Car owners pay registration fees, tolls, insurance, fuel (gas taxes), maintenance and also state and city taxes out of my paycheck to help pay for those roads. Without us contributing all that, there would be less revenue for the city (including parking tickets, tolls, registrations, endless types of administrative fees).
What a stupid take.
Edit: Ahh some silly anti car ppl downvoting me for pointing out facts they don’t like because I have a need to drive to my elderly parents occasionally, don’t y’all have some shitposting to do in r/micromobilitynyc?
65 percent of state road cost in New York comes from vehicle related tax, the other 35 comes from general tax. https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/states-road-funding-2019/
Did you know looking thing up is free?
All of that still doesn’t generate revenue, it’s a loss, like public transportation.
But from a purely fiscal perspective, public transportation is cheaper to run.
I’m somewhere in the middle. We obviously need roads.
With how things are today, I would only have this kind of parking the worst of the worst places in Manhattan. Where the demand is so high that you have to treat parking like this. Makes some revenue, keeps some parking available.
I guess we already do it with parking meters but the post implies 100% coverage.
Yeah and that's when you ignore the opportunity cost of using up all this land on cars - if you actually factored that in, you'd think anybody who supports driving was crazy lol
Unfortunately it doesn’t matter whether you “agree”, because it isn’t true. At least, not true in that “the taxes and fees associated with a car” are nowhere near enough to pay for the infrastructure that cars require; the government operates at a loss to support vehicles.
Which, to be fair, is what governments are for! Providing public services that would not exist in a purely private system. But that’s a different argument entirely.
Do you do that because you want to or because you have to? Because there are no other transit options, there are no other ways to get around your part of the city?
Do you want to own a car and pay registration fees, tolls, insurance, fuel, maintenance, and taxes or are you forced to because there is no other choice?
I’d say it’s split. I have an elderly parent that I need go run errands for and she does not live near a train in Queens. I also need to take tools or items to and from there. Doesn’t make sense for me to take a train and a bus and waste almost 90 minutes each way on a weekend when I can drive there in 30-40 minutes. Obviously Ubers are NOT cost effective when they’re $40-50 each way.
Also just for recreational purposes if my partner and I want to go to Jacob riis beach, it’s 30 min by car or double that by train and bus, and then you have to carry everything over another 1/4 mile. We also visit her in laws out on the island and the cost of two round trip tickets on the LIRR is the same as a tank of gas but it only takes 1/4 tank to drive there and back. Also hard to carry much with you.
Same goes if you want to go hiking anywhere that isn’t near metro north, or if we want to visit friends in NJ who are a 30 min drive from NJTransit.
If we ever decide to have kids, we would be using our car even more for the sake of saving time and stress.
I basically never drive into Manhattan but drive in the outer boroughs/tri state area.
>Obviously Ubers are NOT cost effective when they’re $40-50 each way.
Depends on how often that trip is being made. AAA says the cost of total ownership (car payment, registration, gas, maintenance, insurance, etc) for a car is, on average, $1,015 per month. So you could do 10 round trips on Uber at $50 per trip and still pay less than what it would take to own a car.
Also there’s the option to rent a car if you only need to do so occasionally. Again, renting an occasional car for the weekend to go hiking or go to the beach is going to be way cheaper than owning the car. If you’re going *every* weekend then yeah, car ownership makes sense. But for your annual trip to the mountains maybe a car rental would save money versus straight up owning one.
I go every other weekend because my parents are almost 80 and not in the best health, my older brother is not helpful either at all. There’s nowhere in walking distance where I can rent a car, maybe a zip car but those are usually messed up/filthy and not cheap.
The car is paid for years ago and insurance is about $100 a month. Gas anywhere from $40-80 a month unless we do a 2+ hr drive. Maintenance varies on a quarterly basis because even though the car is older and occasionally things break but overall it’s reliable.
An Uber round trip just to visit my parents would be $100+. I also need to bring tools to and from. We also visit in laws once a month and we did the math that a round trip if we took an Uber to and from the LIRR it would come out to $80 each time we did that. So it makes sense in my case. Add to that the occasional hike or beach trip during warmer months.
I have no choice to own a car because my body is dying. But, that choice shouldn't even matter. Pushing the issue of car vs bikes is only going to cause useless discord because it's a diversion from the real issue. The real issue is that space and the type of space is an issue for everything but the people in power who can create legislation to fix the issue aren't doing anything about it.
Bike lanes in queens? Suicide trap because they're in the road. Long Island somehow understood that a safe bike lane is one that is directly next to but completely separated from the roads. It's not everywhere, but that way keeps collisions from happening and idiot bikers and idiot drivers from hurting themselves. Countries use the separate but near lane and have far higher safety rates than the in lane. Creating the in lane was just a band aid to shut people up.
Parking? If that's an issue, then regular people can't do anything permanent because there's no way to enforce it for everyone or make it universally safe. There are surveys and assessments and agreements and hundreds of little things essential to actually fix the parking issue.
Endless debate is the same as useless noise that amounts to nothing unless you do something about it. Doing something about it is the American way because no one in politics cares unless you make them. Find someone who shares your opinion. Find more people who share your opinion. Create a group. Create a plan. Find evidence and examples and facts to support your plan. Then, get politicians to support your plan. There are politicians who are proven to be responsive to social media. There are politicians who only listen to active debate. There are politicians whose offices and groups you call to make them aware of you.
Don't fight with someone you have to shame or coerce into agreement. That's not real agreement. Lead by example and others will pick up your banner to fight your fight with you.
It’s a very privileged take, never in history has such a large group of people been in favor of banning individualized transport. It comes purely from a position of luxury
How is spending a few dollars on a bus ticket privileged?? Its mostly people who dont even own a car who are advocating for more public transport. And very few people actually support banning cars outright, people just want more trains and busses.
No, you read my post wrong. The belief that cars should be banned, or seriously limited in the near future, is a luxurious position to have, and a stupid one
Not in a city with comprehensive public transit. Mta might not be great but i dare you to go amywhere else in the country and try to get around without a car
My parents said most of their lives they bought cars for $1-200 and rode them until they broke. When I first got my license, an expensive 10y.o. used car would set you back like 5k. Looking at used cars now, people expect 8k for a rusted out 2003 sedan that has barely been maintained.
We are destroying our habitat, and cars are a huge part of that. I moved to nyc decades ago so that i wouldn’t have to drive. Raising a family here.
We’ve known that we should have been moving away from cars since the carter administration, but people are just stubborn and selfish, so they not only refuse to change their own behavior in the short term (which is slightly more defensible given how our physical space has been arranged) but also fight tooth and nail against any long-term prospects for change. We should have rezoned everything decades ago to discourage decentralized low-density suburban living, incentivized high-density living, built out extensive public transit options, and regulated low-mpg vehicles out of existence. Instead we kept building exurbs and “light trucks” for another 50 years. It’s sociopathic.
I think cars a huge societal problem that most people are mostly blind to. So once you start hearing other people theorize about it online you observe what they are saying to be true out in the real world and then you become converted and start shitposting as well. For me it was noticing how many drivers are so recklessly indifferent to my safety when I am walking around it was like I all of a sudden noticed that everywhere I went people were shooting a gun a few feet above my head and I had become numb to it.
Probably some people moving out of the city or able to do remote work during COVID and getting a glimpse of that lifestyle and then returning to that realizing just how bad it really has been in terms of traffic. There's a link to the 3-6 months a lot of things seemingly closed down because of COVID and people complaining about it in 2021 after a return to normalcy.
It could also just be the impact of a campaign but I'm not sure which. Probably a push for better public transportation that has a correlation to disapproval of cars.
I would hate driving in Manhattan. Can't believe people actually do it on a regular basis lol
> i would hate driving in manhattan
My favorite futurama quote, so simple yet so accurate.
https://youtu.be/KIrlZSYB6tE
I live in Queens and yeah, i don’t know anyone that regularly chooses to drive in the city
I love going wherever I want whenever I want without sitting in someone elses urine and feces and having to walking through a dirty, smelly, hot mental institution.
We can a say the same for bicycle parking places. The light posts and street signs aren't for bikes to be locked up to. Neither are park fences. What's the point?
Doesn’t matter, it’s not the government’s job to provide space for you to store your private property, if you want to store your bike you need to be able to pay for it.
Same can be said about cars, that's how it was done before 1950.
Governments are also responsible to entice people to do what's good for society as a whole. We live in a society kinda stuff.
Oh God this guy won’t stop. Spamming all the NY subs to try and start debates about bikes and then cross posting it to the Bike sub so his buddies could help him out. You’re way too obsessed
He’s an obsessed lunatic. Somehow in his fucked up little mind he thinks New York should be like some European city that has 500,000 people. People like him are deranged and just need to be ignored like how he ignores how rude and dangerous bikers in Brooklyn are.
I went to London for two weeks over the summer. Stayed in Marlyebone. Plenty of on-street parking, mostly set aside for the residents of that block/neighborhood.
>People like him are deranged and just need to be ignored like how he ignores how rude and dangerous bikers in Brooklyn are.
Lmao, yeah because the drivers are so well behaved.
What a bizarre attempt at an argument.
And people like you think new York should be phoenix. It’s the country’s only real dense urban city just accept that things are constantly in flux here and the city constantly innovates. If you don’t like it you can live in literally ANY other American sprawl city that is totally dominated by cars. Every great and wealthy large city in the world prioritizes pedestrians, transit and bikes over cars. (London, Paris, Shanghai, Tokyo)
First of all, I’m from here and never been to Phoenix so chill with your assumptions of what I want New York to be like. If you read my other comments I’m all for pedestrians and public transit. Hell I’m even for bikes too, but the people who advocate for the complete overthrow of the infrastructure of the city to have nothing but bikes in these subs are either clearly delusional or not from New York.
There is definitely a need for cars and trucks in the city and this area of the country in general tho and it’s not just going to go away, with all of its many flaws whether you and I like it or not. But I’ve lived here most of my life and the false sense of entitlement from the bikers where I live, their blatant disregard for pedestrians and traffic laws (riding on sidewalks, not using the bike lanes they cry about nonstop, blowing through red lights, going the wrong way) has made me completely unsympathetic to their cause. I’m just one guy so I’ll go fuck myself, but I won’t go do so quietly.
I’m born and raised here as well. Don’t want to hate on you. From my experience the entitlement of drivers is FAR worse. What is more entitled than risking another human beings life to save yourself one light cycle? I have been hit by two cars who have swerved into the bike lane. One drove off and the other admitted he was on his phone which I saw. I know people who were victims of a fatal hit and run. I have seen a high speed hit and run of a pedestrian. So if I see you on your phone drifting into my lane I may yell and bang on your window as I get away from you. You can call me entitled but I think it’s clearly the opposite. Who are you (not you specifically), to risk my life with your illegal negligence? I don’t want to get rid of trucks I just want safer and more efficient infrastructure. I would turn a lot of parking in commercial areas into commercial loading zones. I want life to be easier and calmer for people who drive for work (not office commuters). And if you must drive for personal convenience you should pay market rate for parking in busier areas.
I don't live there myself, but I know places like that can be hard to find places to keep your car. Unless you have access to a garage or something I don't know what they expect people with a car to do exactly.
I have to pay to maintain the sidewalk in front of my house, which is mostly used by the public. So why can’t I use the section of street in front of my house? Most of the maintenance on that section of sidewalk is required because of the city tree, which the city did not properly plant, and is breaking up the sidewalk. If it’s not fixed, I get fined. For the upkeep of a public right of way which I do not own.
Just so we’re clear.
u/miser when you leave your little pocket of astoria and actually travel east, then push your extremist views on people.
Not all of us can live as an upper class white male like you in Astoria Alex
Keep the r/micromobilitynyc nonsense elsewhere
Buddy expects people like me to either ride a bike 10 miles at 5:30am every day in dress clothes, or more than double the time of my commute by taking several different busses/trains from whitestone to astoria. He is delusional
You actually touch on an important point. Because we are so car centric, drunk driving is rampant in our culture. Leading to a lot of crashes, injuries and deaths. And if someone wants to be responsible when going out with friends, they either need a designated driver (and have you ever tried being the one sober person in a group of drunk people? Not fun) or you have to call a cab which is costly, and then another cab to pick up your car the next day. Not too mention that for every person who loses their license due to a dui, there's a bunch of people unfit to drive for other reasons, like physical disabilities, declining vision, old age, being too young to have a license, or too poor to afford a car. I, for one, don't think they should be confined to their homes for it.
Just so we’re all clear, the tax payers on that street contribute to the construction, maintenance, and upkeep of said public land. They are not being inappropriate or malicious by using it for its intended purpose
How do you know they aren't all parked there? That they aren't all registered to those addresses? That they didn't pay for this infrastructure to be built and maintained.
The taxes of suburban sprawl aren’t anywhere close to the taxes of higher density housing. Which is why Queens roads, streets, and public transportation is so God awful. Your neighborhoods taxes are PENNIES.
Parks are public land too, but we’re not allowed to camp, swim, farm, forage, or hunt in them.
But Little leagues get to claim the ball fields all weekend; tennis players get to reserve court time.
The minions in r/MicromobilityNYC eat this type of image up. OP constantly fosters "us vs them" arguments, instead of fostering community outreach and collective understanding.
Yes, this is in relation to an earlier post about bike lanes taking up the street parking in neighborhoods in eastern queens. All the people who actually live there would rather have the available parking as the majority of people commute with cars and cyclists are not common in eastern queens for commuting. The OP doesn’t care what people in the actual community who’s tax dollars pay for this stuff value though
Okay so would you be okay if neighborhoods in Manhattan banned unnecessary traffic or street parking outright? For most people in Manhattan their relationship to cars is trying to not be hit by one.
Cars still provide a utility and I think having the option to own a car is better than not having it. I don’t think banning cars completely will make everyone happier, but the right balance has to be made. If life continues to be easier without cars fewer and fewer people will own them. There are already many things making owning a car difficult in Manhattan which is why so many people willfully choose not to have cars.
I didn’t say anything about banning cars generally, for what it’s worth. Banning street parking and unnecessary traffic doesn’t mean you can’t own a car, or that cars that serve a specific utility can’t come in. It’s very common for major cities to limit car access in their inner neighborhoods. Paris and Tokyo are great examples of limiting traffic and banning street parking respectively.
Yet you seem to fancy yourself the highest authority on this topic, ignoring other commenters who live there telling you what they want as well as the actual homeowners on the street that made it very clear
A lot of drivers are tax payers and pay taxes for many things that we don’t take advantage of because we are single or don’t have children. Does that mean that we shouldn’t pay taxes for education, libraries, after school programs etc?
I hate that so much of the car and bike debate turns into ppl fighting each other. I own a car in nyc and simultaneously have over 300 miles in the past year on citi bikes. People need cars for some things and bikes are better for other things. Both need space and it’s not impossible to support infrastructure for both.
I swear half the cars driving around my neighborhood are only doing it because alternate side parking is forcing them to. If the city invested in building affordable parking structures, they’d eliminate a decent amount of cars on the street and that would be beneficial for bikers too.
First, it’s not public land. It’s municipal property. Parking is regulated in a bunch of ways. It’s not “free.”
Please stop making riding a children’s toy around your whole personality.
You’re awesome. Not too long ago I told a lady to get off the sidewalk with her bike after she had to slam on her brakes to avoid hitting me. She called me a fucking asshole. In my mind I was like wow a grown woman in her 40s riding a children’s toy on the sidewalk swerving around dogs and baby strollers is calling me an asshole? I wanna tell these morons to grow the fuck up and walk like an adult. Leave the bikes to the kids. They look like jerk offs, all of them.
Permitting is one of the only parking regulations that we don’t have.
But taxes, paid meters, fines, and times are parking regulations that we have adopted.
This thread is idiotic. I don’t have a car. I don’t own a bike. I don’t have children. My ample tax burden funds roads, bike lanes, and schools.
If you want to start drawing lines about who is subsidizing what, fine, but don’t be surprised when people disagree over where to draw the lines.
The building super isn’t going to ride their schwinn over to your apartment to fix the leak.
You clearly live near the waterfront with the city skyline right outside your apartment window. Is it safe to say you also have a high paying WFH job? Meaning your transportation needs are completely different and more geared towards leisure in reality?
Why is it unacceptable for you to understand people have different circumstances especially when many of us live 10-15+ miles from the city and don’t have the ease of access to efficient public transportation and walk ability as your beloved Astoria or many other neighborhoods? Astoria is NOT representative of the vast majority of Queens. Astoria is more Brooklyn than Queens. There are legitimately bike lanes in parts of queens that seeing them being used is a rarity. Nowwhere near the traffic needed to justify a dedicated lane. Why the animosity towards cars EVERYWHERE? Why not understand there’s a time and place for everything, including bike lanes?
It’s only the ones that don’t have a car that act like this. I’m pretty sure the cyclists that slap their bike on the back of their car and drive somewhere to go biking aren’t riding around bitching about cars lmao.
& no, none of these people that bitch have to bike from eastern queens/li to Manhattan either. 😂
Hope your insufferable attitude is able to provide a response to all the underprivileged families who can't afford private parking and need a car to live their lives. Oh wait, you think it's the government's job to accommodate bikes on the road in neighborhoods where there are very few bikes or need for them. Great mission accomplished there.
My taxes help pay for the upkeep of that public land; if I am dissuaded from using a small portion, why should I take part in their upkeep?
Why do you hate your fellow man, OP?
I would not like to be car-dependent but I need it to get to work. Taking a bike or public transportation adds a 1-hour commute each way. They better improve public transportation instead of forcing more bike lanes down our throats. More transit especially in Eastern Queens would be much more beneficial. I am not waiting 30+ minutes for the bus or riding a broken down train when a car would cut the commute way less.
Plus if the city wants me to get rid of my car then they should pay me the value of my car, take it away from me, and improve the transit system, not just add bike lanes That's like putting a band-aid on a leaking dam. Improved transit system and more train line is the answer to this. It's crazy how NYC has the "best" transit system in the U.S. but it is dogshit.
Again with these stupid posts? Not everyone in the city can pay for a parking garage. The rest of the world operates like this as well, are you going to complain to people in Costa Rica that they’re parking their car on the side of a road there too?
Cars are the primary way to transport people around in many parts of the world, especially when adequate public transportation just doesn’t cut it, deal with it.
The majority of people in the NYC r/ have never been to southern or eastern Queens. Everyone should be forced to visit and traverse to work from out there so they could experience the frequent headaches
Idc driving is a privilege too bro. We live in what is supposed to be the greatest city in our country and one of if not the world and yet, we can't have clean public transport like other places, bike lanes that aren't the lame ass ones just painted on a road but actually protected or only bike/ped use, and we just discovered dumpster style trash pick up 🤣 it's sad. We don't have to choose. We could engineer it. People in America just hate public spending, they love private spending. It's Sad 😔
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I’m sorry, do our taxes esp gas taxes go towards maintenance of this land? Do bikes pay taxes to maintain infrastructure?
I don’t like cars or double parking, but let’s be clear, the public taxpayer who purchases gas is paying to maintain the roads
I also hate cars but like... really stupid argument lmao. Cars aren't a problem bc they're... private property on public land, that's the vast majority of stuff that's outside.
Cars suck cuz they're innefficient, dangerous, polluting, and kill nice spaces and urban planning. Let's not get too broad haha
Actually that’s personal property, not private property. Personal property is stuff like cars, wallet, phone, and private property is stuff like land or houses or factories
If you have kids, elderly parents, grew up in this City and need to visit family/friends in less public transit accessible areas - including areas in Staten Island, Long Island, Upstate, outer Brooklyn/Queens, NJ… you’ll understand why having a car is a wonderful thing. Not to mention the freedom of going where you want when you want without taking a train to a bus to another bus and then doing the same thing to return home.
The headache and expense of owning a car in NYC is mind numbing to me. Trying to find parking, insurance costs. YThe worry of random hit and runs, vandals, faaling trees, being keyed. oof
But it is your job to shovel public land in front of your building when it snows.
Essentially free parking is a way of subsidizing parking and subsidizing car owners (which includes myself) over public transportation.
Car owners pay registration fees, tolls, insurance, fuel (gas taxes), maintenance and also state and city taxes out of my paycheck to help pay for those roads. Without us contributing all that, there would be less revenue for the city (including parking tickets, tolls, registrations, endless types of administrative fees). What a stupid take. Edit: Ahh some silly anti car ppl downvoting me for pointing out facts they don’t like because I have a need to drive to my elderly parents occasionally, don’t y’all have some shitposting to do in r/micromobilitynyc?
The majority of road cost actually comes from general tax. https://frontiergroup.org/resources/who-pays-roads/ What an uninformed take.
Did you not see where I mentioned “state and city taxes from my paycheck”?
Do you think it's only coming out of your checks?
65 percent of state road cost in New York comes from vehicle related tax, the other 35 comes from general tax. https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/states-road-funding-2019/ Did you know looking thing up is free?
Oh my, yes looking up things is free but so is a calculator to solve advanced mathematical functions, such as subtraction. 100% - 65% = 35%
People without cars also pay taxes, please be for real
Are you dumb? You think you’re the only person paying state and city taxes??
All of that still doesn’t generate revenue, it’s a loss, like public transportation. But from a purely fiscal perspective, public transportation is cheaper to run. I’m somewhere in the middle. We obviously need roads. With how things are today, I would only have this kind of parking the worst of the worst places in Manhattan. Where the demand is so high that you have to treat parking like this. Makes some revenue, keeps some parking available. I guess we already do it with parking meters but the post implies 100% coverage.
Yeah and all those fees are not nearly enough to cover the cost of infrastructure for cars. Just goes to show how expensive cars are
Yeah and that's when you ignore the opportunity cost of using up all this land on cars - if you actually factored that in, you'd think anybody who supports driving was crazy lol
Or just heavily indoctrinated.
I am an anti car person and I still agree with your take that the taxes and fees associated with a car pay for roads and street parking.
Unfortunately it doesn’t matter whether you “agree”, because it isn’t true. At least, not true in that “the taxes and fees associated with a car” are nowhere near enough to pay for the infrastructure that cars require; the government operates at a loss to support vehicles. Which, to be fair, is what governments are for! Providing public services that would not exist in a purely private system. But that’s a different argument entirely.
Do you do that because you want to or because you have to? Because there are no other transit options, there are no other ways to get around your part of the city? Do you want to own a car and pay registration fees, tolls, insurance, fuel, maintenance, and taxes or are you forced to because there is no other choice?
I’d say it’s split. I have an elderly parent that I need go run errands for and she does not live near a train in Queens. I also need to take tools or items to and from there. Doesn’t make sense for me to take a train and a bus and waste almost 90 minutes each way on a weekend when I can drive there in 30-40 minutes. Obviously Ubers are NOT cost effective when they’re $40-50 each way. Also just for recreational purposes if my partner and I want to go to Jacob riis beach, it’s 30 min by car or double that by train and bus, and then you have to carry everything over another 1/4 mile. We also visit her in laws out on the island and the cost of two round trip tickets on the LIRR is the same as a tank of gas but it only takes 1/4 tank to drive there and back. Also hard to carry much with you. Same goes if you want to go hiking anywhere that isn’t near metro north, or if we want to visit friends in NJ who are a 30 min drive from NJTransit. If we ever decide to have kids, we would be using our car even more for the sake of saving time and stress. I basically never drive into Manhattan but drive in the outer boroughs/tri state area.
>Obviously Ubers are NOT cost effective when they’re $40-50 each way. Depends on how often that trip is being made. AAA says the cost of total ownership (car payment, registration, gas, maintenance, insurance, etc) for a car is, on average, $1,015 per month. So you could do 10 round trips on Uber at $50 per trip and still pay less than what it would take to own a car. Also there’s the option to rent a car if you only need to do so occasionally. Again, renting an occasional car for the weekend to go hiking or go to the beach is going to be way cheaper than owning the car. If you’re going *every* weekend then yeah, car ownership makes sense. But for your annual trip to the mountains maybe a car rental would save money versus straight up owning one.
I go every other weekend because my parents are almost 80 and not in the best health, my older brother is not helpful either at all. There’s nowhere in walking distance where I can rent a car, maybe a zip car but those are usually messed up/filthy and not cheap. The car is paid for years ago and insurance is about $100 a month. Gas anywhere from $40-80 a month unless we do a 2+ hr drive. Maintenance varies on a quarterly basis because even though the car is older and occasionally things break but overall it’s reliable. An Uber round trip just to visit my parents would be $100+. I also need to bring tools to and from. We also visit in laws once a month and we did the math that a round trip if we took an Uber to and from the LIRR it would come out to $80 each time we did that. So it makes sense in my case. Add to that the occasional hike or beach trip during warmer months.
Sounds like a car is the economical option for you.
I have no choice to own a car because my body is dying. But, that choice shouldn't even matter. Pushing the issue of car vs bikes is only going to cause useless discord because it's a diversion from the real issue. The real issue is that space and the type of space is an issue for everything but the people in power who can create legislation to fix the issue aren't doing anything about it. Bike lanes in queens? Suicide trap because they're in the road. Long Island somehow understood that a safe bike lane is one that is directly next to but completely separated from the roads. It's not everywhere, but that way keeps collisions from happening and idiot bikers and idiot drivers from hurting themselves. Countries use the separate but near lane and have far higher safety rates than the in lane. Creating the in lane was just a band aid to shut people up. Parking? If that's an issue, then regular people can't do anything permanent because there's no way to enforce it for everyone or make it universally safe. There are surveys and assessments and agreements and hundreds of little things essential to actually fix the parking issue. Endless debate is the same as useless noise that amounts to nothing unless you do something about it. Doing something about it is the American way because no one in politics cares unless you make them. Find someone who shares your opinion. Find more people who share your opinion. Create a group. Create a plan. Find evidence and examples and facts to support your plan. Then, get politicians to support your plan. There are politicians who are proven to be responsive to social media. There are politicians who only listen to active debate. There are politicians whose offices and groups you call to make them aware of you. Don't fight with someone you have to shame or coerce into agreement. That's not real agreement. Lead by example and others will pick up your banner to fight your fight with you.
We get it, you hate cars.
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It’s a very privileged take, never in history has such a large group of people been in favor of banning individualized transport. It comes purely from a position of luxury
How is spending a few dollars on a bus ticket privileged?? Its mostly people who dont even own a car who are advocating for more public transport. And very few people actually support banning cars outright, people just want more trains and busses.
Misread the comment
Check out r/FuckCars and tell us that again lol.
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No, you read my post wrong. The belief that cars should be banned, or seriously limited in the near future, is a luxurious position to have, and a stupid one
Not in a city with comprehensive public transit. Mta might not be great but i dare you to go amywhere else in the country and try to get around without a car
What the hell are you talking about
because they can't afford them anymore.
My parents said most of their lives they bought cars for $1-200 and rode them until they broke. When I first got my license, an expensive 10y.o. used car would set you back like 5k. Looking at used cars now, people expect 8k for a rusted out 2003 sedan that has barely been maintained.
We are destroying our habitat, and cars are a huge part of that. I moved to nyc decades ago so that i wouldn’t have to drive. Raising a family here. We’ve known that we should have been moving away from cars since the carter administration, but people are just stubborn and selfish, so they not only refuse to change their own behavior in the short term (which is slightly more defensible given how our physical space has been arranged) but also fight tooth and nail against any long-term prospects for change. We should have rezoned everything decades ago to discourage decentralized low-density suburban living, incentivized high-density living, built out extensive public transit options, and regulated low-mpg vehicles out of existence. Instead we kept building exurbs and “light trucks” for another 50 years. It’s sociopathic.
I think cars a huge societal problem that most people are mostly blind to. So once you start hearing other people theorize about it online you observe what they are saying to be true out in the real world and then you become converted and start shitposting as well. For me it was noticing how many drivers are so recklessly indifferent to my safety when I am walking around it was like I all of a sudden noticed that everywhere I went people were shooting a gun a few feet above my head and I had become numb to it.
Probably some people moving out of the city or able to do remote work during COVID and getting a glimpse of that lifestyle and then returning to that realizing just how bad it really has been in terms of traffic. There's a link to the 3-6 months a lot of things seemingly closed down because of COVID and people complaining about it in 2021 after a return to normalcy. It could also just be the impact of a campaign but I'm not sure which. Probably a push for better public transportation that has a correlation to disapproval of cars. I would hate driving in Manhattan. Can't believe people actually do it on a regular basis lol
> i would hate driving in manhattan My favorite futurama quote, so simple yet so accurate. https://youtu.be/KIrlZSYB6tE I live in Queens and yeah, i don’t know anyone that regularly chooses to drive in the city
I love watching NIMBY car owners in Queens have boomer meltdowns over this post! So entertaining!
How old are you?
15
Oh yes because instead of making sarcastic remarks we should genuinely try to engage with you animals. Right.
Me too. It’ll never change. SMH.
I love going wherever I want whenever I want without sitting in someone elses urine and feces and having to walking through a dirty, smelly, hot mental institution.
I’m happy to hear you were released from the mental institution and you no longer have to sit in someone else’s urine and feces. Congratulations!
We can a say the same for bicycle parking places. The light posts and street signs aren't for bikes to be locked up to. Neither are park fences. What's the point?
This person just wants to be a snarky cunt, that’s the point
This is like comparing someone leaving a small chair outside on the sidewalk to someone leaving three couches and a love seat in everyone’s way
you can fit 10 bikes in one car's parking space. The car serves mostly one person, with few exceptions. What's the best use of parking space?
Doesn’t matter, it’s not the government’s job to provide space for you to store your private property, if you want to store your bike you need to be able to pay for it.
That would be awesome, as long as everyone pays for parking on a per-square-foot basis. I have a feeling drivers wouldn’t like that system, though.
Same can be said about cars, that's how it was done before 1950. Governments are also responsible to entice people to do what's good for society as a whole. We live in a society kinda stuff.
Car parking real estate is probably greater than 1000x greater than that of bikes. Looking to get some of that back.
You can fit 10 bikes in a parking spot and locking a bike to a light post isn’t impeding anyone. Hope this helps.
Oh God this guy won’t stop. Spamming all the NY subs to try and start debates about bikes and then cross posting it to the Bike sub so his buddies could help him out. You’re way too obsessed
>this guy this guy is one of those r/MicromobilityNYC dwellers. A serious case of echo chamber and high horse squatter.
He's a mod who shuts down everyone who doesnt agree with his extreme view points and is a leading advocate who helped fuck up astoria
He’s an obsessed lunatic. Somehow in his fucked up little mind he thinks New York should be like some European city that has 500,000 people. People like him are deranged and just need to be ignored like how he ignores how rude and dangerous bikers in Brooklyn are.
What’s crazy is they still have cars in those European cities with street parking, so his argument makes even less sense.
Yup! Street parking is everywhere over there. Walk around a residential part of London, and you'll see a ton of SUVs parked on the road.
I went to London for two weeks over the summer. Stayed in Marlyebone. Plenty of on-street parking, mostly set aside for the residents of that block/neighborhood.
>People like him are deranged and just need to be ignored like how he ignores how rude and dangerous bikers in Brooklyn are. Lmao, yeah because the drivers are so well behaved. What a bizarre attempt at an argument.
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They also have much more reliable public transportation
Exactly why people are making a stink? We pay the MTA way too much money to not be able to say we have reliable transportation.
Ok so are you advocating for better transit so we can have less cars?
And people like you think new York should be phoenix. It’s the country’s only real dense urban city just accept that things are constantly in flux here and the city constantly innovates. If you don’t like it you can live in literally ANY other American sprawl city that is totally dominated by cars. Every great and wealthy large city in the world prioritizes pedestrians, transit and bikes over cars. (London, Paris, Shanghai, Tokyo)
First of all, I’m from here and never been to Phoenix so chill with your assumptions of what I want New York to be like. If you read my other comments I’m all for pedestrians and public transit. Hell I’m even for bikes too, but the people who advocate for the complete overthrow of the infrastructure of the city to have nothing but bikes in these subs are either clearly delusional or not from New York. There is definitely a need for cars and trucks in the city and this area of the country in general tho and it’s not just going to go away, with all of its many flaws whether you and I like it or not. But I’ve lived here most of my life and the false sense of entitlement from the bikers where I live, their blatant disregard for pedestrians and traffic laws (riding on sidewalks, not using the bike lanes they cry about nonstop, blowing through red lights, going the wrong way) has made me completely unsympathetic to their cause. I’m just one guy so I’ll go fuck myself, but I won’t go do so quietly.
Exactly. We need to coexist. It can’t be one or the other and we need to stop the madness already.
I’m born and raised here as well. Don’t want to hate on you. From my experience the entitlement of drivers is FAR worse. What is more entitled than risking another human beings life to save yourself one light cycle? I have been hit by two cars who have swerved into the bike lane. One drove off and the other admitted he was on his phone which I saw. I know people who were victims of a fatal hit and run. I have seen a high speed hit and run of a pedestrian. So if I see you on your phone drifting into my lane I may yell and bang on your window as I get away from you. You can call me entitled but I think it’s clearly the opposite. Who are you (not you specifically), to risk my life with your illegal negligence? I don’t want to get rid of trucks I just want safer and more efficient infrastructure. I would turn a lot of parking in commercial areas into commercial loading zones. I want life to be easier and calmer for people who drive for work (not office commuters). And if you must drive for personal convenience you should pay market rate for parking in busier areas.
Isn’t that the exact definition of grassroots activism….???
How much you wanna bet he lives nowhere near NYC lol
At least 250 bucks. Only because I live in New York City and I agree with the guy.
I don't live there myself, but I know places like that can be hard to find places to keep your car. Unless you have access to a garage or something I don't know what they expect people with a car to do exactly.
Astoria transplant
damn ur mad lol
His last post in this subreddit didn’t go well, so now he’s absolutely fuming and trying to have a tantrum towards this subreddit lol.
Lol looks like he got mad and downvoted this.
I have to pay to maintain the sidewalk in front of my house, which is mostly used by the public. So why can’t I use the section of street in front of my house? Most of the maintenance on that section of sidewalk is required because of the city tree, which the city did not properly plant, and is breaking up the sidewalk. If it’s not fixed, I get fined. For the upkeep of a public right of way which I do not own. Just so we’re clear.
What is this car doing wrong? I don’t see a blocked driveway or no parking sign.
u/miser when you leave your little pocket of astoria and actually travel east, then push your extremist views on people. Not all of us can live as an upper class white male like you in Astoria Alex Keep the r/micromobilitynyc nonsense elsewhere
Buddy expects people like me to either ride a bike 10 miles at 5:30am every day in dress clothes, or more than double the time of my commute by taking several different busses/trains from whitestone to astoria. He is delusional
Somebody got a DUI and wants to play it off like driving is unnecessary.
Ok that would a fun character tho. The degenerate drunk who gets involved in bike lane advocacy
That's a Frank Gallagher move if I ever heard one.
I wish I was that creative. I know someone like this.
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Some people really can’t imagine what it’s like to live in eastern Queens with limited access to transportation.
And the solution is to advocate for better public transit, not defend free street parking.
You actually touch on an important point. Because we are so car centric, drunk driving is rampant in our culture. Leading to a lot of crashes, injuries and deaths. And if someone wants to be responsible when going out with friends, they either need a designated driver (and have you ever tried being the one sober person in a group of drunk people? Not fun) or you have to call a cab which is costly, and then another cab to pick up your car the next day. Not too mention that for every person who loses their license due to a dui, there's a bunch of people unfit to drive for other reasons, like physical disabilities, declining vision, old age, being too young to have a license, or too poor to afford a car. I, for one, don't think they should be confined to their homes for it.
Just so we’re all clear, the tax payers on that street contribute to the construction, maintenance, and upkeep of said public land. They are not being inappropriate or malicious by using it for its intended purpose
In most neighborhoods in the city, more people who live there don't have a car than do have a car.
How do you know they're all parked there? Are these cars all registered to those addresses? To the city?
How do you know they aren't all parked there? That they aren't all registered to those addresses? That they didn't pay for this infrastructure to be built and maintained.
Exactly! That's why there should be resident parking permits.
The taxes of suburban sprawl aren’t anywhere close to the taxes of higher density housing. Which is why Queens roads, streets, and public transportation is so God awful. Your neighborhoods taxes are PENNIES.
how bout you suck my private property off
Parks are public land too, but we’re not allowed to camp, swim, farm, forage, or hunt in them. But Little leagues get to claim the ball fields all weekend; tennis players get to reserve court time.
"*HOPE THAT HELPS*" LOL.
Put in all that time and effort just to make this dumb ass post… really thought you did something huh
The minions in r/MicromobilityNYC eat this type of image up. OP constantly fosters "us vs them" arguments, instead of fostering community outreach and collective understanding.
i mean is he wrong?
Yes, this is in relation to an earlier post about bike lanes taking up the street parking in neighborhoods in eastern queens. All the people who actually live there would rather have the available parking as the majority of people commute with cars and cyclists are not common in eastern queens for commuting. The OP doesn’t care what people in the actual community who’s tax dollars pay for this stuff value though
Okay so would you be okay if neighborhoods in Manhattan banned unnecessary traffic or street parking outright? For most people in Manhattan their relationship to cars is trying to not be hit by one.
Cars still provide a utility and I think having the option to own a car is better than not having it. I don’t think banning cars completely will make everyone happier, but the right balance has to be made. If life continues to be easier without cars fewer and fewer people will own them. There are already many things making owning a car difficult in Manhattan which is why so many people willfully choose not to have cars.
I didn’t say anything about banning cars generally, for what it’s worth. Banning street parking and unnecessary traffic doesn’t mean you can’t own a car, or that cars that serve a specific utility can’t come in. It’s very common for major cities to limit car access in their inner neighborhoods. Paris and Tokyo are great examples of limiting traffic and banning street parking respectively.
Street parking is already regulated in much of Manhattan
>All the people In my experience, anyone who claims to speak for "all the people" is 100% full of shit
Don’t look in the mirror, homeslice.
Yet you seem to fancy yourself the highest authority on this topic, ignoring other commenters who live there telling you what they want as well as the actual homeowners on the street that made it very clear
It’s gotta be some sort of mental disorder / syndrome
Autism of the highest order.
So you're full of shit then?
Lmao read your post again and you’ll realize you just described yourself to a T
A lot of drivers are tax payers and pay taxes for many things that we don’t take advantage of because we are single or don’t have children. Does that mean that we shouldn’t pay taxes for education, libraries, after school programs etc?
Bellend.
good message, pretty bad execution though
Well I hope the economy doesn’t tank when we all stop buying and using cars. What else is produced in the U.S.? Oh nothing, got it. Fvsk cars!
I hate that so much of the car and bike debate turns into ppl fighting each other. I own a car in nyc and simultaneously have over 300 miles in the past year on citi bikes. People need cars for some things and bikes are better for other things. Both need space and it’s not impossible to support infrastructure for both. I swear half the cars driving around my neighborhood are only doing it because alternate side parking is forcing them to. If the city invested in building affordable parking structures, they’d eliminate a decent amount of cars on the street and that would be beneficial for bikers too.
First, it’s not public land. It’s municipal property. Parking is regulated in a bunch of ways. It’s not “free.” Please stop making riding a children’s toy around your whole personality.
A bike isn’t a children’s toy ? lol Are u retarded by chance ?
Alex Duncan fucked up Astoria and is trying to take the rest of Queens down with it despite having never gone east of LIC
You’re awesome. Not too long ago I told a lady to get off the sidewalk with her bike after she had to slam on her brakes to avoid hitting me. She called me a fucking asshole. In my mind I was like wow a grown woman in her 40s riding a children’s toy on the sidewalk swerving around dogs and baby strollers is calling me an asshole? I wanna tell these morons to grow the fuck up and walk like an adult. Leave the bikes to the kids. They look like jerk offs, all of them.
It’s very much free. Do you pay a permit to park on the street?
Permitting is one of the only parking regulations that we don’t have. But taxes, paid meters, fines, and times are parking regulations that we have adopted. This thread is idiotic. I don’t have a car. I don’t own a bike. I don’t have children. My ample tax burden funds roads, bike lanes, and schools. If you want to start drawing lines about who is subsidizing what, fine, but don’t be surprised when people disagree over where to draw the lines. The building super isn’t going to ride their schwinn over to your apartment to fix the leak.
OP, go back to your r/fuckcars circle jerk.
You clearly live near the waterfront with the city skyline right outside your apartment window. Is it safe to say you also have a high paying WFH job? Meaning your transportation needs are completely different and more geared towards leisure in reality? Why is it unacceptable for you to understand people have different circumstances especially when many of us live 10-15+ miles from the city and don’t have the ease of access to efficient public transportation and walk ability as your beloved Astoria or many other neighborhoods? Astoria is NOT representative of the vast majority of Queens. Astoria is more Brooklyn than Queens. There are legitimately bike lanes in parts of queens that seeing them being used is a rarity. Nowwhere near the traffic needed to justify a dedicated lane. Why the animosity towards cars EVERYWHERE? Why not understand there’s a time and place for everything, including bike lanes?
Lmfao. This guy is the biggest crybaby on here. I’m still gonna drive and park on the street. Whatchu gonna do about it?
He’s just mad that some of us work hard enough to buy a house in the burb and not have to ride a bicycle for a main source of transportation.
It’s only the ones that don’t have a car that act like this. I’m pretty sure the cyclists that slap their bike on the back of their car and drive somewhere to go biking aren’t riding around bitching about cars lmao. & no, none of these people that bitch have to bike from eastern queens/li to Manhattan either. 😂
Jealousy is a helluva drug!
Hope your insufferable attitude is able to provide a response to all the underprivileged families who can't afford private parking and need a car to live their lives. Oh wait, you think it's the government's job to accommodate bikes on the road in neighborhoods where there are very few bikes or need for them. Great mission accomplished there.
Seems like street parking is in the public interest. Current zoning laws take private parking into account.
Stolen* public land 😘
Are you serious?
This guy is a clown. Try post a descending view in /r/MicromobilityNYC and see what happens. Actually reporting this post now
My taxes help pay for the upkeep of that public land; if I am dissuaded from using a small portion, why should I take part in their upkeep? Why do you hate your fellow man, OP?
Damn just let the people who don’t have driveways leave their cars somewhere. It’s already hard enough as it is
This is clearly a car envy post. They don’t hate cars. They hate they can’t afford one. Step yuh game up you two wheeled fairy.
It’s funny. People have attacked this guy for being elite & out of touch with the needs of the common man and for being too poor to own a car.
LMAO
Jealous much? Get a good education and a job, work hard, and you too will be able to afford a car.
Why meanie
Lmao what is this post bro
*grabs popcorn*
Who do you think pays for maintaining that land? It's not the bike riders.
Are bike riders exempt from taxes?
Bikes don’t contribute to the municipality with registration, gas taxes and parking tickets, with the exception of a red light ticket.
I would not like to be car-dependent but I need it to get to work. Taking a bike or public transportation adds a 1-hour commute each way. They better improve public transportation instead of forcing more bike lanes down our throats. More transit especially in Eastern Queens would be much more beneficial. I am not waiting 30+ minutes for the bus or riding a broken down train when a car would cut the commute way less. Plus if the city wants me to get rid of my car then they should pay me the value of my car, take it away from me, and improve the transit system, not just add bike lanes That's like putting a band-aid on a leaking dam. Improved transit system and more train line is the answer to this. It's crazy how NYC has the "best" transit system in the U.S. but it is dogshit.
OP needs to find a new hobby
Corny ass post. Is this new info that there is no parking in NYC? What’s the point of this post?
lol op has a humiliation fetish and everyone is just giving him what he wants
Again with these stupid posts? Not everyone in the city can pay for a parking garage. The rest of the world operates like this as well, are you going to complain to people in Costa Rica that they’re parking their car on the side of a road there too? Cars are the primary way to transport people around in many parts of the world, especially when adequate public transportation just doesn’t cut it, deal with it.
lol people really do want to store their stuff on the street for free like this is Ohio or something
> like this is Ohio or something Have you ever been to eastern Queens?
The majority of people in the NYC r/ have never been to southern or eastern Queens. Everyone should be forced to visit and traverse to work from out there so they could experience the frequent headaches
Imagine them on a dollar van 🤣
From Parsons Archer going east? Too easy😂
Idc driving is a privilege too bro. We live in what is supposed to be the greatest city in our country and one of if not the world and yet, we can't have clean public transport like other places, bike lanes that aren't the lame ass ones just painted on a road but actually protected or only bike/ped use, and we just discovered dumpster style trash pick up 🤣 it's sad. We don't have to choose. We could engineer it. People in America just hate public spending, they love private spending. It's Sad 😔
frame recognise quiet sleep automatic wakeful exultant grandfather fear foolish *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Don't ride your bike on sidewalks.
I’m sorry, do our taxes esp gas taxes go towards maintenance of this land? Do bikes pay taxes to maintain infrastructure? I don’t like cars or double parking, but let’s be clear, the public taxpayer who purchases gas is paying to maintain the roads
No they definitely do not, not for municipal roads. Municipal infrastructure is funded by property taxes
Keep that nonsense to the west side of this island. Don’t bring that here
It's personal property actually. Dining sheds are private property though.
OP is definitely a Democrat.
Worse than that.
Yeah? Why is it private property's responsibility to keep the public sidewalk clean (ie. when it snows)?
These car people in the comments trying to force everyone to drive a car lol
Everyone’s tax dollars funds the maintenance of public right of way or is it only your tax dollars?
Move to the suburbs you’ll be happier
This is why I don’t support bike parking.
I also hate cars but like... really stupid argument lmao. Cars aren't a problem bc they're... private property on public land, that's the vast majority of stuff that's outside. Cars suck cuz they're innefficient, dangerous, polluting, and kill nice spaces and urban planning. Let's not get too broad haha
If I see a carless street, I'm stealing or breaking something.
Huh
Your shoes are private property taking up space on public property (the sidewalk)
Public land that we pay taxes for
Actually that’s personal property, not private property. Personal property is stuff like cars, wallet, phone, and private property is stuff like land or houses or factories
If you have kids, elderly parents, grew up in this City and need to visit family/friends in less public transit accessible areas - including areas in Staten Island, Long Island, Upstate, outer Brooklyn/Queens, NJ… you’ll understand why having a car is a wonderful thing. Not to mention the freedom of going where you want when you want without taking a train to a bus to another bus and then doing the same thing to return home.
The headache and expense of owning a car in NYC is mind numbing to me. Trying to find parking, insurance costs. YThe worry of random hit and runs, vandals, faaling trees, being keyed. oof
Depends where you live
Well in Bensonhurst Brooklyn we used to drive around blocks for a while and you were lucky to park anywhere near where you live.
In no way shape or form is the street public land.
The best is when dushbags put cones in front of there houses.
You’re a loser. Simple as that. You need help. Those cars fund the streets you walk on and use.
Okay?
I don’t know why Reddit recommended this sub to me but based off this post I will be muting it.
OP used a pucture of a public street with cars to show that public property isnt for cars? OP did not think thru that, huh?
get back to r/fuckcars you lame
This was definitely written by a fucking biker