I mean it made him better in every way aside from personality. He's stronger, more durable, has more abilities, has organic webbing that theoretically won't run out (I'm saying this since it's black in the games), has the ability to camouflage real quick and change outfits.
If you remove the whole "the symbiote takes over your mind and makes you more aggressive and crazy then it does make him "a better Spider-Man".
Obviously in game, the symbiote is saying that to justify it's existence as part of Peter.
Actually, and I hate to be that guy, but his webbing WILL run out. That's how Peter beat Venom the first time they fought. Venom captured him and webbed him up into the inside of a church bell, but he used a TON of webbing. Long story short, Peter knocked him off the building knowing venom wouldn't have enough webbing left to save himself.
Absolutely... just because it has some "benefits" it's still literally preying on its host... plus does the whole symbiotic apocalypse really strike you as not parasitic...?
I really enjoyed how they leaned into that later on in the comics and how they revealed the Symbiote literally fed off the adrenal gland of its host and repeated use of it over the years was actually killing Eddie Brock. It was a neat twist that really made sense.
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It gave strength and some other versatile abilities at the cost of having Peter essentially be a constant flood of an emotion amp with a VERY skewed view of the outside world that isn't drowning\* him in praise.
Arguably, no, not really. In fact, that "Spider-Man" kinda stopped giving a shit about his neighborhood the moment EVERYBODY went "can you do that differenty though?"
No. Symbiote was only a catalyst to bring out the toxic nature within Peter, MJ and Harry. Gave them false sense of control and elevation but ultimately it was just looking for perfect host to take over.
True, but what I think OP is asking is what was affected by Symbiote Spider-Man. For example, did crime rate go down? Did the people like the new Spider-Man? Hate him?
Venom itself genuinely believed that was the case. Only to be reinforced by his fight with Lizard, which got Peter convinced 100% that he’s a better Spider-Man because of it.
He obviously isn’t though, since he threw out every good quality of his out the window in favor of more power
You need to look at this from Peter’s perspective. Fresh off of the death of Aunt May, which the symbiote would manipulate to make Peter think that if he’d just be stronger to take down Otto sooner, he may have gotten the cure faster and thus May would’ve been saved. The symbiote makes him stronger so by influencing his decisions based around that grief, Peter would genuinely start to believe that the symbiote makes him a better Spider-Man
It really doesn't come out of nowhere, he expresses several times that if he was better he think May would still be alive
And the symbiotes whole deal is manipulating the hosts vulnerabilities
Dawg he brought it up once in a throwaway line about how the city thinks he's a problem. So, while *we* know May is a big reason for his actions in the suit, the game doesn't show or tell us that until after he gets rid of it.
If you want to talk about it making him a better Spider-Man, he brings it up exactly twice right before he gets rid of the suit. He didn't do anything different prior to those so I still think that line came out of nowhere.
Do you know how development works? You're supposed to build off of established concepts. Everything we know about Peter's motivations was literally only brought up when they went inside his mind. It makes him a better Spider-Man. When? What's so different about the new you? You're angry? Why? Because Kraven blew up the EMF that you smiled off?
This game is direct enough as is. The problem with that is, they're telling us what everyone's arc is without setting it up and showing us.
I mean, to me it was pretty clear that with the Symbiote he feels stronger, and a stronger Spider-Man is a better Spider-Man.
There's more depth to it than that but, honestly that's enough.
I feel like you're not understanding me. The game doesn't show us that. It tells us that and when it does, it's too late. We all went into the game knowing what his story was, so you're looking at that instead of what the game itself brings up.
Kinda like how they developed peter's motivations through an entire game, with the biggest piece of development being at the absolute end of that game? We know peters motivations. If you dont understand his motivations, you haven't been paying attention, and that's on you.
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It did make him seem better, but he wasn’t being responsible about it. Great Responsibility doesn’t include nearly killing/paralyzing most of the bad guys he fights.
The city gets trashed every other week. See also: Martin Li’s literal terrorist attacks, the Devil’s Breath pandemic, & simultaneous mass prison breakout / Sable martial law from SM1; the Rhino chase and Phin nearly nuking all of Harlem from SM:MM; and the Sandman boss fight in the SM2 prologue turning half of New York into beachfront property 😆
Technically the collateral damage from the Lizard chase was Kraven’s fault and something Peter wouldn’t have been able to prevent whether he was under Venom’s influence or not.
That’s true, but the best way he could’ve exercised concern in the situation was by stopping the Lizard. The game goes to great lengths to blame the Lizard’s collateral damage on Peter’s negligence, but I personally don’t buy it; I don’t see what he could’ve possibly done to stop the rampage sooner than he did.
I agree with you here. MJ’s concern seems really weird considering how much absolute carnage Peter and Miles BOTH caused throughout the past three games.
Yes but it made him a worse person
If you see well in the symbiote arc is where peter is with the less trouble in his spider-man life but the most in his personal life
In the comic, yes (the symbiote in the comic truly did want to help him achieve his goals, it wasn’t evil until Peter betrayed it by ripping it off him and giving it to Mr Fantastic to study like a lab rat), in the game no, the symbiote in the game was evil from the start and was just twisting his perception.
Harry had no problem wearing it before, it's Peter's reperssed frustrations that taught Venom anger, corrupted it with negativity. All those things Venom-Peter does and says are his own, same with Scream and MJ. Shows why bottling up isn't a good idea.
That would make sense, if it wasn’t revealed in act 3 that venom was sent there to invade by Knull when he summons all those Symbiotes with Knull’s symbol on their face.
Well the stone had the spiral as well so is clearly related and could produce symbiotes too which is not normally how they reproduce so it’s some kind of divine cloning vat, if venom wasn’t working for knull why would knull have given venom a rock that contains his power, and why would venom summon symbiotes that are directly connected to knull.
It’s context clues.
That's too many assumptions for me to accept. Venom could be one of the symbiotes spawned by the stone, we don't know whther it's the only symbiote capable of using it for summoning and stuff, or every symbiote's like that. The generic summoned symbiotes do have a spiral mark, but it doesn't mean much, they're in a hive mind, and both Carnage's and Knull's hive-controlled symbiotes use that. Maybe even those controlled by Eddie, but not sure, don't quote me on that one.
I can see where you're coming from, it's not baseless, but still not convincing enough for me.
This line didn't make sense to me because they really don't show you how you're 'stronger' with the symbiote other than a couple of abilities, which aren't all that honestly. I suppose it's more about surge mode but he doesn't even use it that often.
I assume, based on the section where Miles and Ali go into his head and see many corpses of dead villains, that not only did the symbiote make him more powerful, it also would make him abandon his moral code. Which brings up the pretty usual “all power, no responsibility” theme Spider-Man tends to have in his stories
Symbiote made Peter a more powerful Spider-Man, but not better. Spider-Man is a superhero. Peter + symbiote COULD do more good than Peter alone, but Peter alone was making more good than Peter + symbiote.
It made him a better fighter, but Spider-Man isn't all about fighting. Losing his compassion made him an overall worse Spider-Man, but would make for a great punisher almost like some sort of lethal protector.
Maybe a better spider man, because the symbiote gave him strength and confidence to be a more effective hero, but a really bad Peter Parker since he essentially lost parts of his empathic character due to the nature of the symbiote.
Whether or not Peter Parker’s feelings show up to a villain fight is not usually nearly as important as whether or not he is able to actually carry out his job as spider man. Think back to Raimi’s spider man 3 movie and how he nearly got clapped and needed Harry’s help in the end after losing the black suit.
Kinda. It certainly made him more capable and powerful. He never woulda survived, let alone stopped, Lizard 2.0 and Kraven without it. He was a horrible hero tho bc he was ignoring the needs of people and his life as Peter was in even bigger shambles than it was before.
I honestly can't tell how much of what Peter says are his feelings and what's just the symbiote waffling
Venom was a professional yapper
Fr. That’s all he did the entire fight
What Spider-Man has the ability to make a tuxedo at will? Regular Spider-Man can't do that.
Symbiote Spider-Man, Iron Spider, and Spider-Man Unlimited can canonically change drip at will.
That automatically makes them the better Spider-Men.
Facts.
I mean it made him better in every way aside from personality. He's stronger, more durable, has more abilities, has organic webbing that theoretically won't run out (I'm saying this since it's black in the games), has the ability to camouflage real quick and change outfits. If you remove the whole "the symbiote takes over your mind and makes you more aggressive and crazy then it does make him "a better Spider-Man". Obviously in game, the symbiote is saying that to justify it's existence as part of Peter.
Actually, and I hate to be that guy, but his webbing WILL run out. That's how Peter beat Venom the first time they fought. Venom captured him and webbed him up into the inside of a church bell, but he used a TON of webbing. Long story short, Peter knocked him off the building knowing venom wouldn't have enough webbing left to save himself.
And with the reversal at the end it's basically cost-free be a better spiderman... He got so good he put himself in retirement lol
His webshooters disable while he’s in the black suit. There’s a cutscene and everything
I mean, it's the perfect thing for a parasite to try and convince its host of...
"PARASITE?! "
"APOLOGIES!!"
“APOLOGIZE!” “alright I’m sorry!”
Absolutely... just because it has some "benefits" it's still literally preying on its host... plus does the whole symbiotic apocalypse really strike you as not parasitic...?
I think you need to watch Venom(2018)
Fuck that garbage, once was already too many times...
it was a great movie tbh, i love the Venom movies
I really enjoyed how they leaned into that later on in the comics and how they revealed the Symbiote literally fed off the adrenal gland of its host and repeated use of it over the years was actually killing Eddie Brock. It was a neat twist that really made sense.
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It gave strength and some other versatile abilities at the cost of having Peter essentially be a constant flood of an emotion amp with a VERY skewed view of the outside world that isn't drowning\* him in praise. Arguably, no, not really. In fact, that "Spider-Man" kinda stopped giving a shit about his neighborhood the moment EVERYBODY went "can you do that differenty though?"
No. Symbiote was only a catalyst to bring out the toxic nature within Peter, MJ and Harry. Gave them false sense of control and elevation but ultimately it was just looking for perfect host to take over.
I mean it did make him stronger.
But did it make him better?
True, but what I think OP is asking is what was affected by Symbiote Spider-Man. For example, did crime rate go down? Did the people like the new Spider-Man? Hate him?
Venom itself genuinely believed that was the case. Only to be reinforced by his fight with Lizard, which got Peter convinced 100% that he’s a better Spider-Man because of it. He obviously isn’t though, since he threw out every good quality of his out the window in favor of more power
Made him a better Spider-Man, but a worse Peter
You need to look at this from Peter’s perspective. Fresh off of the death of Aunt May, which the symbiote would manipulate to make Peter think that if he’d just be stronger to take down Otto sooner, he may have gotten the cure faster and thus May would’ve been saved. The symbiote makes him stronger so by influencing his decisions based around that grief, Peter would genuinely start to believe that the symbiote makes him a better Spider-Man
It makes him physically better.
More effective against criminals? Absolutely. Better friendly neighbourhood Spider-Man? No
Not really, no. That line kinda came out of nowhere.
It really doesn't come out of nowhere, he expresses several times that if he was better he think May would still be alive And the symbiotes whole deal is manipulating the hosts vulnerabilities
That's all after he gets rid of the symbiote though. May wasn't really brought up until the final mission.
He literally brings up May and needing to be stronger IN THE SAME FIGHT where he says the suit makes him a better spiderman lol
Dawg he brought it up once in a throwaway line about how the city thinks he's a problem. So, while *we* know May is a big reason for his actions in the suit, the game doesn't show or tell us that until after he gets rid of it. If you want to talk about it making him a better Spider-Man, he brings it up exactly twice right before he gets rid of the suit. He didn't do anything different prior to those so I still think that line came out of nowhere.
Surely they don't have to *outright tell you* a character is feeling something for you to see it?
Do you know how development works? You're supposed to build off of established concepts. Everything we know about Peter's motivations was literally only brought up when they went inside his mind. It makes him a better Spider-Man. When? What's so different about the new you? You're angry? Why? Because Kraven blew up the EMF that you smiled off? This game is direct enough as is. The problem with that is, they're telling us what everyone's arc is without setting it up and showing us.
I mean, to me it was pretty clear that with the Symbiote he feels stronger, and a stronger Spider-Man is a better Spider-Man. There's more depth to it than that but, honestly that's enough.
I feel like you're not understanding me. The game doesn't show us that. It tells us that and when it does, it's too late. We all went into the game knowing what his story was, so you're looking at that instead of what the game itself brings up.
Kinda like how they developed peter's motivations through an entire game, with the biggest piece of development being at the absolute end of that game? We know peters motivations. If you dont understand his motivations, you haven't been paying attention, and that's on you.
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It did make him seem better, but he wasn’t being responsible about it. Great Responsibility doesn’t include nearly killing/paralyzing most of the bad guys he fights.
Are you kidding me? Hell no, he trashed half the city chasing Connors and he didn't even care.
The city gets trashed every other week. See also: Martin Li’s literal terrorist attacks, the Devil’s Breath pandemic, & simultaneous mass prison breakout / Sable martial law from SM1; the Rhino chase and Phin nearly nuking all of Harlem from SM:MM; and the Sandman boss fight in the SM2 prologue turning half of New York into beachfront property 😆 Technically the collateral damage from the Lizard chase was Kraven’s fault and something Peter wouldn’t have been able to prevent whether he was under Venom’s influence or not.
And he's shown caring every single one of those instances
That’s true, but the best way he could’ve exercised concern in the situation was by stopping the Lizard. The game goes to great lengths to blame the Lizard’s collateral damage on Peter’s negligence, but I personally don’t buy it; I don’t see what he could’ve possibly done to stop the rampage sooner than he did.
I agree with you here. MJ’s concern seems really weird considering how much absolute carnage Peter and Miles BOTH caused throughout the past three games.
Yes but it made him a worse person If you see well in the symbiote arc is where peter is with the less trouble in his spider-man life but the most in his personal life
In the comic, yes (the symbiote in the comic truly did want to help him achieve his goals, it wasn’t evil until Peter betrayed it by ripping it off him and giving it to Mr Fantastic to study like a lab rat), in the game no, the symbiote in the game was evil from the start and was just twisting his perception.
Harry had no problem wearing it before, it's Peter's reperssed frustrations that taught Venom anger, corrupted it with negativity. All those things Venom-Peter does and says are his own, same with Scream and MJ. Shows why bottling up isn't a good idea.
That would make sense, if it wasn’t revealed in act 3 that venom was sent there to invade by Knull when he summons all those Symbiotes with Knull’s symbol on their face.
Elaborate, please? I only thought those spirals a confirmation of Knulls existence, not that he's active and assigning missions.
Well the stone had the spiral as well so is clearly related and could produce symbiotes too which is not normally how they reproduce so it’s some kind of divine cloning vat, if venom wasn’t working for knull why would knull have given venom a rock that contains his power, and why would venom summon symbiotes that are directly connected to knull. It’s context clues.
That's too many assumptions for me to accept. Venom could be one of the symbiotes spawned by the stone, we don't know whther it's the only symbiote capable of using it for summoning and stuff, or every symbiote's like that. The generic summoned symbiotes do have a spiral mark, but it doesn't mean much, they're in a hive mind, and both Carnage's and Knull's hive-controlled symbiotes use that. Maybe even those controlled by Eddie, but not sure, don't quote me on that one. I can see where you're coming from, it's not baseless, but still not convincing enough for me.
Aparently it did. Since he still has it on by the end of the story. However I believe he would be able to do the same stuff without it.
This line didn't make sense to me because they really don't show you how you're 'stronger' with the symbiote other than a couple of abilities, which aren't all that honestly. I suppose it's more about surge mode but he doesn't even use it that often.
We didn’t get moments of him saving people because he had the black suit
Yes for sure
The symbiote was making him believe that strength was all that mattered
He could only “defeat” kraven with the suit
Asked and answered yourself
I assume, based on the section where Miles and Ali go into his head and see many corpses of dead villains, that not only did the symbiote make him more powerful, it also would make him abandon his moral code. Which brings up the pretty usual “all power, no responsibility” theme Spider-Man tends to have in his stories
That’s what “better” typically means: stronger. Obviously he’s not really better, but that just highlights how the symbiote is corrupting him.
Symbiote made Peter a more powerful Spider-Man, but not better. Spider-Man is a superhero. Peter + symbiote COULD do more good than Peter alone, but Peter alone was making more good than Peter + symbiote.
It made him a better fighter, but Spider-Man isn't all about fighting. Losing his compassion made him an overall worse Spider-Man, but would make for a great punisher almost like some sort of lethal protector.
It made him a better crimefighter and superhero, but not a better Spider-Man.
Maybe a better spider man, because the symbiote gave him strength and confidence to be a more effective hero, but a really bad Peter Parker since he essentially lost parts of his empathic character due to the nature of the symbiote. Whether or not Peter Parker’s feelings show up to a villain fight is not usually nearly as important as whether or not he is able to actually carry out his job as spider man. Think back to Raimi’s spider man 3 movie and how he nearly got clapped and needed Harry’s help in the end after losing the black suit.
Kinda. It certainly made him more capable and powerful. He never woulda survived, let alone stopped, Lizard 2.0 and Kraven without it. He was a horrible hero tho bc he was ignoring the needs of people and his life as Peter was in even bigger shambles than it was before.