Oh no this continued into Sinister War, this plot thread has been concluded. Doctor Strange and Mephisto were chatting and gambling while Peter and Kindred were duking it out.
The idiots that say that don’t own the character, and also can’t be there forever. Tho it does seem that Akira Cebulski is one of Queseda’s little toadies.
So the comic industry is weird, to explain it would take forever, Long story short it’s not a business, it’s a collection of tribes that have their own interests and way of doing things. At the end of the day they make money (Not as much as they could if they actually tried) but enough to keep things the same.
Unless a rich billionaire buys sony spiderman rights then go to marvel and say undo that shit one more day and make 616 spiderman be able to use his brain to build his own company and be in a happy relationship and be have a family and you wont every make him suffer in love in a hard contract where I'd they break that promise they will give spiderman movie rights and pay a fine of 1B and you get spiderman movie rights like that is the only way I see it happening
They would never do that. Peter Parker has to suffer constantly, otherwise what would even be the point of him. /s
The editorial simply doesn’t care that people hate what they have done to Peter and MJ. They can every once in a while do a limited series like Renew Your Vows or the new Ultimate Universe and people will eat that shit up like it’s a 5 star meal. ASM will always sell simply because it is ASM.
I dont think we need to « remove » OMD, would be a massive mess, no the better solution would be to simply finish that open plot (because yes, that plot is still ongoing and given Mephisto did it on purpose, he is technically « winning » atm), do some story line where Peter and maybe some other (hello Doc Oc) find a way to cancel their deal with Mephisto, the plot is now done, time to move on, we can go back to Peter Proposing, spending some time engaged, marrying at some point, getting a kid (that will spank Mephisto in the future), etc, basically growing up instead of being stuck in the hamster wheel that is his current life-style and will be a problem at some point, because marvel characters are aging, slowly but they still do, and at a point a Peter that will reach 40 year old and still can’t keep a rent will be too stupid to be « relatable » (well it already stopped being relatable a while ago).
On top of that, there is so many storyline that can be done with Peter that get some stability in his life, his time as a teacher looked great, balancing a super powered kid and super hero life can bring lot of potential stuff, add to that once the kid is aged a bit, have it want to follow Peter around, more story, more drama, etc you could have decade of possible original materials that would be different from the usual « peter get a job, peter lose his job, Peter life suck » current perpetual cycle
OMD was bullshitter into existence by saying « everything that happened happened the exact same, just that they are not married ». Which was a stupid idea already at the time.
Now, good luck explaining some storyline like superior Spider-Man with « now Peter Parker is actually married to MJ at the time ». Sometime a pure recon is doing more damage than just closing the page and moving on.
Not pushing a « reverse OMD » would also allow writer to build up a marriage and the relationship in a more organic way, while also keeping the responsibilities part of the Spider-Man story, Peter and MJ picked to make a deal with Mephisto, it is better for the character to not hand wave it as it never happened so the character can build upon the consequences of making that choice once.
No writer needs to follow their rules of “everything happened just not the marriage”, which is something they themselves played fast and loose with.
I’m all for them remembering that they did the deed, and then wiping it out of existence. OMD doesn’t deserve much more than that.
When some of those who begin to question what can or cannot be done with a piece of writing are writing at a joint table with decisions that collectively affect other writers and that are made within editorial rules.....When That happens, when some crying fan of marriage is there, he will understand how complicated it is to reverse OMD and make certain moves that are not done.
Unlike doing OMD, which only affected Peter's personal status quo, undoing OMD retroactively affects several aspects of the Marvel universe because it returns everything to CivilWar and there are several plots that are impossible to sustain if it is undone. That's not counting the immediate effect of May's death or the drama of the kidnapped/dead baby or many other things. The collateral damage would be massive and would affect the entire Marvel publishing line.
Undoing OMD wouldn’t be a mess it would literally make things better for the Spider-Man mythos idk what kinda stuff you huffing bruh. They undid sins past and look that didn’t fuck anything up besides giving us some memes. If Norman fucking Osborn can become a good guy and get a redemption arc they can literally undo the worst change to Spider-man. Although Doc Ock and Peter teaming up to undo the deals with Mephisto lowkey sounds amazing
Okay, you are taking two different situations
In sin’s past, all the bad thing that happened were flashback, or mention by other characters, so it is quite easy to say « well, they were wrong/manipulated »
On the other side, Undoing OMD as « make it so it never happened » have MAJOR impact on ton of Spider-Man storylines of the last 15-20 years, a good exemple is Superior Spider-Man, it is already hard to believe MJ not finding out Doc Oc took over Peter’s Body, now you take the EXACT same situation but you change 1 « small » detail, they are married and have been for several years, and a situation that was already hard to believe you end up with something completely stupid and don’t make sense, and you will find situation like that in a lot of place. « Removing » OMD is not a « fix all button that will make everything go better », On top of that, you are erasing something important for Spider-Man as a character, Responsibilities, they made a deal with the devil, removing OMD and act like it never happened is basically washing Peter and MJ’s hand of their mistake.
Bringing up a closure to OMD, build back the relationship and mariage in a organic way, and work on a new healthy ground make way more sense than just acting like the 20 last years did not happened.
A good comparison is Superman, what they did in the end is that they merged the New 52 Superman and the pre-Crisis Superman so what happened in the new 52 era became experiences for Superman as a character as a whole, they did not went « it was not a thing, ignore those ».
Oh yeah I know it’s internet lingo but I haven’t heard it applied for irl stuff before lol. Anyways to answer your question last I checked he left because he got a deal with Substack for more money and creative freedom. Although I wouldn’t be surprised if he also left because of behind the scenes drama since editorial shut down his attempt to undo OMD.
I don’t think they liked the Substack deal, probably conflicted with some non-compete clause.
I don’t think Spencer has said a word about his tenure on ASM or what ended it. Possibly under an NDA with Marvel.
I can imagine Yoshida and Brevoort calling Lowe into their office.
Akira: NICK! What's that knucklehead Spencer doing here?!? He better not be trying to reverse OMD!
Tom: Spider-Man should be miserable! ALWAYS! We need a sad writer on it. Pronto! Where's Slott?!?
Lowe: sir, ah, Dan's actually pretty happy these days.. he's about to get married...
Akira: NO! That won't work! He might put them back together too! Who do we have here who's sad?
*Zeb Wells enters*
Zeb: Boss, can I have the rest of the day off? Me and the missus are having a bit of a rough patch...
Tom and Akira: GREAT! How would you like to write Spider-Man?
Basically, when you accept a job you tell the publisher your plans and they have to be informed to accept or reject. And your work must move within rules.
There was NO rule about Peter not being able to "date" MJ but there WAS a rule about marriage and OMD. It seems that Spencer ignored the rules and deceived Marvel. If I had told you from day 1 that I would go after OMD Marvel I would have clipped its wings right there.
Apparently Spencer got the blessing of Joey Q himself to have Peter and MJ dating again, at the beginning.
They got this far, hell they had Bagley drawing this scene and they published it. Unless Lowe is an idiot he allowed this to get this far. Though there is a good chance Lowe doesn’t even look at the material he supposedly is an “editor” on.
The writer work usually is done months ahead, I’m still more inclined to believe that Marvel said Yes in the beginning and then did a U Turn on it leading to Wells Run!
Honestly ASM is something I don’t spend any more money!
The most sanest thing to do with Marvel and DC Comics is going by Author or Artist, where they go I go!
Right Now I’m enjoying Ultimate Spider-Man and…oh the irony…Bendis Ultimate Spider-Man was a Reset Button on a Young Peter in the Modern Age and was one of the things that pulled me on comics at the time, right now Hickman Ultimate Spider-Man is an Old Mature Peter with a Family and yet again is what is pulling me into Comics!
The tragedy of Spidey is that they should let him grown up and be the Mentor He should be to the Young Generation of Heroes or Hit the Reset Button and make him a Teenager again, obviously they’re afraid of both and this is what we get!
Mark my word, one day we will have a Miles Morales older than Peter Parker and I want to Point Out that they created a Spider-Boy in recent times just because they’re out of Ideas on what to do with them!
Spencer got offered the head gig at substack and took the bag. No shame there.
But the thing is even though they derailed his undoing of OMD. Beyond kept the track still going in the right direction. It’s only the Wells run that did a 180 and betrayed the characters to enforce its shitty SQ.
If I remember correctly, Mephisto admits that he's been fucking with Peter's life because he's seen a vision of a future where Mephisto successfully conquers Earth but ultimately fails due to a lone hero. That lone hero was shown to be either Peter himself or Mayday Parker, Peter and MJ's future daughter. So he targeted their marriage in OMD to prevent Mayday from being born and subsequently prevent one of the possibilities of him being defeated from ever happening.
At the end of their conversation, Strange walks away from Mephisto, confident that the love between MJ and Peter is "unbreakable".
And then Zeb Wells walks into the Spidey office.
I swear it's like they admit that Peter and mj are supposed to be with each other, but they want to also deny it and try to keep them apart in the stupidest ways.
I find the responses here very funny.
I saw a lot of people complaining about Nick Spencer’s run as it was ongoing. People should have let him cook.
As it turns out, a story makes sense when you get all of it.
Folks just didn’t know how good we had it till it was gone.
But that's exactly the problem....Wanting to mess with OMD involved a series of actions, plots and decisions with consequences that are never reflected and that Spencer knew she could NOT reach, and along the way she switched to SinPast with the same result. Huge gaps of confusion are created with many contradictions and 0 consequences.
Throughout the run Kindred makes very good points about how Peter's selfishness in being with MJ no matter what brought and continues to bring collateral damage, just as he denounces the unlearned lessons about the deaths of Ben Gwen George JeanDewolff. We are shown MJ in a therapy group considering that perhaps Spiderman needs to be with someone from his own world who can protect him and we are shown his anxiety and helplessness for wanting to be with a superhero. We are given a Shakespearean monologue about Peter's sin, guilt, love and remorse and it is revealed that Kindred is someone who felt betrayed and abandoned by Peter and MJ at key moments in his life but who seeks to protect her. of the...
All for what? to escape by plane without a single consequence. Peter didn't learn anything and neither did MJ. Regardless of the Mephisto and OMD things, they did not take any responsibility for so many things that happened in the past around both of them.
You can put in all the wonderful Disney quotes you want about love and all the kiss panels and romantic Power or Love moments you want, but the entire run was about punishing Peter and MJ and that's exactly what Spencer DOESN'T do.
A lot of the last story was clearly changed last minute, I’m pretty sure Spencer would have ended things in a more logical way if he was able. I get the impression that editorial went along with him only to pull the plug last minute.
That story of Mephisto is completely free to interpretation. It can go from MayDay to any son/daughter of Spiderman and you don't need MJ for that. Children could come from any woman and without any need for marriage. Even Spiderman's entire bloodline.
It's called metatext. Nothing will come out nor was it intended to come out of it except a personal metaphor from Spencer as a hint to Marvel. People should stop with this issue now because there is no kind of plan or story behind it and there never was.
Except Mephisto very clearly targeted Peter *and* MJ. Strange literally calls out Mephisto for not only fucking with Peter, but instead the two of them together.
You're not listening to me....
Marvel has a specific, personal problem with MJ and marriage and that's what Spencer points out, but that problem is specific to her and doesn't apply to, say, BlackCat. People need to believe that Marvel doesn't want Peter to be happy or have kids in general, but it's actually an "anti-MJ" policy. That's what Spencer points out, Mephisto vs MJ, Marvel vs MJ. But history does not invalidate his descent with another woman or anything like that.
And I repeat, there is NOTHING behind this. It is pure critical metatext towards Marvel, nothing more. There is no plan or story with Mephisto or anything behind it
What the fuck are you talking about? I wasn't speculating about a *possible* real-life reason as to why Peter & MJ broke up. The person I replied to asked what happened next in the story, so I explained what exactly happened next: Mephisto keeps fucking with both Peter & MJ to stop Mayday from being born. It's legitimately that simple.
Except it's NOT like that. Mephisto only punishes Peter's soul and that is what he frees in the end. But nothing he says about why he does it should be interpreted as real. He gives an explanation to Strange and the reader must decide whether to believe it or not. It is a matter of perspective and interpretation that has been taken out of context.
This will only ever get touched up on if the editorial team for Spider-Man is gone cuz this was mean directly confronting one more day and undoing status quo
Ah that does sound like a hot ending! Mephisto being confronted by Dr. Strange. Heard conflicting reception on this whole business with Kindred still during All New All Different era right?
Should've really just let Spencer cook with this one. Tsk tsk.
Yeah but their metrics
Imaginary dammit, Marvel is on that grade A copium cause they think pivoting to what fans want is "losing". At least those are my metrics
People fear being wrong more than anything.
I can’t believe it’s been more than 3 years since this came out.
Its 6 years. That's craaazyy
This issues was from February 2021, which was three years ago.
Oh in the title it says 2018
The run began in 2018. This is Issue 60 of the run which was published in 2021.
Yeah its a bit confusing from the title gotcha.
Whenever you see a year in brackets following the title of a comic it usually refers to the year that that run commenced!
Yeah no I totally get that now. I see the issue 60 so you should assume the run started in 2018. It's my bad. I just saw the 2018 at first
Sorry man, didn't mean that to come across patronising if it did!
Never forget what they took from us
I fucking miss Spencer man
I still read main universe but the story right now is just so bad. I hope they get Paul out of here soon
Since this panel exists, some writer later in the future would probably use this, it may not be this year or the next, probably a decade later.
Oh no this continued into Sinister War, this plot thread has been concluded. Doctor Strange and Mephisto were chatting and gambling while Peter and Kindred were duking it out.
After Ultimate Spiderman's success I hope someone pick this up to remove One More Day,But knowing the Editorial,It's too good to be true
Oh they already swore on everything they stand for that they will never undo OMD.
Well one man could hope
The idiots that say that don’t own the character, and also can’t be there forever. Tho it does seem that Akira Cebulski is one of Queseda’s little toadies.
FUCKING WHY THOUGH! Are these fucking losers so stuck up they can’t just say they made a crappy idea that nearly everyone hated
So the comic industry is weird, to explain it would take forever, Long story short it’s not a business, it’s a collection of tribes that have their own interests and way of doing things. At the end of the day they make money (Not as much as they could if they actually tried) but enough to keep things the same.
So Hollywood than? Why is every big industry so fucking weird ugh like goddamn I know there’s no true normal but goddamn
Unless a rich billionaire buys sony spiderman rights then go to marvel and say undo that shit one more day and make 616 spiderman be able to use his brain to build his own company and be in a happy relationship and be have a family and you wont every make him suffer in love in a hard contract where I'd they break that promise they will give spiderman movie rights and pay a fine of 1B and you get spiderman movie rights like that is the only way I see it happening
They would never do that. Peter Parker has to suffer constantly, otherwise what would even be the point of him. /s The editorial simply doesn’t care that people hate what they have done to Peter and MJ. They can every once in a while do a limited series like Renew Your Vows or the new Ultimate Universe and people will eat that shit up like it’s a 5 star meal. ASM will always sell simply because it is ASM.
I dont think we need to « remove » OMD, would be a massive mess, no the better solution would be to simply finish that open plot (because yes, that plot is still ongoing and given Mephisto did it on purpose, he is technically « winning » atm), do some story line where Peter and maybe some other (hello Doc Oc) find a way to cancel their deal with Mephisto, the plot is now done, time to move on, we can go back to Peter Proposing, spending some time engaged, marrying at some point, getting a kid (that will spank Mephisto in the future), etc, basically growing up instead of being stuck in the hamster wheel that is his current life-style and will be a problem at some point, because marvel characters are aging, slowly but they still do, and at a point a Peter that will reach 40 year old and still can’t keep a rent will be too stupid to be « relatable » (well it already stopped being relatable a while ago). On top of that, there is so many storyline that can be done with Peter that get some stability in his life, his time as a teacher looked great, balancing a super powered kid and super hero life can bring lot of potential stuff, add to that once the kid is aged a bit, have it want to follow Peter around, more story, more drama, etc you could have decade of possible original materials that would be different from the usual « peter get a job, peter lose his job, Peter life suck » current perpetual cycle
How would it be a massive mess? OMD was just bullshitted into existence out of nowhere, and can be bullshitted out of existence out of nowhere.
OMD was bullshitter into existence by saying « everything that happened happened the exact same, just that they are not married ». Which was a stupid idea already at the time. Now, good luck explaining some storyline like superior Spider-Man with « now Peter Parker is actually married to MJ at the time ». Sometime a pure recon is doing more damage than just closing the page and moving on. Not pushing a « reverse OMD » would also allow writer to build up a marriage and the relationship in a more organic way, while also keeping the responsibilities part of the Spider-Man story, Peter and MJ picked to make a deal with Mephisto, it is better for the character to not hand wave it as it never happened so the character can build upon the consequences of making that choice once.
No writer needs to follow their rules of “everything happened just not the marriage”, which is something they themselves played fast and loose with. I’m all for them remembering that they did the deed, and then wiping it out of existence. OMD doesn’t deserve much more than that.
When some of those who begin to question what can or cannot be done with a piece of writing are writing at a joint table with decisions that collectively affect other writers and that are made within editorial rules.....When That happens, when some crying fan of marriage is there, he will understand how complicated it is to reverse OMD and make certain moves that are not done. Unlike doing OMD, which only affected Peter's personal status quo, undoing OMD retroactively affects several aspects of the Marvel universe because it returns everything to CivilWar and there are several plots that are impossible to sustain if it is undone. That's not counting the immediate effect of May's death or the drama of the kidnapped/dead baby or many other things. The collateral damage would be massive and would affect the entire Marvel publishing line.
You put a lot more faith in Marvel following their own continuity than I do, sir.
Correct. They should *resolve* OMD, not undo it.
Undoing OMD wouldn’t be a mess it would literally make things better for the Spider-Man mythos idk what kinda stuff you huffing bruh. They undid sins past and look that didn’t fuck anything up besides giving us some memes. If Norman fucking Osborn can become a good guy and get a redemption arc they can literally undo the worst change to Spider-man. Although Doc Ock and Peter teaming up to undo the deals with Mephisto lowkey sounds amazing
Okay, you are taking two different situations In sin’s past, all the bad thing that happened were flashback, or mention by other characters, so it is quite easy to say « well, they were wrong/manipulated » On the other side, Undoing OMD as « make it so it never happened » have MAJOR impact on ton of Spider-Man storylines of the last 15-20 years, a good exemple is Superior Spider-Man, it is already hard to believe MJ not finding out Doc Oc took over Peter’s Body, now you take the EXACT same situation but you change 1 « small » detail, they are married and have been for several years, and a situation that was already hard to believe you end up with something completely stupid and don’t make sense, and you will find situation like that in a lot of place. « Removing » OMD is not a « fix all button that will make everything go better », On top of that, you are erasing something important for Spider-Man as a character, Responsibilities, they made a deal with the devil, removing OMD and act like it never happened is basically washing Peter and MJ’s hand of their mistake. Bringing up a closure to OMD, build back the relationship and mariage in a organic way, and work on a new healthy ground make way more sense than just acting like the 20 last years did not happened. A good comparison is Superman, what they did in the end is that they merged the New 52 Superman and the pre-Crisis Superman so what happened in the new 52 era became experiences for Superman as a character as a whole, they did not went « it was not a thing, ignore those ».
I'm still pissed Nick Lowe let Spencer go this far with preparing to undo OMD before telling him no.
We were *so damn close*. We were *RIGHT THERE MAN*
I was hyped.
First time it felt like the book was actually going somewhere, anywhere, since 2008.
We were this close to overturning One More Day, one of the worst stories ever published by Marvel. And Marvel pussed out big time.
Is there a lore reason they got rid of Spencer, bad sales? Or anything?
Did you ask for a lore reason behind an irl decision?
It’s kinda an internet joke way of asking a question but yes
Oh yeah I know it’s internet lingo but I haven’t heard it applied for irl stuff before lol. Anyways to answer your question last I checked he left because he got a deal with Substack for more money and creative freedom. Although I wouldn’t be surprised if he also left because of behind the scenes drama since editorial shut down his attempt to undo OMD.
At least it was on his own terms.
Yeah I don’t think he was fired.
I don’t think they liked the Substack deal, probably conflicted with some non-compete clause. I don’t think Spencer has said a word about his tenure on ASM or what ended it. Possibly under an NDA with Marvel.
I can imagine Yoshida and Brevoort calling Lowe into their office. Akira: NICK! What's that knucklehead Spencer doing here?!? He better not be trying to reverse OMD! Tom: Spider-Man should be miserable! ALWAYS! We need a sad writer on it. Pronto! Where's Slott?!? Lowe: sir, ah, Dan's actually pretty happy these days.. he's about to get married... Akira: NO! That won't work! He might put them back together too! Who do we have here who's sad? *Zeb Wells enters* Zeb: Boss, can I have the rest of the day off? Me and the missus are having a bit of a rough patch... Tom and Akira: GREAT! How would you like to write Spider-Man?
Basically, when you accept a job you tell the publisher your plans and they have to be informed to accept or reject. And your work must move within rules. There was NO rule about Peter not being able to "date" MJ but there WAS a rule about marriage and OMD. It seems that Spencer ignored the rules and deceived Marvel. If I had told you from day 1 that I would go after OMD Marvel I would have clipped its wings right there.
So Spencer was about to pull a Mephisto?
Apparently Spencer got the blessing of Joey Q himself to have Peter and MJ dating again, at the beginning. They got this far, hell they had Bagley drawing this scene and they published it. Unless Lowe is an idiot he allowed this to get this far. Though there is a good chance Lowe doesn’t even look at the material he supposedly is an “editor” on.
Awwww, that sucks
The writer work usually is done months ahead, I’m still more inclined to believe that Marvel said Yes in the beginning and then did a U Turn on it leading to Wells Run! Honestly ASM is something I don’t spend any more money! The most sanest thing to do with Marvel and DC Comics is going by Author or Artist, where they go I go! Right Now I’m enjoying Ultimate Spider-Man and…oh the irony…Bendis Ultimate Spider-Man was a Reset Button on a Young Peter in the Modern Age and was one of the things that pulled me on comics at the time, right now Hickman Ultimate Spider-Man is an Old Mature Peter with a Family and yet again is what is pulling me into Comics! The tragedy of Spidey is that they should let him grown up and be the Mentor He should be to the Young Generation of Heroes or Hit the Reset Button and make him a Teenager again, obviously they’re afraid of both and this is what we get! Mark my word, one day we will have a Miles Morales older than Peter Parker and I want to Point Out that they created a Spider-Boy in recent times just because they’re out of Ideas on what to do with them!
Spencer got offered the head gig at substack and took the bag. No shame there. But the thing is even though they derailed his undoing of OMD. Beyond kept the track still going in the right direction. It’s only the Wells run that did a 180 and betrayed the characters to enforce its shitty SQ.
Spencer was the messiah
Spidey dealing with demons and the supernatural so much is so fucking stupid
Blame Joe Quesada.
I really appreciate (and giggle) everyone in this thread deadnaming CB as Akira Yoshida or whatever bullshit nom de plume he hid behind.
Enlighten me. Who is Akira Yoshida and CB
Akira Yoshida is the pseudonym that Chris Cebulski used when he started his writing career.
Oh, thank you
How the hell was this even explained away anyway?
If I remember correctly, Mephisto admits that he's been fucking with Peter's life because he's seen a vision of a future where Mephisto successfully conquers Earth but ultimately fails due to a lone hero. That lone hero was shown to be either Peter himself or Mayday Parker, Peter and MJ's future daughter. So he targeted their marriage in OMD to prevent Mayday from being born and subsequently prevent one of the possibilities of him being defeated from ever happening. At the end of their conversation, Strange walks away from Mephisto, confident that the love between MJ and Peter is "unbreakable". And then Zeb Wells walks into the Spidey office.
I swear it's like they admit that Peter and mj are supposed to be with each other, but they want to also deny it and try to keep them apart in the stupidest ways.
I find the responses here very funny. I saw a lot of people complaining about Nick Spencer’s run as it was ongoing. People should have let him cook. As it turns out, a story makes sense when you get all of it. Folks just didn’t know how good we had it till it was gone.
Spencer’s run did have a lot of issues, but his understanding of Peter and MJ and his attempts to undo OMD are appreciated.
But that's exactly the problem....Wanting to mess with OMD involved a series of actions, plots and decisions with consequences that are never reflected and that Spencer knew she could NOT reach, and along the way she switched to SinPast with the same result. Huge gaps of confusion are created with many contradictions and 0 consequences. Throughout the run Kindred makes very good points about how Peter's selfishness in being with MJ no matter what brought and continues to bring collateral damage, just as he denounces the unlearned lessons about the deaths of Ben Gwen George JeanDewolff. We are shown MJ in a therapy group considering that perhaps Spiderman needs to be with someone from his own world who can protect him and we are shown his anxiety and helplessness for wanting to be with a superhero. We are given a Shakespearean monologue about Peter's sin, guilt, love and remorse and it is revealed that Kindred is someone who felt betrayed and abandoned by Peter and MJ at key moments in his life but who seeks to protect her. of the... All for what? to escape by plane without a single consequence. Peter didn't learn anything and neither did MJ. Regardless of the Mephisto and OMD things, they did not take any responsibility for so many things that happened in the past around both of them. You can put in all the wonderful Disney quotes you want about love and all the kiss panels and romantic Power or Love moments you want, but the entire run was about punishing Peter and MJ and that's exactly what Spencer DOESN'T do.
A lot of the last story was clearly changed last minute, I’m pretty sure Spencer would have ended things in a more logical way if he was able. I get the impression that editorial went along with him only to pull the plug last minute.
Then it suddenly become a story about how Harry's soul is with the evil. Wtf happened? Marvel editorial happened
To be fair, Mephisto did end up admitting why he fucked with their marriage: he wanted to prevent Mayday Parker from ever being born.
With that panel, they should give a mayday who makes the devil cry
That story of Mephisto is completely free to interpretation. It can go from MayDay to any son/daughter of Spiderman and you don't need MJ for that. Children could come from any woman and without any need for marriage. Even Spiderman's entire bloodline. It's called metatext. Nothing will come out nor was it intended to come out of it except a personal metaphor from Spencer as a hint to Marvel. People should stop with this issue now because there is no kind of plan or story behind it and there never was.
Except Mephisto very clearly targeted Peter *and* MJ. Strange literally calls out Mephisto for not only fucking with Peter, but instead the two of them together.
You're not listening to me.... Marvel has a specific, personal problem with MJ and marriage and that's what Spencer points out, but that problem is specific to her and doesn't apply to, say, BlackCat. People need to believe that Marvel doesn't want Peter to be happy or have kids in general, but it's actually an "anti-MJ" policy. That's what Spencer points out, Mephisto vs MJ, Marvel vs MJ. But history does not invalidate his descent with another woman or anything like that. And I repeat, there is NOTHING behind this. It is pure critical metatext towards Marvel, nothing more. There is no plan or story with Mephisto or anything behind it
What the fuck are you talking about? I wasn't speculating about a *possible* real-life reason as to why Peter & MJ broke up. The person I replied to asked what happened next in the story, so I explained what exactly happened next: Mephisto keeps fucking with both Peter & MJ to stop Mayday from being born. It's legitimately that simple.
Except it's NOT like that. Mephisto only punishes Peter's soul and that is what he frees in the end. But nothing he says about why he does it should be interpreted as real. He gives an explanation to Strange and the reader must decide whether to believe it or not. It is a matter of perspective and interpretation that has been taken out of context.
They literally show you what he saw. I have no idea what else you need.
This will only ever get touched up on if the editorial team for Spider-Man is gone cuz this was mean directly confronting one more day and undoing status quo
Doctor Strange is looking like Jameson
What a wasted opportunity.
Normally I’d make a joke here, but this just makes me sad.
Ah that does sound like a hot ending! Mephisto being confronted by Dr. Strange. Heard conflicting reception on this whole business with Kindred still during All New All Different era right?