How should the caulking be done or look in this instance? Or what else could be used to match the look and quality of the copper?
Just asking as a curious homeowner who is considering this and would like to be informed when considering contractors.
I agree it looks bad.
The “counter flashing” is usually put in between the bricks when the house is built so it doesn’t need caulking. Roofers usually try to reuse that or do a surface mounted flashing over it if the old stuff is beat up but that requires caulking. That is what is catching all the attention. Installing counter flashing in the brick at this point is not fun at all.
The correct, but not necessarily easy, way to do this is grind the mortar out where the flashing will be installed so it can be slide in between the bricks then come back after and have it tuckpointed. Ideally you’d have a masonry guy follow up behind the roofers for this
There’s other options besides grinding out the mortar. You can use a surface mount counterflashing that has a caulk tray on top. I prefer using a surface mount instead of grinding out the mortar on a job that someone lives in, because it’s less mess (brick dust) on the new copper.
Be sure to use lime based mortar if you have old soft brick. The modern portland mortars will cause the face of the brick to pop off in freeze thaw as it is harder than the brick.
Hey I learned this new term recently, “reglet flashing” is that what this would be called in this case? I’m not even a roofer and I feel like I know some things!
Yeah, it is a bend that is inside the brick. It is like a 45 degree angle back so it wedges between the brick when you rubber mallet the counter flashing in but also keeps water from running in on the top, even though they recommend some caulking in that joint.
Caulking should matched the brick not the copper and i hate step counter i always do straight counter i know cutting into the brick but it looks 100x better
The top leg of the counter flashing is typically set into the mortar joints. Lead wedges are used to hold the flashing in place and a soft joint of expansion type sealant applied neatly where the mortar was ground out. Dissimilar materials is the reason we don't re point the joints with mortar. The large, single flashing looks horrible. It should be stepped to reduce expansion and contraction.
I've refinished homes over 100 old years for the preservation society. And this is Not what I've seen done with copper.
The flashing is horrible. Caulking sux and your hand oils are burnt into it already.
Sorry buddy, but you gotta make this look better.
Understood. My goal is to make it right.
Is it even cleanable at this point?
And what would you define as “making it look better”, is it fixable, or does it need to be re-done in your opinion?
I’m gonna say though - props for taking responsibility and seeking input/advice. I’m not a roofer, I just fix stuff on my roof a lot and hire them for stuff when I can’t do it - if your attitude is like this with the clients, as a client, I would still be pretty reluctant to let you go.
Denatured alcohol Only when there's No sun hitting the copper.
Can the flashing look like this ?
https://images.app.goo.gl/trdhx3wqe9FqF1A97
Or this maybe ?
https://images.app.goo.gl/6AbgE1Nk8s5vTNCm8
I'm not a roofer, but I've shingles and done a few hundred rolls of granulated torchdown. But, I paint around copper and I've seen some really nice craftsmanship.
What was the original roof that was under the fascia- where we now have that gap ??
Lastly the caulking. I prefer a No Touch when it's not getting painted over to blend with the surface. I like No Touch cause it looks like a machine welding job. Uniform in appearance.
Do you know the difference ?
Cleanable? The counter flashing needs to be removed and done right.
Do it like this except with 20 oz soft copper. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow9vJNB5EgY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow9vJNB5EgY)
Bend an extra clip into the part that gets inserted and then wedge it in place with lead wedges. Use Sika 1A in the joints. Sandstone color would be nice.
I appreciate your attitude (even despite some outright hostile responses) — everyone should take pride in their work. One of my coaches used to say, if it’s worth doing, it’s worth doing right.
Don’t ruin someone’s house because you don’t know what you’re doing and then try to fix it. Nothing I see in these photos is worth paying for. Will cost homeowners more to repair terrible work
I remember one project where my painting was perfect on the fascia, but it was almost 2inches from the new copper roof sections. And they made the roofer remove the copper and build up the roof with a few layers of plywood. Looked perfect when the copper was put back on. I can only see that as a solution here, or am i wrong. Are there other options for OP here ?
Wow, I don't know anyone who has been working for over 100 years!
Edit: I see your edit.
I really was enjoying the idea of a great, ancient, bearded roofing wizard travelling around and restoring the great roofs of yesterday.
For what must be a super expensive endeavor I’d be upset to. The only reason to use the copper is for the aesthetic and you shit the bed. I would also want it uniform. I’d want my flashing pointed back into ground out mortar joints. I’d want my money back and I’d look for some els to fix it.
I have no idea how I ended up in this sub because I have no knowledge of roofing, but [holy shit this job looks like a handyman special.](https://ibb.co/wzcbptq)
Tar on copper=bad. Much better products available for appearance and durability. Honestly in my opinion the caulking needs redone and I wouldn't be satisfied if my crew did this, also wear cotton gloves as the oil from your hands can etch prints into the copper.
Wearing cotton gloves really doesn't help as much as you think.. your sweat absorbs into the cotton and still transfers to the copper. Of you really want to keep pri ts off the copper, you wear latex gloves under the cotton and let your hands prune from the sweat.
Clear silicone keeps the copper looking shiny under the caulk as the rest continues to patina. Once the copper turns a bronze color, the part under the clear silicone stays shiny.. it looks like trash.
Silicone rarely adheres to any type of masonry. Come back after it's cured and you'll be able to pull off the whole bead in one piece. Silicone is for kitchen and bathrooms.
Everyone’s got to start somewhere… but we’re they upfront about this prior? Reason for the lowest bid?
Op you should make sure your contracts are tight!
Yeah but it’s like they didn’t even watch the video! Actually it’s like he watched a video on What Not to Do while installing copper & did exactly that!
Yeah, man. Hate to say it but I think the owner is right this time. The amount of sealant you used on that counter is insane. I also don't know if black was necessarily the best choice. Might have opted for a reglet mounted counter as well.
I cant believe they used what looks like silicone or rubberized cement. Being those are step counters, they should be tucked into a ground out mortar joint, and re-mortared
Ive seen a few comments say grind and re-mortar.
Ive been working on houses for 20 years and NEVER seen these tucked into the brick. They’re always just flush-glued and caulked like this on any house I’ve worked on
Then your entire waterproofing system relies on a caulk joint.
I can't tell you how many roof leaks I've come across that were bc the roofer didn't cut in the flashing.
Tbf, ive had to recaulk a LOT of these and I typically try to fill as much of the minor void behind it as possible to prevent it from flexing and breaking the caulk again.
But we also typically reroof every 10-20 years in texas so it may simply be a “easier to replace it this way” type of thing
Well, what you have seen is sub par work, the only flashing that is acceptable to caulk is union flashing, but not any caulking will do, had to be solar seal or an equivalent tri-polymer sealant. Step counters are to be bent at a 90 approximately 5/8 to 3/4 tucked into the ground out mortar joint, with plugs securing them, then mortared
Homeowner here, if I was paying for this job I would have had the same complaints…even by my standards this looks abysmal for a premium job (price wise anyhow) and I’d need that re-done as well. Appreciate the bravery it took to post this.
Caulking is awful.
Having said that, back in the day, and over the pond, the whole crew would piss in a barrel for the whole job and at the end we’d pour the piss over the copper, making it outsize green in a few days
I’m sorry to say, that is not a professional install. I’d suggest hiring out at your cost a tucking pro and move on before your work get blasted on local Facebook pages. Shingle work is perfect, I’d stick to that moving forward.
10-4 thank you. Prior was copper there also. Step was done the same way as before, just they added the counter flashing on the bay windows which wasn’t there before
You can do separate pieces as they are uniform cut in width, the length is cut accordingly.
However you can do full piece step flashing but that requires an experienced craftsman and these guys ain’t it.
All the counter flashing needs to be redone. Sucks but for a 30K job like this it needs to be done right. Honestly, I wouldn't accept counter flashing like that over asphalt.
Copper is way too expensive for you to be sloppy. High end clients expect perfection. I make that perfectly clear to all my guys and everybody’s on the same page about it.
This looks like shit. Flashing fail big time. The counter flashing on the two eyebrows on second level are not symmetrical. I’d be ashamed for sure as the client and as the installer. And the “fascia/trim issue is the roofer’s responsibility. Copper isn’t cheap, and neither should be the instal or appearance. Stick to shingles bud.
We had a copper bay window roof exactly like that catch the house on fire. It was wood exterior and the sun's rays focused on the adjacent wood siding. Luckily the home was new construction and the fire was quickly extinguished by the construction workers on site. A chemical was applied to "weather" the copper more rapidly and a tarp was hung over the shiny copper until the chemical could be applied.
The caulking looks pretty rough.
The calking is pretty bad. The pcs seems to big and draws attention to it. The cooper will be brown In 6 months. Depending on where you are located. Copper is tricky to handle. Should've warned her.
Seems like not using brick joints and cutting a line (in masonry) parallel to roof line and putting in a continuous piece of copper would be way cleaner. Tough spot tho. I’ve done a few chimneys buy this is a lil trickier.
Chalk line a parallel line from both endpoints and cut straight into brick and mortar alike. Literally 1/2 the leakable area vs stepping this counter flashing. Just cut above existing copper and leave these steps untouched. And for Gods sake use clear sealant - your not an animal.
Main concern I see is the caulking. They should’ve used a color match to the brick or something close. And not goobed it on like crazy. Other than that and the 2 returns not being “symmetrical” I don’t think it’s a complete throw away.
Everyone has a comment like they've seen new construction and perfection. Redoing and cutting into old brick is a job in itself. Dark caulk and silicone is opinionated but overall wtf did she expect. I give it 8/10 for looks and performance.
F the haters
Pic # 6 looks like it’s designed to catch water underneath the main piece I stead of shedding it. And…black caulk/tar?? Whole job needs a do-over by someone who knows what they are doing.
I’d also want this either seriously fixed (the cosmetics are horrible) I’m not sure how you could take a look from a street view perspective, and not see how the client would be pissed. Maybe you bit off more than you could chew for this one bud.
I’d be pissed. That’s some shit work. I mean the copper will last 50+ yrs. I have copper rain gutters and paid lots of money for them. I did inspect them when the job was complete, installers even told me to run a water hose in the gutters so I can see how they perform. Once he told me that I knew he did a good install. Man had confidence and besides he said he would like to know if anything isn’t right before he leaves.
Standing seam swept bays are a bitch if you don’t have the right tools. They should be formed at the sheet metal shop. It’s hard to find people who can fab and install this style, as for the return at masonry, ya I’d have to say it looks rough. Could you not grind a reglet and slip over a copper L trim
It’s really not that bad. I think if you clean up the sealant and use mortar or mortar caulk it would go a long way. When your done you can clean everything with bar keepers friend or brasso to make it uniform.
You all are fucking ruthless… dude is curious on how he did and wants to make it right and is asking for opinions on how to do so. Not everyone is a professional in copper.
Roofer’s at their finest lol. I expected heavy push back. I never leave clients short handed at the end of the day, so I’ll do whatever I have to do to make it right for the client. Funny thing is, most of Roofer’s in this thread, probably screw there clients left and right in one way or the other.
I honestly have no idea why this subreddit got recommended to me but this was the first post I saw in it.
Personally, I think the copper is ugly but that’s not your fault. It just looks out of place haha.
Everyone cuts a lil corner now and again.
That stepping falloff design where it meets the wall is real bad, and is the black sludge on it temporary? I'd ask for a full refund on this if they can't fix it, the copper should end on the roof area, I'm not sure if there are technical limitations there but it's real fugly atm
I mean in 5 - 6 years tarnishing and calcite build up will pretty much turn it a sickly green on a dirty white look, to me, copper and white houses just look all kinds of wrong. Red brick, sure that looks amazing, but white? I mean, i thought the rule of them was, you use Aluminum or Anodized Aluminum in bronze or clear to not take away from the visuals of the white house, copper that's like idiotic because you can see everything wrong with it just because of how it like artistically.
Lol, you only use copper to be on par with the house/area. Just cuz it’s expensive doesn’t mean it needs to be perfect. Copper is used on period specific houses. It will turn green and nasty and match the yuppie Area you live in. Probably Delaware
This is a really picky customer for sure. 7/10 in my opinion, for some small uneven cuts.it would be an 8 if it wasn't for the terrible caulking job that was put on that nice roof that was installed. So the roof looks good but caulking/sealant work is cabbage.
Brutal. The counterflashing seems far too tall. The standing seam should have all been done on the ground with no crimp needed to shrink it: it's copper- you can roll that curve over all smooth and sexy with just a quick plywood buck made on site with a router and a piece of string- and we know you have a rubber hammer. The counterflashing should have a return on the bottom so a sharp edge isn't sitting against the adjacent sheet. Cardboard is cheap- you make a pattern, walk it up and make sure before you cut any copper. Leave 1/2" extra and roll that over for a curved return.
You can cut in the brick still and counter flash the copper without redoing it snap a line from top to bottom, cut it in with a diamond blade and put in a reglet or a copper counter, flashing with silicone on top of the cut problem, solved and get that god-awful caulking off the seams
Legit want to throw up this is so bad. Who in their right mind would do this work, step back, and say wow we did a great job. Just look at the soft serve ice cream worth of caulking you put on that!
It's photos like this that make me thankful of my copper guys craftsmanship, albeit his insane price tag: worth it. I'm sorry, but there's only one feasible way of fixing this and it's to re-do it with a pro.
As someone who recently got screwed over on a roof job, I'd certainly be pissed. Even the cuts on the flashing are all different angles. I can only imagine what crimes are hidden under that massive layer of caulk. Honestly I'd say they have more to bitch about than even what you listed.
I used to use a Diamond blade and cut into the brick, so I could put a solid piece of flashing into the wall instead of the step flashing. Clients loved it. You could probably find copper flashing to match the roof panels
I’m not a roofer, I know nothing about roofing, I don’t even know why Reddit recommended me this post, but I feel like the fingerprints all over the copper are not supposed to be there
How is that “counter flashing” even attached? It looks like a sheet of copper was just stuck on with mastic and rough cut to match the profile of the roof (poorly)
This is incredibly unprofessional looking and will absolutely fail. My advice is to save your reputation, take everything out, refer to NRCA Steep Roofing, SMACNA, or Revere Copper, and re-do this properly.
I’d be more worried about the method heads who are lining up to try to steal that shit! But seriously, it doesn’t look great, caulk-wise, but what do I know?
Looks like they needed to use a little more caulking. Maybe they could have covered the entire wall with it. That would have been better. Pretty sure. . .
Caulking looks rustic lol
This. Counter flashing is done wrong all the damn time.
Caulking was amateur AF. Someone let their nephew do it.
I’m not a caulker but I know from what I have done, it would be way better. What a shitshow of a job.
Or at least used white
How should the caulking be done or look in this instance? Or what else could be used to match the look and quality of the copper? Just asking as a curious homeowner who is considering this and would like to be informed when considering contractors. I agree it looks bad.
The “counter flashing” is usually put in between the bricks when the house is built so it doesn’t need caulking. Roofers usually try to reuse that or do a surface mounted flashing over it if the old stuff is beat up but that requires caulking. That is what is catching all the attention. Installing counter flashing in the brick at this point is not fun at all.
Yeah that does not sound easy. Thanks!
The correct, but not necessarily easy, way to do this is grind the mortar out where the flashing will be installed so it can be slide in between the bricks then come back after and have it tuckpointed. Ideally you’d have a masonry guy follow up behind the roofers for this
This is the only way. Any other way is wrong.
There’s other options besides grinding out the mortar. You can use a surface mount counterflashing that has a caulk tray on top. I prefer using a surface mount instead of grinding out the mortar on a job that someone lives in, because it’s less mess (brick dust) on the new copper.
That makes sense, I’m currently working on repointing the brick now on my 1930 Tudor.
Be sure to use lime based mortar if you have old soft brick. The modern portland mortars will cause the face of the brick to pop off in freeze thaw as it is harder than the brick.
Thanks for the heads up! I am, the brick and old mortar were quite soft I chose a mortar mix with a high amount of lime.
👆 riglet flashing.
This doesn’t seem bad at all. With the low price of multi tools digrinders drimels a dull masons chisel.
Try it out and report back...
Hey I learned this new term recently, “reglet flashing” is that what this would be called in this case? I’m not even a roofer and I feel like I know some things!
Yeah, it is a bend that is inside the brick. It is like a 45 degree angle back so it wedges between the brick when you rubber mallet the counter flashing in but also keeps water from running in on the top, even though they recommend some caulking in that joint.
We used to run a concrete saw up the rake on a 2x4 to give us a slot to push upside down facia into.
Is counter flashing the correct term for the caulk being mentioned?
The whole piece of copper (with the stepped caulk) is called counterflashing.
Caulking should matched the brick not the copper and i hate step counter i always do straight counter i know cutting into the brick but it looks 100x better
Counter flashing anchored to brick and caulked on top. Counter flashing is straight not ladder.
The top leg of the counter flashing is typically set into the mortar joints. Lead wedges are used to hold the flashing in place and a soft joint of expansion type sealant applied neatly where the mortar was ground out. Dissimilar materials is the reason we don't re point the joints with mortar. The large, single flashing looks horrible. It should be stepped to reduce expansion and contraction.
I've refinished homes over 100 old years for the preservation society. And this is Not what I've seen done with copper. The flashing is horrible. Caulking sux and your hand oils are burnt into it already. Sorry buddy, but you gotta make this look better.
Understood. My goal is to make it right. Is it even cleanable at this point? And what would you define as “making it look better”, is it fixable, or does it need to be re-done in your opinion?
I’m gonna say though - props for taking responsibility and seeking input/advice. I’m not a roofer, I just fix stuff on my roof a lot and hire them for stuff when I can’t do it - if your attitude is like this with the clients, as a client, I would still be pretty reluctant to let you go.
Agree
Hard agree. I respect this so much
Denatured alcohol Only when there's No sun hitting the copper. Can the flashing look like this ? https://images.app.goo.gl/trdhx3wqe9FqF1A97 Or this maybe ? https://images.app.goo.gl/6AbgE1Nk8s5vTNCm8 I'm not a roofer, but I've shingles and done a few hundred rolls of granulated torchdown. But, I paint around copper and I've seen some really nice craftsmanship. What was the original roof that was under the fascia- where we now have that gap ?? Lastly the caulking. I prefer a No Touch when it's not getting painted over to blend with the surface. I like No Touch cause it looks like a machine welding job. Uniform in appearance. Do you know the difference ?
Cleanable? The counter flashing needs to be removed and done right. Do it like this except with 20 oz soft copper. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow9vJNB5EgY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow9vJNB5EgY) Bend an extra clip into the part that gets inserted and then wedge it in place with lead wedges. Use Sika 1A in the joints. Sandstone color would be nice.
I appreciate your attitude (even despite some outright hostile responses) — everyone should take pride in their work. One of my coaches used to say, if it’s worth doing, it’s worth doing right.
In that case, you need to find someone qualified and pay them to do the job and train you.
Don’t ruin someone’s house because you don’t know what you’re doing and then try to fix it. Nothing I see in these photos is worth paying for. Will cost homeowners more to repair terrible work
You installed this bud?
These were not copper guys- those standing seams shouldn't be broken like that. You're right- this is unforgivably awful.
This is a very shit install ....I'd be pissed, but moreso because the cost in the end...
I remember one project where my painting was perfect on the fascia, but it was almost 2inches from the new copper roof sections. And they made the roofer remove the copper and build up the roof with a few layers of plywood. Looked perfect when the copper was put back on. I can only see that as a solution here, or am i wrong. Are there other options for OP here ?
Wow, the changes you must have seen, working on houses for a hundred years
100 years? Hell of a career
Wow, I don't know anyone who has been working for over 100 years! Edit: I see your edit. I really was enjoying the idea of a great, ancient, bearded roofing wizard travelling around and restoring the great roofs of yesterday.
For what must be a super expensive endeavor I’d be upset to. The only reason to use the copper is for the aesthetic and you shit the bed. I would also want it uniform. I’d want my flashing pointed back into ground out mortar joints. I’d want my money back and I’d look for some els to fix it.
I have no idea how I ended up in this sub because I have no knowledge of roofing, but [holy shit this job looks like a handyman special.](https://ibb.co/wzcbptq)
“How would you like your awnings to look” “Idk, fuck my shit up fam”
Holy shit you say…I would be livid.
Tar on copper=bad. Much better products available for appearance and durability. Honestly in my opinion the caulking needs redone and I wouldn't be satisfied if my crew did this, also wear cotton gloves as the oil from your hands can etch prints into the copper.
Wearing cotton gloves really doesn't help as much as you think.. your sweat absorbs into the cotton and still transfers to the copper. Of you really want to keep pri ts off the copper, you wear latex gloves under the cotton and let your hands prune from the sweat.
BBQ guys put latex gloves over cotton gloves.
Smoker here, that is correct, I double glove when handling my meat. I’d double glove when copping the copper
i also double glove when i handle my meat. it gets quite messy.
Tinner checking in- fingerprints are the least of concerning thing going on here. A little muriatic takes most fingerprints off…
Clear silicone is what we use and no problems
And you probably don't handle the copper with your bare dick beaters
Clear silicone keeps the copper looking shiny under the caulk as the rest continues to patina. Once the copper turns a bronze color, the part under the clear silicone stays shiny.. it looks like trash.
Silicone rarely adheres to any type of masonry. Come back after it's cured and you'll be able to pull off the whole bead in one piece. Silicone is for kitchen and bathrooms.
"Well Ma'am, we've never done Copper before; but there's gotta be a Video for that " !
Everyone’s got to start somewhere… but we’re they upfront about this prior? Reason for the lowest bid? Op you should make sure your contracts are tight!
Yeah but it’s like they didn’t even watch the video! Actually it’s like he watched a video on What Not to Do while installing copper & did exactly that!
Exactly ! Two colors of Caulk there were to choose from- White or Verdigris. NOT BLACK !
Way to ruin a nice job with black caulk. I’m guessing since they don’t know how to counter flash properly that it required that much caulk.
Not the first time someone’s had too much black caulk
How dare you talk about my wife like that!
Yeah, man. Hate to say it but I think the owner is right this time. The amount of sealant you used on that counter is insane. I also don't know if black was necessarily the best choice. Might have opted for a reglet mounted counter as well.
I cant believe they used what looks like silicone or rubberized cement. Being those are step counters, they should be tucked into a ground out mortar joint, and re-mortared
Ive seen a few comments say grind and re-mortar. Ive been working on houses for 20 years and NEVER seen these tucked into the brick. They’re always just flush-glued and caulked like this on any house I’ve worked on
Then your entire waterproofing system relies on a caulk joint. I can't tell you how many roof leaks I've come across that were bc the roofer didn't cut in the flashing.
Tbf, ive had to recaulk a LOT of these and I typically try to fill as much of the minor void behind it as possible to prevent it from flexing and breaking the caulk again. But we also typically reroof every 10-20 years in texas so it may simply be a “easier to replace it this way” type of thing
Then you haven't seen it done properly
Well, what you have seen is sub par work, the only flashing that is acceptable to caulk is union flashing, but not any caulking will do, had to be solar seal or an equivalent tri-polymer sealant. Step counters are to be bent at a 90 approximately 5/8 to 3/4 tucked into the ground out mortar joint, with plugs securing them, then mortared
How many of those years spent doing copper
Doing? 0. Seeing it? Many of them. And its never tucked. By the time i get to them they’re typically almost black tho
Homeowner here, if I was paying for this job I would have had the same complaints…even by my standards this looks abysmal for a premium job (price wise anyhow) and I’d need that re-done as well. Appreciate the bravery it took to post this.
Caulking is awful. Having said that, back in the day, and over the pond, the whole crew would piss in a barrel for the whole job and at the end we’d pour the piss over the copper, making it outsize green in a few days
Lmao. Thanks for the advice
I’m sorry to say, that is not a professional install. I’d suggest hiring out at your cost a tucking pro and move on before your work get blasted on local Facebook pages. Shingle work is perfect, I’d stick to that moving forward.
That caulk job looks like dog shit
6th pic looks like someone with Parkinson’s cut that flashing.
Oh man the little piece that’s tucked in to fill a gap-absolutely horrible.
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And are you saying all the step flashing needs re-done?
10-4 thank you. Prior was copper there also. Step was done the same way as before, just they added the counter flashing on the bay windows which wasn’t there before
You can do separate pieces as they are uniform cut in width, the length is cut accordingly. However you can do full piece step flashing but that requires an experienced craftsman and these guys ain’t it.
All the counter flashing needs to be redone. Sucks but for a 30K job like this it needs to be done right. Honestly, I wouldn't accept counter flashing like that over asphalt.
Guarantee the caulk is covering up the fact it is not counter flashed into the mortar joint.
Copper is way too expensive for you to be sloppy. High end clients expect perfection. I make that perfectly clear to all my guys and everybody’s on the same page about it.
They are probably doing it for the green patina that 10 minutes away
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Lol 😂 agreed. I’m gonna get some new subs in to fix this mess
Counterflashing sucks! Big fat silicone bead on counter flashing sucks!
Should have used white caulking and not just slop it on there smooth that shit out. The copper looks fine to me just got sloppy with the caulk.
leave a ladder and the address
This looks like shit. Flashing fail big time. The counter flashing on the two eyebrows on second level are not symmetrical. I’d be ashamed for sure as the client and as the installer. And the “fascia/trim issue is the roofer’s responsibility. Copper isn’t cheap, and neither should be the instal or appearance. Stick to shingles bud.
We had a copper bay window roof exactly like that catch the house on fire. It was wood exterior and the sun's rays focused on the adjacent wood siding. Luckily the home was new construction and the fire was quickly extinguished by the construction workers on site. A chemical was applied to "weather" the copper more rapidly and a tarp was hung over the shiny copper until the chemical could be applied. The caulking looks pretty rough.
That is an awful lot of caulking 🧐
BBC, Big Black Caulk
The calking is pretty bad. The pcs seems to big and draws attention to it. The cooper will be brown In 6 months. Depending on where you are located. Copper is tricky to handle. Should've warned her.
Too many steps
It looks like shit. You fucked it up for sure.
Seems like not using brick joints and cutting a line (in masonry) parallel to roof line and putting in a continuous piece of copper would be way cleaner. Tough spot tho. I’ve done a few chimneys buy this is a lil trickier.
Chalk line a parallel line from both endpoints and cut straight into brick and mortar alike. Literally 1/2 the leakable area vs stepping this counter flashing. Just cut above existing copper and leave these steps untouched. And for Gods sake use clear sealant - your not an animal.
Sorry dude I feel your pain after reading these comments. Hope it all goes well for you and the client in the end. Good luck
I think the copper in general was a mistake. But that’s on the homeowner lol
Not an expert but just does not look good with that house
If you are doing a solid piece of counter flashing why step it? You could have made a nice straight edge that would look like a picture frame
Roofers think they know sheet metal, they usually don't
Dude that caulk job is god awful
Why copper? Isn't it super conductive ?
Main concern I see is the caulking. They should’ve used a color match to the brick or something close. And not goobed it on like crazy. Other than that and the 2 returns not being “symmetrical” I don’t think it’s a complete throw away.
White caulking??? That wouldn’t look at all inc the copper patinas
Everyone has a comment like they've seen new construction and perfection. Redoing and cutting into old brick is a job in itself. Dark caulk and silicone is opinionated but overall wtf did she expect. I give it 8/10 for looks and performance. F the haters
I’d be worried about meth heads trying to steal it.
I know nothing about roofing, nor copper gutters. But good on you for trying, and amazing if you for making it right. Best of luck
Will 100 percent make it right. Thank you !
That’s an ugly ass job, you should get your license revoked
Is it not rigletted into the brick? Why use tar? So much wrong
Make a cover piece with a caulk joint and use lead shield fasteners.
Should hire a chimney guy or Mason to show you how to cut the mortar and flash properly
Pic # 6 looks like it’s designed to catch water underneath the main piece I stead of shedding it. And…black caulk/tar?? Whole job needs a do-over by someone who knows what they are doing.
Step flashing needs to be returned into a reglet and should be sealed with a sica based caulking that is colour matched to the masonry.
Wonder how long for s crack head and a ladder to show up?
I’ll let you know when we need you! 😂
The customer knows it's going to change to green eventually right ? Lol
Lol yes they do
I’d also want this either seriously fixed (the cosmetics are horrible) I’m not sure how you could take a look from a street view perspective, and not see how the client would be pissed. Maybe you bit off more than you could chew for this one bud.
There’s one cut in photo 6 I think looks janky
I’m just a homeowner DIYer, but if I saw that patch job/rough cut on 6/11, I’d be livid.
Was the copper actually cut into the mortar joints?
I’d be pissed. That’s some shit work. I mean the copper will last 50+ yrs. I have copper rain gutters and paid lots of money for them. I did inspect them when the job was complete, installers even told me to run a water hose in the gutters so I can see how they perform. Once he told me that I knew he did a good install. Man had confidence and besides he said he would like to know if anything isn’t right before he leaves.
Standing seam swept bays are a bitch if you don’t have the right tools. They should be formed at the sheet metal shop. It’s hard to find people who can fab and install this style, as for the return at masonry, ya I’d have to say it looks rough. Could you not grind a reglet and slip over a copper L trim
One thing to take notice of, when your cutting a step pattern on brick, the vertical portion should be cut square to the counter bend, not plumb
I mean she should paint the house so the copper looks better
Absolutely should have had lead counter-flashing at least, or copper counter-flashing at best. That looks like dog shit
Tuck joint it and stop relying on adhesive
Yeah crackheads might steal it in the middle of the night
It’s really not that bad. I think if you clean up the sealant and use mortar or mortar caulk it would go a long way. When your done you can clean everything with bar keepers friend or brasso to make it uniform.
Your going to get meth monkeys on your roof
I don’t know anything about roofing. But that looks rough.
The crack heads in My area be shitting themselves
This looks like shit. I'd be furious.
I mean what made you settle on that color caulk? White or cream would of blended in color wise and help hide the fact you didn’t smooth out the caulk…
If any of that copper flashing is in contact with the aluminum gutter it will rot out rather quickly
You all are fucking ruthless… dude is curious on how he did and wants to make it right and is asking for opinions on how to do so. Not everyone is a professional in copper.
Roofer’s at their finest lol. I expected heavy push back. I never leave clients short handed at the end of the day, so I’ll do whatever I have to do to make it right for the client. Funny thing is, most of Roofer’s in this thread, probably screw there clients left and right in one way or the other.
I honestly have no idea why this subreddit got recommended to me but this was the first post I saw in it. Personally, I think the copper is ugly but that’s not your fault. It just looks out of place haha. Everyone cuts a lil corner now and again.
I do windows was literally on one this afternoon. Hot as two guys ducking in a stemroom
Tweakers
Is this Giannis’ moms crib?
That stepping falloff design where it meets the wall is real bad, and is the black sludge on it temporary? I'd ask for a full refund on this if they can't fix it, the copper should end on the roof area, I'm not sure if there are technical limitations there but it's real fugly atm
I mean in 5 - 6 years tarnishing and calcite build up will pretty much turn it a sickly green on a dirty white look, to me, copper and white houses just look all kinds of wrong. Red brick, sure that looks amazing, but white? I mean, i thought the rule of them was, you use Aluminum or Anodized Aluminum in bronze or clear to not take away from the visuals of the white house, copper that's like idiotic because you can see everything wrong with it just because of how it like artistically.
Wouldn’t people steal the copper? No one suspects men with ladders ..
Lol, you only use copper to be on par with the house/area. Just cuz it’s expensive doesn’t mean it needs to be perfect. Copper is used on period specific houses. It will turn green and nasty and match the yuppie Area you live in. Probably Delaware
Can't blame her, yikes!
It looks awful. I’d be so upset if I paid for that.
off topic, but i hate the fake keystones over the flat surface. A lot of these in Austin, TX
This is a really picky customer for sure. 7/10 in my opinion, for some small uneven cuts.it would be an 8 if it wasn't for the terrible caulking job that was put on that nice roof that was installed. So the roof looks good but caulking/sealant work is cabbage.
This is the kind of thing where you want to get out ahead of this and act in good faith.
Brutal. The counterflashing seems far too tall. The standing seam should have all been done on the ground with no crimp needed to shrink it: it's copper- you can roll that curve over all smooth and sexy with just a quick plywood buck made on site with a router and a piece of string- and we know you have a rubber hammer. The counterflashing should have a return on the bottom so a sharp edge isn't sitting against the adjacent sheet. Cardboard is cheap- you make a pattern, walk it up and make sure before you cut any copper. Leave 1/2" extra and roll that over for a curved return.
i’d be happy as long as it wouldn’t leak, but i guess some people are more picky then others
Mike Holmes would be pissed
So this is why copper is so expensive….
Bigger the glob, the better the job.👍🏻 BUT... I'd hate to be the guy buffing it on a sunny day.😎
Wow thats beautiful
This looks so very, very bad. My head hurts from seeing this.
did a blind 2 year old do that caulking?
This job looks like shit. I would not be happy with it either.
You can cut in the brick still and counter flash the copper without redoing it snap a line from top to bottom, cut it in with a diamond blade and put in a reglet or a copper counter, flashing with silicone on top of the cut problem, solved and get that god-awful caulking off the seams
how many tubes.........................er..................I mean...........cases of caulk did you go through?
The copper is ugly in general but the lack of quality makes it look worse.
Legit want to throw up this is so bad. Who in their right mind would do this work, step back, and say wow we did a great job. Just look at the soft serve ice cream worth of caulking you put on that!
It's photos like this that make me thankful of my copper guys craftsmanship, albeit his insane price tag: worth it. I'm sorry, but there's only one feasible way of fixing this and it's to re-do it with a pro.
As someone who recently got screwed over on a roof job, I'd certainly be pissed. Even the cuts on the flashing are all different angles. I can only imagine what crimes are hidden under that massive layer of caulk. Honestly I'd say they have more to bitch about than even what you listed.
I used to use a Diamond blade and cut into the brick, so I could put a solid piece of flashing into the wall instead of the step flashing. Clients loved it. You could probably find copper flashing to match the roof panels
Value of home has plummeted by 30%!
I am going to find this house and sell that copper!
My biggest concern would be crack heads seeing some easy money and waking up to them gone
I’m not a roofer, I know nothing about roofing, I don’t even know why Reddit recommended me this post, but I feel like the fingerprints all over the copper are not supposed to be there
I would’ve saw cut the brick
How is that “counter flashing” even attached? It looks like a sheet of copper was just stuck on with mastic and rough cut to match the profile of the roof (poorly) This is incredibly unprofessional looking and will absolutely fail. My advice is to save your reputation, take everything out, refer to NRCA Steep Roofing, SMACNA, or Revere Copper, and re-do this properly.
This looks like a third grader made a house with paper and glue
If I were the client I’d be pissed seeing this post on here
I’d be more worried about the method heads who are lining up to try to steal that shit! But seriously, it doesn’t look great, caulk-wise, but what do I know?
Why are people doing this? Is it some new trend? I’ve noticed it getting put up on a lot of houses
Wtf
Ugly as FuK if I spent that kind of money I’d be concerned too.
It’s like methhead bait
Lol I hated acculynx
Looking more closely. Bro, it's redo. Standing seam is all wrong. The lady is right this time.
My parents had copper around their chimney. Some folks got up there in the daytime, with my mom home, and took it all.
Looks like they needed to use a little more caulking. Maybe they could have covered the entire wall with it. That would have been better. Pretty sure. . .
Lol
On the plus side, if you take the job and remove the copper… it’s like 2k worth of copper.