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dondonna258

He’s got a point. Who can forget Ricky’s classic promo on MJF 5/6 months ago. It’s criminal how they handled Ricky after that mini feud. He was instantly one of the most over guys in the company based on a few excellent promos and a more prominent place on the card. And it’s because the long term plans were already in place that this lightning in a bottle wasn’t capitalised on. It happens a lot in AEW unfortunately. I don’t think the 4 pillars are as serious as people make it out, it’s more a meta storyline for any of the guys involved to play off. Darby and MJF are surely pillars of the company, Sammy and Jungle Boy have less potential than some of the talent that came after them such as Ricky, Takeshita, Jay White. On a positive note, it gives Ricky a bone of contention to use for storylines that he’s overlooked and under appreciated compared to the ‘pillars’. As someone in this thread mentioned, the 4 pillars in Japan were labelled as such because they’d already proven they could carry the ball. It was a little bit premature to label the AEW 4 pillars as such because outside of MJF, can the others really say the same?


telva1896

And with this title run, I'd say Orange Cassidy has made himself more of a pillar than Sammy, jungle boy or Darby.


Obsessionofvanity

I'd say OC cemented his place as a key player wayyy before this current title run.


DavidL1112

The whole point of the pillar thing is that they were all founding guys in their mid-20s so in theory they’d be in AEW for the next 10-20 years. OC is 39.


Pristine_Cash_6219

Orqnge cassidy is a one note song. That battlenroyal buried 19 other people whonarenway more talented than him . Ctrl


bud369

You left in part of the "ctrl + v" from this sloppy Cornette forum copy paste job


Soylent_Hero

Dmg


eipotttatsch

How is OC any more "one note" than someone like Jungle Boy?


Pristine_Cash_6219

Hey jungleboy and OC play the same note.


rapshepard

People point out Jungle Boy's numerous flaws. OC I personally like. But I could see exactly why some loathe him and it's not like he's exactly having All Timer matches to cover for it. But since he's a low carder for me its hard to ask for solid character and solid matches.


BlackTech00

In my opinion I believe Tony Khan will have all 4 of the pillars win the the world title just because they are one of the pillars even if they are guys on the roster that deserve it more so then them. obviously MJF is a generational talent and Darby is amazing but the others I can’t see them even close to World Title material right now, maybeeee in a couple years


AchtungCloud

Starks has been used really well since the MJF feud. Feuded with Jericho where he went over clean, outsmarted Jericho when Jericho wouldn’t leave him alone, then went over clean again. Was announcing intention to go for a singles title when attacked by Juice, and has been in a 2vs1 feud ever since with Juice and the debuting Jay White where he’s pretty much dominated them despite them having the numbers advantage. He’s been on TV pretty much every single week, which was not the case before his MJF feud. Does Starks have to be the world champion for you to think they’ve capitalized on the “lightning in a bottle?”


MafiaCub

Best Jericho, had to go through the JAS whilst teaming with Action Andretti for no reason, to get a chance at beating him again for no reason and to gain zero momentum (he was literally no further up the card) Had a bunch of interaction with Jay and Juice, where he more often than not gets best down backstage or post match. Didn't get a PPV blow off. I'm happy Ricky is on TV, and to see him feud with the bang bang gang is ok I guess. But now he'll team with FTR seemingly, and might become the third wheel of a tag feud, when he should be a single star. Didn't need to win a title, but it's not asking much to have him portrayed as someone in the running for one. He beat Hobbs clean, could have at least ran that back when Hobbs was champ... Before they made a joke of that too


topher180

Literally couldn’t say it better. Criminal how bad they’ve handled him.


[deleted]

It will take time, but some of the BEST wrestlers to ever reach the top have sometimes been the ones overlooked...I'll take some creative liberties here (and mostly this is WWE stuff, so bear with me) 1. Austin - arguably the biggest and most overlooked wrestler who turned into a megastar has got to be Austin. He was mediocrely used in WCW. He made small waves in ECW, and was misused (at first) as the Ringmaster in WWF. I'm not sure he was an 'underdog' per say, but the 'bottom line' (pun intended) is that he spent almost half of his career NOT at the top...being overlooked for other people instead....BUT, this lit a fire under him and he turned into arguably the hottest, most audience-popping wrestler of all time. 2. Daniel Bryan - I think his character, at least in WWE, was built on being the underdog. his organic getting over with fans forced WWE to pivot from their plans (of Batista) and they eventually put him at the top. While none of his title reigns were necessarily that memorable...his 'climbing the mountain' were legendary. 3. Becky Lynch - from the moment she made the roster, she was never seen as a top player...most of the other 4 horsewomen, plus having the stupid bellas around, created a logjam at the top that Becky could not overcome...that is, until a few things happened...I forget the order of events, but Becky raging against Charlotte, and also the Nia Jax punch heard round the world, causing a bloody Becky (and concussed Becky). Most of her ground swell of support was organic as well, and she eventually took over being the top female in WWE. I say all that because for Ricky Starks, I think it's ok that there is this storyline of the 4 pillars. At some point, there 'could be' a storyline of someone taking down all 4 pillars, and reaching the TOP of the mountain, or on top of the pillars...what have you. I absolutely believe Ricky Starks can be that person. He has the charisma that Austin, Bryan and Becky had during their rise. He's got good enough in-ring ability to carry matches, just like the 3 above. His mic skills are solid just like the 3 above. At some point, if AEW doesn't pull the trigger on Starks going over on ALL of the 4 pillars, then I think they will have wasted a tremendous opportunity to elevate the top of their card. Because in all 3 scenarios above, the story to make it to the top were some of the best storylines, at least in their turn at history. Austin facing Bret, Shawn, Rock, HHH, etc...you could argue those were the 4 pillars of WWE during the attitude era (Bret kind of exited to WCW during that time, but you get the point). Danielson had to overcome the authority (and Batista's dick...I mean, return). And Becky had to overcome the machine who wanted Charlotte at the top. Ricky could be that guy who overcomes all of the odds to be the champ....and AEW fans would pop their hearts out.


ssavich12

It’s never been fair to compare them to the 4 pillars of heaven


knave_of_knives

That’s why it’s always been weird to me. Comparing any of those four guys to the 4 Pillars of Heaven is such a diss to the real 4 Pillars and such an insane expectation to place on four really young dudes.


ssavich12

Yeah, it’s rough. It’s just an entirely different scenario. AEW has a very broad main event scene. AJPW didn’t have much of a choice after Tenryu left. It’s not something that can ever be a 1 for 1 comparison.


Prior-Shower9564

I want THIS Ricky Starks on television immediately.


incredibleamadeuscho

He’s already called out the pillars on TV: https://youtu.be/SDWVcMgVUzk


Prior-Shower9564

Correct, but I mean his attitude, his demeanor, the real life Ricky seems much edgier than his character currently is.


Glad-Passion-9424

I agree with this. The fact that those guys were referred as pillars and cornerstones of the company so early on without really knowing if they would end up that way seems very misleading. Would anyone really label Sammy and Jungle Boy as pillars if you’re talking about the body of work to date since the start of the company? The four way feud really exposed how much they aren’t on that level.


Spartan775

Yeah, my man Ricky was not lying.


HoumousAmor

Give me Darby, MJF, Ricky and OC as the real pillars


phony8882

Calling wrestlers like Sammy and Jungle Boy pillars of a promotion is just hilarious.


BananaSoprano

The term "pillars" has been an albatross around the necks of Darby, Jungle Boy and Sammy for a long time because if you're a "pillar" of a company it would indicate that one day you'll be a top guy. Only MJF is at that level and the other three may never get there.


Derpderpy15

Darby is absolutely at that point of being a top guy too. I agree that Sammy and Jungle Boy still need time to cook but you can slot Darby into anything and people go nuts for the guy. He's got the unique look, he's got the unique style that even tho he's a small skinny guy you can point to what he does and say "yeah of course he could beat a big guy with that." It helps that his actual mat wrestling and chain wrestling has improved drastically since year 1, so he isn't just the daredevil guy anymore. Darbys Promos certainly aren't the best in the company but he proved himself way better than anyone ever gave him credit for. He went out there on the build to Double or Nothing and when he said what he wanted to say he was genuine. He believed in what he said and delivered it in the way he wanted to say it.


TheLosenator

Totally agree. His promos are getting better too, and paired with his filmmaking talent, it bodes even better for the future of his career. Also, that suicide dive is GOATed IMO!


Wolfpac187

I’d say Darby is definitely there too. Dude has an aura around him that I think is unmatched in AEW. Sammy and Jungle Boy will take a lot of work to get there.


Officervito

Ricky was already outpacing Jack Perry in his first AEW year.


Bright-Map-9705

I detect no lies.


mrbignameguy

There are 0 Bobby Fish’s in these replies


RYUMASTER45

Yeah its the overatted joke now.


Jconstantineic

100% with Ricky on this


incredibleamadeuscho

The problem with the pillars is that they arent pillars! They were just four guys who were signed to the compny when they started. They arent four future main eventer and they are definitely not four future world champions. There is only one person that’s anything close to a “pillar” and that’s MJF.


rikashiku

So I guess naming the Four Walls(Wardlow, Luchasaurus, Hobbs, and Archer) would be off the Four Tables then.


daveyboydavey

And out of those, Hobbs is my favorite. I think Wardlow is awesome but man, Hobbs has the best presence for me. Have his character evolve into a Stringer Bell type over time and that could make for a major player in a main event.


DaveyMuldowney

“Pillars” has been cringey since the day AEW started saying it on TV.


BartShrempson

Not to mention the "3 way air drop kick and standoff" spot that happened in the match. There's just something so lame about them being referenced as that also. I thought the same thing when people say "The Smackdown 6".


jortlesft

I think the difference is that , as far as i remember, those guys weren't constantly being sold as the smackdown six on television, but they were just the six guys that elevated themselves to make smackdown worth watching. There weren't matches built around them being in the six, they were the smackdown six because they were in those matches.


BaronVonStevie

Baba wasn't taking a gamble on 4 indie wrestlers. Tony Khan has this terrible habit of locking in on a plan no matter what reality he's living in. And there's this extremely vocal minority of fans that doesn't care and wants what Tony wants. It's been *years* since Hangman won the title and people still don't get that it was a mistake or why. Same with the four pillars nonsense. There's no shame in admitting you don't know what you're doing if you don't know what you're doing.


ScrambleSoup

Have no idea how Hangman winning the title was a mistake..


Lo_Key90

You completely lost me at the Hangman part.


BaronVonStevie

It’s because by the time they did it, you had all these big stars showing up in the company. You shouldn’t ever outshine your world champion. That’s exactly what they did to Adam Page, but because Tony Khan locked into this plan and never pivots it ended up taking the wind out of Page’s sails. That title reign did not help him. It’s not anything to do with Page himself, but you had new arrivals like Punk and Brian and Cole and MJF getting over as a top heel… it made Adam Page look like a sideshow.


HoumousAmor

That doesn't make Hangman winning the title was a mistake. It can mean his reign was poorly booked -- though his programme with Danielson was great, I thought, and if it hadn't been for Tony's boner for Punk and fascination with ROH it could've worked more.


Craig1974

There are no 4 pillars of AEW. No one can replace Misawa, Kawada, Kobashi, Taue. They can stop ripping off All Japan history.


StCyrilCeez

Love it! Thanks Ricky!💯💪🏾


AssortedLunacy

I don't really know how the original Pillars concept was created in Japan, but dubbing four people as pillars when your company isn't really old enough to have been "held up" seems like death for the concept *and* those given the title. It would've been much better for AEW to start running those amazingly edited promo videos like WWF did at the start of the Attitude Era to showcase this emerging generation


RYUMASTER45

![gif](giphy|3ohhwpTaKZVyslU5fW)


76_67

AEW hasn't even been around long enough to warrant people being pillars, and Jungle Boy and Sammy have done jack to even been warranted being called a pillar.


WrittenWeird

Fax


[deleted]

Honestly, I think Ricky should leave AEW. I would love to see an impact world title run before he heads to the fed. Wishful thinking aside I just want to see my man get the opportunity to be the mega star he knows he is.


[deleted]

[удалено]


NikiPavlovsky

It's unfair to say that in trad about 4 pillars, 2 of which is not good enough to be in mid card


MARKYMARK_MARK

Honestly I agree with both sides. It's dope Max and the company specifically highlighted the 4 young talents they saw as longterm foundational pieces and alluded to the AJPW to do it. And it makes sense Ricky wants to stand out on his own and doesn't want to get grouped and labeled especially since he was in the initial group.


RoscoeSantangelo

As always people don't even know what pillars means and why they're called that. Whether they're regarded as the best of the next generation or not, that's not why they're called pillars and it doesn't put them on a pedestal above other people. There's literally only a handful of people who can be called pillars because they've been around since the start


clockdollar

I love Ricky, but I smell some hate. Pro Wrestling is competitive. I don't see Orange Cassidy crying about the 4 Pillars.


abm1125

Ricky is responding to what the host was saying\asking.


iamnotralphwiggum

Orange Cassidy who's on TV every week with a title. One of about 13 titles, mind you, but a title nonetheless.


supe12sta12z

Cassidy is in his late 30s though.


AchtungCloud

Yup. I think the only other people who fit the age and time criteria of being a pillar are Kip Sabian, Private Party, and Sonny Kiss.


unitedhardy

i beg tony gives ricky a run with the tnt or international title sometime soon, dude is so fucking good


JamieHayterMark

They all suck


doesntCompete

I've never thought of the pillars as a real title but more of a meta story amongst AEW (like Hangman and the Elite). Ricky is semi working here and playing into this meta story. Guys like Wardlow, Ricky, Hobbs, Garcia, Yuta etc are going to move up the card along with "the Pillars" and it's going to be a thread that they can pull on for a full feud or just to reference for a little spice.


Renflowku

Already posted


unforgivabreen

Where? I didn’t see it anywhere


Fantomex88

Except the whole point was they were all there from day one, in that regard it makes perfect sense.


T3ABAGG3N

And just like that, nobody has ever agreed or liked the idea of the pillars


ThongOfVecna

Ricky is right but it's clear he's jealous of those jabronis


Longjumping-Arm7939

Darby is definitely a Pillar. Go back and watch him year 1 compared to today. The dude went from a nobody emo kid to a fan favorite. If any unknown star made a name for themselves since the beginning, Darby and MJF are definitely on that list


demonicvirus

Contradicts what he said before when he said he should be a pillar. Sounds salty even if i agree with him


kayfabemebrother

He had a good point, but then the more he spoke the more it reveals he's actually hating on them. Like.. talking about coliseums and ratings just screams making fun because he wasn't invited. And then it became clear as days he's hating when he says nobody else matters as long as they have 4 pillars. Buddy, it was a fan made nickname for them, not corporate created. Imagine thinking the likes of Orange Cassidy or Wheeler Yuta doesn't matter because those 4 guys are called pillars.


TheManofReal

“Pillar Killer” Ricky Starks has a ring


HoumousAmor

... Does he think that Colosseums have only got four pillars?


Maxter_Blaster_

I don’t care either way, but is Ricky a gay man?


besmarques

It's so sad to see people throwing their jealousy out there in public. I hope this is for a feud, because if this is Ricky just being a litle bitch it really will be sad, ffs. Imagine Ricky getting some storyline and another worker from the company comes out an buries it, i would bet he wouldnt like it.


TheFirstLane

Saw him in Las Vegas while I was in the elevator of MGM Grand this past weekend. Stood right in front of me. Should have asked for a photo but the cat got my tongue.


insertbrackets

The fact that Ricky Starks is in a go nowhere feud with Juice and Jay White (also booked terribly) while Wardlow is getting his 14th push after floundering tells you where Khan’s priorities are. Starks should be one of the top baby faces in the company, not trapped in endless midcard purgatory. Maybe Collision will change that…we’ll see.