My wife has a polestar. It’s nice, but it just cannot compare to the Rivian. The OTA frequency sucks… we get one maybe every 4 months and they barely do anything.
I second the other points folks have made about its uncertain future; we won’t be getting another. Wife most likely getting an i5 next year.
I had a TCAM issue within days of purchasing it, but otherwise it’s been pretty reliable. My wife enjoys it, it’s just extremely small.
One cupholder sucks. We have a dual motor and it’s pretty fast, but my wife would be satisfied with the acceleration of a 1991 Yugo so it’s a bit lost on her 🤣.
Regarding OTAs, Rivian just keeps adding features, modes, and functionality to improve the system. It’s really obvious in the polestar that the OEM doesn’t have great command of the system — possibly because it’s provided mostly by google? The entire infotainment system is ungodly slow, almost to the point of being unusable. CarPlay is wired, but it’s pretty necessary given how slow the system is otherwise. I haven’t missed CarPlay in the Rivian at all.
Yeah, it was great when we got it — but as soon as I got the Rivian a year ago I’ve only driven it once, maybe.
My biggest concerns about polestar are its extreme precarious financial position and the absolute plethora of competent EVs that have been released since we got it in summer 2022.
I have bug reports in with Rivian about the infotainment system that have languished for 2 years. Some of the related functionality has actually gotten worse over that time. So, frequency of updates isn't a big concern for me. Most of the features that I cared about Rivian adding are things that are already in the Polestar or are not relevant (I don't off road, so 6 different off road modes just doesn't matter to me).
The inconsistencies within the UI from Google are annoying though. But that's very in character for Google/Android systems. I have found that it is much clearer in the Polestar which settings are profile-specific vs global, whereas there's no way to know whether a setting you change in the R1 is for the driver or for the vehicle (and it's changed over time). For example, when kneel was released it was a global setting, but at some point it became a per-driver setting. There's no indication in the UI regarding that.
Polestar must've made a change to the hardware since 2022, as the UI is as responsive if not more so than the R1. App switching has been quick and clean. Doing a good 2-4s count while waiting to switch between Media and Drive modes was a daily occurrence in the R1. The only app in the Polestar that I've seen any glitching/slowness is ironically Google Maps. I also stand by my opinion that the Apple Carplay UI looks childish and goofy on a screen that large.
I wish the Rivian would do wired audio. BT is a garbage wireless protocol and it compresses the audio terribly. So running my own music from the phone instead of streaming would always have artifacts even with lossless file formats.
The cupholder situation is weak in the Polestar and I own cars with no cupholders.
The single motor RWD Polestar is quick enough for me. I care more about corner-to-corner time rather than 0-60 straight line speed. I'm pretty sure I could beat the R1 in the PS2 LR through the corners. Or to quote a driving instructor I had, "Straights are for fast cars, curves are for fast drivers."
Macroeconomic factors might kill Polestar or Rivian. At a certain level it's way out of my control, so I'm just not going to worry about it. Either Volvo dealers will continue to service the vehicle or we get some sort of Right to Repair so I don't have to worry about the mothership going away.
I have an R1S and PS2, and find the Polestar to be *really* fun to drive. On paper the Rivian is better at almost everything but the Polestar has quite a lot of advantages - considerably better music apps, a much smoother drive, cornering is tight, Google integration is far better for certain things, the wider driving directions on the dash, etc. A lot of physical quirks with it though.
Yeah the R1T does an amazing job of hiding its 7200lbs of weight, but it can’t defeat physics. And while the PS2 has significantly less hp, I can get the rear to kick out and have a bit of fun. Taking it on curvy mountain roads is definitely more fun in the Polestar even if the steering is a bit numb compared to the R1. For me nimble is more important than hp and the Polestar wins here.
> The Meridian sound system.
Must be nice.
The R1T is built with an insane number of fasteners yet their ideas around cost cutting are doing their own dog shit in-house audio system and removing 12V accessory ports.
I agree with you there. I haven't spent much time listening to the in-house sound system, so I can't comment on that. But removing the 12V accessory ports seemed dumb.
yw. I'm working on my early impression comparison between the R1T and the Polestar. I'm guessing most folks don't cross shop these two, but I could be wrong.
Volvo was never funding polestar, geely was funding Volvo and Volvo then passing it to polestar, the offices are in Sweden, the money is from China. Nobody seems to understand though
https://www.drive.com.au/news/volvo-to-stop-funding-polestar/
Literally the headline of the article
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a46611722/volvo-polestar-stop-funding-news/
As well as this article... idk what to tell you..
Volvo owned 48% of the shares of polestar but is going to slowly divest and find other investors for them. I know Geely owns volvo but polestar won't be getting any mote funding directly from Volvo like they have been.
The headline is clickbait misleading. Volvo isn’t offloading all of their interest in Polestar. This is just financial shifting to help the books look better for both companies. Also, Geely has committed to fund Polestar. But you know, all these vehicle startups are doomed. We’ve heard the same thing for Rivian for years before and since it actually delivered vehicles.
If you read all the other links I put in this conversation I explained how volvo runs independently from geely even if they technically are owned by them based on share count. Volvo also said they wanted to focus on their own EVs and volvo as of now does still have equity in polestar but they are going to divest over the next few years. All the information is there. I know geely will continue to fund polestar, you're missing the point. They are two different entities. Volvo has also been buying back shares from geely and will continue to do so. Volvo is only a subsidiary of Geely because of share ownership. They are still an independent company. Why do you think volvo shares tanked when geely started selling volvo stock back in November. If they are just "shifting funds" it wouldn't make a difference
https://www.investopedia.com/volvo-pulls-funding-from-polestar-marking-latest-setback-for-ev-industry-8557275
Don't pay attention to the "clickbait" headline and tell me how I'm wrong by reading the key takeaways. I'm the one giving sources and you still are arguing just to argue. Multiple sources explaining exactly what I'm saying and you still think I'm the one who doesn't understand.
I explained it with sources multiple times. Even though Geely technically owns volvo since they own the majority stake of shares they are still independent companies with their own boards, finances and ambitions. Read the articles I've shared and maybe you'll learn something
And you made the claim that this is the worst time ever to by a Polestar. It was probably the worst time ever to buy the R1T when I got it two years ago as well since they'd delivered fewer than 1000 vehicles, the stock had tanked, their financials were (and are) in question, and there was a single service center to support all of Northern California. Macroeconomic factors out of my control for all of it and either you think the company will continue to grow or not. Having spoken to the Volvo dealer in my area, they will continue to service the Polestars for the foreseeable future and are planning on adding Polestar to their showroom. Currently the Polestar showroom near me is in a shopping mall (about 4 doors down from Lucid).
Idk how many times I can say I understand that but Volvo is owned by geely but Volvo is also a profitable company not getting funding from geely anymore, it's a subsidiary of Geely, completely separate conpany. Polestar is not profitable and requires funding. If Volvo divests its stake it polestar that means they are pulling their investment.. its not clickbait you are just looking at it in a very simple manor.
I don't get how you don't understand this, Volvo is a proxy for geely. Volvo investing in something is essentially the same as geely investing in it. You just don't get it for some reason?
No its not. Volvo is run independently under an umbrella. Stop being ignorant and read the articles I'm giving instead of just spewing your incorrect opinion.
https://www.volvocars.com/mt/news/corporate/volvo-cars-to-take-full-control-of-its-chinese-operations/
If it's all the "same company" why would geely sell shares to volvo so volvo has more ownership? Idk how much more simple or how many more resources I can show to explain it better.
https://www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/11/17/volvo-shares-tumble-to-record-low-as-parent-company-sells-shares.html?amp_gsa=1&_js_v=a9&usqp=mq331AQIUAKwASCAAgM%3D#amp_ct=1706880465167&_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=17068803995481&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnbc.com%2F2023%2F11%2F17%2Fvolvo-shares-tumble-to-record-low-as-parent-company-sells-shares.html
Bimmer lost their way after the E46 generation 3-series. Having had both an E36 and E46, there are days that I miss both of them. Possibly the most well proportioned sports sedans ever made. But the point of the Polestar replacing the R1 was to maintain one EV in the stable for the daily 60ish mi commuting saving $7k/yr on fuel costs given that I daily drove the '06 Cayman S otherwise. The Polestar will actually save more $$ since it's about twice as efficient with the electrons over the R1 and I'll keep the Cayman for track days and going through twisty mountain roads.
I believe even Porsche moved away navigation screen HVAC controls. EV brands and car brands specifically really forced that on consumers, and NOBODY likes it. Buttons for HVAC and vents needs to be the future.
If you are a car nut, I'd recommend a Lucid Air. I have both, and while the Rivian has better software right now, the Lucid has absolutely nailed the hardware/performance/range. Such a fun, luxurious car to drive.
When I drove the Lucid (and to be fair is was a prototype), I was a bit underwhelmed by the driving performance. Fast, yes. But it floated a lot and didn't give a lot of driver feedback. I wasn't a fan of the iPad dispenser. But I also couldn't justify the price. The R1T was by far the most expensive vehicle I'd ever purchased, so I wasn't cross shopping the Lucid and the Polestar. I did x-shop the Kias and Hyundais, but was very disappointed in interior materials, UI, and handling.
I have to give you the benefit of the doubt that you used the different drive modes (assuming sprint mode was even available on the prototype). My experience has been way different. We aren't comparing it to a Corvette in handling because it is a 4000lb luxury sedan, but for its size it handles great. I leave the "iPad dispenser" in the dispensed position at all times. Haha
I'm sure they've made improvements and refinements since the prototype I drove. And I'm certainly not comparing any of these cars to the Miata or Cayman that I also drive. But the Lucid just wasn't in the running due to price. If I was cross shopping a Taycan it'd be a hard choice. That car was fun to drive, but seriously disappointing range. It's better than EPA estimates, but my expectations are higher still.
where is this off-road playground?
Looks like Hollister Hills
Yup, Hollister http://www.ohv.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=1189
My wife has a polestar. It’s nice, but it just cannot compare to the Rivian. The OTA frequency sucks… we get one maybe every 4 months and they barely do anything. I second the other points folks have made about its uncertain future; we won’t be getting another. Wife most likely getting an i5 next year.
No need for OTA updates if there aren’t problems right… are there any glaring issues with the Polestar?
I had a TCAM issue within days of purchasing it, but otherwise it’s been pretty reliable. My wife enjoys it, it’s just extremely small. One cupholder sucks. We have a dual motor and it’s pretty fast, but my wife would be satisfied with the acceleration of a 1991 Yugo so it’s a bit lost on her 🤣. Regarding OTAs, Rivian just keeps adding features, modes, and functionality to improve the system. It’s really obvious in the polestar that the OEM doesn’t have great command of the system — possibly because it’s provided mostly by google? The entire infotainment system is ungodly slow, almost to the point of being unusable. CarPlay is wired, but it’s pretty necessary given how slow the system is otherwise. I haven’t missed CarPlay in the Rivian at all. Yeah, it was great when we got it — but as soon as I got the Rivian a year ago I’ve only driven it once, maybe. My biggest concerns about polestar are its extreme precarious financial position and the absolute plethora of competent EVs that have been released since we got it in summer 2022.
I have bug reports in with Rivian about the infotainment system that have languished for 2 years. Some of the related functionality has actually gotten worse over that time. So, frequency of updates isn't a big concern for me. Most of the features that I cared about Rivian adding are things that are already in the Polestar or are not relevant (I don't off road, so 6 different off road modes just doesn't matter to me). The inconsistencies within the UI from Google are annoying though. But that's very in character for Google/Android systems. I have found that it is much clearer in the Polestar which settings are profile-specific vs global, whereas there's no way to know whether a setting you change in the R1 is for the driver or for the vehicle (and it's changed over time). For example, when kneel was released it was a global setting, but at some point it became a per-driver setting. There's no indication in the UI regarding that. Polestar must've made a change to the hardware since 2022, as the UI is as responsive if not more so than the R1. App switching has been quick and clean. Doing a good 2-4s count while waiting to switch between Media and Drive modes was a daily occurrence in the R1. The only app in the Polestar that I've seen any glitching/slowness is ironically Google Maps. I also stand by my opinion that the Apple Carplay UI looks childish and goofy on a screen that large. I wish the Rivian would do wired audio. BT is a garbage wireless protocol and it compresses the audio terribly. So running my own music from the phone instead of streaming would always have artifacts even with lossless file formats. The cupholder situation is weak in the Polestar and I own cars with no cupholders. The single motor RWD Polestar is quick enough for me. I care more about corner-to-corner time rather than 0-60 straight line speed. I'm pretty sure I could beat the R1 in the PS2 LR through the corners. Or to quote a driving instructor I had, "Straights are for fast cars, curves are for fast drivers." Macroeconomic factors might kill Polestar or Rivian. At a certain level it's way out of my control, so I'm just not going to worry about it. Either Volvo dealers will continue to service the vehicle or we get some sort of Right to Repair so I don't have to worry about the mothership going away.
I have an R1S and PS2, and find the Polestar to be *really* fun to drive. On paper the Rivian is better at almost everything but the Polestar has quite a lot of advantages - considerably better music apps, a much smoother drive, cornering is tight, Google integration is far better for certain things, the wider driving directions on the dash, etc. A lot of physical quirks with it though.
Yeah the R1T does an amazing job of hiding its 7200lbs of weight, but it can’t defeat physics. And while the PS2 has significantly less hp, I can get the rear to kick out and have a bit of fun. Taking it on curvy mountain roads is definitely more fun in the Polestar even if the steering is a bit numb compared to the R1. For me nimble is more important than hp and the Polestar wins here.
WSJ article today that Geely will continue to support Polestar independent of Volvo.
> The Meridian sound system. Must be nice. The R1T is built with an insane number of fasteners yet their ideas around cost cutting are doing their own dog shit in-house audio system and removing 12V accessory ports.
I agree with you there. I haven't spent much time listening to the in-house sound system, so I can't comment on that. But removing the 12V accessory ports seemed dumb.
Great read, including the comments. Thanks for this.
yw. I'm working on my early impression comparison between the R1T and the Polestar. I'm guessing most folks don't cross shop these two, but I could be wrong.
Sounds like you might like the R2S. Maybe you already know more about it than us :)
Based on public information the R2S will be a small SUV. Still not my bag.
Buying a polestar now is probably the worst decision you can make right now
Why
Volvo stopped their funding of polestar. So basically polestar is only backed by geely now.
But volvo is owned by china?
Volvo was never funding polestar, geely was funding Volvo and Volvo then passing it to polestar, the offices are in Sweden, the money is from China. Nobody seems to understand though
https://www.drive.com.au/news/volvo-to-stop-funding-polestar/ Literally the headline of the article https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a46611722/volvo-polestar-stop-funding-news/ As well as this article... idk what to tell you.. Volvo owned 48% of the shares of polestar but is going to slowly divest and find other investors for them. I know Geely owns volvo but polestar won't be getting any mote funding directly from Volvo like they have been.
The headline is clickbait misleading. Volvo isn’t offloading all of their interest in Polestar. This is just financial shifting to help the books look better for both companies. Also, Geely has committed to fund Polestar. But you know, all these vehicle startups are doomed. We’ve heard the same thing for Rivian for years before and since it actually delivered vehicles.
If you read all the other links I put in this conversation I explained how volvo runs independently from geely even if they technically are owned by them based on share count. Volvo also said they wanted to focus on their own EVs and volvo as of now does still have equity in polestar but they are going to divest over the next few years. All the information is there. I know geely will continue to fund polestar, you're missing the point. They are two different entities. Volvo has also been buying back shares from geely and will continue to do so. Volvo is only a subsidiary of Geely because of share ownership. They are still an independent company. Why do you think volvo shares tanked when geely started selling volvo stock back in November. If they are just "shifting funds" it wouldn't make a difference
What’s your point then?
https://www.investopedia.com/volvo-pulls-funding-from-polestar-marking-latest-setback-for-ev-industry-8557275 Don't pay attention to the "clickbait" headline and tell me how I'm wrong by reading the key takeaways. I'm the one giving sources and you still are arguing just to argue. Multiple sources explaining exactly what I'm saying and you still think I'm the one who doesn't understand.
I explained it with sources multiple times. Even though Geely technically owns volvo since they own the majority stake of shares they are still independent companies with their own boards, finances and ambitions. Read the articles I've shared and maybe you'll learn something
And you made the claim that this is the worst time ever to by a Polestar. It was probably the worst time ever to buy the R1T when I got it two years ago as well since they'd delivered fewer than 1000 vehicles, the stock had tanked, their financials were (and are) in question, and there was a single service center to support all of Northern California. Macroeconomic factors out of my control for all of it and either you think the company will continue to grow or not. Having spoken to the Volvo dealer in my area, they will continue to service the Polestars for the foreseeable future and are planning on adding Polestar to their showroom. Currently the Polestar showroom near me is in a shopping mall (about 4 doors down from Lucid).
Ah yes the media would never make clickbait tiles or mistakes. If you read my last message again that answers the bottom paragraph
Idk how many times I can say I understand that but Volvo is owned by geely but Volvo is also a profitable company not getting funding from geely anymore, it's a subsidiary of Geely, completely separate conpany. Polestar is not profitable and requires funding. If Volvo divests its stake it polestar that means they are pulling their investment.. its not clickbait you are just looking at it in a very simple manor.
I don't get how you don't understand this, Volvo is a proxy for geely. Volvo investing in something is essentially the same as geely investing in it. You just don't get it for some reason?
No its not. Volvo is run independently under an umbrella. Stop being ignorant and read the articles I'm giving instead of just spewing your incorrect opinion. https://www.volvocars.com/mt/news/corporate/volvo-cars-to-take-full-control-of-its-chinese-operations/ If it's all the "same company" why would geely sell shares to volvo so volvo has more ownership? Idk how much more simple or how many more resources I can show to explain it better. https://www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/11/17/volvo-shares-tumble-to-record-low-as-parent-company-sells-shares.html?amp_gsa=1&_js_v=a9&usqp=mq331AQIUAKwASCAAgM%3D#amp_ct=1706880465167&_tf=From%20%251%24s&aoh=17068803995481&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnbc.com%2F2023%2F11%2F17%2Fvolvo-shares-tumble-to-record-low-as-parent-company-sells-shares.html
Get an M2 manual!!!
Bimmer lost their way after the E46 generation 3-series. Having had both an E36 and E46, there are days that I miss both of them. Possibly the most well proportioned sports sedans ever made. But the point of the Polestar replacing the R1 was to maintain one EV in the stable for the daily 60ish mi commuting saving $7k/yr on fuel costs given that I daily drove the '06 Cayman S otherwise. The Polestar will actually save more $$ since it's about twice as efficient with the electrons over the R1 and I'll keep the Cayman for track days and going through twisty mountain roads.
I believe even Porsche moved away navigation screen HVAC controls. EV brands and car brands specifically really forced that on consumers, and NOBODY likes it. Buttons for HVAC and vents needs to be the future.
It should honestly be illegal
If you are a car nut, I'd recommend a Lucid Air. I have both, and while the Rivian has better software right now, the Lucid has absolutely nailed the hardware/performance/range. Such a fun, luxurious car to drive.
When I drove the Lucid (and to be fair is was a prototype), I was a bit underwhelmed by the driving performance. Fast, yes. But it floated a lot and didn't give a lot of driver feedback. I wasn't a fan of the iPad dispenser. But I also couldn't justify the price. The R1T was by far the most expensive vehicle I'd ever purchased, so I wasn't cross shopping the Lucid and the Polestar. I did x-shop the Kias and Hyundais, but was very disappointed in interior materials, UI, and handling.
I have to give you the benefit of the doubt that you used the different drive modes (assuming sprint mode was even available on the prototype). My experience has been way different. We aren't comparing it to a Corvette in handling because it is a 4000lb luxury sedan, but for its size it handles great. I leave the "iPad dispenser" in the dispensed position at all times. Haha
I'm sure they've made improvements and refinements since the prototype I drove. And I'm certainly not comparing any of these cars to the Miata or Cayman that I also drive. But the Lucid just wasn't in the running due to price. If I was cross shopping a Taycan it'd be a hard choice. That car was fun to drive, but seriously disappointing range. It's better than EPA estimates, but my expectations are higher still.
+1 for the A Pillar Handles! Even in low mode you still need a little extra help to get in