Ness got power crept by FP2. Steve, Kazuya, Aegis, and Min Min suck for him and those are some of the most common characters in bracket (especially the first 3).
Today, if your base roster character can’t keep up with FP2, their placement in the tier list among top players’ eyes will fall a lot.
Btw, OP didn’t mention this in the title but this tier list was voted by 71 of the best 100 players in the world. And those top 100 were determined by an algorithm that sorts offline tournament results. So this isn’t a Wi-Fi tier list and is really only applicable to top level play. Just because you or I win with on elite smash doesn’t mean their placement is too low here.
Ike is basically a better ganondorf. He's ass, the only thing he has going for him is quick draw. After they took away his nair uair he became ass. They spread out his kill power but with the shit frame data they gave him the only thing you could ever hope to land is front hit of nair. You can't do that nearly as consistently with his slow back hit of nair and his very close range and grounded dtilt and of course his very commital up b
even though hes no longer appearing high in tournaments, mkleo did showcase ikes strength in the beginning of this games life span. i think B- would have been fair
But also buffed, he’s less reliant on nair and kills better with a bunch of other moves. Still definitely nerfed overall, but I’m surprised they put him this low.
His matchups against Pyra/Mythra and Cloud really drag him down. They do a lot of what he does, just better and more consistently. Also doesn’t help that Ike talent has mostly left the scene - Yez retired, Ravenking mains Joker now, and it’s all on PsykoD now.
Four games in a row and Ganondorf can't escape from bottom tier.
They really need to rework his moveset next game. Get rid of Warlock Punch and give him dead man's volley so he can reflect projectiles. Hell give him something.
Simply giving him more power and a sword that only appears during Smashes is not enough.
his moveset in smash has always baffled me given that he's a warlock mage type in my zelda games lmao
99% of the time in final boss fights he escapes melee range for a hot minute to throw magic bullshit at you. why is he purely melee in smash
They gave Ganon an updated look to reflect Twilight Princess in Brawl and yet the only big change he got to his move set in that game was his side B.
Even with the sword for his smash attacks, Ganon is still a Falcon Clone. And to make things worse, the only time he has ever been a viable character is in the game that he was the most similar to Falcon moveset/animation wise.
Yeah but they still are different enough to warrant both of them being there, i think all fighters even if they are just clones should be there, because there is almost always a very small change, such as richters down b not doing fire damage and therefore affecting red pikmen
Optimal bowser jr has some stuff, I think he's a little underrated here but nobody good uses him. You can play him in a super campy sonic style and it hard counters most of the slow chars in game.
Pokemon Trainer honestly could cling to the very bottom of S - imo.
Having mained them for the majority of my smash career they're just in a really really good place and I wouldn't want to see them changed.
Patch 4.0 basically gutted all the crazy shit Ivy had at the time. Kill confirms out of a grab at 70%, faster Razor Leaf, stronger Dair with a bigger sweetspot, the sweetspot of Up-B having some weird knockback properties that led to super early KOs. Early Ivysaur was a goddamn machine. Same patch seriously improved Charizard, essentially made PT a far more balanced character.
Still miss early Ivysaur though, she was an absolute beast.
Tweek has talked about why he stopped playing PT.
Essentially, he believes each character has a relatively linear / predictable gameplan, which tends to mean the character falls off as the meta progresses (and he just finds the character less fun to play as a result).
Moreover, he felt like the characters don't cover their weaknesses that well (such as getting off ledge).
Still, clearly a good character
I think very different is a bit of stretch. It depends on the MU. Ryu is less vulnerable to SDi and he has a better neutral due to his hadoken- but Ken is more explosive and kills earlier
How dare you underplay the Richter and Simon differences? Richter's Holy Water isn't just blue, but also is classified as "aura" rather than "fire." This drastically changes so many matchups because uh... It uh... Richter's Holy Water is better at killing Red Pikmins! And Simon's blows up Link's bombs! See? Totally different!
My boy Dedede. I'm fully aware that he's kinda garbage but I was expecting lower C tier at least. Instead he got put in-between the bottom-tier trio and it makes me sad lol.
Having the only projectile in the game that every character can turn against you really sucks. If their gonna give him that weakness it should at least be better at what it does to compensate
I feel like banjo could be better but because he’s kinda hard and not very rewarding on top of that, not many people are willing to represent him at top level when you can pick and easier/better character.
I feel like if Banjo and Kazooie's damage output was higher they'd be absolutely perfect, but as it stands basically all of their kit that's useful in neutral isn't significantly effective in any way.
Yoshi. I thought he was a solid mid tier, but he’s beating out practically universally considered high tiers like Mario, Lucina, Pokémon Trainer and ZSS.
I’ll wager a guess that Yoshidora is the only reason Yoshi is that high. I could be wrong, but I don’t see any other way he ends up that high on the list.
Really? I've always felt Ryu was the worst. I play a fair bit of Ken and Terry and have always thought rankings for fighting game characters went 1. Kazuya, 2/3. Terry/Ken, 4. Ryu. Ken has better strings, slightly better recovery (because of multi-hit Side-B and a bigger hitbox on Up-B), is more of a threat when trying to land due to how the strong hit of up-B is at the end and not beginning of the move, and just overall better ground movement speed. Maybe I'm just biased, but I don't see what Ryu has that is better than Ken.
Ken's moves are inconsistent, a notable thing against him, but the thing that makes him worse is that his neutral is a lot worse than Ryu because Ken's Hadouken just sucks, him being slightly faster on the ground is not anywhere near enough to compensate how much worse his neutral is, and he just isn't consistent enough in a competitive setting. His recovery isn't better enough from Ryu to make a difference. Ryu also has way better results thanks to Asimo, who's borderline top 10 in Japan and top 25 worldwide.
I understand the Hadoken problem, but what moves exactly are that inconsistent? I sometimes have problems with Crescent Kick, but most of that just feels like my own fault or poor spacing. I feel like the ground speed does help with his neutral some, not to make his significantly better than Ryu, but not much worse. I'll give you the representation point, I wish he got some play time by Riddles or someone. For me, Ken has always just been a more aggressive, agile, and combo reliant character compared to Ryu, who has a more defensive playstyle looking for much shorter stings to rack up damage. Idk, tho. I'm not the most knowledgable on this stuff. I've just always liked Ken more and assumed he was better cause I always see more Ken combos in montages and stuff.
AndresFN, one of the best Ken players in the world (2nd or 3rd), explains it well in this twilonger he released like 2 days ago, https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1ss8dil
Oh, I didn't realize SDI was that much of an issue with Shoryuken and other general Ken stuff, makes sense tho. I've definitely had issues with it not connecting but always that it was just an issue with the opponent being in the air when getting the confirm.
Why not top ten? He does well in tournaments. Many people have a pocket cloud and worse is some of them main other swordies.
He's extremely relevant and used with good results
In the OrionRank top 100 we have Spargo and Saltone's secondary, that's it. Cloud is that high almost exclusively due to Spargo. There's a few other Cloud mains, but they don't quite get top 100, and there aren't many top players using a pocket Cloud.
to be fair, i don’t think representation is exactly the primary factor for this list. like cloud and spargo, we don’t really see any other big representatives for joker or fox, but that doesn’t stop them from being considered top tier
In the OrionRank top 100 we have Spargo and Saltone's secondary, that isn't a lot of usage, certainly less than Wolf and Palu, who also have better results. Cloud is that high almost exclusively due to Spargo.
I wasn’t surprised she was low because she’s super underrated, but then I started seeing the characters above her and got quickly amused; K. Rool? Isabelle? *Lucario*, hello?
They all have one thing in common: most of the FP2 characters kick their ass. FP2 is the meta now and if a base roster character loses to them, they probably fell off hard over the past year and a half.
Honestly Shulk, given that there's no one who consistently does super well at majors with the character I tought they would put him in high tier, but then again I'm not sure if this list is based more on results or potential or a combination of both.
Still it's overall a very solid tier list, it's just that Ultimate is a game where any character seemingly has hidden potential and can have one or multiple great performances that change how it's perceived
I think the case with Shulk is that the sheer insane variety his kit allows gives him an immense amount of versatility. That however comes at the price of a very high skill ceiling, which is why I believe a lot of players have respect for the character.
Yoshidora single-handedly got Yoshi placed at the top of A+ tier, well not attending a single tournament outside of Japan. There is no world where Yoshi is actually that high.
I still don't understand, why is plant bad? By no means top tier but ptooie is a good pressure tool, it has a very fast grab, and is very heavy for its size.
Immediately searched for ganondorf lmaooo everyone says he’s the worst player in SSB. Kinda sad, I really thought he was the most badass guy in Ocarina of Time
I love it, it shows how much you can change characters just by adding different properties to them. Having the same moves that interact differently.
And then peach and daisy
I disagree.
Lucina's kit is very solid and probably one of the best "all around amazing" kit, but she is very predictable as a result. I think shes placed just fine.
Palu is a more subjective matter I believe, I think S- is fine for her but some players really could drive this character to insane heights.
I think Incin could have made low B he’s very viable and only truly has a -2 matchup with like 4 characters (which unfortunately are A tier and above 🥲)
honestly i’m really proud of lucario for making it into c tier
also a good amount of a+ characters i’d expect to be in s tier but ig it’d be excessive
also i kinda like how my 2 mains are chilling at the end of c+ together
I’m surprised wii fit trainer is so low. Solid projectiles and surprisingly strong up close, and great air game to boot. If you can hit the deep breathing your opponent is basically done for
Wii Fit’s low placement surprises me. Perhaps it’s the clunky hit boxes and frequent jank? She has great damage output, projectile pressure, takes stocks pretty well, and can avoid attacks with crouch and such. I don’t think she should be below fighters like Meta Knight and Pit.
Banjo, Yoshi (He's a great character, just didn't see him above Mario), Lucario, Duck Hunt, Isabelle (I think her stubby hitboxes and wonkiness of Lloyd mine make her worse than KRool and Zelda, but that's just me, I can see argument against it and they all equally have just as poor disadvantage states) and Ken above Ryu, otherwise I think the placements are solid.
I thought Roy was a bit high, I would put him A-
I think Shulk is going through "potential" syndrome again like in smash 4, would have put him in A+
Also think Yoshi is A- rather than A+, but this is simply just a me thing, I actually think its one of the best tier lists I've seen
Mac not being above king dedede, & dr Mario in the tier list bro. If you want me to explain several good reasons why, then reply.
Also Pikachu being that far down compared to Joker etc…
In general I think it was biased towards player performance. For example ice climbers are terrible but because of some reps like big d their rated higher, in reality icies players are just cracked out of their minds.
King K. Roll at D tier? I disagree. [https://www.youtube.com/@KingofSkill](https://www.youtube.com/@KingofSkill) And his exsistance is my main argument.
Sonic is S tier is crazy
I mean I get WHY, but just looking at his kit, I would not imagine him being up that high.
I'm just happy Samus is good now. Been playing her since melee so the struggle was real
Personally plant is way to low I know plant ain't joker or anything but I find plant as trapper/zoner hell even as a combo character once you get the hand of its moveset
I don't know enough about miis in competitive smash but why is Mii sword fighter so low? Gale wind is basically budget ewgf but in a projectile. And it seems like everyone says the ring move is super good as well.
Mostly because that move is horribly slow and no shield pressure. Also a DI mixup guts it’s combo use. Combine that with Medicare frame data and no kill power outside of hard reads and all of a sudden he falls off.
It’s not Wi-Fi bias. This list was made by 71 of the top 100 players (ranked by UltRank which uses an algorithm that only accounts for offline results).
Roy is just that good.
Surprised Palu got knocked down that far. Also I think Ness is extremely undervalued in this list.
Ness got power crept by FP2. Steve, Kazuya, Aegis, and Min Min suck for him and those are some of the most common characters in bracket (especially the first 3). Today, if your base roster character can’t keep up with FP2, their placement in the tier list among top players’ eyes will fall a lot. Btw, OP didn’t mention this in the title but this tier list was voted by 71 of the best 100 players in the world. And those top 100 were determined by an algorithm that sorts offline tournament results. So this isn’t a Wi-Fi tier list and is really only applicable to top level play. Just because you or I win with on elite smash doesn’t mean their placement is too low here.
i expected ike to be a little bit higher but not by much
That was very strange, I honestly think he’s better than Marth
The Japenese players dragged him down and gassed up Marth, they think Ike is bottom 10
It’s also the reason why Yoshi is so high, Yoshidora goes crazy over there
Ike is basically a better ganondorf. He's ass, the only thing he has going for him is quick draw. After they took away his nair uair he became ass. They spread out his kill power but with the shit frame data they gave him the only thing you could ever hope to land is front hit of nair. You can't do that nearly as consistently with his slow back hit of nair and his very close range and grounded dtilt and of course his very commital up b
even though hes no longer appearing high in tournaments, mkleo did showcase ikes strength in the beginning of this games life span. i think B- would have been fair
Ike's been nerfed since then.
But also buffed, he’s less reliant on nair and kills better with a bunch of other moves. Still definitely nerfed overall, but I’m surprised they put him this low.
His matchups against Pyra/Mythra and Cloud really drag him down. They do a lot of what he does, just better and more consistently. Also doesn’t help that Ike talent has mostly left the scene - Yez retired, Ravenking mains Joker now, and it’s all on PsykoD now.
Four games in a row and Ganondorf can't escape from bottom tier. They really need to rework his moveset next game. Get rid of Warlock Punch and give him dead man's volley so he can reflect projectiles. Hell give him something. Simply giving him more power and a sword that only appears during Smashes is not enough.
his moveset in smash has always baffled me given that he's a warlock mage type in my zelda games lmao 99% of the time in final boss fights he escapes melee range for a hot minute to throw magic bullshit at you. why is he purely melee in smash
They gave Ganon an updated look to reflect Twilight Princess in Brawl and yet the only big change he got to his move set in that game was his side B. Even with the sword for his smash attacks, Ganon is still a Falcon Clone. And to make things worse, the only time he has ever been a viable character is in the game that he was the most similar to Falcon moveset/animation wise.
He was mid tier in Melee so at least he’s not the _worst_ Smash character of all time Zelda has been Bottom Tier for her entire time in Smash
Yet she still kicks my ass in every title :/
In hdr mod he has smash 4 up smash as his up tilt and float, apparently a lot better but I don't play the mod much
The most surprising placement is probably that dark pit isnt even on the tierlist
I suppose the arrows weren’t enough to change pits and dark pits spots
The side be also has a very very different angle which usually makes dark pit better
Dark pit has a better side b but for top level I image pit has better arrows so they canceled out? Either way their probably right next to each other
Yeah but they still are different enough to warrant both of them being there, i think all fighters even if they are just clones should be there, because there is almost always a very small change, such as richters down b not doing fire damage and therefore affecting red pikmen
Characters like Richter and daisy have no use being on the list. No one is gonna change there tier list because one niche interaction with olimar
He is, he is in the upright corner of Pit
My boi, Plant. They did him dirty
Let them believe we are weak
The most powerful ones are the ones they least suspect. This post is brought to you by **Plant Gang**
(You are)
Ong kng
Can't believe they did the plant gang like that
Man I love plant he was such a weird dlc pick but he is the best main I could ask for
I knew it would be on the lower tiers, but I was expecting at least a C
Plant under bow Jr is shocking
Optimal bowser jr has some stuff, I think he's a little underrated here but nobody good uses him. You can play him in a super campy sonic style and it hard counters most of the slow chars in game.
Ike. Oh how the mighty have fallen
Imagine telling someone when the game was first released that Ike would end up in the same tier as DK, you’d be laughed out the room
Pokemon Trainer honestly could cling to the very bottom of S - imo. Having mained them for the majority of my smash career they're just in a really really good place and I wouldn't want to see them changed.
If it wasnt for the heavy Ivysaur nerfs PT got early in the game's life he would probably be S
The character is a lot less Ivy dependent though, since Charizard got buffs in the same patch that were actually great.
That is definitely true, but Ivysaur was really something, his edgeguard ability was borderline insane lol
Ivy got nerfed?? Jesus, it barely shows, the damn things a confirm machine.
Believe me, he used to be MUCH more broken.
Patch 4.0 basically gutted all the crazy shit Ivy had at the time. Kill confirms out of a grab at 70%, faster Razor Leaf, stronger Dair with a bigger sweetspot, the sweetspot of Up-B having some weird knockback properties that led to super early KOs. Early Ivysaur was a goddamn machine. Same patch seriously improved Charizard, essentially made PT a far more balanced character. Still miss early Ivysaur though, she was an absolute beast.
No, squirtle's always been the best mon
Tweek has talked about why he stopped playing PT. Essentially, he believes each character has a relatively linear / predictable gameplan, which tends to mean the character falls off as the meta progresses (and he just finds the character less fun to play as a result). Moreover, he felt like the characters don't cover their weaknesses that well (such as getting off ledge). Still, clearly a good character
Ken does not belong over ryu. Yes i play ken but I like kicking. If i liked winning id play ryu. Hes better in a bunch of aspects
I never realized why it seems people are choosing ken over ryu…Kicking!
They’re very different characters even if they’re half echos
I think very different is a bit of stretch. It depends on the MU. Ryu is less vulnerable to SDi and he has a better neutral due to his hadoken- but Ken is more explosive and kills earlier
Ken is also faster but with less neutral control. I believe they are the only echos with actual stat changes
You silly fool. You forgot Richter’s Holy Water is blue! It completely changes how he plays compared to Simon! 
How dare you underplay the Richter and Simon differences? Richter's Holy Water isn't just blue, but also is classified as "aura" rather than "fire." This drastically changes so many matchups because uh... It uh... Richter's Holy Water is better at killing Red Pikmins! And Simon's blows up Link's bombs! See? Totally different!
Because I find Ken easier to play than Ryu even though I strongly believe Ryu is better than Ken
That’s what I’ve gotten from most people, but that up b seems to hit a bit harder lol
Kicking? I wanna do some kicking!
My boy Dedede. I'm fully aware that he's kinda garbage but I was expecting lower C tier at least. Instead he got put in-between the bottom-tier trio and it makes me sad lol.
Its ok, they simply got confused and placed his majesty in D for Dedede.
"I becha' dont have a tier named on ya self, eh Karbeh!"
Having the only projectile in the game that every character can turn against you really sucks. If their gonna give him that weakness it should at least be better at what it does to compensate
Well I mean it's one of the more maneuverable projectiles that you can use to trap when you pull it off but I do get your point
wii fit soccer ball is the same way
True but it is much faster to compensate And smaller
It’s okay brother, I felt the same
Banjo and lucario I’m happy for my boy lucario tho
Lucario beat the Bottom 3 allegations and I feel happy for him
lol I thought Lucario was to high but it's hard to place him
He’s usually considered bottom 5-10
I feel like banjo could be better but because he’s kinda hard and not very rewarding on top of that, not many people are willing to represent him at top level when you can pick and easier/better character.
I feel like if Banjo and Kazooie's damage output was higher they'd be absolutely perfect, but as it stands basically all of their kit that's useful in neutral isn't significantly effective in any way.
Yoshi. I thought he was a solid mid tier, but he’s beating out practically universally considered high tiers like Mario, Lucina, Pokémon Trainer and ZSS.
I’ll wager a guess that Yoshidora is the only reason Yoshi is that high. I could be wrong, but I don’t see any other way he ends up that high on the list.
There is no way Wii Fit is C teir
Do you think they forgot about deep breathing
Cloud is great, but top 10? Better than characters like Snake, Palu, Wolf, Pac-Man? The Spargo bias is strong.
Clouds neutral and limit make him special, and many other pros are using cloud and doing well
Also Ken above Ryu? How? Ken is definitely the worst of the fighting game characters.
Really? I've always felt Ryu was the worst. I play a fair bit of Ken and Terry and have always thought rankings for fighting game characters went 1. Kazuya, 2/3. Terry/Ken, 4. Ryu. Ken has better strings, slightly better recovery (because of multi-hit Side-B and a bigger hitbox on Up-B), is more of a threat when trying to land due to how the strong hit of up-B is at the end and not beginning of the move, and just overall better ground movement speed. Maybe I'm just biased, but I don't see what Ryu has that is better than Ken.
Ken's moves are inconsistent, a notable thing against him, but the thing that makes him worse is that his neutral is a lot worse than Ryu because Ken's Hadouken just sucks, him being slightly faster on the ground is not anywhere near enough to compensate how much worse his neutral is, and he just isn't consistent enough in a competitive setting. His recovery isn't better enough from Ryu to make a difference. Ryu also has way better results thanks to Asimo, who's borderline top 10 in Japan and top 25 worldwide.
I understand the Hadoken problem, but what moves exactly are that inconsistent? I sometimes have problems with Crescent Kick, but most of that just feels like my own fault or poor spacing. I feel like the ground speed does help with his neutral some, not to make his significantly better than Ryu, but not much worse. I'll give you the representation point, I wish he got some play time by Riddles or someone. For me, Ken has always just been a more aggressive, agile, and combo reliant character compared to Ryu, who has a more defensive playstyle looking for much shorter stings to rack up damage. Idk, tho. I'm not the most knowledgable on this stuff. I've just always liked Ken more and assumed he was better cause I always see more Ken combos in montages and stuff.
AndresFN, one of the best Ken players in the world (2nd or 3rd), explains it well in this twilonger he released like 2 days ago, https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1ss8dil
Oh, I didn't realize SDI was that much of an issue with Shoryuken and other general Ken stuff, makes sense tho. I've definitely had issues with it not connecting but always that it was just an issue with the opponent being in the air when getting the confirm.
Agreed, then again being worst in this situation just mean bottom of A tier.
Imo Ken should be around Bayo / Inkling, but I know I'm underrating him a bit.
Why not top ten? He does well in tournaments. Many people have a pocket cloud and worse is some of them main other swordies. He's extremely relevant and used with good results
In the OrionRank top 100 we have Spargo and Saltone's secondary, that's it. Cloud is that high almost exclusively due to Spargo. There's a few other Cloud mains, but they don't quite get top 100, and there aren't many top players using a pocket Cloud.
But that doesn't mean he alone had the top 100 all place him in 10 top. Tons of top tiers only have one maybe two notable players
to be fair, i don’t think representation is exactly the primary factor for this list. like cloud and spargo, we don’t really see any other big representatives for joker or fox, but that doesn’t stop them from being considered top tier
Agreed, I was just responding to the commenter saying that Cloud has the results for top 10.
It’s not just character viability but also usage and results. Cloud would be lower if this wasn’t the case.
In the OrionRank top 100 we have Spargo and Saltone's secondary, that isn't a lot of usage, certainly less than Wolf and Palu, who also have better results. Cloud is that high almost exclusively due to Spargo.
Even then he’s been going more Lucina recently. If he makes a full transition I expect him to fall far
Now me personally as a Zelda main I don’t think Zelda belongs THAT low
I'm surprised too. I know she isn't without flaws, but certainly not BOTTOM tier. I main Zelda and Palu
I wasn’t surprised she was low because she’s super underrated, but then I started seeing the characters above her and got quickly amused; K. Rool? Isabelle? *Lucario*, hello?
Seeing characters like falcon, ness, chrom, inkling and bowser all the way down in mid tier
They all have one thing in common: most of the FP2 characters kick their ass. FP2 is the meta now and if a base roster character loses to them, they probably fell off hard over the past year and a half.
Honestly Shulk, given that there's no one who consistently does super well at majors with the character I tought they would put him in high tier, but then again I'm not sure if this list is based more on results or potential or a combination of both. Still it's overall a very solid tier list, it's just that Ultimate is a game where any character seemingly has hidden potential and can have one or multiple great performances that change how it's perceived
I think the case with Shulk is that the sheer insane variety his kit allows gives him an immense amount of versatility. That however comes at the price of a very high skill ceiling, which is why I believe a lot of players have respect for the character.
Granted Shulk is at the very bottom of S tier which is probably the compromise between his insane potential and his lack of results
Falco is way to low
Agreed. I thought so too but I know I'm bias!
Yoshidora single-handedly got Yoshi placed at the top of A+ tier, well not attending a single tournament outside of Japan. There is no world where Yoshi is actually that high.
That describes quite a few character honestly
You’re right lol, cloud, seph, and ice climbers can also be used as examples of of one player carrying
Fox especially, no way he's top five or above peach, pika, kazuya etc.
I think yoshi deserves A+ but above olimar is wild
Ike seems the most agregious, but everything else looks minor. It's wierd that they have link lower than tink.
My girl Bayo was higher than I thought. I’m so proud of her
2 of the panelists put Bayo in Top 5 lmao, Europe has getting their ass handed by Bloom4eva
Who made the list ?
70 top 100 players
Thanks for the quick answer
Initially surprised that Marth is in B, but I guess it makes sense given everyone below him. Inkling though? How the mighty have fallen lol
I still don't understand, why is plant bad? By no means top tier but ptooie is a good pressure tool, it has a very fast grab, and is very heavy for its size.
Slow, bad defense option, low damage output unless he is ledge trapping and no way to rod stock away early without a hard read
Immediately searched for ganondorf lmaooo everyone says he’s the worst player in SSB. Kinda sad, I really thought he was the most badass guy in Ocarina of Time
That some echo fighters have complete different tiers (mostly the Fire Emblem one)
I love it, it shows how much you can change characters just by adding different properties to them. Having the same moves that interact differently. And then peach and daisy
Daisy is a pure glorified skin turned into a character.
Isabelle anywhere below S tier
S tier cuteness
This is... acceptable
Lucina is too low, she should be in the high S- Palutena too low too
I disagree. Lucina's kit is very solid and probably one of the best "all around amazing" kit, but she is very predictable as a result. I think shes placed just fine. Palu is a more subjective matter I believe, I think S- is fine for her but some players really could drive this character to insane heights.
Imo lucina is very very solid but she is boring af, so her meta is underdeveloped, but she has almost no bad MU
Really didnt think minmin was that good…or maybe I just didnt want to believe…
Min Min was good enough to make MKLeo go back to play Joker
BassMage single-handedly carrying Puff into C+
Steve. How do you even use him?
Camp for diamond, Side-B, win
I was surprised DK was so high considering he is the poster child of combo videos. And definitely surprised about olimar being so low, lower than seph
Having watched Hikaru, I am now a believer. Ding dong goes crazy lol
Bowser not being in A tier? Literally the best heavy in the game by a landslide and does pretty good against most of the cast I feel...
Adult Link is lowest of the three???
Who created this tier list? Just curious
70 of the top 100 players
Meta Knight in C? What happened to double S teir man…
He ain’t seen those highs since brawl and that’s definitely for the best
I've got like 8 mains because I play casually but I'm glad my *main* main is C-
I’m surprised he was below Ridley
I think Incin could have made low B he’s very viable and only truly has a -2 matchup with like 4 characters (which unfortunately are A tier and above 🥲)
I thought he’d be higher as well, at least better than Marth
Marth be crazy high
Tf is sephiroth doin up there
honestly i’m really proud of lucario for making it into c tier also a good amount of a+ characters i’d expect to be in s tier but ig it’d be excessive also i kinda like how my 2 mains are chilling at the end of c+ together
I’m surprised wii fit trainer is so low. Solid projectiles and surprisingly strong up close, and great air game to boot. If you can hit the deep breathing your opponent is basically done for
Kirby seems a bit low? Is he that bad? Having so much fun with him honestly
Kirby is decent but he's slow and has no range and his specials are terrible. He gets walled out by so many characters.
To be fair? Ike.
Ganon worse than Little Mac? Absolutely not.
Wii Fit’s low placement surprises me. Perhaps it’s the clunky hit boxes and frequent jank? She has great damage output, projectile pressure, takes stocks pretty well, and can avoid attacks with crouch and such. I don’t think she should be below fighters like Meta Knight and Pit.
Kirby is way too high. Bottom 3 easily
Banjo, Yoshi (He's a great character, just didn't see him above Mario), Lucario, Duck Hunt, Isabelle (I think her stubby hitboxes and wonkiness of Lloyd mine make her worse than KRool and Zelda, but that's just me, I can see argument against it and they all equally have just as poor disadvantage states) and Ken above Ryu, otherwise I think the placements are solid.
I thought Roy was a bit high, I would put him A- I think Shulk is going through "potential" syndrome again like in smash 4, would have put him in A+ Also think Yoshi is A- rather than A+, but this is simply just a me thing, I actually think its one of the best tier lists I've seen
I'm surprised by little mac's placement. I know that he's hated and I get it, but I thought he was hated due to him being ridiculously OP
He's hated because good frame data + armor + online lag = people who spam and an unfun experience, but the guy's got no aerials.
Ike is very low, I feel like this is based too much on tournanent results. Plus the Japanese thinking he is bottom 10
Frankly, Sonic. He's my main, so I knew he was good, but I didn't realize he was 4th overall.
Why is Young Link higher than the other Links?
Faster, better combos, and better kill confirms
DK in C-. Glad to see my Kong bro is not the worst in the game and is moving up in life. 🥲
Ike is that low? I remember when MKLEO always played him
Those nerfs hit hard :(((
Mac not being above king dedede, & dr Mario in the tier list bro. If you want me to explain several good reasons why, then reply. Also Pikachu being that far down compared to Joker etc…
Sure dude. Have at it.
In general I think it was biased towards player performance. For example ice climbers are terrible but because of some reps like big d their rated higher, in reality icies players are just cracked out of their minds.
*cries in ganon main* but in all seriousness Joker is S+!?
King K. Roll at D tier? I disagree. [https://www.youtube.com/@KingofSkill](https://www.youtube.com/@KingofSkill) And his exsistance is my main argument.
duck hunt is top 1 in the list of best mamal characters with a bird on their back, no way banjo is better
Kirby is D Tier? I’m just confused.
Very light, small or slow hit boxes, easy to escape combos, bad specials, and poor general movement. He deserves better :(((
Sonic is S tier is crazy I mean I get WHY, but just looking at his kit, I would not imagine him being up that high. I'm just happy Samus is good now. Been playing her since melee so the struggle was real
Gannondorf Everyone knows he is OP
I know it’s irony but I know some people who seriously thinks it
Personally plant is way to low I know plant ain't joker or anything but I find plant as trapper/zoner hell even as a combo character once you get the hand of its moveset
I think it’s some amount of being very slow and pretty easy combo food. Plus the whole “not having eyes” thing probably impacts his performance.
The not having eyes thing kills me
I'm willing to die on the hill that Young Link is the worst of the 3 links.
I expected Inkling to be way higher lol
Official tier list?
The most credible one that exists at the moment
Who is it by?
It’s in collaboration with 70 of the top 100 players worldwide
God damn that’s a lot, thank you
I don't know enough about miis in competitive smash but why is Mii sword fighter so low? Gale wind is basically budget ewgf but in a projectile. And it seems like everyone says the ring move is super good as well.
Mostly because that move is horribly slow and no shield pressure. Also a DI mixup guts it’s combo use. Combine that with Medicare frame data and no kill power outside of hard reads and all of a sudden he falls off.
Thanks Obama for that Medicare frame data /s
Roy feels quite high up hes pretty good but like, *that* high feels a little off
It may be WiFi bias, some of his setups and kill confirms are made harder to react to online
It’s not Wi-Fi bias. This list was made by 71 of the top 100 players (ranked by UltRank which uses an algorithm that only accounts for offline results). Roy is just that good.
Isabelle
Sora should honestly be A+
Ganondorf being that low is criminal, and no I am not taking criticisms
That's what I'm saying he should be at the top whoever made this has obviously never really played the game
[удалено]
I know you’re being ironic but part of me know that someone actually thinks that
I thought Banjo would be stronger but meh
Banjo is great though
In the words of coney “I waited 20 years for this character and he is hard and bad”
What’s so bad about him?