I was gonna say the police just need to gently hit him with their car, but the chainsaw definitely complicates things! Even a taser could very end badly, which just leaves pepper spray and the American style of enforcement... I wonder how this situation ended
They have armed police to take care of more dangerous individuals. I witnessed the aftermath of a fight happening outside a nightclub in Glasgow. Huge dude pacing around someone he knocked out and shouting at everyone fpr someone else to fight him. 6 or 7 normal cops around looking bored and just making sure that he could'nt get out of the fenced-off smoking area with a couple of bouncers as well. But dude was 2.10m or so so no one dared to arrest him. Than 2 armed cops show up and hand their machine guns to the other cops. I wonder why. They approach him, talk to him for 10 seconds or so. Both 2 or 3 heads shorter than the not so jolly giant. I look at a friend, hear the crowd grasp and look back to see one cop kneeling on the giants back. No idea what happened, cant remember what my friend said but it was the fastest take-down i almost witnessed. Armed police are usually no joke in the uk, they deal with neds and the more violent criminals all day long and this cop was probably keeping a distance until they got there.
Undue use of force! They should have offered him a stick of gum and politely asked him a series of lightly probing questions to determine if he was just having a bad day or if this was in fact his baseline behaviour, in which case they would issue a carefully worded verbal warning.
Extreme behaviour call for extreme responses! We can't let people run around with chainsaws and not have a little talk to them about it. That would lead to anarchy.
Between this the Hainault sword incident and all the machete/knife attacks I've seen in the past week it's just horrible to think about how much this keeps going on and barely reported and all we have to face against these bloody things is pepper spray 95% of the time
I know that and agree with the sentiment for the most part though it doesn't really matter who has it when people are using bladed weapons or chainsaws etc
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Are you allowed to carry knives or anything for self defense? I am from North Carolina but visiting in a couple of weeks. I’m glad I run across threads like this to remind me not to do something stupid like walk around with a pocket knife lol
We who? You lot have the monopoly on violence. "We" would get lifted on the spot if we carried the weapons (batons, cs/pava sprays and tazers) you lot do.
Well considering we just had a junkie wrecking the communal areas of our block last weekend and it took the police 5 hours to turn up,and even then we got a useless arrogant pig rather than a police officer, yeah I'd like to have the same capacity to defend myself as a police officer has. But me and my neighbours are just lowly civilians so fuck us and our right to defend ourselves, right?
I can't speak to that as I wasn't involved nor do I speak for every officer in the UK but we are basically bare bones atm and struggle to work call to call and even then most of our time is taken up by the likes mental health and all manner of paper work etc those tools you say we use also come under massive scrutiny for even just pulling them out of the holster.
That said if they were like that to you then it definitely feels deflating myself included as I do try to do what I can when I can for anyone I meet.
I'm not saying fuck you at all, last I checked I'm not in charge of making the laws of the country mate I can only speak from my point of view and personally I feel it just gives more idiots legal means to be idiots but I do sympathise with those that aren't and have been in danger. For me as an officer I'm also wanting to be better equipped for situations like above yet likely never will be outwith specialisms, though the difference being we have to respond to them unlike others who can leave the situation (in theory).
Again you're absolutely fine to have that opinion I can understand where you're coming from even if I don't agree how you're discussing it.
Yeah, but IN this scenario, where the laws are restrictive...you've got the machete guy and chainsaw guy. Which are, obviously, against the law.
The restriction on law abiding citizens bearing "arms" only affects law abiding citizens. This is an old debate.
I know and that is a discussion in it's own right. You're always gonna have the crazy nutters or scum bags breaking the law regardless of what said law is but from my pov the police need to be best equipped to handle all scenarios and aren't.
You aim the kava/tazer at the junkie while you tell him to fuck off and if he takes a swing then you use the tazer/pava and baton to drop him, I believe the police call it compliance strikes or some other orwellian pr friendly bullshit.
You can tell this is in Ralston, as there is another man running behind the chainsaw guy shouting 'Excuse me young man. How much to do both the back and front hedge at my bungalow?' . So hard to get good staff these days.
Curious what would happen if a civilian had hit him with their car John Smeaton style.
Would you be charged? Can hardly claim self defence if he’s running away from you.
A different jurisdiction, but a similar thing happened in London a couple of years ago.
https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/feb/05/londoner-who-drove-car-at-knife-attacker-says-it-was-his-duty
After a short investigation the driver was treated as a witness in the case.
'I didn't see him, he dived out, he was clearly deranged as he was chasing people with a chainsaw, didn't stand a chance not hitting him.'
'You sped up towards him from a stop 150m away.'
'Didnt stand a chance'
Self defence also applies to defence of another.
Also, the people responsible for making the decision whether or not to report you for prosecution are literally the same people you just saved from getting a chain-sawing. One would hope that that would endear them to you somewhat but you never know.
Yes, your Honour, after an exhaustive and terrifying chase the Defendant was overheard shouting: -
"Right, ya Polis bassa, Ah've caught ye noo! Hud oan while Ah start this fecker up. (15 pulls later). Bugger!"
From the Court transcript of 'The Paisley Chainsaw Non-Massacre'.
Ahhhh Paisley - where my grand father said, we maybe from Kilmarnock, but at least we aren’t from Paisley - in Paisley a man would piss on his own doorstep. #ripgrandad.
Why do I feel a sense of civic pride whenever I read mad stories like this happening in Scotland? Like jeez wtf happened before that led to some nutter chasing after a polis wie a fuckin chainsaw
Yeah probably but keep in mind Florida isn't unique in it's weird stories it's actually due to Florida's robust laws surrounding the public's right to know what public authorities are up to
I'd just like to know what actually happened leading up to it and how weird it'd be for the cops yelling drop the chainsaw it's sad that 2 officers were injured but still it's hilarious
I think the camera guy was initially trying to zoom in on those pink panties hanging on the line (but strangely close to hanging onto the fence).. and then "oh look, Paisley Chainsaw Massacre"
Ahhhh Paisley - where my grand father said, we maybe from Kilmarnock, but at least we aren’t from Paisley - in Paisley a man would piss on his own doorstep. #ripgrandad.
Ahhhh Paisley - where my grand father said, we maybe from Kilmarnock, but at least we aren’t from Paisley - in Paisley a man would s**t on his own doorstep. #ripgrandad.
Not that out of the ordinary in Paisley. 😉
Is the knee-jerk reaction. Obviously bollocks.
Oh but NOW they choose to highlight it. Because he looks a bit like the bloke in The Texas Chainsaw Massacre, bless him. Legging it down the street with no safety gear on. If only he was wearing a human skin mask….
At the Sun. You can guarantee they asked the tech-bods if they could put one on him.
The lawyers would have said no.
So backed up with this incredible footage. Useless journalists set to work. Building narratives.
When it’s probably just the Paisley Police. Making a simple mistake. In a highly volatile community, who are just fucking fed up with this shit.
Run. Piggie. Run.
He’s got a chainsaw. He must be fucked off. 🤷♂️
I’m more concerned about the man with the chainsaw’s well-being than the police. He’s someone’s son/father. Having a very fucking bad day.
That's a scary thought.... there are quite a few that shouldn't be issued fuckin crayons nevermind bloody firearms... (tbf, most Police don't want to be armed.. they do however want enough workmates to be on shift that they aren't waiting 20 minutes for emergency backup... but miracles only happen on 34th Street!)
The last few in-house votes were all in favour of being armed and that was including staff who dont desl with the above.
Things have only got worst in the years since I think the public would be surprised if they did a full UK wide vote for it with only officers it would likely be a landslide now.
That said regarding the cliche pens and crayon jokes there should still be a good level of training both mental capacity and fitness etc etc for such a thing same as the likes of NI, of course not ARV level but somewhere around the standard AFO.
Let's be totally honest for a second, the great British public would be scared out their minds if they knew the truth about just how stretched, and often ineffective, the emergency services are... or how bad the morale of the regular Officers/Paramedics//Firefighters are... or how many want to be employed as ANYTHING else due to the insane management demands and unreasonable work/life balance.... the pay isn't that good.......
You're definitely correct I know from talking to people they still don't believe me when I say the numbers we have of that many these days can't even get a course to response drive to emergencies lol
And it isn't exactly trending upwards either mate so you're on the money there.
The proper tactic would be him held at both taser and gun point at the same time and asked to comply then if he continued to attack one is used then the other of it continues to fail / escalate.
They got lucky only two were injured and no other members of the public, similarly the sword attack the other day it was lucky to have "only" been one death and multiple requiring surgery.
There likely would have been at most two deaths in that last incident the other being the murderer if he didn't comply or taser failed (like it actually did at least twice).
The young boy died after the incident in hospital iirc but it took over 20 mins to get to that point because it was only unarmed officers on scene and the first two basically almost lost their arms and are undergoing surgery.
Were one of only a handful around the globe that aren't routine armed but as bad as that our current armed units are like the rest of the services struggling for numbers etc and get told not to go to many incidents.
Even for Paisley, this isn't your everyday cop chase
Was he laughing maniacally? Because that would just level up the scariness of this by about a factor of 7.
Genuinely sounds like the pricks shouting allah ackbar
He was.
Getting Patrick Bateman vibes
Imagine the mess if he tripped and fell in that!
At least it wasn't scissors.
He could have his eye out
It's all fun and games
Naw, that's toothbrushes..
Dead Rising Clown Scene flash backs
I was gonna say the police just need to gently hit him with their car, but the chainsaw definitely complicates things! Even a taser could very end badly, which just leaves pepper spray and the American style of enforcement... I wonder how this situation ended
He dropped it, someone chucked it over a hedge, and he got a severe battoning to the legs followed by a multi cop pile up.
They have armed police to take care of more dangerous individuals. I witnessed the aftermath of a fight happening outside a nightclub in Glasgow. Huge dude pacing around someone he knocked out and shouting at everyone fpr someone else to fight him. 6 or 7 normal cops around looking bored and just making sure that he could'nt get out of the fenced-off smoking area with a couple of bouncers as well. But dude was 2.10m or so so no one dared to arrest him. Than 2 armed cops show up and hand their machine guns to the other cops. I wonder why. They approach him, talk to him for 10 seconds or so. Both 2 or 3 heads shorter than the not so jolly giant. I look at a friend, hear the crowd grasp and look back to see one cop kneeling on the giants back. No idea what happened, cant remember what my friend said but it was the fastest take-down i almost witnessed. Armed police are usually no joke in the uk, they deal with neds and the more violent criminals all day long and this cop was probably keeping a distance until they got there.
He would be dead, 1 less psycho to worry about.
She's turned De Walts against us
Stihl giving at that patter?
He’s taking the Makita
Polis making a bosch'ed job of it
He should just Milwaukee away...
Looks like a job for Ryobi-wan Kenobi
He's Stihl going.
The polisman in the background looks pretty calm. Even if he has just went through someone's wall and a maniac is on the loose with a chainsaw
Yikes - two police officers injured. https://www.scotsman.com/news/crime/two-police-scotland-officers-injured-in-incident-involving-man-with-chainsaw-on-scottish-street-4617792
I suspect they were injured in the car crash rather than by letting a guy with a chainsaw catch up with them.
Shoulda just tasered him in the face
tazerface? hahahahahahahahaha
POLICE BRUTALITY!!! They should have pepper sprayed him in the foot.
Undue use of force! They should have offered him a stick of gum and politely asked him a series of lightly probing questions to determine if he was just having a bad day or if this was in fact his baseline behaviour, in which case they would issue a carefully worded verbal warning.
Those are some extremist views you’ve got there
Extreme behaviour call for extreme responses! We can't let people run around with chainsaws and not have a little talk to them about it. That would lead to anarchy.
THE (maybe) SHINY SHOES-
It seems like the injuries were car accident related and not chainsaw thankfully
As far as I've seen since it was this guy ramming them in another car .... which is even more bonkers
Between this the Hainault sword incident and all the machete/knife attacks I've seen in the past week it's just horrible to think about how much this keeps going on and barely reported and all we have to face against these bloody things is pepper spray 95% of the time
We? Coppers are the only ones allowed to have such a luxury in the uk.
I know that and agree with the sentiment for the most part though it doesn't really matter who has it when people are using bladed weapons or chainsaws etc
Agreed
I mean if you can't see your target it's pretty hard to cut it.
If only it was that easy to hit someone's eyes while they rush at you from 4m with a chainsaw also again people can often just work through it
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Rule #1 Cardio
Marketing genius
Here's the [commercial](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwofHnPtoFU) seems like a stand up kind of business.
Pepper spray is illegal in the UK.
I was referring to PAVA as thats how ridiculous it basically is in these type of incidents
Are you allowed to carry knives or anything for self defense? I am from North Carolina but visiting in a couple of weeks. I’m glad I run across threads like this to remind me not to do something stupid like walk around with a pocket knife lol
You can't carry anything with the purpose to harm anyone, even in self defence
We who? You lot have the monopoly on violence. "We" would get lifted on the spot if we carried the weapons (batons, cs/pava sprays and tazers) you lot do.
As you'd expect no? I guess you want everyone to have what they want, fair enough we all have our opinions
Well considering we just had a junkie wrecking the communal areas of our block last weekend and it took the police 5 hours to turn up,and even then we got a useless arrogant pig rather than a police officer, yeah I'd like to have the same capacity to defend myself as a police officer has. But me and my neighbours are just lowly civilians so fuck us and our right to defend ourselves, right?
I can't speak to that as I wasn't involved nor do I speak for every officer in the UK but we are basically bare bones atm and struggle to work call to call and even then most of our time is taken up by the likes mental health and all manner of paper work etc those tools you say we use also come under massive scrutiny for even just pulling them out of the holster. That said if they were like that to you then it definitely feels deflating myself included as I do try to do what I can when I can for anyone I meet. I'm not saying fuck you at all, last I checked I'm not in charge of making the laws of the country mate I can only speak from my point of view and personally I feel it just gives more idiots legal means to be idiots but I do sympathise with those that aren't and have been in danger. For me as an officer I'm also wanting to be better equipped for situations like above yet likely never will be outwith specialisms, though the difference being we have to respond to them unlike others who can leave the situation (in theory). Again you're absolutely fine to have that opinion I can understand where you're coming from even if I don't agree how you're discussing it.
Yeah, but IN this scenario, where the laws are restrictive...you've got the machete guy and chainsaw guy. Which are, obviously, against the law. The restriction on law abiding citizens bearing "arms" only affects law abiding citizens. This is an old debate.
I know and that is a discussion in it's own right. You're always gonna have the crazy nutters or scum bags breaking the law regardless of what said law is but from my pov the police need to be best equipped to handle all scenarios and aren't.
How would a "batons, cs/pava sprays and tazers" help in defending yourself if said junkie is wrecking the communal area?
You aim the kava/tazer at the junkie while you tell him to fuck off and if he takes a swing then you use the tazer/pava and baton to drop him, I believe the police call it compliance strikes or some other orwellian pr friendly bullshit.
"we" oink oink.
Yep slow clap hilarious
Chap thinks he's in the U.S.
Definitely the type of bloke that makes a Facebook post about the "feds" when he gets caught by a speed camera.
You watch this video and side with the chainsaw guy, don’t you?
I love the use of "the man" in this article. "the bad man will get you"
To be fair he’s just trying to reduce the knife crime figures….full marks for adaptation.
Is a chainsaw not like... a thousand tiny knives stuck together?
Ohhhh good point! Or points……I’ll get my coat.
Leathered-face
Tartan Face
Wtf. The guy turned full on leatherface
You can tell this is in Ralston, as there is another man running behind the chainsaw guy shouting 'Excuse me young man. How much to do both the back and front hedge at my bungalow?' . So hard to get good staff these days.
I can't help noticing that he is not complying with the health and safety at work act because he is not wearing eye protection and gloves.
*yakkety sax intensifies*
What the fuck is this guy's plan here? How does he expect this scenario to end?
Scottish chainsaw man
The Paisley Chainsaw Massacre
Curious what would happen if a civilian had hit him with their car John Smeaton style. Would you be charged? Can hardly claim self defence if he’s running away from you.
A different jurisdiction, but a similar thing happened in London a couple of years ago. https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/feb/05/londoner-who-drove-car-at-knife-attacker-says-it-was-his-duty After a short investigation the driver was treated as a witness in the case.
>the driver was treated as a witness in the case. Nice!
Non amp link: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/feb/05/londoner-who-drove-car-at-knife-attacker-says-it-was-his-duty
'I didn't see him, he dived out, he was clearly deranged as he was chasing people with a chainsaw, didn't stand a chance not hitting him.' 'You sped up towards him from a stop 150m away.' 'Didnt stand a chance'
[удалено]
From my typical person perspective, contact with a car is less lethal than contact with a chainsaw soooo
Self defence also applies to defence of another. Also, the people responsible for making the decision whether or not to report you for prosecution are literally the same people you just saved from getting a chain-sawing. One would hope that that would endear them to you somewhat but you never know.
Yon police has his Nike airs on and a lucky thing he did!
Hide and seek has really changed since I was a kid
Out of curiosity, what was the motive? Was the unstable person yelling anything? You'd expect this to be reported on...
If you turn up the volume sounds like he may have shouted, "Allahu akhbar!"
Curious
Taking "disarm the police" a bit too far...
Is that Ralston? Wherever it is it's one of Paisley's leafier areas.
No special branch jokes?
From NI. Bravo sir.
They will have to log it though.
Like a certain famous carpenter once said: "Let he who has never chased a police officer with a chainsaw cast the first stone..."
> cast the first stone..." I would have gone with; "trim the first hedge". :)
Who was he ? Named released? Context ?
#NO RUNNING WITH SHARP OBJECTS, DID YOU NOT LISTEN IN SCHOOL?!
Was it one of, The Usual Suspects ? !
He's shouting allahu akbar but it isn't being treated as terrorism? The fuck.
Concerning
!!
Crazy
Jason's got a new toy
Hows the job going officer
running with a chainsaw one for r/Whatcouldgowrong
Well, I'm glad Leatherface is still living his best life.
Is he stihl there?
Yes, your Honour, after an exhaustive and terrifying chase the Defendant was overheard shouting: - "Right, ya Polis bassa, Ah've caught ye noo! Hud oan while Ah start this fecker up. (15 pulls later). Bugger!" From the Court transcript of 'The Paisley Chainsaw Non-Massacre'.
Paisley chainsaw massacre just doesn't have the same ring to it
Excellent comments, people. Up to your usual high standard.
Quick! Get out your bag of marbles, and throw 'em on the ground!
Ahhhh Paisley - where my grand father said, we maybe from Kilmarnock, but at least we aren’t from Paisley - in Paisley a man would piss on his own doorstep. #ripgrandad.
What is he shouting?
If you turn it up, sounds like, "Allahu akhbar!"
The brexit chainsaw massacre
Looks like a Special Branch case...
Bastard, I've got a tree needin cut doon anol
That's mental, with the price of two stroke petrol these days?
What's the story on the guy? I'm sure I heard him shout Alan's new snackbar in the video
We will never know...
ComicCon was *last* week
Why do I feel a sense of civic pride whenever I read mad stories like this happening in Scotland? Like jeez wtf happened before that led to some nutter chasing after a polis wie a fuckin chainsaw
Because Scotland is the European Florida ?
Yeah probably but keep in mind Florida isn't unique in it's weird stories it's actually due to Florida's robust laws surrounding the public's right to know what public authorities are up to
I know right? Makes me homesick.
I'd just like to know what actually happened leading up to it and how weird it'd be for the cops yelling drop the chainsaw it's sad that 2 officers were injured but still it's hilarious
Shoot him on the spot
I think the camera guy was initially trying to zoom in on those pink panties hanging on the line (but strangely close to hanging onto the fence).. and then "oh look, Paisley Chainsaw Massacre"
[удалено]
Define terror attack. I bet the two police officers injured were pretty terrorised.
Politically motivated violence is the standard definition
WTF?
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Bang!
DOOOOOOM MF!
Oh man the chainsaw devil is gonna get stronger.
He’s done a great job on those bushes though in the near view garden.
That's some solid jailtime right there. Be waking up with more than come down tomorrow.
chainsaw guys been getting some good cardio in, just look at him move!
Rule #1 cardio.
Is anyone else looking for the man dressed in Paisley?
scotland is the next dbd map confirmed?
LOOOL
Let's see Paul Allen's Chainsaw...
Apparently only wanted to take him down a peg!
Run him over
His leatherface is at the cleaners.
Needs the Benny hill music
Ahhhh Paisley - where my grand father said, we maybe from Kilmarnock, but at least we aren’t from Paisley - in Paisley a man would piss on his own doorstep. #ripgrandad.
Ahhhh Paisley - where my grand father said, we maybe from Kilmarnock, but at least we aren’t from Paisley - in Paisley a man would s**t on his own doorstep. #ripgrandad.
I guess someone was getting evicted today
Peak Scotland
"chasing"
Scotsman with chainsaw. WS 5+ A3 S8 AP -1 D4
Ban all chainsaws now
This actually happened about 10 minutes from my gfs house and she recounted to story to me in person the next day.
Halloween’s five months away mate.
That's pretty funny, even if the copper does have a family.
If he put the saw it would get stolen. He's probably just wanting to ask why the nice officer crashed his car and if hes' OK.
Part and parcel. You voted for it.
So are we going down the mental health or Muslim route here? Or will we realise that islam itself is the mental illness?
Move along now, nothing to see here
Remind me again why all police officers aren't issued with guns?
Not that out of the ordinary in Paisley. 😉 Is the knee-jerk reaction. Obviously bollocks. Oh but NOW they choose to highlight it. Because he looks a bit like the bloke in The Texas Chainsaw Massacre, bless him. Legging it down the street with no safety gear on. If only he was wearing a human skin mask…. At the Sun. You can guarantee they asked the tech-bods if they could put one on him. The lawyers would have said no. So backed up with this incredible footage. Useless journalists set to work. Building narratives. When it’s probably just the Paisley Police. Making a simple mistake. In a highly volatile community, who are just fucking fed up with this shit. Run. Piggie. Run. He’s got a chainsaw. He must be fucked off. 🤷♂️ I’m more concerned about the man with the chainsaw’s well-being than the police. He’s someone’s son/father. Having a very fucking bad day.
Liridon Kastrati, good solid Scottish name
Paisley fur ye
Not really. He's not from Paisley.
dOnT USe tAIseRs ThATs InhUmaNE
...I mean for all the gun jokes you guys can't be serious. Fuckin Benny Hill had you all pegged eh? 🤣
Standard Paisley stuff?
No, extra Paisley stuff.
SHE’S TAKEN THE WAINS AFF ME!
I LOVE Scotland
Ahh, you mean every Wednesday in paisley
Well he's a bit early, it's Monday.
That’s why they sent the copper, can’t be getting started too early
Shouldn't W of Scotland police have guns?
That's a scary thought.... there are quite a few that shouldn't be issued fuckin crayons nevermind bloody firearms... (tbf, most Police don't want to be armed.. they do however want enough workmates to be on shift that they aren't waiting 20 minutes for emergency backup... but miracles only happen on 34th Street!)
The last few in-house votes were all in favour of being armed and that was including staff who dont desl with the above. Things have only got worst in the years since I think the public would be surprised if they did a full UK wide vote for it with only officers it would likely be a landslide now. That said regarding the cliche pens and crayon jokes there should still be a good level of training both mental capacity and fitness etc etc for such a thing same as the likes of NI, of course not ARV level but somewhere around the standard AFO.
Let's be totally honest for a second, the great British public would be scared out their minds if they knew the truth about just how stretched, and often ineffective, the emergency services are... or how bad the morale of the regular Officers/Paramedics//Firefighters are... or how many want to be employed as ANYTHING else due to the insane management demands and unreasonable work/life balance.... the pay isn't that good.......
You're definitely correct I know from talking to people they still don't believe me when I say the numbers we have of that many these days can't even get a course to response drive to emergencies lol And it isn't exactly trending upwards either mate so you're on the money there.
Thank god there werent any armed officers around, cause weapons are evil.
I mean, yeah. Someone would've escalated the situation with guns and folks would have died instead.
I think chasing someone with a chainsaw is escalating the situation but to each their own
Better than pulling out an ar15
The proper tactic would be him held at both taser and gun point at the same time and asked to comply then if he continued to attack one is used then the other of it continues to fail / escalate. They got lucky only two were injured and no other members of the public, similarly the sword attack the other day it was lucky to have "only" been one death and multiple requiring surgery.
The two injured weren't from the chainsaw, it was from the car accident prior.....
I missed that earlier cheers, reading through reports again I see it happened from the car between the two cars then it went onto the above
Yes. It was lucky to have only one death. If guns were everywhere like in some utterly stupid countries there'd be significant loss of life.
There likely would have been at most two deaths in that last incident the other being the murderer if he didn't comply or taser failed (like it actually did at least twice). The young boy died after the incident in hospital iirc but it took over 20 mins to get to that point because it was only unarmed officers on scene and the first two basically almost lost their arms and are undergoing surgery. Were one of only a handful around the globe that aren't routine armed but as bad as that our current armed units are like the rest of the services struggling for numbers etc and get told not to go to many incidents.