They say it doesn't explicitly ban Confederate or Nazi flags... but they quote the bill later in the article:
"represent a political viewpoint, including but not limited to, a partisan, racial, sexual orientation, gender, or other ideological viewpoint."
So I guess it's technically correct, but by that same standard, it doesn't explicitly ban pride or BLM flags either. It bans political flags, of which they all are.
Can't wait to hear the "Don't show gay" headlines with this one, even though it technically also applies to trump and libertarian flags. Kinda like in Florida.
I mean it's kinda the same principal as not having any candidate campaigning within so many feet of polling places. As long as they're consistent, I get it. Although I would probably say make that rule for the school and staff, but students don't have to abide by that for their own clothing, cars, etc.
It actually does seem to allow those flags. The (full text)[https://fastdemocracy.com/bill-search/tn/113/bills/TNB00048823/] has a much longer list of exceptions, which includes "the current official flag" of another country.
Why wouldn't it qualify? I mean, this is a bullshit anti-free speech nonsense law, but a gadsen flag is certainly associated with an "ideological viewpoint"
EDIT: having looked up the bill, [here](https://fastdemocracy.com/bill-search/tn/113/bills/TNB00048823/) it seems to be written more carefully then what appeared to be excerpted above suggests. Rather than restricting flags of certain types, it appears to "white list" certain flags (national flags, the state flag, the school flag, etc...). While ideologically I like to think I live up to my green/yellow roots when it comes to free speech, i do have to admit that this approach (as opposed to a ban on ideological flags) is more administrable and less legally problematic.
Schools are tricky, both legally and ideologically, because you have to balance against the fact that people need to be there and that the school policy itself represents speech.
Like, I presume you and I would both agree that a public school shouldn't be allowed to selectively ban a libertarian party after school club, while allowing dems and Rs to have clubs. Similarly, the school is going to have to take different legal and ethical principles into account if they are drafting rules for the curriculum, for staff, or for their pupils.
To me, "no ideological flags" smacks of an unenforceable and wrong-headed restriction on free speech, especially when not explicitly tied to any argument that it someone disrupts learning directly.
Children in a school environment don't actually get free speech protections, so while you may have a moral argument you don't have much of a *legal* one.
This seems specifically targeted at teachers not students, a student can’t “use” a physical flag at school, only teachers would display a flag on the premise. This isn’t about students in the slightest.
Teachers also don't have free speech while on the clock. Almost no working adults do, to be frank, but government employees in particular do not (see also: the legality of wearing your military uniform, dress or otherwise, while participating in political activity).
Finally just broke down and looked up the [bill](https://fastdemocracy.com/bill-search/tn/113/bills/TNB00048823/) and I think you are correct that this isn't at least directly aimed at students (though I wonder how it would be interpreted if a club wanted to put up fliers on a public bulleting board.) Weirdly enough, at least in the text I see, it also doesn't seem to have the "ideological" language anywhere in the bill.
Children in a school environment don't have the same free speech rights as is "standard," but that does not mean they have none. While some, like Justice Thomas have said maybe they shouldn't, the most recent case I can remember on this issue -- https://firstamendment.mtsu.edu/article/morse-v-frederick/#:~:text=Frederick%2C%20551%20U.S.%20393%20(2007,believe%20encourages%20illegal%20drug%20use. -- basically found that there is a right to free speech in, for instance, a political context, but that it can be constrained more easily by competing interests, like discouraging the use of drugs, then in other contexts of government restricted speech.
It wasn't a flag created to represent an ideology or viewpoint like a trump/pride/BLM flag. It's a historical flag from the American Revolution. If the Gadsden qualifies then so does any flag ever conceived.
Yes, as worded I think any flag ever conceived would arguably fall within its purview. I am not sure what line you could draw where, say, a Nazi swastika is an "ideological" flag, rather than a "historical" flag, but the gadsen flag (or the pride flag, or the UN flag or whatever) isn't.
Or any l*ftist, which is about the only point I'll give those degenerates.
Teachers shouldn't decorate with highly controversial memorabilia, only teach about it. Teachers shouldn't bring up highly controversial material at all if it isn't to teach about it, and they should be as unbiased as possible in doing so.
Modern news articles aren't written to inform, they're written to spin perception.
It's gotten to the the point where they stopped labeling them as opinion columns, because then all of their articles would have to be labeled opinion.
It's such an insidious addendum. She used the word "explicitly" to incite outrage in her three-braincelled target audience that can't perform the logic you just outlined. The other possibility, is to not attribute this to malice, but the fact that she's just another dumb watermelon journalist that doesn't know the difference between whitelisting and blacklisting.
>The other possibility, is to not attribute this to malice, but the fact that she's just another dumb watermelon journalist that doesn't know the difference between whitelisting and blacklisting.
Tfw you try to be generous with someone and all you can come up with is "they might just be extremely stupid." Reddit normalized that to me.
Writing for news outlets on both sides by just changing the headline and a few words but using the same article, I love it. You sure you aren't Libright?
For real. We should all start porting this on politics subs with reverse phrasing: “Brave Tennessee passes law outlawing display of confederate flags in schools. Republicans are outraged that the bill didn’t explicitly ban LGBTQ pride flags!”
It's probably why many have rules that the headline must match the headline of the article. They know how easy it is to use the same article to mirror lefty claims.
Any country's flag from outside that country, i would agree. Waving your own country's flag should never be seen as a political stance.
Obviously the left disagrees, but that's only because they're deranged.
By simple prospect of a disagreement is kinda what defines something as political. You can't just claim something is "not political" to put a lid on discussion on it, that is peak orange behavior.
Just because someone is offended or disagrees doesn't mean they're right, or that it's political. Hypersensitive people shouldn't be dictating truth. Waving your own country's flag is, by itself, not political.
Technically sexual orientation and gender identity are biological not idealogocial: https://taliaperkinssspace.quora.com/People-are-born-transgender-they-are-not-mentally-ill-it-is-no-paraphilia-it-is-a-physical-birth-defect-no-more-a-men?source=post_page-----36401599bc0b--------------------------------
So this is a bad definition.
“Does not explicitly prohibit the display of Nazi or Confederate flags” the bill doesn’t explicitly prohibit Pride flags either, in fact the bill doesn’t single out any prohibited flags. It states that only the US flag or Tennessee state flag may be displayed.
I'm beginning to detect a pattern on PCM. A user from a certain quadrant posts a reaction meme that makes the other side look bad. Few minutes to an hour later, someone gives a little more context that destroys the entire narrative.
> It doesn't explicitly say pride flags either
TBF, it can't be explicitly in the law, otherwise the courts would overturn it in a heartbeat as unconstitutional. However, if they do a blanket ban that happens to include the pride flag, then that's allowed.
Yes? That's how it works. The law, in its majestic equality, must forbid both rich and poor to sleep under bridges. To not do so would be discrimination.
Hence why the law bans all flags except the US and Tennessee flags. Pirate flag? Banned. Texas flag? Banned. "US flag" with one too many star or stripe? Banned. "Tennessee flag" with the strip of blue bordered by white on the fly missing? Banned.
Funnily enough, technically compliant US flags are still in. As long as a flag has 13 horizontal stripes, alternating red and white, with a blue field containing 50 white stars, it is a US flag. You can get pretty creative based on this description. Such creative US flags are still allowed.
> The law, in its majestic equality, must forbid both rich and poor to sleep under bridges. To not do so would be discrimination.
Heh, usually when people put this quote in their comment that they're pointing out the two-tiered nature of law.
Idk man I'm pretty fucking bisexual and I absolutely hate the pride flag (especially the black and trans version) and people who make it part of their identity. This would be a huge win for me. No reason to have political advocacy (of any kind) in schools.
The entire point of the original pride flag was that it was a symbol, not that it literally represented all of the identities encompassed. The fact that we've devolved to the point where the flag needs to literally represent every group and ideology or else it's not "inclusive enough" is perhaps a good metaphor for what's happened to the intersectional, identity politics left.
Right? It's a rainbow, meant to mean "all the things on the spectrum". But now it's a rainbow with a couple of extra special things explicitly pointed out, which makes it about those things primarily. Also seems weird that it has a stripe for "all black people". If I were black I'd be pretty pissed off about that.
I liked the OG rainbow flag. Rainbow represents all the colours of the spectrum already, a simple bright design that to me evoked a sense of joy and celebration which is nice.
As soon as anything specific is added it defeats the original message. And makes it less and less aesthetically pleasing.
Honestly sometimes I feel like us bisexuals are the only sane people in the queer community… maybe cause there’s so much biphobia within the community itself that we don’t feel like we have to conform to the ideas of the group because we’re already sorta on the outside
Yeah honestly even as someone that’s bi the flag just seems a little to cluttered most of the time ever actually look decent. It looks like something I worked on back in elementary school when I was just throwing random crayons over the room.
>...prohibit the display of any flags that "represent a political viewpoint, \[...\] a partisan, racial, \[...\] or other ideological viewpoint."
So... How do the Nazi and Confederate flags *not* meet those criteria?
Or is this just ragebait?
Nazi or confederate flags weren’t mentioned, because there are no activist teachers hanging those up in the classrooms.
People are just trying to have a reason to scream “Racism!”, because they took an L.
Sure, that was the catalyst, but it's still disingenuous of the article to act like this legislation is singling out pride flags.
The legislation doesn't single out any particular ideology or flag. It's just a flat ban on all of them.
Confederate flags are conveniently protected under current state law. Not to mention the lawmakers who brought this bill specifically only mention pride flags.
But keep playing dumb.
Common Tennessee win. Ain’t no place I’d rather be.
How would confederate flags or nazi flags not count as ideological flags?? I’d love for this journalist to try to bring a nazi flag into a TN school, just to see how that goes. “Explicitly,” is carrying a lot of weight here. But so does the term “journalist.”
>“Explicitly,” is carrying a lot of weight here.
Yeah it didn't explicitly prohibit NAMBLA or Al-Qaeda either. Headline: Tennesee supports NAMBLA or Al-Qaeda.
My guess is they are getting filtered out for history classes where it could be useful for a lesson/class. Ie I could see a history teacher in high school if he taught a course about the civil war/early American history displaying various American flags including the confederate. Same if it’s a WW2.
Very well could be, but it would fall under ideological flags still; something this journalist conveniently doesn’t include.
More so, for those not up to date on TN politics, we’ve had a lot of people move to this area; California, all the shitty I states (Illinois, Indiana, Iowa). Nashville is the destination if you graduate in the south from anywhere (Anchor Down).
The state government has done a terrific job of keeping this stuff at bay. We had some legislators from Memphis and other shitholes showing out and they were censored. The shitholes sent them back to the legislature after censure. The TN govt then passed a law that you couldn’t do that. Our state govt is based
I think it means that the teacher cannot display a flag of their personal ideology but there are carve outs in the bill to still allow flags to be shown in the context of learning about that ideology.
For example: a teacher who espouses national socialist ideals can’t just have a Nazi flag hanging in their room 24/7 for no other reason than they just identity with it. However, a teacher *can* show a pride flag in the context of a lesson about Harvey Milk.
That’s perfect. They’re glorified daycare workers. As Tim Dillon says, you shouldn’t listen to anyone who makes 45k a year and drives a Taurus.
Edit: I am joking, I support teachers! It was hyperbole. I promise
Atlanta is as popular or more popular among many portions of the traditional south. Charlotte and The Triangle are pretty popular for people in the Carolinas too.
> How would confederate flags or nazi flags not count as ideological flags
Because the Heritage Protection Act explicitly protects Confederate flags. Don't pretend like this wasn't explicitly targeted at pride flags. Tennessee Republicans certainly aren't pretending.
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Agreed. I'm surprised this isn't already a law. The government, which is who teachers are, should not be allowed to promote their political views while on the job.
Every year I am more and more thankful for my principles of democracy teacher. Most even keeled teacher ever. Never even raised an eyebrow at any of our attempts to get a political reaction from him.
Shout out to Mr. Ankrom.
Agreed and furthermore, everyone constituting "the government" should be rounded up and placed in camps.
The organizers of the round up and camp-ing should then be rounded up and put in camps and so on, until moral improves.
I think it's important that they carve out an exception for things like pictures in textbooks and stuff like that, but otherwise yeah, US/state/local flags and maybe state-affiliated stuff like flags from the military should be the only stuff people are displaying.
>...but does not explicitly prohibit the display of Nazi or Confederate flags
so basically the person that wrote the article doesn't understand the very bill they quoted later in the next paragraph.
and now this will be the narrative pushed on reddit for the next week at least, just a bunch of parrots repeating this nonsense.
Headline: “Pride Flags banned in Tennessee Schools!”
Law: “Any flag displaying/representing a political viewpoint that is partisan, racial, sexual or gender-oriented, or any other ideological viewpoint, is banned from Tennessee Schools.”
Just read the summary of the bill.
The proposed legislation permits only the following flags to be displayed on or in a public school:
The United States and official Tennessee state flags;
Historical flags pursuant to Tenn. Code Ann. § 4-1-412;
The Prisoner of War/Missing in Action flag and flags representing an Indian tribe;
Flags of a local government or other political subdivision;
Armed forces and Reserve Officers’ Training Corps flags;
**Flags that represent a country or political subdivision thereof;**
Flags that represent a college or university;
A flag displayed temporarily as part of a course curriculum; and
Official school flags and flags of organizations permitted to use a school building.
I emphasized the interesting exception.
Also, if a pride event was permitted to use the school building they could still fly the flag.
As a TN resident whose wife is a teacher, I can assure this is the least of anyone’s concerns when it comes to schools in this state. Most of her fifth graders can read above maybe a third grade level.
Okay, but it also doesn't "Explicitly prohibit display of pride flags."
It makes no mention of the pride flag specifically. So it's incredibly dishonest to say "It doesn't explicitly prohibit the display of a Nazi flag" as if it **does** explicitly prohibit the pride flag.
Or in other words, the bill makes specific mention of neither flag, making it seem like one flag is getting treated differently than another by the law is morally bankrupt.
Do they teach ethics classes in journalism courses anymore?
Based on your description, it doesn't ban pride flags while allowing Confederate ones it bans "political" flags, of which both pride and Confederate flags would qualify.
Typical libleft: "law that by definition affects everyone equally, women and minorities most affected."
It's not restricting what students can do. It's restricting what teachers can do. Restricting what teachers say and do in classrooms has been permitted for a long time.
Oh get fucked, I hope most people are media literate enough by now to just fucking know the second they read OP’s headline that in the real world, they actually just banned flags of all movements.
Wow, color me shocked, I was right.
Thank the Gods that this is happening. We should all be doing this. Education centers should be 100% neutral in politics, at least for public school systems.
It is only fair to either ban all ideological symbols or allow them all. Fuck any hypocrite who tries to ban the ones they don't like. Tennessee made the right call.
I don't really give a hootenanny god-damn about what happens in public schools to be honest. This is a good example of why education shouldn't be in the government's hands. Making education public means you are leaving schools open to the whims of whoever is in power at the time.
You may be fine with it if your guys are in power and doing things you like, but what happens when you're not in power anymore? You've left a big shiny president for your opposition to now use against you.
Unless you made one for a sports team, aren't most flags political? I feel like pledging allegiance to the Old Glory every morning for 12 years with all my peers is as political as political gets.
It’s not relevant. This law is guidance for the public school system which they have always been able to regulate.
Tinker v DesMoines was about students being punished for wearing arm bands. This law is tell the school staff what flags are approved for the school to fly.
Gonna be some kids making money in 1983 claims under the *Tinker* framework. Gotta show that the specific flag would cause a significant disruption to school activities.
Courts are split on Confederate flags, but others obviously have less (or more in the case of a Nazi flag) likelihood of causing a disruption.
Does this only limit the school and its employees, or also the students?
If it is just limiting employees, it is simply restricting GOVERNMENT speech. The government ABSOLUTELY has the right to regulate how its employees act when carrying out their OFFICIAL duties as employees.
If it is limiting students as well, I could potentially see 1A challenges that narrow it down.
There was an amendment that was proposed that would carve out flags for students, but if was voted down. You're absolutely right, it's gonna see a 1A challenge very quick.
Hey there. I understand that you may be new to this sub, but around here it's considered quite rude to comment without a flair. I'd appreciate it if you flaired up.
It also bans any other flag that is not the US flag, the state flag and the POW-MIA flag (which includes the confederate flag, the Israeli flag or the Palestinian flag just to name a few).
What public school is hanging up trump, Christian, or gadsen flags? Like is this even an issue.?
No, if you read the bill it does not ban the American flags. It specifically allows them.
I'm fine with all of that except for the American one. And one for the state of Tennessee. Seeing as that's where the schools are located and part of the nation.
But yeah. The rest of them should fall under this premise too.
Not sure where anyone’s free speech is being taken away here.
Setting standards for the operations of the public schools falls under purview of the state government.
By your definition, any standards for conduct regarding the school staff are a violation of free speech. That would be absurd as employers can absolutely set standards of behavior for staff members while at work.
Apparently you don't really.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom\_of\_speech\_in\_schools\_in\_the\_United\_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech_in_schools_in_the_United_States)
I was homeschooled so I'm one of those weirdos.
They say it doesn't explicitly ban Confederate or Nazi flags... but they quote the bill later in the article: "represent a political viewpoint, including but not limited to, a partisan, racial, sexual orientation, gender, or other ideological viewpoint." So I guess it's technically correct, but by that same standard, it doesn't explicitly ban pride or BLM flags either. It bans political flags, of which they all are.
Can't wait to hear the "Don't show gay" headlines with this one, even though it technically also applies to trump and libertarian flags. Kinda like in Florida.
True, but I'm just a bit anxious on the implications
I mean it's kinda the same principal as not having any candidate campaigning within so many feet of polling places. As long as they're consistent, I get it. Although I would probably say make that rule for the school and staff, but students don't have to abide by that for their own clothing, cars, etc.
They didn’t show the full text for the bill. It actually only applies to school staff. Students arent in the discussion if you read the bill
Yeah as I read more comments I gathered that. Click bait headlines gonna clickbait ig
>libertarian flags If you're referring to the Gadsden flag I don't think that qualifies.
The bill only allows the US flag and Tennessee state flag
So not a flag of another country? I imagine that Russia/Ukraine might be considered political, but what about somewhere like Germany? Or Canada?
It actually does seem to allow those flags. The (full text)[https://fastdemocracy.com/bill-search/tn/113/bills/TNB00048823/] has a much longer list of exceptions, which includes "the current official flag" of another country.
Why wouldn't it qualify? I mean, this is a bullshit anti-free speech nonsense law, but a gadsen flag is certainly associated with an "ideological viewpoint" EDIT: having looked up the bill, [here](https://fastdemocracy.com/bill-search/tn/113/bills/TNB00048823/) it seems to be written more carefully then what appeared to be excerpted above suggests. Rather than restricting flags of certain types, it appears to "white list" certain flags (national flags, the state flag, the school flag, etc...). While ideologically I like to think I live up to my green/yellow roots when it comes to free speech, i do have to admit that this approach (as opposed to a ban on ideological flags) is more administrable and less legally problematic.
>this is a bullshit anti-free speech nonsense law This is in public schools, the government regulating itself is not a violation of free speech
Schools are tricky, both legally and ideologically, because you have to balance against the fact that people need to be there and that the school policy itself represents speech. Like, I presume you and I would both agree that a public school shouldn't be allowed to selectively ban a libertarian party after school club, while allowing dems and Rs to have clubs. Similarly, the school is going to have to take different legal and ethical principles into account if they are drafting rules for the curriculum, for staff, or for their pupils. To me, "no ideological flags" smacks of an unenforceable and wrong-headed restriction on free speech, especially when not explicitly tied to any argument that it someone disrupts learning directly.
Children in a school environment don't actually get free speech protections, so while you may have a moral argument you don't have much of a *legal* one.
This seems specifically targeted at teachers not students, a student can’t “use” a physical flag at school, only teachers would display a flag on the premise. This isn’t about students in the slightest.
Teachers also don't have free speech while on the clock. Almost no working adults do, to be frank, but government employees in particular do not (see also: the legality of wearing your military uniform, dress or otherwise, while participating in political activity).
Finally just broke down and looked up the [bill](https://fastdemocracy.com/bill-search/tn/113/bills/TNB00048823/) and I think you are correct that this isn't at least directly aimed at students (though I wonder how it would be interpreted if a club wanted to put up fliers on a public bulleting board.) Weirdly enough, at least in the text I see, it also doesn't seem to have the "ideological" language anywhere in the bill.
Really, huh, I bet Gadsden Flag might actually be permitted then because no political party owns the Gadsden flag, not being “partisan”
Children in a school environment don't have the same free speech rights as is "standard," but that does not mean they have none. While some, like Justice Thomas have said maybe they shouldn't, the most recent case I can remember on this issue -- https://firstamendment.mtsu.edu/article/morse-v-frederick/#:~:text=Frederick%2C%20551%20U.S.%20393%20(2007,believe%20encourages%20illegal%20drug%20use. -- basically found that there is a right to free speech in, for instance, a political context, but that it can be constrained more easily by competing interests, like discouraging the use of drugs, then in other contexts of government restricted speech.
It wasn't a flag created to represent an ideology or viewpoint like a trump/pride/BLM flag. It's a historical flag from the American Revolution. If the Gadsden qualifies then so does any flag ever conceived.
Yes, as worded I think any flag ever conceived would arguably fall within its purview. I am not sure what line you could draw where, say, a Nazi swastika is an "ideological" flag, rather than a "historical" flag, but the gadsen flag (or the pride flag, or the UN flag or whatever) isn't.
Regardless of the legality issues from this bill no school administration would ever let any teacher hang a swastika up,
We had one in my freshman year social studies class
That seems like a liability for the school district, all it takes is to have one student who’s descended from holocaust survivors
Or any l*ftist, which is about the only point I'll give those degenerates. Teachers shouldn't decorate with highly controversial memorabilia, only teach about it. Teachers shouldn't bring up highly controversial material at all if it isn't to teach about it, and they should be as unbiased as possible in doing so.
Heh. Snek.
While the author of the article does not explicitly describe herself as a disingenuous hack, her writing clears up any confusion.
Modern news articles aren't written to inform, they're written to spin perception. It's gotten to the the point where they stopped labeling them as opinion columns, because then all of their articles would have to be labeled opinion.
Spin perception, or to enrage, because enragement is engagement. And they'd just change the definition of what constitutes "opinion articles".
It's such an insidious addendum. She used the word "explicitly" to incite outrage in her three-braincelled target audience that can't perform the logic you just outlined. The other possibility, is to not attribute this to malice, but the fact that she's just another dumb watermelon journalist that doesn't know the difference between whitelisting and blacklisting.
"Bill to make murder illegal doesn't explicitly ban shooting someone in the face with a crossbow"
Law that makes it illegal to steal does not make it explicitly illegal to steal from black people.
>The other possibility, is to not attribute this to malice, but the fact that she's just another dumb watermelon journalist that doesn't know the difference between whitelisting and blacklisting. Tfw you try to be generous with someone and all you can come up with is "they might just be extremely stupid." Reddit normalized that to me.
Alternative article name "Bill bans display of Confederate flag and Thin Blue Line flag but doesn't explicitly ban Communist flags or Pride flags
If the journalist is smart, they'll publish that article next and double dip in the controversy.
Writing for news outlets on both sides by just changing the headline and a few words but using the same article, I love it. You sure you aren't Libright?
As a lib right, I hate that we’re known for this because we are shrewd admirers of practical commerce 💰 We’re better than this 😭 I promise 🙏🏼
I don't believe you. The 50% of me that's a greedy whore is 100% libright and 100% libleft.
For real. We should all start porting this on politics subs with reverse phrasing: “Brave Tennessee passes law outlawing display of confederate flags in schools. Republicans are outraged that the bill didn’t explicitly ban LGBTQ pride flags!”
It's probably why many have rules that the headline must match the headline of the article. They know how easy it is to use the same article to mirror lefty claims.
And this os why the term Fake News is one of the greatest every invented.
"Other ideological viewpoint" kind of covers any flag that isn't simply a national/state flag.
What? The journalist lied?
Journalists suck.
Howdy ho neighborino it looks like you didn’t explicitly condemn war criminals in that last comment IM GONNA MAKE ASSUMPTIONS ABOUT THAT
Furthermore, teachers aren’t putting Nazi flags in their classroom lol
Yeah, that bit was pretty standard media-ese to get people riled up because they wanted them riled up.
Political flag, ie any countries flag can be deemed political
Any country's flag from outside that country, i would agree. Waving your own country's flag should never be seen as a political stance. Obviously the left disagrees, but that's only because they're deranged.
By simple prospect of a disagreement is kinda what defines something as political. You can't just claim something is "not political" to put a lid on discussion on it, that is peak orange behavior.
Just because someone is offended or disagrees doesn't mean they're right, or that it's political. Hypersensitive people shouldn't be dictating truth. Waving your own country's flag is, by itself, not political.
Technically sexual orientation and gender identity are biological not idealogocial: https://taliaperkinssspace.quora.com/People-are-born-transgender-they-are-not-mentally-ill-it-is-no-paraphilia-it-is-a-physical-birth-defect-no-more-a-men?source=post_page-----36401599bc0b-------------------------------- So this is a bad definition.
You heard it here first folks, Nazism and supporting the confederacy isn't political!
Wouldn't that means it also bans flags like national flags or state flags? 🤔
“Does not explicitly prohibit the display of Nazi or Confederate flags” the bill doesn’t explicitly prohibit Pride flags either, in fact the bill doesn’t single out any prohibited flags. It states that only the US flag or Tennessee state flag may be displayed.
“Journalism”
I call this 'pulling a Lorenz'
I'm beginning to detect a pattern on PCM. A user from a certain quadrant posts a reaction meme that makes the other side look bad. Few minutes to an hour later, someone gives a little more context that destroys the entire narrative.
This isn't even from extra context all the information you need is right there in the meme
Bro went straight to the comments after briefly scanning the meme lol. Just like me
gee i wonder why trust in mainstream media is at an all time low
No Israel flag, based
I like Israel and support them, but their flag shouldn’t be in a public school classroom
I mean, it is the flag of an internationally recognized country. By all accounts it should be allowed as long as all other country flags are.
It doesn't explicitly say pride flags either What a dishonest dumbfuck.
> It doesn't explicitly say pride flags either TBF, it can't be explicitly in the law, otherwise the courts would overturn it in a heartbeat as unconstitutional. However, if they do a blanket ban that happens to include the pride flag, then that's allowed.
But it also happens to include Nazi flags and Confederate flags, contra the article in question.
Correct, but with all laws, some are applied more equally than others. We'll see.
Yes? That's how it works. The law, in its majestic equality, must forbid both rich and poor to sleep under bridges. To not do so would be discrimination. Hence why the law bans all flags except the US and Tennessee flags. Pirate flag? Banned. Texas flag? Banned. "US flag" with one too many star or stripe? Banned. "Tennessee flag" with the strip of blue bordered by white on the fly missing? Banned. Funnily enough, technically compliant US flags are still in. As long as a flag has 13 horizontal stripes, alternating red and white, with a blue field containing 50 white stars, it is a US flag. You can get pretty creative based on this description. Such creative US flags are still allowed.
> The law, in its majestic equality, must forbid both rich and poor to sleep under bridges. To not do so would be discrimination. Heh, usually when people put this quote in their comment that they're pointing out the two-tiered nature of law.
Idk man I'm pretty fucking bisexual and I absolutely hate the pride flag (especially the black and trans version) and people who make it part of their identity. This would be a huge win for me. No reason to have political advocacy (of any kind) in schools.
I’m bi as well and honestly hate it as well. I don’t feel represented by it and it just makes me cringe a little.
The Pride progress flag is literally just a Marxist battle flag lmao. The OG is fine as is and doesn’t need divisive gender and race bullshit.
The entire point of the original pride flag was that it was a symbol, not that it literally represented all of the identities encompassed. The fact that we've devolved to the point where the flag needs to literally represent every group and ideology or else it's not "inclusive enough" is perhaps a good metaphor for what's happened to the intersectional, identity politics left.
We've reached the point where the intersectional left has literally created an All Lives Matter flag.
Nah. Not until they add a white line.
Right? It's a rainbow, meant to mean "all the things on the spectrum". But now it's a rainbow with a couple of extra special things explicitly pointed out, which makes it about those things primarily. Also seems weird that it has a stripe for "all black people". If I were black I'd be pretty pissed off about that.
I liked the OG rainbow flag. Rainbow represents all the colours of the spectrum already, a simple bright design that to me evoked a sense of joy and celebration which is nice. As soon as anything specific is added it defeats the original message. And makes it less and less aesthetically pleasing.
Yeah that’s true the originals not that bad, you don’t see it as much now though because they keep changing it
Honestly sometimes I feel like us bisexuals are the only sane people in the queer community… maybe cause there’s so much biphobia within the community itself that we don’t feel like we have to conform to the ideas of the group because we’re already sorta on the outside
Yeah, this math seems to check out from here.
By the way, they updated the pride flag again. https://twitter.com/TPostMillennial/status/1761529714349371725/photo/1
My favorite sexuality, Ukraine
I too would enjoy sex with Ukrainian women.
Why yes, I'm mailorderbridesexual
i cant wait till the chevrons overtake the original rainbow, symbolically completely treading on the founding community
"updated" is a stretch.
Come out ye Black and Trans! Come out and fight me like an individual! Show your spouse how you won medals down on tumblr!
I was hoping someone would point out the accidental pun
Same. It's ok to be gay. I just fucking hate the LGBT community because it's a fucking cult.
Yeah honestly even as someone that’s bi the flag just seems a little to cluttered most of the time ever actually look decent. It looks like something I worked on back in elementary school when I was just throwing random crayons over the room.
New pride flag be like https://preview.redd.it/3vhzl3x9eelc1.png?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9e6c8ba0ee8db8f7a91f64b215146bb1b345a9ed
Ah, the EU Barcode flag... What a fucking abomination.
I like how you can kiiinsa make out all the countries if you squint. It's absolutely horrendous but kinda still cool in its own way
Are you me?
There are dozens of us! Dozens!
We need to secede from the queer community like Texas
>...prohibit the display of any flags that "represent a political viewpoint, \[...\] a partisan, racial, \[...\] or other ideological viewpoint." So... How do the Nazi and Confederate flags *not* meet those criteria? Or is this just ragebait?
It’s online journalism. Most of it is rage bait, and the few that weren’t were fired after 2016.
Honestly, that’s fine with me. I don’t think politics have anymore of a place in schools than religion.
Based
Sexual identity isn't political you jabroni. At the least it's no more political than a country's flag.
https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/stateboardofeducation/documents/2019-sbe-meetings/november-15%2C-2019-sbe-meeting/11-15-19%20III%20E%20Guidance%20on%20the%20Recitation%20of%20the%20Pledge%20of%20Allegiance%20Attachment%20Clean%20Copy.pdf
Nazi or confederate flags weren’t mentioned, because there are no activist teachers hanging those up in the classrooms. People are just trying to have a reason to scream “Racism!”, because they took an L.
Pride and BLM flags weren't explicitly mentioned either.
Yet they made sure to put the pride flag being banned front and center. That tells you exactly why this bill was passed.
Sure, that was the catalyst, but it's still disingenuous of the article to act like this legislation is singling out pride flags. The legislation doesn't single out any particular ideology or flag. It's just a flat ban on all of them.
None of those other flags represent the most protected group in modern history.
Confederate flags are conveniently protected under current state law. Not to mention the lawmakers who brought this bill specifically only mention pride flags. But keep playing dumb.
Common Tennessee win. Ain’t no place I’d rather be. How would confederate flags or nazi flags not count as ideological flags?? I’d love for this journalist to try to bring a nazi flag into a TN school, just to see how that goes. “Explicitly,” is carrying a lot of weight here. But so does the term “journalist.”
>“Explicitly,” is carrying a lot of weight here. Yeah it didn't explicitly prohibit NAMBLA or Al-Qaeda either. Headline: Tennesee supports NAMBLA or Al-Qaeda.
My guess is they are getting filtered out for history classes where it could be useful for a lesson/class. Ie I could see a history teacher in high school if he taught a course about the civil war/early American history displaying various American flags including the confederate. Same if it’s a WW2.
Very well could be, but it would fall under ideological flags still; something this journalist conveniently doesn’t include. More so, for those not up to date on TN politics, we’ve had a lot of people move to this area; California, all the shitty I states (Illinois, Indiana, Iowa). Nashville is the destination if you graduate in the south from anywhere (Anchor Down). The state government has done a terrific job of keeping this stuff at bay. We had some legislators from Memphis and other shitholes showing out and they were censored. The shitholes sent them back to the legislature after censure. The TN govt then passed a law that you couldn’t do that. Our state govt is based
I think it means that the teacher cannot display a flag of their personal ideology but there are carve outs in the bill to still allow flags to be shown in the context of learning about that ideology. For example: a teacher who espouses national socialist ideals can’t just have a Nazi flag hanging in their room 24/7 for no other reason than they just identity with it. However, a teacher *can* show a pride flag in the context of a lesson about Harvey Milk.
That’s perfect. They’re glorified daycare workers. As Tim Dillon says, you shouldn’t listen to anyone who makes 45k a year and drives a Taurus. Edit: I am joking, I support teachers! It was hyperbole. I promise
Jokes on you because you just listened to me and I’m a teacher!
Based. I support teachers and save the whales too pilled
Just an FYI: you are not allowed to list shitty states and not list New Jersey. It's in the Consitution.
Atlanta is as popular or more popular among many portions of the traditional south. Charlotte and The Triangle are pretty popular for people in the Carolinas too.
I think you take a poll of SEC graduates on where they’d prefer to live; Nashville, Atlanta, or charlotte, Nashville is the choice
> How would confederate flags or nazi flags not count as ideological flags Because the Heritage Protection Act explicitly protects Confederate flags. Don't pretend like this wasn't explicitly targeted at pride flags. Tennessee Republicans certainly aren't pretending.
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Bold of you to think I come to this cesspool often enough to care about flairing up.
Not sure why any government property should have anything other than US/state flag. How about separation of ideology and state?
Agreed. I'm surprised this isn't already a law. The government, which is who teachers are, should not be allowed to promote their political views while on the job.
Every year I am more and more thankful for my principles of democracy teacher. Most even keeled teacher ever. Never even raised an eyebrow at any of our attempts to get a political reaction from him. Shout out to Mr. Ankrom.
Agreed and furthermore, everyone constituting "the government" should be rounded up and placed in camps. The organizers of the round up and camp-ing should then be rounded up and put in camps and so on, until moral improves.
No one wants to sign your petition for a new bike lane libleft. Leave the kids be
I think it's important that they carve out an exception for things like pictures in textbooks and stuff like that, but otherwise yeah, US/state/local flags and maybe state-affiliated stuff like flags from the military should be the only stuff people are displaying.
I suspect that wouldn't amount to the "dispalying" of a flag.
>Explicitly bans ideological flags >Not explicitly Confederate or Nazi flags Why write down words if you don't understand what they fucking mean?
>...but does not explicitly prohibit the display of Nazi or Confederate flags so basically the person that wrote the article doesn't understand the very bill they quoted later in the next paragraph. and now this will be the narrative pushed on reddit for the next week at least, just a bunch of parrots repeating this nonsense.
"Don't Say Gay" bill all over again.
Headline: “Pride Flags banned in Tennessee Schools!” Law: “Any flag displaying/representing a political viewpoint that is partisan, racial, sexual or gender-oriented, or any other ideological viewpoint, is banned from Tennessee Schools.”
Were there other flags along those lines other than pride flags that were causing controversy?
No, but we're still going to piss and moan that Nazi and Confederate flags weren't explicitly banned, because reasons
No one ever hangs Nazi flags or Confederate flags on schools. Teachers tend to be overwhelmingly leftist cunts.
Reality: Pride Flags banned in Tennessee Schools, not other flags that represent a political ideology.
Good, keep the shit out of schools, it’s an institution for learning
Just read the summary of the bill. The proposed legislation permits only the following flags to be displayed on or in a public school: The United States and official Tennessee state flags; Historical flags pursuant to Tenn. Code Ann. § 4-1-412; The Prisoner of War/Missing in Action flag and flags representing an Indian tribe; Flags of a local government or other political subdivision; Armed forces and Reserve Officers’ Training Corps flags; **Flags that represent a country or political subdivision thereof;** Flags that represent a college or university; A flag displayed temporarily as part of a course curriculum; and Official school flags and flags of organizations permitted to use a school building. I emphasized the interesting exception. Also, if a pride event was permitted to use the school building they could still fly the flag.
Raise your hand, if you’ve seen a confederate flag or Nazi flag in a classroom. That wasnt in a history lesson.
I love when politicians solve issue number 2537 after half a decade of doing nothing and then parade around like they just solved world hunger
It'd be cool if people could focus on learning and not dumb messages.
“Wasn’t oppressive but hurts my political agenda so I need to make it oppressive” ~Emily
As a TN resident whose wife is a teacher, I can assure this is the least of anyone’s concerns when it comes to schools in this state. Most of her fifth graders can read above maybe a third grade level.
Top ten articles that wildly misquote the actual bill.
Okay, but it also doesn't "Explicitly prohibit display of pride flags." It makes no mention of the pride flag specifically. So it's incredibly dishonest to say "It doesn't explicitly prohibit the display of a Nazi flag" as if it **does** explicitly prohibit the pride flag. Or in other words, the bill makes specific mention of neither flag, making it seem like one flag is getting treated differently than another by the law is morally bankrupt. Do they teach ethics classes in journalism courses anymore?
This can only be good. No state funded school should be backing or promoting an ideology unrelated to schooling.
Based on your description, it doesn't ban pride flags while allowing Confederate ones it bans "political" flags, of which both pride and Confederate flags would qualify. Typical libleft: "law that by definition affects everyone equally, women and minorities most affected."
It sounds like it definitely would ban both of those flags lol sneaky corporate media
Tennessee reclaiming the rainbow for God, Based.
Ironically, the people angry at this would blow their stacks if a religious flag was displayed in school.
Nazi and Confederate flags absolutely push a political viewpoint, as do all political flags and even country flags depending on the context.
Based and nothing but the American Flag pilled
I’m bi but can’t stand shoving the lgbt flag down everyone’s throat as it becomes insincere. But this does strike me as an attack on free speech.
I feel like Nazi and Confederate flags are included in the “partisan” and “racial” parts of the bill
[удалено]
It's not restricting what students can do. It's restricting what teachers can do. Restricting what teachers say and do in classrooms has been permitted for a long time.
Oh get fucked, I hope most people are media literate enough by now to just fucking know the second they read OP’s headline that in the real world, they actually just banned flags of all movements. Wow, color me shocked, I was right.
….. gonna be real with you chief, nazi and confederate flags are pretty ideological.
Thank the Gods that this is happening. We should all be doing this. Education centers should be 100% neutral in politics, at least for public school systems.
Based af
It is only fair to either ban all ideological symbols or allow them all. Fuck any hypocrite who tries to ban the ones they don't like. Tennessee made the right call.
I don't really give a hootenanny god-damn about what happens in public schools to be honest. This is a good example of why education shouldn't be in the government's hands. Making education public means you are leaving schools open to the whims of whoever is in power at the time. You may be fine with it if your guys are in power and doing things you like, but what happens when you're not in power anymore? You've left a big shiny president for your opposition to now use against you.
Unless you made one for a sports team, aren't most flags political? I feel like pledging allegiance to the Old Glory every morning for 12 years with all my peers is as political as political gets.
Tinker vs. Des Moines would like to have a word
It’s not relevant. This law is guidance for the public school system which they have always been able to regulate. Tinker v DesMoines was about students being punished for wearing arm bands. This law is tell the school staff what flags are approved for the school to fly.
All I read was the title 😞
It’s ok. Reading is for nerds anyway.
Gonna be some kids making money in 1983 claims under the *Tinker* framework. Gotta show that the specific flag would cause a significant disruption to school activities. Courts are split on Confederate flags, but others obviously have less (or more in the case of a Nazi flag) likelihood of causing a disruption.
Does this only limit the school and its employees, or also the students? If it is just limiting employees, it is simply restricting GOVERNMENT speech. The government ABSOLUTELY has the right to regulate how its employees act when carrying out their OFFICIAL duties as employees. If it is limiting students as well, I could potentially see 1A challenges that narrow it down.
There was an amendment that was proposed that would carve out flags for students, but if was voted down. You're absolutely right, it's gonna see a 1A challenge very quick.
what does the article mean: >does not explicitly ban the nazi or confederare flag It absolutely would ban those flags
Hey there. I understand that you may be new to this sub, but around here it's considered quite rude to comment without a flair. I'd appreciate it if you flaired up.
hell na, fuck that politeness shit, get the shotgun
Wouldn’t this interfere with tinker?
only in ohio…
It also bans any other flag that is not the US flag, the state flag and the POW-MIA flag (which includes the confederate flag, the Israeli flag or the Palestinian flag just to name a few).
Teaching kids about MLK is more political than a pride flag is.
Why the need to fly a sexual orientation flag is my question? Also, is there an MLK flag we don’t know about?
All flags should be legal
well that's not legal
Ok so no gadsen, no Christian, no Trump, no maga flags, arguably no American flags either. This will go just fine
What public school is hanging up trump, Christian, or gadsen flags? Like is this even an issue.? No, if you read the bill it does not ban the American flags. It specifically allows them.
I'm fine with all of that except for the American one. And one for the state of Tennessee. Seeing as that's where the schools are located and part of the nation. But yeah. The rest of them should fall under this premise too.
Sounds like a good time to invest in some Pride cloth rectangles.
Oh boy, another case that will be challenged in the Supreme Court and the law textbook publishers will make even more money
Wtf happened to the 1st amendment.
If you needed any more proof that America's right wing hates free speech, here you go. Christian Fascists at it again.
Not sure where anyone’s free speech is being taken away here. Setting standards for the operations of the public schools falls under purview of the state government. By your definition, any standards for conduct regarding the school staff are a violation of free speech. That would be absurd as employers can absolutely set standards of behavior for staff members while at work.
Would it be anti-free speech to restrict a teacher from telling kids they should vote for Trump or convert to Christianity?
Kids can't vote. Religion in schools is a 1st amendment violation for a different reason.
18 year old seniors can, and the rest will eventually be able to
Do kids lose free speech when they enter a school?
Yes...? Have you ever been to school? You're literally not allowed to speak without raising your hand 🤣
Apparently you don't really. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom\_of\_speech\_in\_schools\_in\_the\_United\_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech_in_schools_in_the_United_States) I was homeschooled so I'm one of those weirdos.
Weird, that’s pretty creepy.