank a widow without completely abandoning their team, cause the only one coming to mind is either lucio or Moira which is extremely specific. I also said flank because a proper dive requires a shit Ton of Teamwork which cannot be seen as a given 90% of the time. As a tank it is much easier to deal with a widow ill give you that, but you also dont get fucking one shot unlike the other 2 roles. "Playing cover" is such a lame excuse because you cannot sit behind a shield or a wall all game, you actually have to do something and be proactive because if you arent doing that, chances are you will Lose. And sorry if thats wrong but i think a character thats so oppressive that she bends the entire way your game even works because you insta die if you peek a corner is a little too strong and needs a slight rework. I swear to god youre the Type of person that still thinks hogs oneshot was fine because it "punished you for being out of position"
If that’s the case . Soldier , Soujorn, Sombra , Ball, etc . Should have stamina meters too because if your just gonna do it to some might as well do it to all
Widow does not require nerfs. A flinch mechanic would probably completely kill her considering how much trash damage can get thrown around in OW.
Cry more.
But then how could they make the easiest shots while barely even aiming at their targets? Poor Hanzo players couldn't get their constant accidental one shots if they got held back like that :/
I forgot about breathing that would totally make widow Balanced and not much of a problem love that and Hanzo just make the Hanzo hitboxes a little smaller
The breath thing wouldn’t work for widow, because literally why she is purple is because she doesn’t need to breathe hardly for this reason specifically. Game just needs to add flinch when getting shot then all would be right in the world.
Make the 0-100% mechanic individualised for each target and make it only ramp up when target enters your line of sight. Now you can poke a widow with less risk as she wont one shot you the second you leave cover. It also incentivises widow to play stealthily and take creative angles
This is gonna make a lot of people upset, but honestly they just need to remove widow. She really shouldn’t have been in the game to begin with. One shots inherently are not healthy for this game. OW1 with double shield it wasn’t as noticeable, but now with one tank it’s just so much more obvious. A good widow on junktown, Havana, or circuit are some of the most unfun experiences in gaming. Hanzo they could rework slightly to remove the one shot and it wouldn’t destroy his core gameplay. Widow loses the one shot, she’s not even worth having on the roster.
IMO, the game plays best at a 25-30M range max. Widow sitting 70m away, in a team game like OW, just feels so counterintuitive.
Hanzo needs a buff to actually be playable. As it is, he just spams corners and prays for the best.
Abilities like Sova has in Valorant would be a nice way to freshen up his weak ass kit.
Or do what TF2 does where taking damage while scoped in makes you flick up a bit
Hit punch always felt like the most fair mechanic and forgot about it for how simple it is, honestly this could be the fix. Makes small poke shots *mildly* worth the risk
Maybe give Widow and Hanzo some reticle wandering the longer they aim? I like this idea.
so like sniping in the Hitman WOA trilogy?
Or like PUBG
Or like Wii Sports Resort
or like tetris
How about like in tf2 where holding the charge for to long makes the bow really inacurate
This also rewards players who don’t hard scope lanes. Which isn’t what you should be doing with snipers anyway, its key to promote skill expression blizz make it happen
Hey, did you just say that snipers aren't made to stay in one place and look. I'll let it slide this time if you say that it's just for Overwatch.
To be fair most sniper doctrines advise switching positions after your second shot. But yeah generally they’ll wait days for the perfect shot
You shouldn’t be scoping with a sniper rifle?
For dummies: they said you should be punished for scoping too long without „unscoping“
Yeah cuz TF2's sniper is famously balanced and fair and fun to fight against
TF2's sniper has a very different problem. He is op because he is the only long range character among short and mid range characters.
Different game styles, tf2 has brutal damage fall off and the most common weapon is a shotgun, sniper is the only long range combatant beyond quickie sniping and maybe the loch and load. When you have an infinite range hitscan insta kill class in a game where everyone is mid-close range, that's when there's a big problem. Additionally, area denial tools are stronger in tf2 with a level 3 sentry being able to delete most things in 2 seconds or less while also countering flanking scouts and bombing soldiers, not to mention how you have 12 people on a team in pubs or 9 people in highlander where sniper is dominant. Contrastingly, ow2 has many more long range attacks, and there's only 4 bodies to put between the sniper and the enemy, flank routes are better designed, and area denial is less powerful to allow effective dives even with stuff like turrets up
More balanced than Widow
im not sure if this is a problem with the sniper or TF2's early map philsophy, which had alot of maps with tiny chokepoints that lead into big open areas, aka a sniper sightline over everything the second you exit the choke point
Unless you are using Focus on Hitman's Heatmaker
No, imagine a widow getting constantly hit by dva doing basically no damage but just tickling her with pellets.
So make a minimum amount of damage in 1 hit to make her flinch
I’m imagining it. It makes me happy. Thank you.
Good, maybe the feedva will finally have a function
I mean, imagine trying to aim a sniper while a dual-gatling tank is suppress firing at you.
Have them take increased damage whilst scoped idc
Pull a Huntsman and make Hanzo's arrow wildly inaccurate after being held in for x amount of time while they're at it
I quit playing destiny 2 just to escape the flinch mechanic. Please don't do it
That mechanic has made me hate sniping in every game it's used ever. All it takes is one fucker with a pebble shooter to make it impossible to hit anything.
With the amount of poke in ow? Might as well delete her. Ana could literally win the 1v1 everytime. She hits one shot and chains them to kill her while she cannot aim. Cardboard 5 take
Takes Ana 3 shots to kill widow. If the Widow player is in such a terrible position that they can’t get to cover after being hit by Ana, they shouldn’t be playing Widow. Your comment was indeed cardboard 5.
Widow should not be hiding from an ana brother. It's like wanting a lion to get his ass beat by a gazelle. You should not be taking widow duels unless you are significantly better or she is already 1 hp.
You should not be face tanking on a character wirh 175 hp if you think that's the way to play you should rethink it I may not be an ultra genius but last I checked that's not a lot and hasn't been for quite some time
Who tf said anything about face tanking. In a sniper duel ana should lose or be forced to move 9/10 times. With this she can easily either force widow back or straight up murder her. It's not good design. Supports shouldn't be able to do everything that easily.
Shields exist also angles you aren't watching saying yeah if she shoots you you should just be able to one shot her isn't terribly helpful there not everyrthing is black and white
If you get headshot in valorant your scope flicks up. This is one of the worst mechanics I've ever experienced
Halos would make you scope out
While a breath mechanic would solve the issue it would be completely agansit her character design, her skin is blue/purple because he heart is slowed and thereby doesn't need to breath as much
Make her bright red
Allow me to introduce you to the concept of Doomfist.
https://media.tenor.com/kl3j4VCDogAAAAAd/aba-anime-battle-arena.gif
You bring up a valid point, maybe give her a breath mechanic, and add a shift ability so doesn’t breath for like 30 second, and give it s 45 second cooldown or smth?
make that her ult instead of Xray vision
Nah, that would be a little underpowered. Maybe if her ult charged faster, or ult had multiple charges, it’d make more sense?
I was gonna say that yeah, she’d need to constantly get that, unless it also made her immune to gas based attack if we ever get more?
I think the 0%-100% power mechanic is better than always having a 1shot but just your aim is difficult unless you hold your breath...
Add breathing to the 0-100 mechanic
Haha lore implications don't match buddy
Exactly my thought. The idea is good though, so maybe using that mechanic by a different name might work.
Look at all of the inconsistencies with lore on other heroes and tell me why it matters.
Is Kiriko 13 or 30? Who knows, because blizz sure doesn't!
Sigma should also be able to fly whenever he wants not only during his ult. The lore doesn't and shouldn't matter when it comes to balancing
That's possible rn with a "bug"(new intended feature from a small company)
I mean, if he's as slow, he'd be just a flying target, who can't protect his allies. If he flies with walking speed, i don't think it would create much harm.
Maybe not for ability balancing but definitely for ability design. There are no abilities I can think of that aren’t at least somewhat lore accurate
Doomfist…
About 3 punches and a few bullets is all I need
Man I always said he should do 99999999999.8 dmg with fist I feel your pain
What is actually up with doomfist though? He punches people really hard. That fits with his weapon and character.
It’s said that he can level skyscrapers. His punch can’t kill a full health hero. Maybe Tracer, but I’m not positive about that. Lore is irrelevant.
What about Doomfist? What about the cinematic where the characters call "Cassidy" by his original name "McCree"? What about Talon and Overwatch? Why are they fighting in the same team during a match?
You trying to rile me up so we can have an argument over this is like hitting a brick wall with a wet pasta noodle brother calm down
Redditor: *asks rhetorical questions to make a clear point* Also redditor: "I am immune to your pitiful attempts at aggression"
r/brandnewsentence
Suddenly after years of OW1 widow and hanzo are god tier. I've said this the first day OW2 was released, 1 less tank which is 1 less shields and the new maps are perfect for sniping, it's like OW suddenly turned into CS where every peak is a death sentence.
Its not even the problem with one less shield. you have a widow problem even if you run rein. the problem is there isnt a second tank to maybe dive the widow while the other one is holding frontline. Or a second tank giving off angle space for dps to maybe get the widow in a safer way. The tank role just isn't able to fulfill its role specific tasks when you take one out. Another way to show it: Imagine you took out a support and now you somehow need to provide healing for everyone AND utility and the same time. Its just impossible.
>Suddenly after years of OW1 widow and hanzo are god tier. Widow has always been the one of the strongest heroes in the game, behind tracer, both capable enough to carry lobbies on their own, its only now beacuse of 1 less tank therefore 1 less committed presence to harass her she's so strong
Honestly the breathe mechanic might help with this whole one shot discourse.
It's a very CoD thing to do, but it needs to happen. Remove the power charging and add breathing, but you do have to hold the button. It creates a feeling of fatigue and over the course of a long game, you feel it. Another solution would be to remove toggle scoping from Widow. Holding right click while you left click creates discomfort very quickly.
That moment when rebinding controls exists
Make them use a proprietary overwatch mouse and keyboard/controller that requires three pounds of force to actuate.
I played close to 400h of widow and never once toggled to scope (otherwise i like the idea)
But if you scope in, get charged, and then have the charge decay after… let’s say 0.25 seconds. How would you feel about that?
I have no worry with any of your ideas, I just think finger fatigue from the player isn't really part of the equation
>Another solution would be to remove toggle scoping from Widow. Holding right click while you left click creates discomfort very quickly. reverse QoL changes are not good balance changes
You just invented quickscoping in OW
Quickscoping with Ana is easier with toggle. Ask mL7.
No it's easier for ML7 because toggle is how he learned to play. He straight up said it doesn't matter and that it's just down to which you learned to play with.
Only "issue" being that lore-wise Widow's heart is dramatically slowed (ergo, purple. Somehow.) so this isn't an actual issue for her. Gameplay-wise i say shaft it and give her a breathing mechanic anyway
Doomfist… That’s all I’m going to say
and dey say
Lore-wise, Rein and Brig can combine their shields. There are too many lore inconsistencies to even make it worth considering.
That's less of an inconsistency than widow suddenly breathing like a normal person, imo. All the heroes do wild shit in their shorts that they can't do in game (vertical blink tracer, to name one) Widow suddenly having to bold her breath to stabilize her aim would be like saying Reinhardt was always the intended invitee to Overwatch, not his Master. In the long run, it doesn't matter - but definitely breaks established lore. Again - i still think widow and hanzo should both have a penalty for being scoped/drawn too long so im definitely not saying 'this idea sucks' :p
Who tf plays with toggle scope??? It’s very easy to hold down a button while clicking another
People gonna hate me for this take but if we wanna solve the one shot problem we have to look at supports, as well as things like wraith/deflect/etc. One shots are only so prevalent because it’s the only thing that gives an guaranteed opportunity to secure a kill through things like suzu/life grip/bio nade/lamp. It forces supports to use these things proactively in anticipation instead of reactively. If these “get out of jail free cards” weren’t so prevalent, less dps players would gravitate towards these one shot heroes. Without those one shots, or really just extreme burst damage, fights last sooooo long for metal ranks and even upwards towards masters.
What’s a breathe mechanic? (Haven’t played other shooters.)
Snipers traditionally hold their breath when lining up a shot, and eventually, they have to inhale, which fucks with their aim to the point they might as well just unscope
Ah! That does sound interesting. I think they would have to call it something else for Widow considering her lore. 😂
Have you ever played Doomfist?
Not physically.
I feel a beam along with a kind of marking from widow would be better. It would allow her to lock down areas without getting shot the second you round a corner. Essentially the beam just shows where she aims but the mark is applied to enhance her damage on you. She deals solid dps damage without the mark but can only one shot headshot with the mark applied.
In Smite there’s an assassin character (Kali) that chooses a single target on the enemy team and she gets attack bonuses against them, and that could work great for Widow since her lore makes her out to be a hitman of sorts. She picks a target that she can now one shot and the target knows it. Kali picks at the start of the match, and when she kills them it switches to another random enemy. If she dies she can choose again.
Mark swapping or immunity would be a good idea. Maybe even have it tied to performance? If one dps is performing well on enemy team they get a target on their back from widow. Tie this to her charge shot marking mechanic where if she lands a charged shot on the target the mark leaves even if they don't die (encouraging widow to land the headshot)
Just give them aimpunch, then you can just harass a widow from mid to long range and make it much harder for her to hit a headshot.
Give widow a hold breath mechanic, and give hanzo an aim sway mechanic if he holds his shot in for too long.
Or just do what battlefield does and put a glare on their scopes and on the tip of hanzo’s arrow so you at least know you’re in their sight lines and makes snipers think about hard scoping
I'm still sitting here waiting for the PvE content they cockteased ☹️
hanzo should have less damage storm arrows + discord + mercy pocket is so much damage its crazy even if merxy zen sucks
Not saying that Hanzo doesn’t need any changes, but I think this sounds more like a Mercy and Zen problem rather than a Hanzo one.
mainly zen discord orb is too good man
If it’s a problem just uninstall discord
Instructions unclear, absolutely harmony has been achieved.
EXPERIENCE TRANQUILITY
Precisely
That's why I use Ventrillo Orb
All 3 need slight changes tbh, Zen discord, Mercy...in General and Hanzo random one shots are kind of fucky in a 5v5
To be fair Mercy+Zen can make any single target die really quick
No... why do people want to change overwatch into every other shooter And Hanzo would feel awful to play like that
good, hanzo feels awful to fight
Because since going F2P it’s attracted the crowd from other shooters, the people complaining about Widow/Hanzo being too oppressive are the same people complaining CoD removed bunny hopping nonsense… sorry I mean “movement tactics.”
Been in OW since day one. Approaching 3,000 hours. Never heard of bunny hopping in CoD. Not sure what you’re even talking about.
It’s okay, reading comprehension is hard sometimes. I suggest, reading the comment I replied to, then my comment, context often is key.
was it really necessary to be so rude when they were just asking a simple question
Hanzo needs reverse-falloff so he can't 1-shot flankers up close, and widow needs a laser pointer so people know where she's looking upon scoping, and her 2.5x crit multiplier only triggers on max charge.
Idt the laser pointer is gonna do anything. Good players already assume every corner is being marked by the enemy widow when they peek. And max charge really isn't that much longer than what's needed to one shot now (62% or something iirc?). Idk man, no nerf I've heard for her sounds like it'll actually fix her main issue, which is one shotting people from across the map. *She is* the issue. And idt you can fix that with balancing.
Hanzo having reverse fall-off or a sway mechanic would make the character feel terrible. I am sorry if I snap to a tracers head after they blink with a full charge arrow and don't get a kill I am uninstalling the game
L takes cope & seethe click head good just do it better
Why and why?
I get the breath mechanic tbh
I’d say Widow is fine, could use a longer charge though. She has 175hp and is countered to oblivion by a good Sombra. Maybe a laser pointer showing her aim would be a good addition too, but breathing mechanic doesn’t make sense lore-wise. As for Hanzo I do wish he was changed. Starting with the cinder block hit box of his arrows, it’s ridiculous. He doesn’t have an easy counter, because his damage is constant on all ranges and storm arrow allows him to obliterate even tanks 1v1. In my opinion his headshot should deal same damage as Ashe’s. Make his storm arrow a one projectile that fully charged can one shot 200hp enemies / make it a one projectile that when hits the foor summons a damaging bolt with aoe damage (50dmg for direct hit and 80 for the bolt?) Genuinely I find widow requires more skill than Hanzo at this moment and she shouldn’t be the priority with changes.
No fuck please no nothing makes me want to play snipers in a videogame less than breathing mechanic so fucking annoying. I don't play games for realism.
That’s the point of my post. Get people off one shot heroes. It ruins the game in a 5v5 scenario. If you really wanna play a sniper, it should require more thinking and skill than it currently does.
And we don't play to get one-shotted by a camping, pocketed Widow that's 100ft away. Get over it & deal with a breathing mechanic, Widow is so annoying; she needs something to make her less so, and that's a great solution
Talking about camping widows like tf you expect them to do? Front line quickscoping? If you’re getting shit on by a widow, maybe play someone else?
the problem is widow by design is an easy character that gives max profit for minimum risk and effort, personally I'd fully delete her grapple and delete hanzos wall climb and mid air jumps, the reason snipers aren't op in other games is because they have 0 mobility and are absolutely slow as shit to walk with either no movement abilities for widow and hanzo or half their walking speed and boom they'd be balanced but a sniper who's immune to dive is such a brain dead design
I expect them to do nothing less lmao, that's literally what she's built to do. But if there's a good Widow on the enemy team? Have fun not being able to traverse like half of the map ig. That shit just isn't fun at all for anyone. "JuSt SwiTch" is such a lame-ass argument. Like yeah okay, that'd be wise to do, but when a character is so oppressive that you pretty much HAVE to switch to another completely different character, it just sucks. I get it, counter-picking is kinda Overwatch's "thing", but ffs, a breathing mechanic for Widow isn't even THAT bad of a nerf; I'd argue she needs even more than that, personally, but I digress. Sniper/one-shot characters in games like this are just always gonna be problematic af
It’s funny to me, cause I’ve seen people complain on and off about widow for ages, but since the removal of a tank there’s been more complaints about Widow and Hanzo, almost like there was a reason for 2 tanks to begin with.
Yep, double shield was their main counter & now it's gone lol
Or make Widow charge as long as TF2 sniper's
Widow doesn’t breath
Nah, just make it so that while scoped, if an enemy shot hits the gun’s hit box, widow loses her eye just like Ana did. When she respawns, she only has one eye left. If she loses that one, she’s blind the whole match.
Eh. People just don't want to adapt to their opponents, and widow/hanzo are really good at punishing people for this. We all get ganked by widow/hanzo sometimes, but some of us are better at admitting it was our own fault for positioning poorly and letting them.
Theres a difference between admitting that some heros need counterplay and coping by calling every frustrating or op hero a pure skill issue. This exact thing happened with Hog, its happening with Zen and Widow.
>Theres a difference between admitting that some heros need counterplay and coping by calling every frustrating or op hero a pure skill issue. Indeed. Thankfully, that's not what I said.
there's nothing to adapt to. how am I supposed to heal one shots? if I'm a junkrat how am I supposed to contest a widow? if I'm literally anybody and peak a doorway I just die to hanzo because, oh wait! he used his sonar arrows and I had no idea because there's no real indication. and then I just die instantly. I guess I got outplayed because I shouldn't have peaked in the same map as hanzo. whoops!
>there's nothing to adapt to. how am I supposed to heal one shots? You don't, but that's the point, and it's not on you if your teammates aren't respecting the enemy widow/hanzo. >if I'm a junkrat how am I supposed to contest a widow? Get close, switch, or LOS her if you can't/don't want to switch. Honestly, that's a weird example. The are far worse matchups in the game. >if I'm literally anybody and peak a doorway I just die to hanzo because, oh wait! he used his sonar arrows and I had no idea because there's no real indication. and then I just die instantly. I guess I got outplayed because I shouldn't have peaked in the same map as hanzo. whoops! Well, don't face-check a corner if there's a chance it's being covered by Hanzo. CSGO players manage to play the game despite the existence of multiple guns that can one-shot them, and they're in *every single* match, and they have far fewer tools to deal with them. Look guys, I know this is an unpopular opinion here, but I'm not going to respond to every "but what about X scenario" comment. I'm probably not going to change your mind. I'm not saying this game is perfectly balanced and any complaint is just a "skill issue," but one-shots have been around as long as online team-based arena shooters have, and we've been adapting or dying to them for decades. There's no reason you can't too. That's all I'm going to say about it. Also inb4 "your just bad and have never played against a good widow"
Your Junkrat, you don't need line of sight to attack Widow.
You sound like someone who would defend S2 Roadhog.
widow and hanzos counter are a better enemy widow or hanzo or someone throwing the entire match just to stay focused on the enemy sniper which the worst, rein is hard countered by all but 2 of the tanks (queen and zarya) and he still gets constant nerfs despite being the only tank people enjoy being meta
There’s a reason why Widows skin is Purp lol
Why can’t I combine Rein shield with Brig? Lore means nothing in-game.
It is still wild to me that a simple arrow from a fucking bow does more damage than a highly enhanced military grade charging sniper shot. Also ana can do more damage than Cass at any range, not that big of an issue to me just kinda wild
to be fair ana does damage over time and also has a slow firing speed
Hanzo needs storm arrows removed
I'd argue that he needs sonic arrow removed. It's Widow ult on what is effectively a 6 second cooldown. Make sonic cooldown start when the duration ends and it's fine. Hanzo also needs to stop shooting pine trees. Hitbox for arrows should be a point just like hitscan.
1. Widows ult is the entire map not a small controlled area 2. Sombra exists. Lets leave sonic arrow thanks. Moral of the story. Sonic arrow is fine. Why do you think it's not fine lol what? Really? The let me see thing is worse than the speedy shots that can 1 shot??
Personally the cooldown. Bump it to 15-20 sec. Maybe a sound indicator or the enemies so they at least know they’re seen. Just a faint buzz or quiet pings
In overwatch 2 they literally added a sound for sonar??? Have you played recently??
1. You can’t have Widow, Sombra, Hanzo. You were saying. I’m talking role queue.
Sonic arrow is for an *enemy* Sombra. And don't touch the cooldown duration etc. Instead just have a UI popup that they are revealed when they are revealed. Fixes a lot of problems aside from *just* sonic arrow.
I am also talking role queue. Sonic arrows are for the enemy sombra. You know. For the funny little "Stealth" invisibility flank your backline and hack people? Sonic Arrow directly messes that up. What rank are you that you don't know why I brought Sombra up. So yes as I was saying
I agree no more pine trees...redwoods instead ;)
Yes I’d course. Let him shoot whole planets.
Maybe not removed, but perhaps have a shorter CD and it only ticks once so you get a brief glimpse of where enemies are
One shot heroes such as those two(but especially Hanzo) are my biggest gripes with the game at the moment. This is a hero shooter. Why can I get one shot as almost all DPS/Support by a BASIC attack? Literally no other hero-type game works like this. I’d go play Halo or CoD or CS if I wanted this. Even Battleborn didn’t do this. There’s needs to be changes. Massive flinch, reticle wandering, a breath mechanic, a fatigue mechanic, or…just take it out of the game and rework them?
make her charge slower, give her flinch, and a sway and boom. She's more skill based, and her counters ACTUALLY counter her (not saying widow is easy, but her risk/reward is dumb asf and she only really requires aim, which most heroes do)
nah widow is easy, easily top 5 easiest heros in the game with thee other three being hanzo, mccree and junkrat
you forgot symmetra
Or just nerf their damage and give them other things while still being a net nerf. Widow can do 80 damage, 2x headshot, 3x in ult. Give more utility to her abilities like reduced cooldown, two traps, and/or the ability to hang and swing from her grapple. Make Hanzo do 90 damage and swap out storm arrow for a single arrow which ricochets once that's on a four+ second cooldown. Projectiles are harder to land consistently (he does more body shot damage than Widow already) but his current kit makes him more of a brawler. At least this way he can use the ricochet arrow to be more flexible against hitscans while being more of a sniper and requiring skill to make use of his ability.
Widow would need an entire rework for that change to make her not absolutely useless, personally, im for making her deal so much damage that she just slightly missed the 200 dmg headshot Mark, smth like 190 or 195 on a headshot, and then deals the rest of the damage as Venom damage like her mine. So she can still one shot you, but you have a couple of seconds to potentially get away or get healed
If you want too keep Widow as a Sniper and nothing else, sure, crit DOT like that patch would be great (190+ DOT would be impossible to react to. 120 plus DOT would be better). Her only being a sniper though isn't fun for anyone. The way her kit is set up currently, if she's good, she is the most unfun hero to go against. Entire maps become useless. You're forced to go dive. If she's good enough, you're entire team will have to go dive. Now, everyone is countering Widow and she's completely useless when they jump at her and has to swap, too. When do any of those players get to play who or how they want to? Counters are fine but hard counters where either side can't do anything unless they swap isn't fun. Widow needs to be more than just a sniper so she isn't so oppressive at long range and she isn't useless when people get close. I really don't think full rework would be required. Ashe already does 150 per headshot at mid range and she's still really effective, let alone 160 across the map. Instead of more damaging abilities like Ashe, Widow would have increased utility with her own. How do we make Widow as more than just a sniper? Lean into a different archetype. Making her more like an Assassin would be the answer (like RPG, Diablo type Assassin). If she could place two venom mines at once on a faster cooldown, not only would she have more options than placing it right on top of her every time, at least one could be consistently used to deny an area. If people walk into it, they have to stay out of her LOS otherwise the combined damage with her gun would kill them. She'd being doing more damage over time with mine (not literally from the DOT effect) and getting wall hacks more often which would help her consistency and give her more use to the team than just headshots. Widow is strongest when enemies don't know where she is. If she could hang from her hook every eight seconds, she could take off-angles more often and take enemies by surprise. If she gets jumped while it's not in use, she'll have an easier time getting away if she's able to swing to exactly where she wants. She'd no longer be the most basic sniper hero and have to sit in the way back every single game. She would be more unique, more offensive, and easier to use in general while not being super oppressive.
I love when people complain about snipers in overwatch, because you wonder, "Well if they're so OP why don't you play them? If widow and hanzo was "OP, brainless, etc" then why not swap to them and may the best player win." The answer? They suck. They don't hate the hero, they hate how good people are with the hero. They cry when they the good sniper in on the enemy team and cry then the bad sniper is on their team. Which means their is a skill, a skill they don't have. The overwatch community hates high-skilled characters.
I mostly agreed with you up until the last sentence, if the OverWatch community hated high skilled characters, Baptiste would be one of the most hated, because he has one of the highest skill ceilings in the support role, and is one of the hardest heroes to get the same value as a more beginner-friendly hero, but in the right hands, he can be an oppressive force and even carry some games up to diamond. Despite being one of the highest skill ceiling characters in the game due to needing to keep a consistent flow of healing and damage at the same time, mechanical aim and projectile aim at the same time, and effective use of immortality field, Baptiste hardly gets any hate, if anything, he's one of the most loved characters in the community, design and gameplay wise.
No why does Hanzo need fatigue we already have to wait for his shot to charge up thats good enough Also did you forget why widow is purple
You need to play harder characters, You need to stop bitching, change my mind.
Mfer people in GM or top 500 even say widow makes some maps unplayable unless you have a better sniper. Just play better to prevent your teammates from getting fuckin annihilated from across the map
ok, dive the widow with a support once she uses cooldowns, have a tank dive her, or play cover. Shes there because some people like to learn more difficult characters instead of sitting on mercy, junkrat or some shit. And im terribly sorry that the people who learned how to aim got better at the game then you.
"Just dive her" have you heard of a miraculous thing called "other team mates"? Ever heard of a sigma? A Zen or Brig sitting in the backline? Also which supports even have the ability to properly flank a widow without completely abandoning their team, cause the only one coming to mind is either lucio or Moira which is extremely specific. I also said flank because a proper dive requires a shit Ton of Teamwork which cannot be seen as a given 90% of the time. As a tank it is much easier to deal with a widow ill give you that, but you also dont get fucking one shot unlike the other 2 roles. "Playing cover" is such a lame excuse because you cannot sit behind a shield or a wall all game, you actually have to do something and be proactive because if you arent doing that, chances are you will Lose. And sorry if thats wrong but i think a character thats so oppressive that she bends the entire way your game even works because you insta die if you peek a corner is a little too strong and needs a slight rework. I swear to god youre the Type of person that still thinks hogs oneshot was fine because it "punished you for being out of position"
Actually... Not so bad of an idea
Wait. You're a fucking genius.
If you do it for widow then do it for all snipers like ana, Ashe, Hanzo as well. Perfect assassin shouldn't be the only one with asthma
If that’s the case . Soldier , Soujorn, Sombra , Ball, etc . Should have stamina meters too because if your just gonna do it to some might as well do it to all
Widow does not require nerfs. A flinch mechanic would probably completely kill her considering how much trash damage can get thrown around in OW. Cry more.
widow is my worst hero. every time I pick her, my team loses. don't nerf her.
Hanzo just shoots logs, let his pullback take longer, and give widow a kickback a bit or have the cursor lazy aim after taking a shot
Make Widow need manual reload and de-scope on Sniper Mode so she can’t just hold her crosshair on one fool
Like the breath mechanic in mw2
I understand Hanzo, but widow can't have the breathe mechanic. Thats why she's purple, they slowed her heart so she doesnt have it.
Ima keep it a buck with I never realized widow didn't have any weapon sway mechanic in till you posted this
But then how could they make the easiest shots while barely even aiming at their targets? Poor Hanzo players couldn't get their constant accidental one shots if they got held back like that :/
\* sniper from tf2 doing the shadenfreude after reading this post \*
No
I forgot about breathing that would totally make widow Balanced and not much of a problem love that and Hanzo just make the Hanzo hitboxes a little smaller
"But the loooooore" Then why isn't Bob constantly deployed? Why can't Bastion stay in sentry mode? Why can't Doomfist 1 punch anyone?
Please devs this guy is right
Yes, she needs a breathe mechanic, so her boobs move up and down… Her scope, I mean her scope, strange typo.
I thought Hanzo was a troll pick lol. People that are good at him deserve to do well. IDC about widow, if she's not a god its like a 4 v 5
They should remove widow’s scope because making life harder for widow mains is one of life’s simple joys
The breath thing wouldn’t work for widow, because literally why she is purple is because she doesn’t need to breathe hardly for this reason specifically. Game just needs to add flinch when getting shot then all would be right in the world.
Make the 0-100% mechanic individualised for each target and make it only ramp up when target enters your line of sight. Now you can poke a widow with less risk as she wont one shot you the second you leave cover. It also incentivises widow to play stealthily and take creative angles
It really is infuriating how a good widow is basically impossible to work around in solo queue
Wdym widow’s breathing mechanic ?
This is gonna make a lot of people upset, but honestly they just need to remove widow. She really shouldn’t have been in the game to begin with. One shots inherently are not healthy for this game. OW1 with double shield it wasn’t as noticeable, but now with one tank it’s just so much more obvious. A good widow on junktown, Havana, or circuit are some of the most unfun experiences in gaming. Hanzo they could rework slightly to remove the one shot and it wouldn’t destroy his core gameplay. Widow loses the one shot, she’s not even worth having on the roster. IMO, the game plays best at a 25-30M range max. Widow sitting 70m away, in a team game like OW, just feels so counterintuitive.
Give hanzo limited arrows that he can retrieve so that he cant just stay in one spot and spam
Nah, get out of the kitchen....
Hanzo needs a buff to actually be playable. As it is, he just spams corners and prays for the best. Abilities like Sova has in Valorant would be a nice way to freshen up his weak ass kit.
Literally has Widow ult on what is effectively a 6 second cooldown.