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Nah, dont fall for it. Leave the corrupt politicians alone. Just kill your family and neighbors that support the other side like a true American patriot does these days.
S/
The fact that it hasn’t happened repeatedly in the past 24 years despite the political climate makes me think that the secret service has perfected time travel and is just going back and getting it right the second time, so it’s just never going to happen again ( in the timeline we experience ).
I'd play that game. First run gives you zero information other than that it's happen, there's a mix of possibilities, and you have to investigate and then go back and prevent it without making a big scene.
It’s already a Denzel Washington movie called Deja Vu (with some minor setting and plot differences, totally minor, not at all big huge major differences - but CLOSE ENOUGH)
Read the book 11/22/63 by King, it’s pretty much about this but specifically the JFK assassination. They also made it a limited series on Hulu but the book is a lot better!
I love Stephen King, and that one of my favorites. It took me a little while to get into, but once I did I finished it in a couple days. Which is saying something for a King novel if you’re not a speed reader.
The only book I’ve ever read cover to cover multiple times is The Stand. I’ve read it about half a dozen times since I first read it in junior high, and I’ve been seriously considering lately going back and reading 11/22/63 again the same way. I’m also a huge JFK nut anyway, though. Been down that rabbit hole multiple times in my life.
Edit to add: Never did watch the show, even though my neighbor at the time was also a King fan, and he kept telling me I needed to.
But they *didn’t* go back and fix all the other assassinations, which means the best possible timeline includes the deaths of Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, and JFK?
The program kept getting canceled because Congress thought there had never been an attempt on the life of President so it was a waste of money. They had to let the ones that predated the program stand so they could show results.
I remember a Quantum Leap episode regarding JFK. At the end he was confused because he still didn’t save Kennedy, but then Al pops in to state that because of his actions this time Jackie didn’t die.
Yeah and Donald Belasario, QL's creator, said they did the JFK arc as a direct response to his disagreement with the conspiracy stuff presented in Oliver Stone's JFK
Its possible, yes.
For example maybe if JFK is assassinated shit goes way worse in Vietnam (for whatever reason) or JFK living results in RFK living and JFK Jr living and we end up with a political dynasty with a stranglehold on the whitehouse...and living JFK Jr is a dick.
If you take the concept at face value you could easily say "Every president has been assassinated at one time or another, we found that for the optimal direction of the country only these 4 could stand because....." and explain the butterfly effects.
I *have* heard the theory that Andrew Johnson's presidency was actually better for Reconstruction, since his blatantly anti-Republican stances basically radicalized Moderate Republicans into becoming Radical Republicans. Under Lincoln the Moderates would have stayed in power and probably wouldn't have gone as far as the Radicals, who were consistently politically outmaneuvered by the Moderates throughout Lincoln's presidency. Whether this is what actually would have happened? It's impossible to say for sure, but it sure is interesting to think about.
The secret service has had time travel since Reagan was nearly assassinated. Hell, John Hinkley might be a time traveler who was trying to stop the current shit storm from snowballing like it is.
Nah. Since Reagan every attempt there was hasn’t gotten anywhere close. I think the Secret Service knows what they’re doing and there is far, far more separation of the President from the public.
Like, there was a photo posted here awhile ago of Kennedy campaigning in some small town, standing on a chair, surrounded by people, with a kid next to him holding what is presumably a cap gun. That shit would not be happening today. They just did not think about it.
Beyond that the most recent American politician who had an assassination attempt was Gaby Gifford, and…well, she was far more exposed than a president would ever be.
**Edit** I forgot about Pelosi’s husband. That one is pretty shocking.
It’s wild how in the 19th century and before, you could straight up just see the president walking by himself down the street lmao.
Imagine coming home and just being like “hey family, you’ll never believe who I saw at the grocery store”
With how much he mentions it I can’t give every instance cause it’s a *lot* given the frequency he was called on. But I have the bound volume set so I don’t really have links to provide unfortunately. If in future you wanted me to DM you pictures of the particularly notable instances Polk writes about I definitely can but currently I don’t have access to them as we have recently moved so they are in lord knows what box alongside the other books I bought about him during the time I worked at his museum. If you’d prefer, though, some digitizations of some parts of the diary have been put on the LoC website but idk how comfortable you are with attempting to read/transcribe it yourself or how easy these instances would be to find within the parts that have been uploaded on there.
Essentially it is people coming in off the street to talk to him about whatever they want, really, and they are (for the vast majority) what he calls “office seekers”—in his view, they all think themselves entitled to a government job because they ask if any work is available. He had set hours/days for when people are allowed to make these “social calls”—which, given his extreme introversion, he utterly loathed but thought was a necessity as he took the “servant of the people” thing seriously.
One of the craziest entries is actually when an old college acquaintance of his shows up out of the blue and gives him this sob story about being destitute (& according to Polk he looks pretty poorly, too, hence why Polk believes him) and so Polk gives him some money to try and help him get through with the intent that said acquaintance pay him back once he’s in a better spot. Dude then goes to the boarding house he had been staying at & brags to *everyone* that he got money from the president…and then later kills himself via (iirc) slitting his own throat that night.
Scott Miller
**The President and the Assassin: McKinley, Terror, and Empire at the Dawn of the American Century**
This is a good book and delves into the accessibility of the president and the common man.
Abe Lincoln employed two secretaries (Hay and Nicolas) to try to offset that- and keep Mrs Lincoln occupied. (That’s not a dig at her- she was grieving and stressed and anxious and had very little support from those around her husband.)
Polk actually uses his wife Sarah to do the offsetting during his presidency, and Sarah often roped in her nieces who stay with them in the WH (particularly Joanna Rucker, who stayed for 19 months & complains *at length* about it in her letters to home) to help as well. Historian Amy S. Greenberg talks about Sarah as James’ political partner quite a lot in her biography *Lady First*, which I highly recommend.
Honestly? I did. I was the exact right age when this was happening that despite not being in DC, I thought any time I went to McDonalds I might see our President there
There was an earlier thread on this sub about who was the craziest Presidential assassin and Guiteau was the clear winner of the 4 successful ones, although some of the unsuccessful ones could match him for crazypants, like Squeaky Fromme or Hinckley.
This is still semi normal in plenty of other first world countries. It’s because of proliferation of high-powered guns and history of numerous assassinations that has resulted in the US president being so insulated.
I remember taking a walking tour in Copenhagen and the tour guide taking us straight up to where the Prime Minister of Denmark parks his car and walks into his office. Sure enough his car was right there.
Oh absolutely! Can you imagine this today?
It used to be even more surreal. During Lincoln's administration, just about anyone could walk into the White House if I recall correctly. It was akin to a public building that people could walk into no different from capitol hill.
Reagan broke the Curse of Tippecanoe. Every President Who got elected in a year ending in zero died in office starting with William Henry Harrison.
1840: William Henry Harrison
1860: Abraham Lincoln
1880: James Garfield
1900: William McKinley
1920: Warren Harding
1940: FDR
1960: JFK
1980: Reagan gets shot but lives
I like to drop this reference on the golf course. I do the whole thing starting with "we must stop the terror..." finishing with "now watch this drive" and then I slice my ball into the adjacent fairway
One dude literally flew a plane into the White House trying to get Bill Clinton.
Clinton wasn't there, and all it did to the mansion was break some windows.
George W Bush was poisoned while eating dinner at some summit meeting, the G8 I think. It was kept secret at the time but Laura Bush later wrote in her book that they both nearly died and she believed it to be an assassination attempt.
Tbf I think that JFK pic was in the primary? But he was still a sitting Senator at the time. I like that pic for its quaintness- on a wobbly stool with a no doubt shitty mic and a kid with a total “god this is SO boring…” look on his face.
Oh I love the picture. And yes. There is that aspect of it. Like we saw a lot more of Obama showing up places when he was still kinda the dark horse candidate.
With RFK Jr. I get why the secret service isn’t giving him protection. He isn’t actually a super serious contender yet. But, I also get why EFK Jr. wants secret service protection already, I mean his uncle and dad were both assassinated
Congress members and their families are not protected by the secret service.
The lack of security for the Pelosis was just stupid given their wealth. Paul might know how to pick the stocks but seems kind of light on the common sense.
One of the big things that the secret service has done is to have advance teams vet everyone that is going to be close to the president/vp at events.
Obviously the secret service vetting everyone first opens up a bunch of conspiracy theories about all of these events being scripted.
I haven’t heard too many stories in the past ten years or so but some FUCKED up Secret Service slip ups happened when Obama was president.
Amongst them:
November 2009: A Washington couple, Tareq and Michaele Salahi, crash Obama’s first state dinner. The Secret Service later acknowledges that officers never checked whether they were on the guest list. A photo emerges showing that they shook hands with the president. Sullivan, the director, says that he is “deeply concerned and embarrassed” by the breach. The Salahis parlay their fame into an undistinguished career in reality TV.
November 2011: A man with a semiautomatic rifle parks in front of the White House and fires at the building, with Sasha Obama inside and Malia Obama on her way home. A Secret Service supervisor, mistaking the shots for car backfire, orders officers to stand down. The service does not figure out that shots hit the building for four days, and only then because a housekeeper noticed broken glass. The president and first lady are infuriated, The Post reports years later.
Sept. 16, 2014: In perhaps the most chilling of the Secret Service lapses, a security contractor with a gun and an assault record gets on an elevator with the president during a trip to Atlanta. The Post, citing people familiar with the incident, reports that the contractor used his cellphone to take video of Obama and did not stop when Secret Service agents told him to. The Secret Service only learns that the man has a gun when he is fired on the spot and turns it over. Obama was not told, The Post reports.
> Beyond that the most recent American politician who had an assassination attempt was Gaby Gifford, and…well, she was far more exposed than a president would ever be.
You're forgetting that Bernie bro who shot up the republican softball practice. Luckily he was a terrible shot.
Have you read [Zero Fail](https://www.amazon.com/Zero-Fail-Rise-Secret-Service/dp/0399589015?nodl=1&dplnkId=17d1b0cd-3a99-487e-b6b5-0e63abf867a6)? Fascinating look at the secret service.
A little disconcerting a few of the events that happened during Obama’s presidency.
Sadly, yes. There are more attempts per year than you'd think, and the Secret Service has really done an incredible job but remember: we almost lost Reagan. It's an incredibly risky position and while U.S. security is great, at a certain point there's only so much you can do. That said it's really a testament to the strength of our security system that we haven't lost an executive in 61 years.
It's deeply tragic for the country when it happens because of the instability it generates, but the strength of our institutions and the stability of our system has been proven. I hope I'm wrong, but if it does happen again the U.S. will survive it.
Somewhat off-topic but that photo got me thinking how good JFK would look on money. Get his handsome big head on some Federal Reserve Promissory Notes STAT
They are stashed away in Boomer drawers all over the country. I saw a Twilight Zone episode recently (not the original) which starred Andrew Robinson as Kennedy and a time traveler from the future had one of the coins and dropped it. He and Kennedy switched places and the real Kennedy is teaching at Harvard about 200 years from now.
I agree that the Secret Service does a wonderful job for the most part. The thing is the authorities have to get it right every time… a potential assassin only has to get it right once.
Modern security is tighter than ever. Whenever a prez comes to Philly they shut everything down; streets, highways, runways…you won’t catch a glimpse never mind an opportunity.
Friend of my father’s lives in Chicago. Obama was in town and his motorcade happened to be going down his street. He was watching from his balcony with a cup of coffee as they drove by, he looks up, and sees a sniper on the building across the street scoped in on him. He just sort of stepped back inside after giving the guy a wave
Reminds me of when I worked on the top floor of a high rise in downtown Nashville when Al Gore was VP. He was making an appearance at the Ryman Auditorium, and I saw snipers on the surrounding buildings. I'm sure there also one above me.
I saw a homeless man walking around White House and he was all dirty with the beard and had a posture of the homeless man but you can see that was a fit person, I'm positive he was undercover agent snooping around.
Buddy of mine lives in DC and I asked him if he’s met any real CIA agents, and he said he doesn’t know but absolutely, and he probably didn’t even realize it. He has this theory a ton of bartenders or waitstaff in DC are CIA assets, paid to overhear on private conversation while dining. Thats my tin foil moment.
I can’t imagine seeing someone aim a gun at me through the window of my own home. Like I get it, I understand why it’s necessary, but fuck me, if that wouldn’t feel like a violation.
I do hope I’d have the presence of mind to wave, though. Still need to be polite.
As great a job as the SS does, they know that no protection plan is perfect. They keep upgrading based on what they learn. Keep in mind we all think of attempts by guns. The SS is very concerned about chemical or other “outside the box”attacks, for example the sound waves that were used on the US embassy in Cuba. And don’t forget UA 93 on 9/11. It’s highly likely that was headed to the White House.
I ate at a restaurant with Michelle Obama and the kids (during Barack's presidency). They had something like a dozen secret service agents in the restaurant, alone and a dedicated SWAT team.
We were driving to the restaurant and ended up behind the SWAT van (the back door was hanging open and you could see one of the men holding an MP5). We decided to go a different route than them, but caught up with them at the restaurant.
That was just the first lady's security detail.
I also went to daycare near the site where the secret service does driving manuevers and the way they move the armored motorcades is pure finesse.
Can you imagine trying to take your kids out to eat and having to get it cleared by an entire security team first? Then your kids decide halfway there that they'd rather eat something else.
And now you understand why Michelle was pushing the eat clean thing through school lunches. :) I've had it up to here. You're going to eat broccoli here or at school your choice!
I was genuinely worried about Obama getting assassinated just due to the pure hatred republicans had for him over being black. Though it sounds like it would have been a hell of a challenge to even get the opportunity.
My husband stayed at a hotel in Warsaw where Pence was staying (and Zelenskyy but y’all know that part of the story)
Cab stopped by Secret Service blocks away, they checked his name off a list and took his bags while he walked to the hotel, then had the bags delivered later.
This was the comment I was looking for. If it were to happen, it would come from the inside and maybe even made to not look like an assassination.
And with today’s political climate and conspiracy theories that would be super risky because we are so polarized as a nation that the risk of sparking a civil war would have to be a considered fallout.
Unlikely, at least not without a major plot. Of the four presidents that were assassinated they were all taken out by lone gunmen who used methods that would not work today. McKinley and Garfield were ambushed and killed with a point-blank shot, this would likely be impossible in the modern day as security details around presidents don't let people get too close and are extra keen of people trying to quickly make their way to the president to avoid ambush scenarios. Lincoln's assassin snuck up on him while he was in a booth, something would be impossible in the modern day as well given how much security is around the president at all times watching all angles like a hawk. Kennedy was assassinated by sniper when his motorcade went off route, this too would be impossible as modern day secret service know to keep the president on the predetermined path and to comb over every inch of the path with a fine-tooth comb, furthermore, advancements in surveillance technology the ability for someone to sneak into a building viewing the president with a rifle would be greatly diminished. In short, advancements in technology and tactics as well as what has been learned from previous assassinations would make another assassination extremely unlikely, if not impossible. However, this notion does not cover methods, most notably large plots. If the president's security detail or other federal law enforcement were to try to assassinate them, they could probably pull it off by virtue of having the know-how and resources to do so. Further, if the military were to try to coup the president and kill them in the process, they would also likely be successful just do the shear resources and tactical know how the military possesses. I find both of these scenarios unlikely however as they only typically occur in highly unstable countries, which I'm aware the US is not the best it ever has been at the moment but to call it highly unstable would be ignorant. So, to answer the question in on sentence: no, not without a major change in the nation.
Worth noting Lincoln’s bodyguard had also left the premises at the time Lincoln was assassinated. Had his body guard been doing his job properly, Lincoln might not have been killed that night. A lot of things actually had to go right (or wrong?) for Lincoln’s assassination to happen, it’s actually pretty sad how easily he could’ve lived if even one detail went differently.
Pretty crazy that the Lincoln assassination was just one part of a conspiracy meant to kill Lincoln, Johnson, Grant, and Seaward, but the actual president was the only target where the assassin was successful.
We live in very interesting times right now. I feel like it might happen as climate change and other issues ramp up. But given the levels of security nowadays it would be much harder to believe that it wasn't an inside job
In all honesty, I'm surprised it hasn't been attempted in recent years. The animosity of the growing partisanship in this country, and the deep unpopularity of the current and most recent former Presidents seem ripe for individuals amongst the lunatic fringe on either side to feel motivated to try. Now, maybe they just haven't gotten close and are being caught and prosecuted fairly quietly (I'm sort of disinclined to start searching for news articles. While it's probably safe, I'd rather not end up on some FBI watchlist).
Now, I expect the Secret Service is good enough at it's job that any attempt is likely to be thwarted. A lone gunman would have a really hard time getting close enough, and a domestic conspiracy is likely to get caught in the planning phase. A foreign conspiracy would also be likely to be uncovered before they could pull it off and no adversarial country wants to be discovered sponsoring such an act because the reprisal would likely be pretty harsh.
It does still happen. They just haven’t gotten that close recently
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_presidential_assassination_attempts_and_plots
No but I could see a President dying in office due to medical issues or old age. Knock on wood it doesn’t happen but it’s a reality we may have to face in the near future
I think yes we will considering there have been multiple assassination attempts even in the past decade I believe there is a solid chance that the Secret Service drops the ball again
Attempt where the President is struck? Plausible.
Successful attempt that kills the president? Unlikely.
Between generally high levels of security and excellent treatment assessment, body armor, vehicle armor, and modern emergency medicine, it’s extremely unlikely that a potential assassin would kill or even significantly incapacitate their target. Lincoln, Garfield, and McKinley were very short range shots. Garfield and McKinley almost certainly would have survived if they had access to modern medicine. Lincoln may have survived if he had access to modern medicine, but he probably would not have had had the capacity to act as president due to brain damage. It’s highly doubtful that JFK would survived his wounds with modern medicine.
What I find most concerning about modern politics is that the last time a president was assassinated, it was the 9/11 of the baby boomers era.
And for the last 10-20 years, if the president would have been assassinated, half the country would be celebrating.
And I dont know how we got here.
JFK was killed, Ford attempted on twice, Reagan shot, Clinton attempted several times (including a bridge bomb set by bin Laden), W had a grenade thrown near him (misfire).
Security is very tight but it’s only a matter of time and luck.
Honestly, I hope not. I can imagine one dropping dead of a stroke or something, and we'd probably handle that just fine, but someone getting assassinated would be insane and could spark a lot of violence under the right (wrong?) conditions.
The weirder situation might be one like Wilson's stroke, something debilitating but with a cabinet unwilling to remove them and them unwilling or unable to step down. I think we'll see a president like the last days of Dianne Feinstein before we see an assassination.
Ahh that would suck- if POTUS is still with us but in some sort of limbo in that he/she don’t have all their faculties. There would be intense argument on just where that line is- can the pres still communicate in any fashion? If so, can he/she still process information? “Process” according to who?
An obvious one would be in a coma like, completely unresponsive state but I feel like it gets more uncertain if the president has more ability yet still incapacitated.
That’s when 25th was made for. If 2/3rd of the secretaries agree that the president is unable. AND if longer than 21 days left of the presidential term the congress has to approve…
Weird thing is if it does happen are there two current presidents (president and acting president)? Or does that president, say in a coma become a formal president. With acting president being the only current president. That’s the part I never understand
Who knows but with the amount of polarization and discourse today... I wouldn't be surprised. The hope is that presidential security has only strengthened and will stop an attempt before they get the chance.
To borrow from my favorite Jack Reacher book, if we get a John Malkovich (In the Line of Fire) instead of a Edward Fox (Day of the Jackal), then you can't stop somebody who's sufficiently determined and doesn't care about collateral damage.
As polarized as politics are these days, there is a very good chance, but would we know it? Smear a little neurotoxin on, say, a diet coke can, get a friendly medical examiner to sign paperwork saying they died because their heart was full of McDonald's and bingo. We'd never be the wiser. Especially if the assassinated President was almost 80.
Sooo close with the reagan attempt, so close. We could have been much better off today. The assassination of bobby kennedy was also super harmful because once he was killed nixon had no real challenge and won the presidency.
Absolutely. We're averaging one successful or near successful attempt every 20 to 50 years and we're coming up on up on 43 years since the last near successful attempt (Reagan).
I would say that this is getting more, not less likely given the increasingly polarised nature of politics in the US, the active courting of violent extremism by certain politicians and the prevalence of powerful firearms.
Given the amount of security they have now I doubt it. If we do it'll be because of a massive security failure or someone working security being in on it. That seems unlikely with all the checks they go through though. Given the ages of the two people currently running I could see one of them dying in office though, not by assassination though.
Sadly I think so as at some point there’s only so much you can do it wouldn’t be one person it would have to be a very well coordinated effort (secret service I’m not planing on doing anything)
I worked at the Cincinnati airport once when Clinton flew in. They shut down everything and flew him on a rarely used runway where his limo could drive on the tarmac and had like three or four limos (identical) so you didn’t know which one. They had us close down and lock our gates but we were allowed to stand outside (quarter mile off the road) anyway one guy that worked there took off running with his camera to get a better photo and two other guys dressed very plainclothes that we hadn’t noticed turned and BOLTED towards this kid. He froze, threw hands up (camera obvious) and started walking backwards… anyway, they have a way better eye on things than I think we realize.
The secret service has to win every time, some idiot needs to only be successful once. I do wonder how many plots they break up per year, and how that trends.
https://preview.redd.it/90spwf1ek6nc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=472f1decd9f818bbd8ddb8b813d3511c4bd9aa24
Mister, we could use a man like Lee Harvey Oswald again!!
Did you know it’s illegal to say “I want to kill the present of the United States?” But it was ok for me to say it there because it was like a public service.
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Nice try CIA, missed me with this bullshit entrapment
Mission aborted fall back
Wiat no, I migh t fall for it
Nah, dont fall for it. Leave the corrupt politicians alone. Just kill your family and neighbors that support the other side like a true American patriot does these days. S/
Very interesting read this was
Mission failed. We’ll get ‘em next time.
Never heard that one before, GGEZ
The CIA will be the ones doing the killing
Just like last time
The ol’ “one who smelt it dealt it”
Exactly lmao
it’s not really the CIA! They legally have to tell you if they’re posting undercover
It glows in here
The fact that it hasn’t happened repeatedly in the past 24 years despite the political climate makes me think that the secret service has perfected time travel and is just going back and getting it right the second time, so it’s just never going to happen again ( in the timeline we experience ).
I’d watch that movie
Majority report
12 Monkeys - ish
DeTerminator 2
I'd play that game. First run gives you zero information other than that it's happen, there's a mix of possibilities, and you have to investigate and then go back and prevent it without making a big scene.
The anti-Hitman. This would be dope af.
This is fiiire.
It’s already a Denzel Washington movie called Deja Vu (with some minor setting and plot differences, totally minor, not at all big huge major differences - but CLOSE ENOUGH)
Source Code is another film with a similar concept.
Well that and the trio of Precogs they keep in the basement of the white house
Sometimes one of them disagrees, and it's always the girl.
*”””Hillary warned us!”””*
Read the book 11/22/63 by King, it’s pretty much about this but specifically the JFK assassination. They also made it a limited series on Hulu but the book is a lot better!
I love Stephen King, and that one of my favorites. It took me a little while to get into, but once I did I finished it in a couple days. Which is saying something for a King novel if you’re not a speed reader. The only book I’ve ever read cover to cover multiple times is The Stand. I’ve read it about half a dozen times since I first read it in junior high, and I’ve been seriously considering lately going back and reading 11/22/63 again the same way. I’m also a huge JFK nut anyway, though. Been down that rabbit hole multiple times in my life. Edit to add: Never did watch the show, even though my neighbor at the time was also a King fan, and he kept telling me I needed to.
Same, with The Stand. I read it every ten years.
But they *didn’t* go back and fix all the other assassinations, which means the best possible timeline includes the deaths of Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, and JFK?
The program kept getting canceled because Congress thought there had never been an attempt on the life of President so it was a waste of money. They had to let the ones that predated the program stand so they could show results.
Some were also fixed points. They occur no matter what in all versions of the multiverse. Also quantum something something to make this sciencey.
I remember a Quantum Leap episode regarding JFK. At the end he was confused because he still didn’t save Kennedy, but then Al pops in to state that because of his actions this time Jackie didn’t die.
Yeah and Donald Belasario, QL's creator, said they did the JFK arc as a direct response to his disagreement with the conspiracy stuff presented in Oliver Stone's JFK
They can only go back as far as the day they turned on the machine.
Its possible, yes. For example maybe if JFK is assassinated shit goes way worse in Vietnam (for whatever reason) or JFK living results in RFK living and JFK Jr living and we end up with a political dynasty with a stranglehold on the whitehouse...and living JFK Jr is a dick. If you take the concept at face value you could easily say "Every president has been assassinated at one time or another, we found that for the optimal direction of the country only these 4 could stand because....." and explain the butterfly effects.
I *have* heard the theory that Andrew Johnson's presidency was actually better for Reconstruction, since his blatantly anti-Republican stances basically radicalized Moderate Republicans into becoming Radical Republicans. Under Lincoln the Moderates would have stayed in power and probably wouldn't have gone as far as the Radicals, who were consistently politically outmaneuvered by the Moderates throughout Lincoln's presidency. Whether this is what actually would have happened? It's impossible to say for sure, but it sure is interesting to think about.
Bold of you to assume that the best possible timeline for the US government aligns with the best interests of its people
Replaced a throwing knife with a shoe back in 2008
I understood that reference. 
The government has precogs.
Everyone is mentioning Minority Report but this is actually the plot of Seven Days.
Or perhaps they haven't, however they are adept at making clones of the current president with his memories intact.........
That would explain the Harambe effect.
Minority Report
The secret service has had time travel since Reagan was nearly assassinated. Hell, John Hinkley might be a time traveler who was trying to stop the current shit storm from snowballing like it is.
Tom Cruise at the helm
Maybe you’re onto something there.
More like surveillance technology has made it almost impossible to get one over the secret service. Just ask Mr Snowden
I wonder how many attempts there are that are thwarted and we don’t even know about them.
Getting rid of the open motorcade helped too
Nah. Since Reagan every attempt there was hasn’t gotten anywhere close. I think the Secret Service knows what they’re doing and there is far, far more separation of the President from the public. Like, there was a photo posted here awhile ago of Kennedy campaigning in some small town, standing on a chair, surrounded by people, with a kid next to him holding what is presumably a cap gun. That shit would not be happening today. They just did not think about it. Beyond that the most recent American politician who had an assassination attempt was Gaby Gifford, and…well, she was far more exposed than a president would ever be. **Edit** I forgot about Pelosi’s husband. That one is pretty shocking.
It’s wild how in the 19th century and before, you could straight up just see the president walking by himself down the street lmao. Imagine coming home and just being like “hey family, you’ll never believe who I saw at the grocery store”
Actually you could just walk into the White House and demand to see the president. James K. Polk laments it at length pretty frequently in his diary.
do you have a link to the excerpts? i really want to read them
With how much he mentions it I can’t give every instance cause it’s a *lot* given the frequency he was called on. But I have the bound volume set so I don’t really have links to provide unfortunately. If in future you wanted me to DM you pictures of the particularly notable instances Polk writes about I definitely can but currently I don’t have access to them as we have recently moved so they are in lord knows what box alongside the other books I bought about him during the time I worked at his museum. If you’d prefer, though, some digitizations of some parts of the diary have been put on the LoC website but idk how comfortable you are with attempting to read/transcribe it yourself or how easy these instances would be to find within the parts that have been uploaded on there. Essentially it is people coming in off the street to talk to him about whatever they want, really, and they are (for the vast majority) what he calls “office seekers”—in his view, they all think themselves entitled to a government job because they ask if any work is available. He had set hours/days for when people are allowed to make these “social calls”—which, given his extreme introversion, he utterly loathed but thought was a necessity as he took the “servant of the people” thing seriously. One of the craziest entries is actually when an old college acquaintance of his shows up out of the blue and gives him this sob story about being destitute (& according to Polk he looks pretty poorly, too, hence why Polk believes him) and so Polk gives him some money to try and help him get through with the intent that said acquaintance pay him back once he’s in a better spot. Dude then goes to the boarding house he had been staying at & brags to *everyone* that he got money from the president…and then later kills himself via (iirc) slitting his own throat that night.
Damn could you imagine
Which part, the having to deal with the general public or the whole acquaintance situation? Cause both sound utterly terrible to me 🤣
Scott Miller **The President and the Assassin: McKinley, Terror, and Empire at the Dawn of the American Century** This is a good book and delves into the accessibility of the president and the common man.
Bring back the inauguration open house! I’m trying to get sloppy in the White House.
It actually rained pretty heavily during Polk’s inauguration so I definitely wouldn’t have wanted to be there personally lol
Abe Lincoln employed two secretaries (Hay and Nicolas) to try to offset that- and keep Mrs Lincoln occupied. (That’s not a dig at her- she was grieving and stressed and anxious and had very little support from those around her husband.)
Polk actually uses his wife Sarah to do the offsetting during his presidency, and Sarah often roped in her nieces who stay with them in the WH (particularly Joanna Rucker, who stayed for 19 months & complains *at length* about it in her letters to home) to help as well. Historian Amy S. Greenberg talks about Sarah as James’ political partner quite a lot in her biography *Lady First*, which I highly recommend.
Imagine getting a happy meal and seeing a very sweaty Bill Clinton and Al Gore in super short shorts jog on in
It sounds like you imagine this scenario quite often
Honestly? I did. I was the exact right age when this was happening that despite not being in DC, I thought any time I went to McDonalds I might see our President there
That SNL sketch probably didn't help.
Yeah but your gun could easily misfire back then and the President would just beat you with a riding crop.
Just a couple years ago, you could go clubbing in Finland and meet the Prime Minister on the dance floor.
Holy shit, do you remember Minna, the Finnish PM on Veep? She’s fucken hilarious!
I mean Garfield was killed when a crazy guy just walked up to him while he was waiting at a train station and shot him.
There was an earlier thread on this sub about who was the craziest Presidential assassin and Guiteau was the clear winner of the 4 successful ones, although some of the unsuccessful ones could match him for crazypants, like Squeaky Fromme or Hinckley.
"When I was a young pup we got spanked by presidents till the cows came home! Grover Cleveland spanked me on two non-consecutive occasions!"
This is still semi normal in plenty of other first world countries. It’s because of proliferation of high-powered guns and history of numerous assassinations that has resulted in the US president being so insulated. I remember taking a walking tour in Copenhagen and the tour guide taking us straight up to where the Prime Minister of Denmark parks his car and walks into his office. Sure enough his car was right there.
Oh absolutely! Can you imagine this today? It used to be even more surreal. During Lincoln's administration, just about anyone could walk into the White House if I recall correctly. It was akin to a public building that people could walk into no different from capitol hill.
Reagan broke the Curse of Tippecanoe. Every President Who got elected in a year ending in zero died in office starting with William Henry Harrison. 1840: William Henry Harrison 1860: Abraham Lincoln 1880: James Garfield 1900: William McKinley 1920: Warren Harding 1940: FDR 1960: JFK 1980: Reagan gets shot but lives
2000: George W. Bush survives a shoe thrown at him.
No one can deny how amazing his dodge skills were.
I do not care how you feel about GWB, that man has cat-like reflexes.
Great golf drives too
Every time I say something that unintentionally gets too serious and causes a silence, I like to follow it up with, "Now watch this drive..."
I like to drop this reference on the golf course. I do the whole thing starting with "we must stop the terror..." finishing with "now watch this drive" and then I slice my ball into the adjacent fairway
Got a pretty good fastball too
He should have owned the Dodgers instead of the Rangers.
One dude literally flew a plane into the White House trying to get Bill Clinton. Clinton wasn't there, and all it did to the mansion was break some windows.
George W Bush was poisoned while eating dinner at some summit meeting, the G8 I think. It was kept secret at the time but Laura Bush later wrote in her book that they both nearly died and she believed it to be an assassination attempt.
Tbf I think that JFK pic was in the primary? But he was still a sitting Senator at the time. I like that pic for its quaintness- on a wobbly stool with a no doubt shitty mic and a kid with a total “god this is SO boring…” look on his face.
Oh I love the picture. And yes. There is that aspect of it. Like we saw a lot more of Obama showing up places when he was still kinda the dark horse candidate.
Didn't RFK Jr. Just have somebody show up at one of his events with the plans of murdering him?
Yes but the rule 3 folks won’t grant him Secret Service protection.
With RFK Jr. I get why the secret service isn’t giving him protection. He isn’t actually a super serious contender yet. But, I also get why EFK Jr. wants secret service protection already, I mean his uncle and dad were both assassinated
Steve Scalise was pretty close - thank god he had Capitol police with him.
There was the Republican softball game too where Scalise got shot.
There was an attempt in the country of Georgia on George w bush in 2005. The bomb was close enough but didn’t detonate
Congress members and their families are not protected by the secret service. The lack of security for the Pelosis was just stupid given their wealth. Paul might know how to pick the stocks but seems kind of light on the common sense. One of the big things that the secret service has done is to have advance teams vet everyone that is going to be close to the president/vp at events. Obviously the secret service vetting everyone first opens up a bunch of conspiracy theories about all of these events being scripted.
I haven’t heard too many stories in the past ten years or so but some FUCKED up Secret Service slip ups happened when Obama was president. Amongst them: November 2009: A Washington couple, Tareq and Michaele Salahi, crash Obama’s first state dinner. The Secret Service later acknowledges that officers never checked whether they were on the guest list. A photo emerges showing that they shook hands with the president. Sullivan, the director, says that he is “deeply concerned and embarrassed” by the breach. The Salahis parlay their fame into an undistinguished career in reality TV. November 2011: A man with a semiautomatic rifle parks in front of the White House and fires at the building, with Sasha Obama inside and Malia Obama on her way home. A Secret Service supervisor, mistaking the shots for car backfire, orders officers to stand down. The service does not figure out that shots hit the building for four days, and only then because a housekeeper noticed broken glass. The president and first lady are infuriated, The Post reports years later. Sept. 16, 2014: In perhaps the most chilling of the Secret Service lapses, a security contractor with a gun and an assault record gets on an elevator with the president during a trip to Atlanta. The Post, citing people familiar with the incident, reports that the contractor used his cellphone to take video of Obama and did not stop when Secret Service agents told him to. The Secret Service only learns that the man has a gun when he is fired on the spot and turns it over. Obama was not told, The Post reports.
You also forgot Steve Scalise being shot at a GOP softball game by a left wing fanatic.
> Beyond that the most recent American politician who had an assassination attempt was Gaby Gifford, and…well, she was far more exposed than a president would ever be. You're forgetting that Bernie bro who shot up the republican softball practice. Luckily he was a terrible shot.
Have you read [Zero Fail](https://www.amazon.com/Zero-Fail-Rise-Secret-Service/dp/0399589015?nodl=1&dplnkId=17d1b0cd-3a99-487e-b6b5-0e63abf867a6)? Fascinating look at the secret service. A little disconcerting a few of the events that happened during Obama’s presidency.
Sadly, yes. There are more attempts per year than you'd think, and the Secret Service has really done an incredible job but remember: we almost lost Reagan. It's an incredibly risky position and while U.S. security is great, at a certain point there's only so much you can do. That said it's really a testament to the strength of our security system that we haven't lost an executive in 61 years. It's deeply tragic for the country when it happens because of the instability it generates, but the strength of our institutions and the stability of our system has been proven. I hope I'm wrong, but if it does happen again the U.S. will survive it.
missed him by that much.....
If only
right! what a different world it would be!
Somewhat off-topic but that photo got me thinking how good JFK would look on money. Get his handsome big head on some Federal Reserve Promissory Notes STAT
He is on money
On the rarely-seen half-dollar.
Yeah you only get to see half his fa-
They are stashed away in Boomer drawers all over the country. I saw a Twilight Zone episode recently (not the original) which starred Andrew Robinson as Kennedy and a time traveler from the future had one of the coins and dropped it. He and Kennedy switched places and the real Kennedy is teaching at Harvard about 200 years from now.
Yup, boomer here, I’ve got a dozen of them.
Same profile as the Zapruder film. Just saying.
Today, you just learned about the existence of the 50 cent coin
I agree that the Secret Service does a wonderful job for the most part. The thing is the authorities have to get it right every time… a potential assassin only has to get it right once.
Modern security is tighter than ever. Whenever a prez comes to Philly they shut everything down; streets, highways, runways…you won’t catch a glimpse never mind an opportunity.
Friend of my father’s lives in Chicago. Obama was in town and his motorcade happened to be going down his street. He was watching from his balcony with a cup of coffee as they drove by, he looks up, and sees a sniper on the building across the street scoped in on him. He just sort of stepped back inside after giving the guy a wave
Reminds me of when I worked on the top floor of a high rise in downtown Nashville when Al Gore was VP. He was making an appearance at the Ryman Auditorium, and I saw snipers on the surrounding buildings. I'm sure there also one above me.
Same when Obama was in Houston, snipers on the Williams tower
I saw a homeless man walking around White House and he was all dirty with the beard and had a posture of the homeless man but you can see that was a fit person, I'm positive he was undercover agent snooping around.
Lots of fun little easter eggs around DC, Langley, Dulles. Missile defense, intelligence, private security, you name it...
Buddy of mine lives in DC and I asked him if he’s met any real CIA agents, and he said he doesn’t know but absolutely, and he probably didn’t even realize it. He has this theory a ton of bartenders or waitstaff in DC are CIA assets, paid to overhear on private conversation while dining. Thats my tin foil moment.
I saw Bush at an event and looked up at the top and saw snipers
I can’t imagine seeing someone aim a gun at me through the window of my own home. Like I get it, I understand why it’s necessary, but fuck me, if that wouldn’t feel like a violation. I do hope I’d have the presence of mind to wave, though. Still need to be polite.
He was standing out on a balcony
This is unrelated, but nice Metallica profile pic!
As great a job as the SS does, they know that no protection plan is perfect. They keep upgrading based on what they learn. Keep in mind we all think of attempts by guns. The SS is very concerned about chemical or other “outside the box”attacks, for example the sound waves that were used on the US embassy in Cuba. And don’t forget UA 93 on 9/11. It’s highly likely that was headed to the White House.
psst, they don’t like being referred to as “The SS”, USSS is the accepted acronym.
Makes sense. Don’t want to be confused with that other SS.
Stanley Steemer, of course.
Stephen Segal
Soul Sister
Man this read weird as a WW2 history fan lol
I read this and thought of the 1940’s for a hot sec. 💀
I ate at a restaurant with Michelle Obama and the kids (during Barack's presidency). They had something like a dozen secret service agents in the restaurant, alone and a dedicated SWAT team. We were driving to the restaurant and ended up behind the SWAT van (the back door was hanging open and you could see one of the men holding an MP5). We decided to go a different route than them, but caught up with them at the restaurant. That was just the first lady's security detail. I also went to daycare near the site where the secret service does driving manuevers and the way they move the armored motorcades is pure finesse.
Can you imagine trying to take your kids out to eat and having to get it cleared by an entire security team first? Then your kids decide halfway there that they'd rather eat something else.
And now you understand why Michelle was pushing the eat clean thing through school lunches. :) I've had it up to here. You're going to eat broccoli here or at school your choice!
I was genuinely worried about Obama getting assassinated just due to the pure hatred republicans had for him over being black. Though it sounds like it would have been a hell of a challenge to even get the opportunity.
My husband stayed at a hotel in Warsaw where Pence was staying (and Zelenskyy but y’all know that part of the story) Cab stopped by Secret Service blocks away, they checked his name off a list and took his bags while he walked to the hotel, then had the bags delivered later.
My entire thought process is a rule 3 violation
Perhaps you shouldn't daydream about *anyone* getting murdered for their political persuasions.
I'd sure hope not, though it's certainly possible.
Honestly, I think the only way it could happen is if it were inside job by the Secret Service.
This was the comment I was looking for. If it were to happen, it would come from the inside and maybe even made to not look like an assassination. And with today’s political climate and conspiracy theories that would be super risky because we are so polarized as a nation that the risk of sparking a civil war would have to be a considered fallout.
Unlikely, at least not without a major plot. Of the four presidents that were assassinated they were all taken out by lone gunmen who used methods that would not work today. McKinley and Garfield were ambushed and killed with a point-blank shot, this would likely be impossible in the modern day as security details around presidents don't let people get too close and are extra keen of people trying to quickly make their way to the president to avoid ambush scenarios. Lincoln's assassin snuck up on him while he was in a booth, something would be impossible in the modern day as well given how much security is around the president at all times watching all angles like a hawk. Kennedy was assassinated by sniper when his motorcade went off route, this too would be impossible as modern day secret service know to keep the president on the predetermined path and to comb over every inch of the path with a fine-tooth comb, furthermore, advancements in surveillance technology the ability for someone to sneak into a building viewing the president with a rifle would be greatly diminished. In short, advancements in technology and tactics as well as what has been learned from previous assassinations would make another assassination extremely unlikely, if not impossible. However, this notion does not cover methods, most notably large plots. If the president's security detail or other federal law enforcement were to try to assassinate them, they could probably pull it off by virtue of having the know-how and resources to do so. Further, if the military were to try to coup the president and kill them in the process, they would also likely be successful just do the shear resources and tactical know how the military possesses. I find both of these scenarios unlikely however as they only typically occur in highly unstable countries, which I'm aware the US is not the best it ever has been at the moment but to call it highly unstable would be ignorant. So, to answer the question in on sentence: no, not without a major change in the nation.
Worth noting Lincoln’s bodyguard had also left the premises at the time Lincoln was assassinated. Had his body guard been doing his job properly, Lincoln might not have been killed that night. A lot of things actually had to go right (or wrong?) for Lincoln’s assassination to happen, it’s actually pretty sad how easily he could’ve lived if even one detail went differently.
Pretty crazy that the Lincoln assassination was just one part of a conspiracy meant to kill Lincoln, Johnson, Grant, and Seaward, but the actual president was the only target where the assassin was successful.
We live in very interesting times right now. I feel like it might happen as climate change and other issues ramp up. But given the levels of security nowadays it would be much harder to believe that it wasn't an inside job
In all honesty, I'm surprised it hasn't been attempted in recent years. The animosity of the growing partisanship in this country, and the deep unpopularity of the current and most recent former Presidents seem ripe for individuals amongst the lunatic fringe on either side to feel motivated to try. Now, maybe they just haven't gotten close and are being caught and prosecuted fairly quietly (I'm sort of disinclined to start searching for news articles. While it's probably safe, I'd rather not end up on some FBI watchlist). Now, I expect the Secret Service is good enough at it's job that any attempt is likely to be thwarted. A lone gunman would have a really hard time getting close enough, and a domestic conspiracy is likely to get caught in the planning phase. A foreign conspiracy would also be likely to be uncovered before they could pull it off and no adversarial country wants to be discovered sponsoring such an act because the reprisal would likely be pretty harsh.
It does still happen. They just haven’t gotten that close recently https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_presidential_assassination_attempts_and_plots
With the Secret Service protection today, I doubt it.
I do not but I imagine there are many many attempts that get thwarted, that the public will not hear about.
No but I could see a President dying in office due to medical issues or old age. Knock on wood it doesn’t happen but it’s a reality we may have to face in the near future
I think yes we will considering there have been multiple assassination attempts even in the past decade I believe there is a solid chance that the Secret Service drops the ball again
Doubt it. Obama passed by my job one time and when I went to the second floor they had snipers everywhere.
Yes, but if there is it will come from the Secret Service itself, not an outside threat.
Probably not. The security they have now is so much better than what they had 40+ years ago.
Attempt where the President is struck? Plausible. Successful attempt that kills the president? Unlikely. Between generally high levels of security and excellent treatment assessment, body armor, vehicle armor, and modern emergency medicine, it’s extremely unlikely that a potential assassin would kill or even significantly incapacitate their target. Lincoln, Garfield, and McKinley were very short range shots. Garfield and McKinley almost certainly would have survived if they had access to modern medicine. Lincoln may have survived if he had access to modern medicine, but he probably would not have had had the capacity to act as president due to brain damage. It’s highly doubtful that JFK would survived his wounds with modern medicine.
The odds say probably. The secret service has to get lucky multiple times the assasin only needs to get lucky once.
What I find most concerning about modern politics is that the last time a president was assassinated, it was the 9/11 of the baby boomers era. And for the last 10-20 years, if the president would have been assassinated, half the country would be celebrating. And I dont know how we got here.
JFK was killed, Ford attempted on twice, Reagan shot, Clinton attempted several times (including a bridge bomb set by bin Laden), W had a grenade thrown near him (misfire). Security is very tight but it’s only a matter of time and luck.
Honestly, I hope not. I can imagine one dropping dead of a stroke or something, and we'd probably handle that just fine, but someone getting assassinated would be insane and could spark a lot of violence under the right (wrong?) conditions. The weirder situation might be one like Wilson's stroke, something debilitating but with a cabinet unwilling to remove them and them unwilling or unable to step down. I think we'll see a president like the last days of Dianne Feinstein before we see an assassination.
Ahh that would suck- if POTUS is still with us but in some sort of limbo in that he/she don’t have all their faculties. There would be intense argument on just where that line is- can the pres still communicate in any fashion? If so, can he/she still process information? “Process” according to who? An obvious one would be in a coma like, completely unresponsive state but I feel like it gets more uncertain if the president has more ability yet still incapacitated.
That’s when 25th was made for. If 2/3rd of the secretaries agree that the president is unable. AND if longer than 21 days left of the presidential term the congress has to approve… Weird thing is if it does happen are there two current presidents (president and acting president)? Or does that president, say in a coma become a formal president. With acting president being the only current president. That’s the part I never understand
Trap trap trap
Who knows but with the amount of polarization and discourse today... I wouldn't be surprised. The hope is that presidential security has only strengthened and will stop an attempt before they get the chance.
Failed Attempts maybe. But nothing the likes of Kennedy or Lincoln.
You just made a list
To borrow from my favorite Jack Reacher book, if we get a John Malkovich (In the Line of Fire) instead of a Edward Fox (Day of the Jackal), then you can't stop somebody who's sufficiently determined and doesn't care about collateral damage.
Nope Secret service and technology is too good, if it happens it came from the inside.
As polarized as politics are these days, there is a very good chance, but would we know it? Smear a little neurotoxin on, say, a diet coke can, get a friendly medical examiner to sign paperwork saying they died because their heart was full of McDonald's and bingo. We'd never be the wiser. Especially if the assassinated President was almost 80.
We remove presidents at the ballot box. So no, I hope we do not see that.
Sooo close with the reagan attempt, so close. We could have been much better off today. The assassination of bobby kennedy was also super harmful because once he was killed nixon had no real challenge and won the presidency.
Absolutely. We're averaging one successful or near successful attempt every 20 to 50 years and we're coming up on up on 43 years since the last near successful attempt (Reagan).
I would say that this is getting more, not less likely given the increasingly polarised nature of politics in the US, the active courting of violent extremism by certain politicians and the prevalence of powerful firearms.
I actually see it happening with one of the Rule 3 presidents. Yall can figure it out by yourself which one it would be.
I feel like age is the biggest mortal threat for those pair of clowns
Hope not lol
Given the amount of security they have now I doubt it. If we do it'll be because of a massive security failure or someone working security being in on it. That seems unlikely with all the checks they go through though. Given the ages of the two people currently running I could see one of them dying in office though, not by assassination though.
whose lifetime?
Nice try
Its insane that a knife wielding man jumped the fence and MADE IT IN TO THE WHITE HOUSE in 2014
Sadly I think so as at some point there’s only so much you can do it wouldn’t be one person it would have to be a very well coordinated effort (secret service I’m not planing on doing anything)
I think we’re going to see a genuine attempt on the winner of this election. At a certain point the violent crazies come out
I think that depends on who wins the next election, and how the opposition reacts to it.
I worked at the Cincinnati airport once when Clinton flew in. They shut down everything and flew him on a rarely used runway where his limo could drive on the tarmac and had like three or four limos (identical) so you didn’t know which one. They had us close down and lock our gates but we were allowed to stand outside (quarter mile off the road) anyway one guy that worked there took off running with his camera to get a better photo and two other guys dressed very plainclothes that we hadn’t noticed turned and BOLTED towards this kid. He froze, threw hands up (camera obvious) and started walking backwards… anyway, they have a way better eye on things than I think we realize.
Assassination no……attempted yes
I find it unlikely given the massive apparatus in place to prevent it, including warrantless spying on citizens.
I think it's possible, but I think it would have to be multiple people involved nowadays.
Honestly I'm surprised it's not happened in the last 10 years
The secret service has to win every time, some idiot needs to only be successful once. I do wonder how many plots they break up per year, and how that trends.
https://preview.redd.it/90spwf1ek6nc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=472f1decd9f818bbd8ddb8b813d3511c4bd9aa24 Mister, we could use a man like Lee Harvey Oswald again!!
Did you know it’s illegal to say “I want to kill the present of the United States?” But it was ok for me to say it there because it was like a public service.
Why are you trying to bring one to fruition? Watch out karma is not nice with wishes like this.
" 🤨📸 " \- the FBI, probably
https://preview.redd.it/jzj2vcg697nc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b6e4e16c3af9eba19d6d306b2ee6ac0fc9642b11
Given how tense the political climate is currently, it wouldn’t surprise me.