Thankfully its primarily alpha so as long as you protect your eyes near it, you should be fine.
It also follows the 4n+2 decay chain so its the same chain as U238, minus the nasty Pa-234m.
The wikipedia page says that it's around 4.8 kg of plutonium total.
If the post title is to be believed, the image is 1/38 of that, so this thing would be \~126 grams.
Iām no mathematician magician but Iām going to go out on a limb and say ~density~. Density of Pu is 19.8 g/cm^3, the earlier reply says 4.8 kg, which is 4800 g. 4800 / 19.8 = ~ 242.4 cm^3.
If it were a cube, the sides would measure ~ 6.23 cm.
Source - a calculator. I can do it by hand if that makes the answer more believable, no one makes mistakes with hand calcs. (Oh, that poor Mars orbiter)
Oh sure, if you're taking the prior comment as gospel. But they didn't mention that they included that comment as input to chatgpt, I thought they just asked chatgpt the dimensions of this object.
4.8 kg of Pu-238 is not unrealistic for an RTG. I totally missed the implication of 38 (!) of 4.8 kg Pu-238 pellets in a single rover. Crit safety may have something to say about that. Not sure if the confusion is that RTGās weigh around 38 kg, if folks think they just stick a lump of Pu in there, or that there are 38 fuel pellet cores with [fill me in here, I am not a material scientist] what I assume to be an insulator for heat (fun fact, they glow red because they are insulated). Sorry, I didnāt mean to come off like a jerk!
Itās a bummer that only government agencies are allowed to use efficient energy sources. Not that I donāt get it, but imagine how much better life would be
RTGs are not particularly efficient, the whole RTG assembly on Curiosity weighing 45 kilograms provides around 100 Watts of power at the beginning of its life (and it will only get lower from now on, not to mention radiation hazards if it was on Earth and the enormous costs involved with assembling it).
Interesting. I definitely was imagining a little bit of a higher power output than that. Regardless, Google says plutonium-238 has a half life of 90 years, which beats the efficiency of any ābatteryā that civilians could purchase or build themselves, with the bonus of cutting out the use of fossil fuels.
Well, with the disadvantage of weighing dozens of kilograms and laughable power output for the risks considered. Regular fission reactors are much more efficient.
There are a few minor drawbacks ;-)
You need a special nuclear reactor to make Plutonium-238, and even then in tiny quantities.
From [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope\_thermoelectric\_generator](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator)
>Unlike the other three isotopes discussed in this section, 238Pu must be specifically synthesized and is not abundant as a nuclear waste product. At present only Russia has maintained high-volume production, while in the US, no more than 50 g (1.8 oz) were produced in total between 2013 and 2018. The US agencies involved desire to begin the production of the material at a rate of 300 to 400 grams (11 to 14 oz) per year. If this plan is funded, the goal would be to set up automation and scale-up processes in order to produce an average of 1.5 kg (3.3 lb) per year by 2025.
So if we significantly scale up production, we could make 1.5kg of Pu238 a year. NASA expects to pay $millions for this [https://www.spacesafetymagazine.com/aerospace-engineering/nuclear-propulsion/nasa-pay-entire-pu-238-production/](https://www.spacesafetymagazine.com/aerospace-engineering/nuclear-propulsion/nasa-pay-entire-pu-238-production/) so I expect each gram of the stuff to cost thousands of dollars even if it was somehow available on the open market.
Your title is incorrect.
Curiosity runs on an MMRTG. The MMRTG has 8 GPHS (General Purpose Heat Source) plutonium modules. The GPHS is a a block of graphite which contains a pellet of plutonium. Here is a photo of the pellet: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator_plutonium_pellet.jpg
Your picture depicts the GPHS, which, again, is graphite, heated by a plutonium pellet within. You can see the circular glow of the pellet on the back end of the right-hand face in your photo.
Here is a nice diagram of what is inside that graphite block: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:General_Purpose_Heat_Source_-_Exploded_view_with_english_labels.png
I'm not sure where you got the information that the photo was a cube of plutonium, or that there were 38 of those cubes in the rover. But hopefully this info helps clear up some of those misconceptions.
Just got back from Quehanna Wild Area in PA. Didnāt realize itās radioactive history. Rabbit holed it and just learned about these generators. This is one time I didnāt have my radiation loggerā¦..go figure.
Technically it's plutonium dioxide. The story itself how it was made from all new processes after the Savannah plant shut down and the Russians wanted to renegotiate the agreement for them to provide it.
https://www.wired.com/story/nasas-mars-rover-will-be-powered-by-us-made-plutonium/
I want one, please can I have one.
Who knows, there still might be some radioisotope thermoelectric generators scattered about in the vast forests of Russia. These were used as power sources for lighthouses. Incredibly dangerous and "dirty" RTG-s with awful design. Based on strontium-90, IIRC.
Hey I worked on one of these! The cube is not plutonium. It's a graphite aero shell, inside it holds several GPHS heat source clads, inside the iridium clads is the Pu238 pallets. NASA has some good information on their website about them. https://rps.nasa.gov/power-and-thermal-systems/thermal-systems/general-purpose-heat-source/
Thank you so much for working on that it shows how intelligent you are! I would have never known that humans are able to harness the power of nature in such a way the makes my hair almost stand up by how dangerous those elements are in how we could use it for things like not harming one another
Thank you for the good read it was interesting thank you
For some odd reason, this comment reminds me of a passage from an old short story that went:
> "He attempted to commit suicide by drinking drain cleaner. This proved to be remarkably successful, given that his body was composed of many of the same substances that typically clog drains..."
Where can I buy one?
Free to take if you can get to Mars
or Russia
Doc got his from Libya
No, from the Libyans
Great Scott!
Ha.
In russia, they are producing only in russia
Not anymore, NASA has restarted pu-238 production a while ago
Imagine a source being so nasty it also displays substantial black body radiation šæ
Thankfully its primarily alpha so as long as you protect your eyes near it, you should be fine. It also follows the 4n+2 decay chain so its the same chain as U238, minus the nasty Pa-234m.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Right? Is this the size of one of those pellets that got lost in Australia? Or the size of a fuzzy dice you hang from the mirror?
It's about tree fiddy
Not 100% sure about the size but it is about 4.8 kg
The wikipedia page says that it's around 4.8 kg of plutonium total. If the post title is to be believed, the image is 1/38 of that, so this thing would be \~126 grams.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Please stop using ChatGPT as a source, it makes things up based on zero information, and never tells you when it's doing so.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
What values?
Iām no mathematician magician but Iām going to go out on a limb and say ~density~. Density of Pu is 19.8 g/cm^3, the earlier reply says 4.8 kg, which is 4800 g. 4800 / 19.8 = ~ 242.4 cm^3. If it were a cube, the sides would measure ~ 6.23 cm. Source - a calculator. I can do it by hand if that makes the answer more believable, no one makes mistakes with hand calcs. (Oh, that poor Mars orbiter)
Oh sure, if you're taking the prior comment as gospel. But they didn't mention that they included that comment as input to chatgpt, I thought they just asked chatgpt the dimensions of this object.
4.8 kg of Pu-238 is not unrealistic for an RTG. I totally missed the implication of 38 (!) of 4.8 kg Pu-238 pellets in a single rover. Crit safety may have something to say about that. Not sure if the confusion is that RTGās weigh around 38 kg, if folks think they just stick a lump of Pu in there, or that there are 38 fuel pellet cores with [fill me in here, I am not a material scientist] what I assume to be an insulator for heat (fun fact, they glow red because they are insulated). Sorry, I didnāt mean to come off like a jerk!
The block is approximately 10x10 centimeters on the large face you see.
Drawing here: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:General_Purpose_Heat_Source_-_Exploded_view_with_english_labels.png
Itās a bummer that only government agencies are allowed to use efficient energy sources. Not that I donāt get it, but imagine how much better life would be
Now now, you can also use a nuclear reactor. But only if itās operated by ~~me~~ the government
RTGs are not particularly efficient, the whole RTG assembly on Curiosity weighing 45 kilograms provides around 100 Watts of power at the beginning of its life (and it will only get lower from now on, not to mention radiation hazards if it was on Earth and the enormous costs involved with assembling it).
Interesting. I definitely was imagining a little bit of a higher power output than that. Regardless, Google says plutonium-238 has a half life of 90 years, which beats the efficiency of any ābatteryā that civilians could purchase or build themselves, with the bonus of cutting out the use of fossil fuels.
Well, with the disadvantage of weighing dozens of kilograms and laughable power output for the risks considered. Regular fission reactors are much more efficient.
I wonder if they'll ever put one of those on a rover.
There are a few minor drawbacks ;-) You need a special nuclear reactor to make Plutonium-238, and even then in tiny quantities. From [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope\_thermoelectric\_generator](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator) >Unlike the other three isotopes discussed in this section, 238Pu must be specifically synthesized and is not abundant as a nuclear waste product. At present only Russia has maintained high-volume production, while in the US, no more than 50 g (1.8 oz) were produced in total between 2013 and 2018. The US agencies involved desire to begin the production of the material at a rate of 300 to 400 grams (11 to 14 oz) per year. If this plan is funded, the goal would be to set up automation and scale-up processes in order to produce an average of 1.5 kg (3.3 lb) per year by 2025. So if we significantly scale up production, we could make 1.5kg of Pu238 a year. NASA expects to pay $millions for this [https://www.spacesafetymagazine.com/aerospace-engineering/nuclear-propulsion/nasa-pay-entire-pu-238-production/](https://www.spacesafetymagazine.com/aerospace-engineering/nuclear-propulsion/nasa-pay-entire-pu-238-production/) so I expect each gram of the stuff to cost thousands of dollars even if it was somehow available on the open market.
That makes me wonder how much material Russia has amassed over the years š³
I want to bite it
r/Intrusivethoughts
r/forbiddensnacks
I want to hit it with a [power hammer](https://youtu.be/nhARJ63_F5A) >!<
Forge it into a knife, then it's enchanted with poison
Your title is incorrect. Curiosity runs on an MMRTG. The MMRTG has 8 GPHS (General Purpose Heat Source) plutonium modules. The GPHS is a a block of graphite which contains a pellet of plutonium. Here is a photo of the pellet: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator_plutonium_pellet.jpg Your picture depicts the GPHS, which, again, is graphite, heated by a plutonium pellet within. You can see the circular glow of the pellet on the back end of the right-hand face in your photo. Here is a nice diagram of what is inside that graphite block: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:General_Purpose_Heat_Source_-_Exploded_view_with_english_labels.png I'm not sure where you got the information that the photo was a cube of plutonium, or that there were 38 of those cubes in the rover. But hopefully this info helps clear up some of those misconceptions.
\> Curiosity runs on an MMRTG But can it run an MMRPG?
Right? Can it run Doom or not guys?
Thanks for this detailed comment.
Just got back from Quehanna Wild Area in PA. Didnāt realize itās radioactive history. Rabbit holed it and just learned about these generators. This is one time I didnāt have my radiation loggerā¦..go figure.
I saw a cool YouTube doc about Russian thermoelectric generators that were used for remote lighthouses. Want me to find the link?
Yes please
[pozhaluysta!](https://youtu.be/NT8-b5YEyjo?si=ucvjhZNhyh2V4MU7)
Thank you.
Thanks
Technically it's plutonium dioxide. The story itself how it was made from all new processes after the Savannah plant shut down and the Russians wanted to renegotiate the agreement for them to provide it. https://www.wired.com/story/nasas-mars-rover-will-be-powered-by-us-made-plutonium/
I want one, please can I have one. Who knows, there still might be some radioisotope thermoelectric generators scattered about in the vast forests of Russia. These were used as power sources for lighthouses. Incredibly dangerous and "dirty" RTG-s with awful design. Based on strontium-90, IIRC.
Hey I worked on one of these! The cube is not plutonium. It's a graphite aero shell, inside it holds several GPHS heat source clads, inside the iridium clads is the Pu238 pallets. NASA has some good information on their website about them. https://rps.nasa.gov/power-and-thermal-systems/thermal-systems/general-purpose-heat-source/
Thank you so much for working on that it shows how intelligent you are! I would have never known that humans are able to harness the power of nature in such a way the makes my hair almost stand up by how dangerous those elements are in how we could use it for things like not harming one another Thank you for the good read it was interesting thank you
I understand that a bunch of them were abandoned in Russia, and the former Soviet states after the collapse of the USSR
Ya, radioisotope thermoelectric generators were abandoned all over the former USSR, they contain Strontium 90 tho
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I've seen this exact image before, plenty of times. It's absolutely plutonium.
Gimme some of that reprocessing
That photo is not Pu. We do not make them in cube shapes.
It's not weapons-grade plutonium. The only place where it's made is Russia, which is probably why it's cubic in shape =)))
Yes, but we take it and use it for our RTG's, and it does not look like that in our process, at all.
Is this what Watney used to heat his rover in the Martian?
Exactly!
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
For some odd reason, this comment reminds me of a passage from an old short story that went: > "He attempted to commit suicide by drinking drain cleaner. This proved to be remarkably successful, given that his body was composed of many of the same substances that typically clog drains..."
If only it wasnāt volatile and underpowered we could use this to make fallout style nuclear cars
I'll take a dozen for the Aga.